It's because someone gave out apples and nickles next door and got pissed because every kid walked away going "awww, man..."
Also entirely possible, someone's a cheap racist, classist prick and doesn't want kids from "other neighborhoods" incentivized to come to their part of town,
Imagine buying a home for several hundred k only to be told by others in minute detail what you can and can't do on your OWN property. Land of the free my ass lol.
No one (should be) going into this blindly. You are free to request all the CC&R documents of the HOA before buying, and often you can request the financials to see if they're still solvent. FFS, if you're about to spend hundred of thousands of dollars in one go - pay attention to the details!
Literally every new home going up around here is in a HOA, and the old ones that aren't sell for a premium. It's not so easily avoided. The whole concept should be abolished, or at the very least restricted to only providing services for the homes that are subject to it.
This might be, but I believe u often have no choice. Either accept the terms or u don't get the house. And with the housing market being absolutely shitty, I believe many people have no choice but to accept those terms, cos the alternative would mean getting no home at all.
It's not impossible that enough people in the neighborhood like Bruce either. It'll be some effort to oust him, and you might end up with the duties -- but then you can make the rules minimal interference.
Cuts both ways, though. Not enough people involved could allow Bruce to take over.
ATM, the HOA in my neighborhood is very very tolerable. The money (all $100 per year) goes towards maintaining landscaping and the signage. The only "restrictions" they have are no above ground pools (which I 100% agree with and they were rather powerless when someone actually installed one), and if you're gonna put in a detached shed, at least try to make it a permanent structure instead of some cheapo plastic plastic thing from walmart or lowes.
So most apartments in most countries in the world? Sure. Not sure why you have "own" in quotation marks, it's quite normal outside of the US where you get "condos" with a ton of fees.
Usually every apartment owner gets an equal say in what happens e.g for planning and financing renovations, hallway cleaning (take turns on a weekly basis or hire a service or hire some retired person who lives in the building as a part-time job), etc.
It does indeed stop making sense when you're not all living in a shared building. If I want my lawn slightly taller than everyone else, that's my right.
I guess, kinda, but the concept of "ownership" isn't the divine right of kings. It's an understanding of possession in relation to the rest of the world and other people. There are like zoning laws and shit like that for a reason, just because you buy a piece of land doesn't mean you can develop it into whatever you want and put a chemical processing plant in a residential neighborhood.
Just because you bought an apartment and maintain exclusive ownership of it, it's in the context of someone else owning the building, and someone/thing further owning the area that building is in. Ownership doesn't give you any right to alter something in a way that affects the other peoples owned property or possessions.
Not that I'm advocating that it's right or even a good thing, but essentially the "final boss" of ownership is the government because people can't be trusted not to be petty dicks to each other
Usually you can modify everything inside the condo (walls, floors, ceilings) as long as it doesn't compromise the structure of the building. In smaller condos (4-6 units) sometimes you can change the siding of the outside or the roof of your part too, depends on the building.
A house isn't so different in that there are restrictions, since you have zoning codes and stuff. It's ownership in that you own the right to live inside it and sell it and modify it within reason.
And for shared expenses in fancy neighborhoods like a maintained garden/sign entrance area with a gate. Or a neighborhood club house with a pool. The kinds of stuff apartment complexes have.
What I learned last year is many kids don't like typical candy bars. They want skittles and nerds, and the like, at least here.
All my "filler" candy was gone, and I ended up eating the candy bars myself. I dunno, maybe they all had food allergies?
Anyway, this year I got skittles and nerds, and less chocolate, so I'll probably end up with no chocolate and a bunch of skittles and nerds which I don't like.
I would understand why my kids would want to go to a full size only candy bar neighborhood but I wouldn’t really want to take them there… the house that does that is supposed to be the rare extra thing, if every house does it it’s not special anymore and my kids are getting diabetes
When I was a kid, the fun-size candy bars were for me, and I gave the full size to my parents. I got to enjoy the variety without getting full as quickly, and I could scarf down way more of the small stuff before they figured out how much I'd eaten. The full size candy bars were merely a distraction for my elaborate heist of my own candy.
Who the fuck feels pressure because the DINKs next door are giving out full sized snickers? If it’s not in the budget, then turn your porch light off. Simple. If I don’t work this Halloween, I’m going to be giving out some good stuff! And hopefully I will not have much left, otherwise I will eat it 😓😭
That sounds like one of those "ok guys, no gifts, okay?" situation where some are too poor / cheap to afford something, but then everyone else is gonna be "fuck that noise" and gonna one up each other into the nicest gifts just to fuck with the rest.
Hilarious.
As an outsider, the whole situation is a weird clusterfuck of social expectations. I've only ever seen trick or treating on TV and it seems to be a stage managed ritual where kids dress up and everyone buys candy for everyone else's kids.
Although, the American part of the company that I work for makes bank every Halloween, which is nice.
Yeah, but it's one of those traditions that is just good to keep up once in place. I got the benefit of free candy from neighbors once a year as a kid, so it's just the right thing to do to give candy to kids now. Pay it forward to the next generation. America needs to maintain what little selfless collectivism we have, even if Americans are really just being tricked into it under the guise of holiday tradition.
Most people don't put so much pressure on it. It's just a fun holiday where you get to dress in a costume and go running around the neighborhood getting candy.
on TV and it seems to be a stage managed
That's the TV part.
kids dress up and everyone buys candy for everyone else's kids
Yup, that's the holiday in short. You also get "spooky", which is like scary but no one is scared.
It's one of the best holidays because the entire point is "fun" and the stakes are low.
I’m not understanding how this is a totally unreasonable request on its face nor the automatic HOA hate. Like I get that some are militant but some just run neighborhood pools with small libraries for kids and organize neighborhood activities…
Honestly the quip about cost makes this person seem like a rich asshole who just needs attention and kinda makes it seem like the rest of the neighborhood is tired of the rich asshole showing off.
Surely something like this doesn’t happen in a vacuum.
I think most HOAs are established by the property developers specifically to keep housing prices high, not to serve the community. They serve profits and treat homes as an investment asset. And they have specific laws that make them undemocratic and oppressive, and reward a specific type of person to take over. So that is why they are hated.
Maybe they should be renamed to "property development organization" or something because they don't really work for actual home owners.
Dude I had these HOA fucks go through my shit in my shed. I have it on camera. This is 'Merica, and I carry a. (Sorry I really like Donald Glover). Usually I'm not bothered by stuff but oh boy did that piss me off. I started locking the gate after that. Oh yeah and the fee was about $550 a month when I moved for essentially mowing the lawn and doing useless shit. They did a lot of illegal shit as well. Reading the last update to their contract was the last straw, fuck this shit I'm out.
It's one of those things where you have to think where to draw the line. Kind of like in grade school you had to ask to go to the bathroom and in college your professor says why are you asking?
A lot of the stuff is superficial and totally focused on increasing property values--to increase HOA fees. I did the math and they were raking in about a half a million a year for mowing the lawn and telling me my trash can can't be outside the fence--I had the property right by the street; the irony was they didn't anyone any lip about theirs being out.
I'm saying the irony is "to avoid situations where some homes feel pressure to match larger offerings" is kind of insulting. I mean the whole thing is written in such a condescending that I would do the opposite out of spite.
I didn't get a sense of condescending language in the letter in the post. It can be enormously difficult to communicate those kind of things by text though, so either of us could have the right of that.
But yeah, as I say your situation can be different to others. From a parents point of view I'd imagine I'd be pissed if someone was giving out full size chocolate bars to kids for Halloween. But it is less popular here in Australia, so its not really a wide spread question like in the US.
Theres definitely a problem with 'top down' rulemaking. In my view its only going to get better if decision making and organising starts at the community level. A bottom-up approach. Decisions should be made as close as possible to the people living in the democracy that the democracy, as an organisation, purpotedly serves.
I've been listening to a lot of Daron Acemoglu's latest book tour. I had some thoughts I shared on it yesterday on my Mastodon account. You might be interested.
and no, i'm not sharing it because it had zero engagement on Mastodon fml 😆 I just can't be bothered rewriting an explanantion of the 'domination' aspect Acemoglu presents as a countervailing force pulling at the two poles of liberalism.
I don't understand what is reasonable about feeling pressured to give out full size candies just because some other house is doing it. Can you explain that?
This is merely a suggestion. Also, Trader Joe's sells 1lb+ Belgian chocolate bars that are about a 1/2" thick. It would be expensive, but possibly worth it.
In one awful neighborhood I lived in, the locals put up literal road blocks so that peole could not drive in from another neighborhood and drop their kids off to trick or treat. Big stupid hand written sign and tactical suburban dads all standing around it.
I lived in the neighborhood and was driving my kids around because it was a giant neighborhood and there were a lot of big hills (kids were little then). I just drove around their stupid roadblock. Didn't say anything, didn't even look.
Agreed with folks who support HOA. Various homes have various financial situations, and if trick-or-treating is widespread in any given neighborhood, offering larger treats can cost quite a lot. Even worse if it turns into a competition of who's more "generous", and it seems many commenters are about to do just that.
Halloween is a celebration for everyone, and it's crucial to not make people feel miserable or anxious over it.
People are out here judging others based on what they give and you think someone else is the problem? Where does this end? Am I supposed to make sure my costume doesn't make people feel bad? Do we need an approved list of decorations? Which holidays am I allowed to care a lot about?
We all know the houses that go all out for Halloween or Christmas or whatever. Are we supposed to lose that because the Halloween people don't match the Christmas people?
Some people feel inadequate about being bald. The answer isn't to give them a wig, it's to change the perception of being bald.
You can't buy the larger pumpkins because it makes people jealous that they can't afford that. No you can't repair the holes in your clothes because poors exist.
Richer people giving out bigger packs of sweets is a tiny form of wealth redistribution.
I can't believe that I'm about to write this smh... In this exact case I'm actually with the HOA.
With the cost of living as it is, not all homes can necessarily afford the candy. So in order to not expose the less fortunate, and their kids, I don't think it's such an absurd proposal.
Maybe it's not the HOA's job to bring it up, but bitching about the letter just shows your privilege.
The pretext that the size of candy bar handed out at Halloween has any indication of class is utter bs.
Also, if that were the case the HOA should consider making candy available to homes that can't afford it rather than asking those that can to cheap out. The fucks the point of communal fees otherwise?
Disagree. There's no rule that says you have to give out candy at all. What this really does is it forces all kids to lose the chance to get the full size candy bars. This is effectively like telling a billionaire that it's not fair to the middle class to accept the billionaire volunteering more money to be taxed because it makes the middle class feel like they're not contributing enough, so instead mandating a flat tax rate.
If you can't keep up with the Joneses, then don't. Nobody gives a shit. But don't enshittify Halloween for everybody just because your feelings can't handle your inability to compete at something that was never a competition in the first place.
It really is that easy. UK here so our equivalent to HOAs is far less restrictive but does cover the entire country.
Usually if someone doesn't have decorations out they are left alone, if they do then they probably have sweets to give out. Which sweets is entirely up to them.
Some schools arrange trails which seems pretty nice.
So first off I don't live in a country that celebrates halloween, so I might not understand all the hubbub.
I do however have kids that have attended school with less fortunate kids. So I have it ingrained in me that I don't want to alienate said kids. It's not a matter of telling you not to do what you want, it's a matter of the poor kids being able to go to school without being bullied.
As I tried to indicate in my original comment, I think it's overreaching of the HOA to do this, but it may actually come from the right place.
Well and sometimes control is good, right? Like if it's an apartment building where the units are owned by the tenants or condos or even row houses it helps to have an established self governed organization of some kind to keep ground rules for shared walls / roofs at the very least. And even in fully separate housing it can help if there are shared community areas like a clubhouse, pool, playground, etc. There are two main problems though:
First of all, self governance requires active participation of at least most but ideally all members. You run into that same problem with any kind of self governance and that's how even very good things like unions can get a bad reputation. If you don't actively participate in union discussions they can easily be corrupted and wind up as an even more insidious control tactic by the employer.
The second problem is specific to the history of HOAs in the United States. The concept itself was fundamentally started as a way to discourage racially integrated residential areas, then extended to discourage other types of minorities. Yes you see HOAs focusing on petty things like door color but more importantly you'll see them pushing other, more insidious restrictions. When you place restrictions on outdoor decorations you're often restricting specific religious and cultural traditions. If you're only allowed to put up lights within a certain window surrounding Christmas, you're pressuring people to not observe holidays with light displays that occur at other times of the year. When you restrict the amount of unmarried adults in a house you're pushing out poor people who need roommates and and cultures that live generationally, as well as homosexuals in areas where they're not allowed to get married / claim marital privileges.
So while there are some practical benefits, the history of HOAs requires highly active and intentional participation from everyone involved to overcome the dark history of the concept and there are very few situations in which that's worth it, especially in a community where the houses are not physically connected.
That specific symptom is actually more consistent with something called obsessive compulsive personality disorder which has some overlap with OCD the anxiety disorder but usually presents with less bizarre obsession-compulsion links and usually less insight, because usually nothing they're doing is overtly nonsensical. The maladaptive / disordered aspect is more that they're allowing their obsession with rules to impact their relationship or even impose actively harmful restrictions on the people around them.
We often buy too much candy. When we realize we did, we usually have a soulful moment where we need to decide how much candy we're keeping for ourselves. Yes, we can buy candy anytime but we're adults so we usually don't buy bags of little sugar pucks.
After we've broken our hearts taking more than we need and less than we want, we usually try to wait until it's the last kid of the night who's old enough to understand but young enough to be utterly bombastically awestruck and dump some preposterous amount of candy in their bag after doing a quick non-verbal "you cool with this happening?" Negotiation with their parent.
Yeah but I spend a lot of time eating candy and then wrapping the dog food with the candy-wrappers, so … they should appreciate the effort I’ve gone to
How about a wearable poster board print out with a giant red NO stamped on it in faux blood as your costume. You can stay at home or walk the neighborhood, handing out full sized bars.
Want to be a real extra contrarian? Build a "candy stand" made of the print out. Add castor wheels and a loud speaker and flashing lights. Finally, add a button kids can slap that shouts "fffuuullll sssiiizzeedd bbbbbaaarrrrrsssss!!! at max legal volume. Roll it from HOA leader house to HOA leader house as the night carries on.
Ohh yeah, you better be rolling deep in full sized bars. It better basically be a large pallet of candy pretending to be a candy stand. You will have an army of insane 5-11 year olds slapping the shit out of that button for hours, and you gotta be able to keep the magic going to match maximum obnoxiousness.
You'll have to be a goddamn hero to those children, a being of endless chocolate, to really, really shame whatever adult though this was a reasonable request.
I mean, at that point, you might as well put up a market tent in the drive to cover the patio heater, spiced cake donuts, and pony keg of cider for the parents.* Make it a block (the fuckin' trolls) party!
*if anecdotal evidence is permitted, (no HOA bitches in our area) the next year half a dozen neighbors did the same. 🥳
Roving party village seems like a win win for everyone. Maybe build the whole thing on one of those "bike pedal bars" that are somehow the best and stupidest thing possible:
Or what, they'll put a lien on your house? Bet this HOA isn't doing all of the typical stuff HOAs are responsible for, but they have enough time and money to put together this letter.
Nothing in the letter stipulates HOW MANY little candies you can give each child.
If there are lots of kids, I suppose some families might have trouble affording big bars, and feel peer pressure, but I suppose they could use it as a teachable moment for their kids. Anyway, most kids are happy with small candy as long as they get something. Even the toothbrush house is worth the walk up to the door.
I grew up in a smaller town (6-800 pop), for whatever reason I was the only/youngest kid in my neighbourhood.
I always took my neighbourhood last, as they'd stuff me up when they were aware no one else would waddle by, the norm would be 15 cents and 3 euroes wasn't uncommon in that area.. If waddled by at 5 pm
I honestly can't imagine how anyone can afford to give out big bars at all. Don't they cost like $1 each? Are people spending $50 on Halloween candy for trick or treaters?
I think some people, maybe no kids of their own so they have a little money, remember what a big thrill it was for them as a child, and they just really enjoy being A Generous God one night a year. Seeing the faces light up. Maybe especially if they're estranged from family so no gifts to buy. I live in a condo and the few kids in the building go elsewhere to trick-or-treat, so most people don't do anything, but my neighbor down the hall puts out a bowl of regular -size (not giant but not mini) candy bars October 1st and keeps it filled the whole month! I just put out a bowl of little ones on the night.
Not really inconsistent, you’re free to not enter into an HOA covenant and folks willing to subject themselves to being micro nannied are free to do so. That’s freedom ain’t it?
The problem is the HOA exists where it does so if I want to buy there for the other benefits of the location (e.g. school) I have to submit to the HOA. The idea of HOAs originally came about as one method of stopping blacks and other minorities from buying in those areas. Simultaneously these areas got things like pools and gathering areas (clubhouses) while they closed the public versions of these places.
I think you'd be hard pressed to find countries that dont have similar racism based things. Europe is obvious, India has the caste system, China is against non Han, various African groups are against other African groups, etc. The methods used may be different (often more overt) but that doesn't really matter to the outcome.
If there is an existing HOA, unless it's a rare one that's voluntary and not tied to the deed, you can choose to not join only by not buying the house.
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If people "feel pressured" over a candy bar, that's on them. Some people have no issue not even participating so your inferiority complex can suck it
It's because someone gave out apples and nickles next door and got pissed because every kid walked away going "awww, man..."
Also entirely possible, someone's a cheap racist, classist prick and doesn't want kids from "other neighborhoods" incentivized to come to their part of town,
I 100% guarantee you it's the latter.
Based on the wording I’m guessing it’s a gated community.
Classic gated community...buy the cheap shit.
Makes me think it's a "gated" community of McMansions
"We encourage/dictate that you hand out small/cheap candy bars only so that others do not feel pressured/inadequate."
Imagine buying a home for several hundred k only to be told by others in minute detail what you can and can't do on your OWN property. Land of the free my ass lol.
Land of the fee, home of the slave
I have difficulty feeling sympathy for anyone who voluntarily bought a single-family home with an HOA
Sounds like the complaint of someone who didn't understand the legal documents they signed.
No one (should be) going into this blindly. You are free to request all the CC&R documents of the HOA before buying, and often you can request the financials to see if they're still solvent. FFS, if you're about to spend hundred of thousands of dollars in one go - pay attention to the details!
Literally every new home going up around here is in a HOA, and the old ones that aren't sell for a premium. It's not so easily avoided. The whole concept should be abolished, or at the very least restricted to only providing services for the homes that are subject to it.
This might be, but I believe u often have no choice. Either accept the terms or u don't get the house. And with the housing market being absolutely shitty, I believe many people have no choice but to accept those terms, cos the alternative would mean getting no home at all.
Good thing the hoa can never implement new rules or change who is in charge!
Right? Don't like the rules?
It's not impossible that enough people in the neighborhood like Bruce either. It'll be some effort to oust him, and you might end up with the duties -- but then you can make the rules minimal interference.
Cuts both ways, though. Not enough people involved could allow Bruce to take over.
My dad's HOA had a Bruce.
The whole concept of HOA is crazy for me
HOA seems a very bad idea. HOA in the US is terrifying.
ATM, the HOA in my neighborhood is very very tolerable. The money (all $100 per year) goes towards maintaining landscaping and the signage. The only "restrictions" they have are no above ground pools (which I 100% agree with and they were rather powerless when someone actually installed one), and if you're gonna put in a detached shed, at least try to make it a permanent structure instead of some cheapo plastic plastic thing from walmart or lowes.
JFC, only $100 per year? Is that right? That's nothing.
Oh, I thought you meant each yard had landscaping like we do. Is it just common grounds, like the median, etc?
Yeah, like at the front entrance, the median for the main drag, there's a small "public" pond.
Sadly, corporate buyout of homes into perma-rent hell is so much worse in how insidious it is.
You really just have to hope against hope that if you are stuck with a HOA, they're already reasonable or can be wrangled into it.
Corporations are nigh untouchable, and that's horrifying.
it sounds almost reasonable for those weird buildings where people "own" their unit or share walls
So most apartments in most countries in the world? Sure. Not sure why you have "own" in quotation marks, it's quite normal outside of the US where you get "condos" with a ton of fees.
Usually every apartment owner gets an equal say in what happens e.g for planning and financing renovations, hallway cleaning (take turns on a weekly basis or hire a service or hire some retired person who lives in the building as a part-time job), etc.
It does indeed stop making sense when you're not all living in a shared building. If I want my lawn slightly taller than everyone else, that's my right.
because how can anyone consider it ownership if you do not have the right to destroy/modify it?
I guess, kinda, but the concept of "ownership" isn't the divine right of kings. It's an understanding of possession in relation to the rest of the world and other people. There are like zoning laws and shit like that for a reason, just because you buy a piece of land doesn't mean you can develop it into whatever you want and put a chemical processing plant in a residential neighborhood.
Just because you bought an apartment and maintain exclusive ownership of it, it's in the context of someone else owning the building, and someone/thing further owning the area that building is in. Ownership doesn't give you any right to alter something in a way that affects the other peoples owned property or possessions.
Not that I'm advocating that it's right or even a good thing, but essentially the "final boss" of ownership is the government because people can't be trusted not to be petty dicks to each other
Usually you can modify everything inside the condo (walls, floors, ceilings) as long as it doesn't compromise the structure of the building. In smaller condos (4-6 units) sometimes you can change the siding of the outside or the roof of your part too, depends on the building.
A house isn't so different in that there are restrictions, since you have zoning codes and stuff. It's ownership in that you own the right to live inside it and sell it and modify it within reason.
And for shared expenses in fancy neighborhoods like a maintained garden/sign entrance area with a gate. Or a neighborhood club house with a pool. The kinds of stuff apartment complexes have.
What I learned last year is many kids don't like typical candy bars. They want skittles and nerds, and the like, at least here.
All my "filler" candy was gone, and I ended up eating the candy bars myself. I dunno, maybe they all had food allergies?
Anyway, this year I got skittles and nerds, and less chocolate, so I'll probably end up with no chocolate and a bunch of skittles and nerds which I don't like.
Every child now gets 2 full sized candy bars and a bag of chips.
Fuck off busy body!
must protect the neighborhood from the pressure of having a variety of candy
and think of the children! they need a consistent experience in receiving their candy
Well, I guess that means I can still hand out out the little airplane bottles of whiskey to the kids.
King Sized bars, it is. HOA's can kick rocks.
That is some seriously petty bullshit on the part of the HOA.
Get a fucking life.
Request denied.
I would understand why my kids would want to go to a full size only candy bar neighborhood but I wouldn’t really want to take them there… the house that does that is supposed to be the rare extra thing, if every house does it it’s not special anymore and my kids are getting diabetes
When I was a kid, the fun-size candy bars were for me, and I gave the full size to my parents. I got to enjoy the variety without getting full as quickly, and I could scarf down way more of the small stuff before they figured out how much I'd eaten. The full size candy bars were merely a distraction for my elaborate heist of my own candy.
Who the fuck feels pressure because the DINKs next door are giving out full sized snickers? If it’s not in the budget, then turn your porch light off. Simple. If I don’t work this Halloween, I’m going to be giving out some good stuff! And hopefully I will not have much left, otherwise I will eat it 😓😭
I always buy candy I like, do in the case I don't give it all out at least I can enjoy the snack
Peak busybody behavior.
No one mentioned king size, you'd better do that instead just to be safe.
This is hilarious. Somewhere on the other end of the totalitarian spectrum is an HOA encouraging all residents to hand out candy!
That sounds like one of those "ok guys, no gifts, okay?" situation where some are too poor / cheap to afford something, but then everyone else is gonna be "fuck that noise" and gonna one up each other into the nicest gifts just to fuck with the rest. Hilarious.
no mention of how many to hand out per kid, leave a couple of pallets out.
If any trick or treaters actually came to my house, I would definitely want the reputation of the house that gave out full size candy
Instead you buy the pack of full sized bars and keep your lights off and door locked?
Fuck them kids, get a job you bums.
Photocopy the paper and and it out with full sized bars.
Buy like 500 USD worth of the big chocolate bars, the ones that are arranged in little squares, and hand them out.
As an outsider, the whole situation is a weird clusterfuck of social expectations. I've only ever seen trick or treating on TV and it seems to be a stage managed ritual where kids dress up and everyone buys candy for everyone else's kids.
Although, the American part of the company that I work for makes bank every Halloween, which is nice.
Yeah, but it's one of those traditions that is just good to keep up once in place. I got the benefit of free candy from neighbors once a year as a kid, so it's just the right thing to do to give candy to kids now. Pay it forward to the next generation. America needs to maintain what little selfless collectivism we have, even if Americans are really just being tricked into it under the guise of holiday tradition.
It's also one of the only times you ever get to meet the neighbors
Yep. It's candy UBI, and I'm for it!
Ah, the real trick or treating is in corporate messaging.
That's just everything, lol
Most people don't put so much pressure on it. It's just a fun holiday where you get to dress in a costume and go running around the neighborhood getting candy.
That's the TV part.
Yup, that's the holiday in short. You also get "spooky", which is like scary but no one is scared.
It's one of the best holidays because the entire point is "fun" and the stakes are low.
I’m not understanding how this is a totally unreasonable request on its face nor the automatic HOA hate. Like I get that some are militant but some just run neighborhood pools with small libraries for kids and organize neighborhood activities…
Honestly the quip about cost makes this person seem like a rich asshole who just needs attention and kinda makes it seem like the rest of the neighborhood is tired of the rich asshole showing off.
Surely something like this doesn’t happen in a vacuum.
I think most HOAs are established by the property developers specifically to keep housing prices high, not to serve the community. They serve profits and treat homes as an investment asset. And they have specific laws that make them undemocratic and oppressive, and reward a specific type of person to take over. So that is why they are hated.
Maybe they should be renamed to "property development organization" or something because they don't really work for actual home owners.
Dude I had these HOA fucks go through my shit in my shed. I have it on camera. This is 'Merica, and I carry a. (Sorry I really like Donald Glover). Usually I'm not bothered by stuff but oh boy did that piss me off. I started locking the gate after that. Oh yeah and the fee was about $550 a month when I moved for essentially mowing the lawn and doing useless shit. They did a lot of illegal shit as well. Reading the last update to their contract was the last straw, fuck this shit I'm out.
But the US is a big place with lots of HOA's, yours can be bad, while others can be fine but made to look bad.
Reading the request, its reapectful and reasonable reasons given. Seems fine to me.
It's one of those things where you have to think where to draw the line. Kind of like in grade school you had to ask to go to the bathroom and in college your professor says why are you asking?
A lot of the stuff is superficial and totally focused on increasing property values--to increase HOA fees. I did the math and they were raking in about a half a million a year for mowing the lawn and telling me my trash can can't be outside the fence--I had the property right by the street; the irony was they didn't anyone any lip about theirs being out.
I'm saying the irony is "to avoid situations where some homes feel pressure to match larger offerings" is kind of insulting. I mean the whole thing is written in such a condescending that I would do the opposite out of spite.
I didn't get a sense of condescending language in the letter in the post. It can be enormously difficult to communicate those kind of things by text though, so either of us could have the right of that.
But yeah, as I say your situation can be different to others. From a parents point of view I'd imagine I'd be pissed if someone was giving out full size chocolate bars to kids for Halloween. But it is less popular here in Australia, so its not really a wide spread question like in the US.
I see, I didn't really consider that, I don't have kids. It was more or less the concept of being told what to do all the time.
Theres definitely a problem with 'top down' rulemaking. In my view its only going to get better if decision making and organising starts at the community level. A bottom-up approach. Decisions should be made as close as possible to the people living in the democracy that the democracy, as an organisation, purpotedly serves.
I've been listening to a lot of Daron Acemoglu's latest book tour. I had some thoughts I shared on it yesterday on my Mastodon account. You might be interested.
https://mastodon.au/@Gorgritch_Umie_Killa/117459650696393228
and no, i'm not sharing it because it had zero engagement on Mastodon fml 😆 I just can't be bothered rewriting an explanantion of the 'domination' aspect Acemoglu presents as a countervailing force pulling at the two poles of liberalism.
I added it to my reading list. Sounds interesting, thanks
Why?
Regulate sugar intake for children. Big bars equals big sugar. Halloween must already be hell for it, big bars compounds the pressure.
The way my parents did it was collect all the candy, put it on a high shelf, and let us eat one a day.
Can you explain why you'd be upset about that, out of curiosity?
Its just about regulating how much sugar for your kids. Halloween sounds like a nightmare to me.
https://aussie.zone/comment/25524722
That is commendable! Even with the fun size bars, parents have to control how much you eat or it will be too much.
I wonder if the HOA board members have kids.
Did they proudly tell their kids about how they wiped out the scourge of homeowners giving away too much candy on Halloween?
Such a horrible fate these spoilsports saved the kids from... but I guess it's worth it for a power trip
This will help you understand a bit, in song.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kR1m8iXKe-g
I don't understand what is reasonable about feeling pressured to give out full size candies just because some other house is doing it. Can you explain that?
This is merely a suggestion. Also, Trader Joe's sells 1lb+ Belgian chocolate bars that are about a 1/2" thick. It would be expensive, but possibly worth it.
Annoying the Halloween Gestapo would be worth it.
HOA are anti-social tyrants who force their idea of community onto a captive audience.
In one awful neighborhood I lived in, the locals put up literal road blocks so that peole could not drive in from another neighborhood and drop their kids off to trick or treat. Big stupid hand written sign and tactical suburban dads all standing around it.
I lived in the neighborhood and was driving my kids around because it was a giant neighborhood and there were a lot of big hills (kids were little then). I just drove around their stupid roadblock. Didn't say anything, didn't even look.
Douchenozzles.
Only if people are somehow forced into residing in one against their will. That's like saying “City councils are anti-social tyrants”.
Agreed with folks who support HOA. Various homes have various financial situations, and if trick-or-treating is widespread in any given neighborhood, offering larger treats can cost quite a lot. Even worse if it turns into a competition of who's more "generous", and it seems many commenters are about to do just that.
Halloween is a celebration for everyone, and it's crucial to not make people feel miserable or anxious over it.
People are out here judging others based on what they give and you think someone else is the problem? Where does this end? Am I supposed to make sure my costume doesn't make people feel bad? Do we need an approved list of decorations? Which holidays am I allowed to care a lot about?
We all know the houses that go all out for Halloween or Christmas or whatever. Are we supposed to lose that because the Halloween people don't match the Christmas people?
Some people feel inadequate about being bald. The answer isn't to give them a wig, it's to change the perception of being bald.
You can't buy the larger pumpkins because it makes people jealous that they can't afford that. No you can't repair the holes in your clothes because poors exist.
Richer people giving out bigger packs of sweets is a tiny form of wealth redistribution.
I can't believe that I'm about to write this smh... In this exact case I'm actually with the HOA.
With the cost of living as it is, not all homes can necessarily afford the candy. So in order to not expose the less fortunate, and their kids, I don't think it's such an absurd proposal.
Maybe it's not the HOA's job to bring it up, but bitching about the letter just shows your privilege.
The pretext that the size of candy bar handed out at Halloween has any indication of class is utter bs.
Also, if that were the case the HOA should consider making candy available to homes that can't afford it rather than asking those that can to cheap out. The fucks the point of communal fees otherwise?
Disagree. There's no rule that says you have to give out candy at all. What this really does is it forces all kids to lose the chance to get the full size candy bars. This is effectively like telling a billionaire that it's not fair to the middle class to accept the billionaire volunteering more money to be taxed because it makes the middle class feel like they're not contributing enough, so instead mandating a flat tax rate.
If you can't keep up with the Joneses, then don't. Nobody gives a shit. But don't enshittify Halloween for everybody just because your feelings can't handle your inability to compete at something that was never a competition in the first place.
This is about kids being happy not about your insecurities. If you can't or won't participate at whatever level then don't. Why is this hard.
It really is that easy. UK here so our equivalent to HOAs is far less restrictive but does cover the entire country.
Usually if someone doesn't have decorations out they are left alone, if they do then they probably have sweets to give out. Which sweets is entirely up to them.
Some schools arrange trails which seems pretty nice.
So first off I don't live in a country that celebrates halloween, so I might not understand all the hubbub.
I do however have kids that have attended school with less fortunate kids. So I have it ingrained in me that I don't want to alienate said kids. It's not a matter of telling you not to do what you want, it's a matter of the poor kids being able to go to school without being bullied.
As I tried to indicate in my original comment, I think it's overreaching of the HOA to do this, but it may actually come from the right place.
Anyway why do you need to get so upset?
Why are HOAs so obsessed with "consistency"?
The same reason militaries are. Control. Except militaries actually have ressons to do it, other than power tripping people
It's a euphemism for "control".
Well and sometimes control is good, right? Like if it's an apartment building where the units are owned by the tenants or condos or even row houses it helps to have an established self governed organization of some kind to keep ground rules for shared walls / roofs at the very least. And even in fully separate housing it can help if there are shared community areas like a clubhouse, pool, playground, etc. There are two main problems though:
First of all, self governance requires active participation of at least most but ideally all members. You run into that same problem with any kind of self governance and that's how even very good things like unions can get a bad reputation. If you don't actively participate in union discussions they can easily be corrupted and wind up as an even more insidious control tactic by the employer.
The second problem is specific to the history of HOAs in the United States. The concept itself was fundamentally started as a way to discourage racially integrated residential areas, then extended to discourage other types of minorities. Yes you see HOAs focusing on petty things like door color but more importantly you'll see them pushing other, more insidious restrictions. When you place restrictions on outdoor decorations you're often restricting specific religious and cultural traditions. If you're only allowed to put up lights within a certain window surrounding Christmas, you're pressuring people to not observe holidays with light displays that occur at other times of the year. When you restrict the amount of unmarried adults in a house you're pushing out poor people who need roommates and and cultures that live generationally, as well as homosexuals in areas where they're not allowed to get married / claim marital privileges.
So while there are some practical benefits, the history of HOAs requires highly active and intentional participation from everyone involved to overcome the dark history of the concept and there are very few situations in which that's worth it, especially in a community where the houses are not physically connected.
Its another excuse to dull out fines
dole
Go after the argument, not the user.
Honestly fair
Oh no — education!
I conquer.
I keep forgetting to never interact on here. Thanks for reminding me.
probably for the best, it doesn't seem to be working for you
Don't be an ass
but I'm so good at it.....
why you gotta take that away?
Find another passion
I appreciate it when someone lets me know that I'm doing something wrong and how I can do it right in the future in a concise and helpful way.
Why do you hate learning?
“Ohh, why do I even bother?”
Byeee
It's a safe way to live.
That specific symptom is actually more consistent with something called obsessive compulsive personality disorder which has some overlap with OCD the anxiety disorder but usually presents with less bizarre obsession-compulsion links and usually less insight, because usually nothing they're doing is overtly nonsensical. The maladaptive / disordered aspect is more that they're allowing their obsession with rules to impact their relationship or even impose actively harmful restrictions on the people around them.
You absolutely must give out full size candy bars. What happens if Death visits?
I instead buy many pounds of bulk wrapped candy from nuts.com (or any other place) and then hand scoops of candy out.
The kids love having a 2 cup scoop of candy poured in their bag.
We often buy too much candy. When we realize we did, we usually have a soulful moment where we need to decide how much candy we're keeping for ourselves. Yes, we can buy candy anytime but we're adults so we usually don't buy bags of little sugar pucks.
After we've broken our hearts taking more than we need and less than we want, we usually try to wait until it's the last kid of the night who's old enough to understand but young enough to be utterly bombastically awestruck and dump some preposterous amount of candy in their bag after doing a quick non-verbal "you cool with this happening?" Negotiation with their parent.
I definitely haven’t already eaten 3 pounds of salt water taffy ahead of Halloween.
I’ll need to re-up, my planning ahead works against me
Until they realize you just gave them 2 cups of dog food.
Yeah but I spend a lot of time eating candy and then wrapping the dog food with the candy-wrappers, so … they should appreciate the effort I’ve gone to
Encouraging, asking, request. It's not a rule because they know they can't make it stick. Hand out whatever you want.
Print that email out on a large poster board and display it by your front door as you hand out king size candy.
How about a wearable poster board print out with a giant red NO stamped on it in faux blood as your costume. You can stay at home or walk the neighborhood, handing out full sized bars.
Want to be a real extra contrarian? Build a "candy stand" made of the print out. Add castor wheels and a loud speaker and flashing lights. Finally, add a button kids can slap that shouts "fffuuullll sssiiizzeedd bbbbbaaarrrrrsssss!!! at max legal volume. Roll it from HOA leader house to HOA leader house as the night carries on.
A mobile candy station? They'd never make it out alive. 😱🤣
Ohh yeah, you better be rolling deep in full sized bars. It better basically be a large pallet of candy pretending to be a candy stand. You will have an army of insane 5-11 year olds slapping the shit out of that button for hours, and you gotta be able to keep the magic going to match maximum obnoxiousness.
You'll have to be a goddamn hero to those children, a being of endless chocolate, to really, really shame whatever adult though this was a reasonable request.
I mean, at that point, you might as well put up a market tent in the drive to cover the patio heater, spiced cake donuts, and pony keg of cider for the parents.* Make it a block (the fuckin' trolls) party!
*if anecdotal evidence is permitted, (no HOA bitches in our area) the next year half a dozen neighbors did the same. 🥳
Roving party village seems like a win win for everyone. Maybe build the whole thing on one of those "bike pedal bars" that are somehow the best and stupidest thing possible:
Likely need a permit for a moving cider hut, though. Better to keep that on-site, IME. 😅
Make sure you put pictures of all the board members on it.
Whenever I hear about “fun size” candy bars, I think of a quote from a stand-up comedian (whose name I can’t remember):
“What’s fun about less candy?”
He made a good point.
Was that stand up comedian Strong Bad?
A-yep.
https://youtu.be/O8zBnooMLAU?t=163
He was a stand-up kinda guy, even if he looked more like a cut-out. 🤘🏼
Rest in awesomeness, you gawdamn legend. 🖤
THANK YOU! Seeing Strong Sad dressed up as Andy Warhol was great, too!
Now I’m thinking it very well could have been
I think he usually did more of a "hop up" than properly standing up
Or what, they'll put a lien on your house? Bet this HOA isn't doing all of the typical stuff HOAs are responsible for, but they have enough time and money to put together this letter.
Nothing in the letter stipulates HOW MANY little candies you can give each child.
If there are lots of kids, I suppose some families might have trouble affording big bars, and feel peer pressure, but I suppose they could use it as a teachable moment for their kids. Anyway, most kids are happy with small candy as long as they get something. Even the toothbrush house is worth the walk up to the door.
I grew up in a smaller town (6-800 pop), for whatever reason I was the only/youngest kid in my neighbourhood.
I always took my neighbourhood last, as they'd stuff me up when they were aware no one else would waddle by, the norm would be 15 cents and 3 euroes wasn't uncommon in that area.. If waddled by at 5 pm
I honestly can't imagine how anyone can afford to give out big bars at all. Don't they cost like $1 each? Are people spending $50 on Halloween candy for trick or treaters?
I think some people, maybe no kids of their own so they have a little money, remember what a big thrill it was for them as a child, and they just really enjoy being A Generous God one night a year. Seeing the faces light up. Maybe especially if they're estranged from family so no gifts to buy. I live in a condo and the few kids in the building go elsewhere to trick-or-treat, so most people don't do anything, but my neighbor down the hall puts out a bowl of regular -size (not giant but not mini) candy bars October 1st and keeps it filled the whole month! I just put out a bowl of little ones on the night.
Ya never know, they might have backup candy for when the toothbrushes run out!
"land of the Free"
Whoever told you that is your enemy
Not really inconsistent, you’re free to not enter into an HOA covenant and folks willing to subject themselves to being micro nannied are free to do so. That’s freedom ain’t it?
The problem is the HOA exists where it does so if I want to buy there for the other benefits of the location (e.g. school) I have to submit to the HOA. The idea of HOAs originally came about as one method of stopping blacks and other minorities from buying in those areas. Simultaneously these areas got things like pools and gathering areas (clubhouses) while they closed the public versions of these places.
USA - always racist.
Should be their slogan.
I think you'd be hard pressed to find countries that dont have similar racism based things. Europe is obvious, India has the caste system, China is against non Han, various African groups are against other African groups, etc. The methods used may be different (often more overt) but that doesn't really matter to the outcome.
HOAs often come with the house, and in some areas it can be hard to find a house without one.
If there is an existing HOA, unless it's a rare one that's voluntary and not tied to the deed, you can choose to not join only by not buying the house.
I have a fantasy where i get rich and hand out 5 lb chocolate bars one year.
King size everything. There's even a special golden candy bar that wins you a king size mattress!
Beat me to it by 13 mins.