Oh, that's easy to clean up. Just open explorer, go to desktop, Ctrl+A, Ctrl+X, make a new folder called 2025-Jan, and then inside of that folder, Ctrl+V. Problem solved, forever.
I absolutely do it the other way. Nothing is on my desktop except for the trash bin. There is a shortcut to the file explorer and browser pinned to the task bar. And that's it.
There is nothing at all on my desktop except for a text document created by my girlfriend saying that she loves me that she snuck on there when I wasn’t looking.
Taskbar is all you need. Also, the windows/meta button, then just typing (or if you're in KDE, literally just typing) the thing I want to do and hitting enter. Fuck desktop icons.
Windows + E for file explorer as well, when you can't be bothered with the mouse. I wish you were able to pin specific folders to the taskbar, as opposed to just general explorer. I want to save one click.
I use my keyboard as little as possible, so shortcut keys aren't for me. I use a laptop, and am usually lying on the couch, too far to reach the keyboard. I have a few shortcuts mapped to my mouse. You'd be surprised how much I can surf the web with just the mouse. And sometimes even with my left hand.
Also Microsoft: If you ever try to leave us we will delete all of your data on all of your devices. We might even do it at random just for fun…No, we won't warn you.
I fucking hate onedrive sooo much for this, it kills me a little everytime and it happens all the time. Im just a husk at this point. God damn fuck you onedrive.
and it gives you that shitty prompt with like 3 locations to dark pattern you into using it instead of just putting you in the explorer window so you can go right to where you want to fucking save it. Wasting a shitload of time.
I'd be happy if those apps were asking to save to Documents like in the screenshot. But alas, reality is much more cruel. They always want to save to some vague OneDrive location, and won't even show you the local file browser without extra steps.
I don't want any of my files uploaded to OneDrive; therefore I don't want to save them in the OneDrive folder. I have other folders where I'd like to save my files instead.
So the behaviour I described is a persistent annoyance for me; despite you telling me it isn't a problem.
What I absolutely do not want, is my Desktop on One Drive. For starters, its often a scratch place. I don't want it instantly pushing 6GB of photos I just pulled off my camera's memory card to the cloud before I can sorr them.
Microsoft and application developers treat the Documents folder like a total dumping ground for whatever random nonsense they can dream up. No wonder people look elsewhere. Need to store user files? Documents. A database? Documents. Giant cache files? Documents. Config? Documents. Executables? Fuck it put those in Documents too.
Why would I ever store my real documents in a folder so littered with shit that I can never find anything? It's not like the search actually works.
Also as a Linux user myself and to head off any smugness, developers do the same thing with the home directory so users end up inventing weird ways to stay organized.
I don't ever search for files/folders in explorer's browser anymore. I just use Everything and TreeSize at this point. Windows' search function is pointless.
I have my files meticulously organized in hierarchical folders that sync across all my devices through One Drive and to my NAS through One Drive.
I hate that Microsoft wants to dump everything in Documents.
Also, for SOME FUCKING REASON, my work system, wants to put everything into the root of One Drive. Like fuck please put it in Documents at least. I don't want ANYTHING in the root folder if I can avoid it, aside from maybe the occasional super special thing.
Today I used Alt+Space to open krunner, typed the name of a C script I'm working on, and it pulled up search results for the file, as well as relevant websites I visited related to that title, and in that moment I realized how much I missed out growing up with Explorer.
Rebuttal, with a physical desk you put things you need right now on top in the open. You wouldn't grab something off the printer and put it into a drawer first, then reopen the drawer to get it out of your need it now.
The desktop is "right now" workspace. Why bother to put it into a folder whose only purpose is not to take things out of to put elsewhere? I could at least understand people who download direct to documents... but that still leaves a mess to clean up with installers and such.
Downloading to the desktop is not only sane, but more efficient.
Leaving everything on your desktop is a different conversation though.
I definitely would go ahead and put the printed document directly into a hanging file in my desk drawer if I could read/use the document without ever moving it like I can on a computer...
Somehow I'm doubting that you keep all your computer files in your download folder. You still have to move it. My way just makes it obvious it needs to be filled instead of leaving it on the junk drawer.
And the physical desk analogy still holds. Yeah you put it in a folder in the drawer, but it's the wrong one. Unless you are specifying a custom filepath for each file, in which case, carry on.
Unless you are specifying a custom filepath for each file, in which case, carry on.
This one is correct. I always setup my browser to ask where to put each download, and then send it to the file it needs to live in. Usually have the "default" be the home folder so I can easily browse to the subsequent folder quickly. The browser doesn't just get to decide where to put stuff or it would all be a mess eventually anyway.
I am the opposite and I absolutely hate it when I have to work on someone's laptop with cluttered desktop and folders. Mine only has a taskbar at bottom and clock widget at bottom right corner. All temporary files goes to downloads or to organised directories. What's the point of having a nice wallpaper if you can't enjoy it.
Everything from start menu shortcuts. Much cleaner and nicer that way.
Edit: I am using KDE plasma so not the full screen start menu like in windows but the small box on bottom left with about 15 icons that I regularly use.
I do this too. I do not like anything on my Desktop, but I download files to there, which forces me to deal with them. Interestingly enough, my Downloads directory is a barren wasteland.
Desktop is my temp space. There are files with a very limited shelf live (logs I downloaded to search something, screenshots, ...) so I have to clean them up on a regular base before my desktop becomes too crowded and I get annoyed.
That requires effort up-front every time I click download.
I'd rather just click 'download' and let it go to an easy to find default location. The desktop means I won't just forget about it for months. It may sit there for a day or two, but it definitely won't get ignored the way a folder I rarely look at does; because the clutter right in my face annoys me into cleaning it up.
I use downloads instead, it mainly functions as a temporary folder where anything unimportant can live and once it gets a scroll bar it all gets deleted. For the very rare things that are important I could then move them after.
Well first off, through God Linux, all things are possible. You can have multiple hard links to a file, where a given hard link is deleted, but you can still manipulate the file through any other other links. Alternately, you can open a file, and while you have a valid open file descriptor, delete the file. The file descriptor is still valid until you close the file though, so you can still save (thus move) it to a new location.
Windows locks files when you open them, preventing these kinds of shenanigans.
Yeah, Linux really does give you a gun and lets you point it at your foot if you want to, huh? I say this with the fondness and trepidation of someone who isn't a Linux noob, but also no pro (yet)
The cursed Linux alternative of this is usually putting things directly in the home folder – I used to do this until I got better. Desktop is simple to keep clean when you don't have one in your "desktop environment" by default.
Some people who've used MacOs before OSX dump everything to the root filesystem out of habit. It works just as poorly as a file management strategy as one might expect, albeit better than putting everything on the desktop. Not sure how often that happens but I've known multiple people to do that.
I love GNOME for this. No desktop icons. Windows/super key, type the first letter or two, boom. It's so pretty.
My phone on the other hand? The first screen is nicely arranged. The second screen is just a chronological list of the apps I've downloaded, because they automatically go to desktop, and they'll clutter up my home screen if I don't have a separate sacrificial screen for them
Same. I hate desktop clutter. The horrors I've seen when I've been on someone else's PC. Random desktop documents that haven't been touched in 5 years. Why?!
Even aside from looking ugly, it's not even a good place for apps/files! If you have a window or two open, everything is obscured and you have to move windows out of the way to access your stuff.
They get a lot of shit for it, but IMO Gnome was 100% right to say "No. The desktop inevitably becomes a dumping ground and we don't want that. Your app menu is for apps and your Home folder is for files. We have very good search functionality to find what you want. No desktop icons. If you want that, install an extension."
The availability of extensions for everything is the true power of Gnome for me. They got most things right but I love being able to tweak every little detail to my exact liking
"We" is obviously the hard-working developers who predominantly work on Gnome unpaid. The people who provide the software for free.
To be completely honest, I'm not sure how you don't know who "we" is in that context. When the devs of a project say "we", who do you think they're referring to, the Jackson 5?
Literally every project makes decisions on what their vision is and enacts it. Gnome is no different.
If you don't like a piece of software, don't use it. Nobody is forcing you to use it.
Frankly, you sound entitled. They aren't obliged to make their project to the way you want it. Especially not when you're getting it for free. Entitlement like that is the biggest cancer in the FOSS community, IMO.
Hmm, GNOME pays developers. There's a team of full time employees steering GNOME, and staff. Sure they are a non-profit, but it's a bit romanticizing to claim that they are doing all that work for free. I don't think it is very nice or productive to call people names and gatekeeping FOSS this way. There's such a thing as customization. It's fine that GNOME is very opinionated (everyone accepts that they are and the project lead has said so time and time again that user choice is not part of their focus). But, at the same time, it's not their project, there's a complex governance structure that involves the community. It's contradictory to speak this way about a component of a Linux distro. Linux is philosophically underlined by freedom of choice and personal customization, and it's inappropriate to insult people for wanting some more of that.
Some developers do some paid work. The vast majority is unpaid. I'm not sure where you heard that, but that information is incorrect.
And I never said they did all of the work for free, I said predominantly. Same goes for other projects.
Please don't try to twist my words, I feel I was very clear with them.
Yes, it is their project. They own it. It's theirs. They are the developers.
Linux is philosophically underlined by freedom of choice and personal customization
And Gnome doesn't go against any of that. You are free to not use it. They aren't forcing you. You are free to customise it. They aren't stopping you.
Please stop acting so entitled. This is software they are providing for free, the bulk of the work being unpaid. They don't have to do free work for your specific needs if they don't want to. It's their project.
I never insulted you. If my words hurt, then I'm sorry, my intention is not to hurt you.
I'm just trying to steer you away from the path you're on of thinking you're entitled to XYZ and some predominantly unpaid devs have to cater to your whims. They do not. It's their project, not yours, and they rightly call the shots.
Entitlement like that is the biggest cancer in the FOSS community, IMO.
I said feeling like the devs owe you something is entitlement, which is a cancer to the FOSS world. You aren't owed anything, and neither am I.
Nowhere did I say you were cancer, unless you happen to proudly identify as an extremely entitled person.
Like I said, sorry if my words hurt you, but you aren't entitled to have the devs carer to you specifically. The project is theirs and if you don't like it, fork it or use something else. That's what FOSS is all about.
Why do you think unpaid devs should have to do as you say?
This is actually the one thing I hate about GNOME. I keep a nearly fully empty desktop but I like having one as sort of a staging ground for temp files. I like just being able to chuck a file there and then drag it into another program, all without having nautilus open
This is exactly how I use KDE, but without the GNOME look, which I am not a fan of. You don't even need to hit meta first in KDE, you can just start typing if you have krunner on.
Windows works the same way, you just hit the windows key and start typing and you hit enter, made switching to popos much easier because I use it exactly the same way I do with my windows work laptop
Also You should check out kiss launcher for phone, just start typing and whatever app you want shows up, also has a history list that tries to have apps you use frequently at specific times. Although after using kiss for a few years now whenever I have to use someone's phone it makes it really hard, seeing all those screens with icons like how can you find anything
I use the desktop as a very temporary folder. Because I'll be annoyed by having stuff on there and will delete them as soon as I don't need them any more.
My downloads folder has random installers from 2021.
This drives me mad. I work on multiple projects, how the fuck can I organise things of its all in one folder! The interface to select a different folder is like 3 clicks away too.
On Android it's similar... On some apps(all?) you can't save to the downloads folder. Like WTF? Downloads is where temp stuff goes you damn green buffoon!
I used the desktop all the time when I was on Windows. When I moved to Linux fulltime, KDE wouldn't let you save to desktop. Eventually I figured out how to fix that, but by that time I had the habit broken. Thankfully i never reverted and my shit is generally organized because of it.
As part of my usual process, I minimized most of what the person was using, because I dgaf what users are actually doing on their computers. I'm only interested in getting the "problem" that they're complaining about, solved, so I can go home.
When I finished minimizing everything, I shit you not, this person had two full screens of icons on their desktop. I couldn't help but blurt out "that's a lot of icons" they went on to describe how they use their desktop as a dumping ground and they clear the whole thing every few months.
Since I couldn't give a single shit about what they do with their computer, I said something to the effect of "alright", fixed the unrelated "problem" they had and moved on.
I do the same thing, but mostly because I develop Doom mods for fun and it's just an easy place to dump sprites and audio files. I can drag a file directly from my desktop to the modding program I use, and then just clean up once I'm finished working on what I'm working on. Otherwise my desktop just has a few shortcuts.
Id just like to add that whoever started sending game files to the hidden part of documents should be shot. How hard is it to just make a Games folder and a Games Save folder?
Steam games need to store save files in the same library location as the game, using a sub folder that maps to the steam account name. Stop filling up the app data folder for the operating system account that is running steam. My C drive is full, go away.
Also, Windows doesn't allow writing to files to in Program folders... So let's put everything that needs RAM into that directory! But not the save files, those are hidden 7 layes deep in MyAss/hidden/hidden/almost there/hidden/docs/maybe save files.
The top of your desk is exactly where you want the document that you will need in a minute to go. Its what bosses demanded since before modern computing
If that is not the intended usecase, then what is?
In linux i am saving stuff in a related project folder which may aswell be that projects own desktop.
I didn't think that any Windows related software was actually aware that the 'Documents' folder is supposed to be for documents. Because my 'Documents' folder gets used as a dumping ground for any old program to drop their shit in. Even though there's literally dedicated folders for app data and saved games.
Personally I make my own 'Home' folder with my own pictures, movies, documents etc. folders because whether it's Windows, Linux or Android, the concept of having your own user folder for your own things is a joke because developers don't respect that and just dump their files anywhere.
I don't use the Documents folder because of that reason, but it's still weird to me that that doesn't happen on Linux, so my Documents folder is mostly empty there
Yeah, documents itself isn't bad but you still end up with a bunch of stuff just being chucked into the root of your user folder, despite the fact that folders like '.config' exist. Personally, I like my 'home' space to be just my files, things that I've put there myself, without random programs making new folders and leaving dotfiles lying around. I'm a bit of a neat freak on my pc, way more than in real life. Personally, /home is just another /etc for me. My shit goes elsewhere.
Yeah Documents is basically default for .local config save data trash for any and all programs and games, which is a bummer. I'd like to use it for documents lol.
Windows 95 was easier to use simply because of saving everything to the desktop. When Windows 98 tried to introduce "My Documents" i was like nope and still saved everything to the desktop.
It's not an app, it's actually a very simple repo containing folders and readmes.
It's just a folder structure, which you can use on your system. Unzip the file and slowly fill the folders with your files. I had to create(or maybe even rename/delete) some folders to adapt it to my needs. It took me around 20days during summer to organize around 2-3tb of my laptop and my external disk.
It was a kinda painful manual process, but I think it was really worth it, now things are well organized, I detected and removed hunderds of GB of unecessary/duplicate/unwanted files, it's easier to navigate now, the structure is cleaner and syncing a big part of my drive is relatively easy now. There some files, like installed programs and their data which are in predefined paths and I didnt move those, so these were left out. Also some games save their data in Documents, so I symlinked their data in documents. And there's the defauly downloads folder which is now more of a temporary folder for stuff I download before I move them or delete them.
There is not exactly a standard for how to orginize your files, but this repo is a very good start:)
Edit: I think organizing my files was my first step on the list in order to transition to linux, it would otherwise make it harder to properly backup and sync a mess of files gathering up for years. To sync my files to my external drive I just had to backup only ~10folders and one of which was the "root" (the one in the repo as you can see) which contained about 90% of my files. Much easier, much faster.
Taking a look now. This seems largely pretty smart. I am curious though, how much of the folder structure here felt relevant for you? For me I'm thinking it's ~50%. I agree with you though, that it's a good starting point. I was working on something similar in a text file a while back but never finished. Turns out, organization is pretty hard when you have collected data for 25 years.
Ok, umm, I sent a lengthy response with screenshots and a dirlist to see, somehow it didnt get sent. I'll send it again later, but it will probably take me 4hours, gonna be busy for a little while😅
(To answer your question, this structure holds around 96% of my user data.)
Ok, so, it takes about 96% of the data in the home partition. Here are some screenshots of Qdirstat scans of my laptop's 1tb ssd:
~/:
~/root/:
Many of the files here are flac files and some ancient movies I have. 😄
Also, this is a (censored) directory list of top 3 levels of the root structure (I have put some unecessary dirs in Obsolete-dirs instead of deleting them and many dirs here are either empty or near-empty, like the book categories or the chart dirs):
Btw, I have separate root, home and boot partitons on my nixos install, here's the root partition:
/:
Lastly, the external hdd I have isn't that organized, because many of the backup folder aren't inside the root folder. I think putting them inside the /root/backup/ path would be the proper way, but this would probably break my backup workflow and mess with a script I have to sync my phone. I might do it one time:)
Thank you so much for this! You've given me a lot of ideas. Last question, I think you mentioned symlinking -- can you say more about how you are using symlinks? (I am familiar with the concept but maybe haven't used them how you have for a purpose like this)
I havan't yet used a lot of symlinking, but some of the stuff I do is:
If you can see the dirlist, in ~/root/Imports-Exports/Bottles I have the bottles dir which contains 2 subdirs, Bottles-Apps and Bottles-Games. They are symlinks, pointing to bottles of apps (at ~/root/Software/Applications/Linux/Bottles-Apps) and games (at ~/root/Games/Video/Computer/linux/Bottles-Games) respectively (bottles are wine prefixes that the app "Bottles" creates to run windows programs).
This one is again about windows games. I have the program files and data in 2 separate folder under ~/root/Games/Video/Computer/windows/GameX (where GameX represents a given game) and I symlink them inside the respective bottle dirs (2 of the games I have use the default Documents dir for saving the game data and because I dont have bottles isolated from the rest of the userspace, I symlinked the game data in ~/Documents).
Because nixos uses symlinks for its app shortcuts, simply dragging app icons on the desktop doesnt work (it creates symlinks to the version of the app at this time). Thus, I have to go to nixos's folder with shortcuts to my apps (which gets updated after update) and symlink each shortcut to my desktop.
Another use for symlinks is to keep my dotfiles git versioned and sycned with codeberg, for which I'll have to use gnu stow, but I still haven't done this (my git knowledges are veery limited).
You can do fun stuff, just be careful when copying/deleting/syncing symlinks, not to mess up anything (app tend to warn you if you want to follow the symlink (which affects the targeted file instead of the symlink) or not). They help to keep things tidy, but can get messy with improper use:)
Gotcha. Yeah I saw those -> indicators right after sending you that question. I just installed tree locally -- it is nice! I keep forgetting about that one. I'm gonna take all this as inspiration and come up with a better system. I currently have a server/desktop with my whole entire data archive and a laptop that will have some backup-worthy files, I'd like to be able to easily back them both up locally and to the cloud.
I think getting better organized like you did first is the right move. I have a system in place for the desktop machine that works fairly well, but buying this new laptop threw a wrench into that system because I'd like to reuse it in both contexts but it's currently not equipped to do that. I'll figure it out :) But like you said, being organized helps efforts like that (among many others!)
Everything is saved to the Syncthing folder. I make sure there is a shortcut to it in the sidebar. From there, it gets placed in the proper folder inside of that.
Least cluttered Windows Desktop:
Pffff, if you don't attach to the grid you got way more space for files.
Gotta arrange by penis
If anybody needs me, I'll be here for the next half hour or so.
…there’s no “sort by penis”…
Nice. It's girth will grow for each new file saved.
Can you sort this by penis? Internet Explorer needs to be at the tip or I won't be able to find it.
Thank you so much for this, setting this as my wallpaper right now.
You’re welcome!
Aww, I love TWID! Thanks for the reminder, haven't watched it in awhile
Same here.
There is a folder in my (Linux) desktop called "Old Desktop"
There's a folder inside "Old Desktop" called... "Old Desktop".
Are you me? Haha recently I went looking through them and was appalled. Not enough to actually do anything about it though.
I have the same but with the whole home directory.
/home/user/old_home/old_home/old_home
Man, zooming in and looking at these icons was like a blast from the (not too far) past.
Where's Bonzi Buddy?
Oh, that's easy to clean up. Just open explorer, go to desktop, Ctrl+A, Ctrl+X, make a new folder called 2025-Jan, and then inside of that folder, Ctrl+V. Problem solved, forever.
Where was that file? Oh, My Documents/Old Desktops/2023 November/2023 April/2022 December. Of course.
I absolutely do it the other way. Nothing is on my desktop except for the trash bin. There is a shortcut to the file explorer and browser pinned to the task bar. And that's it.
There is nothing at all on my desktop except for a text document created by my girlfriend saying that she loves me that she snuck on there when I wasn’t looking.
Bro you didn’t have to come here just to brag…
Mine used the sticky note app makes me smile every time I open my laptop.
i don't even have icons enabled on my desktop. Now I don't have to feel stressed about cleaning it up
Ah, a person of culture! Though I admit everything that I regularly use is pinned to the taskbar.
Taskbar is all you need. Also, the windows/meta button, then just typing (or if you're in KDE, literally just typing) the thing I want to do and hitting enter. Fuck desktop icons.
Yeah, this is the way. Disable icons and recycle bin too.
You're ready for GNOME.
What's gnome?
Assuming you're not joking: Gnome Desktop Environment.
Thanks. I wasn't joking. But it doesn't look like something for me. It looks like Apples iOS, and I hate everything apple related.
Windows + E for file explorer as well, when you can't be bothered with the mouse. I wish you were able to pin specific folders to the taskbar, as opposed to just general explorer. I want to save one click.
I use my keyboard as little as possible, so shortcut keys aren't for me. I use a laptop, and am usually lying on the couch, too far to reach the keyboard. I have a few shortcuts mapped to my mouse. You'd be surprised how much I can surf the web with just the mouse. And sometimes even with my left hand.
Microsoft: put it in OneDrive. We will use your content to train our AI models. No really this is fine.
Also Microsoft: If you ever try to leave us we will delete all of your data on all of your devices. We might even do it at random just for fun…No, we won't warn you.
I love the random deletetion. They deleted a whole year of my university notes just because.
Me: "I've got an elaborate folder structure for all my documents."
Windows: "You want to put this in the root directory of OneDrive."
Me: "No, I want to put it in \SpecialFiles\ProjectName\IterationNo\DetailedSchematic"
Windows: "Root directory of OneDrive it is."
I fucking hate onedrive sooo much for this, it kills me a little everytime and it happens all the time. Im just a husk at this point. God damn fuck you onedrive.
and it gives you that shitty prompt with like 3 locations to dark pattern you into using it instead of just putting you in the explorer window so you can go right to where you want to fucking save it. Wasting a shitload of time.
Uninstall it. It’s an optional component.
Not on work locked down pcs its not.
Exactly.
Because My Documents is where Windows keeps all your save games from the last decade and beyond, because why would I use it to store MY DOCUMENTS?
That's why I debloat windows anytime I do a new install. Drop that box 🥊
It's a work computer, so my options are limited
Good god. Putting stuff in the desktop is a big yuck. Your desktop probably looks like your room.
The desktop is like the inbox of files, inbox-zero it and it's a tidy place to keep things in focus until they're sorted and filed away or deleted.
Right. Why have an easy to locate area to quickly access temporary files, amiright?
Not every temp file is downloaded.
If a cluttered desktop is a sign of a cluttered mind, what does an empty one signify?
Nan-in served tea. He poured his visitor's cup full, and then kept on pouring.
The visitor watched the overflow until he no longer could restrain himself, "it is overfull, no more will go in!".
"Like this cup," Nan-in said, "your desktop is full of documents and shortcuts. How can I show you Zen unless you first empty your cup?"
Zen
I alternate between a cluttered and empty desktop.
Ride the waves
Can confirm.
What is "your room"? Which room?
The padded one.
That's my comfort room
take it back
No
I'd be happy if those apps were asking to save to Documents like in the screenshot. But alas, reality is much more cruel. They always want to save to some vague OneDrive location, and won't even show you the local file browser without extra steps.
If yOU dOn'T uSe oNEdrIvE iT is IMpOssiBle to AuTO sAve! The technology just doesn't exist to save on a timer without involving the cloud!
F12
Documents, Desktop and Picture folders are just moved from the user folder into the user folder\OneDrive folder.
Other than that it work exactly the same.
OneDrive also always has a local folder. Usually in your user folder.
You can blame a lot on OneDrive, but this isn't one of them.
I don't want any of my files uploaded to OneDrive; therefore I don't want to save them in the OneDrive folder. I have other folders where I'd like to save my files instead.
So the behaviour I described is a persistent annoyance for me; despite you telling me it isn't a problem.
I don't mind OneDrive sync, I like it honestly.
What I absolutely do not want, is my Desktop on One Drive. For starters, its often a scratch place. I don't want it instantly pushing 6GB of photos I just pulled off my camera's memory card to the cloud before I can sorr them.
You see, I have OneDrive disabled and set to not sync.
It still wants me to save to a OneDrive directory, simply because I'm signed into my Microsoft account.
Microsoft and application developers treat the Documents folder like a total dumping ground for whatever random nonsense they can dream up. No wonder people look elsewhere. Need to store user files? Documents. A database? Documents. Giant cache files? Documents. Config? Documents. Executables? Fuck it put those in Documents too.
Why would I ever store my real documents in a folder so littered with shit that I can never find anything? It's not like the search actually works.
Also as a Linux user myself and to head off any smugness, developers do the same thing with the home directory so users end up inventing weird ways to stay organized.
I don't ever search for files/folders in explorer's browser anymore. I just use Everything and TreeSize at this point. Windows' search function is pointless.
I have my files meticulously organized in hierarchical folders that sync across all my devices through One Drive and to my NAS through One Drive.
I hate that Microsoft wants to dump everything in Documents.
Also, for SOME FUCKING REASON, my work system, wants to put everything into the root of One Drive. Like fuck please put it in Documents at least. I don't want ANYTHING in the root folder if I can avoid it, aside from maybe the occasional super special thing.
Today I used Alt+Space to open krunner, typed the name of a C script I'm working on, and it pulled up search results for the file, as well as relevant websites I visited related to that title, and in that moment I realized how much I missed out growing up with Explorer.
Saving to desktop is insane behaviour and the OP just told on herself.
Rebuttal, with a physical desk you put things you need right now on top in the open. You wouldn't grab something off the printer and put it into a drawer first, then reopen the drawer to get it out of your need it now.
The desktop is "right now" workspace. Why bother to put it into a folder whose only purpose is not to take things out of to put elsewhere? I could at least understand people who download direct to documents... but that still leaves a mess to clean up with installers and such.
Downloading to the desktop is not only sane, but more efficient.
Leaving everything on your desktop is a different conversation though.
Desktop is for empty space so when you close everything it's clean
I definitely would go ahead and put the printed document directly into a hanging file in my desk drawer if I could read/use the document without ever moving it like I can on a computer...
Somehow I'm doubting that you keep all your computer files in your download folder. You still have to move it. My way just makes it obvious it needs to be filled instead of leaving it on the junk drawer.
And the physical desk analogy still holds. Yeah you put it in a folder in the drawer, but it's the wrong one. Unless you are specifying a custom filepath for each file, in which case, carry on.
This one is correct. I always setup my browser to ask where to put each download, and then send it to the file it needs to live in. Usually have the "default" be the home folder so I can easily browse to the subsequent folder quickly. The browser doesn't just get to decide where to put stuff or it would all be a mess eventually anyway.
Rock on, you are an inspiration to us all.
I just do everything out of my file manager. I use Krusader, which has twin panes and tabs.
You reminded me of this funny tweet
I agree, but I think the tone of the joke suggests that OP is at least somewhat self-aware
I am the opposite and I absolutely hate it when I have to work on someone's laptop with cluttered desktop and folders. Mine only has a taskbar at bottom and clock widget at bottom right corner. All temporary files goes to downloads or to organised directories. What's the point of having a nice wallpaper if you can't enjoy it.
I'm the same way. I will tolerate no icons on my desktop. It's widgets or nothin'.
Now, my physical desktop, on the other hand...
You do at least have some shortcuts on your desktop, right?
Otherwise, why have a desktop?
You can open a picture if you want to look at it
Not OC, but no, that's what the taskbar is for, I use my iconless desktop as a space to drag windows around and multitask
Everything from start menu shortcuts. Much cleaner and nicer that way.
Edit: I am using KDE plasma so not the full screen start menu like in windows but the small box on bottom left with about 15 icons that I regularly use.
That's what the super key is for, you hit the super key and start typing the name of whatever it is you want and hit enter just like a phone
So, what, remember the names of all the things I could want? Also, "just like a phone"?
Yeah like on a cell phone you type the name of the app and it shows up
That's what the aecond monitor is for
Everything downloads to the desktop, that way it's in my face so I have to deal with it.
The clutter on the desktop annoys me into cleaning it up, but I'll ignore a downloads folder once I've grabbed whatever I just downloaded.
you are the first person i’ve know to also do this! it really does help
I do this too. I do not like anything on my Desktop, but I download files to there, which forces me to deal with them. Interestingly enough, my Downloads directory is a barren wasteland.
But... You can just download things to their deserved spot in the first place?? Why the extra step
Desktop is my temp space. There are files with a very limited shelf live (logs I downloaded to search something, screenshots, ...) so I have to clean them up on a regular base before my desktop becomes too crowded and I get annoyed.
A lot of stuff don't have a spot. And no, I'm not putting that meme template I will need for 5 minutes into the tmp folder, I'm not insane.
That requires effort up-front every time I click download.
I'd rather just click 'download' and let it go to an easy to find default location. The desktop means I won't just forget about it for months. It may sit there for a day or two, but it definitely won't get ignored the way a folder I rarely look at does; because the clutter right in my face annoys me into cleaning it up.
Working around/against my own procrastination.
I use downloads instead, it mainly functions as a temporary folder where anything unimportant can live and once it gets a scroll bar it all gets deleted. For the very rare things that are important I could then move them after.
How do you move a file after deletion? I need to know this black magic.
Well first off, through
GodLinux, all things are possible. You can have multiple hard links to a file, where a given hard link is deleted, but you can still manipulate the file through any other other links. Alternately, you can open a file, and while you have a valid open file descriptor, delete the file. The file descriptor is still valid until you close the file though, so you can still save (thus move) it to a new location.Windows locks files when you open them, preventing these kinds of shenanigans.
Yeah, Linux really does give you a gun and lets you point it at your foot if you want to, huh? I say this with the fondness and trepidation of someone who isn't a Linux noob, but also no pro (yet)
I would expect nothing less from a filthy outlook user
The cursed Linux alternative of this is usually putting things directly in the home folder – I used to do this until I got better. Desktop is simple to keep clean when you don't have one in your "desktop environment" by default.
Some people who've used MacOs before OSX dump everything to the root filesystem out of habit. It works just as poorly as a file management strategy as one might expect, albeit better than putting everything on the desktop. Not sure how often that happens but I've known multiple people to do that.
For some reason I hate the idea of just dropping everything in the Home folder, yet Downloads just ends up becoming exactly that anyway lol
In the documents folder. The documents folder.
no... No please...
In the pictures folder. Cmon...
oh god why....
The... The downloads folder?
: '-(
For those that don't know... This is a reference to this video. https://youtu.be/cUbIkNUFs-4?si=4kxIC8qsvdW0FVAZ
People who save files on the desktop deserve to use Windows.
I love GNOME for this. No desktop icons. Windows/super key, type the first letter or two, boom. It's so pretty.
My phone on the other hand? The first screen is nicely arranged. The second screen is just a chronological list of the apps I've downloaded, because they automatically go to desktop, and they'll clutter up my home screen if I don't have a separate sacrificial screen for them
Same. I hate desktop clutter. The horrors I've seen when I've been on someone else's PC. Random desktop documents that haven't been touched in 5 years. Why?!
Even aside from looking ugly, it's not even a good place for apps/files! If you have a window or two open, everything is obscured and you have to move windows out of the way to access your stuff.
They get a lot of shit for it, but IMO Gnome was 100% right to say "No. The desktop inevitably becomes a dumping ground and we don't want that. Your app menu is for apps and your Home folder is for files. We have very good search functionality to find what you want. No desktop icons. If you want that, install an extension."
The availability of extensions for everything is the true power of Gnome for me. They got most things right but I love being able to tweak every little detail to my exact liking
The reason I don't use Gnome is "We don't want that" Okay, and just who the fuck is 'we?'
"We" is obviously the hard-working developers who predominantly work on Gnome unpaid. The people who provide the software for free.
To be completely honest, I'm not sure how you don't know who "we" is in that context. When the devs of a project say "we", who do you think they're referring to, the Jackson 5?
Literally every project makes decisions on what their vision is and enacts it. Gnome is no different.
If you don't like a piece of software, don't use it. Nobody is forcing you to use it.
Frankly, you sound entitled. They aren't obliged to make their project to the way you want it. Especially not when you're getting it for free. Entitlement like that is the biggest cancer in the FOSS community, IMO.
Hmm, GNOME pays developers. There's a team of full time employees steering GNOME, and staff. Sure they are a non-profit, but it's a bit romanticizing to claim that they are doing all that work for free. I don't think it is very nice or productive to call people names and gatekeeping FOSS this way. There's such a thing as customization. It's fine that GNOME is very opinionated (everyone accepts that they are and the project lead has said so time and time again that user choice is not part of their focus). But, at the same time, it's not their project, there's a complex governance structure that involves the community. It's contradictory to speak this way about a component of a Linux distro. Linux is philosophically underlined by freedom of choice and personal customization, and it's inappropriate to insult people for wanting some more of that.
No, no, no, no.
Some developers do some paid work. The vast majority is unpaid. I'm not sure where you heard that, but that information is incorrect.
And I never said they did all of the work for free, I said predominantly. Same goes for other projects.
Please don't try to twist my words, I feel I was very clear with them.
Yes, it is their project. They own it. It's theirs. They are the developers.
And Gnome doesn't go against any of that. You are free to not use it. They aren't forcing you. You are free to customise it. They aren't stopping you.
Please stop acting so entitled. This is software they are providing for free, the bulk of the work being unpaid. They don't have to do free work for your specific needs if they don't want to. It's their project.
I never insulted you. If my words hurt, then I'm sorry, my intention is not to hurt you.
I'm just trying to steer you away from the path you're on of thinking you're entitled to XYZ and some predominantly unpaid devs have to cater to your whims. They do not. It's their project, not yours, and they rightly call the shots.
Sure, all those things could be argued to some degree or another. Just don't call people cancer. Throwing insults devalues your argument.
I never called you cancer, or insulted you.
See:
I said feeling like the devs owe you something is entitlement, which is a cancer to the FOSS world. You aren't owed anything, and neither am I.
Nowhere did I say you were cancer, unless you happen to proudly identify as an extremely entitled person.
Like I said, sorry if my words hurt you, but you aren't entitled to have the devs carer to you specifically. The project is theirs and if you don't like it, fork it or use something else. That's what FOSS is all about.
Why do you think unpaid devs should have to do as you say?
This is actually the one thing I hate about GNOME. I keep a nearly fully empty desktop but I like having one as sort of a staging ground for temp files. I like just being able to chuck a file there and then drag it into another program, all without having nautilus open
Yeah, desktop as the temp location is great for a few reasons.
I can easily see what is in the queue.
It reminds me to do something about it.
I can rearrange the dozen or so icons for fun when I am having trouble picking what to do. Kind of like inventory management in an rpg.
When I hit about 15 it prompts me to clear the list by either finishing them or putting them all away so I can start again with a clear screen.
Iirc, there's an extension to allow for desktop icons? I may be misremembering, it might be a setting somewhere. Either way, I'm sure you can do it.
Oh yeah there is, it comes with Ubuntu. It's a bit janky compared to the former native implementation though :(.
This is exactly how I use KDE, but without the GNOME look, which I am not a fan of. You don't even need to hit meta first in KDE, you can just start typing if you have krunner on.
Why not disable apps going to your homescreen instead?
Windows works the same way, you just hit the windows key and start typing and you hit enter, made switching to popos much easier because I use it exactly the same way I do with my windows work laptop
Also You should check out kiss launcher for phone, just start typing and whatever app you want shows up, also has a history list that tries to have apps you use frequently at specific times. Although after using kiss for a few years now whenever I have to use someone's phone it makes it really hard, seeing all those screens with icons like how can you find anything
People who use desktop as your unsorted downloads folder, who hurt you?
I use the desktop as a very temporary folder. Because I'll be annoyed by having stuff on there and will delete them as soon as I don't need them any more.
My downloads folder has random installers from 2021.
As god intended (sorted by downloaded date)
Why would I hide downloads in the downloads folder?
Kidding. I use downloads for downloads.
Desktop is for WIP project files.
These days, replace "Documents" and "Downloads" with "the root folder of OneDrive".
Yeah, that is so fucking annoying. I never save anything there, yet it absolutely always suggests that. Fucking microsoft.
This drives me mad. I work on multiple projects, how the fuck can I organise things of its all in one folder! The interface to select a different folder is like 3 clicks away too.
I think she means OneDrive.
Its a black hole. You just drop files in there and never open them again.
Soooo true! I can’t believe how much they’ve made the damn computer fight you on this!
This is some Window level joke. BTW, I put my configs in home directory.
I find it hard to believe that Lauren, who saves everything to the Desktop, is dabbling with Office config files.
You probably keep the files she's referring to in your Documents, Downloads, etc. folder within your home directory too.
Holy Shit.
You monster! They belong in ~/.config
On Android it's similar... On some apps(all?) you can't save to the downloads folder. Like WTF? Downloads is where temp stuff goes you damn green buffoon!
As a long time Android user, this comment is not aligned with my experience at all
Well, has been like this on Android 10, 14 and now I'm on 15 so idk. Also searched online and Google says it's a "security feature".
Never seen this. Seems like you selected the option to only allow this app to save to specific folders?
I used the desktop all the time when I was on Windows. When I moved to Linux fulltime, KDE wouldn't let you save to desktop. Eventually I figured out how to fix that, but by that time I had the habit broken. Thankfully i never reverted and my shit is generally organized because of it.
Story time.
I was helping someone at work the other day....
As part of my usual process, I minimized most of what the person was using, because I dgaf what users are actually doing on their computers. I'm only interested in getting the "problem" that they're complaining about, solved, so I can go home.
When I finished minimizing everything, I shit you not, this person had two full screens of icons on their desktop. I couldn't help but blurt out "that's a lot of icons" they went on to describe how they use their desktop as a dumping ground and they clear the whole thing every few months.
Since I couldn't give a single shit about what they do with their computer, I said something to the effect of "alright", fixed the unrelated "problem" they had and moved on.
I do the same thing, but mostly because I develop Doom mods for fun and it's just an easy place to dump sprites and audio files. I can drag a file directly from my desktop to the modding program I use, and then just clean up once I'm finished working on what I'm working on. Otherwise my desktop just has a few shortcuts.
I don't get how this is easier than just having an explorer window open to a folder with the files where the exposed desktop would be.
But hey, you do you. I'm not about to say that you can't use your PC like this. I'm not your manager, and you can do what you want.
Whether I "get" it or not is irrelevant.
Id just like to add that whoever started sending game files to the hidden part of documents should be shot. How hard is it to just make a Games folder and a Games Save folder?
Steam games need to store save files in the same library location as the game, using a sub folder that maps to the steam account name. Stop filling up the app data folder for the operating system account that is running steam. My C drive is full, go away.
Also, Windows doesn't allow writing to files to in Program folders... So let's put everything that needs RAM into that directory! But not the save files, those are hidden 7 layes deep in MyAss/hidden/hidden/almost there/hidden/docs/maybe save files.
My steam games are all installed on an external SSD so I can put those distractions out of reach. I can't imagine ever going back.
You mean /Users/username/AppData? The folder where all applications store their user-specific data?
I don't mind the location; but it's annoying being hidden by default. Trying to direct people to it can be a pain sometimes.
(though 'run' > '%appdata%' usually works)
Hurrdurr aCHully
Isn't the desktop just a place for displaying a picture? People have icons there?
The top of your desk is exactly where you want the document that you will need in a minute to go. Its what bosses demanded since before modern computing
If that is not the intended usecase, then what is?
In linux i am saving stuff in a related project folder which may aswell be that projects own desktop.
This one guy at work has 3 layers of desktop icons. LAYERS. I don't know how he manages.
L- layers??
icons on icons on icons as there is no blank space left.
On Windows? AFAIK Windows eventually just gives you a "no space on desktop" popup... Never seen any layering.
Yep. Dealt with that mess today.
"Sir, please. I'm begging you. Use a folder. Just one single folder."
"THOG NO LIKE COMPUTER! THOG SAVE TO DESKTOP!!!"
This is why you people aren't allowed access to printers anymore.
It's not because people kept printing their emails 40" wide on the plotter? TIL.
Idgaf as long as it isn't onedrive.
OneDrive can be configured to automatically back up your desktop. So the desktop might be OneDrive
True and that's one of the reasons I quit Windows altogether. Linux doesn't have this kind of bs.
I didn't think that any Windows related software was actually aware that the 'Documents' folder is supposed to be for documents. Because my 'Documents' folder gets used as a dumping ground for any old program to drop their shit in. Even though there's literally dedicated folders for app data and saved games.
Personally I make my own 'Home' folder with my own pictures, movies, documents etc. folders because whether it's Windows, Linux or Android, the concept of having your own user folder for your own things is a joke because developers don't respect that and just dump their files anywhere.
I don't use the Documents folder because of that reason, but it's still weird to me that that doesn't happen on Linux, so my Documents folder is mostly empty there
Yeah, documents itself isn't bad but you still end up with a bunch of stuff just being chucked into the root of your user folder, despite the fact that folders like '.config' exist. Personally, I like my 'home' space to be just my files, things that I've put there myself, without random programs making new folders and leaving dotfiles lying around. I'm a bit of a neat freak on my pc, way more than in real life. Personally, /home is just another /etc for me. My shit goes elsewhere.
I actually really like this and when I reconfigure my laptop I might implement the same thing
Yeah Documents is basically default for .local config save data trash for any and all programs and games, which is a bummer. I'd like to use it for documents lol.
All IT support immediately revoked.
If the "shopping trolley test" determines good versus evil, then where you save your files determines lawful vs chaotic.
Lawful: specific files in specific places
Neutral: everything goes in downloads
Chaotic: everything goes on desktop
Lawful Good - Saved in specific places
Lawful Evil - Saved in recycle bin
Neutral Good - Saved in downloads
Neutral Evil - Saved in downloads or documents but you're not sure which one
Chaotic Good - Everything goes on desktop
Chaotic Evil - Everything goes into a random location
New alignment: Chaotic Lawful: I deleted my desktop folder to prevent me from cluttering the desktop
Lawful Neutral: Saved in specific places, one of which is the desktop.
🤮
Right click>view>uncheck show desktop icons
Don't forget to put a screenshot of the old desktop as a wallpaper for an epic prank!
Back when I still used Windows, this was step #1 for every desktop environment.
OneDrive documents --> PC documents --> desktop
why must I press so many buttons to get it where I want :/
Windows 95 was easier to use simply because of saving everything to the desktop. When Windows 98 tried to introduce "My Documents" i was like nope and still saved everything to the desktop.
I found this a few months ago and after adapting it to my needs I now have my files heavily organized (makes backups much easier).
https://github.com/roboyoshi/datacurator-filetree
What exactly is the app? The GitHub page isn't the most descriptive. How does it help you with backups?
It's not an app, it's actually a very simple repo containing folders and readmes.
It's just a folder structure, which you can use on your system. Unzip the file and slowly fill the folders with your files. I had to create(or maybe even rename/delete) some folders to adapt it to my needs. It took me around 20days during summer to organize around 2-3tb of my laptop and my external disk.
It was a kinda painful manual process, but I think it was really worth it, now things are well organized, I detected and removed hunderds of GB of unecessary/duplicate/unwanted files, it's easier to navigate now, the structure is cleaner and syncing a big part of my drive is relatively easy now. There some files, like installed programs and their data which are in predefined paths and I didnt move those, so these were left out. Also some games save their data in Documents, so I symlinked their data in documents. And there's the defauly downloads folder which is now more of a temporary folder for stuff I download before I move them or delete them.
There is not exactly a standard for how to orginize your files, but this repo is a very good start:)
Edit: I think organizing my files was my first step on the list in order to transition to linux, it would otherwise make it harder to properly backup and sync a mess of files gathering up for years. To sync my files to my external drive I just had to backup only ~10folders and one of which was the "root" (the one in the repo as you can see) which contained about 90% of my files. Much easier, much faster.
Thanks. Makes sense. I'll give it a look.
Taking a look now. This seems largely pretty smart. I am curious though, how much of the folder structure here felt relevant for you? For me I'm thinking it's ~50%. I agree with you though, that it's a good starting point. I was working on something similar in a text file a while back but never finished. Turns out, organization is pretty hard when you have collected data for 25 years.
Ok, umm, I sent a lengthy response with screenshots and a dirlist to see, somehow it didnt get sent. I'll send it again later, but it will probably take me 4hours, gonna be busy for a little while😅
(To answer your question, this structure holds around 96% of my user data.)
Oh, dang. I appreciate that effort. Sorry that it went into the void!
Ok, so, it takes about 96% of the data in the home partition. Here are some screenshots of Qdirstat scans of my laptop's 1tb ssd:
~/:~/root/:Many of the files here are flac files and some ancient movies I have. 😄
Also, this is a (censored) directory list of top 3 levels of the
rootstructure (I have put some unecessary dirs inObsolete-dirsinstead of deleting them and many dirs here are either empty or near-empty, like the book categories or the chart dirs):::: spoiler root
:::
Btw, I have separate root, home and boot partitons on my nixos install, here's the root partition:
/:Lastly, the external hdd I have isn't that organized, because many of the backup folder aren't inside the root folder. I think putting them inside the /root/backup/ path would be the proper way, but this would probably break my backup workflow and mess with a script I have to sync my phone. I might do it one time:)
Thank you so much for this! You've given me a lot of ideas. Last question, I think you mentioned symlinking -- can you say more about how you are using symlinks? (I am familiar with the concept but maybe haven't used them how you have for a purpose like this)
Hehe, glad I helped:)
I havan't yet used a lot of symlinking, but some of the stuff I do is:
If you can see the dirlist, in
~/root/Imports-Exports/BottlesI have the bottles dir which contains 2 subdirs,Bottles-AppsandBottles-Games. They are symlinks, pointing to bottles of apps (at~/root/Software/Applications/Linux/Bottles-Apps) and games (at~/root/Games/Video/Computer/linux/Bottles-Games) respectively (bottles are wine prefixes that the app "Bottles" creates to run windows programs).This one is again about windows games. I have the program files and data in 2 separate folder under
~/root/Games/Video/Computer/windows/GameX(whereGameXrepresents a given game) and I symlink them inside the respective bottle dirs (2 of the games I have use the defaultDocumentsdir for saving the game data and because I dont have bottles isolated from the rest of the userspace, I symlinked the game data in~/Documents).Because nixos uses symlinks for its app shortcuts, simply dragging app icons on the desktop doesnt work (it creates symlinks to the version of the app at this time). Thus, I have to go to nixos's folder with shortcuts to my apps (which gets updated after update) and symlink each shortcut to my desktop.
Another use for symlinks is to keep my dotfiles git versioned and sycned with codeberg, for which I'll have to use gnu stow, but I still haven't done this (my git knowledges are veery limited).
You can do fun stuff, just be careful when copying/deleting/syncing symlinks, not to mess up anything (app tend to warn you if you want to follow the symlink (which affects the targeted file instead of the symlink) or not). They help to keep things tidy, but can get messy with improper use:)
Gotcha. Yeah I saw those
->indicators right after sending you that question. I just installedtreelocally -- it is nice! I keep forgetting about that one. I'm gonna take all this as inspiration and come up with a better system. I currently have a server/desktop with my whole entire data archive and a laptop that will have some backup-worthy files, I'd like to be able to easily back them both up locally and to the cloud.I think getting better organized like you did first is the right move. I have a system in place for the desktop machine that works fairly well, but buying this new laptop threw a wrench into that system because I'd like to reuse it in both contexts but it's currently not equipped to do that. I'll figure it out :) But like you said, being organized helps efforts like that (among many others!)
Drag has one thing on the desktop.
Space Cadet Pinball.
The only thing one really needs.
Tf...no...
Everything is saved to the Syncthing folder. I make sure there is a shortcut to it in the sidebar. From there, it gets placed in the proper folder inside of that.
My documents folder had 0 weeks until a few weeks ago. Everything in custom subfolders of home
Kde gives me the option to keep my desktop folder, or any other folder, or files linked to that specific activity as my Desktop.