Pope Francis has died
https://news.sky.com/story/pope-francis-has-died-the-vatican-says-12890455Open linkView original on lemmy.dbzer0.com1094
Comments385https://news.sky.com/story/pope-francis-has-died-the-vatican-says-12890455Open linkView original on lemmy.dbzer0.com
This is huge, pinning it for now.
One would even suggest this is world news.
Definitely. This potentially changes the structure of the Church which impacts every country in which it operates.
1.3 billion followers in 160+ countries.
I am surpringly annoyed about Americans somehow finding a way to make this about themselves.
In reality I'm much more worried about the likely counterreformist pushback that is likely about to happen. We're about to find out if a remarkably powerful organization's leader was able to seed enough support to secure a politically aligned successor, and if the answer is "no" a bunch of organizations are about to get even more ruthlessly conservative at a time when a new strain of fascism is seeking moral support. The Catholic Church has been here before. It didn't go well.
"Francis appointed nearly 80% of the cardinal electors who will choose the next pope, increasing the possibility that his successor will continue his progressive policies, despite the strong pushback from traditionalists."
https://www.reuters.com/world/pope-francis-has-died-vatican-says-video-statement-2025-04-21/
The catch is that he did not appoint by ideology. His appointments were mainly based on the guys doing work for poor people, for migrants, and on them doing their jobs in the global south.
Quite a few of these he made cardinals are somewhat conservative in their views, especially regarding sexuality
It helps a bit that typically those that have more compassion tend to be more liberal, but in general even the more liberal Catholics tend to be somewhat conservative
I mean, there are catholic priests and officials that are very liberal - they do exist. But those people do usually not even get into a position as a bishop, so they are not on the table to potentially become cardinals.
Yeah. It's more than annoying, especially as it's the same old Vance joke again and again and again. Which isn't even clever.
I am not a Christian by any means but I worked with them quite often. Francis did change a lot of things and while he wasn't in no way perfect - he did have his drawbacks, for a fucking pope he was much better than anyone before him within the last few hundred years. People (especially on the internet)nowadays expect other people, especially political leaders to "check all their boxes" and if one thing is not going as far as they want, they are alienated.
Often I have the impression that as long as someone is not going "all the way" in the right direction they are seen as bad as someone who does not do anything at all or goes in the wrong direction. (Which is ironic because the church itself has evolved past the "saint or sinner" directive)
Francis has been going in the right direction probably 60% of the way and 10% in the wrong direction. Is the Catholic church there yet? No. Is there a big chance it might turn back? Yes. Would he been elected if he was so reformist it was sure he would topple everything and go 100%? Surely not.
But he did much more than any of his predecessors did.
Any much more most commenters do.
Besides: It's okay to feel sorry for an old man dying. That's called fucking compassion. I work in healthcare and have seen a lot of people die. I feel sorry for almost all of them.
In the end a human has died. Period.
So progressive there's an anti Vatican II movement in America
I don't feel that sorry when an old person dies, they've lived their life, and dying is a natural part of the cycle. I do feel bad for those they left behind, who will miss them dearly.
I feel worst for young people who die before their time, and never got to experience the life they planned for, that's a true tragedy.
I'm entitled to not feel sorry for the unelected ruling class dying. Whether it's the queen, or it's the pope.
Both brought more misery than did good. The existance of them both were a net negative to the world.
Fuck the church.
The pope is elected in his country
Great post. Holding the leash on the next Pope would be a huge strategic coup for the MAGA Nazis, and too much of a temptation to resist. There are no coincidences in politics, and dropping dead immediately after Couchfucker's visit is to close to not be suspicious.
I expect a full court press by the MAGA Nazis to have their hand-picked creep as the next Pope, and they will make all sorts of threats to accomplish it. In the end, if the Vatican chooses someone other than the MAGA Nazi candidate, Catholics will suddenly become one more persecuted political democraphic in America.
The joke about Vance killing him? I don't think people mean it as a joke. That's how the mob-like tactics work. It's a very real consideration. Organized crime is intertwined deeply in American government and geopolitics.
Shit even the Vatican was wrapped up in mafia stuff in the past and probably still is.
Sorry but I used AI for this;
"The Vatican has been associated with mafia connections, particularly during the papacies of Pope Paul VI and Pope John Paul II. These connections have been linked to financial scandals and criminal activities involving figures like Michele Sindona and Roberto Calvi. Sindona, a reputed international mafia chieftain, was appointed as the Vatican banker by Pope Paul VI, leading to significant financial disasters and frauds. Calvi, the head of Banco Ambrosiano, was also deeply involved in money laundering and had ties to the mafia and the Vatican Bank under the leadership of Archbishop Paul Marcinkus. Marcinkus faced criticism from Pope John Paul II's inner circle but was protected by the Pope, highlighting the complex relationships within the Vatican during this period.
In recent years, efforts have been made to address these issues. The Vatican created a working group in honor of Rosario Livatino, a Catholic judge killed by the mafia, to study the expulsion of criminal organizations from the Catholic Church. These initiatives reflect ongoing efforts to separate the Church from criminal influences and to promote integrity within its financial and organizational structures.
The Vatican's financial dealings have long been a source of scandal and embarrassment, contributing to a "black legend" that mars the Church's image. Pope Francis has been particularly active in reforming Vatican finances, centralizing control over Vatican assets to reduce the risk of corruption and illegal activities.
Despite these efforts, concerns about mafia influence persist, with investigations and arrests involving mafia members and their alleged cooperation with the Vatican Bank."
And trump....
"Donald Trump has been linked to organized crime figures throughout his career. He has been accused of doing business with and receiving favors from the Mafia during his early years as a developer in New York City. For instance, Trump used concrete supplied by companies controlled by the Mafia to build his properties, including Trump Tower, at a time when the concrete industry was under Mafia control.
Trump's lawyer, Roy Cohn, had ties to several Mafia bosses, and Cohn introduced Trump to some of these figures. Trump also had business dealings with individuals who had connections to organized crime, such as John Staluppi, a "made" member of the Colombo crime family, and Kenneth Shapiro, who worked for Philadelphia mobster Nicodemo "Little Nicky" Scarfo.
In 2013, Trump admitted on David Letterman's show that he had encountered "characters" associated with organized crime during his time in New York, but claimed he tried to stay away from them.
These allegations have been detailed in various books and articles, including Wayne Barrett's biography "Trump: The Deals and the Downfall" and a book titled "'MAFIA' Don: Donald Trump's 40 years of Mob ties" by H.B. Glushakow."
Organized crime is a key player in national and geopolitics. It never went away, they got better at it. And corrupted officials got better at hiding them. America is probably currently dominated by organized crime right now.
There are four main rulers of humanity, nations/politicians, organized religions, 1% wealth business, and organized crime. They all mingle and all manipulate the poor and vulnerable to gather followers, soldiers, and sycophants in order to maintain control. It's very real war happening.
Oh yeah, the death of an 88-year-old man who has been suffering from serious medical issues for months is so odd and unexpected that it is more reasonable to propose that the vice-president of the US personally killed him.
Vance is actually a secret agent that killed the Pope, no one would suspect the murder of a dying man! It's like a bad Tom Clancy novel.
I don't expect a conservative backlash, on the contrary Francis's Pontificate has weakened the conservative wing considerably. Given that 80% of the voting cardinals were appointed by Pope Francis, I would expect them to elect a successor that continues in the same direction, perhaps even a more radical one.
During his pontificate Francis also made a lot of efforts to bring in new groups into the corridors of power. Not only by his appointment of cardinals, but also e.g. by reforming the Curia with Praedicate evangelium.
Compared to the iron grip the reactionaries held before my understanding is you're right. That doesn't mean that wing is going to get away with a continuist choice. I mean, it's more likely than it used to be, but I'm not making a call until the Habemus Papam.
As a non-Catholic American, I have the same worry for the global geopolitics. It just so happens that the united states is part of those geopolitics.
It sure feels like the tides are turning conservative everywhere, but apparently a Filipino progressive is a favorite to be next
We'll see where it goes. They aren't exactly transparent about these things, and they've been arguing among themselves for a while. We'll know with the white smoke, I suppose.
There is a roman saying, "the one who enters conclave as the pope [to be] leaves it as a mere cardinal"
There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again.
I can't read this. The saying I know is probably Roman: "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me".
https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/6436-there-s-an-old-saying-in-tennessee-i-know-it-s
As dumb as Bush was, he was smart enough to not say "shame on me" on camera.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bushism
You can find the original quote in the examples section.
Ah, I didn't knew there was a president in America that made the mistake of paraphrasing it like that. Shame on americans that keep bein' fooled in that fake democracy :P
I'm not Catholic, and i don't follow this stuff closely, but I've seen a LOT of popes come and go, and as far as I remember, the chosen pope has NEVER been the early favorite. Anybody whose name is being knocked around right now is unlikely to be the final choice, recently-historically speaking.
Bummer. Then I guess it’ll be another Italian.
A very old one indeed. It's never certain how conclaves will go.
I think in terms of the church the term "conservative" does not necessarily align with the political understanding. The largest shift in the church is demographic. White Europeans are loosing power rapidly in the catholic church. Subsequently the catholic church will align less and less with "Western" conservatives, and their imperialist understanding of geopolitics.
I expect to see much more opposition of "christian conservative" politicians in Europe towards the catholic church.
Ironically just yesterday the president of the German federal parliament of the "christian conservative" CDU told the Churches to shut up about politics.
It is not ironic, half of Germans are protestants.
Nope. Half of Germans (47%) don't have a confession. 21% of Germans are protestants.
She is describing herself as catholic though and even studied catholic theology.Her attack was directed at all churches, not just the catholic church.
More specifically she said "the churches shouldn't be another NGO" and then gave examples as to what they shouldn't talk about. So the idea is already that "NGO"s are something bad and civil society voicing political stances is bad. But then religious institutions commenting on how politics are in violation of the values the religion teaches, seems to be particularly disdained. This is also historically worrisome as the churches in the GDR used to be hailed for taking a stance against the regime and there is a lot of stories, how the churches in the third Reich would have taken stance, although i am not sure if the ratio of opposition/silence/collaboration is accurately represented in those stories.
I'm waiting for someone to suggest that a it's time for the first woman pope.
Haha I was thinking that, but there’s no way. And that’s a problem
Me too, bud. Me. Too. Alas, there is no escaping them for me. I do wish more Americans could travel abroad and see the world beyond our borders. I would wager fewer than 20% of Americans have been 50 miles from our borders and it can lead to a pretty insular world view.
Should we make it about a religion that's known for pedophile priests and them being protected? Or about how religion is a long con scam of power and wealth that has been the leading cause of war and persecution for centuries upon centuries?
Granted, by all appearances, I believe he seemed to be a pretty good guy. Hopefully the next pope will be as good. Take what you can while religions still exist, I suppose.
Yes.
Yes, you should.
Because as much as you see it as a domestic throwaway denomination among many, they are extremely and increasingly overrepresented in developing countries (and a couple of European ones as well).
So if you want to know which way the use of contraceptives, the position on gay people or the express support for neofascism is going to go in Africa this is relevant.
It is not about the US or their opinions. And I say this as an atheist.
And turning it into politics, because there is no otger way to talk about things
Sure, discussing politics is important to some degree, but it isn't the most important thing in our lifes
One of the most important persons in the world (atleast for catholics) has died. We shouldn't laugh about it. We shouldn't politicize it. We shouldn't take it to any other context.
I'm surprised and sad at the same time. Even tho i like edgy memes and memes about Pope John Paul II (he is a legend in Poland and polish community do meme about him but in a very respectful way), i really find it bad to do so about Pope Francis right now - so i dislike any post like this
It is literally a political position. There's about to be an election to choose the next guy.
I agree that it is serious in that it's going to have an impact on people's lives, far beyond the relatively small direct power they have. That concerns me.
To be clear, I have zero respect for the institution, but I care about how they wield the influence they have, and I'd much rather have a relatively progressive guy like Francis than a relative reactionary like John Paul II, with all due respect to Polish pride. I'm assuming we can at least agree on taking him over Benedictus.
The church is political. The church should be political. Francis pushed for the church to take more of a stance and it rubbed "christian conservatives" the wrong way, because their political goals are a mockery of the values Jesus preached.
I agree the church is political and should be open about it, and pay taxes like any other political organization. Not just the Catholic Church but all denominations, and across the religions and around the world.
It's just a religion, we strip it of any power if they misbehave.
I am very curious to know who "we" is in this context.
Europe. We have a history of stripping power from christianity, and we'll continue till there's nothing left if necessary.
So yeah, just be powerless, it's just a religion.
Europe has a history of stripping power from Christianity? Like, Europe Europe?
Is this some other Europe I don't know about? There may be an Europe I entirely missed somewhere, I suppose. Because the Europe I know took a millenia to marginally diminish the power of Christianity, and it only happened because of liberal democracy quietly supplanting spirituality for convenience. It was in no way, shape or form a political choice based on them "misbehaving".
I mean, even if that was true, which hah, nah, the places where the Catholic church is growing these days are in Africa and Asia. Stop making me have to lump Europeans with the gross ethnocentrism of USmericans.
I can't really take it serious when Belgium is labeled as catholic Christianity majority.
The majority of practicing religious people are Muslim.
The churches are empty.
For one thing, Belgium is like 2% of the EU, so barely representative. For another, being actively practicing is less relevant than how much political influence is wielded and how many institutions are baked into the legal and political system to align with a particular worldview.
And for another another, this isn't about Europe (or the US) much at all. They matter way less than the countries trying to secure a semblance of civil rights in the context of an increasing interference from Western-originated religions using them as breeding grounds for retrograde conservatism.
So you are very welcome to remain oblivious and pretend you have culturally overcome the footprint of Christianity (which again, hah, nah), but that has zero bearing on the relevance of these events.
Yeah sure it impacted our culture. But nobody believes in Christianity anymore. There's a political party dying because they have Christian in their name. Their voters literally keep dying year after year.
Haven't really heard anyone talk about this religion the past 10 years.
I've heard a lot about Islam though, because of immigrants. Like god damn these people actually still believe in a deity.
Anyways, have fun with your religion stuff. Keep it out of belgium
Cultism is such a potent tendency of the human animal that new cults form spontaneously in the absence of established mythologies (or despite them). Fascism is a cult phenomenon, for instance, and the people vulnerable to such belief systems are unerringly broken in the same way that religious people are broken. It’s like someone scooped out the part of their brains responsible for maintaining epistemic norms and replaced it with oatmeal.
You should know that lots of countries and societies will not do this. Especially in the global south.
Unfortunately that's not the way it works.
Yeah, meeting JD Vance can be too much for anyone.
We should spread the news that Vance killed him!
vance liz truss'd the pope
Honestly, it's not even hat far fetched. He probably denied visits because he was in bad health, yet Americans probably pushed to meet anyway
I believe the pope met with the UK PM and one other dignitary the previous day, so he wasn't denying all visits.
Edit: ... and he did meet with Vance the next day.
I would imagine they have some beautiful, world class couches in the Vatican. I can only imagine what the Pope walked in on!
I'm actually sad about this one. He was by far the best pope of my lifetime.
Low bar.
True but he exceeded the existing bar by a lot.
Yes, but if the next one is a little better, and the next one, and the next one...
The church evolves very slowly.
If politics is anything to take a pattern from, things will get slightly better, but those moments of hope are followed by gigantic steps backwards.
You've really got to boil that frog for a while
Doesn't help they pick the oldest guys in the room to become the pope.
That’s why they keep doing it, same thing in politics. Old people holding back progress in a desperate attempt to grasp onto power just a bit longer.
I mean, I think they're also choosing old people to be pope because it's a "for life" thing. Plus the whole wisdom aspect and shit since it's religion
I feel like anyone who still believes that crap that age necessarily brings wisdom needs to be prevented from making any political decisions at any cost.
Of course it doesn’t necessarily bring wisdom, agreed,
Also agree with considering life experience though
That is by no means a given! In fact we should expect a counter-movement within the church, as that's what happens if a leader is gone that was pushing the organization in a more progressive direction against the will of many influential members.
They will definitely not appoint an even more progressive pope after him. He was “the progressive pope” for a time and now they will shift gears in the other direction for a time. The Catholic Church is not on some steady progressive march. Especially the way politics are going around the world, you can expect a very anti-woke pope next.
Speed bump.
I feel depressed watching someones last days no matter who they are. R.i.p. I think it was brave of him to be in public for so long.
He had the dopest pope rock album too, I imagine that record will stand
Spokesperson of the biggest pedophile ring dies, and that makes me sad.
52
He was the best child rapist out of the lot of them 😢
I hope his religion is real so he can burn in hell with his predecessors.
Don't be sad, he was as just bad as any of his colleagues.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/11/world/europe/pope-francis-homophobic-slur.html
I have terrible news for you if you think using a homophobic slur is as bad as anything the previous popes and cardinals have been doing.
The homophobic slurs should also be a reminder that the catholic church is a homophobic cult.
If your concept of a religious institution that has more than a billion people listening to it is reduced to "homophobic cult", how does that differ from being part of a "bigoted cult" because you condemn people based on your simplistic understanding of their religion?
The catholic church is indeed a homophobic cult that condemns homophobia as a sins for which you get punished in hell, having million of followers or being popular doesn't change the fact. Scientology has millions of followers are we going to give them any credibility because of that?
How does your sentiment differ from someone who would say:
You take the broadest brush and just stroke over everything, instead of being willing to accept any nuance.
Probably because one is founded on evidence and the other one is founded on a made up concept by the institution in question.
Isn't this 'whataboutism'?
Francis was known as a liberal reformer, making headlines across the globe by permitting the blessing of same-sex couples and promoting global action on climate change.
Francis worked as a janitor and a chemical technician in the food-processing industry before entering the seminary.
He was outspoken about clergy abuse and called on the Catholic Church to "act decisively" against paedophile priests just months after his 2013 appointment.
He was also known as the ceo of a homophobic and misogynist cult and for strolling around italy in a private helicopter.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jan/19/pope-francis-victims-church-sexual-abuse-slander-chile
Wasn't this then 6 months later:
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/pope-francis-begins-purge-at-chilean-church-over-sex-abuse-scandal https://apnews.com/article/33b208ef4bc84576a503b059629607db
Sounds like you could maybe... forgive him... for making a mistake while attempting to cleanup the worst mess in modern catholic history?
But I'm not a catholic or religious at all
They took action after there was a public backlash. Do you know what the context of the original comment is?
https://www.bishop-accountability.org/2021/07/a-teen-was-accused-of-abuse-inside-vatican-city-powerful-church-figures-helped-him-become-a-priest/
This was tbe same man that said being homosexual isn't a crime and doesn't merit persecution for it, albeit by the catholic creed being a sin.
An insult is only as long someone allows it to be.
Downvote away.
He did get a lot of things right:
Pope Francis says Trump 'is not a Christian,' Trump responds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnv6tIRW86A
He's the internally appointed CEO of a cult persuading people to believe that ghosts are real. The blessing of same-sex couples is a stunt the catholic church pulled to save face in 21st century, their different treatment of homosexual couples still speak loud about their cult homophobia.
You are hard pressed to be more of an atheist than I am.
You expect dogma to be nullified with a snap of finger? Even more when that same dogma is taken from the book on which the creed is built upon?
As if people require any sort of excuse to shun and persecute those who are different.
I find it more important countries to codify into law the right for anyone, regardless gender or sexual orientation, to enjoy the same rights, including marriage if so they choose but like it or not, a man forcing that small change into a monolithic, organized, religion is something to be recognized.
I expect homophobic cult leaders to be called out for what they are and not praised or defended
Then start by the first line priests.
Those can be some of the worst individuals in the church, and some of the best, at the same time.
There are incredibly forward thinking, humanist and humane individuals acting as local parish priests, individuals that entered the ranks for personal calling and devotion, doing their best to push back on backwards thought and belief on "pious" communities. Those should garner wide support, when it is the exact opposite that happens, with usually the most reprobate and closed minded individuals being seen as "good" priest and thus rising in the ranks, to keep the status quo, one generation after the other.
Institutions are made of people. That man did little but achieved something to move the creed in a better direction. Most just tend to small affairs or outright go for even more dogmatic understandings of outdated subjects, which by itself drives away more people.
Now that I think about it, as reading or being knowledgeable of what any "holy" book holds is the best way to create atheists, maybe those are doing the best job.
Even the "best" individuals in the catholic church are still the members of a homophobic and misogynist cult persuading people to believe that ghosts are real. catholic church bending and changing its own sacred holy laws as it suit them is more proof of their bullshits.
Of course the worst pro-russia troll would also troll against catholicism, why am I surprised
Calling out the the admin of a homophobic cult and pointing out their homophobic slurs is "trolling"
You are definitely in good faith for accusing people of being russian trolls in a pope thread...
This comment proves the church’s PR experiment worked. The lies worked. He wasn’t progressive, he was a hard conservative, homophonic, misogynist who defended pedos and spewed hollow platitudes while sitting on a trillion dollars. But the church put him in place and threw a huge propaganda machine behind him and you bought it
Edit: to the pedo lovers in this thread who are gonna miss king pedo
https://youtu.be/DUlj48Rvp1c
I think he was the first Pope Francis. But even if he were the second, that wouldn’t make him a homophone.
I guess all popes are homophonic in some languages, like in Spanish “la papa” is potato and “el papa” is pope.
You win the award for funniest spelling pedantry of the month.
Did you even see the earlier Popes? He did everything you say and yet this guy was liberal by every definition compared to the guy he replaced. Benedict was nasty and he knew it.
He said a lot. Did the opposite and continued the church’s status quo, you’re a fool if you think his pro lgbt talk was sincere, actions speak louder than words
Conspiracy theorists are so weird... Like do you imagine a smokey room with the pope and a group of cardinals talking about how they want to represent the church in a completely opposite way to how they want it to be? Or is there a "shadow church" that controls it all and the pope is unaware?
Which marvel movie best reflects the situation do you think?
I mean, the Catholic Church is a political organization that has global reach, I don't think it's a wild conspiracy that they carefully consider their appearance.
This phrase, right here, sounds like it came from a conspiracy theorist. Because that's exactly how conspiracy theorists rationalize things. Anything that counters my belief is "lies" and it's just a "PR experiment". It can't possibly be that the pope is, like most people, complex with varied beliefs and potentially even contradictory beliefs.
No. It's "lies from a PR department". 🙄
But they do have a pr department. The holy see is a political organization. They are an internationally recognized government with diplomatic relationships. While not a member state of the UN they are permanent observers and influence decision making on a worldwide scale, and it's not a secret that the church, which is run by the same person as the holy see (the Pope) has had its fair share of controversy.
I don't think it's a stretch to think the holy see spends time and effort in order to make their appearance, and the appearance of the church, look better.
"I don't think it's a stretch" and "they have a PR department" are not "evidence".
lol we have proof of these people causing genocides and raping children but sure that’s far fetched
Proof of things "A" is not proof of things "B"
It's a true shame. Francis was the most "eco-socialist" pope we are going to get. Managing to offend entrenched conservatives deserves respect.
Yeah, he ALMOST restored the office of Pope to relevancy :D
When his draconian successor inevitably comes along, we can go back to ignoring the papacy again.
The most PR pope, never meant anything he said, all gaslighting and hollow platitudes, no actual change, still shuffled around and defended pedos
Ah yes, the expected purity test. Let's just ignore any progress made and make snark remarks online while we wait for the 100% ideologically pure.
The only purity test pass would be a person who refuses to do it, the only progress would be the collapse of that genocidal church
I fucking hate you Vance, this is your fault!
Guys. Joe Biden is Catholic. The Vatican has an opportunity to do the funniest thing ever.
JD Vance visits the Vatican, the pope literally dies
I guess he didn't say "thank you"
Like Liz Truss to the queen.
Pope is recovering;
meets JD Vance
dies a couple days later....
Hmm
let's wait a couple days and see if he comes back
You literally missed the right number by one.
I don't think they did. In the bible, Jesus died Friday afternoon and rose Sunday morning. That's pretty close to two days- just over a day and a half, depending on when God yoinked his son's spirit.
The tradition took place over three days, but we'll know if he's a'risin' by the day and a half mark.
Well done! As Martin Luther King Jr said:
“Love cannot drive out pedantry, only more pedantry can do that”
He was an alright Pope in the end. Not a soulless bastard like Benedict.
He even opted out of the traditional, expensive papal funeral and requested to just be laid in state and then buried in a wooden coffin lined with zinc.
Why zinc?
It's a fairly common lining for coffins that you're gonna either transport internationally or put in mausoleums. It keeps the body preserved for longer and takes about 100 years to break down.
I can't not read this as "expensive paypal funeral".
Well, now it's time to swing to an even Nazier Nazi.
You joke but there is a genuine possibility that the Vatican might elect someone who is more conservative, if not very so. The Vatican under Francis had been the most progressive it had been in decades. And it ruffled the feathers of many conservative clergies.
Yep, and there's no way Musk, Trump, and Putin aren't trying to rig that vote. A Papal blessing would go a long way to speeding up their march.
Oh, it wasn't a joke, I was just saying it in a humorous manner.
They are priests, they are all the same, no matter the cult or the specific affiliation (Jesuit in this case): https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/pope-paedophile-priests-children-god-vatican-b2336786.html
According to the article, the context for the flashy headline is that all Catholics are children of God and that all must be treated with compassion, while still acknowledging that pedophiles are monsters.
I will not pretend that Francis's hands are totally clean. He has mistreated abuse cases in the past. Around 2019 he actually started implementing some reforms that have to some extent helped. While I don't think he did enough, he did much more than his predecessors. I highly suspect the next pope will be another Benedict and not another Francis. Consequently, I suspect that the mishandling will get worse.
The child in me kind of wishes he had passed on 4/20 Easter, but alas.
That being said, while I'm not religious I appreciate a lot (not all) of what this Pope has done. His Apostolic Exhortation on the Idolatry of Money, and the gross inequality wrought by capitalism is worth a read.
Looks like it's time for another pope race. I would like to throw my hat in the ring. As a lapsed Catholic trans woman who's never so much as visited a seminary, I know I'm an unorthodox choice. But maybe it's time to mix things up. My central campaign planks? We're going to bring back indulgences and try to make the Papal States a thing again. Also, expect skits and improv sessions to have a big place in Catholic mass in the future!
"That was because he refused to welcome god-king JD vance in person!!!! God punished the pope for his impertinence!!!!"
- Some MAGA-Nut somewhere, probably
probably closer to all of 'em
Gfdi. I'm not religious, but knowing that Catholics are going to choose a new Pope, I can only look forward to more bad news of comformity to godawful world news in the form of a shitty New Pope who inspires and empowers all the shitty people.
Great, one more thing to make the world even worse.
Yeah, “guess I’ll die” is a normal reaction to meeting JD.
Yeah, it's sarcastic but could be definitely true: https://newsthump.com/2025/04/21/pope-loses-will-to-live-after-meeting-jd-vance/
Lmao this has my rolling
Probably, he finished him...
AI slop
https://cagle.com/cartoonist/marian-kamensky/2025/04/21/295020/easter-miracle-with-jd-vance
https://humor-kamensky.sk/cartoons
If you're gonna call someone out you can atleast double check first
TBF the layout is pretty confusing.
I did consider when making my comment that it could likely be work of an artist, but if the artist chose AI slop as their aesthetic, it was a conscious choice. Thanks for the source, though.
Close. It was more like "i may be wrong but I don't care".
I'm too lazy to look it up so just imagine that gif of Chidi saying "That's worse".
Wait, so the vaccine hating vp bowman visits the Vatican and the next day the pneumonia suffering Pope dies. Coincidence...?
It would be more than coincidence if the next Pope was an ultra-conservative, GOP-friendly guy from the US and A. Of course this would never happen, but.... ehm... who knows?
You mean like this guy?
Who is Raymond Burke, the cardinal Donald Trump wants to be the next Pope?
Currently sixth favourite only, so barring some big upset, not likely to win.
Perhaps he will rise higher after HitlerPig threatens their tax-exempt status.
I doubt that the Catholic Church is big enough in the US for them to have that much of an influence on who the next pope is. There hasn't ever been a pope from the US.
Boom! There's the hook. The Catholic church is HUGE in America, the fourth highest Catholic population in the world, behind Brazil, Mexico, and Phillipines, and ahead of countries like Italy, Spain, France and Argentina, all of whom have contributed Popes.
Expect the MAGA Nazis to demand that the next Pope be an American of their choice, with all sorts of threats to follow, including removing their tax-exempt status.
Good one, this needs to be much higher.
I was going to post that HitlerPig will be pushing his own choice for Pope, and here we are. Now I'm wondering if Couchfucker slipped something into the Pope's tea.
JD probably got the measles and took it to see an old sickly man. Hence why he was so insistent on seeing him.
Vance is too stupid, he'd fuck it up.
Remember this?
He'd end up putting the Iocaine powder in his own tea.
Someone else in his entourage did something nefarious.
Jesus, he looks like that mobbed up character from the Untouchables:
From what I understand, the rest of the Roman Catholic Church sees US Catholics as weird and a kind of lost cause. So I have doubts that the US would have too much sway over the conclave.
They usually are, but I also had doubts that a weirdo becomes POTUS again. Everything seems to be possible these days...
He’s been sick for a while.
That just makes him easier to knock off.
That's not even a joke. What you said is true.
I didnt even mean it as a joke. I wouldn't put it past the MAGA Nazi scum.
Check out my other post. https://feddit.org/post/11169779/6171380
Ask Pete
Pope: dies
Corpo God : "We are happy to announce the relocation of Pope Francis to his next steps within the company. We are thankful for their contribution for the last 12 years and we look forward to their future achievements. BR, management.
Someone liked this guys death...
Someone also clicked the comment suggestion and said "congratulations"
Boy asks Pope if his atheist father is in heaven.
Humility, patience, kindness, grace, and rationality. Would that we should have more leaders like him in the future.
May he rest in peace.
Bring him back, take Trump instead
I declare myself pope, and as my first official act, I'm excommunicating all my antipopes!
This has so been done. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conclavism
I declare myself Epop and denounce the Pope!
Friendly reminder: Progressive for a pope is still a transphobe who actively facilitated the rape of children. Not to mention all the horrific colonizer shit.
Rest in piss Frankie boy.
I hate that you're right. Like, seeing how kind and compassionate the man was outwardly in the day to day and knowing of the horrors he and the church participated in and tried to hide... It makes me all the more sour to organized religion.
100%
After the way he let Robert Finn skate when he ran cover for a priest raping kids, Francis belongs in Hell. It's a bummer that Hell isn't a real place.
I mean... he spent some of his final hours with jd vance. Doesn't get more hellish than that.
It's like, he was pretty woke for a Pope, but, he was still a Pope.
I don't think things would have worked out well had he gone full prog anyway. There'd be schisms for sure. Hell, Trump would probably declare an American Catholic Church and have himself elected Pope of it. (Shit, I really shouldn't have given him that idea)
I don't really know which way he personally felt. But even a Jesuit at the end of the day is a Catholic.
You'll understand if I honestly don't care if a fundamentally hateful and harmful org broke up.
If "maybe we should stop supporting transphobia and rape and..." will kill an org... that org probably shouldn't exist at all.
My guess is that they will elect a conservative pope to replace Francis. It is no secret that there are court intrigues and in-fighting in the Vatican between progressive and conservative clergies. Pope Francis openly went toe to toe with many ultraconservative, MAGA clergies in America, de-frocking one of the priests.
Vatican itself does not have much influence on this election. Francis was smart enough to appoints lots of bishops from "remote" regions like for example Mongolia or Pakistan, who have not been able to form political networks with each other and make it far more difficult for court intrigues to work out. Yes , the conclave surely will see those again, but there should be a counter weight at play here
You ended up in the Catholic thread bro, everyone here bought the PR and actually believed this guy was good
You will hardly find any theists in Lemmy, let alone staunch Catholics.
You have to give credit to where it's due, Pope Francis did his best as the leader of one the biggest religious organisations. And I am not defending where the gap of his leadership had been, but leaders never have absolute authority because this is an often false notion they always do. Keep that mind, as he still have to contend with his subordinates. I mean, a leader is still just one person versus the aristocrats and elites who lend support and authority. The subordinates actually have the power if you think about it (like, who elects the pope after all?) That being said, I am no longer religious but I have read over the years of court intrigues of friction between conservative and progressive Catholic clergies. Many conservative clergies complain about Francis and said they miss Pope Benedict XVI. Francis had to play a delicate balance of court politics.
He was like man this guy sucks, I don't want to live in a world where this guy has power, then dies. I feel the same dude...
Any signs of plutonium poisoning?
So him not meeting Vance earlier may not have been a snub then☹️ (he did)Was he involved in any of the traditional Easter stuff? (He was)
I mean... he did meet Vance. I don't know why there was lies being spread around about that. All you have to do is do a quick little search and you'll get pics from several angles of the pope and Vance chatting.
I will say, though, that the pope looked rough, so it isn't super surprising that he passed shortly after.
That's what I get for getting my news from Lemmy memes.
Updated my comment
That's fair. I have fallen for fake news myself a few times too.
On Saturday April 19th he met with Pietro Parolin. This was framed as a snub. On Sunday 20th he met with Francis.
“I know you have not been feeling great but it’s good to see you in better health,” Mr. Vance told the pope, according to video footage of the visit
So was he promoted or fired by the man upstairs?
Relocated to another position, a lateral movement perhaps.
Siento que hay tanto más que podría haber hecho y no pudo o por la edad o por el rozamiento con el resto del sistema. Le tocara a sus sucesores continuar supongo...
Entiendo porqué, pero también lamento que no haya vuelto Argentina.
QEPD Bergoglio
Did Vance/Trump mafia kill him because the Pope upset him?
Do other religions go to such great lengths to cover this kind of news? Like would we see the same for the Dalai Lama?
RIP Pope Francis. Glad you put Just Dumb in his place.
Good. I’m an indigenous person who has plenty of relatives who suffered under church run schools. This pope was nothing but a PR figurehead, down vote me all you want but my native brown ass is finished worshiping your popes and colonial religion.
I will take down votes with pride, it’s not new for me to get shit on for refusing to bow to this colonial, religious idiocy
RIP.
This is such a weak form of expressing emotion and respect that it actually expresses the opposite.
username checks out
Rest in piss indeed
He didn‘t die. He became more powerful than you could ever imagine.
Somehow Palp.....I mean Pope returned.
Repeat with me: "Morto 'n papa, se ne fa n'antro".
This is Romanesco (the dialect of Rome) for "When a Pope is dead, another one is made", usually used to comment situations in which the present condition will not be changed simply because of how the underlying mechanisms work.
Literally nothing to see here.
It is generally used similarly to "life goes on". Even if with more pessimism about the fact that certain things don't change (sometimes for good though).
It is still going to be a big deal for a few weeks though...
Depends how tuned in you are. If it wasn't for this pinned post on Lemmy I wouldn't have known.
Trump only likes popes that don't die at a similar age. In fact, had the pope become president and leading racist nazi asshole, he would be alive today.
My theory is that pope Francis when to see where the heck god is at. Cuz WTF man!
Wonder if he really made it through the Easter or whether they kept it covered so that it looked like so
He made an appearance at Easter mass yesterday.
Mustered up that last goodbye to the people
Hologram technology really has come a long way
Did they do an Easter at Bernies?
There goes one neighborhood in Rome
"Before Francis took ill in February, he criticized President Donald Trump’s mass deportation policy. 'What is built on the basis of force,' Francis warned in a letter to American bishops, 'and not on the truth about the equal dignity of every human being, begins badly and will end badly.'"
-New York Times
Now I'm not saying Vance murdered the pope but I'm not not saying it either...
Obviously, he should have been nicer to JD Vance. God punished him for his rudeness.
You joke, but I'm sure that someone somewhere is saying it seriously.
I know. That's what's scary. You remember the post from somewhere, where a redneck called the pope not a real Christian? Because he showed compassion?
One Pope closer to "Peter the Roman":
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes
“I know you have not been feeling great but it’s good to see you in better health,” Mr. Vance told the pope, according to video footage of the visit
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/20/us/politics/pope-francis-meets-with-jd-vance.html
Rest in peace Pope Francis 🕯️
Well, that's hardly a good excuse for pawning JD Vance off on some flunky. Seriously, popes these days...
When we needed him more than ever.
I'd love to make a joke about Russia sabotaging the pope election, but it wouldn't even surprise me...
Incredibly sad to see him go.
Ope. There goes the Pope.
Noooooo! He had his whole life ahead of him.
Getting the good news out of the way early this week. Too bad they'll probably select a replacement for him.
Killed by the US for not wanting to talk to JD 😔
Poisoned to make room for new pope tRump
Again?
damn, I had hoped that Vance getting snubbed was a direct action
Damn, that was one crazy pope.
Gotta get that zio pope in there. :/
Republicans are celebrating and calling him a commie...
Breaking news: Pope Francis is still dead.
I derive a sick pleasure from seeing people I dislike die. Hihehohohiho
lol oops god bless uwu
Well, he's not the first.
his grave is a gender neutral bathroom
One less pedo
Should've worn a suite to that JD Vance meeting.
Bye.
Bye bitch
He wasn't "progressive" in any real form. It was just a good brand when he became Pope.
I wouldn't expect the "progressive" part to change rapidly up or down in the Latin church.
Just one mafia boss being replaced with a successor. Not big news.
it's relative, he was progressive compared to the thousands of popes who came before him
Francis was Pope # 266.
👍
Trump will appoint an excommunicated pedophile priest as a replacement.
I'm not exactly sure how it works, but I don't think the American president gets to appoint the next pope....
Hefty tariffs on communion hosts
Like that will stop him from trying.
Well, yeah, but that wouldn't stop him from trying.
This is likely to be one of the biggest news stories of everyone reading this lives. Regardless of your personal feelings on organized religion, Catholism, etc. This was someone who led a 2000 year old organization with over 1 billion members.
Hopefully, everyone posting "lol JD Vance killed him" can reflect on this 50 years from now as they look back on their lives, and the small amount of dopamine they received was worth it. And maybe they'll have even moved past their incessant need to post surface level thoughts and memes and developed the ability to process information and add value to a conversation. But I doubt it.
I say all of this as someone who actually hates the Catholic church. I want to end by saying that all you people spamming those comments, posts, memes, etc. You are the reason the internet is getting worse.
Well three popes have died since 2005.
I mean, people can simultaneously realise the gravity of this, AND poke fun at the coincidence thst the Pope died after meeting JD Vance.
You aren't contributing much either by making an entire comment criticising those people. Why not ignore and move on and make an useful comment?
It's also okay to not have something important or ground-breaking to say. I don't think people saying JD killing him are ruining the internet.
There have been several popes in my lifetime and the only one I really remember going was jp2, and that wasn't even a huge story in the scheme of things.
Why is this pinned? This person was the CEO of a cult persuading people ghosts are real and manipulating them to give the cult money. Thanks god he's dead.
The loss of the Pope represents a seismic shift impacting 1.3 billion Catholics in 160 countries. It's the definition of "World News".
I'm not a Christian and I recognize this which is why I pinned it. Will do the same thing for his funeral and the election of the new Pope.
A billion people live in India, i expect a pinned post next time india pm dies, for his funerals and for the elections of a new pm...
If Modi suddenly died, you bet it would be pinned. Same in Politics if Trump died.
There's a time and place to be a euphoric neckbeard. This is neither.
The cult this guy is the internally appointed CEO of, does not spare people guilty of homosexuality even after their dead: they are to be damned for the rest of the eternity.
A pinned post where people are praising him to me looks like the right time and place to remind people about the shady shit this guy was involved in.
Yeah yeah yeah you've spammed the same thing all over the thread and I don't give a fuck. We all know the issues with religion.
It's already been shown elsewhere you're sensationalizing old stories to turn another person's death into your soapbox. It's crass, and it turns people away from your message. If you're going to use someone's death as a jumping-off point for pointless masturbatory anti-religious rhetoric, be prepared for people to see it for what it is and you for what you are. Or at least use a fucking thesaurus dude.
They are not old stories, the homophobic slurs were from last years and the context is a recent scandal.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2021/vatican-sexual-abuse/
"Someone" is the internally appointed CEO of a cult that use death for any sort of non-sense masturbatory rhetoric.
"Old" is subjective, and I'd still say they're old and have been repeated ad nauseum, but you definitely left out the context that would cast doubt on your initial message. This is intellectually dishonest.
I wish you'd quote what I said about the thesaurus and take that into consideration, too. There are other words besides "internally appointed CEO" and "cult." It's literally just spam for spam's sake. We get it dude, you're mad at the church. Go be mad at it someplace other than a news thread.
You don't come across as someone who cares about these issues or the people who have been hurt by the church. You come across as someone exploiting death for the sake of argument, which makes you no better than the Catholic church by your own admission.
Now fuck off back to r/atheism and quit spamming lemmy news threads with edgy drivel.
Here is it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2021/vatican-sexual-abuse/
The cult leader was addressing sexual abuses in church seminars and said that there are too many "fags" in there.
Unlike the catholic church i'm not exploiting death to convey lies and promote my cult, i'm not exploiting death at all i'm simply commenting on a pinned thread about the shady stuff this guy was involved in.
r/atheism is where they discuss the non-existence of god. A news thread looks fit to discuss the shady scandals involving the person in question. Perhaps you should go to r/chatolicchurch
At this point, it just feels like I'm punching down. So I'm gonna go ahead and stop, because you clearly are not equipped to meet me where I am.
Please continue spamming the same link with the same commentary. They are sure to listen to you if you just scream louder. You aren't swinging at ghosts at all. :)
Nah. Cults are small religions. He was in charge of the biggest religion. That's the opposite of a cult.
I'm gonna specify next that the pope is in charge of the biggest cult.
He condemned the Russian aggression on multiple occasions.
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-pope-francis-religion-moscow-8daccc2a83b24a94cff36f3b2a45dc4d
Quick search shows he did condem it.