Spyke
lemmy.world

Reusing names of critical system directories in subdirectories in your home dir.

193
lemmy.zip

I agree with this take, don't wanna blame the victim but there's a lesson to be learned.

55
neatcheereply
piefed.social

except if you read the accompanying text they already stated the issue by accidentally unpacking an archive to their user directory that was intended for the root directory. that's how they got an etc dir in their user directory in the first place

67
sh.itjust.works

Could make one archive intended to be unpacked from /etc/ and one archive that's intended to be unpacked from /home/Alice/ , that way they wouldn't need to be root for the user bit, and there would never be an etc directory to delete. And if they run tar test (t) and pwd first, they could check the intended actions were correct before running the full tar. Some tools can be dangerous, so the user should be aware, and have safety measures.

-2
neatcheereply
piefed.social

they acquired a tar package from somewhere else. the instructions said to extract it to the root directory (because of its file structure). they accidentally extracted it to their home dir

that is how this happened. not anything like what you were saying

12

I understand that they were intending to unpack from / and they unpacked from /home/ instead. I'm just arguing that the unpack was already a potentially dangerous action, especially if it had the potential to overwrite any system file on the drive. It's in the category of "don't run stuff unless you are certain of what it will do". For this reason it would make sense to have some way of checking it was correct before running it. Any rms to clean up files will need similar steps before running as well. Yes this is slower, but would argue deleting /etc by mistake and fixing it is slower still.

I'm suggesting 3 things:

  • Confirm the contents of the tar
  • Confirm where you want to extract the contents
  • Have backups in case this goes wrong somehow

Check the contents:

  • use "tar t'' to print the contents before extracting, this lists all the files in the tar without extracting the contents. Read the output and check you are happy with it

Confirm where:

  • run pwd first, or specify "-C '/output-place/'" during extraction, to prevent output to the wrong folder

Have backups:

  • Assume this potentially dangerous process of extracting to /etc (you know this because you checked) may break some critical files there, so make sure this directory is properly backed up first, and check these backups are current.

I'm not suggesting that everyone knows they should do this. But I'm saying that problems are only avoidable by being extra careful. And with experience people build a knowledge of what may be dangerous and how to prevent that danger. If pwd is /, be extra careful, typos here may have greater consequences. Always type the full path, always use tab completion and use "trash-cli" instead of rm would be ways to make rm safer.

If you're going to be overwriting system files as root, or deleting files without checking, I would argue that's where the error happened. If they want to do this casually without checking first, they have to accept it may cause problems or loss of data.

1
fedia.io

I dunno, ~/bin is a fairly common thing in my experience, not that it ends up containing many actual binaries. (The system started it, miss, honest. A quarter of the things in my system's /bin are text based.)

~/etc is seriously weird though. Never seen that before. On Debians, most of the user copies of things in /etc usually end up under ~/.local/ or at ~/.filenamehere

8

~/bin is the old-school location from before .local became a thing, and some of us have stuck to that ancient habit.

5

I use ~/config/* to put directories named the same as system ones. I got used to it in BeOS and brought it to LFS when I finally accepted BeOS wasn't doing what I needed anymore, kept doing it ever since.

2

[OP] accidentally untarred archive intended to be extracted in root directory, which among others included some files for /etc directory.

7

Oh, my! Perfect use of that scene. I don't always lol, when I say lol. But I lol'ed at this for real.

2
vapelokireply
lemmy.world

So, you don't do backups of /etc? Or parts of it?

I have those tars dir ssh, pam, and portage for Gentoo systems. Quickset way to set stuff up.

And before you start whining about ansible or puppet or what, I need those maybe 3-4 times a year to set up a temporary hardened system.

But may, just maybe, don't assume everyone is a fucking moron or has no idea.

Edit Or just read what op did, I think that is pretty much the same

-1

But may, just maybe, don’t assume everyone is a fucking moron or has no idea.

Well, OP didn't say they used Arch, btw so it's safe to assume.

(I hate that this needs a /s)

2
lemmy.ca

Oof. I always type the whole path just because I have made this mistake before.

59
BillyClarkreply
piefed.social

That doesn't protect you from typos.

rm -rv /home/schmuck /etc

"Whoops, I accidentally added a space."

I have three ways around this:

  1. ls ~/etc ... <press up arrow, replace ls with rm -rv>
  2. ls ~/etc ... rm -rv !$
  3. Add the commands to a simple script and use variables to remove the danger of a command line.
15
BCsvenreply
lemmy.ca

Thankfully I don't hit the space bar randomly (yet) but btrfs snapshotting has saved the day for other mishaps

3
BillyClarkreply
piefed.social

I think the bigger point is that if you type the entire path, you are obviously typing more characters, which gives more opportunities for typos, whatever they may be.

It's far safer to find ways to type less. Less typing, fewer typos. As long as you can do it safely.

3

I don't think that applies when you intend to type something but accidental type enter after your first slash / :)

1
lemmy.today

OOOOOOOOOOOF!!

One trick I use, because I'm SUPER paranoid about this, is to mv things I intend to delete to /tmp, or make /tmp/trash or something.

That way, I can move it back if I have a "WHAT HAVE I DONE!?" moment, or it just deletes itself upon reboot.

57
lemmy.today

That's certainly something you can do! I would personally follow the recommendation against aliasing rm though, either just using the trash tool's auto complete or a different alias altogether.

Reason being as someone mentioned below: You don't want to give yourself a false sense of security or complacency with such a dangerous command, especially if you use multiple systems.

I liken it to someone starting to handle weapons more carelessly because the one they have at home is "never loaded." Better safe than sorry.

Lol we should have "rules of rm safety":

  • Assume rm is always sudo unless proven otherwise.
  • (EDIT)Finger should be off the Enter key until you are certain you are ready to delete.
  • Never point rm at something you aren't willing to permanently destroy.
  • Always be aware of your target directory, and what is recursively behind it!
23
Sylveonreply
lemmy.blahaj.zone

I think this is the best approach. I've created a short alias for my trash tool and also aliased rm to do nothing except print a warning. This way you train yourself to avoid using it. And if I really need it for some reason I can just type \rm.

If you want to train yourself even more effectively you can also alias rm to run sl instead :)

6

you can also alias rm to run sl instead :)

Choo-choo!!

Hehe I just thought of a hilariously nefarious prank: alias ls to sl. 😂

2
programming.dev

After being bitten by rm a few times, the impulse rises to alias the rm command so that it does an “rm -i” or, better yet, to replace the rm command with a program that moves the files to be deleted to a special hidden directory, such as ~/.deleted. These tricks lull innocent users into a false sense of security.

5
lemmy.today

I've read this somewhere too! Where are you quoting it from if I may ask?

But yes I also agree 💯%. rm should always be treated with respect and care by default rather than "customizing the danger away."

2
programming.dev

Quoting from Linux Hater's Handbook, lovely read

EDIT: UNIX Haters, not Linux hater, my bad

2
lemmy.today

... is it the "UNIX-Hater's Handbook" from 1994 with a parody of "The Scream" on the cover?

1

i always do "read;rm ./file" which gives me a second to confirm and also makes it so i don't accidentally execute it out of my bash history with control-r

7

F

(That's not going to help you, just paying my respects.)

4
feddit.uk

Let he who has not wrongly deleted system critical files in Linux cast the first stone.

46
KickMeElmoreply
sopuli.xyz

Amateurs. You all did it accidentally. I deleted system critical files intentionally believing it was beneficial.

28
HereIAmreply
lemmy.world

/dev is just all bloat with stupid recursive directories

14
0x0reply

A development directory? I don't need that!

4
mercreply
sh.itjust.works

I can do one better. A similar 'rm' command but while a Windows disk was mounted read/write. So, 2 OSes damaged in one command.

11

Great! Now you can enjoy that freshly assembled directory feeling, knowing that now you only have the configs in there that you need.

43
sh.itjust.works

This is why you should setup daily snapshots of your system volumes.

Btrfs and ZFS exist for a reason.

35

That's my current approach. Fedora Atomic, and let someone else break my OS instead of me.

5
sh.itjust.works

You can still break your /etc folder. But many other folders are safe.

Personally I do both.

1
Jakeroxsreply
sh.itjust.works

Wish ZFS didn't constantly cause my proxmox to need to be forcefully restarted after the ZFS pool crashed randomly.

6
wylinkareply
szmer.info

I get months of uptime on a ZFS NAS, though I'm not using Proxmox. I don't think it's the filesystem's fault, you might have some hardware issue tbh. Do you have some logs?

9
Jakeroxsreply
sh.itjust.works

I just reformatted back to ext after messing with it for about a month, been totally fine since.

I do also assume it was something screwy with how it was handling my consumer m2

3

I am running a zfs raidz1-0 pool on 3 consumer nvme in my workstation, doing crazy stuff on it.

Ran zfs under proxmox with enterprise nvme and had the same issue.

It is proxmox, not zfs

7
jjj
lemmy.blahaj.zone

Is there any reason to use a root account? If you had used sudo for each privilege needing command in stead it would have stopped you.

26
lemmy.today

Is there any reason to use a root account?

if you just borked your /etc and need to rebuild because you don't have sudo anymore

30

I hand-edited sudoers.conf day one on the job without using visudo

So in one day, I learnd both how to move a volume from one AWS VM and that there's no good reason not to use visudo.

4
4amreply
lemmy.zip

Would it? I think it would have just let you do it.

3
lemmy.world

I think they just mean you'd be prompted for a password, which should give you pause if you're supposed to be deleting items in your home folder.

2

If you use sudo for each privileged command you wouldn't typically use sudo to remove something in your home directory, so the command would fail. At which point you'd check why the command failed.

1
sh.itjust.works

The biggest flaw with cars is when they crash. When I crash my car due to user error, because I made a small mistake, this proves that cars are dangerous. Some other vehicles like planes get around this by only allowing trusted users to do dangerous actions, why can't cars be more like planes? /s

Always backup important data, always have the ability to restore your backups. If rm doesn't get it, ransomware or a bad/old drive will.

A sysadmin deleting /bin is annoying, but it shouldn't take them more than a few mins to get a fresh copy from a backup or a donor machine. Or to just be more careful instead.

5
programming.dev

Unix aficionados accept occasional file deletion as normal. For example, consider following excerpt from the comp.unix.questions FAQ:
6) How do I “undelete” a file?
Someday, you are going to accidentally type something like:
% rm * .foo
and find you just deleted “*” instead of “*.foo”. Consider it a rite of passage.
Of course, any decent systems administrator should be doing regular backups. Check with your sysadmin to see if a recent backup copy of your file is available

“A rite of passage”? In no other industry could a manufacturer take such a cavalier attitude toward a faulty product. “But your honor, the exploding gas tank was just a rite of passage.”

There's a reason sane programs ask for confirmation for potentially dangerous commands

2

True, in this case trash-cli is the sane command though, it has a much different job than rm. One is remove forever no take backs, the other is more mark for deletion. It's good to have both options imo. Theres a lot of low level interfaces that are dangerous, if they're not the correct tool for the job then they don't have to be used. Trying to make every low level tool safe for all users just leads to a lot of unintended consequences and inefficiencies. Kill or IP address del can be just as bad, but netplan try or similar also exist.

1
feddit.nu

The handbook has numbered pages, so why use "page X of the pdf"? I don't see the page count in my mobile browser - you made me do math.

(I think it's page number 22 btw, for anyone else wondering)

4
lemmy.world

I dont know if you use firefox on your phone, but i do, and i fucking hate it that i cant jump to a page or see the page number im on.

4

That is what I'm using. I don't really read enough pdf:s to notice it normally, but I guess it's another reason to get off my ass about switching browsers ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

2

The handbook has numbered pages, so why use “page X of the pdf”?

Because the book's page 1 is the pdf's page 41, everything before is numbered with roman numerals :)

I also wasn't expecting anyone to try and read with a browser or reader that doesn't show the current page number

3
lemmy.zip

Btw, what's this about QWERTY to slow them down? Far as i know, it's to reduce finger travel?

2

Qwerty was developed so that typewriter hammers have a low chance of hitting each other and get stuck. It was never about finger travel or ergonomics.

PCs adapted the layout and unfortunately we stuck with it ever since. There are many better layouts, some more extreme in terms of difference to qwerty, some just fix the most blatant problems. Colemak and Dvorak for example.

5

On mechanical typewriters the little arms that slap the steel letters onto the ink ribbon/paper could get physically jammed. QWERTY was designed to make it so that was less likely to happen by placing the keys in an order that discouraged it.

At least, that's the way I learned it.

Source: trust me bro

5
lemmy.world

Your first mistake was attempting to unarchive to / in the first place. Like WTF. Why would this EVER be a sane idea?

21

I don't know if it should be a bad thing. Inside the tar archive the configs were already organized into their respective dirctories, this way with --preserve-permissions --overwrite I could just quickly add the desired versions of configs.
Some examples of contents:

-rw-r--r-- root/root      2201 2026-02-18 08:08 etc/pam.d/sshd
-rw-r--r-- root/root       399 2026-02-17 23:22 etc/pam.d/sudo
-rw-r--r-- root/root      2208 2026-02-18 09:13 etc/sysctl.conf
drwx------ user/user         0 2026-02-17 23:28 home/user/.ssh/
-rw------- user/user       205 2026-02-17 23:29 home/user/.ssh/authorized_keys
drwxrwxr-x user/user         0 2026-02-18 16:30 home/user/.vnc/
-rw-rw-r-- user/user        85 2026-02-18 15:32 home/user/.vnc/tigervnc.conf
-rw-r--r-- root/root      3553 2026-02-18 08:04 etc/ssh/sshd_config

Keeps permissions, keeps ownership, puts things where they belong (or copies from where they were), and you end up with a single file that can be stored on whatever filesystem.

12

I assumed something like this. That's a perfectly valid usecase for a tar extracted to /.

But I love it how people always jump to the assumption that the one on the other end is the stupid one

9
SkaveRatreply
discuss.tchncs.de

that was my reaction when I saw a coworker put random files and directories into / of a server

I feel like some people don't have a feeling about how a file system works

11
reddthat.com

Its a pretty common Windows server practice to just throw random shit on the root directory of the server. I'm guilty of this at times when there isn't a better option available to me, but I at least use a dedicated directory at the root for dumping random crap and organize the files within that directory (and delete unneeded files when done) so that it doesn't create more work later.

2
feddit.org

I mean, there is a home directory for the root-user, that you could use for these things.

2

Root's home directory only works if you're sshing in as root (not a great practice, although its certainly not as bad as on Windows thanks to key auth. You can simply revoke the keys of the admin you just let go rather than resetting a bunch of passwords). The reason its common practice in Windows Server administration is a combination of common practices: having dedicated admin accounts in AD for each administrator, Windows lacking a decent directory for content shared between users, and of course the general laziness that Windows administration attracts and fosters.

2

That makes sense if there is more than one user for a server (i.e. work environment). I would not care if it was on my home lab server, except that the root folder is deleted and remade on each boot.

1

Maybe they do and don't fear the HFS? I mean do you use the HFS in a docker container?

1

Be happy that you didn't remeber the ~ and put a space between it and etc😃.

16

The only backups i have are /etc/nixos/configuration.nix and ~ the rest and die in a fire

9
filipreply
sopuli.xyz

This is also dangerous because you could run the second command by accident later when browsing command history

1
Vintorreply
retrolemmy.com

I accidentally untarred archive intended to be extracted in root directory

19

life hack: alsways make a new directory to extract something in. that way you dont have to rm a bunch of random files, and maybe sone dotfiles you'll never notice or know where they came from

2

I am new to Linux and just getting somewhat comfortable as my daily driver, very proud of myself that I got the joke pretty quickly :)

12

I fucking hate using rm for these very reasons.

There's another program called "trash-cli" that gives you a trash command instead of going straight to deletion.

I'm not sure why more distros don't include it by default, or why more tutorials don't mention it.

10
wabassoreply
lemmy.ca

Ok speaking of this, where do a distro’s config and boot scripts even come from? Are they in a package? Like on Debian so the .debs have metadata that can add cron jobs and such?

6
fedia.io

I've always just used gio trash (formerly gvfs-trash). KDE-based systems have something similar (but with syntax that's perfectly logical but completely unsuitable, in my opinion).

The third party trash package works in places the GUI and the aforementioned GUI-related command line tools may not. I can't tell whether this is a bug in trash or in the system tools, TBH.

For example, /tmp is one such directory where trash works but gio trash refuses.

Either way, the GUI Rubbish Bin won't keep track if things are deleted from such places by trash.

2

The third party trash package works in places the GUI and the aforementioned GUI-related command line tools may not. I can't tell whether this is a bug in trash or in the system tools, TBH.

Might be a bug I've never experience this issue with the trash-cli tools.

1

Yeah, same thing like with unclosed bottles, cup too close to the table edge, etc.: Accidents that can hapen, will happen.
Better name them something else in your user dir.

And yes, painful experience.

9

Reminds me of when I had a rogue ~ directory sitting in my own home directory (probably from a badly written script). Three seconds into rm -rf ~ and me wondering why it was taking so long to complete, I CTRL+C, reboot, and pray.

Alas, it was a reinstall for me that day (good excuse to distro hop, anyway). Really glad I don't mount my personal NAS folder in my home directory anymore, holy shit.

9
lemmy.world

Thats nothing, on 2 separate occasions i mistyped the parameters for dd and erased my entire hard drive lol.

8

Last week I started a utility to check if the sectors of a usb drive were damaged. I did not read the big red banner saying that it does so by writing to every sector...

12

I am still triple checking when I see /dev/sda as a target drive in such utilities. I use NVMe, so nowadays that's probably a flash drive for me, but it still gives me adrenaline when I notice it.

4

I usually start typing with # before the command, so that even if i accidently hit enter, it won't run. After verifying the command enough times, i removes the # and run the command(take command from history if i hit enter)

1

I think it could use more guard rails. Like if you are flashing a 4gb image to a 256 gb partition. a confirmation dialog?

1

Ohohoho man did you ever fuck up. I did that once too. I can't remember how I fixed it. I think I had to reinstall the whole OS

7

This is why I use an atomic distro

Much harder to break important things, but little things all come pre-broken.

6
lemmy.ml

Welcome to the "I have shot myself in the foot with rm" club! Take a seat anywhere!

(Mine was trying to delete the old System 9 "System Folder" by typing rm -rf System\ Folder, but instead hitting the return key when it came time to hit the \, thereby starting a deletion of the running macOS 10 operating system inside the "System" folder. It got through the c's in the second and a half or so before my frantic control-C attempts halted it. Amazingly, OS X would still boot, but no longer run Carbon apps, necessitating a complete OS reinstall, lol.)

6

I try to always put the -rf at the end for this reason. Not sure what works on Mac but it does allow it on most Linux shells

3

Rest in peace my granny,she got hit by a bazooka

(got no clue why, but really FEELS like an appropirate reaction to have, I salute to you and your pain sir!)

4
lemmy.world

Make an alias in .bashrc (or equivalent) so that rm always have the -i flag to prompt for “you really wanna do it !?”.

4
sik0fewlreply
piefed.ca

That just trained me to automatically add -f to avoid the prompts.

4

You use btrfs, right? Right???

Tried the terminal emulator for the first time today, but I kinda can not get used to the fact, that I cannot move it around :(

3
lemmy.world

Why is the cursor still on the same line as the prompt?

3
x00zreply
lemmy.world

I think he pressed up after having run that command to see what he wrote wrong.

6

Unlikely, as the v flag would leave a list of all deleted files before the active prompt.

Edit: I get it now. The ls was executed after deletion

4
feddit.online

I've literally done rm -rf / while root. I thought I was elsewhere and did rm -rf . and I was in the top level directory. When it took way longer than I expected, I hit CTRL+C about 10 times and looked at the damage. Oops.

Luckily it didn't get to /home, but it did wipe out /bin and /etc. I had to rebuild the OS. I learned.

3

Half a year ago I accidentally git cloned to a folder named ~, so naturally I did rm -rf ~.

Mistakes were made. Fortunately I backup my ~ so it was just annoying.

5

If I'm about to run an rm with a slash in it, alarm bells go off in my head. I prefer to cd to the parent and then rm whatever without slashes in the name.

That didn't save me the other day when I accidentally put a space before an asterisk, but thankfully that wasn't in a place that was overly important.

Gotta retrain myself to look out for extra nothing now.

3

I chowned root recursively once to root:root caught it half way when errors started popping up about stuff that was denied. Was trying to do ./ but missed the .

2

When I make a mistake like this, and have to do some important cleanup I'll sometimes jump into mc

1