This is all part of the puritanical shift that’s happening in some Gen Z circles, this post can’t be talking about millennials. I saw an article a few months ago that stated millennials were the drunkest generation and that while Gen Z as a whole drink less there has been a strong uptick in their consumption recently. Can’t imagine why they might have started drinking more, well besides you know the everything happening in the world
This is exactly it. South Carolina is full of sloppy alcoholics and the alcohol lobby spends a lot of money to keep it that way. They'll be the last in the country to legalize.
That's absolutely part of it. Here in Wisconsin the Tavern League has outsized influence and we still don't have legal weed and we lead the country in drinking. Although I've been seeing more and more of those THC drinks. I'm not sure what kind of loophole those slip through, but they seem popular.
Damn y'all don't even have medical, always thought you guys would follow us here in Michigan relatively quickly as our states have very similar politics but I didn't think about big beer lobbying.
Is there a line of dispensaries on the border in illinois then like we have here for all the ohio and indiana people coming to buy weed?
Yeah, at least there’s one set up in South Beloit. It’s more expensive than Michigan though and has a much stricter limit on what you can buy as a non resident. We went that route before, but the grey area stuff I can get at the grocery store is much more convenient. I’d do Michigan but it’s a bit farther of a drive than Illinois. Maybe I’ll grab stuff next time I head to pictured rocks
Why don’t we have it? Wisconsin got gerrymandered to hell for a decade. The Supreme Court is now left leaning and is breaking the gerrymander, so hopefully we can get legalization of some sort soon
They're derived from hemp, which became federally legal a few years back. It's the same chemical (d9-THC) that's found in cannabis indica and sativa, but it's present in such low quantities in hemp that it takes wayyyyyy more plant matter to extract enough.
If delta-9 is a different molecule but still an active ingredient, then not all the active ingredients are regulated. And these "thc" drinks are lying.
There's a massive uptic in what is functionally decentralized religious cult homesteading
Homesteading on its own sounds good. But when you look into why it's catching on right now. It's basically just religious indoctrination, manospehere, paranoia, racism, sexism, and conspiracy theories.
Read an article a bit ago. Take away: Millennials drink the most but largely kicked the nicotine thing. Gen Z have brought back nicotine in a big way, even causing a resurgence in chewing tobacco. Its all just homosapiens coping, so I say pick your poison and keep doing your best.
That's interesting. I do not have any desire to start smoking, but I probably do drink more than I should. I don't drink daily, but if I have one I'm probably having 2-4. I'm a hair holder than you are fwiw.
I would assume marketing is also the influence on that decision. Seemingly gen alpha seem focused on vaping instead, so times are changing - not necessarily for the better.
Exactly. Want to actually fight drugs? Give people something to hope for, and opportunities to do better things than constantly numb oneself with various substances to cope with a soulless nightmare society.
I notice it's a good barometer for society's health: Once all the jobs start laying off again and the costs go up and up and up and we get into some other war, everybody starts reaching for the stims to get through their jobs and the narcotics to find respite from everything else.
Just constant stress and pressure in the very air. It sucks...
IDK, with the amount of drunk driving in the US I’ve always wondered if we shouldn’t flip the two so that people have experience with how alcohol affects them before they have the ability to get behind the wheel of a car.
I see a lot of ridiculouness tv show every day. The american culture like opening cans with their teeth on the side of the can and throwing themselves onto tables and from roofs is completely insane. Nobody even bats an eye.
Nah dude we should be building heavy stone houses despite one of our coasts being highly prone to earthquakes, the entire middle of our country prone to tornadoes and only a small section of the east coast being suitable for heavy stone houses! We should be willing to be crushed to death in an earthquake or take a fat rock to the head during a tornado so they can’t talk about this anymore!!
Woah wooden houses are totally resistant to all those situations and even more! I'm certain that's why we build so many and leave them empty across every biome in the country.
!!!!!!!!!! Fuck I forgot to add all these. Just sprinkle em in as you please
It's not hard to get liquor as a teen in the US and it's underground. I was drinking too vomiting just about every weekend throughout highschool. I doubt that's going on as much with a 5% lager in a pub, and I don't see clubs tolerating it that much.
I'd be interested in seeing numbers on which produce more alcoholics. Coming from the latter, the former would have been much safer and better overall🤷♂️.
I'm honestly so concerned by the amount of energy drinks zoomers drink, plus the vaping. They're less into downers, but fuck me they love those stimulants.
Thing is, the vaping is so much worse for heavy metals, so were going to have to dedicate a huge amount of resources treating people for that since it is actually so unchecked
No it's not. The articles on that study severely misrepresented the results. Everything was under OSHA levels, significantly lower than what's in cigarettes, and a few were lower than atmospheric levels.
The formaldehyde study and the glycerin break down study had methodologies so far outside of regular usage that they were designed to produce harmful products.
The popcorn lung scare was full of shit too. Diacetyl and acetyl proponol were only used in tiny amounts in recipes that needed a buttery flavor. Despite the levels being orders of magnitude higher in cigarettes, and the only recorded cases being industrial workers and a guy with a microwave popcorn huffing fetish, the industry dropped it.
The EVALI bullshit was black market THC carts cut with Vitamin E acetate.
The amount of false propaganda against vaping is staggering. It was cutting into tobacco tax revenue, so the FDA killed the industry that was focused on harm reduction.
I personally don't care whether vaping is worse for the person doing it than smoking. The thing I do care about is that vaping affects other people much less than smoking does.
Right, but how are you measuring that? Vaping is far less addressed than tobacco cigarettes are and whatever health effects there may be could be broad enough in the coming decades to stress healthcare systems, and it has facilitated an entire industry of disposable coils and batteries used to power the things, which then just get chucked wherever. It's maybe less harmful in terms of second hand smoke, though I haven't read any study to confirm that, but that isn't the only way harm is caused.
I've binned off both but personally it's the cigarettes I miss, especially straights. Vaping just tastes cloying as fuck to me now, it's so strongly flavoured if you're vaping a lot you become totally nose-blind to it.
At least with Vaping there's no second hand smoke iirc, so while it's still bad for you it doesn't damage the people around you too thus it's more of a personal choice
I was a heavy coffee drinker until they found my heart defect.
Now I have no caffeine, doctor's orders, for 22 ish years now.
Sometimes I'll sneak a sip of coffee if I have a migraine, it helps. But God help me I won't sleep that night.
You don't realize how much of a tolerance to and a dependence on caffeine that you build up, until you're off of it for awhile, and try some again.
It really has a powerful effect on you, even if you don't realize it right now.
If I drank an energy drink right now, after being dry for so long, my heart would definitely race and I doubt I'd sleep for two days.
I don't miss caffeine though, honestly.
I don't wake up tired anymore, I just, wake up. And drink some water 🤷♂️ then go to work, feeling fine. Not amazingly energized, but not dragging either.. Just.. Normal 🤷♂️
Caffeine is a drug like anything else. If you can get off the stuff for awhile, say 6 months? I bet you'll be amazed at how you feel, and you won't go back.
Is there a reason you don't take the meds, like cost or something?
If not, you should definitely prioritize the meds, you're going to build up a resilience to Caffeine faster and it's like, so bad for you. I get it though, weed and caffeine are super common and effective forms of self-medication fot ADHD.
I can only get generic concerta on the NHS which does NOT work at all, sideeffects are not worth the impact it has. If I want to be in a medicated state I generally just obtain high quality speed paste and dose it at a theraputic level.
Jesus christ, and I thought Canadian healthcare was a shit show. From what I understand, lisdexafetamine (Vyanse) should also be covered by the NHS, though I'm not sure about what the requirements for generic brands are there. It's much, much easier on you than something like concerts.
I want Vyvanse but cannot get it due to shortages, I know for a fact that amphetamines work well for me even mentioned it to my doctor that I'd tried them but alas. NHS is seemingly in a constant state of meltdown.
The difference is incredible! I am not and never was a caffeine addict. I just drink from time to time and I enjoy the taste. But that "from time to time" is like once in 3 months. Or at least when I need energy and my sleep was short that night.
The difference is insane! It keeps me glued and moving the whole day. I come off work and I do things non stop. I can't shut up. It doesn't let me fall asleep quicker than usual (10-15min). It feels that it is a some sort of an enhancement drug.
I hope I will never require it most of the days so I won't build tolerance. And I do not want to get addicted to energy drinks. If coffee is a mild enhancement drug, energy drink is a straight up poison mixed with cocaine.
The piper is coming. No I'm not defending alcohol, but the level of drug addiction among our young people is shocking. The amount of digital addiction is shocking. I work in youth crisis so I am not talking on my ass, most young people are addicts now. So it's all fun to talk down about boomers who drank but holy fuck is this generation ever screwed.
While what you seen is definitely real, it may not be as bad as what you see as you work in the field of youth crisis. You see it so often as that is your job and it can skew your findings to be more to the negative side as people that are not having those issues likely aren't going to a youth crisis center and therefore are not around you. Again, it is very much a thing, but you do have some unintended bias as that is what you do for a living.
You are assuming that my experience is limited to youth crisis.
I have 11 years of experience working in addiction,... My response to your cynicism is this... You can only truly understand the scope of the greater issues on all levels ... And with all generations, once you've worked in the field. And it helps to have lived experience.
Edit: oh yeah I know, I'll up vote the uninformed opinion, and I'll downvote the person who works in the field and is an educated and trained and expert /s
Go to your settings > scroll down to "Show Scores" > uncheck all that shit. You don't need it. It's a vestigial dark pattern from commercial social media design to keep you checking how well your comments are "scoring" as if that made any sense.
It should never have been surfaced to frontend of Lemmy.
I don't want to have an automatic yeah no yeah no back and forth with you but... I suspect I'm much older than you and I can attest here that most people, even in professional roles, were hammered all day. They were as "functional" as this current generation is on ridiculous amounts of weed, psychedelics, and uppers... That is to say, not as functional as they could be. There's no "what's worse" contest here; the choice of drug doesn't change the underlying issue. I'm a recovered addict and I work in the field of addiction so I'm speaking from the heart.
Love a pint, personally. Drinking with friends trumps most other activities. Currently on my way to see The Prodigy with some old friends I'm meeting in Edinburgh. Looking forward to the pubs and merry laughs as much as the gig, in fact more so.
originally i wanted to write that we didn't have lead exposure, but ...
Flint Michigan. and that's actually not even the worst municipal water system by far. That's merely the one that got a little more publicity than most.
It's nice that we don't have fumes from leaded gasoline, generally speaking--that it's no longer the standard and most household sector products that use fuel don't take leaded gasoline.
Yep. I don't hear many folks talk about Jackson, Mississippi's lead water problem. You'd think that being the capital of Mississippi that it would be talked about more.
It gets me fucked up in my head so I don't like it. The weed we have around here is next level stuff. I smoked when I was young but can't handle it anymore.
From what I've seen in the UK, it's not that the youth particularly see temperance as a virtue it's more than unless you're going to a Spoons pints are £6 if not more these days. Ket is big in Britain too, on account of it being cheap especially compared to pints. They don't want to be filmed while hammered and immortalised on tiktok either.
I feel it's a common problem that economic factors are often attributed to moral ones.
It tastes like ass as well. I haven't drank in like 8 years by now, but I think I would've taken longer to quit it if it tasted like a full fat Coke, lol.
Yeah, same. Was struck by it at a korean restaurant that had the equivalent of a wine pairing, and their selection was just … something for children, only children can't drink. As in, I like straight soju and makgeolli, but I'd rather get some craft makgeolli without sweeteners than something flavoured like chemical blueberry replica.
Commercially produced makgeolli will always use artificial sweeteners because there's still active fermenting taking place and any real sweeteners will be turned into alcohol, which will effect the taste and alcohol content. With craft makgeolli, you add a sweetener, like juice or honey or sugar, shortly before serving.
But I think the main point is more along the lines of expectations for alcohol and general tastes: I find overly sweet stuff a turn-off, and generally need to temper sweet stuff with something sour or bitter.
Also, mixing juice and alcohol can very often result in what a lot of us drank as teenagers, and may have rather negative associations to. Like I don't have problems with gimlets and micheladas or radlers, but I think I prefer them all on the boozier side, and stuff like rum & coke is just … not for me.
So if I go to a restaurant and get what I interpret as more or less teenager drinking swill full of artificial flavouring, Black Tower and general goon sack swill, I'm going to have a bad time, and be left wondering if this stuff is actually representative of what they consider alcohol for adults, or if the people at the restaurant are being weird.
Yeah, the smell of RedBull vodka makes me nearly puke now, after young me actually puked too often from it
I also don't like sweet alcohol stuff.
My little brother on the other side doesn't like beer and tends more to those sugar bombs.
Can't understand it... The sugar makes the hangover much worse
Yeah, I get it. There was a bit of a fruit flavored soju fad about ten years ago in Korea, but that has pretty much completely died off. You'd be hard pressed to find soju cocktails or makgeolli dolled up in Korea outside of a few regional places that want to be known for chestnut or corn or sweet potato makgeolli.
And I feel like when I first started drinking, 15, 16 years old, drinks with flavor were easier to consume. As drinking progressed, those were the drinks I avoided like the plague. I haven't had a long island iced tea since I was 21 or 22.
And that's not to say there aren't well crafted cocktails that taste good, but none of them taste like a coke.
I'm not against a pornstar martini every once in a while, but only if it's made well. I've had instant cocktails and those are not even worth the tin they're served in.
This sounded like bullshit but I’m open to the idea enough to do a few minutes of digging. The study that the first few search results reference tested rats and found that, according to my understanding at least, intermittent sugar intake can be addictive in a similar manner to opiates, but to a smaller degree than actual opiates. There was no comparison to alcohol.
There was this brief article where the chair of nutrition at Harvard said sugar can mimic some traits of addictiveness but specifically stated it can’t be classified the same as alcohol or nicotine. No actual study done, just a guy who presumably knows what he’s talking about.
So claiming sugar is more addictive than alcohol still sounds like bullshit to me. Habit forming? Yes. Withdrawal symptoms after high regular consumption? Yes. Over consumed (at least in the US)? Hell yes. But more addictive than alcohol? Do you have an actual source to support such a claim?
They compared sugar to the worst known addictive substance- opiates. Alcohol is far less addictive than opiates. Therefore, despite a lack of quantizing what is "less", it is likely that sugar is more addictive than alcohol.
I do think a lot of people force themselves to like it, when it's "cool" as a young adult. I'd bet most people would pick a different drink if there was no buzz around alcohol.
100%. I never could convince myself to like it and I tried like hell in my early 20s. Then I discovered hard cider, still not better than a soda but good enough to easily get fucked up with.
But then weed became legal and I've all but phased out drinking altogether. Besides, it's too damn expensive
"Cool" or "tough", I saw it both in my teenage and army days. People are very silly. Being a good family man, responsible father and loving husband, that's cool; controlling one's anger, being self-sacrificial, needing little and giving a lot, that's tough. Oh well. 🤷♂️🙃
I haven't drank in ~2.5 years and got served an alcoholic beer on accident.
Even the first sip tasted awful. Super sweet but at the same time like disinfectant.
And I used to love this brand of beer. Crazy how much of an acquired taste alcohol is.
You sure that wasn’t an alcohol free beer? Unless it’s de-alcholized beer, a non-alcoholic beer is stopped being brewed before a lot of the sugar from the yeast is turned into alchohol.
So they tend to be sweeter unless they add some additives, and they taste like stale alcohol as well, that could have been the disinfectant tinge. As they are still 0.5% alcohol typically.
100% sure because I've ordered the nonalcoholic Version and they apologised about a hundred times when I pointed out it was an alcoholic beer.
I drink a lot of non alcoholic beers and tried a lot of different brands, so I'm used to the way they taste. Also a lot of them have very low amounts of sugar in them (I.e. Jever fun, Fürstenberg 0%, etc).
I can't stand beer or wine (or Coke), but I genuinely enjoy the harsh taste of hard liquor. I stopped drinking over a year ago and have no desire to ever drink alcohol again, but sometimes the craving for the taste hits me so hard and I almost give in until I remember how alcohol makes me feel, both while I'm drinking it and the day after. I really wish I could sit and enjoy a few drinks for the taste without there being any alcohol in it.
Wonder if it's somewhat emotional, like reminiscing the "good ol' days", or if it's just truly an acquired taste. Idk, I probably partied and drank more than 95% of "programmer socks" and "ugh I hate people" lemmings but now even a glass of prosecco is not tasty at all, lol. I could just have juice, and for a fraction of the price!
Older Millennial here, they are right, too bad people my age didn't get the memo. Never understood, even back in school, why getting plastered is celebrated.
The main reason I've decided to abstain from alcohol is because I've seen first-hand what alcoholism does to a person. I've don't want to end like my dad.
Same! I'm Gen-X and promised myself at age 4 when I witnessed my dad was always stumbling into the house drunk & ill & scary, I have no desire to put any poison into my body. Still never have and never will.
If alcohol guarantees death at 60 like my alcoholic narcissistic pos dad, I think I'll just keep drinking. Other drugs too because I'm not a fucking square like he was :). If you have someone (even if it's just you) to protect from yourself, I completely understand. edit: shit, if you have another good reason, that's cool too. I'm drunk.
One time a friend of mine showed me this chicken they got from the food pantry and one of the ingredients was caffeine. Needless to say I don't eat much food pantry meat these days. Why was there caffeine in that chicken I may never know.
Sadly, found out my niece has been getting blacked out drunk in college repeatedly. In one of the videos she showed me, she probably consumed more alcohol in a 5-second clip than I have in 2 years. Just a bottle of Tito's, and she just chugged it.
In the community page of my investment platform, the older folks who invested in Diageo, the parent company of Guiness, are genuinely shocked and finally convinced that younger generations are drinking less because Diageo is struggling financially.
Nevermind the health reasons why drinking alcohol is bad, it just really have become expensive to go out, let alone go drinking alcohol!
I'm middle aged, I've never smoked, at the most in my younger years I'd drink one glass of wine or cider or something like that a week. I don't anymore, I have maybe 3 drinks a year tops now. It's amazing to me how my parents' generation is still alive because they smoked like fiends and drank buckets of rum and cokes on the weekends, and I'd say that they weren't big drinkers compared to others.
Thing is- it's the boomers that pushed things like the 21 to drink laws and the absurdly strict enforcement of them (like sending a parent to jail if their kid has a party).
You guys spent a few decades decrying teenage drinking, making it hard for teens to drink. And now you all are shocked when kids do something else.
Don't forget- nicotine is 18+ not 21+. So chances are every high schooler has a friend or a sibling that can get them vapes.
Vapes are small. Many don't look like anything in particular to someone who doesn't know what they are. And they are easy to hide, easy to conceal, easy to transport, AND easy to use throughout the day.
So for a substance for kids to get into, it's got a lot of advantages over alcohol.
Plus which vaping is much more common to do alone. Kids are spending far less time on in-person social interactions now (probably because boomers flipped out over stranger danger).
I've read that certain GLPs used for weight loss can also cause a distaste for alcohol. Someone that had been a somewhat regular drinker was interviewed saying they suddenly found that they didn't like the taste anymore and stopped drinking alcoholic beverages.
Not gonna say that's the whole cause of course, but it may be a contributing factor.
I know quite a few bartenders who tell me that it is true that younger kids aren’t drinking but they are still going to the bars with friends that do drink. Where before you might have a customer a night who didn’t drink now there are a few tables with groups that includes nonalcoholic drinkers. A couple have told me of groups where the non drinkers out number the person drinking alcoholic beverages. They just want to hangout with friends and sip cokes or club sodas. As long as they tip something no one cares.
A beer delivery driver told my where he’s based at they can only deliver CBD or THC sodas to the strip clubs. I had no idea some of them couldn’t serve beer. Missouri for ya.
Way more than 100% I think. I've heard from a guy who was a restaurant manager that 1 drink pays for the bottle, and cocktails are even more marked up I reckon
hey, man. i'm a gen-xer drinking lime beer and watching 90s general hospital episodes on youtube.
lemme lay it down for you, youngin'.
pokeman is lame. memes are lame. drinking alcoholic beverages without alcohol is lame. naming an alcoholic beverage without alcohol a 'mocktail' is lame.
your entire generation is composed of 90% plastic from soda bottles and the other 10% is from social media propaganda. you don't want to poison yourselves lol.
Fellow genxer: you don't speak for all of us. Yes times were harder. Especially for minorities. If we knew better: then it should have been better. But We didn't have the answers.
Doesn't drink or smoke, poisons themselves with anything and everything else under the disguise of trying to achieve enlightenment through mushrooms, drugs or trying to live healthy by consuming supplements, vegan substitute of real things etc...
193 replies
we must know different people
This is all part of the puritanical shift that’s happening in some Gen Z circles, this post can’t be talking about millennials. I saw an article a few months ago that stated millennials were the drunkest generation and that while Gen Z as a whole drink less there has been a strong uptick in their consumption recently. Can’t imagine why they might have started drinking more, well besides you know the everything happening in the world
If weed is legal drinking goes down.
I wonder if it’s people living in weed “dry” states that are the current outliers.
Well here in the Netherlands it was Covid that did in the student drinking culture and apparently it just never bounced back.
Its most probably also inflation. Now i spend 2-3x more
This is exactly it. South Carolina is full of sloppy alcoholics and the alcohol lobby spends a lot of money to keep it that way. They'll be the last in the country to legalize.
Texas is always in a race for last place too
That's absolutely part of it. Here in Wisconsin the Tavern League has outsized influence and we still don't have legal weed and we lead the country in drinking. Although I've been seeing more and more of those THC drinks. I'm not sure what kind of loophole those slip through, but they seem popular.
Weed drinks and gummies, largely. I can pick them up at woodmans in the liquor section, though come November I may need to stock up
Hemp loophole
The hemp loophole
Brought to you by a senate who didnt read their own bill in 2018
man do i miss woodmans
Damn y'all don't even have medical, always thought you guys would follow us here in Michigan relatively quickly as our states have very similar politics but I didn't think about big beer lobbying.
Is there a line of dispensaries on the border in illinois then like we have here for all the ohio and indiana people coming to buy weed?
We're surrounded by legal states too. We buy their weed and they buy our fireworks.
Yeah, at least there’s one set up in South Beloit. It’s more expensive than Michigan though and has a much stricter limit on what you can buy as a non resident. We went that route before, but the grey area stuff I can get at the grocery store is much more convenient. I’d do Michigan but it’s a bit farther of a drive than Illinois. Maybe I’ll grab stuff next time I head to pictured rocks
Why don’t we have it? Wisconsin got gerrymandered to hell for a decade. The Supreme Court is now left leaning and is breaking the gerrymander, so hopefully we can get legalization of some sort soon
They're derived from hemp, which became federally legal a few years back. It's the same chemical (d9-THC) that's found in cannabis indica and sativa, but it's present in such low quantities in hemp that it takes wayyyyyy more plant matter to extract enough.
You'd think it would be the active ingredient that is regulated, not the actual plant.
It is! THC is the regulated chemical. delta-9 is a different molecule which was made federally legal as a result of allowing hemp farming
If delta-9 is a different molecule but still an active ingredient, then not all the active ingredients are regulated. And these "thc" drinks are lying.
It's possible they've only recently started earning enough to be able to afford booze.
A chunk of them still aren't old enough to buy alcohol. Of course the stats will go up as they become old enough to buy it.
In this economy?
Moonshine is about to make a glorious comeback
Lol I remember that being a thing with millennials 10 years ago
I never understood why
But then I remembered millenials (and I am one who probably leaned toward a hipster when I was young) love old timey weird stuff
drives away on his penny farthing
I made it in college because I was broke as fuck.
Fair enough
I would doubt that fact about millennials without a source to back it up. It just doesn’t track with experience, but I could definitely be wrong.
Agreed, the only people I know who drink regularly are boomers and I as a millennial only ever drink when I’m around those boomers.
Gen Z is lost to the manosphere and homesteading. Those are used to push right wing puritanical propaganda. I really hope they snap out of it.
...homesteading?
There's a massive uptic in what is functionally decentralized religious cult homesteading
Homesteading on its own sounds good. But when you look into why it's catching on right now. It's basically just religious indoctrination, manospehere, paranoia, racism, sexism, and conspiracy theories.
The "crunchy life style" is a big source of this.
It's basically living off grid, eating what you raise. It mainly draws in women by pushing traditional gender roles propaganda.
used to drink alot when i had no future prospects.
I still do, but I used to too
Acting a fool in public today means high chance someone records a video of you at your worst.
Read an article a bit ago. Take away: Millennials drink the most but largely kicked the nicotine thing. Gen Z have brought back nicotine in a big way, even causing a resurgence in chewing tobacco. Its all just homosapiens coping, so I say pick your poison and keep doing your best.
And those not doing nicotine are probably doing THC instead. There is a measurable negative impact of legalizing marijuana on alcohol sales
Which is weird, cause I can drop drinking no problem, I'm on the nicotine train for life though, 35yo.
That's interesting. I do not have any desire to start smoking, but I probably do drink more than I should. I don't drink daily, but if I have one I'm probably having 2-4. I'm a hair holder than you are fwiw.
I would assume marketing is also the influence on that decision. Seemingly gen alpha seem focused on vaping instead, so times are changing - not necessarily for the better.
Exactly. Want to actually fight drugs? Give people something to hope for, and opportunities to do better things than constantly numb oneself with various substances to cope with a soulless nightmare society.
I notice it's a good barometer for society's health: Once all the jobs start laying off again and the costs go up and up and up and we get into some other war, everybody starts reaching for the stims to get through their jobs and the narcotics to find respite from everything else.
Just constant stress and pressure in the very air. It sucks...
Yeah millennials are like the most alcoholic generation.
Laughs in British.
By the time Americans are trying alcohol for the first time, some of us are straight up alcoholics and have been trying to quit for several years.
Yeah, we're going to let you have this one
IDK, with the amount of drunk driving in the US I’ve always wondered if we shouldn’t flip the two so that people have experience with how alcohol affects them before they have the ability to get behind the wheel of a car.
Weird flex.
You can recover by telling us we're dumb for building houses out of wood, or calling us fat.
Well yes, there are several other policies and mannerisms of yours besides the 21-year-old MLDA that are quite frankly inscrutable to me.
I see a lot of ridiculouness tv show every day. The american culture like opening cans with their teeth on the side of the can and throwing themselves onto tables and from roofs is completely insane. Nobody even bats an eye.
Ooh! Ooh! Make a school shooter joke! Those are always a hit!
Americans don't even build houses out of wood anymore, we build houses out of plastic and sawdust.
Is our wooden house situation old-hat now? It seems like the problem is just going to get worse as time goes on
Nah dude we should be building heavy stone houses despite one of our coasts being highly prone to earthquakes, the entire middle of our country prone to tornadoes and only a small section of the east coast being suitable for heavy stone houses! We should be willing to be crushed to death in an earthquake or take a fat rock to the head during a tornado so they can’t talk about this anymore!!
Woah wooden houses are totally resistant to all those situations and even more! I'm certain that's why we build so many and leave them empty across every biome in the country.
!!!!!!!!!! Fuck I forgot to add all these. Just sprinkle em in as you please
Denmark that has been topping the drinking charts among 15-16 year olds almost every year this century:
Its so expensive how can this be?
We got a solution for that: Drink until you forget how much you paid.
It's not hard to get liquor as a teen in the US and it's underground. I was drinking too vomiting just about every weekend throughout highschool. I doubt that's going on as much with a 5% lager in a pub, and I don't see clubs tolerating it that much.
I'd be interested in seeing numbers on which produce more alcoholics. Coming from the latter, the former would have been much safer and better overall🤷♂️.
Some on the continent have been legally drinking since 16, and illegally since earlier than that
Majority is teens; but frankly, there are instances where children drink. At least hard liquor isnt as popular as relatively-low alcohol drinks.
I would say a majority of Americans drink long before they turn 21. I have friends who experienced exactly what you're talking about
I'm honestly so concerned by the amount of energy drinks zoomers drink, plus the vaping. They're less into downers, but fuck me they love those stimulants.
The vaping is depressing because it feels like all the gains made by anti-smoking have been eroded with more people smoking than ever before.
I personally don't mind vaping, since many smokers switched to vaping and people who vape don't emit a passive aura of stench.
Thing is, the vaping is so much worse for heavy metals, so were going to have to dedicate a huge amount of resources treating people for that since it is actually so unchecked
No it's not. The articles on that study severely misrepresented the results. Everything was under OSHA levels, significantly lower than what's in cigarettes, and a few were lower than atmospheric levels.
The formaldehyde study and the glycerin break down study had methodologies so far outside of regular usage that they were designed to produce harmful products.
The popcorn lung scare was full of shit too. Diacetyl and acetyl proponol were only used in tiny amounts in recipes that needed a buttery flavor. Despite the levels being orders of magnitude higher in cigarettes, and the only recorded cases being industrial workers and a guy with a microwave popcorn huffing fetish, the industry dropped it.
The EVALI bullshit was black market THC carts cut with Vitamin E acetate.
The amount of false propaganda against vaping is staggering. It was cutting into tobacco tax revenue, so the FDA killed the industry that was focused on harm reduction.
Oh awesome, do you have any sources on that then?
Edit: I was seriously asking though.
I personally don't care whether vaping is worse for the person doing it than smoking. The thing I do care about is that vaping affects other people much less than smoking does.
Right, but how are you measuring that? Vaping is far less addressed than tobacco cigarettes are and whatever health effects there may be could be broad enough in the coming decades to stress healthcare systems, and it has facilitated an entire industry of disposable coils and batteries used to power the things, which then just get chucked wherever. It's maybe less harmful in terms of second hand smoke, though I haven't read any study to confirm that, but that isn't the only way harm is caused.
I've binned off both but personally it's the cigarettes I miss, especially straights. Vaping just tastes cloying as fuck to me now, it's so strongly flavoured if you're vaping a lot you become totally nose-blind to it.
At least with Vaping there's no second hand smoke iirc, so while it's still bad for you it doesn't damage the people around you too thus it's more of a personal choice
Ngl I have a problem with energy drinks.... been trying to ditch them in favour of coffee
I was a heavy coffee drinker until they found my heart defect.
Now I have no caffeine, doctor's orders, for 22 ish years now.
Sometimes I'll sneak a sip of coffee if I have a migraine, it helps. But God help me I won't sleep that night.
You don't realize how much of a tolerance to and a dependence on caffeine that you build up, until you're off of it for awhile, and try some again.
It really has a powerful effect on you, even if you don't realize it right now.
If I drank an energy drink right now, after being dry for so long, my heart would definitely race and I doubt I'd sleep for two days.
I don't miss caffeine though, honestly. I don't wake up tired anymore, I just, wake up. And drink some water 🤷♂️ then go to work, feeling fine. Not amazingly energized, but not dragging either.. Just.. Normal 🤷♂️
Caffeine is a drug like anything else. If you can get off the stuff for awhile, say 6 months? I bet you'll be amazed at how you feel, and you won't go back.
I have ADHD and dont take the meds and im pretty sure without caffeine id just fall apart.
Also ADHD here, but perhaps a different blend? At any rate, I function 🤷♂️
Yeah I just about function, failed university and got kicked out but am able to hold down a job and pay rent thank fuck.
Is there a reason you don't take the meds, like cost or something?
If not, you should definitely prioritize the meds, you're going to build up a resilience to Caffeine faster and it's like, so bad for you. I get it though, weed and caffeine are super common and effective forms of self-medication fot ADHD.
I can only get generic concerta on the NHS which does NOT work at all, sideeffects are not worth the impact it has. If I want to be in a medicated state I generally just obtain high quality speed paste and dose it at a theraputic level.
Jesus christ, and I thought Canadian healthcare was a shit show. From what I understand, lisdexafetamine (Vyanse) should also be covered by the NHS, though I'm not sure about what the requirements for generic brands are there. It's much, much easier on you than something like concerts.
I want Vyvanse but cannot get it due to shortages, I know for a fact that amphetamines work well for me even mentioned it to my doctor that I'd tried them but alas. NHS is seemingly in a constant state of meltdown.
The difference is incredible! I am not and never was a caffeine addict. I just drink from time to time and I enjoy the taste. But that "from time to time" is like once in 3 months. Or at least when I need energy and my sleep was short that night.
The difference is insane! It keeps me glued and moving the whole day. I come off work and I do things non stop. I can't shut up. It doesn't let me fall asleep quicker than usual (10-15min). It feels that it is a some sort of an enhancement drug.
I hope I will never require it most of the days so I won't build tolerance. And I do not want to get addicted to energy drinks. If coffee is a mild enhancement drug, energy drink is a straight up poison mixed with cocaine.
The piper is coming. No I'm not defending alcohol, but the level of drug addiction among our young people is shocking. The amount of digital addiction is shocking. I work in youth crisis so I am not talking on my ass, most young people are addicts now. So it's all fun to talk down about boomers who drank but holy fuck is this generation ever screwed.
While what you seen is definitely real, it may not be as bad as what you see as you work in the field of youth crisis. You see it so often as that is your job and it can skew your findings to be more to the negative side as people that are not having those issues likely aren't going to a youth crisis center and therefore are not around you. Again, it is very much a thing, but you do have some unintended bias as that is what you do for a living.
You are assuming that my experience is limited to youth crisis.
I have 11 years of experience working in addiction,... My response to your cynicism is this... You can only truly understand the scope of the greater issues on all levels ... And with all generations, once you've worked in the field. And it helps to have lived experience.
Edit: oh yeah I know, I'll up vote the uninformed opinion, and I'll downvote the person who works in the field and is an educated and trained and expert /s
If it helps, I gave you both updoots because the discussion was enlightening and mostly productive. :)
Go to your settings > scroll down to "Show Scores" > uncheck all that shit. You don't need it. It's a vestigial dark pattern from commercial social media design to keep you checking how well your comments are "scoring" as if that made any sense.
It should never have been surfaced to frontend of Lemmy.
Having a coping mechanism because we are not hopeful about the future is standard from my experience
Truth.
And that's why it's really not a contest, and we must forgive our parents' generation and a few going back from there.
Right? At least I can drink and work.
Wait...
I don't want to have an automatic yeah no yeah no back and forth with you but... I suspect I'm much older than you and I can attest here that most people, even in professional roles, were hammered all day. They were as "functional" as this current generation is on ridiculous amounts of weed, psychedelics, and uppers... That is to say, not as functional as they could be. There's no "what's worse" contest here; the choice of drug doesn't change the underlying issue. I'm a recovered addict and I work in the field of addiction so I'm speaking from the heart.
I just injected another marijuana in your honor good sir /s
And yet it didn't make you funny, weird 🤷
Nope, everything else was though
Not all of them are even old enough to buy it yet.
That never stopped me, when I was a teenager.
Love a pint, personally. Drinking with friends trumps most other activities. Currently on my way to see The Prodigy with some old friends I'm meeting in Edinburgh. Looking forward to the pubs and merry laughs as much as the gig, in fact more so.
You know what else we also didn't poison ourselves with at anywhere NEARLY as high a level as boomers did? Lead.
Now we just consume lead trough plant based protein supplements
https://www.npr.org/2025/10/16/nx-s1-5576294/protein-powder-lead-consumer-reports
But that's mostly because the US supplements industry is an unregulated disaster.
"trough"? That's a new one to add to this thing:
English is a tough language. It can be mastered through thorough thought though, while you sit next to a trough.
That is still a very worrying sentence when the only safe level is 0
Safe level is zero but there's a gradient of severity
of course. I'm alluding to the fact that while theres been a significant improvement, we still in many places consume worrying amounts of lead.
originally i wanted to write that we didn't have lead exposure, but ...
Flint Michigan. and that's actually not even the worst municipal water system by far. That's merely the one that got a little more publicity than most.
It's nice that we don't have fumes from leaded gasoline, generally speaking--that it's no longer the standard and most household sector products that use fuel don't take leaded gasoline.
Yep. I don't hear many folks talk about Jackson, Mississippi's lead water problem. You'd think that being the capital of Mississippi that it would be talked about more.
Ehm. Cigarettes, alcohol, cocaine, ketamine, speed, xtc, ghb, lsd, etc. Just alcohol is for noobs.
where is good old weed?
It gets me fucked up in my head so I don't like it. The weed we have around here is next level stuff. I smoked when I was young but can't handle it anymore.
That's something I applaud the younger generations for. I'm just hoping that it's not due to not socializing in person.
From what I've seen in the UK, it's not that the youth particularly see temperance as a virtue it's more than unless you're going to a Spoons pints are £6 if not more these days. Ket is big in Britain too, on account of it being cheap especially compared to pints. They don't want to be filmed while hammered and immortalised on tiktok either.
I feel it's a common problem that economic factors are often attributed to moral ones.
It tastes like ass as well. I haven't drank in like 8 years by now, but I think I would've taken longer to quit it if it tasted like a full fat Coke, lol.
Tastes are funny. I think coke tastes like ass. I'd much rather have a good beer.
Yeah, same. Was struck by it at a korean restaurant that had the equivalent of a wine pairing, and their selection was just … something for children, only children can't drink. As in, I like straight soju and makgeolli, but I'd rather get some craft makgeolli without sweeteners than something flavoured like chemical blueberry replica.
Commercially produced makgeolli will always use artificial sweeteners because there's still active fermenting taking place and any real sweeteners will be turned into alcohol, which will effect the taste and alcohol content. With craft makgeolli, you add a sweetener, like juice or honey or sugar, shortly before serving.
Mmm, bottle fermentation.
But I think the main point is more along the lines of expectations for alcohol and general tastes: I find overly sweet stuff a turn-off, and generally need to temper sweet stuff with something sour or bitter.
Also, mixing juice and alcohol can very often result in what a lot of us drank as teenagers, and may have rather negative associations to. Like I don't have problems with gimlets and micheladas or radlers, but I think I prefer them all on the boozier side, and stuff like rum & coke is just … not for me.
So if I go to a restaurant and get what I interpret as more or less teenager drinking swill full of artificial flavouring, Black Tower and general goon sack swill, I'm going to have a bad time, and be left wondering if this stuff is actually representative of what they consider alcohol for adults, or if the people at the restaurant are being weird.
Yeah, the smell of RedBull vodka makes me nearly puke now, after young me actually puked too often from it
I also don't like sweet alcohol stuff.
My little brother on the other side doesn't like beer and tends more to those sugar bombs.
Can't understand it... The sugar makes the hangover much worse
I drank Malibu once, when I was 12. I got very drunk (as 12 year olds do), and haven’t been able to smell it without nausea since
Yeah, I get it. There was a bit of a fruit flavored soju fad about ten years ago in Korea, but that has pretty much completely died off. You'd be hard pressed to find soju cocktails or makgeolli dolled up in Korea outside of a few regional places that want to be known for chestnut or corn or sweet potato makgeolli.
And I feel like when I first started drinking, 15, 16 years old, drinks with flavor were easier to consume. As drinking progressed, those were the drinks I avoided like the plague. I haven't had a long island iced tea since I was 21 or 22.
And that's not to say there aren't well crafted cocktails that taste good, but none of them taste like a coke.
I'm not against a pornstar martini every once in a while, but only if it's made well. I've had instant cocktails and those are not even worth the tin they're served in.
I will say that Surfsides aren't bad, but generally I'm not a fan of any of them.
Most canned margaritas due in a pinch though. Learned this on a spirit flight
Sugar is more addictive than alcohol.
And so is coffee from what my mom tells me but nobody cheated, got rowdy or beat his wife because of too many churros, lol.
And pound for pound almost just as bad for your liver
This sounded like bullshit but I’m open to the idea enough to do a few minutes of digging. The study that the first few search results reference tested rats and found that, according to my understanding at least, intermittent sugar intake can be addictive in a similar manner to opiates, but to a smaller degree than actual opiates. There was no comparison to alcohol.
There was this brief article where the chair of nutrition at Harvard said sugar can mimic some traits of addictiveness but specifically stated it can’t be classified the same as alcohol or nicotine. No actual study done, just a guy who presumably knows what he’s talking about.
So claiming sugar is more addictive than alcohol still sounds like bullshit to me. Habit forming? Yes. Withdrawal symptoms after high regular consumption? Yes. Over consumed (at least in the US)? Hell yes. But more addictive than alcohol? Do you have an actual source to support such a claim?
They compared sugar to the worst known addictive substance- opiates. Alcohol is far less addictive than opiates. Therefore, despite a lack of quantizing what is "less", it is likely that sugar is more addictive than alcohol.
I do think a lot of people force themselves to like it, when it's "cool" as a young adult. I'd bet most people would pick a different drink if there was no buzz around alcohol.
100%. I never could convince myself to like it and I tried like hell in my early 20s. Then I discovered hard cider, still not better than a soda but good enough to easily get fucked up with.
But then weed became legal and I've all but phased out drinking altogether. Besides, it's too damn expensive
"Cool" or "tough", I saw it both in my teenage and army days. People are very silly. Being a good family man, responsible father and loving husband, that's cool; controlling one's anger, being self-sacrificial, needing little and giving a lot, that's tough. Oh well. 🤷♂️🙃
I haven't drank in ~2.5 years and got served an alcoholic beer on accident.
Even the first sip tasted awful. Super sweet but at the same time like disinfectant.
And I used to love this brand of beer. Crazy how much of an acquired taste alcohol is.
You sure that wasn’t an alcohol free beer? Unless it’s de-alcholized beer, a non-alcoholic beer is stopped being brewed before a lot of the sugar from the yeast is turned into alchohol.
So they tend to be sweeter unless they add some additives, and they taste like stale alcohol as well, that could have been the disinfectant tinge. As they are still 0.5% alcohol typically.
100% sure because I've ordered the nonalcoholic Version and they apologised about a hundred times when I pointed out it was an alcoholic beer.
I drink a lot of non alcoholic beers and tried a lot of different brands, so I'm used to the way they taste. Also a lot of them have very low amounts of sugar in them (I.e. Jever fun, Fürstenberg 0%, etc).
Sweet beer?
What brand was it. Beer is bitter, not sweet unless you add some fruit or it’s mixed beer with juice something else.
Beer should be barley (wheat/rice/etc), hops, water, and yeast. That’s it.
It was Hacker-Pschorr Weißbier, so a Bavarian would say as beer as it can get
I see that’s a perfectly normal ingredient list. Maybe the glass wasn’t cleaned? That’s so weird about the sweet though.
I’ve had some 8% fruit yeasted beers, and they do taste like juice though.
I can't stand beer or wine (or Coke), but I genuinely enjoy the harsh taste of hard liquor. I stopped drinking over a year ago and have no desire to ever drink alcohol again, but sometimes the craving for the taste hits me so hard and I almost give in until I remember how alcohol makes me feel, both while I'm drinking it and the day after. I really wish I could sit and enjoy a few drinks for the taste without there being any alcohol in it.
I can drink beer, but after working on and off at a distillery for a decade as a contractor, the smell of vodka/whiskey just makes me gag.
Wonder if it's somewhat emotional, like reminiscing the "good ol' days", or if it's just truly an acquired taste. Idk, I probably partied and drank more than 95% of "programmer socks" and "ugh I hate people" lemmings but now even a glass of prosecco is not tasty at all, lol. I could just have juice, and for a fraction of the price!
I'm gonna say it, alcohol and smoking is shit. Especially those who smoke you even smell like shit
As a millennial enjoying a cocktail right now, hey, you do you.
Not sure if boomers includes late forties but I quit drinking 4 or 5 years ago & went vegetarian.
Best decisions of my life after marriage & having kids.
Late forties is late gen x, a firm decade between you and the boomwrs
Damn, even gen X forgot about gen X
I stopped drinking against my will, and every day I open the news I wish to god I could pick it back up.
Older Millennial here, they are right, too bad people my age didn't get the memo. Never understood, even back in school, why getting plastered is celebrated.
Because... well... points around in multiple directions
That's not going to make anything better though. You'll just go down a path of addiction and self-destruction. Plus it's expensive.
The main reason I've decided to abstain from alcohol is because I've seen first-hand what alcoholism does to a person. I've don't want to end like my dad.
Same! I'm Gen-X and promised myself at age 4 when I witnessed my dad was always stumbling into the house drunk & ill & scary, I have no desire to put any poison into my body. Still never have and never will.
If alcohol guarantees death at 60 like my alcoholic narcissistic pos dad, I think I'll just keep drinking. Other drugs too because I'm not a fucking square like he was :). If you have someone (even if it's just you) to protect from yourself, I completely understand. edit: shit, if you have another good reason, that's cool too. I'm drunk.
Yeah. I’m not a Boomer I’m GenX, but as I get older I come to realize - poisoning myself with alcohol is becoming more & more appealing. Life sucks.
You know its funny that caffeine and nicotine and alcohol and fake sugar all cause me serious health issues.
I pray we stop putting caffeine in everything especially soda so I can enjoy it again.
But honestly; Im fine drinking my caffeine free teas and fruit drinks and water though.
Maybe I should see a doctor lol.
One time a friend of mine showed me this chicken they got from the food pantry and one of the ingredients was caffeine. Needless to say I don't eat much food pantry meat these days. Why was there caffeine in that chicken I may never know.
We found better poisons.
Tide pods?
Too awful tasting.
Well.. you would know
Sleep aids work but suck if you fail. That's what I tried doing.
Sadly, found out my niece has been getting blacked out drunk in college repeatedly. In one of the videos she showed me, she probably consumed more alcohol in a 5-second clip than I have in 2 years. Just a bottle of Tito's, and she just chugged it.
In the community page of my investment platform, the older folks who invested in Diageo, the parent company of Guiness, are genuinely shocked and finally convinced that younger generations are drinking less because Diageo is struggling financially.
Nevermind the health reasons why drinking alcohol is bad, it just really have become expensive to go out, let alone go drinking alcohol!
I'm middle aged, I've never smoked, at the most in my younger years I'd drink one glass of wine or cider or something like that a week. I don't anymore, I have maybe 3 drinks a year tops now. It's amazing to me how my parents' generation is still alive because they smoked like fiends and drank buckets of rum and cokes on the weekends, and I'd say that they weren't big drinkers compared to others.
Try growing up in Russia
No thanks
Millennial here, been drinking heavy for 20+ years. Young generation missing out. But at the same time I respect the decision
And same face for younger generation when they have difficulties meeting people and building relationships with colleagues etc.
Boomers love vaping, once it is a product to sell them
Thing is- it's the boomers that pushed things like the 21 to drink laws and the absurdly strict enforcement of them (like sending a parent to jail if their kid has a party).
You guys spent a few decades decrying teenage drinking, making it hard for teens to drink. And now you all are shocked when kids do something else.
Don't forget- nicotine is 18+ not 21+. So chances are every high schooler has a friend or a sibling that can get them vapes.
Vapes are small. Many don't look like anything in particular to someone who doesn't know what they are. And they are easy to hide, easy to conceal, easy to transport, AND easy to use throughout the day.
So for a substance for kids to get into, it's got a lot of advantages over alcohol.
Plus which vaping is much more common to do alone. Kids are spending far less time on in-person social interactions now (probably because boomers flipped out over stranger danger).
I've read that certain GLPs used for weight loss can also cause a distaste for alcohol. Someone that had been a somewhat regular drinker was interviewed saying they suddenly found that they didn't like the taste anymore and stopped drinking alcoholic beverages.
Not gonna say that's the whole cause of course, but it may be a contributing factor.
I pretty much stopped drinking on Wegovy mostly because I always feel full and I have to choose between a cocktail or food.
I know quite a few bartenders who tell me that it is true that younger kids aren’t drinking but they are still going to the bars with friends that do drink. Where before you might have a customer a night who didn’t drink now there are a few tables with groups that includes nonalcoholic drinkers. A couple have told me of groups where the non drinkers out number the person drinking alcoholic beverages. They just want to hangout with friends and sip cokes or club sodas. As long as they tip something no one cares.
They already paid for the drinks.
In Seattle they serve CBD sodas. Nice alternative and flavorful
A beer delivery driver told my where he’s based at they can only deliver CBD or THC sodas to the strip clubs. I had no idea some of them couldn’t serve beer. Missouri for ya.
I don't believe that nobody cares. Coke is $5 maybe. Any fucking thing in restaurant with any alcohol is $15+
Profit margins on cocktails are basically 100%
Way more than 100% I think. I've heard from a guy who was a restaurant manager that 1 drink pays for the bottle, and cocktails are even more marked up I reckon
Millennials when gen y avoid social media
...Millennials are gen Y?
Vaping isn’t a great alternative. Pick your poison. Fapping on the other hand… don’t sleep on edible cannabis either
Not a boomer (Born in '83) but right now I am enjoying my... third?... glass of strong beer
It's a lot easier to get a place at the bar these days.
One thing is, it's harder to find a scene because most people stay home, but the people who do do out are out to meet people and have fun.
hehe doodoo
Where I am, some vape shops market themselves like they're dispensaries.
Maybe if they stuck with tradition they'd know how to fucking spell
Thank you!
They will take pills in their 30s to fight depression anyway
will do. starting... now
hey, man. i'm a gen-xer drinking lime beer and watching 90s general hospital episodes on youtube.
lemme lay it down for you, youngin'.
pokeman is lame. memes are lame. drinking alcoholic beverages without alcohol is lame. naming an alcoholic beverage without alcohol a 'mocktail' is lame.
your entire generation is composed of 90% plastic from soda bottles and the other 10% is from social media propaganda. you don't want to poison yourselves lol.
HAHAHAHAHAHA.
any questions?
Fellow genxer: you don't speak for all of us. Yes times were harder. Especially for minorities. If we knew better: then it should have been better. But We didn't have the answers.
So siddown old man.
Yeah. Why on Earth do you think I care whether a random unc thinks something I do is lame?
Yeah. How come no matter what color the shampoo is the lather is always white?
What’s a genx? lol FORGOTTEM!
Right on brother
Doesn't drink or smoke, poisons themselves with anything and everything else under the disguise of trying to achieve enlightenment through mushrooms, drugs or trying to live healthy by consuming supplements, vegan substitute of real things etc...