My parents legitimately believe ivermectin is a cure all and are stockpiling it. They take it for just about anything. They also believe plenty of other wacky things like viruses don't exist and cancer is just a fungal infection.
My dad last year nearly lost his foot after it got infected. They let it fester for months and only treated it with like essential oils or some other pseudoscience. He eventually had to go to the emergency room and stay at the hospital and receive antibiotics. 🙄
And immediately saw the error in his ways? Absolutely not. These people get sick to the point of dying. Go to the emergency room and get healed through real medicine and the efforts of a dozen nurses and a doctor or two. Then they leave and brag to their friends and family "see told you I'd be fine" and never give credit to the REAL medicine that fixed the issue.
Many of my relatives are diehard MAGA. So, when Trump said not to wear masks or quarantine, my aunt and her husband and son went out of their way to basically spend every second they could at superspreader events. They were warned it was dangerous, not restricted in any way, but still felt the need to act out to validate political feelings.
Naturally, they all caught COVID in the early days. My uncle and cousin both passed, leaving my aunt as a devastated shell of a woman. When we would see each other at family dinners she would usually just sit with a far-off, forlorn look. Every once in a while she would tune in for a bit to spout some pro-Trump bullshit. I wanted to scream “He helped to kill your family!”
I decided to just stop spending time with these people before I said something I would regret.
But would you really regret screaming 'he helped to kill your family'? I think it would be awesome ... unless there's a significant inheritance at stake.
The problem is that American politicians are gutting the school system because they WANT more mentally disabled people. "I love the poorly educated" - DJT. People like this lady, who will manslaughter their families for Trump, are spreading his propaganda. I don't care how sad she is, if she's spreading his propaganda and telling other people to go through the same tragedy. Someone needs to speak up and stop the cycle of pointless deaths.
Mentally disabled or not, these people are destroying the country. They are hurting lots of other people. They should know better. They have made a choice to be that way and refuse to change even with the brutal consequences made very clear. If they won't see reason they deserve ridicule.
We don't say 'oh the poor Nazis, they were mentally disabled' - no, we fought them and sacrificed big time to destroy their evil ways.
If that mentally disabled person was killing people? Yeah, I'd yell at them. Other people dying doesn't mean anything to these people because they don't care about other people. The only thing they understand is themselves
The woman's mind is broken. She's a cult victim. If she's not actively harming OP, why would being cruel help now? She's already killed her husband, in her mind. She's fucked already.
Good choice. There's no getting them out of it without professional help. This is an identity cult. They identity is tied to his, that's why their ego can't take any hits on him. They explain everything away.
My dad literally will not talk to me because I refused to say that ivermectin is a miracle cure. He’s angry at me for some study or article that he thinks I am obsessed with (I honestly have no idea what he’s talking about), and insists I retract my belief in it or we can’t have a relationship. Since I haven’t the first clue what he’s even on about, he made his choice..
Can’t wait for the next round of crackpot email forwards. Hopefully he sticks to his word and won’t contact me anymore.
Edit - the last time I spoke with him was at my step mom’s funeral, where she had just died of cancer, which they treated with….I’ll give you one guess.
I guess I can somewhat understand his obstinance towards you. If he admits he’s wrong, he also has to admit he had a hand in killing his wife through willful ignorance.
What sucks the most is that ivermectin is a miracle cure! It just isn't helpful again COVID or Hantavirus. The 2015 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine was awarded (in part) for discovering ivermectin.
It's what frustrates me the most about discussion with people like this. They're willing to take a random drug, a drug that is fully backed by the medical community, but they're not willing to take the drug actually recommended by the medical community.
I have a similar experience with my own father after he started using TikTok and Instagram, though it's not about ivermectin (spoiler: he thinks I'm a "commie"). I think old people are just not equipped to survive on the internet. It's like they lack the instincts to known when they're being scammed.
It gives me a tiny bit of hope for the future, because even though gen alpha aren't exactly the brightest generation so far, they're at least all fully attuned to the internet and (hopefully) better equipped to navigate its many perils.
I think old people are just not equipped to survive on the internet
I think its people in general
During lock down when people were at home and having to amuse themselves some made bread and did arts and crafts, whilst others ended up jumping off a cliff into conspiracy theories and right wing bollocks
One guy I know of suggested ivermectin and dog dewormers to treat my bf's cancer because 'cancer is caused by parasites.... there's plenty of information on the internet.... you can do your own research...etc etc'
I used to think the average person was mostly decent and sensible, but not anymore
Idk what the hell happened to baby boomers. When I was growing up my parents (boomers) constantly reminded me you can't believe everything you read online and that the "girl" I was chatting with on AIM could actually be some fat 40 year old pedo.
That wasn't uncommon, that was the same experience all my buddies had and same thing was drilled into us at school.
Now, I'm seeing these folks treat memes on Facebook like it's the gospel truth. Or some random mommy blog post with zero references as straight facts. It's so maddening ... What happened to these people?
I have an uncle who is basically a leftist boomer, but who is into that Art Bell kind of stuff. More recently he's been getting into the "big pharma is keeping us sick" stuff and it's really frustrating to see.
My mom died a couple years ago (she thought "vibration therapy" would cure her cancer), and when my sister and I were cleaning up her house to sell it we found so many empty bottles of ivermectin as well as other crazy stuff. It's just the stupidest scam. Oh, medicine, biology, chemistry, etc is all bullshit, but horse medicine? Yeah, that's legit.
My mother, a once slightly famous biochemist, died in December from influenza. Tragic that someone who had been a health nut her entire life (other than the 2 pack a day smoking habit she fostered from 11 to somewhere in her 40s) became a complete anti science loon as she got older.
She always believed in new age crap. She was confined that she could see auras and perform psychic healing when l was a kid. She's the reason that I was dosed with ghastly spinach 'smoothies' instead of surgery to relieve the pressure on my brain after a TBI when I was 7.
But it ramped up massively in the information age. No longer relegated to fringe bookstores, her rampant need to be a keeper of the secret teachings was validated by a cadre of charlatans and lunatics online. She became rabidly anti-vaxx, except when forced to so she could travel to southeast Asia... right as lockdown happened in the US. Did she reconsider this ill conceived motion? He'll no!
She managed her sky high cholesterol with a variety of herbs or whatnot. Same with blood pressure issues. Then had a catastrophic stroke not too long after that covid road tour. Never recovered and very likely was receiving poor care while sick with influenza.
At least it's not shungight. Viral medical trends are problematic when they get sold as cure calls, bad when it's unfounded, worse when it's half true. Poisons the well.
IMO, this is one of the consequences of not having universal health insurance that isn't talked about enough. If the bar for going to the doctor is "about to lose a limb from infection", then people become vulnerable to pseudo-scientific garbage, simply because they hardly ever receive advice from actual medical professionals.
This is one my comment talking point. When people have to think about "can I afford this?" anytime they need to goto the doctor, then they'll only go when it's serious. But they are not qualified medical professionals to decide what needs medical attention or not. So they seek advice from other people, past experiences and Internet and we have this problem.
Honestly, it shouldn't cost that much to just goto a doctor's office and return. We don't need MD for everything, have other professional people there that are qualified enough to tell you when something doesn't need attention, or simple solutions. Maybe just cleaning a scrap, or giving you a brace for minor sprain, all those without having to see MD.
I have a lump that my doctor recommended I go see a specialist for a look. But I am waiting for my insurance to settle the bill / or wait to be able to afford both bills.
You should not have to be ill or have to explain why you need to take a day off. Just have sufficient undesignated PTO to maintain good mental and physical health.
My US doctor is pretty good about telehealth visits. I can send them messages online, or schedule video appointments for certain things. it makes it much easier to get questions answered or schedule visits with some more flexibility. I know many states still don't allow any medical access via phone/video/online.
In Mexico, I can ask questions and talk to my doctor over Whatsapp. I don't need to log into a healthcare website to ask for the minor requests.
The US is such a backwards place and the healthcare system is incredibly broken.
I agree with you 100%. When the prospect of a health emergency or chronic condition means bankruptcy, people can’t help but look for alternatives.
Under a capitalist system where anyone can sell ‘supplements’ and any other random ‘treatment’ under the radar long enough to make a quick buck, misinformation abounds and the desperate roll the dice.
Health care isn’t just that. It’s what keeps families together, it’s what keeps communities together, and it’s a tragic farce that too many of us see it as a privilege and not a right.
The bar for a lot of us is also at "about to lose a limb from infection". The only difference is that we don't get a hospital bill to go with that visit.
I noticed Canada is recruiting healthcare professionals from the US, and one of the things they really like is being able to provide healthcare without the middleman insurance companies denying healthcare.
In the US, people don't go to the doctor when they have a problem, they go as a last resort because they have to ask themselves how much it would cost.
18% of Americans haven't ever seen a doctor and 40% of Americans haven't seen one for 5 years.
A number of studies in low income communities in the south show that over 60% of people in those communities have intestinal parasites. That's just the ones we know of.
One thing we know for sure is that ivermectin is about as magic as they say it is for parasites only. It's a fantastic drug for that.
Over 60% of low income citizens would likely feel much better after getting their parasites removed from ivermectin. So what they are seeing, seems true. They could be sick from something else but get rid of a long standing comorbidity of a pariste infection, you bet they are feeling good. They just think that relief from the varied symptoms from parasite is actually something else cured.
This ivermectin religion has real miracles, it's just not the ones they think they are. This belief is entirely created because Americans don't have healthcare. That's why this belief isn't found elsewhere.
"I am solving the problem by taking the medicine, and I am smart because I'm using a secret medicine they don't want me to know about" causes the brain to release the good feelings chemicals which does make you feel better.
In the US, people don’t go to the doctor when they have a problem, they go as a last resort because they have to ask themselves how much it would cost.
In Estonia it's sorta the same except a visit costs nothing for the GP and 20 euros for the initial visit to a specialty doctor (subsequent visits are free).
We just don't go to the doctor because we're stubborn as fuck and "it'll heal on its own".
Hmm looks like some stats I pulled were from polls, and I fell victim to people paraphrasing that around 20% of rural people not having a primary care doctor in the last few years as "not even having seen a doctor" sorry about that.
I haven't seen a doctor in at least a decade and a half, when my parents took me to checkups as a child. I'm very lucky to be healthy, and am in the gym 3-5 days a week to keep my streak going as long as possible.
However, I'm calling bullshit on this:
A number of studies in low income communities in the south show that over 60% of people in those communities have intestinal parasites. That’s just the ones we know of.
That sounds insane to me. 60% is a motherfucking epidemic. Where's the source for these studies???
It's extremely common in Africa. My ex who was Zulu hated that you couldn't get deworming here. Ignore the fact that in Ontario you aren't getting worms. She brought her misconceptions that KZN is like here.
I don't get vaccinated regularly. Covid was an exception, and I got that at some medical place that was offering them for free (In hindsight idk what type of business they were, but the dude who injected me looked like a real doctor)
They could be sick from something else but get rid of a long standing comorbidity of a pariste infection, you bet they are feeling good. They just think that relief from the varied symptoms from parasite is actually something else cured.
TL;DR: Studies showing a positive effect from Ivermectin on Covid came mostly from areas with high worm infection incidence, areas with low incidence showed no or smaller positive effect.
NB: Link is a selfhosted Substack, works better with JavaScript turned off.
Honestly. So much overreaction about this. Everyone is letting the news work their manipilative bullshit spreading panic and fear so you keep tuning in and clicking o
Its pretty sad to see how many people on the fediverse are falling for the bs
It does with this strain/variant which is why this story is newsworthy. But the usual one does not. There have been localized outbreaks of this one in the past but never a worldwide pandemic.
As much as I agree with the sentiment of the comment you responded to, I appreciate you for keeping the conversation grounded and honest. You deserve every upvote.
If it hadn't left the ship you'd be right, but it has. A Swiss man left the cruise and tested positive later. If he rode public transit during rush hour even once while infected it could be bad.
I'm not as familiar with Swiss transport, but I've been packed ass to face many of times on a train in Europe
Notable that the virus has a 1 to 8 Week incubation period. The first guy died 5 days into the trip. Implying that he(and probably his wife) brought it onto the ship.
Right if you read the article he was the only one that both left the ship and was later confirmed as infected. There was another Dutch couple that left while sick and quickly were hospitalized. My concern is he was able to move around freely all while he was unknowingly infected. He seems to be the one that had the most opportunity to spread the infection.
Others also left early and have been quarantined. They have not shown symptoms so I didn't bring them up when discussing spread. One infected couple left early as well, but they were already sick and didn't leave South Africa. Although they may have infected a flight attendant, still waiting on tests.
Of course the virus can have a long incubation period. So these individuals may be more relevant to discussion later. There are those that were evacuated to recieve medical treatment elsewhere, but it's not like they are walking around their respective countries.
So first, i don't think that article says they tracked them all.
And second, if you can test them and rule out infection with certainty, why would they be ordered to isolate?
I think the incubation period does play a role there.
Authorities in St. Helena, the volcanic British territory in the South Atlantic where passengers disembarked, said they were monitoring a small number of people who were considered "higher risk contacts." Those contacts were being told to isolate for 45 days, the St. Helena government said.
Yes those higher risk contacts in St. Helena are those that interacted with the passangers/crew when the ship was in port. They are not the people that were passangers on board the ship that left.
And second, if you can test them and rule out infection with certainty, why would they be ordered to isolate?
I did not say this. They are testing an already ill flight attendant. You can't test during the incubation period. Which is highly variable with this virus.
The incubation period is huge. In 40 days we'll know if we are having another pandemic or not.
Hantavirus is not COVID. Every contagious disease isn’t spread through aerosols. Hantavirus needs close, extended contact to transfer, unlike COVID. You’re not going to get hantavirus from walking into a store.
Yes I understand that. Being crammed against another person for a long enough period of time seems right. During any major holiday if you take a train you can easily spend 1 or 2 hours pressed against a few people. Seems fairly close and extended to me. Especially considering there may have already been spread of the virus from contact in an airplane.
Rush hour commutes you might be pressed against a couple of people for 20 minutes or so depending on your commute. This is close, but maybe not extended enough.
Okay now I'm confused. I was talking about the Swiss guy who returned to Switzerland and the public transit system of Europe.
I suppose we're on a thread talking about some American public figures huffing Ivermectin, but I was more concerned about the spread. Which seems like it will kick off in Europe first
Oh, I misunderstood, because of the OP I thought we were talking about the US. I still wouldn’t worry about it, you need bodily fluid contact to transfer it. Monkeypox is more contagious and it never took off.
It was relatively new(20 years 30 years) to the southern end of South America, they beat out an initial outbreak of it, has been endemic there since.
Not too much reaearch has been done on it, i.e. few experts.
It appears that it is most, and potentially only infectious when symptoms are showing, particularly the fever, but is very easily spread during that small window.
It seems like it isnt as easily spread as covid, but yeah, is much nastier.
Three that I know of.
The Eurasian/African one that is the least dangerous and doesnt transmit human to human.
The continental Americas strain that is pretty dangerous(lethality in the 30-60% range) but doesn't spread human to human.
The new kid on the block, the Andes strain, an offshoot of the Americas one. Last Outbreak was in a small town in Argentina in 2018, first discovered 1995, first human to human 1996. ~40 known infections, 11 deaths. Can spread human to human. It has already been confirmed we are dealing with this one.
That's almost as good as my idea. I thought like a really light version of COVID with nothing but light symptoms like fever and sneezing, but it would change your DNA just the right way, so you develop a hidden FFI prion infection, leading to you eventually not being able to sleep until you die.
By the time anyone realizes it is even a thing, nearly everyone would be infected, just a few prions would be 100% fatal, and there would be nowhere on Earth to hide.
Everyone dies from lack of sleep induced dementia.
tinkering with the linux homelab on which u host ur socialist lemmy instance while wearing thigh high socks and a collar and a maid outfit and being forced to take a break from ur tinkering by someone queer dragging u into bed using a leash
accurate description of the average lemmy user (myself included (i wish))
I love not having worms in me exactly as much as I love ivermectin, basically a miracle drug for that. They must be getting the dosage wrong tho because they've clearly got brain worms.
So she thinks (I know, I know) that getting “natural immunity” to COVID protects her from hantavirus? The ivermectin is just the icing on the cake, honestly.
It's what happens when practicing medical physicians forget they are not really researchers. The main problem is that medical schools do teach research, but just enough to give people a false confidence in their own abilities. Medicine covers so much information that medical school is basically just a series of introduction courses. Like with most positions as a physician, your real knowledge comes from what you actually practice during your residency and specialty training.
I specialize in orthopedics and rehabilitation, I can understand the mechanisms and physiology involved in studies done over rna virus replication, but I wouldn't feel confident in my ability to draw conclusions from those studies that are not explicitly stated in the study itself.
From my understanding invermectin has show itself to have some promising potential for moderating rna viruses from replicating. However, it's not very water soluble and so there are currently no effective means to actually get the medication to the affected cells. Which is why none of the studies done on cell cultures in a laboratory can't be extrapolated upon and applied to people.
Even if you are taking 100x the recommended dose, it's mainly just going to travel through your digestive tract and cause more harm than good.
Early laboratory research indicated that ivermectin could kill the SARS-CoV-2 virus, but this was later found to require, in many cases, toxic doses far exceeding those approved for humans. Antivaxxers latched onto this and ran with it, spreading the misinformation far and wide.
Well, there was evidence that it helped and then mainstream pharmaceutical buried the evidence and killed all the scientists. Cause it'd affect their bottom line. And then you've got the secret kabal controlling everything that wants us hooked on their drugs for mind control. The anti-christ is alive, right now, and his name is healthcare /s
The real reason is probably that it was a dewormer that helped some very sick people feel better when they had covid, and then conspiracies about it took off when scientists said "yeah, that's probably not helpful for covid". Science is a messy process, but because of the authoritative way it's taught, people have trouble connecting the process of finding answers in real time with the firmness of the results. That, plus grifters pumping people full of fear and anxiety so they keep coming back for the next hit. It's not pushing ivermectin because they have stake in it. It's pushing ivermectin because it fits a pre-established narrative and thinking is, like, real tough, y'all. You gotta, like, put effort into that. Which is dumb. I've got this one drum, I'mma bang it all day.
I wanna believe that Ivermectine is so consistently reported by these people as helpful because they all have parasites from raw meat diets. So when they get sick with covid the wormer does make them feel better, but not because of the covid.
Having worms is common in poorer parts of the world and deworming humans is quite common. I imagine it's made its way through immigrant communities and then white people latched on.
Actually by sheer volume they were taking all the horse paste away from the horses who needed it so rural supply stores had to lock down their supplies for only people who could prove they owned livestock.
And remember, if you get sick with the hantavirus you can get over it quickly by taking 2x the LD50 of Tylenol. A couple of days and you won't even feel sick. Be sure to tell all your conservative friends because the government likes to cover up this kind of information.
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That makes sense the impact of social media. No one stands out or gets attention for talking about the mass of boring peer reviewed scientific consensus. But wild crackpot jerk off theories people often stand alone and get much larger share of attention. And attention in now quantified by likes and views and is the currency of social media. So if social media success is your aim, make something up - the wilder the better!
Honestly, my suspicion is that you can easily get the stuff. I've gotten it for my dog once or twice (it's a lot cheaper than dog dewormer, despite basically being the same thing), and all you have to do is go into a Tractor supply or the like and it's right on the shelf, no restrictions or anything. This is in contrast to actual medicine, where I have to go to a CVS or the like to pay an overpriced amount for something that is more regulated, and might even be a bit of a placebo effect in the first place (look at flu meds for an example of that).
All of this mostly seems to speak more to the degrading of the American healthcare system due to costs ballooning beyond what some of the poorer in society can afford, so they are more willing to try folk remedies that may or may not work. And in the case of your grandmother, is she gonna risk paying a lot of her life savings to cure her tumors if they aren't benign (without a guarantee that it will work), or is she just gonna hope that the $10 treatment might make her feel better? If they're benign, then the $10 treatment "worked", and if they're not, then she'll get expensive treatment anyway, just probably be in a worse position to get it.
True, which surprisingly in a first world country actually can be an issue. A lot of the people that I see recommending stuff like ivermectin for human use mostly kinda remind me of my great grandmother, who grew up during the depression, when you just had to make due with stuff that probably wasn't the best, but so long as it somewhat worked, they'd use it (even if it absolutely boiled down to placebo effect). The common thread in my mind is basically just that in both cases, they and their families were broke and healthcare wasn't necessarily an option (unless the problem was immediate and completely necessary, like a broken arm or profuse bleeding that was going to require a ton of stitches).
It's just one of the tenets of belief from the orange man conspiracy cult. They joined that cult and chose their special secret conspiracy "facts" to believe in.
I did some limited research on this and there are a few studies that suggest ivermectin could disrupt tumors from forming. But certainly not enough evidence to suggest using it for that purpose given the risk of adverse effects.
It's honestly a pretty astounding medication that's been proven to prevent rna viruses from replicating in cells, and has some pretty cool anti-inflammatory properties. The main problem is that it isn't very water soluble and thus has horrible bioavailability. Basically, it would be as miraculous as people claim it to be if we can find a way to effectively deliver it to the treatment site.
Right now if you take it it primarily just runs through your digestive tract because it can't be absorbed into your blood stream. Which is why it's currently only useful as a dewormer medication.
I'm not sure this is a thought profound enough to count as politics. I'd classify it as nothing more than aerating the mouth, since there clearly was no thought process behind it
Ivermectin works primarily by paralyzing and killing parasites, such as worms and mites, by binding to specific glutamate-gated chloride channels in their nerve and muscle cells.
From what I understand, this 2012 study reports that Ivermectin inhibits transport proteins between cytoplasm and the nucleus which atleast some viruses require. I wonder if the glutamate-gated chlorine channels have a similar mechanism that allows Ivermectin to work in both cases.
https://doi.org/10.1042/BJ20120150
Even with the best medical care, Hantavirus has a 20% fatality rate.
Let’s just hope that conservatives continue being so anti-vaccine… a few more pandemics with human-transmissible highly-fatal viruses and maybe we can get that socialist utopia that the right always cock-blocks us from achieving.
This doctor was previously suspended for vaccine misinformation and now has a complaint against her by the texas medical board for numerous violations of professional conduct, including prescribing medication without ever meeting or examining a patient.
She filed a defamation lawsuit against the hospital which she lost. Ouch. Best of luck to her in keeping her certification, and in finding a new job! She should become trumps personal dr.
Argyria worsens and builds up as exposure to silver continues, and does not resolve once exposure stops because the silver atoms cannot be removed from the skin and other tissues.
This stupid cunt didn't learn a thing from Trump fucking her over, and back to the old song and dance. It's not even surprising... I really hope these tools load up hard on horse paste, hell, mainline it, I could use the entertainment...
Oh yeah, she's just as bad as she ever was, it's just that she finally admitted Trump was a whack job, probably because she thinks she can get MAGA to follow her instead.
Uh... Did he lose a lot of appetite and health improve after deworming himself?
Do conservatives keep banging on about ivermectin because they had an unusually high proportion of parasitic worm infected people?
My ancestors had the CCR5-Δ32 mutation, which is why they survived the Black Plague. That mutation was passed down through generations to me. So I am (theoretically) immune to HIV.
So basically, 1/3 of Europe dying almost 700 years ago means I can't get HIV.
"Herd immunity" is the result of the worst possible failure state, it is by definition a description of maximum damage. It makes no sense to portray it as a good outcome.
Herd immunity and natural immunity are not the same thing. Natural immunity is when you are inherently immune to a pathogen due to your genetic heritage. Herd Immunity is what you have when a large enough percentage of the herd are immune to a pathogen either naturally or due to vaccination.
For example, If 95% of the herd is vaccinated or otherwise immune to a disease, the herd is effectively immune because the non-immune individuals in the herd are surrounded by immune individuals. They are are therefore highly unlikely to be exposed to the pathogen in the first place.
I really hope we don’t have a pandemic. Hentavirus has a 30% death rate. Being against masks, against vaccines, having fadigue of lockdowns would kill at of people
Some variants like the Andes strain are developing the ability to be human-transmissible. It has been recorded jumping from one human host to the next in prior outbreaks. Once it evolves to be trivially-transmissible, all bets are off.
Movie trailer voice: Coming this Sumner the bigly huge cross-over you've all been waiting for. Henta19 it spreads like covid and kills like henta. Evolving now as we decide to do nothing for global stability. Ivermectin has met its match, baby!
This strain is spread by close, intimate contact. Keep mice and rats out of your home, clean up their poop with a wet paper towel if you find it. This will help prevent poop dust from being kicked up, which is how the virus is typically transmitted.
Yes Hantavirus is scary. You can pretty effectively protect yourself, and if you walk in somewhere and happen to spot mice poop just chillin — politely inform whoever is living with mice about what I just told you and leave.
The shitstain who was (and still is) behind the Ivermectin fraud is called Pierre Kory. You can view a very nice and in-depth debunk of all of his claims by Professor Dave here: https://youtu.be/KW_HPnTVuDk
Mary has MD in her name... She's a medical doctor? And then spreading this bullshit? What the actual fuck. Revoke her license! Or charge her for posing as a real doctor, which is illegal.
And when they start dropping like flies, there’s no evidence it’s the virus. It could be the (((woke globalist elite)))’s 5G space lasers, or perhaps God punishing us for not stoning sexual deviants to death or something.
It spreads in secretions and poo of rodents, it’s not airborne like covid. That said, if you sweep up a dusty storage building with mouse droppings you can aerosolize it. Vacuums with crappy filters, the same. Bear in mind, any animal that grooms will spread their diseases with claw scratches. (Like when a bat passes rabies through a claw scratch…it’s because bats groom).
People can be dirty fuckers through. Not washing hands. Wiping their noses on the backs of their hands. Sneezing and coughing in public with no thought to cover, in any respect.
I once met someone who had caught it through aerosolized mouse feces while out in nature and almost died. Apparently his R/C helicopter had caused the contagious dust to spread and he inhaled it.
There is no doubt there are redcoats still sitting on warehouses full of this stuff, who couldn't get rid of it "way back then". These snake oil salesmen and purveyors of lucky charms expected to make millions from selling shit that doesn't work. Not for viral control anyway.
And so by voice of king god donnie (kgd), it's time to bring it back and MANDATE it (quick before it's all out of date).
I wonder how many square feet of the "Big I" Mr. Wormbrain has left to get rid of. Or does he use it to actually deworm?
Oh my god. Fucking horse goop will not save you. Nothing will save you if you get infected. But you probably won’t be infected unless you are rubbing butts with someone who is infected because this particular strain is human transmissible but you gotta be in super close proximity to the infected.
But by all means eat horse paste and dump bleach in your eyes. /s
One article of note:
Proc Jpn Acad Ser B Phys Biol Sci. 2011 Feb 10;87(2):13–28. doi: 10.2183/pjab.87.13
Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
Invermectin does that in vino. BUT In vitro, inside an actual human body, the amount of ivermectin required to create that effect will kill tHe patient. So no, its just not a viable treatment.
I hope you realize who your target audience is. If a Lemming doesn't know actual science and who MTG is, I have bigger questions about that person than the post.
I don't know or care (as a European) who MTG is, but obviously from the USA. All I see is a screenshot of some MD telling ivermectin should work because reasons I don't understand.
As a fellow European and therefore educated beyond fourth grade I know what RNA is, I also know that ivermectin is a horse dewormer, I also know that viruses aren't parasitic wounds.
As a fellow European, I wish I didn't have to know who MTG is, but sadly I do. I also wish that I never heard of HCQ, homeopathy, and the relations between Semitic religions and space-based laser weapons, but here we are
Homeopathy is way more popular in Germany than anywhere else in the world, is funded by state healthcare and administered by their so-called "real doctors". We're not that much better in Europe than the USA, just a few steps behind in the slow slide into madness.
you missed the joke, the post is ironic, we Lemmings (or at least most of us) have brains and know that the claim (that horse dewormer cures viral infections) is bullshit
Sorta. But losing 30% of your population dramatically destabilizes society. Those 30% are nurses, doctors, dock workers, police, pharmacy workers, plumbers, electrical engineers, military officers, ect as well as just ordinary people. The gears of society start to grind to a halt. People stop showing up to work. The dead stop getting buried because neither the hospitals nor the death industry can handle 1% deaths, let alone 30%. The supermarkets aren't restocked. Nobody comes to put out house fires. Nobody can get vaccines for measles, flu, or other common diseases. Normally trivial diseases like minor infections or dyssentary become deadly. Murder rates skyrocket. Winter comes, power goes out with nobody to fix it, people starve, freeze, or die of heatstroke in their homes. Newborn babies and pregnant women die from lack of access to care. A whole generation fractures.
If you lose 30% of your society to illness, you lose your society.
It was immediately and obviously debunked when conservatives and their movement were most vulnerable so the reaction was to cling to the totem of Ivermectin like it could give them salvation.
It treats humans for specific infectious diseases. Covid wasn't one of them, and neither is hantavirus. If you don't believe me, ask the Nobel winner you referenced.
It might work in a petri dish, it doesn't work in the human body. Horses are bigger than humans.
Thats crazy, must be why all those news organizations had to make up stories about people going untreated from gun shot wounds because the hospitals were overwhelmed with people overdosing on ivermectin.
I remember the chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association Haruo Ozaki publicly recommending the use of ivermectin for treating covid based on several observational studies but I dont remember either of the people who won the Nobel prize for ivermectin ever publicly stating anything about its use in treating covid.
I dont remember either of the people who won the Nobel prize for ivermectin ever publicly stating anything about its use in treating covid.
One of them specifically said it's not his area of expertise:
I am a biologist with no claim to expertise in the clinical evaluation of drugs against viral infections. Thus, I have not taken a stand in support of, or against, the efficacy of ivermectin against COVID-19.
I remember the chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association Haruo Ozaki publicly recommending the use of ivermectin for treating covid based on several observational studies
A lot of people said a lot of things during the early days of the pandemic. The current consensus seems to be it only helps if you have Covid and also a coincidental worm infection that the ivermectin treats. Which is often true sadly on large parts of the planet.
So I should ask the Nobel prize winner to find out he doesn't have an opinion on the matter and that is supposed to be evidence that it doesn't work?
Haruo Ozaki made his recommendation to use Ivermectin as a treatment for covid on February 9th, 2021. Not exactly "early days" of the pandemic. It was well over a year into the virus spreading and nearly a year into it officially being a pandemic.
As far as I can tell there is no "current consensus" regarding Ivermectin outside of the mainstream narrative that its "deboonked conservative quackery". Looking into it further there seems to be one side that is willing to point to clinical data like Haruo did when making his recommendation and one side reflexively demonizing it as "horse paste" because the main stream media told them that hospitals were "overflowing" with "ivermectin overdoses". Its only when pushed that they then point to these more recent studies that supposedly "definitively show" ivermectine is ineffective.
Coincidently, only one of these positions seems to have a financial incentive for big pharma but im sure that's not relevant to the conversation.
Looking at the timeline of events regarding Ivermectin there isnt a single study from before the topic became a political issue that found it to be ineffective. As soon as it became a political topic of contention however we suddenly get several studies with dubious funding(all of which can be traced to certain key players who stood to gain financially from ivermectines being found ineffective) and questionalble methodology like using much lower and more infrequent dosing saying that its ineffective......but as with much of the conversation surrounding the vid we get "the experts agree", "the consensus is" and my favorite "the science is settled".
Anyone who's actually looked into the matter and is honest would conclude that at best, we still dont actually know whether its effective or not because the more recent studies on the matter seem to have gone out of their way to ensure that any effect from the ivermectin wouldn't be found.
So I should ask the Nobel prize winner to find out he doesn’t have an opinion on the matter and that is supposed to be evidence that it doesn’t work?
No you should take it as evidence that what the person answering you before me said, that Ivermectin is not intended for use against Coronaviruses, or any viruses for that matter, is true. There was a false quote from Campbell floating around on social media and he publicly disclaimed it. Ivermectin is not an antiviral, its intended use are roundworm infections. That was the point of OPs comment I believe.
Haruo Ozaki made his recommendation to use Ivermectin as a treatment for covid on February 9th, 2021. Not exactly “early days” of the pandemic. It was well over a year into the virus spreading and nearly a year into it officially being a pandemic.
Well you know, relatively speaking it's early days, we are in year 6 now. Kind of besides the point really. Anyway I think I tracked down the (second-hand) quote from Haruo from some pro-Ivermectin website:
The Chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association, Dr. Haruo Ozaki, recommends Ivermectin for use with COVID patients.
He notes that the parts of Africa that use ivermectin to control parasites have a COVID death rate of just 2.2 per 100,000 population, as compared to 13 times that death rate among African countries that do not use ivermectin. – SurfguardCR
You will note here that he specifically refers to parasite infections, i.e. worms. He could just be saying "Hey if your Covid patient has worms, maybe take care of that first".
On a side note the Tokyo Medical Association seems to be a private company, not a public medical authority. Japan did recommend and distribute vaccines as soon as they became available.
As far as I can tell there is no “current consensus” regarding Ivermectin outside of the mainstream narrative that its “deboonked conservative quackery”.
It's a bit more complicated than that, but if you want a one sentence summary I guess it fits. It was a meme that mostly conservatives seem to have fallen for.
Looking into it further there seems to be one side that is willing to point to clinical data like Haruo did when making his recommendation
Any specifics you can share? Like I said above, it seems Haruo was referring to worm infections and was taken out of context.
Coincidently, only one of these positions seems to have a financial incentive for big pharma but im sure that’s not relevant to the conversation.
Lol, who do you think sells Ivermectin? Small pharma?
Looking at the timeline of events regarding Ivermectin there isnt a single study from before the topic became a political issue that found it to be ineffective.
That's untrue AFAIK, but anyway - My original point was that most of the studies that showed a positive effect came from places with relatively high incidences of roundworm infections. And it just makes sense that if you use ivermectin to treat a pre-existing worm infection it will help a patients immune system to fight an additional later Coronavirus infection. There was a false signal in the data and people just ran with it. No need for big (or small) pharma conspiracy here...
That alleged recommendation from Haruo Ozaki you keep quoting for example is five years old now, and specifically citing "parts of Africa" (many of which have a relatively high incidence of roundworm infections).
Anyone who’s actually looked into the matter and is honest would conclude that at best, we still dont actually know whether its effective or not because the more recent studies on the matter seem to have gone out of their way to ensure that any effect from the ivermectin wouldn’t be found.
Or maybe they are showing no effect because there is no effect (except in patients with a pre-existing roundworm infection, which Ivermectin is meant to treat). Sorry but unless you have something more concrete I'm sticking with my "people were panicking and grasping at straws" perspective.
My parents legitimately believe ivermectin is a cure all and are stockpiling it. They take it for just about anything. They also believe plenty of other wacky things like viruses don't exist and cancer is just a fungal infection.
My dad last year nearly lost his foot after it got infected. They let it fester for months and only treated it with like essential oils or some other pseudoscience. He eventually had to go to the emergency room and stay at the hospital and receive antibiotics. 🙄
And immediately saw the error in his ways? Absolutely not. These people get sick to the point of dying. Go to the emergency room and get healed through real medicine and the efforts of a dozen nurses and a doctor or two. Then they leave and brag to their friends and family "see told you I'd be fine" and never give credit to the REAL medicine that fixed the issue.
"See? Told you I'd be fine."
"Dad, you need to take off your leg to go through airport security."
Airplane!_MetalDetectorScene.MP4
Many of my relatives are diehard MAGA. So, when Trump said not to wear masks or quarantine, my aunt and her husband and son went out of their way to basically spend every second they could at superspreader events. They were warned it was dangerous, not restricted in any way, but still felt the need to act out to validate political feelings.
Naturally, they all caught COVID in the early days. My uncle and cousin both passed, leaving my aunt as a devastated shell of a woman. When we would see each other at family dinners she would usually just sit with a far-off, forlorn look. Every once in a while she would tune in for a bit to spout some pro-Trump bullshit. I wanted to scream “He helped to kill your family!”
I decided to just stop spending time with these people before I said something I would regret.
But would you really regret screaming 'he helped to kill your family'? I think it would be awesome ... unless there's a significant inheritance at stake.
I’m a bit baffled by the upvotes on this.
I get it, I’m also furious at the MAGA crowd, but, considering this actually happened, I just feel sorry for that woman.
Losing your family must be horrible either way and if that doesn’t make her reflect, do you think yelling at her will?
You wouldn’t yell at a mentally disabled person, I hope, that’s basically who you’re dealing with.
The problem is that American politicians are gutting the school system because they WANT more mentally disabled people. "I love the poorly educated" - DJT. People like this lady, who will manslaughter their families for Trump, are spreading his propaganda. I don't care how sad she is, if she's spreading his propaganda and telling other people to go through the same tragedy. Someone needs to speak up and stop the cycle of pointless deaths.
Mentally disabled or not, these people are destroying the country. They are hurting lots of other people. They should know better. They have made a choice to be that way and refuse to change even with the brutal consequences made very clear. If they won't see reason they deserve ridicule.
We don't say 'oh the poor Nazis, they were mentally disabled' - no, we fought them and sacrificed big time to destroy their evil ways.
If that mentally disabled person was killing people? Yeah, I'd yell at them. Other people dying doesn't mean anything to these people because they don't care about other people. The only thing they understand is themselves
We're mad and MAGAts deserve much worse than losing their husband and child.
The woman's mind is broken. She's a cult victim. If she's not actively harming OP, why would being cruel help now? She's already killed her husband, in her mind. She's fucked already.
Are you sure? Sounded like she might still be in denial.
You double posted this, just FYI
Thx mate. Deleted the clone. Or did I??!?!?
"Hey Marge, how's the husband and son? Still dead? Still Trump's fault?"
Good choice. There's no getting them out of it without professional help. This is an identity cult. They identity is tied to his, that's why their ego can't take any hits on him. They explain everything away.
My dad literally will not talk to me because I refused to say that ivermectin is a miracle cure. He’s angry at me for some study or article that he thinks I am obsessed with (I honestly have no idea what he’s talking about), and insists I retract my belief in it or we can’t have a relationship. Since I haven’t the first clue what he’s even on about, he made his choice..
Can’t wait for the next round of crackpot email forwards. Hopefully he sticks to his word and won’t contact me anymore.
Edit - the last time I spoke with him was at my step mom’s funeral, where she had just died of cancer, which they treated with….I’ll give you one guess.
We aren’t dealing with rational people.
I guess I can somewhat understand his obstinance towards you. If he admits he’s wrong, he also has to admit he had a hand in killing his wife through willful ignorance.
Truth hurts.
Well at least she died free of worms.
What sucks the most is that ivermectin is a miracle cure! It just isn't helpful again COVID or Hantavirus. The 2015 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine was awarded (in part) for discovering ivermectin.
It's what frustrates me the most about discussion with people like this. They're willing to take a random drug, a drug that is fully backed by the medical community, but they're not willing to take the drug actually recommended by the medical community.
This is my favorite anti-anti-vax argument. You won't take one medicine, here have another with the same medical backing 😂
I have a similar experience with my own father after he started using TikTok and Instagram, though it's not about ivermectin (spoiler: he thinks I'm a "commie"). I think old people are just not equipped to survive on the internet. It's like they lack the instincts to known when they're being scammed.
It gives me a tiny bit of hope for the future, because even though gen alpha aren't exactly the brightest generation so far, they're at least all fully attuned to the internet and (hopefully) better equipped to navigate its many perils.
I think its people in general
During lock down when people were at home and having to amuse themselves some made bread and did arts and crafts, whilst others ended up jumping off a cliff into conspiracy theories and right wing bollocks
One guy I know of suggested ivermectin and dog dewormers to treat my bf's cancer because 'cancer is caused by parasites.... there's plenty of information on the internet.... you can do your own research...etc etc'
I used to think the average person was mostly decent and sensible, but not anymore
Never underestimate the strength of small town loyalty, where obviously everyone knows better than a century-spanning corpus of medical research
Idk what the hell happened to baby boomers. When I was growing up my parents (boomers) constantly reminded me you can't believe everything you read online and that the "girl" I was chatting with on AIM could actually be some fat 40 year old pedo.
That wasn't uncommon, that was the same experience all my buddies had and same thing was drilled into us at school.
Now, I'm seeing these folks treat memes on Facebook like it's the gospel truth. Or some random mommy blog post with zero references as straight facts. It's so maddening ... What happened to these people?
I'm also not talking to your father on behalf of you
Send him Epstein files in return.
There's no getting them out of it without several things, namely their consent and will to change and professional deprogramming.
I guess I'm glad my father is only "ancient aliens" crazy after his TBI made him a trump supporter.
I guess I should be glad my TBI just made me super socially awkward and obsessive about weird niche topics.
Damn, like Fetterman. Sorry that happened to your dad.
Fetterman was an asshole before he was on the national stage.
Same with my dad, although he was a fiscal conservative before just because he's a financial advisor and Republicans are good for business.
Yeah that's the song and dance
I have an uncle who is basically a leftist boomer, but who is into that Art Bell kind of stuff. More recently he's been getting into the "big pharma is keeping us sick" stuff and it's really frustrating to see.
My mom died a couple years ago (she thought "vibration therapy" would cure her cancer), and when my sister and I were cleaning up her house to sell it we found so many empty bottles of ivermectin as well as other crazy stuff. It's just the stupidest scam. Oh, medicine, biology, chemistry, etc is all bullshit, but horse medicine? Yeah, that's legit.
My mother, a once slightly famous biochemist, died in December from influenza. Tragic that someone who had been a health nut her entire life (other than the 2 pack a day smoking habit she fostered from 11 to somewhere in her 40s) became a complete anti science loon as she got older.
She always believed in new age crap. She was confined that she could see auras and perform psychic healing when l was a kid. She's the reason that I was dosed with ghastly spinach 'smoothies' instead of surgery to relieve the pressure on my brain after a TBI when I was 7.
But it ramped up massively in the information age. No longer relegated to fringe bookstores, her rampant need to be a keeper of the secret teachings was validated by a cadre of charlatans and lunatics online. She became rabidly anti-vaxx, except when forced to so she could travel to southeast Asia... right as lockdown happened in the US. Did she reconsider this ill conceived motion? He'll no!
She managed her sky high cholesterol with a variety of herbs or whatnot. Same with blood pressure issues. Then had a catastrophic stroke not too long after that covid road tour. Never recovered and very likely was receiving poor care while sick with influenza.
What an incredibly stupid end.
It's way too common of a story, sorry you had to deal with it too.
She was a cold, brittle narcissist. I went no contact a LONG time ago.
But thank you :)
At least your parents are free from intestinal parasites
Well at least they don't have worm parasites.
It does work well for those things.
Yeah but not a worm in sight!
At least it's not shungight. Viral medical trends are problematic when they get sold as cure calls, bad when it's unfounded, worse when it's half true. Poisons the well.
IMO, this is one of the consequences of not having universal health insurance that isn't talked about enough. If the bar for going to the doctor is "about to lose a limb from infection", then people become vulnerable to pseudo-scientific garbage, simply because they hardly ever receive advice from actual medical professionals.
This is one my comment talking point. When people have to think about "can I afford this?" anytime they need to goto the doctor, then they'll only go when it's serious. But they are not qualified medical professionals to decide what needs medical attention or not. So they seek advice from other people, past experiences and Internet and we have this problem.
Honestly, it shouldn't cost that much to just goto a doctor's office and return. We don't need MD for everything, have other professional people there that are qualified enough to tell you when something doesn't need attention, or simple solutions. Maybe just cleaning a scrap, or giving you a brace for minor sprain, all those without having to see MD.
I have a lump that my doctor recommended I go see a specialist for a look. But I am waiting for my insurance to settle the bill / or wait to be able to afford both bills.
We need to go back to printed almanacs
Great point. Hard to trust doctors when it’s $500 to not find anything over and over and over and over.
Agreeing about universal healthcare but adding sufficient PTO to go to the Dr.
You should not need to use vacation days to visit the doctor. Or to recover from an illness.
You should not have to be ill or have to explain why you need to take a day off. Just have sufficient undesignated PTO to maintain good mental and physical health.
What about ‘unlimited’?
My US doctor is pretty good about telehealth visits. I can send them messages online, or schedule video appointments for certain things. it makes it much easier to get questions answered or schedule visits with some more flexibility. I know many states still don't allow any medical access via phone/video/online.
In Mexico, I can ask questions and talk to my doctor over Whatsapp. I don't need to log into a healthcare website to ask for the minor requests.
The US is such a backwards place and the healthcare system is incredibly broken.
Thats my deal. I have
Add to that the pleatora of fraudulent TV doctors
100 % this. Also maybe overall education quality as well?
Vaccines are often free here
That's great, but I'm talking about broad coverage of health care needs and a general habit of seeing a doctor when you're sick, injured etc.
I agree with you 100%. When the prospect of a health emergency or chronic condition means bankruptcy, people can’t help but look for alternatives.
Under a capitalist system where anyone can sell ‘supplements’ and any other random ‘treatment’ under the radar long enough to make a quick buck, misinformation abounds and the desperate roll the dice.
Health care isn’t just that. It’s what keeps families together, it’s what keeps communities together, and it’s a tragic farce that too many of us see it as a privilege and not a right.
Many of my fellow Canadians fell for that shit, and they have free access to doctors.
(Not all of them, because our healthcare system is weirdly understaffed, but many of them)
The bar for a lot of us is also at "about to lose a limb from infection". The only difference is that we don't get a hospital bill to go with that visit.
I noticed Canada is recruiting healthcare professionals from the US, and one of the things they really like is being able to provide healthcare without the middleman insurance companies denying healthcare.
In the US, people don't go to the doctor when they have a problem, they go as a last resort because they have to ask themselves how much it would cost.
18% of Americans haven't ever seen a doctor and 40% of Americans haven't seen one for 5 years.
A number of studies in low income communities in the south show that over 60% of people in those communities have intestinal parasites. That's just the ones we know of.
One thing we know for sure is that ivermectin is about as magic as they say it is for parasites only. It's a fantastic drug for that.
Over 60% of low income citizens would likely feel much better after getting their parasites removed from ivermectin. So what they are seeing, seems true. They could be sick from something else but get rid of a long standing comorbidity of a pariste infection, you bet they are feeling good. They just think that relief from the varied symptoms from parasite is actually something else cured.
This ivermectin religion has real miracles, it's just not the ones they think they are. This belief is entirely created because Americans don't have healthcare. That's why this belief isn't found elsewhere.
Doesn't even need to be eliminated parasites.
"I am solving the problem by taking the medicine, and I am smart because I'm using a secret medicine they don't want me to know about" causes the brain to release the good feelings chemicals which does make you feel better.
In Estonia it's sorta the same except a visit costs nothing for the GP and 20 euros for the initial visit to a specialty doctor (subsequent visits are free).
We just don't go to the doctor because we're stubborn as fuck and "it'll heal on its own".
Not if you don't rub some dirt in it first it won't
What the fuck? Have you a source for those numbers because they're shocking
Hmm looks like some stats I pulled were from polls, and I fell victim to people paraphrasing that around 20% of rural people not having a primary care doctor in the last few years as "not even having seen a doctor" sorry about that.
40% of Americans haven't seen a doctor in 5 years: https://studyfinds.org/americans-avoiding-the-doctor/ https://www.aarp.org/pri/topics/health/coverage-access/health-care-rural-america/?
But the limited stats on primary care and a lot of self reporting is very bad.
62% parasites infection: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2023.01.10.23284404v1.full
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7253135/#%3A%7E%3Atext=Overall%2C+67.4%25+of%2Ca+community+where
Typing in "southern united states rural primary care access" in Kagi has a lot of sad results.
You got the fucking receipts
Thank you! They are some wild numbers.
I haven't seen a doctor in at least a decade and a half, when my parents took me to checkups as a child. I'm very lucky to be healthy, and am in the gym 3-5 days a week to keep my streak going as long as possible.
However, I'm calling bullshit on this:
That sounds insane to me. 60% is a motherfucking epidemic. Where's the source for these studies???
They sourced their claim
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7253135/#%3A%7E%3Atext=Overall%2C+67.4%25+of%2Ca+community+where
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2023.01.10.23284404v1.full
Its really sad
It's extremely common in Africa. My ex who was Zulu hated that you couldn't get deworming here. Ignore the fact that in Ontario you aren't getting worms. She brought her misconceptions that KZN is like here.
How do you handle vaccines?
I don't get vaccinated regularly. Covid was an exception, and I got that at some medical place that was offering them for free (In hindsight idk what type of business they were, but the dude who injected me looked like a real doctor)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetanus_vaccine
Pretty much this, although it seems freeing the immune system from fighting the worm infection really does help it in fighting the Coronavirus infection: https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-than-you-wanted (Ctrl+F "The Synthesis").
TL;DR: Studies showing a positive effect from Ivermectin on Covid came mostly from areas with high worm infection incidence, areas with low incidence showed no or smaller positive effect.
NB: Link is a selfhosted Substack, works better with JavaScript turned off.
Covid spread easily; I don’t think hantavirus is as easy to spread. However, it’s much more deadly and can be dormant for 60 days, spreading itself.
We’re pretty fucked.
Settle down, we are not fucked. Hantavirus has been around forever, even this strain.
Honestly. So much overreaction about this. Everyone is letting the news work their manipilative bullshit spreading panic and fear so you keep tuning in and clicking o
Its pretty sad to see how many people on the fediverse are falling for the bs
Has it spread human to human? I thought that was a new thing.
It does with this strain/variant which is why this story is newsworthy. But the usual one does not. There have been localized outbreaks of this one in the past but never a worldwide pandemic.
People on the floating petri dishes that are cruiseships are fucked. The rest of us are in no more danger from this than we were before.
The CDC Fired All Its Cruise Ship Inspectors Before the Hantavirus Outbreak
Probably wouldn't have made much of a difference for a ship registered in the Netherlands that never made port in the US.
Will probably be a problem down the road though
As much as I agree with the sentiment of the comment you responded to, I appreciate you for keeping the conversation grounded and honest. You deserve every upvote.
I was kinda hoping that it would lead to The Onion, alas...
The onion lost to real life years ago
More to the point, on a boat with any kind of outbreak.. it's usually always related to the food storage. Main reason why I'd never go on a cruise.
If it hadn't left the ship you'd be right, but it has. A Swiss man left the cruise and tested positive later. If he rode public transit during rush hour even once while infected it could be bad.
I'm not as familiar with Swiss transport, but I've been packed ass to face many of times on a train in Europe
Notable that the virus has a 1 to 8 Week incubation period. The first guy died 5 days into the trip. Implying that he(and probably his wife) brought it onto the ship.
Lot of people left, not just a "Swiss man"
https://www.npr.org/2026/05/07/nx-s1-5814632/passengers-left-ship-hantavirus-st-helena
Right if you read the article he was the only one that both left the ship and was later confirmed as infected. There was another Dutch couple that left while sick and quickly were hospitalized. My concern is he was able to move around freely all while he was unknowingly infected. He seems to be the one that had the most opportunity to spread the infection.
Others also left early and have been quarantined. They have not shown symptoms so I didn't bring them up when discussing spread. One infected couple left early as well, but they were already sick and didn't leave South Africa. Although they may have infected a flight attendant, still waiting on tests.
Of course the virus can have a long incubation period. So these individuals may be more relevant to discussion later. There are those that were evacuated to recieve medical treatment elsewhere, but it's not like they are walking around their respective countries.
So first, i don't think that article says they tracked them all.
And second, if you can test them and rule out infection with certainty, why would they be ordered to isolate?
I think the incubation period does play a role there.
Yes those higher risk contacts in St. Helena are those that interacted with the passangers/crew when the ship was in port. They are not the people that were passangers on board the ship that left.
I did not say this. They are testing an already ill flight attendant. You can't test during the incubation period. Which is highly variable with this virus.
The incubation period is huge. In 40 days we'll know if we are having another pandemic or not.
Hantavirus is not COVID. Every contagious disease isn’t spread through aerosols. Hantavirus needs close, extended contact to transfer, unlike COVID. You’re not going to get hantavirus from walking into a store.
Yes I understand that. Being crammed against another person for a long enough period of time seems right. During any major holiday if you take a train you can easily spend 1 or 2 hours pressed against a few people. Seems fairly close and extended to me. Especially considering there may have already been spread of the virus from contact in an airplane.
Rush hour commutes you might be pressed against a couple of people for 20 minutes or so depending on your commute. This is close, but maybe not extended enough.
The potential is there
Sounds like a good reason to keep driving my canyonero. S/
Love my deer-crushing squirrel-squashing killin' machine!
For transfer exclusively to people who spend extended time on very crowded public transit, maybe, but that describes a very tiny portion of Americans.
Okay now I'm confused. I was talking about the Swiss guy who returned to Switzerland and the public transit system of Europe.
I suppose we're on a thread talking about some American public figures huffing Ivermectin, but I was more concerned about the spread. Which seems like it will kick off in Europe first
Oh, I misunderstood, because of the OP I thought we were talking about the US. I still wouldn’t worry about it, you need bodily fluid contact to transfer it. Monkeypox is more contagious and it never took off.
Do you wear gloves every time you touch a door handle?
Do you not wash your hands before touching your face or food? Because that’s literally all you need to do.
What little Ive seen documented:
20 years30 years) to the southern end of South America, they beat out an initial outbreak of it, has been endemic there since.There’s kind of two varieties. The Americas one is different to the other and was discovered more recently.
Three that I know of.
The Eurasian/African one that is the least dangerous and doesnt transmit human to human.
The continental Americas strain that is pretty dangerous(lethality in the 30-60% range) but doesn't spread human to human.
The new kid on the block, the Andes strain, an offshoot of the Americas one. Last Outbreak was in a small town in Argentina in 2018, first discovered 1995, first human to human 1996. ~40 known infections, 11 deaths. Can spread human to human. It has already been confirmed we are dealing with this one.
That's almost as good as my idea. I thought like a really light version of COVID with nothing but light symptoms like fever and sneezing, but it would change your DNA just the right way, so you develop a hidden FFI prion infection, leading to you eventually not being able to sleep until you die.
By the time anyone realizes it is even a thing, nearly everyone would be infected, just a few prions would be 100% fatal, and there would be nowhere on Earth to hide.
Everyone dies from lack of sleep induced dementia.
I wish I loved something as much as conservatives love Ivermectin.
You do, it’s either self hosting, Linux or socialism
Why not all three
Self hosting your socialist Linux app.
There we go!
Damn, I'm 2 for three. One day I'll have the spare computer to self host something.
tinkering with the linux homelab on which u host ur socialist lemmy instance while wearing thigh high socks and a collar and a maid outfit and being forced to take a break from ur tinkering by someone queer dragging u into bed using a leash
accurate description of the average lemmy user (myself included (i wish))
I love not having worms in me exactly as much as I love ivermectin, basically a miracle drug for that. They must be getting the dosage wrong tho because they've clearly got brain worms.
So she thinks (I know, I know) that getting “natural immunity” to COVID protects her from hantavirus? The ivermectin is just the icing on the cake, honestly.
It's what happens when practicing medical physicians forget they are not really researchers. The main problem is that medical schools do teach research, but just enough to give people a false confidence in their own abilities. Medicine covers so much information that medical school is basically just a series of introduction courses. Like with most positions as a physician, your real knowledge comes from what you actually practice during your residency and specialty training.
I specialize in orthopedics and rehabilitation, I can understand the mechanisms and physiology involved in studies done over rna virus replication, but I wouldn't feel confident in my ability to draw conclusions from those studies that are not explicitly stated in the study itself.
From my understanding invermectin has show itself to have some promising potential for moderating rna viruses from replicating. However, it's not very water soluble and so there are currently no effective means to actually get the medication to the affected cells. Which is why none of the studies done on cell cultures in a laboratory can't be extrapolated upon and applied to people.
Even if you are taking 100x the recommended dose, it's mainly just going to travel through your digestive tract and cause more harm than good.
Ew, dewormer frosting
What's the thing with ivermectin? Do they own shares from the manufacturers or something?
Early laboratory research indicated that ivermectin could kill the SARS-CoV-2 virus, but this was later found to require, in many cases, toxic doses far exceeding those approved for humans. Antivaxxers latched onto this and ran with it, spreading the misinformation far and wide.
Handguns also kill cancer cells in vivo.
Well, there was evidence that it helped and then mainstream pharmaceutical buried the evidence and killed all the scientists. Cause it'd affect their bottom line. And then you've got the secret kabal controlling everything that wants us hooked on their drugs for mind control. The anti-christ is alive, right now, and his name is healthcare /s
The real reason is probably that it was a dewormer that helped some very sick people feel better when they had covid, and then conspiracies about it took off when scientists said "yeah, that's probably not helpful for covid". Science is a messy process, but because of the authoritative way it's taught, people have trouble connecting the process of finding answers in real time with the firmness of the results. That, plus grifters pumping people full of fear and anxiety so they keep coming back for the next hit. It's not pushing ivermectin because they have stake in it. It's pushing ivermectin because it fits a pre-established narrative and thinking is, like, real tough, y'all. You gotta, like, put effort into that. Which is dumb. I've got this one drum, I'mma bang it all day.
I wanna believe that Ivermectine is so consistently reported by these people as helpful because they all have parasites from raw meat diets. So when they get sick with covid the wormer does make them feel better, but not because of the covid.
I think its just people that can't tell memes from facts.
Having worms is common in poorer parts of the world and deworming humans is quite common. I imagine it's made its way through immigrant communities and then white people latched on.
Something else white people stole 🤣
We let them the first time too. If you want to eat horse paste who am I to stop you?
Actually by sheer volume they were taking all the horse paste away from the horses who needed it so rural supply stores had to lock down their supplies for only people who could prove they owned livestock.
Humans were consuming so much horse paste that there was a shortage?! That's wild.
I guess I never really knew why so many people associate ivermectin with horses. I would not have guessed that 😆
As a Canadian who lives on a farm...
That is so so sad. America is doomed.
And remember, if you get sick with the hantavirus you can get over it quickly by taking 2x the LD50 of Tylenol. A couple of days and you won't even feel sick. Be sure to tell all your conservative friends because the government likes to cover up this kind of information.
I died at this.
Bleach is mostly water, and we are mostly water. Therefore, we are bleach.
Here. Drink this, Murderface.
So is that like LD100 or something; I'm not technical so trusting your numbers here.
It isn't like LD100 (although it may be)
LD50 is the minimal dose lethal to 50% of a subject population. Twice that dose might be anything between 50% and 100%.
Damn Poe's law.
I believed in your nonbelieving, friend!
The new hot cure to hantavirus: bloodletting! Balance your humors and align your chakras with this one simple trick!
Don't listen to this quack! What you need is theriac, theriac I say!
I'll sell you leeches from an ancient bloodline! This storied lineage of leeches have drained foul and dangerous humors from some of histories great men!
From Caligula to Kissinger these leeches have left a wake of well balanced, totally sane statesmen. For only three easy payments of 20.99 you too can be drained and join in greatness!
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Instructions unclear, one of the leeches drank too much of my blood and started a rampage around the neighborhood. Also, I'm feeling real heavy, just gonna nap for the rest of my life i guess
Why is ivermectin always the cure to every disease? My grandmother has tumors and my mom mentioned getting her ivermectin. Wtf am I missing here?
Someone told them NO. You cant do that.
That made them feel mad and feel stupid.
Then someone told them that they were right and that someone else was actually the stupid one.
Then they felt better.
Better than better, they now have the secret knowledge and everyone else are the stupid ones.
This is the formula for modern society (esp. social media).
That makes sense the impact of social media. No one stands out or gets attention for talking about the mass of boring peer reviewed scientific consensus. But wild crackpot jerk off theories people often stand alone and get much larger share of attention. And attention in now quantified by likes and views and is the currency of social media. So if social media success is your aim, make something up - the wilder the better!
Religion too.
Yeah, I pretty much mean it is the formula for human cognition.
There is no logic, only horse medicine.
Healthy as a horse and all, right?
Honestly, my suspicion is that you can easily get the stuff. I've gotten it for my dog once or twice (it's a lot cheaper than dog dewormer, despite basically being the same thing), and all you have to do is go into a Tractor supply or the like and it's right on the shelf, no restrictions or anything. This is in contrast to actual medicine, where I have to go to a CVS or the like to pay an overpriced amount for something that is more regulated, and might even be a bit of a placebo effect in the first place (look at flu meds for an example of that).
All of this mostly seems to speak more to the degrading of the American healthcare system due to costs ballooning beyond what some of the poorer in society can afford, so they are more willing to try folk remedies that may or may not work. And in the case of your grandmother, is she gonna risk paying a lot of her life savings to cure her tumors if they aren't benign (without a guarantee that it will work), or is she just gonna hope that the $10 treatment might make her feel better? If they're benign, then the $10 treatment "worked", and if they're not, then she'll get expensive treatment anyway, just probably be in a worse position to get it.
Also people take it and feel better, not realizing they might've also just had worms.
I deworm my dog every few years. Yet I've never dewormed my self. To the pharmacy!
True, which surprisingly in a first world country actually can be an issue. A lot of the people that I see recommending stuff like ivermectin for human use mostly kinda remind me of my great grandmother, who grew up during the depression, when you just had to make due with stuff that probably wasn't the best, but so long as it somewhat worked, they'd use it (even if it absolutely boiled down to placebo effect). The common thread in my mind is basically just that in both cases, they and their families were broke and healthcare wasn't necessarily an option (unless the problem was immediate and completely necessary, like a broken arm or profuse bleeding that was going to require a ton of stitches).
Is it a big commodity or something?
In the horse worm community? Hell yeah
I bet the horse worms aren't stoked about it
It's just one of the tenets of belief from the orange man conspiracy cult. They joined that cult and chose their special secret conspiracy "facts" to believe in.
Morons
I mean it cures worms in horses, so it must be omnipotent
I did some limited research on this and there are a few studies that suggest ivermectin could disrupt tumors from forming. But certainly not enough evidence to suggest using it for that purpose given the risk of adverse effects.
It's honestly a pretty astounding medication that's been proven to prevent rna viruses from replicating in cells, and has some pretty cool anti-inflammatory properties. The main problem is that it isn't very water soluble and thus has horrible bioavailability. Basically, it would be as miraculous as people claim it to be if we can find a way to effectively deliver it to the treatment site.
Right now if you take it it primarily just runs through your digestive tract because it can't be absorbed into your blood stream. Which is why it's currently only useful as a dewormer medication.
I love when science memes is just US politics.
I don't. Lots of people are gonna die or get disabled because of these idiots.
Whoosh.
Just Americans though hopefully
Hahaha! You think we have all the idiots! HAHAHA! MOTHERFUCKER WE EXPORT THAT SHIT!!!
They grow natively everywhere. The internet speads fertilizer.
You realize that's still bad, right?
Now that is a matter of opinion.
I guess fuck the 60% of us who didn't agree to this shit then. Guess we can just keel over and die
Only if you're a truly reprehensible person.
I'm not sure this is a thought profound enough to count as politics. I'd classify it as nothing more than aerating the mouth, since there clearly was no thought process behind it
Ah, it's refreshing to see her back to saying crazy bullshit again.
Yup, was scary finding myself agreeing with her for a while there…
Remember, she changed and began to agree with us for a short time. Our view never changed.
Just so everyone is clear, this is total bullshit — I understand MTG has had her broken clock moments but she's still batshit insane.
Batshit crazy but there's a high chance she's dumping trump ship just in time to make something like Carlson MTG 2028
The vast majority of viruses are RNA-based so it appears that we have a pretty much universal cure here.
Ivermectin works primarily by paralyzing and killing parasites, such as worms and mites, by binding to specific glutamate-gated chloride channels in their nerve and muscle cells.
Nothing to do with RNA viruses.
I think it was the irony
i think they were joking
From what I understand, this 2012 study reports that Ivermectin inhibits transport proteins between cytoplasm and the nucleus which atleast some viruses require. I wonder if the glutamate-gated chlorine channels have a similar mechanism that allows Ivermectin to work in both cases. https://doi.org/10.1042/BJ20120150
Even with the best medical care, Hantavirus has a 20% fatality rate.
Let’s just hope that conservatives continue being so anti-vaccine… a few more pandemics with human-transmissible highly-fatal viruses and maybe we can get that socialist utopia that the right always cock-blocks us from achieving.
This doctor was previously suspended for vaccine misinformation and now has a complaint against her by the texas medical board for numerous violations of professional conduct, including prescribing medication without ever meeting or examining a patient.
She filed a defamation lawsuit against the hospital which she lost. Ouch. Best of luck to her in keeping her certification, and in finding a new job! She should become trumps personal dr.
Colloquial silver works wonders when taken in high doses
Spoiler: it'll turn your skin blue. These idiots should be labeled like smufs
colloidal?
In the streets we call it colloquial silver.
People that blue themselves pretty much did it on purpose. Afaik it's not permanent.
jonathan frakes telling you you're wrong for 47 seconds
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argyria#Pathophysiology
You would think...
This stupid cunt didn't learn a thing from Trump fucking her over, and back to the old song and dance. It's not even surprising... I really hope these tools load up hard on horse paste, hell, mainline it, I could use the entertainment...
She learned that owning the libs is fun.
I'm sure the libs will be very upset if these idiots mainline horse dewormer, that they will have purchased for 16 times it's actual retail value.
Ivermectin comes in apple flavor if y'all are worried about the taste.
/s
Ivermectin? I hardly knew her.
Ivermecter?
So much for her half-assed redemption arc.
Oh yeah, she's just as bad as she ever was, it's just that she finally admitted Trump was a whack job, probably because she thinks she can get MAGA to follow her instead.
Marjorie Taylor Greene is crazy to suggest Ivermectin because Pete Hegseth said germs aren't real.
Does Lemmy have an equivalent to the Herman Cain Awards subreddit? We're definitely gonna need one.
Nothing says ‘we learned nothing’ like speedrunning the exact same miracle-cure discourse all over again.
my coworker told me he started taking it and shat out a bunch of worms. then he tried to convince me that i was full of worms.
Uh... Did he lose a lot of appetite and health improve after deworming himself?
Do conservatives keep banging on about ivermectin because they had an unusually high proportion of parasitic worm infected people?
no but he did just get diagnosed with deep vein thrombosis and congestive heart failure..healthy as a horse otherwise lmao
Ah, yes, congestive horse failure. 🫠
Now I wonder if rfk promotes the stuff
One question: HOW do you "develop" natural immunity.
Answer: The weak ones in the herd DIE!
My ancestors had the CCR5-Δ32 mutation, which is why they survived the Black Plague. That mutation was passed down through generations to me. So I am (theoretically) immune to HIV.
So basically, 1/3 of Europe dying almost 700 years ago means I can't get HIV.
Mind you, I'm not looking to test my luck.
"Herd immunity" is the result of the worst possible failure state, it is by definition a description of maximum damage. It makes no sense to portray it as a good outcome.
Herd immunity and natural immunity are not the same thing. Natural immunity is when you are inherently immune to a pathogen due to your genetic heritage. Herd Immunity is what you have when a large enough percentage of the herd are immune to a pathogen either naturally or due to vaccination.
For example, If 95% of the herd is vaccinated or otherwise immune to a disease, the herd is effectively immune because the non-immune individuals in the herd are surrounded by immune individuals. They are are therefore highly unlikely to be exposed to the pathogen in the first place.
Either way you can't "develop" it yourself.
We NEED to get the stupid people OUT of politics.
I really hope we don’t have a pandemic. Hentavirus has a 30% death rate. Being against masks, against vaccines, having fadigue of lockdowns would kill at of people
We won't. This virus is only transmitted in close contact. None of the the science-based community I follow are worried, so I'm not worried.
Some variants like the Andes strain are developing the ability to be human-transmissible. It has been recorded jumping from one human host to the next in prior outbreaks. Once it evolves to be trivially-transmissible, all bets are off.
My comment addressed the Andes strain. Although it is human transmissable, it requires close contact. That's why it's currently not much of a concern.
Also, at the societal level, the high lethality of the virus makes it far less likely to be able to spread broadly.
“Prior transmissions of the strain did not have ‘close contact’.”
https://youtu.be/rO4Xd5PfIo0
Featuring Prof. Joseph Allen, Professor of Exposure Assessment Science at Harvard University.
I’m more inclined to listen to experts in their field.
Movie trailer voice: Coming this Sumner the bigly huge cross-over you've all been waiting for. Henta19 it spreads like covid and kills like henta. Evolving now as we decide to do nothing for global stability. Ivermectin has met its match, baby!
This strain is spread by close, intimate contact. Keep mice and rats out of your home, clean up their poop with a wet paper towel if you find it. This will help prevent poop dust from being kicked up, which is how the virus is typically transmitted.
Yes Hantavirus is scary. You can pretty effectively protect yourself, and if you walk in somewhere and happen to spot mice poop just chillin — politely inform whoever is living with mice about what I just told you and leave.
The shitstain who was (and still is) behind the Ivermectin fraud is called Pierre Kory. You can view a very nice and in-depth debunk of all of his claims by Professor Dave here:
https://youtu.be/KW_HPnTVuDk
Screw all of this wacky, inconsistent, cynical medical advice. Bring barbers back!
Mary has MD in her name... She's a medical doctor? And then spreading this bullshit? What the actual fuck. Revoke her license! Or charge her for posing as a real doctor, which is illegal.
The MD stands for Makin' Datup
I thought it was Mostly Dreaming
Former Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene
Waxed Lightly Weathered Cut Copper Stairs
And when they start dropping like flies, there’s no evidence it’s the virus. It could be the (((woke globalist elite)))’s 5G space lasers, or perhaps God punishing us for not stoning sexual deviants to death or something.
In any sane country Mary Talley Bowden MD would be struck off the medical register for propagating this brain damage.
It spreads in secretions and poo of rodents, it’s not airborne like covid. That said, if you sweep up a dusty storage building with mouse droppings you can aerosolize it. Vacuums with crappy filters, the same. Bear in mind, any animal that grooms will spread their diseases with claw scratches. (Like when a bat passes rabies through a claw scratch…it’s because bats groom).
People can be dirty fuckers through. Not washing hands. Wiping their noses on the backs of their hands. Sneezing and coughing in public with no thought to cover, in any respect.
Yup. Best to use a string mop and wipe the mouse poop up. Mostly because it's gross and who wants to breathe poop?
Thankfully, Hantavirus is mostly found in deer mice (Peromyscus maniculatus) which as a species prefer to be outside.
If it jumps to the house mouse, (Mus musculus) we're fucked.
I didn't realize there were multiple genuses of mice. Neat
There are a lot of genuses of mice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnCndWVO-7k
Oh holy cats..! Thanks for that link, that guy is most deligtfully awkward and funny.. I had a blast watching the video. Really like that channel.
I once met someone who had caught it through aerosolized mouse feces while out in nature and almost died. Apparently his R/C helicopter had caused the contagious dust to spread and he inhaled it.
YES! Use your horsepaste! This one has a MUCH MUCH higher lethality.
Lalalalala. Doesn’t exist. Fake news. It’s Biden fault. Drink bleach and sun your butthole.
Does that shit taste good or something?
I thought it was the end
But no, my friends, this is when
We get to do it all again!
There is no doubt there are redcoats still sitting on warehouses full of this stuff, who couldn't get rid of it "way back then". These snake oil salesmen and purveyors of lucky charms expected to make millions from selling shit that doesn't work. Not for viral control anyway.
And so by voice of king god donnie (kgd), it's time to bring it back and MANDATE it (quick before it's all out of date).
I wonder how many square feet of the "Big I" Mr. Wormbrain has left to get rid of. Or does he use it to actually deworm?
I hate to be that guy.
But won't this cull Republicans the most?
Not enough of them to matter, likely, just like covid.
30-60% fatality rate iirc. 3 put of 9 infected already dead.
Not sure you want to live through it either, with all the damage it causes.
These people have blue check marks so they know what they are talking about
Can we just throw people like this off a cliff already?
Oh my god. Fucking horse goop will not save you. Nothing will save you if you get infected. But you probably won’t be infected unless you are rubbing butts with someone who is infected because this particular strain is human transmissible but you gotta be in super close proximity to the infected.
But by all means eat horse paste and dump bleach in your eyes. /s
Peer reviewed articles on Ivermectin from the US NIH.gov National Institute of Health.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/search/?term=ivermectin
One article of note: Proc Jpn Acad Ser B Phys Biol Sci. 2011 Feb 10;87(2):13–28. doi: 10.2183/pjab.87.13 Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
What exactly is your point?
Just including some actual scientific data from the NIH for any one interested.
Invermectin does that in vino. BUT In vitro, inside an actual human body, the amount of ivermectin required to create that effect will kill tHe patient. So no, its just not a viable treatment.
You are posting dangerous disinformation as a science meme. Reported.
Stop advertising X dot com.
I hope you realize who your target audience is. If a Lemming doesn't know actual science and who MTG is, I have bigger questions about that person than the post.
I don't know or care (as a European) who MTG is, but obviously from the USA. All I see is a screenshot of some MD telling ivermectin should work because reasons I don't understand.
As a fellow European and therefore educated beyond fourth grade I know what RNA is, I also know that ivermectin is a horse dewormer, I also know that viruses aren't parasitic wounds.
As a fellow European, I wish I didn't have to know who MTG is, but sadly I do. I also wish that I never heard of HCQ, homeopathy, and the relations between Semitic religions and space-based laser weapons, but here we are
Homeopathy is way more popular in Germany than anywhere else in the world, is funded by state healthcare and administered by their so-called "real doctors". We're not that much better in Europe than the USA, just a few steps behind in the slow slide into madness.
Absolutely. We are on a 3-10 year delay, but we get the same bullshit. Remember when QAnon made its way over?
Bruh
WTF?
you missed the joke, the post is ironic, we Lemmings (or at least most of us) have brains and know that the claim (that horse dewormer cures viral infections) is bullshit
I can't find the irony in the post title "We're so back". That's all the post says about the screenshot.
The irony is inherent, here on lemmy we are normal people who understand that this is bullshit
"We're so back" is obviously ironic agreement
woooooosh
What none of the doctors have talked about is what if this mutates with another more contagious disease. This is how the zombie apocalypse starts. 🤷
I'm pretty sure the Marjorie Taylor Greene has already reached her final form and cannot mutate into something more dangerous.
Quand on est con, c'est pas pour un jour...
How is she a congresswoman?... what is her secret? Lol
Horse paste, apparently.
*maybe she's born with it
Maybe it's neighbelline*
you don't have to be smart to work there. In fact it's better to be dumb so that common people could relate.
Why are these shitheads not dead already?!
the answer is simple.
Stuff like this in the only reason Twitter needs to stay alive.
Sigh....
Upvote or downvote. . Fuck.
Wait. The US has 300 Million people. If 30% die from the combination of deadly virus and insane politics, 210 million are left. Right?
Sorta. But losing 30% of your population dramatically destabilizes society. Those 30% are nurses, doctors, dock workers, police, pharmacy workers, plumbers, electrical engineers, military officers, ect as well as just ordinary people. The gears of society start to grind to a halt. People stop showing up to work. The dead stop getting buried because neither the hospitals nor the death industry can handle 1% deaths, let alone 30%. The supermarkets aren't restocked. Nobody comes to put out house fires. Nobody can get vaccines for measles, flu, or other common diseases. Normally trivial diseases like minor infections or dyssentary become deadly. Murder rates skyrocket. Winter comes, power goes out with nobody to fix it, people starve, freeze, or die of heatstroke in their homes. Newborn babies and pregnant women die from lack of access to care. A whole generation fractures.
If you lose 30% of your society to illness, you lose your society.
Are they getting high off this shit? Is it euphoric? What's the deal?
It was immediately and obviously debunked when conservatives and their movement were most vulnerable so the reaction was to cling to the totem of Ivermectin like it could give them salvation.
Wait, are we still pretending like ivermectin is only a horse drug?
Yeah it cures everything! Also it's fun at parties
Only horse parties tho right? I dont wanna do something stupid like win a Nobel prize for using it to treat humans.
It treats humans for specific infectious diseases. Covid wasn't one of them, and neither is hantavirus. If you don't believe me, ask the Nobel winner you referenced.
It might work in a petri dish, it doesn't work in the human body. Horses are bigger than humans.
It might work on Centaurs...
Thats crazy, must be why all those news organizations had to make up stories about people going untreated from gun shot wounds because the hospitals were overwhelmed with people overdosing on ivermectin.
I remember the chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association Haruo Ozaki publicly recommending the use of ivermectin for treating covid based on several observational studies but I dont remember either of the people who won the Nobel prize for ivermectin ever publicly stating anything about its use in treating covid.
One of them specifically said it's not his area of expertise:
https://drew.edu/2021/09/09/drew-university-nobel-prize-winner-refutes-ivermectin-meme/
A lot of people said a lot of things during the early days of the pandemic. The current consensus seems to be it only helps if you have Covid and also a coincidental worm infection that the ivermectin treats. Which is often true sadly on large parts of the planet.
So I should ask the Nobel prize winner to find out he doesn't have an opinion on the matter and that is supposed to be evidence that it doesn't work?
Haruo Ozaki made his recommendation to use Ivermectin as a treatment for covid on February 9th, 2021. Not exactly "early days" of the pandemic. It was well over a year into the virus spreading and nearly a year into it officially being a pandemic.
As far as I can tell there is no "current consensus" regarding Ivermectin outside of the mainstream narrative that its "deboonked conservative quackery". Looking into it further there seems to be one side that is willing to point to clinical data like Haruo did when making his recommendation and one side reflexively demonizing it as "horse paste" because the main stream media told them that hospitals were "overflowing" with "ivermectin overdoses". Its only when pushed that they then point to these more recent studies that supposedly "definitively show" ivermectine is ineffective.
Coincidently, only one of these positions seems to have a financial incentive for big pharma but im sure that's not relevant to the conversation.
Looking at the timeline of events regarding Ivermectin there isnt a single study from before the topic became a political issue that found it to be ineffective. As soon as it became a political topic of contention however we suddenly get several studies with dubious funding(all of which can be traced to certain key players who stood to gain financially from ivermectines being found ineffective) and questionalble methodology like using much lower and more infrequent dosing saying that its ineffective......but as with much of the conversation surrounding the vid we get "the experts agree", "the consensus is" and my favorite "the science is settled".
Anyone who's actually looked into the matter and is honest would conclude that at best, we still dont actually know whether its effective or not because the more recent studies on the matter seem to have gone out of their way to ensure that any effect from the ivermectin wouldn't be found.
No you should take it as evidence that what the person answering you before me said, that Ivermectin is not intended for use against Coronaviruses, or any viruses for that matter, is true. There was a false quote from Campbell floating around on social media and he publicly disclaimed it. Ivermectin is not an antiviral, its intended use are roundworm infections. That was the point of OPs comment I believe.
Well you know, relatively speaking it's early days, we are in year 6 now. Kind of besides the point really. Anyway I think I tracked down the (second-hand) quote from Haruo from some pro-Ivermectin website:
https://www.brightworkresearch.com/how-the-media-lied-about-japan-not-using-ivermectin-for-coronavirus/
You will note here that he specifically refers to parasite infections, i.e. worms. He could just be saying "Hey if your Covid patient has worms, maybe take care of that first".
On a side note the Tokyo Medical Association seems to be a private company, not a public medical authority. Japan did recommend and distribute vaccines as soon as they became available.
It's a bit more complicated than that, but if you want a one sentence summary I guess it fits. It was a meme that mostly conservatives seem to have fallen for.
Any specifics you can share? Like I said above, it seems Haruo was referring to worm infections and was taken out of context.
Lol, who do you think sells Ivermectin? Small pharma?
That's untrue AFAIK, but anyway - My original point was that most of the studies that showed a positive effect came from places with relatively high incidences of roundworm infections. And it just makes sense that if you use ivermectin to treat a pre-existing worm infection it will help a patients immune system to fight an additional later Coronavirus infection. There was a false signal in the data and people just ran with it. No need for big (or small) pharma conspiracy here...
That alleged recommendation from Haruo Ozaki you keep quoting for example is five years old now, and specifically citing "parts of Africa" (many of which have a relatively high incidence of roundworm infections).
Or maybe they are showing no effect because there is no effect (except in patients with a pre-existing roundworm infection, which Ivermectin is meant to treat). Sorry but unless you have something more concrete I'm sticking with my "people were panicking and grasping at straws" perspective.