'Andrew Tate phenomena' surges in schools - with boys refusing to talk to female teacher
Summary
Social media influencers are fuelling a rise in misogyny and sexism in the UK's classrooms, according to teachers.
More than 5,800 teachers were polled... and nearly three in five (59%) said they believe social media use has contributed to a deterioration in pupils' behaviour.
One teacher said she'd had 10-year-old boys "refuse to speak to [her]...because [she is] a woman". Another said "the Andrew Tate phenomena had a huge impact on how [pupils] interacted with females and males they did not see as 'masculine'".
"There is an urgent need for concerted action... to safeguard all children and young people from the dangerous influence of far-right populists and extremists."
https://news.sky.com/story/andrew-tate-phenomena-surges-in-schools-with-boys-refusing-to-talk-to-female-teacher-13351203Open linkView original on lemmy.world1201
Comments480
Every teacher I hear from (US) these days basically says the newest generation coming up is completely screwed. Unreal levels of behavioral issues that are not being addressed at home. Complete lack of engagement with the lesson plan, unfinished assignments all over. They need to curve grades left and right just to get the majority of the class to pass. The parents are more emboldened than ever to make the teachers' lives hell over things they know nothing about and refuse to take responsibility for.
It's easy to brush it off as the standard generational nose-thumbing...but this seems different. Something is really breaking down and I think social media is at the center of it.
It’s a shame teachers are pressured to “curve grade” rather than just flunk these people and hold them back a grade.
Even when I went to elementary school over 15 years ago in Canada, kids weren't allowed to be held back without written permission from their parents. I thought it was really fucking weird because we literally had a kid whose mom did all of his homework (everyone knew; he had horrible writing and she didn't) and yet refused to put him in a remedial class or have him repeat a year.
I can't help but wonder what Dad's take on this situation was.
That assumes there was one (dad, or take from the dad).
I knew a kid like that in school, who's mother did all his homework and projects for him, he couldn't even spell "phone". He was a rich kid who would miss half the school year going on family trips, never took the SAT's, never went to university. He's now an executive at JP Morgan (wish I was joking.)
Schools now lose funding when kids don't pass, so admins press teachers to move them along.
All Kids Left Behind
All Kids Shuffled Off To Become Someone Else's Problem
This is true for nearly every state, from deep red to deep blue. It is not a party issue but a stupid policy that intended for teachers and faculty to work harder to teach students.
It's from a federal law passed under the Bush administration, tying funding to standardized testing scores.
But it was bipartisan, so you're not wrong.
Murica'
"When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodhart%27s_law
Or, if you prefer a clip from The Wire, juking the stats.
Many if not all school districts in the States have their funding tied to their performance, so there is a negative incentive to make grades look good. My elementary school tried to place me in their Special Ed program because my grades would have brought the average up there.
Plus, holding back 60, 70, 80% of an entire class just isn't logistically feasible in most cases.
Neither is passing a kid who doesn’t understand the material.
It is when that kid becomes someone else's problem to deal with.
Its so absurd.
I went to a rural title one highschool. I took general level classes and had honors/high honors at least half of my semesters.
Half way through my senior year, I moved. It sucked balls. My new school, was small, literally the smallest school in my state. Graduation class size was 54 students. It was outside the Capital city, and affluent. Everyone was a "prep" had money, some drove very fancy cars to school ect.
The new school didnt offer Gen level classes, only college and AP. I was upset at that because those classes were known to me to be super difficult at my old rural school. At that time I just wanted to smoke pot with my friends tbh. But .. I took the classes.
Y'all. This little rich prep school's College course classes were easier than my Title one school Gen Ed. I couldn't believe it. This was 2006, and I know now, they did that to keep the funding going. All the little rich kids had parents who could afford to send them all to college, and they needed to look good for thier hard-to-get-into universities.
It still frustrates me the world is like this.
I believe it. I think the much older push against standardized tests was so that "fancy" schools could pump up their grades. I never understood the newer push against standardized tests, you want them exactly so schools can't pump up their grades. Standardized tests create an actual level playing field.
The recent push came from Covid when many people could not take the tests, and then it stuck around after since administrators wanted to focus on your “well-roundedness” and not high test scores.
The newer push was years before covid.
I feel like you could apply this to almost every societal crisis we’re facing. It’s like social media took every little crack in the foundation and turned it into a chasm.
Parents in Facebook echo chambers trying to discover who to blame for their child’s shitty behaviour then getting into arguments when they are told to perhaps get off their phone and speak to their child.
Children in Facebook echo chambers where they make their neurodivergence their entire personality while simultaneously excusing any and all behaviour due to it.
If both groups spoke to each other a lot could be changed.
It is different, because never in human history has it been easier to influence people. We are literally addicted, as in the brain is literally addicted, to our little disinformation device, the output of which is largely controlled by malicious powerful entities. Now add impressionable young brains to the mix.
It is a pretty terrible scenario with no obvious solution.
I retired from the job 5 years ago. Your description rings true from my experience then (and was a big part of me retiring), and the colleagues I've stayed in touch with say it's very noticeably worse now. I'm glad I got out when I did.
From your experience, why do you think that is? Mostly social media? If so, what about it? Bad parenting? The whole Covid remote stuff? Is it economically driven? Are the schools doing anything differently that could cause it?
I would love to pin it on one thing, like social media. While I felt, feel, like that was a big variable in the downfall, I can't underestimate the loss of the "American Dream". I felt like phones should be banned. But some teachers felt like phones could be integrated into the curriculum. I could see both points, but honestly I just felt like society had passed me by. One of my master teachers, when I had been student teaching 25 years previously, said it was time to go when the students no longer entertained you. I felt like that was about right. I don't think knowledge at your fingertips is a reason not to actually learn stuff.
Thanks for sharing that. Like any job, when it's no longer fun, it's time for a change.
Covid really fucked them in not getting normal socialization at school and put a lot of kids behind by a couple of years accedemically. Right now 4/5th grade and up are really screwed. Plus parents just aren't engaged.
I’d at least consider parents aren’t engaged due to time and energy, cause of pressures at work.
Also, when I was at school there were teachers that put extra time and effort in with kids that were top of the class and bottom of the class. Bet it wouldn’t be like that now cause everyone is so rundown.
The curriculum has changed so much and policies require that kids with learning disabilities can have an IEP (Individualized Education Program) and teachers have to come up with alternative learning for multiple kids, leaving them with little time to do anything else. On top of that, experienced teachers have stated that behavior has taken a sharp decline. They no longer separate the problem kids from the rest of the class because studies have shown that their outcomes are better if they remain in normal classes. However, this forces teachers to deal with constant disruptions which causes negative effects on the other students.
Please don't throw mud at IEPs. I grew up in the 70s when all the "retarded" kids were lumped in together regardless of issue, and now have a son who can only attend public school due to having an IEP and specialized support.
If more money needs to be spent to help teachers (including getting more of them or more help for those who there are) I'm all for it, but this sounds a little current-POTUS-ish.
Throw into that mix all the parents who think home schooling is best. Sure, for a select few it's going to be better, but the majority are going to struggle in later life.
What usually happens is a parent gets reported to social services for child abuse. Then they go to facebook ranting about how bad the school is and that they're being targeted. Then they pull their kids out of school to "homeschool" so they can continue to abuse their kids.
Don't worry, they will be bullied throughout their life. Missing a couple years of bullying won't hurt.
I am, not great at parenting, I've made hella mistakes. I've only one son and do my best.
The number of teachers/therapists (my son works a few programs for his needs) that have been floored by my willingness to parent and hold my son accountable for his actions, is far too high.
While I'll take the compliment being "a breath of fresh air" (an actual compliment from a therapist) it bothers me more parents cant take thier own faults to accountability nor hold their children to any standard of conduct really saddens me. I shouldn't be a wildflower in a field of dirt, it should be a field of flowers damn. A silly metaphor but you get my point hopefully.
It sounds like you are
The problem with you being the rare parent to hold their child accountable is that your kid is just going to see it as you being unfair to them. Their peers are going to laugh at them.
A lot of their peers legitimately don't need to worry about being a responsible adult. They will inherit enough wealth to never have to work a day in their life.
I don't know what you're talking about. "Their peers are going to laugh at them"? "Unfair"?
These are your excuses to not teach accountability? Not only are you wrong in that these are not my child's viewpoints or reality, you sound pretty young yourself. All of his peers need to worry about being a responsible adults, regardless of future incomes.
I don't care what the other children are doing, I only care what my child is doing.
Would you jump off a bridge (to your death) if all your friends were? Thats fair right? Lol
Thanks for the laugh
Calm down. I never excused anything.
I just said what would happen to highlight what a difficult task it is.
Those kids are the next generations parents. What are their kids going to be like?
Luckily, they probably won't have any.
Wage slaves who pay rent to landlords
It's mass narcissism and it's going to destroy our society.
If I don't see signs of change soon, I'm getting tf out of here.
The problem is consumerism.
Narcissism is just a symptom of our insecurity.
Based on who America voted for president I don't feel very surprised about the issues and behavior of parents.
I would be surprised if this were the case in every state though.
lol, and here's me thinking I'll get to finally loosen these bootstraps one day. Wouldn't be Millennial difficulty if something nice happened for once, so why should I expect reprieve in retirement age? Probably just be anxious af anyway because not being abused by another generation seems too good to be true.
No joke. We went from getting yelled at by old people for problems they caused, to being called old and getting shoved aside by the generation ahead of us, really freaking fast.
I feel like we've already been forgotten after we were robbed of opportunity and respect at every turn.
I try to focus my energy towards the good ones. There's still good people out there. I've met many kids that would put the majority of adults to shame with their level of intelligence, maturity, and respect. The odds are so against them though.
Nooo, kids were like that form the ancient times /s.
Not just the US. One of our school districts can't fail anyone and your final grade is determined by the work you hand in.
I'll broaden it to not just social media, but the totality of endless scrolling social media, plus endless access to narcissist "influencers", plus addicting video games (inspired by gambling patterns), plus must watch addicting TV shows and movies on demand. A lot of this is endless dopamine machine. Add in both parents working and only children with no siblings is less socialization.
Seems like teachers and schools aren't properly equipped for modern kids.
More like modern kids aren't equipped to deal with reality.
Social media is definitely a big thing, even if it’s not the only thing.
I believe it has two parts. The technology can personalize content and optimize for engagement, so it’s more addicting than traditional media could ever be.
And the jackasses making content have no accountability or editorial standards whatsoever. They churn out whatever clicks and they’re willing to lie, incite, and gaslight their way through it.
Combine the low content standards with the high addiction factor and you have a ticking time bomb. Or maybe it already went off and we’re just looking around at the crater left behind.
Welcome to post-scarcity.
Honestly, I wish I realized it more as a kid. There's not really a reason to pay attention to shit we don't care about because there's some autist out there who is going to enjoy doing it and do it better. We can just apply their solutions and move on with our lives. It's not like they will even care. They're too busy doing other things.
Bless the next generation for fighting back against our tunnel vision.
Probably going to get slated for this but surely at some point we need to accept our being all nice and friendly all the time just doesn't work.
Like if kids are this bad send them off to military school for a month till they shape up. Happens again 6 months, then 12. Government mandated, parents don't like it, they can look after their kids better.
People are absolute shits and don't give a fuck about others or their future. No amount of "please pay attention or you won't understand algebra and won't get a good job" will do anything, you will just get "Why do i need to learn algebra! I'll never use that. John just told me to shut up, what am I meant to do? Just let him disrespect me like that. You should be talking to John!"
Fuck them. Make them do press ups in the rain see if they learn to shut up then.
I actually agree with you. There used to be real consequences for bad behavior and being lazy, and now you get told that it's not really your fault. Zero concept of personal responsibility. Now society is an epidemic of mass narcissism and selfishness. It clearly isn't sustainable. There are going to be severe consequences for our quality of life in the future, and that's assuming society even survives this epidemic at all.
How many Gomer Pyles will that produce?
Maybe less than all the murderers we have now. Being straightened out by the military is a well known phenomenon. We can't keep doing the same things when trends are showing they aren't working, then expect them to work better. Something needs to be changed.
So this teacher had nothing bad to say about the teaching or the education system? It's just bad kids and their bad parents, right? How convenient for teachers.
In reality these schools are indoctrination camps on the school-to-prison pipeline. We live in a fascist society that's literally destroying the planet. Schools are a fundamental part of this process.
TBH kids shouldn't listen to their teachers and schools. That's what got us here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_religion
Those damn machines, impacting the youth!
Those damn newspapers, impacting the youth!
Those damn radios, impacting the youth!
Those damn TVs, impacting the youth!
Those damn internet connected computers, impacting the youth!
Those damn smartphones, impacting the youth!
Those damn AI models, impacting the youth!
Our youth now love luxury, they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders, and they love to chatter instead of exercise. Children are now tyrants not servants of their household. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.
Thousands of years of this stuff.
I’m probably just another old idiot who can’t see things for what they really are, but social media does scare the hell out of me. It’s hard to imagine it being a good thing when personalities are shaped by algorithms that exist entirely to drive engagement so a company makes a buck.
It isn’t just rich chocolaty ovaltine. The kid isn’t being brainwashed to drink a sugary drink from time to time. The kid is a constant revenue stream.
I feel like literally every generation for the last 1000+ years probably had a similar sentiment
You'd be off by 1500 years, that was Socrates.
Considering 2500 years ago is more than 1000 years ago, I'll assume you mean 500 years in the future.
(Also if that's an actual Socrates quote that's hilarious)
That was Socrates circa 500-ish BC, 2500 years ago or so.
Uh...
We really have reached a whole new level of impression.
its all about who controls that stuff
In my opinion the huge difference between this generation and all previous ones is that content is no longer vetted by anyone. It used to be that to put something in front of kids it had to approved by some sane adult. If a TV station marketed to children something that most parents would not approve they would face protests or maybe even legal action. On social media any asshole can post literally anything and millions of kids will consume it without any supervision.
Most media is liberal though. Liberalism is a (right-wing) hegemonic ideology. CNN, Fox, NYTimes, NYPost, NPR... All liberal.
Not so much for leftism though. It's "strange" how the right-wing conflates the two.
https://helpfulprofessor.com/leftist-vs-liberal/
Fox news liberal... lmfao
Tankies are permanently stuck in backwards day. Left is right and right is left. They do this because they're just fascists that don't like to be associated with other fascists. So they call their fascist group "leftist", but they hate democracy, liberalism, the jews, etc just as much as any other fascist.
You know you're actually right on the money, and it's a little startling that it never occurred to me before. Shit.
Yep, that's why the only way to be a good parent nowadays is to not give your kids smart phones or computers of their own. There was a time when it was kinda ok for them to have those devices, but that time is permanently in the past.
Closeted queer kids with bigoted parents need online safe spaces.
I mostly disagree with that. Cocooning up into a terminally online person makes one's life worse, not better.
Straight up abusive parents are another thing of course. But even then those kids need sheltering, not the internet.
I think you underestimate the sheer number of homophobic parents that aren't necessarily abusive but would be if their kid ever came out. There are a lot of people I've talked to that their online escape was the one thing that kept from killing themselves.
I'm not saying that it's healthy but there are a lot of kids in a situation that they can not escape from because of the way that society treats children. Children are treated as something that is closer to property than an individual when it comes to things like law enforcement and emotional abuse.
Homophobia is abusive. Regardless of the intentions. Ignorance of that fact doesn't excuse it.
I agree. Try arguing that to a conservative judge in the south and you will simply be sent home with your abusive parent, who is likely enraged about having to defend themselves from the "law".
Yeah, absolutely. Having been in a marriage with an abusive person, there is zero reasoning with them once they're in that state.
I think muad'dib is just projecting and maybe you are, too.
Using the internet to avoid dealing with problems in real life is an unhealthy crutch.
unfortuatly the healthy way to deal with a situation like that is to remove yourself from it which children are not allowed to do.
So is pretending the internet is not part of "real life" like it's 1998.
This is a very dangerous line of reasoning that will play right into the hands of fascists.,
And, part of the reason for that is section 230 of the Communications Decency Act of 1996.
If a TV station or radio station has a call-in show and the caller swears, it's the station that gets fined. If the station runs a late night informercial where someone is defamed, the station is liable. But, do it online and you're fine. The YouTube algorithm can pick out the juiciest, most controversial, most slanderous content and shove it into everyone's recommendations and only the person who posted that content is responsible.
Section 230 makes sense in some situations. If you're running a bulletin board without any kind of algorithm promoting posts, then it makes sense that you shouldn't be held accountable for what someone says in that bulletin board. But, YouTube, Twitch, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, etc. have all taken it too far. They don't personally create the content, but they have algorithms that analyze the content and decide who to show it to. They get the protections of a bulletin board, while curating the content to make it even more engaging than a segment on Newsmax or MSNBC.
I love how you got a ton of upvotes by vaguely gesturing at the past.
When was this time you speak of?
What has changed is the social fabric of society has been ripped up.
Back when media for kids consisted mainly of broadcast TV shows and books. It's not some mythical past; it's my childhood.
..and that centralized system of culture disemination played a major hand in creating the crisises we are in now.
Ah yes, the Sesame Street to MAGA pipeline.
Have you ever had a creepy guy who hangs around the school desperately trying to impress little kids? Yeah he's the online version.
Or he's your friend's weird, 28 year old brother, whose room is only lit with black lights, and UV reactive posters, has no job, smokes weed all day, and trips all the time, who tells you Mayans invented cell phones.
Some of that's okay.
I mean, he's having an easier time getting laid than most of the people criticizing him on these forums so...
Who do you think adolescent boys are going to listen to more?
That's a bit of projection. Especially when a lot of people shit talking him on these forums are very likely in polycules...
I don't think it is social media. It is much more simple: people can't spend time with each other. Employers keep reducing the wages, while maintaining or increasing the amount of work their employees have to do. This means that workers can't invest time into friends or family, which in turn deprives children of healthy role models.
Jackasses like Tate get to influence the children, because there is a void that has been left empty - Tate has enough wealth and time to fill in for society. Work culture is a ravenous beast, forever chasing workers. If you pause, you lose everything. So you might as well sacrifice the time you could spend with family, since you would lose them anyway if you shirk being a breadwinner.
Optimization for the sake of line going up, inevitably destroys everything that surrounds the pillar that society is forced to worship.
I would also include the death of the “third place”. Because even if you work enough to survive, where do you spend your time outside of the home with other people in your community without spending money? Even worse options if you want kids allowed.
One of the only places I know of is the library. But I’d be very surprised by an 8-10 year old boy spending their time at the library.
I'd like to amend this to say that there is void that support "boys". There's a lot of encouragement for the development of girls into STEM, into sports, into everything else but there's no encouragement for boys. Boys are left to fend for themselves and if they don't get the right support and encouragement at home, they end up ripe for influencers like Tate.
A lot of them spend their free time in their bedrooms, gaming. Their only friends are online gamers that are in other parts of the world. They have no actual physical interaction.
I've even seen posts where young men in their 20s are finally making enough money that they can finally visit online friends that they've known for years, often describing them as "best friends."
It’s interesting my friends kid is 13. A couple of years ago they were able to take a trip across country to visit their online friends that they spend all their time with in games. Those kids are all girls. This life style truly isn’t exclusive to one gender. The father works a 9-5 and the mother is a stay at home mom with some side hustles for extra cash. Their kid seems to be kind but who knows what she is really getting into online. This world is like a caricature of itself.
I'm glad that people can't hide behind a face anymore. In the old times, and this still happens in some places, people will get away with abuse because they're good at using their faces to manipulate people. Preachers, community leaders. They used body language to win people's trust and gain positions of power to abuse people, especially children.
On the internet, people have to be more honest. Video chat is unpopular, so most people are only using words to communicate. Sometimes voice. You're looking straight at someone's soul with less distraction from the physical plane. It's safer.
I wouldn't trust a guy who I've only ever met in the flesh. Ugh, creepy.
I... don't think that's how it works lol.
Why don't you look at all Bachelor Degrees for White Males (seems to be biggest followers of misogynist influencers)
2012-2021 (excluding COVID years as edge cases) :
https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d24/tables/dt24_322.20.asp
6% drop in bachelor degrees for white males vs 1% drop for white women (aligning the races makes it more of an apple to apple comparison)
My point is that stupid, discouraged boys are easily influenced by right-wing misogynists. You want fix this, fix the next generation before it's too late.
Go ahead, you keep enjoying have shitheads running around and keep lamenting how there's nothing to do.
I would argue that those factors aren't a direct cause, but the isolation leaves them vulnerable to things like this. The internet used to be wide open and your semi-random traversal of independent sites would still expose you to a diverse array of people and content.
The pursuit of profit led to massive, accessible, engagement driven social media platforms. Optimization for ad views meant segmenting demographics and serving them distilled content. The hyper specific content led to these demographics living in echo chambers based on their flavor of polarizing content.
The Tate-sphere is built around exploiting that isolation and selling bogus solutions. There's no specific reason the algorithm funnels into it other than it's catches a broad user base on a charged topic => $$$. The algorithm could just as easily push young men into fighting for socially beneficial causes, but anger is a strong emotion that gives the most money.
It's not either or. It could be both. In rhis case, most of these reasons can be traced back to the perversion of capitalism.
Let's not pretend like these children aren't having this behavior reinforced by their parents.
The internet has made it quite easy for kids to develop an "inner life" that their parents have little to no awareness of, regardless of how attentive they are, though it's obviously worse if they are not.
Guess what, it's your job as a parent to keep your kids off the Internet then.
I developed an inner life, it was the only peace I could find from the daily assault that was my outer life. Sure in the past it was more visible habits like reading a book, but letting kids have some autonomy over their lives is important I feel
You're totally right. Without that inner life we'd just be forced into being exactly like our parents because we wouldn't grow as individuals.
I think the problem is when, hypothetically, that inner life that finds you first is a profit-driven hate-brewing death cult brought to you by an algorithm. Then these people "totally get you" and gives you a "community."
I miss when those unsupervised inner life communities were mostly around hobbies or games or whatever to escape life drudgery and make real friends. MySpace wasn't about viral brainwashing campaigns, YouTube was mostly creation for fun's sake, and even with online games and such, we all knew there was a separation between "the Internet" and "Real Life(TM)".
Everybody knew not to take the Internet seriously, because it was a place you went to escape everything else. Nothing really mattered on the internet.
I think now people don't really see a separation. The Internet is real life, in the worst way.
Now so much of it is a minefield of recruitment and manipulation to enlist in culture wars for clicks. There's labels and lifestyles that act as "funnels" and "pipelines" to increasingly toxic extreme identities that find "belonging" in being captive mindslaves and profit-cattle to any number of "influencers."
Completely agree. The people I found online in those early days were just random people without any motive or incentive to sell me on an ideology. There was a trust back then, because opinions weren't really worth anything and no one could access your wallet.
Finding that some community now is a total minefield for users, young or old. So much of the internet has been gamified for a profit/scam at any cost.
I wish that kids could just connect with other random kids across the world like I did, but I think those days are likely done.
That’s it. From what I hear (in Germany) is that the number of students with problematic behavior has increased, yes. That is something teachers can handle, if the parents cooperate or at the very least not interfere.
Unfortunately the number of problematic parents has sharply risen as well. More seem to be taking a page out of the Trump playbook of never admitting anything and going on the offensive instead. They can become quite aggressive and belligerent when their kid faces consequences for their actions, especially if misogyny was involved.
It’s impossible to help these students, if they act out behavior they see at home or, often enough, from their divorced fathers, and are encouraged for it.
Behavioral issues start at home.
Because the kids are digesting the content at home?
Not necessarily, but in my experience with my friends' kids, the ones that are the most maladjusted are the ones with their faces buried in their phones all the time, and these are the same kids that were raised on iPads and YouTube all day. It's one thing to have an hour or two of screen time in a day, but the parents that don't limit it have the kids with the most behavioral problems.
Where did the parents get it? Why did they get it? Why don't they know better?
I'm not being cheeky. I want to know real answers to that shit.
Since i have a kid with autism i notice how little other people with regular kids invest in them. When the kid starts to walk and talk at the age of two, they basically expect of them to act as adults, and I'm not exaggerating. After that kids get a minimal amount of time that parents address to them. Kids are given a phone too keep them not asking for parents attention, which is formative for their social and emotional skills. You don't learn that from other kids or Jake Paul. So it's a combination of shitty parenting and extremely toxic place where people spent hours every day. If you are a developing person it will fuck you up.
As a Millennial that had young parents I was always dumbfounded by my peers’ boomer parents. It’s like they just went to work and treated their kids like an afterthought, and they were too stuck in their greedy consumer mindset and didn’t have a clue about what we consider today the most basic of tech.
It’s not hard for me to imagine that my generation went on to raise kids poorly. I don’t have children myself but I’ve seen plenty of people my age raising them.
We're raising kids now who raise themselves
You paint a picture I'm familiar with, but didn't experience firsthand. You were my friends and acquaintances I grew up with.
I'm late Gen X/Millennial cusp. The oldest of three siblings, both of whom are squarely Millenials. I got computers, but I also enjoyed formative years without them. My parents are boomers, and were not perfect, but I feel like I got the right stuff from them.
I don't have kids. In the 90s when I was a teenager, I saw the writing on the wall and decided never to have children.
Let's not pretend that this is real news instead of phony clickbait from Sky effing News.
When I was a kid in the 80s & 90s that's when the parents get brought in.
He should meet a Luigi.
When I worked in a middle school a couple years back, I heard the Tate shit there. Had a student who would name their Kahoot something like “[female students name] has a nice ass” and administration would refuse to allow me to impose consequences.
If you are around teen boys, please talk to them about Tate. He’s not someone who should be walking free, and he’s not someone children should be listening to.
Gotta remember... This is sky news. Probably fake. Especially since the "survey" doesn't even match the headline.
Wow it seems like everyone here is completely credulous and happy to have their bias confirmed.
When I was 10, or 13 there were literally no issues like this at all. Well, I didn't even think about girls that much at that age, let alone in overly sexual way, lol.
What the actual fuck is happening with society recently? Is everybody going insane because of social media?
Well the solution to that one 10 year old is pretty clear. Actions have consequences, if he wants to be a little shit he can repeat the grade next year after hard failing this one.
Andrew Tate should just put on the Taliban turban and be done with this charade. His entire schtick is Sharia for Americans.
Yall didn’t see this coming with the red pill derived slang that kids have been using? They’re obsessed with their value. It’s terrifying and capitalism loves it.
I'm clueless, what slang are we talking about here, I doubt I'd know it if I heard it.
I don't know much more than you, but they said it right in the comment. "They are obsessed with their value" Such as, "High value man" "low value man" ect
I do know my 14 year old nephew is obsessed with making money in ways I never saw in my youth cohort
Nothing is more toxic than obsessing over money and status. Literally will poison your soul and ruin your life.
Welcome to capitalism baby!
Capitalism is an inadequate reason for all this, because we had decades of capitalism without this level of shit and toxicity.
"How did we get here from there?" One step at a time.
Not all consequences are immediate.
I'd argue it's not the inevitable outcome of capitalism. The grifters are connecting and feeding off each other like never before though. Trump/Tate/Farage/Rogan/Jones/Brand/Peterson/Shapiro are a few that spring to mind. They're probably not sitting round planning stuff (well Shapiro probably is in the dorkiest way possible) but they amplify each other, vouch for each other etc etc.
They're parasites with no moral compunction, they spot a glitch where they can get support, money and power and exploit the shit out of it with no regard to the consequences.
To my mind they harken back to the bullies of the 90s (and I'm sure before) and appeal to that mindset, wokeness bothers them because it represents progress that patches the glitch. I could ramble for hours but I've no solution, I wish someone did.
Consumerism. Consumerism is the problem.
We have sold out.
It'll get you laid!
I don't really see this as something new. None of it really. There have always been backward ass people. They have always called other kids losers and ostracized them. There has always been a classroom full of kids dragging everyone around them down. School never solved these problems so how am I supposed to react when I hear it's getting worse?
Rizz, alpha/beta/sigma, mid, simp. A lot of importance placed on your value, your masculinity and a lot of overlap between gaming and red pill content.
You got kids mewing trying to get their jawlines looking nice. Little girls obsessed with makeup and skincare. It’s wild and people think it’s all innocent. It’s not. It’s early indoctrination.
It's honestly wild to me that people in my age bracket can grow up with heroin chic, and think it somehow just vanished into the ether. I don't know why it's so hard for them to understand that kids are just getting hit with an evolved form of the same bullshit message that you're worthless if you don't fit a specific aesthetic.
How does heroine chic relate? I may have been too young to remember anything besides the look
It was just the "goal" aesthetic I was trying to meet as a young woman. So many of my classmates developed an eating disorder or just started using drugs because the "strung out supermodel" look was what everybody wanted.
Its just a precursor carrying the same message kids are gettimg today. That you're worthless if you don't look the right way, and you should hurt yourself to look the right way.
Ah I see. Yeah the more insecure you are the more money they can make from you. Especially the more unattainable the ideal is.
Thanks! I feel the only new things here are simp and rizz if I'm honest. Simp seems to have gone the way of woke in that it's lost most of its meaning, but when I see it used on YouTube it's sinister AF. Tbh I've noticed this a lot on YouTube of late, high degree of racist and misogynistic comments in videos that feature a woman doing something "incorrectly" or if something criminal happens and it's not readily apparent what the race of the perp is.
You and I are getting the same algorithm cuz I’ve seen the same stuff on insta. I had to deleted it finally. Couldn’t tolerate the intolerance and stupidity. Just a circkejerk of losers.
It's from the Matrix, maybe you've seen it. For those who haven't here it is without giving any major spoilers: at one point one of the main characters tells the protagonist that if he wants to learn the truth he could take a red pill that he offers to him, but if he wants to remain oblivious and continue to live normally he should take a blue pill. They're using this analogy to describe how the media peddles as normal what they consider wrong values and ideas like lgbtq tolerance, feminism and so on.
Needless to say, Tate is a big fan of that movie. So much so that he named his "course" the Matrix Academy. One of my former classmates actually paid for that nonsense. It was just a discord server and the lectures were useless. All the information there could be found for free on the internet by just doing a Google search or watching a few videos on Youtube.
I'm aware of red pill/redpilling - it's the specific slang I'm curious about. My knowledge/experience with Tate is primarily through the news and a few profiles by the likes of Robert Evans, which basically means I'm coming in with the negative viewpoint and no real experience of his content.
Without knowing the slang it likely passes me by as "well that's how the kids talk these days" so I'm likely missing significant dog whistles all the time. I like to be aware - allows me to be vigilant and keep a check on myself.
Stories like this are what I think of every time the topic of regulating social media comes up.
We know it's programmed to create rage machines. We do, and then people act surprised when social media works as designed.
I truly thought that this Tate guy was a complete character like Borat. I'm floored realizing this is a real "person"? How does anyone care about helping this guy. Oh wait.
Parents need to raise their children and stop letting social media do it.
The problem is he's a symptom of broader socialtal issues. Someone else will just rise to fill his place unless we work to address what caused him prominence.
It's okay to treat symptoms of an issue whilst simultaneously treating the cause of the issue.
Fantastic point. Though, we're not doing either really, are we? We're kind of just letting the issues fester and pointing fingers at each other.
I should do more to help...
Would make me happy for a week or so anyway
There already are countless others, Tate is just one of the most prominent. Because of all his crimes.
Luigi all the Andrew Tates of the world, then. Nothing of value would be lost.
(I'd say it should be done through the legal system, but I live in the US, and laws are apparently only for attacking minorities and enemies of the regime now.)
Banning hard drugs doesn't solve the underlying problem, but it makes them less widely available, which is a good thing. Ban him.
Does it? Or does it just make hard drugs more dangerous and drive up multiple related crimes (burglary, shop lifting, mugging, cocoing, county lines etc) and stigmatise people with addiction issues stopping them from being able to seek help?
I believe it does. It's really hard for children to buy hard drugs.
It's also really hard for children to buy booze. Having it legal and regulated stops kids getting it and stops the illegal activities surrounding it AND brings in tax revenue.
With illegal drings you end up with children and vulnerable people falling victim of county lines and cuckooing.
https://metro.co.uk/2025/04/19/cuckooing-devastating-crime-hiding-plain-sight-22926126/
https://www.nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/what-we-do/crime-threats/drug-trafficking/county-lines
Really bad analogy
This is totally a diffusion of social media issue. Twenty years ago, the media that kids had available for consumption was age rated. We had agreed as a society that certain things should not be visible to children until they grow up. It was possible to do because it was centralized (TV, movies, radio, print) and it was accountable to regulatory bodies and the rest of society. If a TV channel showed something as shitty as Tate style propaganda, there was institutional pushback, there were letters to the editor, there was someone specific to be targeted for accountability.
With social media being dominated by US style "freedom of speech" algorithms and US style acceptance of the impossibility (or even undesirability) of regulation and with completely unaccountable megacorps running them while giving very minimal if non-existent attention to who is watching what, we have a complete lack of age rating. We have given up on the idea of protecting childhood it seems.
Coupled with every fucking other issue being brought up in this thread, from COVID, to economic issues, to cultural misogyny, there is a perfect storm...
can you blame boys for aspiring to this
Fail em. It'll be hilarious to the next group of kids who see someone his age in their class. And then the next
That's not how it works in the UK. Everyone progresses through school regardless of how you perform.
Also known as kicking the can down the road.
If you don’t fail a kid in elementary school they’re gonna fail in high school. If you don’t fail them in high school they’re gonna fail in university or in life in general.
Life has consequences for making mistakes and not learning from them. If we try to shelter children from their mistakes and bad habits then we raise adults who are poorly equipped for handling the challenges of life.
When I was in first year of university I met so many nice, seemingly-well-adjusted people who hit a brick wall with their coursework. I believe around a third of my peers failed to graduate at all in their programs. Many dropped out or transferred to other departments or other universities.
But here’s the thing: my peers had already been subject to a rigorous selection process to get in (only about 10% of applicants were admitted). If you had put all applicants through the rigours of the coursework far more would have failed.
The really tragic part of this whole story is when you factor in the degrees of the consequences for failure. In elementary school the consequences for failure would be very low. Children who are older than their peers tend to outperform them anyway. In university, however, the consequences for failure are very high (thousands of dollars wasted on failed courses that need to be repeated).
The consequences for failure outside of school (real life as they call it) are even higher: unemployment, homelessness, incarceration, and even violence and death.
I remember there being someone held back a year. I think it happens.
With the "no child left behind" act, it's really turned into pass every kid no matter what.
Everyone talks about reading, did y'all know for a number of years schools stopped teaching phonics and instesd introduced sight words? Aside from many parents handing over an ipad instead of reading to their young children- the schools dropped phonics for the last 5 years or more in place of "sight words". I believe they've seen the damage and have gone back to phonics now, but there is a whole generational cohort who got fucked now.
Im glad I read to my son. Im glad I never gave him Internet access outaide of supervised educational time, or watching cat videos together. My son, who is in special education for learning disabilities, is one of the best readers in his class, and this year(6th grade) started in with Gen Ed and is excelling there too!
Reading is so good for children. As a toddler and beyond it is easy to bake into bedtime routines. Bedtime took 30-60mins, and we created so many memories for both of us. I'll always remember the silly voice I used to read the Dogmans' "haw-haw-ha-ha" laugh. Close familial bonds keep these kids from feeling alone and turning to social media for support.
I fucking hate that act so goddamn much.
No one fails. You can't drive yourself to elementary school.
Lol, you know society screwed up when there's a "Student Parking" section at your local elementary schools.
That's good, just fuck 'em without disregard. Great model to follow.
Fine, just fail them. This is a problem for the parents to address. And if the parents refuse, then they can enjoy having a child who lives off of benefits and aspires to be an "influencer". Lol.
They can all fail and become bitter incels together
And harm other people in society while they are at it
The beauty of this movement is, that no woman would accept a man like that as a father to her children
No, but incel culture is also rapist culture. They aren't looking for consent.
2A + 4B
It's always interesting seeing comments like this from people who don't understand the situation.
Andrew Tate brags about trafficking and rape, and they idolize him. In short: They don't care about acceptance or consent, their plan is turn women into a subservient class that isn't allowed to have jobs, bank accounts, car, etc.
It's strange how often this has been done in the past. The only culture that didn't treat women like lesser beings afaik were the vikings. Who weren't perticularly known for being kind either. Anyhow. Women there were able to own a plot of land and a home. Rather than be a servant in it to a man.
That shit wasn't transient either, in Scandinavia women will still stand and fuck your shit up if you mess with them.
They somehow solved civilization, it's incredible.
The numbers don't lie - scandinavian countries are happier and healthier.
Not by a little bit, commuting here from California is like traveling between heaven and Somalia.
I have been blissfully unaware of this… I can’t believe how quickly civilisation is turning into a pile of shit.
As a father to a young boy, outside of blocking all social media (tiktok, instagram, facebook, twitter, snapchat) which I already do, is there another medium or method in which this crap can be spread? Of course, I’ll try to instill the same virtues and moral principles that I carry, but I recognise I probably have a few more years, before peer pressure becomes a thing for him. If this is a disease that spreads amongst young men, I’ll try to rip that off, root and stem.
It's not all human civilization. I'm in Japan right now and it's not happening like that here. Don't misunderstand, things aren't perfect here, there's other issues, but the kids are mostly alright.
And even in Canada it's not everybody with these issues, it's mostly the anglos. Lots of non english private schools that don't have these issues for various reasons - banned cellphones, stricter rules, stricter parents, etc.
My friends in China tell me the kids there also don't have these issues. Again, other issues, but not these.
They were already doing that.
Sure, let's not try to help them and just fuck them instead.
Seriously, it's this attitude and name-calling that drives these lost boys in the influence of pigs like Tate.
How society collectively decided to design the Millennial experience lol.
In 10 years, it seems we not only gave up our own nations’ dreams of equality and union, but lustfully decided to lick the boots of those telling us our dreams aren’t worth having. It doesn’t help that the self-proclaimed “leader of the free world” is a known rapist who cuts deals with the Taliban at the expense of women’s liberties.
Some of you need more empathy. These are children whose insecurities are being exploited for profit. Be mad at their parents, and be mad at figures like Andrew Tate. But these are children and they deserve more grace than that.
Watch the series Adolescence (Netflix)
Next to the fact that every. Hour long. Episode. Is a one-take, it shows that this phenomenon is real. It is based on a true story and I won't spoil anything, but it gets dark from the second it starts.
why periods in weird places?
Unlike the reference series, the comment was not done in 1 take and didn't have the budget for professional editing.
It was a toilet comment. I can only take so long before people notice I'm gone.
Just read it out loud (even in your head) and you'll notice it's adding pauses for emphasis. Whether it's good style or not is a different question, but the why seems pretty clear.
Either a 3rd grade drop out, or someone too old to remember what they learned in 3rd grade.
The series is addressed in the article
Those little shits should be slapped by their mom's when they get home from school. Suburban trash.
Just proves he attracts the immature mind
Where are the parents, if my son pulled that shit I would put him a position where he MUST listen to and work for women until he realizes how ridiculous he is.
I think about just how many shitty fathers these kids have, most of them in the maga cult that are lapping up the likes of Carlson and Peterson's lessons on red pilled bullshit and condoning the behavior of their kids (albeit from a notably absent distance).
Send them to a Catholic male-only school, which incidentally is also one of the most right-wing places I can imagine. Let's see how long they remain up to their "masculine" standards.
Abuse isn't the solution to miseducation.
I am just saying that they don't know what they are asking for with this behavior: such places already exist and they are abusive to their own members.
They're likely all the way in for this kind of culture because they are victims of those same kinds of places. People who grow up in catholic school are the ones who grow up to be catholic schoolteachers. Who grow up and send their kids to catholic school. That's kind of how it works.
Nah, that is One Hour Photo kind of apologetics.
Imagine believing that catholic school cures people of their misogyny. Wow.
Wow, just wow. Are you Drax?
The nuns at my father’s Catholic school were brutal. They would slap you with a yard stick if you talked back.
As an old enough Italian, I can assure you that my friends who attended those schools in the 90s still received the same treatment and especially that teachers in public schools who attended those schools kept telling us of how they dreamed of doing that to us.
My Dad went to a catholic school, in America, in the 70s and 80s, and it was that way back then.
oh the society is totally not turning to shit because of terminally online kids. No worries at all.
That is quite a worrying statistic: 41% of young men endorsing a human-trafficking misogynist rapist.
Sometimes I wonder if the Internet should only be allowed for people 21 or 25 years or older.
21 is the new 16... 25 is the new 21.
But... At the same time older adults are extremely dumb too.
But giving a young person access to the Internet is like letting them walk NYC alone at night during the 70s.
Ever since Facebook and 9/11 the Internet has been kind of awful.
We're in for a very, very stupid future.
Social media and the rise of influencers is the downfall of humanity.
Humanity? This isn't happening in every country. The west is not all of humanity.
There aren’t influencers in the east?
When you consume social media in China you see a lot more travel influencers, foodies, educational reels, and generally more positive content. People who post rage content there get banned.
So yes, they have influencers, but the social media I've seen out here is more moderated. Not true for all countries of course, you can get the same TikTok in Japan, and there are LOTS of hateful comments on the Japanese internet.
The funny thing is that people like Tate would be the first to be eaten when the world ends lol
I have young kids. This shit terrifies me honestly.
Tate should get into a fistfight with a hot femboy and lose, his ego (and by extension those of his followers) would probably won't be able to take that.
So? You get a F, you get a F, you get a F...
I can really recommend the mini series Adolesence on Netflix (or wherever) to get a great, dramatized example of how this effect looks like.
First. If the kid doesn't want to talk to the teacher then put the kid into detention until they will. If the kid misses more then a certain number of days of class. Make them take the entire grade again. Fail them.
Second (and I'm not sure how we would do this) cut them off from the internet. There are books in the library for doing research.
If that is where America is heading, to some theocracy like Iran and where men see women as chattel, then I would rather raise children elsewhere there is a culture of empathy.
Sky news wishes it was
The world is fucked and always has been. Humanity are horrible evil beings.
I grew up in Dubai and most of my teachers were women. None of the boys ever gave any lip on account of their sex. If they did, the teacher wouldn't need to discipline them... we would.
There was always a large number of stupid kids who were jerks in school, but it was always hidden behind a mentality of stern rebukes of fights and an occasional suspension. Now, all of those same types of moronic assholes have a digital distillated stream of garbage that fits with their natural tendancies, putting these idiots into hyperdrive.
Honestly, it's probably better that the problem gets worse so that it unmasks the high amount of bullying and abuse that's normally accepted in schools.
Worst of all, when bullies harass and attack and beat people over and over in school, on the rare occasion when a student defends themself, the defender often ends up charged because "cool" bullies get a free pass unless bones are broken or the victim dies, while uncool victims are castigated by schools for defending themselves. The unfortunate recent charging of the innocent Karmelo Anthony with murder for refusing to be bullied by some asshole jock is an excellent example of this.
Andrew Tate is not the problem, this problem has existed for a long time with school just letting it fester. Tate at least finally makes the problem noticeable. The problem has always been school administrators who allow this sort of stuff to happen.
Then BEAT THEM SENSELESS AND REMOVE THEIR SCREENS
I read this and thought something didn't add up. If all Tate ever did was disrespect women and treat them like property, nobody would care about him. Unsurprisingly, the truth is more complicated. See this for example.
If Tate's appeal is not addressed, things will get worse.
The kind of people that think Tate is a hero should be snuffed out lol
A lot of young boys had an "edgy" phase. Let's hope this is somewhat true here as well.
The only good think andrew tate has said is to work on building yourself and work hard. Beyond that, his talking points do more damage to society and bring a lot of harm.
Due these Andrew Tate fans happen to come from a country that devalues women?
I've seen them not wanting to work with women due to some religious fundamentalism.
Good, grbage humans won't pass on their genes
The left coild have done more to court these kids. To late now my gender is a lost cause and every moment is a reminder. I hate this I hate my gender.
I swear people refuse to take accountability for anything. It’s not social medias fault. This is POOR PARENTING. Plain and simple.
So over a few years millions of parents decided to collectively take a hard pivot into bad parenting? Couldn't possibly be an unprecedented media environment with algorithmic targeting?
No but a generation? Yes 1000%. Parents are responsible for their children. Their media usage, their behavior at school, literally everything. A child can not be held accountable by themselves. It won’t ever happen without teaching them. Parents are responsible for teaching their kids manners.
If you believe the answer to this problem is banning social media, you are not looking any deeper than this article and are falling for click bait.
As a parent with kids who are starting to dip their roles into the digital age, I would also say this is mainly a parenting issue, but the economic "squeeze" is the other part.
There are so many tools available to manage the content your kids consume - ad blockers, family accounts with monitoring and management, ect. I may be biased as I'm in the IT profession, but if you live in this digital age and claim ignorance on anything technology related then it's no wonder we are on the state we are in.
Many of the responsibilities the US government agencies used to take on themselves have been eroded to be handled by the individual, coupled with a subscription society for the or day to day appliances and tools we use. After working a full time job M-F, and if I don't have after hours tasks to handle I get maybe 1 hour worth of family before it's time to pack it up for the night. Weekends are typically house work or chores. I consider myself fortunate to have that much. Squeeze in management of my kids content intake and that's just more time taken away from everything else on the list.
I'll do it though because I'll be damned if my kids grow up like these kids are now.
If you believe there should be no accountability or oversight for the richest companies ever that have deep personal access to billions of people across the globe, you should wake to the realities of the 21st century.
He didn't say that. Social media companies should be punished and regulated to a certain extent, but saying that they're the only ones to blame here is frankly bollocks. It's the same discussion we've had with violent video games.
Ignorant parents use this to excuse their lack of action for their kid's use of social media. What they could and should do is to not allow kids access to it or to monitor their traffic. This however requires willpower, time and effort to understand and implement this into daily life. Which either they don't have or don't want to do. This brings us to one of the causes of the low fertility rate for younger generations: it takes more nowadays to raise a child and younger generations are more responsible about raising kids than older generations.
Excessive regulation of social media for kids will massively affect our privacy. Certain European apps now require facial or id verification to use in order to prove you're old enough. I don't know about you, but I sure as hell don't want to give out my ID or let them photo my face just to watch a movie just because some parent isn't responsible enough to educate their kid.
Sounds like absolving social media to me.
The complexity of social media engineering and the scope of its impact is unprecedented. It's not at all the same thing as video game or TV panic. When you account for how much real-life peer discussion is driven by these platforms, protecting your child from this toxic rhetoric is nearly impossible.
You used to have to show your ID to rent a movie in person, why is doing it online any different? If you (rightfully) are concerned about data collection and surveillance, push for legeslative protections on that topic. This is a completely separate issue with a very clear root cause.
Because that data is stored and passed on to third parties in most cases. Because data breeches are a common occurrence nowadays. Because gorvernments and companies can use that data against you later on.
"Oh, that person has a nasty burn on his face? Why don't I save that and pass this information to a face cream company?"
"Oh, this person is a refugee from another country? Why don't I just pass this information to the government so they can see what they're watching?"
It's most definetly not like buying liquor when you briefly show your ID to the cashier.
The EU and California have already done that and the results are rather poor since it's difficult to properly enforce. You can slap fines on said companies, but that's only a setback. It doesn't stop them especially when you have a weak government like the US has right now.
No, it's not. You're sacrificing privacy and liberty for everyone just to fix mostly a parental issue.
The solution is to give those laws teeth. Harsh regulations on platforms that serve unmoderated content open to everyone. Enforce transparency on content serving algorithms. Massive penalties for security breaches. Ban platforms that don't comply.
If you're worried about state actors having access to your clearnet data, that's pretty much unavoidable in the internet age. You can lessen that by pushing against the digitization of society. You shouldn't need a smart phone or internet service to live daily life.
Support brick-and-mortar stores, your local library, a local hobby group. Campaign against always-online car features, IoT e-waste, traffic surveillance laws, etc... Don't make me choose between subjecting children to a stream of unregulated bullshit and the right to privacy. It's a false dichotomy propped up by our need for digital convenience.
I'm just curious... How did you sign up for internet service? Can you walk me through the process?
iPad babies.
People won't even take accountability for believing this phony clickbait headline.
Poor parenting is certainly an issue, but saying "it's not social medias fault" is like saying the opioid epidemic "isn't Purdue's fault". The people who manufacture and distribute the addictive and harmful product should be the first ones we go after. No amount of individual accountability will solve the problem as long as multi-billion dollar corporations are pumping this shit out 24/7.
I'm sorry but misogyny and sexism is basically a tradition in the UK. Culturally encoded white behavior.
The solution to false masculinity is to replace it with real masculinity. Men who speak well of women, who practice custody of the eyes, who willfully suffer for the good of others, and who do hard things. We used to promote examples of such men but that time seems to have passed.
The overwhelming majority of men think Tate is a dumb twat, it's just that being a regular man doesn't get clicks or attention in the clicks and attention economy
Okay maybe a majority, but "overwhelming majority"? No way. There are a lot of incels in America.
Edit: I somehow managed to forget that the article is about Britain.
I can't really confirm this, even in his target market (young boys) he's not popular
https://yougov.co.uk/society/articles/47419-one-in-six-boys-aged-6-15-have-a-positive-view-of-andrew-tate
1/6 is positive which leaves 5/6 who either don't know, don't care or don't like him.
The older we get the more unfavourable we view Tate
One of my favourites:
Louis Theroux's View Of Andrew Tate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_4yusHQWm0
It seems 23% of boys aged 13-15 have a positive opinion of him, as opposed to 53% who have a negative opinion. That's a majority who hate him to be sure, but not an overwhelming majority. Also note that support for Andrew Tate is higher among young adults than teenagers who haven't even entered highschool. 27% of British men aged 18-29 have a positive view of Andrew Tates, while 35% agree with "the sort of thing Andrew Tates would say". He's liked by a significant minority of his major audience (male teenagers and young/young-ish adults).
I can't look at this graph and say that he is well liked by any demographic
Including this one which suggests if you're 40 or over you either haven't heard of him or hate him
Okay, now how many of those boys were saying they have a "negative opinion" of Tate just because they didn't want to get in trouble with their parents/teachers/etc. for listening to Tate?
Eww, keep that religious garbage far away from children.
Wow. It takes a special (in a bad way) sort of person to see an article about a guy who died in the place of another person in the Holocaust and go "ew, religion".
Yeah.... it seems to me that one of the problems is actually that we kinda threw organized religion into the trash bin and replaced it with .... nothing. So is it weird that people fill that void with also total garbage?
Perhaps there was a reason why only socities with strong organized religions survived to this point?
Bow down to your god.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_religion
You remind me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D7rWLzloOI
No.
Doctors who help the less fortunate should be admired but there was a local pediatrician that was arrested for sex crimes against children. Don't emulate him.
That's not hard to understand.
Catholics got a lot of predatory priests for a time because it was one of the few professions where you could explaine away why you weren't interested in adult women. Most abuse was by homosexual men who had an itch for boys. If you look at their share of the population, these men were clearly the primary problem.
They recruited others like them into seminaries and good men were driven away by their behavior.
It took Pope Benedict XVI evicting them from the seminaries to reach an inflection point. But now any pervert can be rather openly perverted and, if they want boys, they'll be more successful as a teacher, coach, or scout leader.
My local public school has had about a dozen arrests of these men in the past ten years. More are hidden in their ranks because everyone is looking at the priest and nobody is looking at the teachers. The problem didn't go away, it just adapted to other professions.
The hivemind seems to really hate you even though they'd probably agree the lack of good male role models is very much a cause of the incel epidemic.
I'm not going to go into details because my english isn't very good and I'm liable to be misinterpreted, but it's not young males in every country who are having these problems. There are countries where the young males are doing great. If you want to understand the issues with young anglo males better look at the countries that don't have these issues and notice what they do differently.
lmao. Grow up.
It would be interesting to know how many children are becoming more ambitious in school. I recently read an article about how more and more girls feel so much pressure to be the best in class that they start controlling their food intake (the only true control they feel they have) leading to anorexia. Two very different but scary extremes.
I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. Can you elaborate for me?
I'm actually not sure why so many people down voted my comment, but I'll try to explain. This article is about boys who don’t respect women or girls. I read another article about girls trying their best but still struggling due to pressure. So I’ve read two very extreme cases, and both articles present it as something widespread. The big issue seems to be social media.
It made me wonder how kids are doing in school, are they more ambitious now but struggling because of mental health? I saw in the comments that a lot of kids are doing poorly.
Just to clarify, I think it’s bad regardless of the reason or how many kids are affected, gender doesn’t matter, and my comment was never about that.
How did you (and maybe others) read my comment? I want to learn to communicate better for next time.
I think you got downvoted because it wasn't clear what you were saying, so people misunderstood. That's why I asked, because I don't like to assume I know what people are saying, I prefer to have them tell me.
If I understand your comment, you are wondering out loud. Perhaps some of the other readers thought you were trying to make a point about something.
Thank you for elaborating!
Yes, I was just open for discussion.
Thanks for telling me! And thanks for giving people a chance to explain them self, I appreciate that about you :D
Society when kids are no longer wearing a uniform, have the same haircut, answer with a stoic "yes madam" and can be beaten into submission in school.
This is a problem that needs to be dealt with with better schooling. More teachers and new and updated curricula.
Yes, maybe parents are getting "worse" or kids are less "behaved", but what would it matter?
Also I really doubt it. Kids probably have more things to deal with and struggle with that. Same goes for parents I think.
"Society when kids are no longer ... beaten into submission" is exactly the take I needed to get my morning going!
I meant that as it was in the past. Obviously it's bad. Not saying we should go back
As I'm collecting downvotes I realize that my post can be read as a defense of kids that like andrew tate.
Fuck tate and all other rightwinger fascists.
I meant to direct my comment at people who say "kids these days are bad".
I don't know about other downvoters, but i downvoted you because you said kids should be beaten into submission at school. Corporal punishment is the refuge of bad parents and it's not a teacher's job to harm your children that way. There is not a single justifiable reason that you need to be physically violent with a child to educate them. In fact, that only makes it worse. You either raise a fearful child or a hateful one. Either way, in my book, it's child abuse and you were calling for it.
And boy would i cause all sorts of sky falling down trouble on the poor soul that decided to physically assault my child, undoing my job of teaching that violence is only a tool of self defense. I suffered significant corporal punishment growing up and i can guarantee it improved my life in no way.
Wtf I don't condone that archaic behavior. I meant that's why kids behaved in the old days, because they had to, or else.
Nowadays we need better schooling.
That's how I meant it.
It's kind of weird people are taking that literally.
Also just a weird is how the internet predominantly lays the blame solely on parents. And people love to absolve everyone else especially teachers of any childhood development responsibilities. LIke the saying goes, 'it takes a village'. Teachers are as much parents as anyone else in the village. The aunts/uncles, neighbors, corner store clerk, mailman, police officer. When kids act up, the adults have to correct it.
Yet the internet generally just glares at the parents. Then again it stands to reason parents or broadly speaking people who actively engage in parenting roles aren't chronically online. They're actually raising children.
People wonder why things are the way they are. Maybe it's because the village has absconded.
If I had kids I should damn well hope they get a beating at school when they step out of line. Figuratively of course. Because. The internet seems to have lost all reading comprehension. Maybe they weren't beat enough at school either... Figuratively I mean.
I am sorry but to me this reads as if you want kids to be beaten