Is the "Gen z stare" a real thing?
As an early 90's millennial, I've never noticed a "gen z stare" as described in news articles like a "blank face that shows lack of social skill or ability to think". The only times I've witnessed it happen and seen the older person accuse them of "gen z stare" is when the older person says something off hand or dumb but isn't self aware enough to realize they're being weird. Hell, I've given people a blank face countless times because I was taught it was better to say nothing at all sometimes. Especially when it came to talking to older people at work.
I remember when I was 16, some middle aged guy at work accused me of having no personality. In reality, I kept all conversations short as possible with him (like almost everyone in the store) because they were casually racist and misogynistic.
Nope. It's always safe to ignore any articles about "kids these days"
Oh I take most "news" with a large grain of salt for sure. Just seems like such an odd thing to attribute to a single generation when everyone alive has probably at some point reacted with a blank face to avoid saying "you're fucking weird"
Well hopefully a bit of salt and a lot of Yorkshire tea.
Perfectly balanced, Todd Howard!
It was only a few years ago that journalists seemed to realize that Millennials had jobs and kids. I'm thinking about college for my kids and "Millennials unable to adapt to the work force" articles are still being written. Bitch, we ARE the work force!
They all want to write a book and disrespects their elders.
As an elder millenial I might have some insight. You know how when we were kids people used to get all up in their feelings when you weren't smiling. That's this. "Gen Z stare", is just "Resting Bitch Face" or "You look prettier when you smile darlin'" repackaged and rebranded. They're mad that the young people in general and women in particular aren't running around with goofy forced smiles on their faces to make them feel special.
Nah. The "Gen Z stare" is the blank-faced look we give people that we think are idiots. It's not that we lack self-awareness...it's you. Gen Z doesn't tolerate stupid. We just can't be bothered to call you out on it, because that's drama we don't need. So we just stare at you, instead.
I'm in my 40s and give dad that look when he lectures me about knowing more than the politicians. He's been unemployed and supported by my grandparents for most of his life.
In fairness to him, most politicians are both stupid and paid to make bad decisions, so he's sadly probably still right...
My sister in law is a conservative millennial and she does this anytime you mention anything negative about Trump
There are women Trump supporters? My God...
The last one makes some sense, since people who call themselves Christians are usually the ones who are least likely to live according to the sermon on the mount, and religiosity requires being dishonest and/or too stupid to distinguish between reality and wishful-thinking fairy tales.
Regardless of how you phrase it, it’s still a lack of social engagement.
Do you think you’re the only generation surrounded by idiots? Most humans have been idiots for all of history. Is just that without digital media you’re forced to live with those people your whole life. Retreating into a digital world for your social and intellectual support isn’t the flex you think it is.
Why should someone put up with dickheads who aren't worth it?
That's the "tradition"
We put up with our parents shit so now you get the same shit. But in a more mental health conscious society we understand passing on the shittiness to the next generation is abuse, not a right of passage. Also the whole worldwide lead poisoning from gas thing messed with a lot of peoples brain chemistry (allegedly)
It's how you end up with sociopaths in powerful positions, noone calls them out on their shit and then one day they have fuck you money then you really won't say anything unless you feel like mysteriously dying with no follow up investigation
Because society has decided parental rights override teenage autonomy. Runaway and they’ll call the cops, who will return you to them, or if they want to be asses, throw you in juvie. So you maliciously comply while expressing your utter disdain for them until you attain the age of majority, then you abandon them and move on with your life. At that point you become a wage slave, have to live somewhere, and much like Dark Helmet, realize you’re surrounded by assholes.
Exactly: society is full of dickheads, then people fuss when they're treated as who they are like they're entitled to more.
I don't think you fully appreciate what it's like to grow up with boomers for parents. Your generation can basically ignore them, without any direct interaction. All you lose, is a birthday card. We grew up with them in our face, every single day. You can't argue with these people. All you can do, is stare at them like they're fucking idiots...because they are. Confronting them, is next to impossible, unless you are prepared to go to war over the stupidest shit imaginable.
This isn't our "social deficiency". It's theirs. We grew up with no way of communicating with a generation of Karens, other than deliberate non-engagement.
That's exactly my experience growing up as a millennial. I think what you (and hater articles) are describing as a gen z thing is normal human behavior when caught in a situation with emotionally unhealthy people, especially if it's an abusive power imbalance.
Boomers aren't really the parents of Gen Z if that's what you're saying, except on the extremes (the youngest boomers with the oldest Gen Z and they had kids past around 40 years old). That's mostly Gen X and older millennials who had kids young. I, as a younger millennial, have boomer parents and even they almost aren't.
(I typed this and had one of those "god, I don't care anymore" moments, but it's typed already so here you go)Gen X forgotten again 😭
Stares into the abyss...
If it's not social engagement, then why are you experiencing a particular social signal from it?
A boycott or a strike is political engagement. Deliberately ignoring you is social engament. A blank stare sends a stronger signal than small talk: It means actually engaging with your ideas and judging you for them. Where small talk seeks to neutralize tensions with noncommittal affirmations, a blank stare communicates a boundary clearly and efficiently.
If someone says "good morning" and you just stare, you're not "not tolerating stupid", you're rude. You know how much better you can make someone's day by giving a friendly response? It'll make your own day better too.
Yes it's rude, but there are some people who think that insincerity, dishonesty, and wasting time is rude. They're probably a minority even within Gen Z, and possibly just see the world differently from extraverts.
The issue is when people are so self-absorbed they treat everyone like idiots, so the “stare” becomes a default.
Congratulations, you've described a common human behavior that humans have been doing for all of human history. 😐
All this nonsense about this or that generation doing something incomprehensible to other generations is just distraction and noise meant to keep us attacking each other instead of coming together against the oligarchy that's been systematically grinding us down for ever increasing profits.
This is the proverbial scrolled-too-far-down-for-this-comment
The various answers in this thread are just hilarious.
The stare is real; it's when they work in a service position but don't communicate. You walk up to the counter and instead of greeting you or asking how they can help you or saying anything at all they just stare at you. That's the Gen z stare. It's that simple and I've encountered it everywhere that employs younger people. It doesn't bother me, you don't have to do shit for a shit wage, but it does make interactions unnecessarily awkward.
The comment saying that Gen z just doesn't tolerate stupid is hilarious. What percentage of your generation voted for Trump again?
Huh maybe it's cultural but I have totally encountered this with older people. Any time there is a ticket or info booth like at a train station, they are either staring or doing something else and I never know if I'm interrupting something. It's the best when they fiddle with something looking very busy, and then they look at me annoyed that I'm not saying what I want from them.
It appears the same but it's a different thing entirely. The older people are confused because they've been doing $THING the same way for 30 years and now $THING has changed and they're struggling. I think that's natural, and also kind of agree with them, because all these "self service kiosks" that are replacing people fucking suck ass by comparison to a live human being that is capable of thinking beyond a few decision trees.
The thing being talked about here is where people take jobs working customer service, where 50% of their job is to be a resource to the customers coming in that may have questions or need assistance, but are annoyed that they're being asked to be a resource to the customers coming in because who fuckin knows why, and are displaying their annoyance by not being a resource to the customers coming in and staring at them like somehow they're at fault for being a customer ruining their day for walking through the door.
So what if there are signs on the ceiling that say "Restrooms"? If someone in their 70s comes in and asks where the restrooms are, why is that so bothersome? I mean, if that's the hardest thing you're dealing with in your day to day count yourself lucky because kid, it ain't gonna get any easier as you get older, not by a fuckin longshot.
Thank you! This is the part I cannot stand. If you want to sit and blink at me on the bus when I ask if the seat next to you is taken, hey, fair enough, Ill just sit down then and fuck you, I was just asking to be nice but aint no one sitting in it and you didnt open your mouth so now Im sitting in it and you can process that however you need to, not my problem.
But when Im at the store and ask where the paper towels are so I dont have to spend 20 minutes walking through a building that covers 40 acres, and get nothing but a dead ass stare, thats fucking ridiculous. Is having to point to an aisle really such a hardship that mentally it causes you to lockup?
Honestly I think this comes down to a lack of socialization. People arent learning how to function in social situations that arent curated for them ahead of time anymore and simply do not know how to communicate properly with strangers. Which is understandable, of course, but where it falls apart is when you willingly take a job to be in that position and then dont want to do what the job entails.
Thank fucking god a normal reply.
Sounds like poor training maybe
To a degree, I do agree with you. However, if you are of the legal age where you are even allowed to hold a job, period, you shouldn't have to be trained on how to interact with human beings. That training should have happened long before you came to us looking for a job. If they're even hired in the first place, they must have demonstrated that they are capable of having a conversation or else they wouldn't have been brought on.
I mean really that's the whole reason we do the interview...we don't give a shit about their technical skills really, because that's all stuff they will be trained on. What we give a shit about is that they're capable of interacting with other people in a professional manner. If someone is sitting for an interview and just blinks at us whenever we ask them a question about their application, they're not going to be offered a job. So its pretty clear that for the interview, at least, they demonstrated that they have that base skill or else I wouldn't be training them in the first place.
So then why the fuck is it that all those skills they demonstrated they have during the interview evaporate the minute they're on the payroll? Like do I really have to train someone that if the phone rings at their desk, they need to answer it? That if they receive a direct email from someone, they need to respond to it? That if someone asks them a question, they need to answer, and not just stare at them?
I can teach people the technical shit all day long, and literally do it all day long. But I should not have to teach them that a ringing telephone needs to be answered, especially if the job they were hired to do was, in part, answering the fucking phone. And there are people out there that still think that I should have to do that, or worse, that Im the jerk for expecting it in the first place. Just such a fuckin clown show all around.
The education system doesn't teach shit on how to interact with human beings though, and even heavily discourages it by making it about individual skill and competing for the highest scores. Then throws them into the real world that functions completely different than what it teaches and floods people with various things that demand attention but giving attention to all at once isn't possible and a lot of it is bullshit anyways. Everything becoming a suburban hellscape where you need a car and parental consent to do anything and people call the police on children or teens doing things by themselves and stuff being increasingly age restricted doesn't help either. Meanwhile everyone still needs a paycheck whether they have those skills or not.
I think it's that they lack environmental awareness because they are so used to staring into a screen all day. Like their brains lack the trained ability to be constantly over viewing their surroundings and using peripheral vision.
It also sucks because to get their attention you have to raise your voice or otherwise startle them to get their attetention, which like the other person said, makes it awkward and probably makes you seem hostile or demanding... when you basically have to be rude and demanding to get them to acknowledge that you want to place an order when they are literally face to face with you... but they are just spaced out.
Unless you are literally a child there is no reason for the person at the counter to greet you or ask how they can help, put on your big boy pants and just tell them what you need and move on, everyone is busy and no one has time to make you feel special, have your order prepared before getting to the counter, just say Hi can I have xyz and they will get it done, that's all the conversation that needs to happen.
First, I've never noticed this "Gen z stare" thing, but you do need something when you walk up to a customer service person. Looking up at me, a little nod, a hello, something to let me know you're ready for me to start the interaction and I'm not interrupting.
That's what blows my mind with that specific argument...that people hesitate before just talking because it's considerate. I appreciate it when Im in the middle of composing an email and the person standing at the door to my office gives me a second to finish the sentence Im writing. Im sure the people that are standing behind the counter have similarly been doing something that requires concentration and appreciated that someone gave them a minute to get to a stopping point before taking their attention away from it.
How the blue fuck that could ever be interpreted as "stupid" or "annoying" is completely beyond my understanding. Or how we're just waiting for someone to say "Oh hi" or "Ill be right with you" or "Can I help you with something?" before interrupting their work is somehow, in itself, worthy of being treated the same as if you just came in dropping F bombs screaming at them.
So I guess that's the disconnect for me...how they literally cannot see the difference between a bog-standard customer service type of interaction and someone legitimately being an asshole to them. To them, they are both equivalent. Anything that involves them interacting with someone they don't feel like interacting with is some sort of slight or imposition. It's totally fine to be that way in your personal life, but not when you're standing at the fucking information kiosk at the hospital, being paid to work at the information kiosk at the hospital, where your job is...wait for it....providing information to people that come to you at the fucking hospital.
Lmao what? You are saying the person put specifically in a position to ask me how they can help me, or say hello, or just have a normal human interaction isn’t required to do that if I’m an adult? Wild.
I'm not saying there should be no acknowledgement of someone, but a simple hello or hi or even a head nod is enough. Stop expecting people to put on a fake smile and make small talk to make you feel good about yourself
I don’t go to the cashier to make small talk and I don’t really think too many people expect that either.
Im sorry but thats just not normal unless you are neurodivergent. We're not robots. Honestly something is wrong if you dont even have mirror facial expressions.
I get dissasociating from a rude customer, but i ja e gotten that stare from a simple ass "hey hows it goin".
Hey how's it going is just an empty phrase that means Hi, you should not expect any response to that other than a hi back at most, unless you actually want to know how they are doing, and the answer to that is they are tired and miserable, which you would know if you ever worked a customer facing minimum wage retail job before. Just because people don't have the energy for your bullshit doesn't mean they are neurodivergent. In many other countries where employees aren't forced to plaster a smile on their face the interaction won't be anymore then this either.
Yes, exactly. Everyone knows it's a pointless platitude, the goal is to get an acknowledgement in response that you can further the interaction. When you don't get that response it's a problem - you don't know if they're busy, and the vast majority of people don't want to be rude by just launching into your order (or whatever) just expecting them to be ready for it.
wait I thought they were just "staring into space" so how are we assuming they're busy now?
I assume they're busy - what you assume is your business, but "they're busy" seems the nicest option.
Uh, actually, it kinda does mean that, because the vast majority of people aren't so exhausted by responding to "Hey, hows it going?" with a normal, human response that they not only completely opt out of doing it but then go on the internet and complain about how unfair it is that they're expected to behave in line with what is defined as 'the norm'.
Here's the questions you need to ask yourself: Why do I feel like being asked to engage with a person that is asking a normal question is equivalent to being forced to engage with someone that is treating me poorly? Why am I seemingly unable to separate the two, and conflate participating in social niceties with being abused? Why is the social equivalent of a papercut and a shotgun blast to the face the same in my eyes, and why do both generate a similar response?
But whatever you do, if you can't handle being expected to respond to "hey hows it going?" with some variation of "not bad, you?", for the love of Christ, please don't willingly seek out employment where a key facet of the job is doing just that, or at the very least if you do, save the blinking and acting like Im inconveniencing you for asking a normal-ass question like "Is this the line to pay?" If you can't even handle that, that is not at all the fault of the person on the other side of the dialog.
Not everyone has the opportunity to get something that isnt customer facing. Most jobs created today are low wage service positions. People are tired and jaded at a world thats leaving them with a fucked up environment, no social safety nets, dwindling job prospects, increasing costs to live without rising wages, rising authoritarian governments all over the world. I get that those positions should have a bit more tact but I also empathize with those young employees who feel like the world has turned its back on them and so they are just doing the bare minimum to survive. The world is becoming less caring for its inhabitants are you really surprised those growing up in that environment are mirroring the treatment they get from the world back to you?
Genuinely what is the proper response to 'hey, how's it going?' Because that is not normal where I grew up but it's normal where I live now and I always respond with something like "good, you?" Unless I know the person, which is obviously wrong because half the time I get no response lol HELP
"Good you" is the perfect response, its just a more personal version of Hi or Hello, no need to over think it. As for the second part if you know the person hows it going can just be a conversation starter, its meant to ask what are you up to, i.e. is there a light topic we can have small talk about that isnt going to be too involved. You can respond with something along the lines of "I'm doing good, such and such happened the other day that was nice, how about you."
Yeah this is something I needed to adapt to as well. That phrase is not a question it's just another way of saying sup or hi, you don't need to answer it even with a cursory I'm good how are you, I just say hey or hi and move on to the next part of the conversation.
There is a huge reason for the person at the counter to greet you or ask how they can help: thats the fucking job.
I find it ironic that you're throwing out lines like "big boy pants" when you could also do the same and get a job where you dont have to work customer service...you know, put on your big boy pants...and go get a job that doesnt require you to be a human facing worker.
"God I cant stand the smell of cooking meat!!"
"Then why do you work at McDonalds?"
"Stop being microaggressive!"
"But there are lots of other jobs out there where they dont cook meat, why not take one of those instead?"
"NO! Why should I have to change? McDonalds should change! And until they do, im going to bitch and complain every chance I get."
"Oh, uh...okay, good luck with that I guess"
I stopped working retail a long time ago and the fact that you think people in certain jobs are worth less than you and should suck up and deal with shitty behavior speaks volumes about what kind of a person you are
Never said that. I worked retail for twenty years, dude. I went back to college in my mid 30s.
I know what the job is. I know what the expectations are. You need to examine why you consider both "Hey, can you help me find something?" and "You're worthless to me and I don't care about you" as equivalent in your mind, because that is the shit people are complaining about.
Nobody is telling retail employees they need to take abuse. What we're telling retail employees is, being asked to assist a customer in itself does not constitute abuse, so please, hold the ire when I come to the customer service desk, the place that exists for that explicit purpose, and ask a simple question. That is literally what you are being paid to do.
Step 1: Get rid of these generational names.
Europe doesn't have them. The USA only has them because whoever comes up with one gets invited to talk about what defines that generation, and with that a lot of money.
I think that's just a "happy little accident".
Don't know about mainland Europe but, in the UK, generational names are definitely a thing. Stupid newspaper headlines about Millennials, Gen Z, Gen Alpha, are very common, unfortunately.
Agree about the idea of getting rid of them, judge people on what they do (the content of their character, if you will) rather than what age they are.
Do you know what the stupid thing about this is? Those generations are not the same between countries. Babyboomer for example are defined as people born between 1946 and 1964 in the USA. In Germany it's 1955 till 1969. There are also people around talking about "Boomer" in asian countries, which had totally different experiences and demographics. The whole concept of those "generations" is trash and people thinking that there is a specific stare for everyone who was born in a certain timeframe is also an idiot
In Italy they are not really a thing. The media uses it sometimes but most people really don't care
As an elder millennial, I've neither witnessed nor even heard of this "phenomenon."
It's quite possible you've done it tho.im 41 and never thought about it until I heard about it. My CPU usually resets and just plays jenny talking to Forrest Gump on the bus. "Are you stupid or somethin?" And then I come back to reality and can function again, and respond in a manner that isn't offensive. If my brain didn't reset, it would respond with low RAM and i would invariably say something incredibly offensive.
Every generation is like this at that age. The hallmark of my generation, GenX, was apathy. Not that I care. Whatever. Never mind.
Hello. Hello. Hello. How low?
no. it's just another thing to make people upset at each other. ignore what they say.
lol sounds like an asshole to work with. I would have handled it the same way.
This guy was insane, we had an employee who came over from China for uni. A few of us are in the lunchroom eating one day then this guy walks in, takes an exaggerated breath in and says "SMELLS LIKE A CHINAMAN IN HERE!" this happened in like 2015. And he has the audacity to think other people are the ones with nothing going through their head.
New girl at work exists.
Asshole: "she'd be hot if she was white and blonde"
Dude, she is hot. And way, way out of your league.
Calling people out should be the norm
Dudes like 55, short, fat, bald and missing teeth and he's judging a young woman like that? Gtfoh.
My guy was early 70s by the time I left and also fat. He was retired but worked part time, pretty sure it was to creep on young girls. Even the 14-16 year old dishwasher girls would say that he always mentioned their appearance, sometimes while he sat there watching them do dishes as he rubs his gut.
Everytime I was talking to a young lady customer he would walk between us and introduce himself. One day my girlfriend was in with her sister and we were talking, he butts in as usual and the 3 of us gave him the "gen z stare" until he walked away. Just thinking about him makes my blood boil.
My last boss was this way! Horrible way to go about living. I gave as little personal 1-to-1 time as possible. The more time he got from me the more he would slowly hint as his whacko conservative ways.
No, hacks keep writing generation war articles because they're stupid and lazy.
Even the "stare" is just a hack's memories of general teenager movie tropes. I bet right now if I said "80's bored teenage stares at character saying something stupid and weird" you know exactly what I'm talking about.
I've seen it a few times. Each time I immediately thought "damn this job must suck" and then later I realized I was the moron customer who asked a dumb question.
The thing is, even if you do ask a dumb question they should treat you with respect, right? And not make you feel bad about it, unless it's perhaps offensive.
Remember when you're mother told you, "if you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all"? Well gen z kids raise by the kids rasied on that behavior. The second line in this societal meme. They don't insult but they don't give fake small talk to cover it. Maybe I'm projecting but i feel the gen z stare is the evolution of that mindset.
That's a pretty profound theory, I completely see what you're getting at. To the YouTube video-essay factory with you!
Yes. They work in the store and know all the things. Others do not. It’s literally not their job to know. It may seem dumb when someone doesn’t know something you have learned 100x over. You may even convince yourself that any normal person should figure some thing out easily. But everyone isn’t working in that store thinking about this stuff for 8 hours at a time and we are all busy living our lives. I don’t believe in being a dick to someone because you think their question is dumb. Frankly we are all smart at some things and dumb at others and the rule should be to have some grace with one another about it.
The water cups may indeed be right there dude but excuse the fuck out of me for not spotting them - I just walked into this restaurant and there are a million things to look at in here.
As someone who works in retail, the thing that pisses me off frankly isn't so much the stupid questions (though yes those are annoying af), it's the fact that most of the time customers don't even attempt to figure it out before asking. A question pops into their head and they immediately ask someone. Maybe they should try to use that brain inside of their head before bothering a severely underpaid & overworked retail worker who can barely afford food on the table before asking such an inane question.
Stupid questions don't bother me as much when I can be assured they who are asking them at least made an attempt to figure it out on their own first.
It also doesn't help when I'm asked the same question fifteen times in a single shift. (No, I'm not exaggerating.)
You know, I kinda low-key hate this. I get why it’s your thing because I’ve also worked various retail and service/hospitality jobs, but still. I usually go out of my way to avoid having to talk to employees, but sometimes I don’t have the time, or my pain flares up and I lack mental energy to do that. In especially the latter case, which is getting more frequent, I just ask someone rather than spending 45 minutes looking with pain-glazed eyes that pass right over what I’m looking for. Same thing if I go to huge places I don’t normally go to. It’s absolutely, no question, a gigantic waste of my time to even try to figure it out rather than just ask someone who works there to look up where it is and point for me, 3 minutes tops. They don’t know where it is either, what hope do I have to guess right?
This is one of those “you don’t really know what someone is dealing with/has experience with” things. And it sucks on both ends, but at least from my experience in those roles, it helps to remember that retailers of all types have a nasty habit of changing store layouts periodically with the specific goal of making regular/frequent customers wander around looking for things they used to be able to find, just so they can briefly make more money on impulse purchases. They’ve even done studies to see how often people are willing to tolerate these layout changes so they can maximize it further. Maybe retailers shouldn’t keep forcing customers to use their whole brain (remapping, which will take multiple trips at full brain power. The effort also fatigues a person, which reduces willpower to resist impulse buys) for what should be a minimal-brain activity (routine habits exist to decrease mental load), and you wouldn’t have people who don’t want to further engage their brain just to find the pie crusts that used to be right here, damnit. The frequency with which they do this encourages people to just ask rather than look because it happens so much they’ve learned it’s probably not worth the effort. A form of learned-helplessness.
I can feel the overwhelm set in whenever I walk into a store to discover a changed layout, sometimes months after it happened. Half the time I just leave because I’m not prepared for that much effort, and I have the luxury to do so because I’m the only one impacted. If I had kids to feed or something the entire equation shifts dramatically, and I’d be in there, zombied, asking annoying questions.
Exactly. You are not in your element so even things that seem obvious might not be. It’s very easy to be wrong. And if you do the wrong thing, people will get made at you because “you could have just asked.” Do they really want customers in there all acting on their best guesses? I think that is a fool’s wish. I also don’t get the expectation that I will prioritize sparing the staff a small effort like speaking some info. I’m not taking a shit on the floor and making them clean it up. I’m asking a question. They're literally paid to help. This is the job. It’s work. This is why they call it working.
Again. You think someone should be able to figure it out with the tiniest effort. But it really may not be so obvious to someone who doesn’t know what you know.
You are not alone here - all people struggle to truly visualize the mind of another person who doesn’t know what they themselves know. Sure you know whatever it is 1000 times over. But the customer does not, and they may have a totally different 1000 things on their mind.
People don’t want to take a guess when they can just ask. If you are in an area where customers can address you, you are there to help them. Why should they stop and guess to spare you effort? It is unreasonable to get pissed off by this.
Some think that respect needs to be earned. I think everyone deserves courtesy, but I wouldn't blame someone for this stare when confronted by MAGA-level idiocy/sociopathy/greed.
I'm an older millennial and I've been doing the gen z stare since the late nineties. I often find the stupidity that spews forth from not just my peers, but what seems all humans, to be disarming to the point of disbelief. That translates to me staring at you blankly for a second. The times i don't stop and recover for that second results in insults spewing from mine own mouth before my brain can restrain. The pause is for both our sake.
We're actually giving them a second to tell us they're just kidding
Exactly, it keeps me from quoting Forrest gump. "You stupid or somethin?"
I have absolutely seen this and experienced this. Although, I don’t think it’s much different from any teenager or young person working shitty jobs in any decade I’ve lived or seen in media. The silent teen staring you down at fast food is timeless.
alienation of labor
That’s not genz thing. That’s the hot potato method of where you drop the potato on the ground and don’t play the games the sociopath wants to play.
This is a more widely used strategy now that mental therapy is more openly discussed. And the best way to win the game with a narcissist/sociopath is to not play their game. in the older days this was done in form of cutting contact. Don’t take their calls. Leave. Don’t interact.
Deadpan stare is a form of this as visual blocking.
Before the 80s so many people thought ‘I can change him!’ And after the 80s there were so many books about living loving a narcissist and how you can’t change him.
Now we just have the deadpan stare. And so many hack comedians from yesterday liken it to ‘cancel culture’ or not having a sense of humour cuz they can’t deal with being irrelevant because of their unchecked hatred landing flat
I guess it depends on the context.
Work in a customer service job? People are going to talk to you. They may ask you questions. Those questions may even be something you consider silly. But guess what? Thats part of working customer service! Youre paid a wage to...wait for it....serve customers. Part of serving customers is occasionally having to answer questions that you may or may not think are stupid.
But its not a big deal. There is no one on this planet that hasn't asked a stupid question before. Even the person that works at the counter at Starbucks and is annoyed that Im asking a question and thinks its appropriate to stand there and blink at me rather than acknowledge I exist in some human way, ill bet any amount of money they asked a stupid assed question at some point in their lives and the person they asked almost definitely didnt just sit there and stare at them until they felt bad for asking it.
I guess my point is, the problem as I see it arent the people that play that game in their day to day, its the people that play that game when their whole job is to assist the public in some way. The context is different. You can do whatever you want in your personal life, but dont take a customer service job if you dont want to interact with customers. Youre paid a wage to answer those questions and assist customers whether you think theyre stupid or annoying or not. But dont worry, nobody forces anyone to work anywhere in this country anyway, so if that is truly too much to bear, there are plenty of other jobs that arent customer service out there, go do one of those.
Signed, a 40-something that has gotten the blink in response to questions like "is this where I pay?" when standing at the register at a diner and being blankly stared at for 5 minutes, or "excuse me, where are the restrooms located?" when Ive got my 3 year old in tow and they're doing the potty dance, about to soil themselves. If someone here thinks those are the appropriate sorts of questions to just stand there like a statue and not respond, please help me understand how, because I cant figure it out.
Yeah I’m noticing people in this thread claiming it is some social injustice to be asking people at their job to respond to simple people talk. Not even complicated questions or like, aggressive customer issues. Just a simple “hey is this where I order?” and they are spiraling.
Fucking weird.
Honestly, and this is digging pretty deep here, I think it boils down to entitlement.
I work in IT, and as one of the more senior people at my firm, am often coaching the paid interns we have coming through in spring and fall. I've been doing this for over a decade now, and I've noticed some trends among these early 20-somethings fresh out of college that was not the case previously. Namely, the employee/employer relationship.
As an easy example, here's a specific argument I have had to have virtually every single time one of the new interns starts: "I know we're supposed to be here at 8am but does it really matter? So what if Im a few minutes late?"
Well, once in a while, sure, shit happens. We're actually pretty loosey goosey with that stuff and don't watch people's punches. We don't go looking for people the minute they're supposed to be at work, we give people 15-20 minutes to settle in and all that shit, which in my mind is pretty fuckin reasonable. But even that is seemingly "too micromanage-y" for the interns lately, and I've found myself having to explain how being on time to work is important, not just for our firm, but like, for society to function. Im explaining to legal adults that they need to be to work on time and its an argument. And the thing is, after a point, here's the answer they're going to get: "Why does it matter? Because if you don't do what you agreed to do, your internship is going to be terminated and you will not be receiving an offer from our firm." And somehow that is unreasonable to them. They literally think they can come in to a new job and do whatever the fuck they want, breeze in 30 minutes late every day, and we're the assholes for taking issue with that.
But that's just one easy, universally recognized example. There are dozens more, every single day. "Aw man, you're telling me I have to do this by hand?" Yes, that's what Im telling you. "But that's going to take ages!" I know, believe me, I've done this same task myself many times. "I don't want to do this." Yeah, I know, but it needs to be done, and everyone else is working on other tasks, so unfortunately you're going to have to do it. "But I don't want to, I think this is dumb." Well, you're entitled to thinking whatever you want, but Im telling you, I need you to do this, and I know you don't have anything else going on because Im the one that gives you your daily task list every morning, so go ahead and get started and let me know if you have any questions. "But I still don't want to do this!" I heard you, but I don't care whether you want to do it or not, you're being paid a wage in exchange for your labor and we need your labor on this specific task. "So I don't get a say in it?" Well, NO, you don't...what on earth would make you think you think that?
And that's the question I never get an answer to. Where they think that they have a say in whether or not they perform a legal task being posed to them by their employer. They're free to quit and get a different job, Im not stopping them. Honestly, I'd prefer if they'd just quit now then me have to dance this stupid dance every other day, explaining to literal adults that the whole reason they're paid a wage is to do these sorts of things. Like what did they think, they were going to come in here and change the business to suit their whims? How fucking childish.
Yes, they do. They can just go home, or walk around the block, or work on something else. No matter what your employer tells them, they aren't a slave at any point in time.
Will there be consequences? Absolutely. They might get fired. They might get sued. If the task is sufficiently important the State might consider them not doing the task criminal negligence.
This isn't entitlement, it's choice and freedom, and perhaps having different priorities than the person assigning tasks. Everyone, including GenZ: Do you, and if you can try to spread joy and reduce suffering.
Do remember tho, someone has to keep the infrastructure working, and it's often not clear where in joy in that lies.
FWIW, I agree with you. But to be clear, I didn't list that choice because I felt it was obvious. They absolutely can walk out and not ever come back, they have that autonomy of course.
Where I make the distinction is where the line is drawn as concerns continuing your employment. If you will not perform the tasks expected of you, you will no longer be paid, your badge will no longer open the front doors, and you will not be working here. If that's the decision you need to make for yourself, I fully support and there are no hard feelings on my side of the desk. I can and have had those sorts of frank discussions before, and it comes with my role in the company as it stands today. Don't want to work a job with a set schedule? No problemo man, I get it, but that's not how it is here, so best of luck to you in the future!
But as long as the wage is being drawn, and I'm asking for things that are part of the job expectations that are listed on the documentation they signed when they started working for us, that is beyond the point of negotiation. I'm not an asshole, and I have never in my life assigned a task that I have not personally done myself when I was in their shoes. The tools and technological gains have made their role easier by orders of magnitude then where it even was when I was the intern all those years ago. But when my mentor was assigning my tasks, never in a million years would I have thought that I had the right to dictate to my boss whether or not I would do that task if I wanted to continue being an employee of the firm. I felt it was pretty obvious and clear to anyone that has worked in their lives that it do be that way...I dont get to tell my boss what Im doing if I want my boss to continue employing me.
That is the disconnect Im referring to...the fact that people are taking jobs thinking that they get to dictate what the job entails, even after being told what the job entails, even after signing documentation saying they agree to what the job entails. Where does that come from? And why are people so surprised that refusing to do what a job entails means that you no longer can reasonably expect to continue that job?
I don't know, but I saw something similar in my father (RIP). He would agree to something, then get some benefits, then later attempt to "renegotiate". That sort of behavior isn't something "GenZ". Some people just want to squeeze water our of rocks, even if it is deleterious to their relationships.
Similarly, I've certainly had employers that, despite my job duties clearly not covering the task would ask and expect me to perform other tasks "for the good of the company". It's fairly common these days for job offers to include "and other duties as assigned" because employers want to have all the power, and I'm fine with workers (of any generation) just refusing to comply.
It does sound like the employee was being unreasonable and maybe should be dismissed, but that doesn't get the task done either, so maybe the "do it, you have no say" approach isn't any better. And, I have no idea how I'd handle it. I kinda don't like delegating stuff anyway, so if I thought the task was important I'd do it myself unless someone happily volunteered. But, I know that might not "scale" the way it needs to make the business work.
Oh, believe me, I know that's not just a GenZ thing. I've worked with people that were in their 60s that would pull the same sort of shit. I think it's human nature to react negatively to being asked to perform an annoying task, and there are many shades of gray in whether the task itself is justifiable or not. Where I differ though is that in my own experience, so long as a request was reasonable, even if the request itself sucked, I didn't refuse to do the thing, or at least, knew that if I refused to do the thing that it might have negative consequences on my continued employment.
I'm not a slave driver...believe me, I am very selective with delegating and like I said, I have literally never once in my life, not ever, asked someone to do something that I haven't done myself and know intimately what it entails. I'll delegate the task and even help them along by giving them guidance on the most efficient way to complete it...way more than I ever got, that's for damn sure; where Im at now had a real sink or swim mentality before I came along and was able to shape things more constructively when it came to developing our new hires and that's reflected in the changes in our turnover over those years.
But anyway, getting back to the point, it's not just a GenZ thing, but it is something I've noticed at a much higher percentage in our younger interns and entry level employees then the years pre-Covid. Everyone is different, but that weird sense that they can have their cake and eat it, too...they can just opt out of doing what's expected of them and still somehow expect to not have any consequences for doing that...that's the thing that I see more and more as time goes on among the fresh hires where Im at. The surprisedpikachu when they're getting talked to about the fact that they've rolled in a minimum of 20 minutes late every day this week with no explanation and that's not okay. Being accused of being unreasonable for talking to them about it in the first place, like I'm out of line with the expectation. That's the attitude that bothers me, and it's more common then I've ever seen it before.
What you’re complaining about seems to just be what every generation has done on their first job. This isn’t a genz thing. This is how most people act on their first job until they learn how schedules work not just for them but for everyone to sync up. Their first time stepping out side of their school or family home.
Cuz that’s also part of your job as a boss who trains staff to succeed: you have to also interact with these interns and teach them this. You do have to answer these stupid questions. Someone did it for you on your first job, and if you think they didnt: think again. Every generation has the entitled phase of when they first step out of the house and face the world who don’t kiss their asses like their parents did.
I just don’t get this generational ageism fight. It’s a stupid argument that gets us no where. It’s just about patting the self on the back at someone else’s expense.
No generation escaped going through this asshole phase. Personally if the new generation does come up with a better way to set schedules, there’s nothing wrong with room to improve. We can all benefit from improvement. Lots of places run on outdated, exclusive rules that can definitely afford improvement.
Yup, I have heard the same complaints about younger generations since the 1990s about Gen X, which are now passed on to us millenials. I've always heard the same old versus young fighting since I was a child.
I've had 1 experience with 1 younger employee that encapsulates what is considered to be the "Gen z stare". She was prolly just bored at working in a beef jerky shop. Not gonna get my ruffles in a feather (I like em crunchy).
Ive worked with younger folk at my work. Half are "oh my lord , we are so screwed " the other half is "damn, this kids smart, I like em"
Soo nothing has changed in the last thousand years.
GenX here. I think it’s the name that’s given to a small collection of social mismatches between the generations’ expectations of one another and their social behaviors.
Gen Z in my view do not place much value on social graces as I define them. They’re under no obligation to please me, I realize. But yeah they do not seem to care much for social graces as I define them. Things like “greet someone before you ask for something,” and “say thank you before you leave.” I try to do these things at all times and I find GenZ do not always return them or give any sign they even saw them. When a cashier hands me my change and it’s time for me to go, I will say “thank you,” and imho it’s good social graces for them to say “thank you” as well or “you’re welcome” or even just “have a nice day.” But with GenZ cashiers, I say thank you, and then realize they had stopped paying any attention to my presence even before I said it. The second the change has been handed to me, it seems they consider the transaction over, period. It can feel abrupt. And in that moment, someone like me can be waiting to hear that “you’re welcome” and instead see the other person staring off into space. I have also heard of worse cases where someone is asked a direct question and instead of answering they just stare. I think those are more extreme cases but it’s believable to me and I’ve heard it enough times for it to be credible. It’s obviously not a universal, constant thing.
I also think that for this generation, being a retail worker is much more of a misery than it was when I was their age. Wages suck more now. People may be less polite now. And corporations have really tried to squeeze the most out of every employee. They have to do a bunch of different things. It seems they schedule the bare minimum number of people they can get away with. Maybe in my day kids enjoyed their job more because they could literally only stand at the register talking to customers when there were some, and in between horse around with the other workers. I think a lot of that slack has been squeezed out of the system. Frankly a lot of service has also been squeezed out of the system. I remember when waiters would pack the rest of your meal to go for you. They still did this when I visited Portugal last year and it was so nice. Many things like this have disappeared. Maybe this is part of why customers are less polite now. Service isn’t what it once was. Not always the fault of the workers.
The bit about the Stare is not always true or even most of the time. But it’s something that happens often enough to notice as a pattern. Once you’ve heard the stereotype of the “GenZ stare” you can start to experience confirmation bias of it. And really you never know if the person you’re facing is GenZ or not.
So it’s not a thing one should over-think. But yes I think there is something real behind it. Like a lot of stereotypes, it’s not fair to apply to everyone, but it may have some origin in reality somehow.
Generally, what works for me is to say it like you mean it. Say it like they just walked across the store to pick up a can that rolled off your cart. throw a little 'unexpected' in there, light smile, and then tell them to have a good day. If you don't sell it, they're going to assume you're going through the motions just to feed the machine. They'll blip back to you for a second from the next mundane task, get a smirk or a little grin, and say you're welcome. Then GTFO, don't tie em up, don't make em think you're flirting.
I doubt it makes their day noticeably better. It hasn't seem to make them noticeably worse. They're probably burned out and don't want to emotionally invest further into their job.
Might this be an extravert thing? Do extraverts enjoy being told to have a good day?
I prefer not to, and I also don't want to be told to smile. I'll put up with banalities like "Hi" even when there's no need to actually get attention, and "Thanks" when the person clearly isn't thankful; but if asked "How are you?" I might actually answer and they probably won't like my answer if they didn't mean it.
Maybe introverted people put more value in honesty and not wasting time?
Dunno, I'm an introvert who's gotten better at extrovert cosplay over the decades
You know… it’s a courtesy. I do mean it - for what it is. Thanks for handing me my change. I’m not going to fire up my acting chops to “sell it” like they did something extraordinary if they did not.
Nah, it's just the natural response to people asking the dumbest shit imaginable while you can't say anything rude without getting fired.
"flabbergasted"
I've encountered what I think of as the Gen z stare once or twice.
It skews more towards the younger end of Gen z, and honestly might even be more of an older gen alpha thing.
What I'm talking about isn't the blank look given after being asked a stupid question, although they are absolutely masters of that as well (and I love that look and use it as myself)
It feels like more of a lack of understanding that someone is asking you a question and expecting an answer, or perhaps an inability to process that question and come up with an appropriate answer.
My friend who works at a bank has what I think is kind of the quintessential story that shows this version of the stare looks like, a younger person walked up to the counter, he asked some variation of "How can help you today?" And just got a stare back, like it never crossed their mind that they'd have to answer a question and say "I need to make a deposit/withdrawal,/etc."
And I don't think it's necessarily a feature of the generation as a whole, not that gens z and alpha don't have their quirks, but I have plenty of Gen z friends and coworkers and I don't think they're much worse off in any particular way than my fellow millennials. I have somewhat less exposure to gez alpha, but overall my opinion of them is largely the same so far.
I think it's a very specific subset of the generation with a perfect storm of social isolation/anxiety issues, maybe some neurodivergence, probably some overbearing helicopter parents, and COVID kind of hitting at exactly the wrong point in their lives so that they missed out on some kind of social development milestones.
Yeah. Totall agree with you interpretation.
You know who also gives me the gen z stare? My mom with dementia. She literally can't understand or process things anymore... and she exhibits the same spaced out behavior and often you have to ask her things a few times before it registers. And just like Gen Z stare kids... they don't ask 'can you say that again' or show any indication they had misheard or not heard what you said, it just didn't register at all that you said something.
I think it is a cognitive thing where basic language interactions just don't register due to issue with attention and focus. I have nephews who are teenagers, and they never do it... but they are basically banned from social media and other phone obsessive stuff and their screen time is limited to 2 hours a day.
It's just another distraction from the class war. Anything that tries to divide us is just a distraction.
I’m Gen X and I have that stare when dealing with some people.
I call it the “dafaq” stare.
Me too, with all people, but specifically only the breathing ones. :P
Each generation goes through a phase where they need to weigh out what "vocal authoritative" people are saying.
Each generation later goes through a phase where they try to pass "what worked for them" off to the younger generation.
Sometimes, it rings true, some times is rings out of touch. Sometimes the advice is too suspect to trust but they don't want to start an argument.
My father tried to tell me I needed to get in somewhere that had a nice pension plan because Funds where bullshit. Turns out funds are bullshit, but pension plans are dinosaurs now and often get raided even worse than fund sheets.
My own is find a good place to work with managers that listen, work hard, become dependable, work harder, become hard to replace, start climbing the ladder.
Either of these things should absolutely cause a blank processing stare on a 20-30 something, because neither are anywhere near universal,
I've always interpreted the stare as a consequence of growing up where cameras (phones) are everywhere and nothing ever disappears from the internet. And as a result people who grew up under that are ALWAYS cognizant of this. So they express nothing because it could make for embarrassing video or photos. Being extra or try-hard are also considered bad. Everything is tamped down, socially. They are seriously just repressed, internalized.
Yes, there is a feeling of the world is now a panopticon and anything you do or say will be used against you and taken out of context.
I also think their lack of facial expressions is a result of growing up staring at screens instead of interacting face-to-face with people.
Boomers would call it the "fluoride stare", in relation to some of them believing fluoride in water made millenials stupid.
I dunno. I'd consider it just a dumb generational thing.
Big talk for an entire generation dumbed down from leaded paint and gasoline lmfaooo
And Asbestos
Me, an aging Xennial: "The hwat?"
It's just a positive sign towards the deprecation of the weird social theater we've trapped ourselves in.
"You must smile at all times even if nothing warranted it, otherwise you are rude and I get offended."
That really doesn't appear to be what people are describing
It's basically the same concept the "Jim face" from The Office. You do something stupid, they stare deadpan at you.
The Gen Z stare is simply the rational response in dealing with customer facing situations where either 1. the customer is problematic, or 2. if the worker genuinely doesn't know what what to do.
Responding or engaging to problematic customers (racist, homophobic, misogynistic) can only lead to conflict, reprimand, or lawsuits.
Responding with inaccurate information or simply saying leads to conflict, reprimand, or poor reviews.
Both have worsened as people have become more polarised, and management cuts funding and hours for training.
The correct response if you don't know is to get a manager.
These people we've been screwing over for our own benefit won't smile for us!
Oh my god leave the poor fuckers alone.
Thank you. stares
I'm also an early 90s baby. It used to be you'd say something back when you caught someone staring at you. Like hey take a picture it'll last longer. Then the one staring would snap out of the moment, crack a joke back, and be done with it. Now it's that moment going on too long and the person engaging the stare doesn't even acknowledge it afterwards. My brother's girlfriend does it all the time. The other day I'm getting ready to leave and opened my door to go to the bathroom and the girl stopped what she was doing to glare at me. No hello, no good morning, no thought behind those eyes. Just nothing. I put my hands up like I got arrested and she snapped back to what she was doing without acknowledging my existence.
It's almost as if nobody told them staring is rude. It's weird. It sucks.
Edit to add a word
This isn't that.
What is it then?
Its not when you catch someone looking. It's when someone stares blankly because what you said is so stupid it doesn't warrant a response.
Saying "take a picture it would last longer" doesn't work functionally in this context.
What is it then if you get the same stare without saying anything at all?
I do that, I stare and say nothing. Too shy
Staring isn't rude. People are awfully self-conscious. People can just be. Weird is fine.
Maybe it's a culture thing then. I grew up in a city where I was told if you look at someone the wrong way they'll beat your ass. I've seen it first hand too. You get the wrong person at the wrong time, staring can lead to a fight.
Who's rude in that situation? Pretty sure anyone who beats people over nothing is a universal dickhead.
The aggressor. Have you never been in a situation where you're walking down a street and lock eyes with someone and they yell back 'the fuck you looking at?' Staring can be so much more than nothing. We've spent all our evolution as a species adding meaning to different looks and stares.
The eyes convey so much emotion. You can look at somebody and tell exactly how they're feeling just by looking at their eyes. That's the problem with the Gen z stare. There's nothing behind it. It's startling when you receive it. My immediate reaction to it is usually 'is there something wrong here?' Then to attach a judgment like you're stupid to it by the person doing it is off-putting.
The only thing I know of that comes close to what you're describing is the "thousand yard stare" of someone in the middle of an internalized existential crisis or reliving a traumatic moment as a daydream.
Or possibly just looking confounded by the other person's incredibly weird/stupid take on something.
My son is a cinephile, and he talks about "iPhone Face" on young actors, where actors in period pieces look like they've seen an iPhone. Once you're aware of it, it's really true. Its really prevalent in crappy Netflix productions and the like.
Can you explain a little more what you mean? Maybe an example?
Timothy Chalamet and Zendaya in Dune, first come to mind. I remember him mentioning them. They look unmistakenly like 21st century cosplaying American kids. He likes Chalamet, and really liked him in Marty Supreme, where they uglied him up, and made him look like a real person. Zendaya is another issue. She's just a current It Girl, without even much to back it up.
He complains that modern movies are too sanitized, especially when it comes to actors. An entire cast will be impossibly beautiful people. Even villains have to be handsome/beautiful. There are a few active actors with "unconventional" looks, but most are older, like Buscemi. But it doesn't seem like anyone is coming up who are known for a distinctive, but not attractive visual image, and Hollywood doesn't seem even vaguely interested.
Edit: Also Julia Sweeney. How could anybody look at her and think she exists in any other time but now.
Forbes has an article from a Ph.D. who claims it's real.
The ‘Gen Z Stare’: What It Means And Why Employers Can’t Afford To Ignore It
By Bryan Robinson, Ph.D., Senior Contributor. author of Chained to the Desk in a Hybrid World: A Guide to Balance.
Jul 16, 2025, 06:43pm EDT Jul 21, 2025, 04:07pm EDT
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryanrobinson/2025/07/16/the-gen-z-stare-what-it-means-and-whats-underneath-it-at-work/
He was born in 1945 according to Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryan_E._Robinson
That puts him in the Silent Generation, as Boomers don't start until 1946.
Ah yes, an 80 year old definitely has the perspective to understand Gen Z. It's possible, extremely unlikely, but there are always exceptions, just look at Skyrim Grandma.
Quickest way to tell is to see how they explain a current massive meme like 6-7. If it's some overly complicated explanation, they clearly have no fucking idea what they're talking about, degree or not. A degree just means you're more educated in one specific thing, the higher that degree, the more specific that knowledge. Often that means anything unrelated to that specialization end up lacking. Some of the most educated people I know are the absolute dumbest as soon as it leaves their very specific knowledgebase.
Here's a quote from that article
6-7 is a combination of absurdism, reference humour, and demand resistance, no?
Some would say even that is an overexplanation, because it's so generalized and clinical.
The origin is a TikTok video about NBA player LaMelo Ball, and a conversation about his height being 6' 7" and a lyric from the song "Doot Doot" by Skilla with the same numbers playing over that. Everything surrounding any reference to the numbers in general has spiraled from that, originally trying to get into further TikTok edits.
https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/67-meme
23 skidoo daddy-o
Nothing has ever changed.
Simple answer: no
Why do you think that? :)
😐
It's not the sort of thing where we have clear statistics on. If we had statistics on the "Gen Z stare" then those would be of limited use due to the lack of historical data which could give us contextualised information in conjunction with contemporary statistics.
There seem to be only anecdotes. The above post marks my first hearing of such a phenomenon and I do therefore think not much of it. I would stipulate that any discussion around the "Gen Z stare" has more in common with folklore retold for nice musings than information which interfaces with the world as it is lived.
Well I appreciate you sharing the timeline of your learning about the subject matter, it's not relevant and wouldn't fall within contemporary statistics.
That's been a thing long before zoomers have been around.
"Why are you looking at me like that?" I would often be asked.
"Because what you just said was so mind blowingly asinine that I need a moment to put together a response."
Young people in customer facing positions seem fairly unemotive in general, I'm not necessarily sure it's a new trend. The positions these young people are in are generally minimum wage (or effectively minimum wage). They aren't really being paid enough to smile lol, or don't really have much to smile about.
I tend to avoid all eye contact with folks in public so I'm probably not really the best to answer it. It's sort of something I've noticed, but I'm really not convinced it's new.
That said, I do get that there's a lot of folks who missed out on a lot of socialization opportunities during the pandemic. Whether that's enough to lead to an epidemic of young people doing a "stare" I'm not sure.
Every young generation gets clowned on. As a millennial I remember us getting it. So it's hard to really say if this is something real or just more "youth bad" rhetoric.
a lot of people try as much as possible not to acknowledge the humanity of service workers, its completely normal for those workers to become numb to the endless stream of jackasses. Even if the next guy coming up does acknowledge them and treat them like a human, its hard to fault any perceived carelessness. Its also not limited to young people, any supermarket I go to has older peole working and you will encounter the same phenomenon. Its the alienation of labor under capitalism.
i worked in customer service positions as a teen and 20 something. it is not hard to just say hello to people when they are in your store. it's a basic requirement of the job.
yes, it is novel for them not to do this. and no it's not a majority, but it's a markedly new experience to go into a store and see a 22 year old who basically ignores customers who re actively seeking their attention/help.
I have no clue what people are going on about it's timeless or whatever, i never dealt with it my entire life until very recently. like i have been going ot the same coffee shop for 20 years, and only in the past year have I had a barista be spaced out when i come up to the counter to order, and it's always these young baristas, it's not the older ones who ever do this.
and also we have issues at my job with gen z employees that we have never had ever before. i have been working there 10 years, and only in the past 2 years have we ever had to fire anyone for lack of performance or violated basic company policies... and we have had to five 6 people in the past year or so, all new hires, because they back the most basic social and work skills that we have never ever had an issue with before.
like we literally give them the rules of employment, they actively violated them and get caught, and act all confused like they didn't understand what they did wrong. so we then terminate them and they are SHOCKED. they seem to totally lack the concept that actions have consequences and if you can't show up to work and follow basic common sense instructions, you don't get employeed.
and like a lot of the posters here they are massively entitled and think they are owed 100K jobs at 22 for entry level jobs and skills.
I'm going to take a shot in the dark and assume it's been about 20 years since you have been a young 20-something? I'm not Gen Z, I'm old enough to remember a pre-911 America. I get on to my girlfriend all the time for this same thing. Yes it is their job working in customer service to make your experience pleasant, but it's also hard to take pride in the work that you do when your employer offers no health benefits, pays you poverty wages, and the cost of everything is constantly on the rise.
The material conditions in which they are growing up are very different than what were present when we were. This kids/young adults do not know what it is like to live in a world without the constant threat of terror or an endless stream of information that seeks to use our anxiety and outrage to keep us engaged.
Have some empathy and try to put yourself in their shoes. I'm well established in my career at this point, and I can't imagine how hard it must be for someone fresh out of college now. If I had that much student loan debt and couldn't find a job using that degree; I'd be mentally checked out making someone's coffee too. I'd be thinking about how the hell I'm going to pay back those loans.
No, 10 years. I have dealt with all the crap you are whining about. I worked for 'poverty wages' until I was in my mid 30s. And yet I never felt I was in poverty... weird. Maybe because I didn't expect to travel, to party, and to own the latest electronic gadgets... because yeah any wage is a poverty wage when you spend more than you make, and you don't save and invest.
It's hard to take pride in your work when you're whiny, entitled, and refuse to take responsibility for yourself, yes. I worked customer service jobs since i was 14, they are ridiculously easy and bare minimum effort. They are not hard back-breaking work, nor are they cognitively demanding. Acting like it's some heroic difficult job to sling coffee or sell clothes is just sad and disrespectful to people who actually have difficult jobs.
I am so sick of being told to have 'empathy' for entitled lazy people who think they are owed a six figure job for doing the bare minimum. I'm glad you think life is so 'hard' for them. I don't. I am not very far removed and I interact with them regularly and a lot of them are just lazy entitled nitwits, a lot of them just depended on the bank of mom and dad. I was help paying family bills at the age of 16 and many of them are still in their 20s and 30s, financially dependent on their parents. It's pathetic. Nobody owes them anything. They have to go otu and actually make an effort.... and funnily enoguh... the gen z kids I know who are making an effort at life... are succeeding and happy. They get jobs, promotions and move up the ladder. They save rather than spend recklessly and they invest and they... become financaily stable and independent?
Nobody is going to become financially successful or independent when they take their 40-50K a year job and blow 10-20K of it on ubereats, traveling, and boozing. But boy do the people who do do that love to whine about hard and unfair and awful life is.
Nobody in their 30's are a member of Gen Z. The first birth year of Gen Z is 1997. Look I get it, I had to cut my own path in life too. My mom was a single mom so I learned how to cook because I was taking care of my siblings while my mom went to school and when she started working. I didn't take any of the fun classes in High School so I could double up on core classes to graduate early. I also got EMT Basic certified during this period so I had a job I could easily work at night when I graduated. EMTs don't get paid shit, and its emotionally and physically exhausting work. I do well now as a software engineer, but I'm not so far removed from that time that I don't remember what it was like to only have dried beans and rice in my pantry.
I just don't understand how someone could go through that and come out on the other side so bitter. But you know sometimes hurt people hurt people. Just like children who are abused sometimes become the abusers themselves. Some people struggle and instead of being mad at the system they get angry at people who try to fight against it.
I genuinely hope you can let go of that resentment for your sake, because it has a way of eating away at you. I work with Gen Z all the time and don't find them to be any more or less objectionable to work with. If anything some of the most problematic people from our department have all been Gen X and I had to let go of one individual because he had repeated behavioral issues. Although I don't think that's a reflection on his entire generation. He's just a person, just like us.
As an aside, several years ago I discovered powerlifting and it has been a great outlet for many of my frustrations. Plus growing muscle and increasing bone density is great for longevity as you age. Come join the community if you're interested or have questions about how to get into the sport. :)
If any young Blahaj users are reading this, I want you to know that this is exactly what my cat would do; and doing this supposed behavior makes you look like a cat. You are a cat if you do this. Carry on.
Being compared to a cat sounds like a wonderful compliment. I should go nap in a sunbeam tbh
and it’s not just any cat, his cat is famous!
It's collective PTSD. 1997. Keeping up with things feels like a marathon. It's hard smile rn. It doesn't feel appropriate rn. You Stonewall until the other person indicates how they feel, but sometimes you get two blank faces going back and forth. In general, we live in interesting times and I don't want to het punched in the face because I smiled about Trump being a bitch.
I wish that term would not get thrown around so much like when a fat chick complaining she was delivered the wrong pizza, now she has PTSD. What you're describing is not PTSD.
PTSD is from more than just war and sex abuse.
https://www.charliehealth.com/post/gen-zs-mental-health-crisis-collective-trauma
I'm well aware of what PTSD is, and that article is about depression. I dont give a shit about this supposed "collective trauma". Edit- most of the people described in the article would be ethically diagnosed as having depression and/or potentially Generalized Anxiety Disorder (GAD). I have a BSc in Psychology and used to treat victims of serious crimes where the offfender(s) was convicted and received federal sentences at minimum 4 years +.
K. Well me and multiple of my friends are diagnosed with cptsd because of the insanity that is our world.
That's why I specified ethical diagnosis. No ethical doctor in North America is going make a diagnosis of PTSD as per the DSM-5 simply because of upsetting world events. It would end up as (like I said) depression and possibly with generalized anxiety. People like yourself are being overdiagnosed with "CPTSD" as per ICD-11 and it's not doing anyone any favors. You and your friends need to visit a war zone or a 3rd world country if you think you got it so bad. You don't know what real trauma is; not by a long shot.
You dont know what lead us to these diagnoses and it is incredibly ignorant and disrespectful to pretend you know better than actual doctors. I hope you never have a practice. You will do lasting damage.
If you ended that with:
"lets turn that frown upside-down :)"
it would have been perfection
You missed the collective memo! Everything that happens that is mildly upsetting is now traumatic and requires years of therapy to cope with... and yes, the barista who mispronounced your name at Starbucks did it DELIBERATELY to mess with you because they secretly HATE you... and it's not at all your projection..
Gen see, gen do. People adopt each others behaviour.
enculturation
The process by which an individual adopts the behaviour patterns of the culture in which he or she is immersed.
The adoption of the behavior patterns of the surrounding culture.
Or they or ze or xe
I've run into it, I think. Went out to eat with the wife and as we walked into the restaurant the hostess just stared at us, then picked up two menus and started walking. We were like, "Do we follow her or...?" And so, sheepishly, we followed her and she did indeed lead us to our seats. It was a couple weeks later when I first heard of the Gen Z stare. I showed my wife and we were like, oh... That was it, we guess.
I've seen it a couple other times - recently at CVS the guy at the pharmacy counter would just sort of stare at each customer without really acknowledging them until after they said what they needed. No greeting or pleasantries of any kind, and then he would go into his standard cvs scripted questions.
why words wen none good
(I'm GenX, [1980] but I've always thought a lot of "polite" "social" habits are dumb.)
refusal to engage in smalltalk is laziness
small talk is fake conversation
not being able to accept that you have nothing interesting to say
It's letting the other person know that you consent to discussion and that you appreciate their company. People who don't do this are lazy and selfish.
Laziness is my choice and a virtue in my profession and my preferred operational method.
Laziness is selfishness when your actions negatively affect other people. Selfishness is not a good person's trait.
You don't get to blame me for your reactions, only my (in)actions.
When no words accomplishes the task just as well, it's not selfish to avoid small talk. The fact that you find it rude or impolite is your problem, not mine.
Which is selfish of you :) QED friendo. Have a day!
how does absence of small talk negatively affect other people
It might make them uncomfortable. If you don't make polite small talk, they won't know if you're a safe person to be around. Did you not know that?
Whether someone makes polite small talk seems like a weird way of judging people's trustworthiness, although, people will reveal stuff about themselves in conversations. But the things that reveal trustworthiness are more likely to be mentioned in serious conversation than in small talk.
Funnily enough, the only time I've experienced this was also at a CVS.
I've seen a lot of this over the last few years, esp since covid.
Part of it is: "That's the most absurdly stupid thing I've heard in a while, let's allow this to echo for a bit and maybe when the speaker thinks on what they said, they'll reconsider." But there's a range, from that to grey rock - just deny the other party any kind of reaction, much less satisfaction. just be a blank space. grey rock is really useful vs narcissists and people who feel entitled (why don't you just smile more).
we weren't as sophisticated in this way when I was a kid; if your parent was emotionally manipulative or abusive, we generally had to just eat shit. kids these days can do research and find strategies, and I respect that. on the other hand, I've never had a problem just picking up the phone and calling someone, which my kid thinks is absolutely deranged. when I told her we'd call people on purpose for pranks - just dumb fun - she thought I was full of shit; pointed out all the bart-calls-moe as examples - well yeah that's a cartoon....
it's funny how times change.
Only encountered it once maybe two years ago. Was in a part of town I am not often around anymore and dropped in a coffee shop I used to frequent. The staff couldn’t have been much older than 20, all with bare midriffs that I have never seen in food service before (this is kind of a grungy art district spot, but still). Ordered my coffee and asked about their food which used to have some gluten free options, and got a blank stare for maybe 10 seconds.
That’s it. Just once. Not a general stereotype but I’m not exactly well traveled so maybe more regional?
I am a millennial mom to a gen Z teenager and have noticed this as well actually. I wasn't sure if it was just that my kids friends are weird or what lol. I said hello and they stare with a small "hey" or don't say anything back while avoiding eye contact?? Lol... Like I am your friends mom? You should probably at least take a "hello"???
Edit: Now that I am reading these comments as a therapist it actually sounds like trauma? The zoning out and being lost in thought happens with chronic trauma victims. It sounds like disassociating from growing up with COVID and other systemically traumatic environments during crucial development periods. Sad
I started doing this a lot several years ago and I don't know what the cause is or what can be done about it
Also, wanted to add stuff like Niagara App for clean tech and Finch which is a cute wellness app that can help build positive habits and it's super adorable. Maybe it will help? Just some ideas to throw out there that have worked for me.
Taking breaks away from technology. Camping? When you are able to - sit with your thoughts and accept them instead of fighting against them. The more we avoid and deny ourselves the ability to feel we end up oppressing and disassociating. You are worthy of love and you are allowed to feel anger and sadness as well. It's normal. Especially lately. Humans have gone through collective trauma for years now, not even counting COVID, and that was a huge one too. It's normal to feel like shit sometimes. Lean on the local community more than ever before. View your local community as a tribe, it helps after natural disasters. There is collective healing that needs to be done.
Also, this breathing technique daily for a few weeks even outside of stressful situations: "Box breathing is a deep breathing technique that involves inhaling, holding the breath, exhaling, and holding again, each for a count of four seconds. It helps reduce stress, improve focus, and calm the nervous system, making it useful in high-pressure situations."
I've seen it before from retail workers. The first time I thought they were on drugs.
They don't activate until they decide to act. They don't engage in formal greeting. Like, "Hi, how can I help you?" Like an idle NPC that hasn't been triggered to run its script yet.
It's probably related to the perpetual screen use that causes derealization or whatever. Like how streamers walk around in real life but their mind is engaged in the virtual world of their chat channel, and the real world to them is the virtual one.
It feels pretty odd to describe someone seeming to not be focused until they realize someone else is there as them being stuck in a fantasy world as a result of screen usage. Putting a smile on and being engaging can be exhausting. I don't think we should fault folks for not doing it for 8 hours while they work.
I think there is a case that could be made for 'screen time' having some kind of impact for how someone might come to value the presentation of persona for the sake of others' comfort.
Like if you spend less time in person-to-person interactions, its might mean you won't value it enough to constantly keep it up.
it's your job to do that. jobs are exhausting... if you can't do that basic task then you shouldn't have that job.
i'm confused. like you expect to not do your job and still get paid? if you work in customer facing jobs it's your job to greet customers.
I'm a millennial too and tbh I've done the gen z stare, sometimes there are just things that dumbfound you.
Nobody is always going to have the answer to everything and be immediately quick on their feet at all times.
I feel like I got this at the dentist office with the receptionist once but could be I was the idiot in the situation. Late for an appointment by a little bit, two options seemed to be ask them if there’s still time or schedule a new appointment. All I got was a blank stare instead of seemingly anything reception related.
Really strange how many attribute their anecdotes to a wide ranging phenomenon afflicting only one specific generation.
It is, and it's not just to do with neurodiverse traits like autism either (unless they can be induced by GenZ's lifestyle, which I don't think they can be.)
I get it from other GenZ people, and observe them using it on others. It's pretty freaking annoying tbh, but maybe thats just because the first example that jumps to mind is someone I really don't like. 🤦♂️
I don't think it's what you describe, which is something different
like the stare I got when I told a grandson he should shovel snow for his grandma. did as much for my grandparents, regretably.
Yep. They never really learned that facial expressions are important part of communication due to being online. Their equivalent is throwing emojis everywhere.
Yes. I encountered it a few times this year, but never really noticed it prior to '24.
I have literally had to yell at gen z baristas and shop clerks to get their attention, they are just ZONED OUT. Like you walk up to the counter and they are two feet away from you and don't acknowledge you unless you break them out of their spell they are in. They are terrible with taking orders too.
I've also had it training new hires at work who are under 25. They simple cannot focus and zone out, and then totally forget everything you just trained them on a day or two ago.
Hey man if you're going around yelling at service employees I think it's clear who's in the wrong.
It's like you didn't read the message and understand the context.
It's like there's never a good reason to yell at anyone, let alone a minimum wage service employee who's barely scraping by.
There are absolutely good reasons to yell at people.
Seriously, what kind of performative crap is saying things like "it's never right to yell at anyone"?
I can't seriously think you either believe or have thought this through.
Okay, tell me about one situation where yelling at someone achieves anything. I can't remember the last time I yelled at anyone.
"Help, we are being attacked"
"Stop fighting!"
"Watch out, there's a bus coming!"
"Leave me alone, leave me alone!"
"Are you proud of working for ICE? Do you go to bed proud of what you do?"
1 is crying out for help instead of yelling at someone
2 doesn't do anything
3 is a good example. Warning someone of imminent danger is a place where yelling at someone actually helps
4 again doesn't do anything except serve the same purpose as 1
5 again doesn't do anything. Nobody's joining ICE with their conscience intact
if you aren't serving people you aren't doing your job. do your job and stop spacing out when someone wants to buy something from you. If you don't show basic decency and respect for your customers, you shouldn't be surprised to get any back.
Also we have had to fire many of our gen z employees because they can't learn and the break rules. Clearly we are in the wrong for requiring our employees actually have to do their job and do it according to company policy and the US legal requirements! How dare we impose the law on them man! They should totally be able to just do whatever they want, whenever they want, as poorly as they want, without any consequence.
And do you pay them enough to deal with bullshit?
If you're not paying enough to motivate them, and you don't make the experience of working enjoyable, of course you're going to be stuck with the worst of the worst employees. They sound like they don't want to be there, if they had any motivation they'd probably spend it looking for a better job
our job has no bullshit. all they have to do is do the work. and they can't do it and not fuck up it. so they get fired.
10 years ago we never fired anyone. 5 years ago, we never fired anyone. the last 3 years we have had to fire 12 people all under the age of 25 because they fuck up repeatedly and refuse to cooperate when they are warned. they also violated common sense rules, like if you work from home, you can't travel and you still have to turn in your work on time. and yet they fail to do these things.
Gen Z and I work in customer service. The average consumer has become such an entitled, idiotic, immature prick that you cannot reason with. Guess what age range these pricks tend to be?
If people are consistently breaking an internal rule, that means the rule should probably be looked at. I work with gen z, I manage gen z, they're just people that society has kicked in the balls over and over and over again and their will to do anything has been eroded since they were conscious. Their primary social years cut off in the middle of a global pandemic. Maybe work with empathy and someone will want to work with you.
the rule is work 40 hours a week and do not travel out of the country while working for us.
we have had to fire 6 people in the last 12 months failing to meet both these very basic 'show up and don't be an entitled idiot' rules.
Idk how strict you guys are with the 40 hours a week. Does 39 count? 38? 35?
I also struggle to see why travelling out of the country is not allowed. Unless it's some sort of really secretive and sensitive work, why can't employees leave the country? Are we talking vacation? Time off?
40 hours is 40 hours. it's not that hard of a concept. slacking off gets you fired.
and it's breaking company policy and USA law to work overseas. it is sensitive work that is under constant threat by attackers.
but slack jawed gen z people can't take themselves or our very serious work, seriously.
stares