Trigger warning - This Epstein stuff is making me sick...
I have spent hours looking through the files and some of the stories are absolutely disgusting. I am having such a hard time because so many citizens don't even know how awful they get and they aren't all even fully released... I am close to feeling like we need pitchforks, torches and shovels if this justice system won't actually do anything... He had a ranch where a witness wrote in saying there are TWO bodies located on the property and they haven't even reported that in the media. I'll link that one below too. It's just so... Horrible. We can't just pretend this doesn't exist... but idk what happens next for the United States and the world. It's not something a country just moves on from.
https://www.justice.gov/epstein/files/DataSet%209/EFTA00078198.pdf
https://www.justice.gov/epstein/files/DataSet%209/EFTA01249507.pdf
Remember, the FBI found NOTHING to even start looking into an investigation.
Zero reasons.
If this brings the western world down then good. Whatever happens, we cannot ignore it. This is what wealth in capitalists nations degenerates into.
well some people are resigning due to being named in the files except the people in the USA. i dont put much hope for USA, but other countries might be able to do it.
Because non capitalist, non Western nations don't do anything like this, right? Junko Furata, African child soldiers, South Asian sex trafficking rings, Khmer Rouge....need we go on?
I'm fucken sorry, who has the only known example of a global paedophile ring implicating nearly all of its leaders? This is fucking unprecendented. No need to take it personally unless you are a capitalist.
Most organized crime in every nation practices sex trafficking, rape, prostitution and slavery of one kind or another. From the Yakuza to the Mexican cartels. It is unprecedented, it's simply very visible. If you think Putin and his oligarchs or the Saudi royals, for example, don't have similar organized immorality, then you're naive. Nevermind past eras or horrors like imperial Japan, who stabbed babies in the womb, the Mongols whose torture and rape was historically prolific, the Aztecs human sacrifices, the list goes on and on. Oh and the world wide Catholic Church? The most prolific child sex abusers in known history?
None of those are global, and if the saudis are anywhere they're probably also in the files which would just make that part of the same capitalist carnal club. I don't see President Xi, or many non-US aligned leaders in here. Its not you or I, why are you so offended?
Competing networks, territorial splits. It's visible in the files that this is a global thing and we see only the tip of an iceberg with one example group
Nope, it’s very clear in the files they hated Xi, Castro and communism and spoke of them as explicit deterrents to their operations.
They had projects with Castro. Something in the seas. Asia is operated by a different network
I wonder what came first, the alignment of the current axes of power, or the elite pedophile gang rings that operate within them.
The pedophilia seems to be a dually motivated method to create suffering and political blackmail currency. In older times blood/virgin sacrifices etc haven't needed the latter
The Catholic Church and organized crime are both global...if you don't even know that, why am I bothering with you?
Saudis are perfectly capable of maintaining their own network as they do their systems of slavery. Epstein was certainly not the only network like this, either.
You just sound like an anti west troll, spreading propaganda.
You sound like a westoid troll, "our government is doing it so can you imagine what the rest of the world is doing!? Omg!"
It's just history. Seems you're having a hard time that it doesn't match your desire to see the west as uniquely horrible.
Good points. However a big difference here is that this organized debauchery and perversions is weaponized to blackmail the most powerful countries in the world into supporting fascists in a small little country to do unspeakable things, that is also exporting that fascism to those home countries.
So the blackmail angle, to ultimately destroy the liberal democracies that these countries are built on, makes it a little different.
Blackmail definitely isn't unique to this situation. The US has specific provisions for conflicts of interest to safeguard against this kind of blackmail because they know it happens. MAGA simply ignore it all and was allowed to. Power finds a way and blackmail is as old as politics.
I am sure it's not unique, do we have any more historical examples we can point to though? All I have is the borgia pope.
Examples of blackmail in politics? Seriously?
The files do mention Putin, as being a deterrent to their operations in Russia. And they hated Xi and Castro. Seems like SOME leaders and powerful people are not sex trafficking pedos 🤷♂️
Or they prevented competition. Their resistance is not necessarily a sign of being better. Putin's soldiers in Ukraine are doing horrific things, his KGB does horrific things, Russian Mercs in Africa do horrific things. Well never know the exact details so there's no way to know.
You say that with no evidence of anything. Dude do you actually think Russia is more advanced than the US in its intelligence? Do you think Putin would be able to hide a network like this from the CIA, who wouldn’t use it against him? You’re just pulling stuff out of your ass, motivated entirely by russiophobia.
That's....an interesting way to spin it.
Of criminals.
That's... Also bad? Why are you bringing that up?
Because the claim seemed to be that the west, and capitalism, is somehow unique in its capacity for doing very shitty things. It is not. Horribleness is a human thing found everywhere humans are and is not caused by capitalism or Western societies.
Yes it’s terrifying, and so is that font you use
lol I appreciate the font roast. I love my font but I do respect others hate for it.
I love your font.
Same, that typeface is amazing.
It was a bit of light in the dark 💕
❤️justice.gov❤️/epstien🥰/files 🌈🤭
This isn't just about America, or MAGA, or even Trump. I always understood that this was an international enterprise, but as I read this stuff, I'm realizing that it was bigger and uglier than my worst imaginings.
I just read about a wealthy guy in a Detroit in the 70s who ran an Epstein-like operation on an island he purchased in one of the Great Lakes. He built a giant mansion on it, and started hosting underage sex parties for wealthy men. The article suggested that he might have been an inspiration for Epstein.
The point is that these people have always been here, and now that Epstein is gone, someone else will be taking his place. Nobody understands the scope of Epstein's business better than his best friend Trump, who also recognizes how lucrative it is, and he is psychological incapable of resisting those riches.
He also has easy access to plenty of sex products. He has enormous detainment centers full or poorly documented children, separated from their families, lawyers, or anyone else who might care about them. They could be disappeared for a long time before someone notices, if ever. I'm sure we'll find that the prettiest ones, of both sexes, are being scheduled for transfer...somewhere.
Putin has also kidnapped thousands of Ukrainian children, another source for East European girls, for those who aren't turned on by brown children.
You can bet that someone is rebuilding an international child sex operation somewhere, and I'm betting that Trump is in on it.
It gets even worse when you realize that the reason why these people don't want social programs is because they need poor, vulnerable kids to prey on. They managed to convince people to literally sacrifice their children, albeit quite indirectly.
Makes you think about USAID...and wtf DOGE may have destroyed there. DOGE's whole point was to burn as much evidence as fast as possible. Wonder how many of those 125+ year old SSI beneficiaries managed to show up to vote in 2024.
Good observation. I just saw another comment that said they deliberately expose kids to violent content younger and younger, so they'll grow up to be good fighting and occupying forces.
When AI/Robotics leads to a 50% unemployment rate (what do you think is the objective of the corporate giddiness of AI? They can't wait to replace as many profit sucking employees as possible) the military is going to be one of the few income-producing employment paths left. Might as well start their "training" young, with lots of violent entertainment.
Do you have more information about the thing you describe around Detroit?
https://lemmy.world/post/43129185
That's the one. Fascinating story.
You can bet it doesn't need to be rebuilt because it never stopped and Epstein was just part of an international ring that involved people from all kinds of positions of authority. In my city alone there were law enforcement , boy scout leaders, and Catholic priests all enabling each other and helping to cover up their crimes while flying people in from all over the world to do this fucked up shit.
Thats one city. Imagine that kind of fucked up shit has been happening all over the world for decades or maybe even centuries. No way in hell it ever stopped because Epstein was indisposed.
You know that plot in the original true detective about the Louisiana pedophile murder ring? It turns out that was almost certainly based on real stories.
I will say that it's fucking insane to think about the fact that Trump and all of his oligarch friends have now legalized kidnapping and trafficking people thanks to ICE/DHS. The implications of what they're almost certainly continuing to do out in the open have got to be pretty obvious, right?
Kidnapping so many people that you can just get away with just losing track of them? Why wouldn't they just keep doing the same shit they've always done?
Small correction, Epstein has been replaced for years, they're not "out of business".
Business is BOOMING.
we are unaware of the details, as we only get to know decades after the fact, if at all...
Check out the franklin scandal from the 80s. It might be the same CIA ring as Epstein.
and these are the people Iranian diaspora are begging to drop bombs on Iran. I bet their ancestors would be rolling in their graves because of the disgrace some of these diaspora Iranians have become.
Also, not sure if you've already read this, but I just stumbled across this book connecting the Michigan cases with the cases in my city, as well as cases involving operations in Chicago and California. Fucking wild.
I'm really glad I saw your comment bc otherwise I never would have really made the connection when Fox Island was mentioned.
https://archive.org/details/simon-dovey-eye-of-the-chickenhawk-thehotstar-2023
The scary part, is now that Epstein is gone, it’s all just happening somewhere else.
I imagine he was one of many as well, and most of them probably aren't dumb enough to fill their inbox with evidence.
Now we know why there are so many missing kids every year... Messed up
its not in thier best interest to eliminate ghislaine now, that would just make things worst, whichis why they are keeping her alive.
Maxwell 100 percent has dirt that would be released on her death, and they can't get to whomever may be holding it. Epstein thought he had that too I'm sure, but Israeli intelligence betrayed him.
This is what I don't get when folk online treat girls under 18 of any age as the same thing. A full grown person who's a 30 something adult being with a 17 year old is exploitative, controlling and weird.
Being with an 8 year old is monstrous and, frankly, worthy of the death penalty.
I'm not excusing the first, but do people really see no difference? If you need a legal line in the sand to determine if it's either totally fine or straight to the guillotine then maybe there's something wrong with you.
Fuck, man, doing this to an adult is heinous. Doing it to a child? I'm not typically a violent person. But I'd kill them.
Same.
Both deserve jail time, and the only people who really care that much are usually from the former group distancing themselves from the latter.
Both are fucking gross. I don't care who's more evil, I both want them shot into the sun. Second one just might deserve a slower ride so they feel the burn a bit more.
Pedophilia is the attraction to children younger than 12-10 to around 3, this is what was occurring mainly within that island. Of course, there where women within their teens and adults which don't technically qualify as pedophilia but are referred to it either way - which is incorrect.
Of course, pedophilia according to dsm5 on itself is listed as a mental disorder, nepophilia is also included. However, it is to say, attraction to those above 13 is not considered as a mental disorder. It also helps to know, that biologically such individuals are closer to adults than children, so it goes in hand with your last paragraph.
It is the sake that the legal line is essentially an "anchor" point, especially since we still believe in hoaxes which are related to growth and maturity. As such this incorrect view is projected to everyone even if the facts are different to what people expect.
In essence, the whole premise overall seems to be fueled by misinformation which is causing the whole "under 18" group to appear as one and the same, no matter the age. This is a major problem I agree, and the misuse of the word pedophilia tells a big story about it.
The reason you don't hear more people explaining the difference between being a pedophile and being an ephibophile is that it makes you look like a pedophile.
Case in point.
there's a joke that goes technically there are 3-4 different words for what the layman calls pedophilia, but the only people who know the difference are psychiatrists and pedophiles
That is true, it is the case for all minor attractions. Within the current situation, the most prominent issue is that information is not factually based and definitions are skewed. Like the original commenter had said, this introduces ambiguity.
I swear to god if fedi starts defending "ephebophilia" as if its meaningfully different enough to matter I'm going to start cutting dicks off lmao.
You're missing the point here. This isn't about defending whatever you seem to disagree on. Its the fact that you seem to think critical analysis is meaningless and "indifferent". The first commenter had this message instilled, yet you are correlating this to things which where not even mentioned.
In respect to the post itself, then yes the age designation is meaningless as you cannot redefine rape and abuse. It is pretty clear that this comment thread was for a specific issue.
Why should it matter to society what the difference between the two is, if the better of the two is still bad enough that they should be hung by their toenails and beaten to death with a sack of hammers?
After a certain amount of bad, there's not much you can do to punish it.
What reason do we have to discuss the difference, unless you think a 30 year old fucking a 17 year old is redeemable?
To answer your question, firstly consider the point of what is misinformation. Because this isn't about the right or wrongs, but the factualities of science and countering misinformation. The function of this thread was to analyse the differences between different stages of age groups which are considered minors. This was highlighted by the root op.
Redirecting the question to you, why do you think it is reasonable to be going off topic?
It is clear the overall aim here is to reinforce the actualities. By introducing rhetorical questions such as "Why should it matter to society what the difference between the two is" it is an attack on education as a whole. Highlighting the differences and defining facts is the whole foundation of society. Of course, this isn't ethics class, it is biology and psychology.
This is a comment chain in a post about the Epstein files in which the top comment in the chain is about a 30 year old fucking someone in their late teens.
Its entirely on topic, fuck off with your bad faith arguments.
This isn't ethics class, or biology class, or sociology class...
Its a comment section about billionaire kiddy fuckers not getting the justice they deserve. Are you sure you're in the right place?
This is a segment of the root op. This was the general scope of this. So I'll advise you to quit with the straw men arguments and reread the whole passage.
an 18 dating a 16 is one thing, and whatever justification can be used then is not applicable to a 30yo dating a 16 yo, let alone any younger... and any argument made by those pedos deserves no response besides putting them on a list
God Damned, that is pure fucking evil. Like, I can't even... Just literal evil.
Why is this man's faces redacted.
?
Wtf. Show us his face.
It's probably trump.
Isn't his name in the illegally-redacted files almost as much as Epstein's?
We passed that point a while ago
Entirely unrelated, does anyone know how much a cheap woodchipper goes for? It's for landscaping
https://www.woodsplitterdirect.com/collections/wood-chippers
Funny enough, a big tree fell on my property a little while back and I wanted to mulch it all for the garden, so I did some research. I was mostly looking at rentals, which were about $500/day for the ones that could handle thick branches.
I wanna say buying was like 10× that for the cheaper ones, but that was for the smaller models more suitable for middle sized branches, but then I would've had to use a chainsaw to break up the thicker chunks.
I wound up cutting it into logs and they're still sitting there, I should probably look into it again and actually get around to it.
130 quid will get you something that can chomp something 45mm in diameter. For something that is more size-agnostic, you're talking closer to a grand
There should not exist a class of people with such unaccountable power that they can do these things and get away with it.
This isn't just about Epstein, Trump and all the other child rapists on those files (although they should definitely go to prison); it's about the system that makes this possible, and puts the worst possible people in a position to do this and get away with it.
We were warned about greed, money, and corruption. This is the result of us ignoring the problem until it festers and turns into an infection that will eventually kill us. We cannot have a civilized society with these kind of wealth gaps while allowing money in politics.
Luigi 'em all
It's crazy that we are living in a surveillance state and it isn't even good for bringing the worst people to justice, they know it's happening and let it happen while the monsters chat about it on fucking gmail while the rest of us think about being watched and worry about getting in trouble for every minor little thing.
Of course, that's exactly the point of a surveillance state. It's purpose is total control of the general population and complete freedom from consequences for the wealthy elite. Any rhetoric about it keeping us safe is pure propaganda. People knew this a long time ago, that's why we have the 4th amendment and other privacy laws.
Anything less than death is far too little for these sick fucks.
Swift and quickly, this needs to end and be left in the past.
too easy of an out
I'm fine with an easy out.
I don't need them to think about their actions. I don't need them to stew and marinate in their guilt. I certainly don't need them to have avenues to still exert influence.
They need to die, anything else is a distraction.
This is my position. Just kill them and move on, we need to make humanity better. There are people who need rescue and care.
Mind, we should keep monsters like Maxwell alive for awhile...so that we can get information about where the innocent have been trafficked. One entire year for all the actionable information that Maxwell and company are willing to trade. No bargaining, nor exceptions, just a delayed execution after the plea deal is struck. Without the deal, immediate execution after a brief trial.
...I am hoping that there are enough little black books, that delayed justice isn't needed to save the innocent.
I hear ya , they're eating our food and breathing our air and it seems they don't feel remorse or shame.
💥🔨
Torturing the torturers won't fix anything.
We should torture a few. As an example. But otherwise yes, quick executions.
not talking about torture.
lock them up. let them only breathe bar-filtered air for the rest of their life
How come? Lots of christians are afraid of hell
And, notably, it doesn't seem to lower crime rates.
Only if you reject a large body of research on that matter conducted by hummanity over centuries. Ie. impaling seems a reasonable compromise between unpoetic justice and a nod the conservative traditional aproach.
Epstein could very well still be alive
That's what I'm saying. We tried that whole jail shit and things got fucky. We had/have enough evidence to get his contacts. Jeffrey Epstein Did Not Kill Himself.
Pole hangings
What else are liberals going to need to realize that there is no reform for this sytem? I couldn't fabricate something that so obviously demonstrates that this system is built to the benefit of the wealthiest through the brutalization of everyone else.
No bro please just vote for Newsom this one time bro let the billionaires just do a little more child raping so that way I won't need to move away for another couple years please
Atm, anything in the Files critical of the current Ukrainian leadership or that connect Epstein to human trafficking in or through Ukraine is getting blasted as "Russian Propaganda". So it looks like we're back to the old Hillary Clinton game of insisting "Stupid Internet conspiracy theories are making us lose".
They believe they're financially comfortable and not in any danger as long as they only make sad noises and wring their hands about "the issues we face" and "problems that need to be fixed". They still rely on being a cog in the system to eat, so they can't really bring themselves to bite the hand just yet.
They won't get angry until they realize it's their retirement, lives, and children at risk. Even then, they'll rationalize a lack of action due to "powerlessness", conveniently forgetting that the first step is organization, not leaping onto action as an individual and getting steamrolled.
Wasn't a genuine question, more of an expression of exacerbation. However, I think this is a stance that demonstrates a less actionable understanding of liberals.
It's true that many have a material interset in the maintenance of capitalist systems -- and all the violence that is necessary for them to exist whether they acknowledge that openly or not -- but you're framing it moralistically as though these people also choose to both be dependent on that system, and be neglected the knowledge and skills necessary to recognize necessary action. I do understand the pessimism deeply, as my experience has taught me that many do choose to remain in ignorance when the opportunity is given; for a number of reasons, but entitled petulance is certainly a factor. If you listen to workers though, you'll notice they do understand that the issue is systemic and not effectively met by individual action. As you said, recognizing what that systemic failure is, who it serves and why, and how to organize in opposition to it are skills that require years of knowledge building to develop. Even further, fascist disinformation campaigns are made more effective by this ignorance when they validate internalized setter-colonial values which these people obviously don't know to be fascistic in the first place. There's nothing convenient about being purposefully disempowered, and no shame in the inability to sacrifice the wellbeing of your dependents to participate in action (or "bite the hand") if you've never been taught about organization.
When you say this, I can't help but wonder if you've seen firsthand the immense levels of anxiety in working-class, blue-collar families as the failures of this system become undeniable and they are indeed unable to understand exactly what to do about it. They don't need the system to completely fall apart to become motivated, many have felt insecure their entire lives and suffered the everpresent threat of homelessness or disability inflicted on them and their families. Those same people have been receptive to systemic change for a long time, and you're right, they are victims of a system that holds their security hostage behind compliance. Maybe if you've only lived in an affluent suburb, it's easier to entertain the idea that people only ever choose inaction, but I'm afraid this thinking is more limiting than the catharsis is worth. I've found it better to meet them with empathy and focus on language building or talking points that emphasize the insecurity of this system that they intuitively know to be true, and educate them on different risk levels of action. There isn't a threshold where people like that will suddenly be receptive to systemic change, they've wanted it their whole lives and we're seeing the consequences of their desire in the success of populist fascist rhetoric in this moment.
I'm part of one of those families. I've lived among them my whole life. It's not a moral judgement, just an observation on human behavior. And I was talking about those in the suburbs more than my own neighborhood.
Then you do get it to a degree, hopefully. This is moralistic though, the assertion that this reflects some natural human behaviour is as well. Suburbs are also not only home to the affluent, suburban sprawl has made them affordable and effective sites of working-poor isolation and precarity exactly because they have hindered the construction of high-density housing and are so difficult to survive in without a reliable flow of cash. If you've lived in communities of factory workers who, while tenuously secure, remember the 2008 Recession sharply, then you know what I mean when I say that there are liberals who understand that foundational systemic change is needed but do not have the time or energy to learn what that means in like terms to what socialist and anarchist theorists or activists use.
It really is unsatisfying to lose the option of discarding people in catharsis, but that is necessary to foster empowerment of workers who only have the tools they've been given.
Look, so, I know I came across as dismissive in my first reply, but you're also coming across as really condescending. Not sure if you're aware, but if your intent is to reach out with empathy and understanding, you might want to consider that.
I get it. I've been reaching out to people for more than 30 years and watching them consistently go against their best interests for about the same amount of time. A little cynicism is natural.
I'm sure in a face to face we'd probably agree on most things, but this conversation doesn't feel productive. Thanks for taking the time to reply and good luck out there.
When are leftists going to actually do something? Like. Sure. I'd be happy under Communism, but the momentum just isn't there in America, unfortunately
Way to self-report your inactivity. I have never lived in a city in my country without multiple mutual aid organizations that took action to improve the material conditions of marginalized groups or participate in public demonstrations to platform their criticisms that were explicitly anarchist or socialist in their political orientation. I bet you have never actually taken the time to learn just how dependent the US system is on programs developed by Black Liberationist mutual aid groups, or how much of your environmental protections have resulted from indigenous and Native American resistance. Have some perspective ffs, just because you're just now hearing about these things doesn't mean they only appear in your line of sight.
No one is asking about the girls that did not make it back from the island. These criminals are lucky we are no longer in the medieval period
the point is that there is not a critical mass of people willing to risk everything to change things.
In the Medieval times it would be the same. Would the average person really want to try and storm castle against professional soldiers wearing plate armour?
Medieval Europe, a region and time period famous for its strict stance against rich old men having sex with children.
i see what you did there.
Clearly that wasn't important enough to keep in his documents. What gets buried at sea, stays at sea.
I think your font choice isn't helping. Justice.gov doesn't need a heart on the o.
Edit: I just read the picture and yeah - disgusting. If you want to make change, print out this page and send it to your congressperson
It's the font on my phone in general as it's default. I am dyslexic and some fonts help me process better. Sorry
It is a bit jarring, but your context is more than enough. Sorry you have to deal with that, no need to apologize to anyone for trying to keep your own world accessible to you.
Honestly I noticed too but I kind of like it. You should have a font that offsets how incredibly depressing everything is.
I mean, also there is that. The world is pretty depressing. The hearts in the font make me happy. I also feel like the world has lost its creativity and has become so linear. Everything is exactly the same. Sometimes I miss early internet customization. I want to know peoples personalities easier online.
Crist... whoever is responsible for this, or did this to another human being needs to be fucking shot. Not in the head, no no... but in the knee caps, shins... everywhere to make it just-as, if not more painful than the pain their victims felt.
We need to take cadaver dogs to Trumps golf courses and epsteins properties
Those poor girls...
We need way more than just pitchforks. These monsters need to feel the same type of abuse they inflicted on their victims.
reopen alcatraz, put him and the entire pedo junta on it. sell the rights to netflix, let san-Franciscans throw rotten produce at them from boats. lord of the flies, style, but this more lord of the shitflies. bondi, miller, trump, all the pervy fucks in the epstein emails talking about 9 year olds and coming to the island
the proceeds will help eliminate the national debt and fund therapy for the countless people damaged by their bullshit
aw, someone doesn't want the pedo put on an island with the other pedos.
are they afraid of ending up there too?
Yep. Its gets worse even. These animals must be euthanized to stop the spread of the rabies
Thanks for the trigger warning. That font really makes me mad.
I mentioned this. I have dyslexia and some font helps me process faster when I read and unfortunately the less straight and even the better. I also like Open Dyslexic and comic sans and I know most normal people hate them but I am not going to change what works for me to appease internet strangers. I do apologize though if it's annoying.
P.S. I also miss early internet days, when everyone customized things more. The creativity has been sucked out by corporations and government.
Makes sense and I totally understand you. I am glad you have found a way to help processing words faster and you can do with your life whatever pleases you.
I still hate the font (from a design perspective).
i think the font's pretty cute personally, happen to remember what it's called?
Universe of light
My phone has a ton of options. Honestly though, I threw away my American crap (got sick of Samsung and the same 3 options) and got a Xiaomi from Ebay. It works with some American carriers and its the best phone I have ever had. So much more customizable and has a full on Leica camera on it with real attachable lenses. Xaiomi Ultra 15
https://www.mi.com/global/product/xiaomi-15-ultra/
Changing font on Android (AOSP/Google) nowadays is not possible.
You need to root your device for something as simple as this.
...no? Go to settings, font and download one or change it to a pre-set. Thats all I did.
but https://www.androidauthority.com/how-to-change-android-fonts-32078/
Vendors like Samsung and some Chinese ones allow for more customisation.
Oh, you can also use a third party launcher to change the font.
Picking a different laucher will not change the font in Firefox.
Hmmm. Iv never owned anything else.
On a side note, we know that hundreds, sometimes thousands of children disappear in war zones. This has happened in Ukraine, is happening in Palestine. Keeping regions destabilised benefits monsters. I would argue most of the aggressors leaderships are proven monsters. Some of those are very well acquainted with Epstein.
PROSECUTE ALL OF THEM
This Epstein case is horrific and the young women deserve justice. It is quite likely that some of our faves are implicated but we must follow the facts and let the chips fall where they may - whether on Republicans or Democrats.
The DOJ has pulled down the second file linked
You think we need pitchforks, torches, and shovels? They are armed with guns.
Typing on a forum won't do anything. Shouting real loud won't do anything. Protests won't do anything.
You can't appeal to a horde of psychopaths. Narcissists and sociopaths and psychopaths do not give a shit about you, and they never well. They would happily step over your dead corpse as they climb the Congressional steps to vote that day.
As an observation, I spent a while in France and I noticed something different about them. They don't put up with shit from their government. If a law is passed that many disagree with, they just don't comply. They refused to accept, for example, vehicle clamping. The government passed it anyway, so they started handling out kits to help people unlock them. People distributed them freely and would actively free any car they saw clamped. They tried to stop them smoking outside cafes. Zero compliance. Maybe it's a hangover from The Revolution, but I found this attitude heartening.
That's just all the more reason to disobey. You can't live your life in fear. Doing the right thing sometimes requires risk.
The pitchforks are a metaphor, obviously.
I'm not sure what point you're getting at. We shouldn't try to do anything, because the guilty are too powerful?
No. I'm saying we've had far too many false hope protests that have wasted decades of time and uncountable resources, and the people in power are literally incapable of the empathy involved to produce results. In fact, the latest craze in right-wing doctrine is calling empathy a weakness, just to make sure any vestiges that still exist within their voters is excised out.
If you want to do something, do something more forceful. These people only care about a few things: not losing their fortunes, not losing their freedom, and not dying. If you can make them afraid for one or more of those things, pursue that.
They view the poor as expendable toys. I wish citizens would get their shit together and clap back but it needs to be en mass.
Your first post read as doomerism to me, but it sounds like quite the opposite actually. We need to organize hard and build something off the back of this horrible state of affairs, right? Maybe something like a general strike until those identified in the documents are behind bars?
I am normally a pretty optimistic person but I need time to mentally work through the traumatic shit I saw in the files for and few days. It was a lot. Absolutely gut wrenching.
I saw my naivete during the George Floyd protests when state police came to my city with blacked out badges and punisher masks.
They are HEAVILY armed.
It's a nice sentiment for garden tools but you need actual firearms. Regrettably, I've yet to go to a major protest since trump has been in office. Somewhat a relief since we know now they are using footage to put protesters in terroist databases. If you aren't going to protests even partially in black bloc you are ill prepared. If you aren't arming yourself you are ill equipped.
I hope this ends, yet I have zero faith in peaceful protests to stop a fascist regime. I'm not saying don't protest, I am explicitly saying that force must be met in kind. When winter ends I anticipate things escalating and heating up a lot more.
God above...
It's funny, that the files has already had a lot mlre consequences in europe than in the us. Even though 6 in the top of your current administration is mentioned a lot more fucking times than even the worst in europe. (I hope they imprison prince andrew for lfe btw)
I saw a video recently about there being bulldozers at the ranch moving things… I’m not sure if I can find it again but someone needs to keep track of these assholes
Edit: found it but it won’t let me upload It’s over here https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSmk7QBJb/
Wait until you find out parts of it are still operational
Probably nearly all of it. Epstein and Maxwell are just the bit that was collecting kompromat on the elites.
Exactly, it's not like they broke up the "organization". They just said "hey could you guys keep it down in there ".
I need eye bleach.
It looks like half of the nation does not care, though. We have got used to the extreme, and won't react any more.
But what can we do
America has tryed nothing and is all out of ideas!
Plan a day to burn down Zorro Ranch. Thats my first thought.
Bodies are there, but a lot of citizens would need to go. We also need to ignore this leadership and find a new leader to engage in change. Thats a really difficult part. What a mess.
From google maps: 49 Zorro Ranch Rd, San Rafael, NM 87056
No we need to take cadaver dogs there
Komtech Communications "temporarily closed"
When I googled it days ago it was the ranch....
I used ddg a few minutes ago and it shows to be in the middle of las vegas
Read up on anarchist praxis and revolt. The only way out is to burn this fucker down and build something new.
Thanks, could not read through it, day soured.
I'm already at 100% belligerance, no need.
Not at all to take away from how horrifying Epstein and every other fuck that joined him is, because they're all fucking disgusting and should be fucking shot. Fuck every one of them.
But also, what the fuck is that font?
Need more than sentiments to make anything happen. I don't know what that is but I hope someone figures it out because if we stand by and do nothing about this despite the absolutely horrific accounts being known, then we as a species deserve extinction. People have no lack of desire or will or fury or want for justice in this, we have no direction for any of those things because we've been systematically disempower our entire lives.
Agreed. We need an assassins guild, but with people who can get the job done rather than nerds like me at the computer. Hell, a million ants could kill someone. Maybe if there are enough nerds...
The pronouns are redacted?
???
I'm sincerely wondering if all these Epstein files are real. Like, it would be a fantastic distraction from ICE, midterm elections meddling and all the rest, to grab random snuff pics from the darkest places of the web, accompanying them with outrageous AI generated descriptions/slop, and let people go crazy over thousands and thousands of documents created this way.
I can't believe the US government would let people access the Epstein files without having some advantage in doing so.
They've been doing everything they can to avoid it, while being (at least minimally) bound by the very obvious optics around that.
Where do you think such awful pics come from anyway? Why NOT these people, why is it MORE plausible to come from not-them?
Tread carefully, you sound sus.
Are you serious? I'm just throwing an idea here. How can you be so sure all this data is legit, when the DOD had plenty of time to add or remove anything they wanted?
I am NOT a trump supporter, far from it, but I won't believe something just because it would fit nicely in my worldview.
What I find sus is the fact that they released the files when nothing stopped them from keeping them secret.
"I don't believe parts of this are credible" is a reasonable stance. I share it.
"Here's what I think instead..." (followed by, frankly, a lot of dumb shit) is much less so.
And some of your "my idea instead" sounds so dumb, that it sounds intended to distract. Sus.
It's just a hypothesis. I'm open to counterarguments. Calling someone dumb doesn't count as one.
Okay, here's the counterargument. Your "hypothesis" does a less good job of explaining our observations than the much simpler explanation (that things instead are exactly as they seem...) and it also conveniently points blame away from the exact people who are doing everything they fucking can to dodge ANY amount of blame for any of this.
So your "hypothesis" helps the worst fucking people alive, and hinders our ability to understand by introducing utter nonsense and saying "maybe it's this instead".
That's more rebuttal than it deserves, and I already basically said those things above. Do you want me to keep going? I can make it even more clear how foolish and harmful it is to be out here "just asking questions, man". We've seen this shit you're doing before.
I think we can assume that among the millions of available documents, some are entirely true, others are completely fabricated, and most fall somewhere in between these two extremes. It would be naive to consider everything as true. We would need to sort through them, but the DOJ has given us no information allowing us to do so. It looks too much like a disinformation tactic not to be suspicious (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firehose_of_falsehood). On the other hand, they took several months before making everything available. One can assume that during that time, they didn't just sit there with their arms crossed looking at the pile of documents: they likely spent a lot of time modifying documents to limit damage on their end and, in the process, cast doubt on their enemies.
It would indeed be highly implausible for 100% of the documents to be fabricated or AI-generated (and besides, I claimed no such thing), but it is difficult to rule out that some of the available documents are completely fake.
Highlighting this fact is absolutely not 'helping criminals.' You say that my hypothesis helps the worst people alive, but can you give me a list of their names? No. These documents serve only to enrage people in a vacuum without pointing a finger on anyone guilty. Very useful for the regime.
Also, it is certainly simpler to believe that 'all these documents are true' as you do, but that is not an explanation—and that is not how Occam's Razor works.
Please note that I am not attacking you or your intentions. I think we're on the same side.
It sounds like we do essentially agree, I have nothing to disagree about in this last comment and feel basically the same way.
The initial phrasing sounded, to me, like carrying water for their own disinformation efforts. It sounded like "nah it's probably this other thing and besides, none of it can be real, they'd never let us access it if it were". I realize you didn't concretely state those things.
And I acknowledge I'm sensitive about the topic, too, but knowing the severity of the crimes (even without including the most lurid reports) and the way this administration behaves, I think that's the right stance and wouldn't really conduct myself differently here.
But I'm glad to know what you think and that it isn't what it sounded like to me.
I have found myself gaslighting myself about them because they are so absolutely horrific and tragic but sadly I do believe they are very much so real. Massie stated the reason they are avoiding releasing them all is due to connect with Isreal and high level officials... It will uncover so much messed up crap and a lot of officials are terrified of the massad because release feels like a death sentence. Biden should have released them. He is so old and near deaths door. He should have taken one for the team and just done it! I know Trump wont.
Its disgusting. My heart hurts knowing so many babies have been brutalized and tortured for so long... and they still are today.