We're a stupid country rules by assholes and morons.
You just know if someone tried to make a serious push for it, all the fox news types would go into a frenzy. It'd be an easy way to whip up their idiot base.
I'm old enough to remember when they tried to convert us to metric. I can tell you why.
People tried to force it on us and we don't need the metric system for daily use. Trying to force people to use it isn't going to work. Now, personally, I'd prefer if measurements on rulers and in cars were still given in both systems.
Metric advocates tend to be smug and insulting towards anyone not using the metric system. I have seen this myself more than once. Calling a whole nation stupid because they use a different but functional system of measurement is hardly a good strategy for converting them to your system.
I learned the metric system in school. I understand that the metric system is superior in many sciences. I have strong interests in anthropology. And here I am at 55 and I have never, not once, needed to use metric. Bone measurements are often given in metric but it's not such a big issue that I need to wholly convert to metric.
My question is, what's the big deal? Is the metric system a religion? I've seen evangelical Christians less intent on converting people. Why?
The main reason it annoys me is because a lot of English-language recipes online are written by USAmericans and therefore use imperial units that I have to convert. I've also noticed that they seem to measure everything in cups even for things where it makes no sense to use volume (flour is a common one—isn't baking supposed to be precise? Flours can have different densities, air pockets, etc). I find ounces really confusing because they can be volume or mass.
Also, imperial is not standardised, so different countries have different amounts for a cup, an ounce, a pint, etc. I guess I can check the recipe author's country and then convert to metric. But I just find it confusing. Can't we just all use the same units that are nice and easy to use together since they're powers of 10?
The actual answer is it's too expensive to convert everything at this point. If it takes months to get a pothole filled, good luck with changing all the sighs even as a start. A lot of people use metric anyway. SAE tools can go where the sun don't shine. Fuck your fractions. Give me a 10 or a 12 or a 17 (mm, stay away Jeffrey) makes more sense than 13/32" ... just why, it's so dumb.
SAE tools for SAE hardware. I agree, saying something like "gimme a 7/16 wrench for this 1/4-20 by 3/8 bolt" is probably like speaking a foreign language to someone accustomed to metric. But you get used to it if you see it every day.
Now metric measurements of wire are fucking ridiculous in my eye. AWG (American wire gauge) all day. The metric equivalent measures the diameter of the wire and calls it like 1 mm2 for 18 awg, 1.5 for 16, 2.5 for 14, 4 for 12 awg etc. AWG keeps it nice and easy, every other even number starting at like 32 down to 2.
It does get a little fucky from there tho lol. Like then it goes 1 and 0 AWG, then 1/0, 2/0, 3/0, 4/0 (pronounced like 1 awwt), then 250, 500, 750, 1000 MCM. But I've also heard those sizes of 250-1000 called KCMIL instead for.... reasons....
It's like most of our measurements. It's what "feels" right if that makes any sense. Fahrenheit is more accurate to what changes are noticeable to the human body, a foot or a yard just paints a way better picture than half a meter etc. I'm sure most of it is based off like farmers or something rather than scientific measurements.
Yeah you make a proper point; most of the stuff the hardware I work with is metric, the wiring is awg, and the temps are Fahrenheit. Honestly other than a 1/4" wrench and 3/8" spark plug socket, I don't remember the last time I used any of my anything out of my box wrench sets. They basically are wall ornaments that collect dust. Same with range, I would just use meters since they're close enough. You know like, target out 300 meters leading left.
We bend raw copper and aluminum busbars at work for manufacturing industrial electrical systems. All standard hardware. Plus whatever else goes into it like insulated supports, polyballs, mounting hardware of components on panels, etc. So I'm probably one of the rare exceptions that use SAE more than metric, especially how pretty much every car (even American made ones) use metric now. Other than maybe changing a bolt for an old lawnmower or something, yeah I get why it's not really used much anymore.
Yeah I think an old Briggs and Stratton engine was the only time time I remember using SAE. I mean I still use SAE [Tap] die sets but the irony is the nut outer is metric.
It's funny how often I have to repeat myself; as in you need 3/8 brass pipe or 1/2 brass pipe, no not 3/8 compression or flared. I work on high end espresso machines these days, like 20-40k ones.
That reminds me of a road in AZ that had signage in KM when I was a kid. I guess it was a part of this program and it never got changed back? It was always a mindfuck suddenly seeing kms instead of miles on road trips through the area.
There was a stretch of the Florida coast that had metric in the late 90s and early 2000s, but people kept stealing the speed limit signs. They also had a problem with people misunderstanding 100kph (about 60mph) and doing 100mph instead.
The US uses the metric system. SI units are provided by Federal Government for almost every quantifiable product produced by a federal agency and its been like that for decades. Often they use a mix of customary and SI units, providing conversions between the two in official reports. Generally you see customary units communicated when work more directly impacts the general public with more technical work using the SI system. Many industrial fields use predominantly the metric system as is the case for medicine and many engineering fields.
The US does not use, exclusively, the metric system because many units had been adopted by convention prior to the formalization of the modern international SI system and for cultural or historic reasons people don't want to change.
That's not so different from other places where measurement systems in common use are often retained.
The metric system debate is, for me, one of the most interesting cultural bugbears on the internet. Because it does not really matter that much what system of measurement a nation uses, its really not going to impact your life that much at the end of the day. Particularly in the modern era where conversion is as trivial as looking up a calculator online. But for whatever reason people get huffy about the metric system.
You seem to be well informed.
I have no knowledge of what units are used formally, or in engineering or so, but often when I read news from the USA where measures are present, I find that they sometimes use the imperial units, and sometimes "the asteroid of the size of 5 football fields" or "a hole of the size of 4 washing machines opened in the road".
That being said, it's likely a journalism issue. Clickbaits matter more than accuracy. That unfortunately holds true not just for the USA..
It's a journalism thing, I think. I've never heard anyone in conversation say things like that. I have heard people describe things like that when someone says "Well, how long is x in, mm, ft, km, etc." "It's about this many of that long" or whatever.
My theory is that the federal nature of the US leads to a default popular attitude of hostility toward any policy that originates above the state level, unless there are commercial interests willing to pay for the marketing and campaign contributions to sell it to the people and/or legislators. And businesses aren’t that interested in an improvement that only marginally affects their profits.
It could be solved by teaching an incoming generation both units, teaching conversion, and printing both units on packaging, speed limit signs, etc, until that generation's children start school, then phasing out the printing of both units.
30 replies
We're a stupid country rules by assholes and morons.
You just know if someone tried to make a serious push for it, all the fox news types would go into a frenzy. It'd be an easy way to whip up their idiot base.
I'm old enough to remember when they tried to convert us to metric. I can tell you why.
People tried to force it on us and we don't need the metric system for daily use. Trying to force people to use it isn't going to work. Now, personally, I'd prefer if measurements on rulers and in cars were still given in both systems.
Metric advocates tend to be smug and insulting towards anyone not using the metric system. I have seen this myself more than once. Calling a whole nation stupid because they use a different but functional system of measurement is hardly a good strategy for converting them to your system.
I learned the metric system in school. I understand that the metric system is superior in many sciences. I have strong interests in anthropology. And here I am at 55 and I have never, not once, needed to use metric. Bone measurements are often given in metric but it's not such a big issue that I need to wholly convert to metric.
My question is, what's the big deal? Is the metric system a religion? I've seen evangelical Christians less intent on converting people. Why?
The main reason it annoys me is because a lot of English-language recipes online are written by USAmericans and therefore use imperial units that I have to convert. I've also noticed that they seem to measure everything in cups even for things where it makes no sense to use volume (flour is a common one—isn't baking supposed to be precise? Flours can have different densities, air pockets, etc). I find ounces really confusing because they can be volume or mass.
Also, imperial is not standardised, so different countries have different amounts for a cup, an ounce, a pint, etc. I guess I can check the recipe author's country and then convert to metric. But I just find it confusing. Can't we just all use the same units that are nice and easy to use together since they're powers of 10?
The actual answer is it's too expensive to convert everything at this point. If it takes months to get a pothole filled, good luck with changing all the sighs even as a start. A lot of people use metric anyway. SAE tools can go where the sun don't shine. Fuck your fractions. Give me a 10 or a 12 or a 17 (mm, stay away Jeffrey) makes more sense than 13/32" ... just why, it's so dumb.
SAE tools for SAE hardware. I agree, saying something like "gimme a 7/16 wrench for this 1/4-20 by 3/8 bolt" is probably like speaking a foreign language to someone accustomed to metric. But you get used to it if you see it every day.
Now metric measurements of wire are fucking ridiculous in my eye. AWG (American wire gauge) all day. The metric equivalent measures the diameter of the wire and calls it like 1 mm2 for 18 awg, 1.5 for 16, 2.5 for 14, 4 for 12 awg etc. AWG keeps it nice and easy, every other even number starting at like 32 down to 2.
It does get a little fucky from there tho lol. Like then it goes 1 and 0 AWG, then 1/0, 2/0, 3/0, 4/0 (pronounced like 1 awwt), then 250, 500, 750, 1000 MCM. But I've also heard those sizes of 250-1000 called KCMIL instead for.... reasons....
It's like most of our measurements. It's what "feels" right if that makes any sense. Fahrenheit is more accurate to what changes are noticeable to the human body, a foot or a yard just paints a way better picture than half a meter etc. I'm sure most of it is based off like farmers or something rather than scientific measurements.
Yeah you make a proper point; most of the stuff the hardware I work with is metric, the wiring is awg, and the temps are Fahrenheit. Honestly other than a 1/4" wrench and 3/8" spark plug socket, I don't remember the last time I used any of my anything out of my box wrench sets. They basically are wall ornaments that collect dust. Same with range, I would just use meters since they're close enough. You know like, target out 300 meters leading left.
We bend raw copper and aluminum busbars at work for manufacturing industrial electrical systems. All standard hardware. Plus whatever else goes into it like insulated supports, polyballs, mounting hardware of components on panels, etc. So I'm probably one of the rare exceptions that use SAE more than metric, especially how pretty much every car (even American made ones) use metric now. Other than maybe changing a bolt for an old lawnmower or something, yeah I get why it's not really used much anymore.
Yeah I think an old Briggs and Stratton engine was the only time time I remember using SAE. I mean I still use SAE [Tap] die sets but the irony is the nut outer is metric.
It's funny how often I have to repeat myself; as in you need 3/8 brass pipe or 1/2 brass pipe, no not 3/8 compression or flared. I work on high end espresso machines these days, like 20-40k ones.
Because that was George Washington’s dream
Originally it was because the ship carrying the official metric measures from France to the US in 1793 was captured by pirates. More recently it’s because there was a near-revolt when Jimmy Carter tried to reintroduce it in the 1970s in an attempt to make the US even slightly less regressive.
That reminds me of a road in AZ that had signage in KM when I was a kid. I guess it was a part of this program and it never got changed back? It was always a mindfuck suddenly seeing kms instead of miles on road trips through the area.
It's still there
https://azdot.gov/adot-blog/kilometers-arizona-you-bet
There was a stretch of the Florida coast that had metric in the late 90s and early 2000s, but people kept stealing the speed limit signs. They also had a problem with people misunderstanding 100kph (about 60mph) and doing 100mph instead.
I’m assuming 2L soda bottles are also a remnant of this era.
Not the only country Liberia uses the imperial system too.
I think its more odd that many countries use a mix (e.g. the UK with units like stones and some lengths in imperial while others are not)
Technically they do. The US units are defined by the metric system, and they are full members of the Metre Convention since 1878.
Because the entire country has a foot fetish.
Fact Check: TRUE ✅
Officially, we're the only ones still using imperial units. But, the British use a mash-up of units in their daily lives, as does Liberia and Myanmar.
Reagan pulled the plug on our attempted conversion in 1980.
We'll convert someday, probably after our imperial reign is over, somewhat fittingly.
Except it's not imperial units, it's US customary. Similar names, different actual quantities.
The US uses the metric system. SI units are provided by Federal Government for almost every quantifiable product produced by a federal agency and its been like that for decades. Often they use a mix of customary and SI units, providing conversions between the two in official reports. Generally you see customary units communicated when work more directly impacts the general public with more technical work using the SI system. Many industrial fields use predominantly the metric system as is the case for medicine and many engineering fields.
The US does not use, exclusively, the metric system because many units had been adopted by convention prior to the formalization of the modern international SI system and for cultural or historic reasons people don't want to change.
That's not so different from other places where measurement systems in common use are often retained.
The metric system debate is, for me, one of the most interesting cultural bugbears on the internet. Because it does not really matter that much what system of measurement a nation uses, its really not going to impact your life that much at the end of the day. Particularly in the modern era where conversion is as trivial as looking up a calculator online. But for whatever reason people get huffy about the metric system.
You seem to be well informed. I have no knowledge of what units are used formally, or in engineering or so, but often when I read news from the USA where measures are present, I find that they sometimes use the imperial units, and sometimes "the asteroid of the size of 5 football fields" or "a hole of the size of 4 washing machines opened in the road".
That being said, it's likely a journalism issue. Clickbaits matter more than accuracy. That unfortunately holds true not just for the USA..
This message is half a screen long.
It's a journalism thing, I think. I've never heard anyone in conversation say things like that. I have heard people describe things like that when someone says "Well, how long is x in, mm, ft, km, etc." "It's about this many of that long" or whatever.
My theory is that the federal nature of the US leads to a default popular attitude of hostility toward any policy that originates above the state level, unless there are commercial interests willing to pay for the marketing and campaign contributions to sell it to the people and/or legislators. And businesses aren’t that interested in an improvement that only marginally affects their profits.
One of the very first things the US govt standardized was the size of screws because it was wreaking havoc with shipbuilding efforts.
we love our Imperial units
Maybe because it works? It ain't a good system, but changes like this affect a lot of different areas and would cause a lot of disruption.
Changes happened to other countries too. They also don't have to do it everywhere all at once.
It could be solved by teaching an incoming generation both units, teaching conversion, and printing both units on packaging, speed limit signs, etc, until that generation's children start school, then phasing out the printing of both units.
Bass ackwards