What are some idioms that no longer make sense? Can you think of a modern replacement?
I was thinking about the phrase 'The pot calling the kettle black'. It comes from a time where cooking was done over open fires and cookware would become visibly ashy. (Fun fact: It first appears and was perhaps coined by Cervantes in Don Quixote!)
What are some other idioms that have lost their literal connection to time? What would be a good modern replacement?
209 replies
"Avoiding things like the plague" because people did not actually seem to want to avoid the plague last time around.
Those that failed to avoid actual plagues often lived only long enough to regret it.
This was true also in the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic. And there were anti-vaxxers even then.
Too soon.
Or not, really.
We're the ones who survived, we're allowed to joke about it
Oh, I didn't say not to joke about it. I just really miss Herman Cain, OK?
/s you animals.
Avoid things like the crypto xD or the AI slop to make it super modern
Oh, man, when it comes to nautical idioms, I could go on all day. There are so many, and they've lost their literal connections so thoroughly, you probably don't even think of some of them as idioms. A few that occur to me immediately:
Honestly, I'm not sure that I want modern equivalents, since many are so rich in imagery.
Don't forget "I like the cut of your jib"
Batten down the hatches too.
Three sheets to the wind!
It's a shame most people think that's about sails being up, but sheets are the ropes that control the sails, if they are to the wind you're not going to make any way
Also today I was literally at the bitter end anchoring a boat with almost all of the available chain.
I do love the imagery of "loose Canon", and by "love" I mean that as it's been described and depicted, it's a truly horrifying situation. So it makes for a really visceral image.
A quick aside: there's this murder mystery/logic puzzle game called "the Return of the Obra Dinn" that takes place on a merchant ship. The game is basically like a series of still frame dioramas that you have to analyze and figure out what's going on. There's a particularly striking scene with a cannon which breaks loose from its chains and several unfortunate sailors. It took me a long time to actually find the third sailor in the scene... (There wasn't a lot left)
Very nice! Amazing how ingrained they've become. "That new recruit is a car without brakes" just doesn't ring the same does it?
I thought "by the boards" referred to losing the mast specifically snapped off right at the deck.
I think the outdated/obsolete nature of terms in many idioms is what makes them charming.
It also makes it pretty clear you aren't using them in a literal sense. If your idioms are too new/unfamiliar and your terminology is too modern/relevant then people might just think you're being literal and not idiomatic.
"Have your cake and eat it too" doesn't really make sense. Cake is not rare or expensive enough that simply possessing it feels good. If you have cake, all you want is to eat it.
The italian version, "you want a full barrel and drunk wife" illustrates the same situation much more clearly.
I'm only half joking when I say this could be the modern replacement. I've caught both myself and the S.O. using "no take only throw" in conversation, often about unreasonably demanding people.
That’s because it’s backwards. Should be “eat your cake and have it too”
Edit: While that preserves the form and is recognizable as the common saying, it makes the meaning clearer if phrased as “Eat your cake and still have it”.
Thank you Unabomber
Also wanting to eat your cake and have it too is supposed to imply you're like a toddler having a tantrum because you're just coming to terms with the rules of object permanence: a person playing peekaboo or hide-and-seek can disappear and still come back, but if you eat your cake it will be ALL GONE!!!
Mouselemming thank goodness you're still here. I scrolled up and you disappeared for a second, I was so worried!
There’s a reason that is seen as greedy and foolish.
Even flipped, it's still weird in English with "Having cake" meaning "Eating cake" in most contexts anyway.
Better stated as “… and still have it”, come to think of it.
this actually finally makes the phrase mean what it means without a bunch of explanation
Ted, is that you?
You cannot have a cake in your possession and also eat that cake. Once you eat it, it is gone.
I cannot possess cake without eating it
I cannot possess cake because I'm not a demon. Yet.
Technically its not gone, just inside you.
Oof ouch my bone satchel
Ted Kaczynski has entered the chat.
When I was a kid, I remember asking my mom about this phrase because it made no sense to me. Why in the world would one even want a cake if they weren’t going to eat it? What is the point?! (I have always been particularly fond of cake — eating it, that is — who cares if it’s pretty if it tastes good?)
According to legend, some people have what's called "deferred gratification", by which they drive pleasure out of knowing that they will get to eat the cake later.
I don't get it either. I think it's a myth.
But maybe you will someday in the future...
But I want it now!
I was confused by this one too, but then I thought about it in the context of a wedding cake; you want to have it as a beautiful thing to show off to all of your guests, but you also want everyone to enjoy how good it tastes as a desert. You can't have both simultaneously, so you have to pick
Just desserts is another one.
“Burning the midnight oil”
Your using your battery without a wall charger, huh?
Good one! I would offer 'Draining the house battery' as a replacement but it doesn't really have a ring to. Maybe 'You've been living in low blue light mode'. No that's even worse! somebody help me here 😅.
using solar at night
"yer using solar at night, ain't ya boi"
that’s more of a ‘you’re a dumbass’ than a ‘you’re a hard worker’ tho, innit?
"Staying up past your bedtime" is about as close as I can think of, off the top of my head.
Entering single digits? Only makes sense for those with 24h time I guess
Never getting your phone on the charger?
24/7 bandwidth draw?
Ignite the midnight petroleum.
"Following the normal work routine"
Eating a dead horse - not unless you buy the budget beef mince at Tesco
Read like rabbits - rabbits can't read or even hold books
Nip it in the butt - that's sexual assault, you're not allowed to do that any more
Get down off your high horse - you're not allowed to get animals high either
Kids should be shorn and not herd - goats have hair, not wool, and can't be shorn. Their natural tendency to herd is a difficult behaviour to break.
Under the weather - unless you're a pilot you're going to be under the weather most of the time
A blessing in the skies - unless your bishop is a pilot too, that's not going to happen.
Fight off more than you can chew - I don't know where to start with this one,
Boneappletea
I always thought it was “nip it in the bud” where a bud is the early stage of a plants development / before the flower emerges on a flower. So meaning “kill it before it grows larger and that becomes harder”
Has to be trolling because they are all wrong.
Under the weather is right.
And get off your high horse is right too. So the whole thing was a weird comment, leaving the readers uncertain if OP was trolling or just...yeah mostly trolling.
They probably messed that one up. I wonder how they meant to mangle it?
You almost got me.
surely there's a /s or a trollface i'm missing
I'm not pulling your Greg, if that's what you mean.
You leave my Greg alone. He's perfectly capable pulling himself & if he needs help I have gloves!
I was half expecting that to have been posted by LadyMondegreen
Don't put the cart before the horse.
Don't submit your post before you write it.
This comment is about to be legen-
pation
RIP Timmy
Wait for it …
"Keep the carriage in the wake of the mare."
Don't buy crypto before it's settled lol
In my home country they say "Cheap as Onions" (eq in English : Cheap as Dirt)
Looking at the prices on Onions nowadays ...
In Italy, when something is expensive, we say that it's salted. Because salt was expensive. Hasn't been for a while but the word is still there!
"Worth ones salt" is older and sort of Italian (Roman)
https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/worth-ones-salt.html
Same in Germany
A stitch in time saves nine.
This refers to a time when clothes were hard to come by and often homemade. If they tore, a small tear could be fixed with one stitch of needle and thread, but if let go too long, it would take many more stitches to repair a bigger rip.
Change your oil (or tires) in time, or change your car.
This is still relevant, please take care of your clothes.
All the horse ones because we don't use horses anymore. There a ton of them.
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Who tf gets a gift horse?
Saddle up. Who tf has a saddle?
Hold your horses. Who tf has horses to hold?
Get off your high horse. Who tf has a high horse?
Beat a dead horse. WTF.
Great examples! 'champing at the bit' also comes to mind. I think cars fill in pretty nicely as a horse substitute. 'Saddle up' has 'buckle up'. Hold your horses has 'Hit your brakes'. As for gift horses... 'Don't look a gift car under the hood?' Hmm doesn't quite work
"Don't check the resale value of a gift car" maybe
But presumably a gift horse is worth something as long as it walks. This summer my kid got a “gift car” and it was critical look at both the undercarriage and the resale value. Thank goodness he was only out the cost of a tow and mechanics inspection
Quit horsing around. You're really putting the cart before the horse.
Edit: sorry, gotta go. I need to see a man about a horse.
They have the same meaning that you're trying see if the horse is healthy and the car's engine is in good condition.
To update replace all with car.
Dont look under the hood of a gift car.
Buckle up.
Hold your engine.
Get out of your limousine.
Turn the key on a drowned engine.
You could still use Hold your horses because the car has horse power. Pressing the brake pedal literally holds your horses.
But that in itself is an outdated idiom. A car has engine power.
I'm sure there's something there with e-scooters. Get off your segway max extreme and get down here. Don't look at the speed regulator of a free scooter. Hold onto your brakes? Idk I'm just spitballing here
I dunno. Yamiks still beats on horses... In both ways.
A buddy in college accidentally said “gifted horse“. Then his girlfriend said “very much so” and we never let him hear the end of it
Dollars to donuts originated in an age when a dollar could buy a considerable quantity of donuts. Inflation has since reduced the literal interpretation of the expression to nearly even odds.
Doughnuts are also zeros
Also donut shops overcharge. Donuts used to be super fucking cheap. That's why they'd be next to the coffee pot at every function, and in the work break room. Now they want like $2 a donut. It's dough that's been boiled in grease. And they get to reuse the grease for many boilings. C'mon.
In 2026 it's literally Donuts To Dollars.
Time is a flat, fried, circle drenched in chocolate frosting and filled with cream!
Chocolate-flavored frosting
I'd bet you dollars to RAM...
Also, I enjoy etymology. To me donuts will always be doughnaughts. (Naught meaning nothing or zero. Essentially zeroes made of dough.)
I came here for this comment. Thanks OP.
FYI this can still happen on liquid propane stoves, so not totally lost to time.
Maybe "Kill two birds with one stone", because who hunts with stones anymore?
As a software dev I'll offer 'Kill two bugs with one patch' as a replacement.
Touché!
99 different bugs in the code, 99 different bugs. You take one out, patch it away, 463 different bugs in the code 🎶
and put 4 new ones in :)
I think I remember seeing a PETA post years ago that suggested "feed two birds with one scone"
Yeah that one bugs me. I can feed multiple birds with one scone easily. I'm putting in too much effort here, but this recipe has the macronutrient mass of a single scone at 90g. The average crow weighs about 300-600g. I chose it because it's a common bird that would be interested in scone and that people like to feed, that's on the bigger end of birds people feed (outside waterfowl). One crow isn't eating nearly a third of its mass in one go, a sixth maybe. Songbirds aren't even getting close to that.
Killing two birds with one stone implies some skill or fortune. You wouldn't say it to describe picking up tomorrow's groceries with today's. Feeding two birds with one scone is only difficult or fortunate if those birds are geese, and even then I assume the only reason two managed to get their bills on that thing is because they're fighting over it.
Also scones are terrible for the health of birds as are all breads. It's frankly on point that peta would be dumb enough to make their animal friendly term equally as harmful to animals.
My fav replacement for this one is “feed two birds with one scone”, I don’t remember where I heard it but it always makes me smile
(Don’t feed bread to birds tho lol)
I prefer stone two birds with the same joint.
I prefer "Get two birds stoned at once"
"it's a twofer!"
kinda
"Pulling my leg." Meaning you are making something up/joking at someones expense.
It does not have any real connection to the present. The idiom came about in the mid-19th century. There's two competing theories about how it came about. The prevailing theory is that pick pockets, particularly child pick pockets, would pull on people legs to distract their mark. The darker theory is that it was related to pulling someone's legs when they were hanged in order to finish the ordeal if they didn't die from the initial drop.
Great example! That one is so ingrained that I never even realised it didn't make literal sense! Maybe a modern replacement could be something like 'You're hiding a camera'
Cap
Wearing metas?
I don't think it's the char/open fire but rather that both pot a d kettle would be made of the same black cast iron
in our holiday house we still cook on an iron stove. we also installed a small gas burner, because that stove is the heating system for all the 3 small rooms. it gets really hot - so usually you don't want to use it during summer.
but the original pans are out of copper. they have a complex shape so, if you remove the cooking top, you can hang them directly into the fire. cast iron surely was and still is a thing. but i will always choose copper over cast iron for something i want hot quickly. i would bet that most kettles where made out of something thin and conductive, so your water is hot quicker.
all our copper is black from the sud.
Alternatively, shiny kettle and the pot sees its own black reflection in it.
(But yeah, I assumed they're both black/cast iron)
(to do something) "on your dime," i.e. at your expense - A reference to public coin operated phones, which for a long time cost 10c/a US "dime" coin per call.
Inflation by the late 70s had made the single dime call a thing of the past, but USD20c was still possible, and inflating phone fees in the 80s required increasing amounts of coinage. Public pay phones were decimated when mobile phones gained popularity and are virtually extinct today in the US.
"on your card" might be a more modern version, but cards are slowly disappearing with NFC phone payments.
Similar to when you "drop the dime" on someone, i.e. using a dime to call the cops on a payphone. Although in my lifetime, I don't think I've heard anyone but Bradley Nowell use that phrase.
Ohhh, that's where "dime you out" comes from.
"Picking up the phone" makes sense because you will probably pick it up to answer or dial. "Hanging up the phone" doesn't really happen so much anymore but we still do it all the time.
On your tab.
Also, "to dial" a phone number.
From back when land line telephones had rotary dials.
https://youtu.be/vLFKdA5iEo4
In Portuguese the equivalent expression is timeless: "o sujo falando do mal lavado" (the dirty one talking about the badly washed).
in Hungarian it's "the owl calling the sparrow 'big-headed'" 😄
we usually shorten it to just "owl calling the sparrow" (doesn't have the same ambiguous meaning as English)
In Arabic "The net is making fun of the sieve"
I didn't mentioned it above, but found that very similar to it in Spanish where we say "El burro hablando de orejas al conejo" (the donkey talking about ears to the rabbit) which we shorten to "El burro hablando de orejas" (the donkey talking about ears)
Always love idioms from other languages. Had a book called "Idioms Delight" that explored equivalents from several different cultures/languages.
"Did you bring the (evening newspaper) with you?" I've used this in different countries, the newspaper referred to is one which historically was sold in the afternoon, not morning. And I ask it of anyone who comes to work late. Now, at least here, all the newspapers come out in the morning, so I just get confused stares.
That sounds like a great candidate for a modern replacement if I've ever heard one! What's something that you can only get at night these days? Seems like everything, especially information, is 24 hours now. Maybe someone more creative than me could chime in?
Hurried right over after dessert, then?
There's tons of replacements, they're not directly equivalent but equally snarky: "Hey part-timer" "Half day?" "Stop by for some coffee?"
Well, you're early for tomorrow!
I've heard some variations on that before.
"Extra extra read all about it." Said because it was an extra leaflet to the daily newspaper published later in the day.
whats the point of a modern replacement? idioms connect us across time and when they really have not modern sense (which there is enough understanding of cookware I don't think we hit that with pot and kettle) then it becomes an interesting backstory.
No real reason, just something to talk about while we all wait around to die really 🤷. I agree with your sentiment - the stories and imagery behind old idioms actually make them more interesting, I dont think they'll be going anywhere soon!
To be funny is why.
I always thought of that idiom as the pot (something generally cast iron and not polished) calling the kettle (something that is polished and therefore reflective) black.
Being that the pot sees itself in the reflection, but calls the kettle that as a derogatory thing, unknowing of it's personal alignment.
I think that the phrase is so old that the difference between a pot and a kettle might have been fairly subtle differences in shape, but both would be black cast iron.
Which is nowhere near as profound as your interpretation.
I love head over heels as, in love.
It's vice versa that makes actual sense, but that was considered too obviously risqué in the age the phrase was coined.
My head over her heels ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I don't know if its literal origin doesn't make sense to a modern person, but I think that most people still get the literal meaning of "pot calling the kettle black", that that is still understandable, so...
We still use "penny-wise and pound-foolish" in the US. We haven't used the pound since we seceded from the British Empire, and we just ended minting of the penny.
The saying apparently predates the US by about 200 years.
Until I looked it up I thought it was about the literal colour of the pot and the kettle. I even thought there might be racist undertones 😅. What's a good replacement for 'Pennywise and Pound foolish'? Maybe 'Steam saler, LootBox whaler'
this is a good one 🤣
"Loses dollars to chase cents" is the closest thing I've heard.
I've also heard "would step over a dollar to pick up a penny".
On a similar note: "in for a penny, in for a pound"
fwiw I'm nearly 30 and I've never heard that phrase in my life. Maybe a regional thing?
I assumed the idiom was from a time when all cookware was made of cast iron.
To be honest, I was never prepared to know what "hoisted by one's own pitard" meant, and knowing today, I still have no clue how this was ever relevant to any time period.
A pitard is a timed bomb used to to blow down a door or wall. The idiom is about blowing yourself up mistakenly instead. Were people using these routinely at some point?
Blowing up or at least weakening a portion of a castle wall during a siege would be useful to the besiegers. Even a small petard could break into a building for nefarious purposes. And being a sapper is notoriously dangerous even now.
Of course Shakespeare could have used the name of a larger bomb, or "speared with his own sword" or something. But Shakespeare's audience would also have clocked the fact that pétard is a French pun from péter which makes it a fart joke. And he never missed a chance for a fart joke.
before the invention of doorknobs, doors were indeed single use. they would be blown open with every use. this is why we invented chamber pots. midnight bathroom breaks were very loud, before people had pots.
I would like to subscribe to your history newsletter.
So is "hoisted" in this case the equivalent of "yeeted"?
Ain't no two ways about it
They don't need to have been used routinely, just knowledge of their use had to be common. In the same way that "shooting yourself in the foot" makes sense even to people who have never used a gun. It was enough to know what "hoist" and "petard" meant to piece together the intent of the phrase. Then once the phrase itself became common the specific knowledge was no longer necessary.
Yup.
Like that one scene in The Two Towers when Legolas suddenly became unable to shoot his bow.
Britta will explain: https://youtu.be/KuuafUtVte0
Not quite updating, but in my house we say "like sweeping the yard" to indicate that something is pointless and wasting time.
"Boss has us doing obviously pointless busy work today"
"Yeah, next he'll be having us sweep the yard!"
Or derogatorily:
"I want you to go do that thing."
"Sure, you want me sweep the yard when I'm done?"
Raking the forest
With the invention of leaf blowers, “sweeping the yard” is real! Or at least for literal yards ….. I have no idea in your industry
I think that many historic trades have been automated to the extent their old terminology is obscure but lives on in idioms.
"To the bitter end" (bitter end meaning the lose end of a rope, from rope-working - not entirely extinct but obscure). Perhaps that one could be "To the edge node"!
"Strike while the iron is hot" (from blacksmithing, again not entirely an extinct craft but largely replaced by automation). Maybe "Cross while the light is green?"
The bitter end isn't loose, it is bitten to (tied to) the windlass. Let the line out until there are no turns left on the windlass
Drinks like coffee and tea can become bitter when you get down to the dregs. That's what the first saying makes me think of.
Same with distillation, you get the heavies that you don't really want in your drink so you end the process. Ie the bitter end.
Wow, great examples! I never realised that first one had a historical meaning. I suppose even without the context it still makes sense because of the adjective 'bitter'.
I wonder if any common sayings nowadays will catch on and become long lived idioms in the future?
That's very good.
"One bad apple will spoil the whole barrel" desperately needs to be replaced because nobody has experience with storing apples in barrels so when Michael Jackson subverted it they took it unironically and now many people think it means the opposite.
I'm not techy but something about one line of bad code can jank the whole program?
"A bad link breaks the chain" maybe. Or "one bug causes an infestation" for the idea that you can't just solve the initial problem once it gets bad, it spreads if not dealth with
Maybe if we just apply "you find one cockroach, there's a million in the walls" to the same problems like bent police and corrupt politicians...
"pot calling the kettle steel" just doesn't have the same ring to it.
I mean black is still a common color for cookware though
"break a leg"
No, please don't.
Isn't the joke the if you break a leg you get in the "cast"?
No the joke is that it's bad luck to wish good luck to an actor, so you wish the worst luck
Doesn't that one come from the German idiom "Hals- und Beinbruch" (break your neck and legs) to wish someone good luck? Which in turns comes from a very butcherdly spoken jiddish phrase meaning (have success and be blessed).
Don't remember where I heard it, but I thought the origin was related to actors and performers. It was a superstitious thing that if you wished someone good luck on stage you would jinx it so instead they did the opposite and wished for the worst. I could be very wrong!
And isn't that somehow attached to a specific Shakespeare play, but then became universal?
Edit: maybe not. See comments below.
There's a superstition among actors about speaking the word "Macbeth" outside of the play, but I don't think telling people to "break a leg" is specifically linked with it. Two separate actor superstitions.
One thing is certain... Actors are weird.
went from hell and back, obviously it has a very christiany origin to it as is moving heaven and earth.
Always took it as "moving the heavens and the earth" as in "I would change the stars in the sky" kind of a way. Way less Christiany but a lot more I am my own gody.
Threshhold
from the time we spread threshes on the floor inside homes and a lip was needed to keep them spilling out.
Modern version?
Ohdear. Cause you yell something along that line when you hit it with your toe.
Ass over teakettle.
I don't think there is a modern equivalent idiom for taking a sloppy fall
Ass over tit, I have heard.
Which I expect ass over teakettle is actually a polite euphemism for
No it's not a euphemism. It's literally walking down the stairs with a teapot and falling and ... Well
Arse over tit is in an identical British expression for the same thing
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ass_over_teakettle
It's the same as 'head over heels' in that the bottom part of your body (your ass) and the top part of your body (your breast/chest) switch places.
I feel like we have to assume the description of how your body moves is the prime definition (head over heels, or any variation) and any substitution of words like ass over teakettle is a playful alteration which works and is understood primarily because people are familiar with the original and understand the alteration through context of use.
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure -- I've occasionally heard English speakers say this (or something similar) much to the confusion of the Japanese folks around. I guess one could swap ounce/pound to gram/kilo, but I think it could use replacing.
Checking in from the States.... The fuck is a "gram/kilo"? Nah, I'm kidding. It's cocaine, right?
Yep. A gram is one cocaine. A kilo is a group of cocaines.
I think the collective is known as "a sniffling".
edit: autocorrect > me.
That is my understanding, yes.
In Dutch we have the similar "een gewaarschuwd man is er twee waard" - loosely translates to "a warned man is worth two"
The gram kg probably already exists, I think?
Maybe, but I've never heard anyone say it (other than me when this comes up which is maybe once every year or two). That said, it may well exist in other, more sensible countries.
I'm canadian, so we use metric for that stuff but the expression is still imperial, probably because ounce and pound are a lot more fun to say
I heard this one the other day: "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride." It's hard to modernize though because transportation has become so cheap. Almost everyone has access to a car or even aeroplane for a modest fee
In my perception it's the opposite. When I was in Houston, people walking the streets in the hot Texas summer were the lowest of the low. There's no infrastructure for pedestrians, distances are huge and the air is hot and humid. Still there were people walking, and they are treated like the scum of the earth.
If wishes were cars, the walkers would drive
If wishes were fishes, we'd all eat well.
If wishes were horses, birthday cakes and stargazing would be a lot more dangerous.
Also wishing wells would be fucked up
If wishes were horses we'd all be eating steak.
Make a wish in one hand and a crap in the other, and see which piles up faster.
Applying wishes were horses to this could be dangerous.
I saw this as a screenshot somewhere today, I think it kind of fits the theme: https://www.threads.com/@beaukorylak/post/DYez23dDppv
The crypto bro trolling the AI bro. It would be a nice modern substitute lol, IF I understand what the meaning is, eng is not my native language, but as I understood it's: Someone bad calling out someone other bad
It's both too contentious and too referential to work imo, not everyone knows what a "x bro" is, or even what trolling is. Would work great on lemmy though.
Also yeah you understood the expression, although it's more about someone calling someone else out on something they also do.
It's a touch stilted but it gets the idea across! May I ask your first language? Any old idioms there that no longer make literal sense in the modern world?
but arnt they still have relevance in many situations in modern times.