Roku explores taking over HDMI feeds with ads
Roku is exploring ways to show consumers ads on its TVs even when they are not using its streaming platform: The company has been looking into injecting ads into the video feeds of third-party devices connected to its TVs, according to a recent patent filing.
This way, when an owner of a Roku TV takes a short break from playing a game on their Xbox, or streaming something on an Apple TV device connected to the TV set, Roku would use that break to show ads. Roku engineers have even explored ways to figure out what the consumer is doing with their TV-connected device in order to display relevant advertising.
https://www.lowpass.cc/p/roku-hdmi-ad-insertion-patentOpen linkView original on lemmy.world1300
Comments477
Any company trying to use the HDMI-CEC protocol in such a subversive manner should lose their license to the HDMI standard IMO.
The HDMI forum is run by big companies so that is not happening, sorry
Death to HDMI. DisplayPort is the superior port.
I'm sure that a DisplayPort device in a chain can also inject video, but I have to admit that I would kind of like to not have two competing video standards, and my impression is that DisplayPort tends to lead HDMI technically, so...
DisplayPort: We have
HDMI: Oh yeah? Well, we have
Fuck HDMI.
Oh and HDMI prevents open source GPU drivers supporting HDMI 2.1 natively.
That was covered under "Specifications hidden behind contracts"
Well, DP supports HDCP too.
The bastards that control the hdmi standard: yeah!
Roku: 💰
Bastards: actually no
Collectivism: 💰💰 Fuck Roku.
It's not like they ever properly implemented it in the first place.
I’m mad that they did their broken implementation of sending control codes between devices that never works. I have to disable it on everything so that the correct input gets set.
And then they are killing the universal remote industry so there is nothing to replace it with.
You know HDMI is not some big secret they can use it without the license and ship from overseas like 90% of shit shipped from China.
For cheap gizmos I can see a chinese seller getting away with it (rebranding under another weird name like AWOYO or something, in a sea of identical devices under different brand names), but not a large business like Roku.
Funnily enough, Flipper did exactly that and the Zero is still doing fine. It's a loophole, but it does seem to be working fine-ish.
HDMI Forum have instead resorted to taking GPU manufacturers hostage because they don't want any specs leaking, that's why AMD were denied being allowed to support latest HDMI in their free Linux drivers.
That only works if you're headquartered in China.
Not that the HDMI Fourm will stop them, anyway. More likely, the companies involved will want to license Roku's patent.
Imagine being the guy working on this and how much you hate yourself anytime somebody asks you what you are working on.
Even worse: Imagine being the guy working on this and being proud of yourself.
I think the former situation is worse for the person working on it.
Unfortunately, I bet these guys don't care. I used to work at a company you might have products from and I would constantly hear "Hey, we're a business" as an excuse to degrade the user experience. :(
I remember having an argument with my teacher in college about this. He asked us what we would do if we were asked to code something that could be used for things you personally don't agree with such as the government using tools to "help" but also remove peoples privacy. Or corporations being able to show you more ads. I told him i would refuse. And he said that it would be my job though and sometimes you have to do things you don't like. So i told him i would quit. And for some reason he could not really comprehend that and we got into an argument.
You were talking to a teacher who probably couldn't afford to pay rent if he ever quit his job.
To be fair, most people I know don’t have the financial flexibility to quit their job if they’re asked by their boss to do something objectionable
“Yeah, I know it’s shitty, but it pays the bills 🤷🏻♂️”
We had to listen this C-level guy give a speech how good the last couple of years have been. We've increased the price of services by 50% and the amount of useless upsell shit we push to people has gone up as well. While our wages are still the same and people are getting laid off constantly. But I need food and shit.
Some people also have no qualms in doing the dirty job. They get paid and they don't care.
I knew a guy who went to work for palantir. I asked "what if you end up working on like domestic spying or other sketchy stuff?'
He was like, shrug, iunno. Guy did not give a shit about anyone outside his immediate friend and family group.
And when it turns out the thing he made is used to hurt his friends?
I'm going to guess he values himself more than his friends, and he'd find justifications, but maybe he'd surprise me.
I recall watching a defcon speech given by someone who used to make malware. He opened the speech by apologizing and saying that he knows that he will burn in hell.
The shittiest of enshitifications.
We need an anti-awards show for shit like this.
I like that. If there was a site that did like The Razzies for movies but for technology enshitification, I would definitely watch, and probably follow a blog if it was done well
Youre in luck!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXhmnQzZ7n8
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=NXhmnQzZ7n8
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
The plungies. Winners receive golden plungers
Plungers wrapped in cheap tinfoil, don’t want to give them anything they can melt down and sell
Roku has always been a shitty company that wants to monetize everything. People are finally waking up. How many of us have a Roku remote that advertises a useless or bankrupt streaming service?
I know I’m old, but I miss having numbers on my remote.
Now I have a “sling” and a “crackle” button. 🙁
Yeah, I do miss being able to quickly type a code to jump to a known broadcaster. Opening up a menu is slower than jumping direct to said thing.
The Roku buttons solves that a little bit, but there is only 4, you can’t change them, and they prioritize featuring whoever pays up.
"People are taking the piss out of you everyday. They butt into your life, take a cheap shot at you and then disappear. They leer at you from tall buildings and make you feel small. They make flippant comments from buses that imply you’re not sexy enough and that all the fun is happening somewhere else. They are on TV making your girlfriend feel inadequate. They have access to the most sophisticated technology the world has ever seen and they bully you with it. They are The Advertisers and they are laughing at you.
You, however, are forbidden to touch them. Trademarks, intellectual property rights and copyright law mean advertisers can say what they like wherever they like with total impunity.
Fuck that. Any advert in a public space that gives you no choice whether you see it or not is yours. It’s yours to take, re-arrange and re-use. You can do whatever you like with it. Asking for permission is like asking to keep a rock someone just threw at your head.
You owe the companies nothing. Less than nothing, you especially don’t owe them any courtesy. They owe you. They have re-arranged the world to put themselves in front of you. They never asked for your permission, don’t even start asking for theirs."
– Banksy
Is there an anti-ad community on Lemmy? Or another non-Lemmy place to work through blocking/avoiding this bullshit? I'm so fed up with the advertisement industry. I don't want ads on my devices. I don't want ads in my operating systems. I don't want ads in my content. I don't want ads in the sky. I don't want ads in the ocean. I don't want to be forced to see or hear ads while putting gas in my car.
I really can't emphasize how much I am willing to go through to rid my life completely of advertisements.
If the gas pumps have those unlabeled buttons around a screen, try pressing all of em. The pumps around here (nebraska) will mute the audio when you press one of the buttons, it just isn’t labeled. I’ve taken to writing “mute” on the magic-button with a sharpie whenever I pump my gas.
Wait, the thing about ads while fueling your car is real?
WTF?!
Yep. Just shell stations around here (so far at least)
They’re super loud and in my experience usually political, think local office smear ads and oil lobbyist propaganda.
Well yeah how else are they supposed to make money? /s
Yeah no it’s real and it’s bullshit. They also have ad signage, but that’s been around my whole life, it just keeps getting worse constantly. I remember boycotting the first company to have gas ads, now I don’t have a no ad choice
Years ago I was talking to some engineers at one of the main gas pump manufacturers. They were venting about their company’s partnership with Verifone. While they used to handle credit card reading themselves in the magnetic stripe days, the switch to chip credit cards and readers in the U.S. meant they were going to partner with an established card reader company and Verifone (at least at the time) was the largest and most established in the new chip technology. Verifone was dominating the partnership and making life difficult for the gas pump company, insisting on all sorts of changes to the devices that weren’t necessary for the gas pump but were going to let them do things like run ads at the gas pump. If the pump manufacturer didn’t go along with it, Verifone seemed to have a very credible threat that they were just going to leave and go to the other main gas pump manufacturer. The gas pump companies needed the card reader a lot more than the other way around.
So, these ads have been a long time coming, but it wasn’t the pump manufacturer that had the idea or wanted to do it.
One of my local gas stations had that to where it was so loud you can hear them in the car. A few weeks after they installed them, someone came by with a hand drill and drilled out all of the speakers. Not sure what happened to that hero but we need more people like them.
While I never condone audio speaker violence, I do want to cheer/salute the activism of the person who did the work.
I've tried pressing every button at every pump I've used in my area and this trick doesn't work. I want to epoxy the speakers and screen and glitter-bomb the entire thing.
I won't. But I want to.
Sometimes it’s multiple presses. Around here for example I find that at my local Shell station it’s the second button down on the right side, two or three times.
At the 76 here its also the second down from the right but only needs a single press.
I was trying to figure out how to shut the one at my local grocery store up and discovered that you can get into the administrative menu if you push two buttons at the same time.
You should install Doom on it.
If there's an exposed speaker hole, a long enough push pin or coat hangar wire can probably ruin the cone and coil.
I really can't afford to commit a crime by damaging the pumps, but if I found a way to temporarily disable them I'd be all for it.
I reckon you could kill it with a pin in a casual enough way, maybe make it look like you’re just putting a hand there to lean? Also you have like 4 other people come throughout the day and get gas at that same pump, and they do a similar casual hand movement around the speaker.
You’d be safe as houses, probably!
Appreciate the response, but I will stick to my non-criminal protest against the ad industry.
Definitely had to resist the urge myself a few times to jam my keys into the speaker when the mute button method didn’t work.
Right side, second button down?
Left side, second from the bottom iirc
You’re doin god’s work, sir
Maybe try jamming something in too so it stays forever pressed and muted
♥️
I don't know if they're on the fediverse yet but Adbusters has been doing great work in this space for a long time.
Dammmn that takes me back! I had a subscription to their magazine in high school in the early 2000s. HOLY CRAP they're still selling the Corporate America flag too! Seeing all those tech company logos on the modern version makes me feel so old though... Shit.
I remember when there were a lot more logos on that flag, too
"CONSOLIDATE ALL THE THINGS!!"
It’s not specifically anti-ad, but the lemmy privacy community regularly discusses ad-blocking as it very much overlaps with privacy.
Look into adgaurd or set up pihole software for dns and have a network device dedicated to blocking ads
Roku uses hardcoded Google DNS, so you’ll need to make some additional changes on your router to direct their 8.8.x.x addresses to your DNS service. Instructions at the below site are for Unlocator, but I think should work with any custom DNS.
https://support.unlocator.com/article/131-how-to-bypass-forced-dns-on-roku
You are a fucking hero. I couldn't figure out why my Roku TVs were still able to get ads after blocking everything.
I already have Pi-hole with a bunch of additional lists to be blocked. I also cancelled all streaming services that service ads, and I use Adblock. I still see ads occasionally. What do you suggest for dedicated ad-blocking hardware?
Also, I don't know what to do about the environmental ads.
Make sure you’ve got rules set in your router to redirect Roku’s hardcoded DNS to your custom DNS service.
Some ads can’t be eliminated - for example, if a service delivers ads through the same content servers that the show/movie is coming from.
Custom DNS probably explains how the fucking thing throws a pop-up display informing me that I can watch the movie I'm watching using their Roku app instead if I want to. I was wondering how it knew the name of the movies I have been watching, lol. I will probably just go and reset my WiFi password on my router and 50+ devices, or rip the WiFi antenna out of the TV, not sure which yet.
https://www.yahoo.com/tech/roku-looks-into-serving-you-ads-on-whatever-you-plug-into-its-tvs-120016754.html#:~:text=While%20you'd%20probably%20prefer,to%20identify%20what's%20on%20screen.
Roku's current only saving grace to me is that I can block their shit conveniently. All my Rokus are on my Raspberry Pi in a special group so I can block specific things.
Ugh. Both of these exist already:
https://www.adquick.com/media/transit/train
https://simpleflying.com/inflight-advertising/
Sigh. They also have them in the rain:
https://www.streetadvertisingservices.com/discipline/rain-advertising
Jesus christ no. They're bombarding adds on sidewalks AND putting some extra PFAS shit in the environment? Is this even legal?
I do not like green eggs and spam.
👏🎉
I can't understand why anyone's money entitles them to put their mental parasites into my attention space. They aren't paying me, and I wouldn't take their money no matter how much they were offering. For fuck's sake, I don't even want to experience the offer of money for ad attention.
They Live
Rate those places online to warn others. fucking hailCorporate nonsense
That only works while this is still a niche use case. Just wait until they find out how many more places they can shove ads while we are forced to stand/sit somewhere for 20 minutes!
Perfect. Then people can avoid ads at that gas station by going to another gas station with ads!
I'm still running an older version of NextPVR with three usb tuners and Comskip.exe - it gets most of the ads out of free to air automatically.
Ublock origin and / or expressvpn seem to block some ads on the catch up services, but not all.
YouTube with Ublock origin and Sponsorblock work well.
Newpipe Sponsorblock fork is good as well.
Man... My personal list of banned companies not to buy from is getting scary long.
Wow somehow their idea is even worse than I imagined, glad I don't own a Roku now.
Yeah way to fuck 80% of the purpose of pausing. This is basically malware.
Do not look away from screen while ad is playing, or playback will be paused for 5 minutes for first offense.
Please drink verification can.
Yeah, I thought it was no different than what already happens on my fire cube. The screensaver with ads mixed in.
This is a much bigger invasion of privacy
How the fuck can an economy that's almost nothing but advertisements sustain itself for any period of time? It feels like forcing more and more ads is the only thing anybody does for money anymore.
Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
It’s got electrolytes!
Now I understand everyone's shit's emotional right now. But I've got a 3 point plan that's going to fix EVERYTHING. ...
Big economy, long time to fall. See example: rome or whatever.
They're not even going to profit so much off the ads as they will having a new way to distribute them. Even then its, "line go up this quarter", not "what if sales go down due to this?". They'll license it out to every offer company who needs it for line go up.
Wait until someone invents a bot/AI script that watches ads for you. Then the whole "ads everywhere" will either implode or it'll trigger a war between AI ad makers and AI ad watchers
Either way, it'll be entertaining.
I don't think AI does what you think it does
They already have that it's called click fraud or automated ad clicking, mostly though it's websites that earned money from advertisers who engage in this, as a sleazy way of making more money.
Though if you want to partake in it there are ad blocking extensions that also do it. It's not perfect but it is quite damaging to the advertising industry.
Interested in a 4 hour Adam Curtis documentary?
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
4 hour Adam Curtis documentary?
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Don't buy Roku TVs. Got it.
Used to recommend Roku to others. I will never buy anything from them or recommend them to anyone again.
Someday maybe boards will figure out that "business" people have no idea what they are doing.
Boards only understand "line go up" or "line go down." If something turns off a few weirdos like us but it lets them sell access to millions of eyeballs they'll do it.
They'd step over their own dying mother to make a buck.
I mean, if she's already dying, what's the issue here? I'm losing money if I have to stop and call 911, when she has a perfectly good phone to do it herself.
History is littered with companies that decided they should "milk" their customers instead of providing new and innovative products. They usually don't last all that long, but you're right that the current board members might not gaf about any kind of longer term existence.
That may have been true in the past, but we're in a corporate fuedal system now, with a bunch of little fiefdoms we can't escape ruled by people who wish they had the rizz of Henry VIII or Louis XVI
Damage private property, destroy the chains that bind us.
I’ve always found their monetization strategy icky. Their remotes, with streaming service ads on them, always made me feel gross. Especially since those services change every couple years, and you get stuck with remotes plugging stupid services like Blockbuster and Redbox.
They know what they're doing! Maximizing share price for the next quarter while they jump ship... It's legitimately disgusting.
To be fair, this is just a patent, not Roku saying they will do this. But if they do, then absolutely.
I don't want my money used for shit like this so Roku and I are done regardless.of if they exercise this patent or not.
Stand up, raise your hands, and shout, “McDonald’s!”
Late Stage Capitalism: Using a microscopic laser, we are able to burn our advertiser logos directly into our customer's retinas, so they will see them even as they sleep.
Shareholders: 👏 👏 👏
If Roku actually does this I would definitely never use them again. Completely asinine behavior. Especially because most people aren't even using stand alone boxes with their smart TVs.
I would get rid of my old Roku that I'm sure is too old for this tech and urge everyone I know to never buy anything Roku, and if they did, I would lambast them every opportunity I could.
Our tv turned out to be a roku tv. When we bought it this wasn’t advertised well. Which feels on brand right now.
I will never buy a Roku device because of that forced arbitration stunt. We can add the fact that they are even considering this to the list of reasons.
Yeah, Roku must be on its last legs with the crap they're pulling. All of this says to me: don't buy Roku.
To be fair, a lot of companies are doing the forced arbitration nonsense. I just bailed on Vultr (VPS host) for doing the TOS update nonsense (undismissable pop-up, must accept to access account), and I've been looking for an alternative and every one I've checked has that forced arbitration nonsense in their TOS. Some let you opt out, but you need to send a letter or email to do so.
So instead of dealing with that, I'm actively looking for ways to avoid using any type of service with forced arbitration. I'm upgrading my NAS to support hosting my things, I'm trying to find VPNs that offer a fixed public address so I can expose services behind my NAT, etc. It's incredibly frustrating because it's literally everywhere now...
I don't know. If done well this could be a much better option than pausing whatever you're watching to show an ad.
If youtube showed ads on the corner of the screen while you're browsing around searching for something to watch, it would be a much better platform than what it is today and it would probably make more money too. If Netflix did this they would triple their revenue.
you've described youtube in 2008 and it was a much better platform.
the issue isn't what time to show ads, or where. It's the furthering invasion of marketing into private spaces and lack of apparent concern for end-user consent. There are security concerns when devices can hijack eachother. This technology is likely to rely on some means of detecting idle time, like comparing consecutive frames as the article states, so you try reading a long text on screen in an RPG, and then you're local kroger brand ad plays.
The problem with this philosophy is that it’s basically how ads started on the internet and now we’re here.
Oh it’s just a small, non-intrusive side bar ad, thats okay… oh it’s just ads on both sides… oh it’s just an additional ad on top and on the bottom… oh it’s just an easily dismissed pop up ad… oh it’s just a short video to watch before I’m allowed to see the site… repeat ad nauseam (no pun intended)
Yep, just like autoplay video was common early on, then bad and now it’s common again starting with ads.
Sounds like IOI in the rp1 movie
I quoted this a week or two ago for something else on here, and someone responded along the lines of you know they'd be trying to up that %, and they were 100% right.
Imagine a world where talented engineers would put their minds to work for solving big problems instead of ... I'm not sure wtf this is.
Increasing profit margins....which is the thing our society puts above all else.
Is it really "society" doing this? Or just the deliciously looking, juicy, meaty, 1%?
The 1% - but unfortunately this includes our leaders and lawmakers; so that puts power in the hands of those who value money above all else. And that power is used to extract more money and power from everyone else. Advertising always reinforces their message of course.
The 1% is society.
When was the last time you, or anyone you know, had an actual voice in how things are run?
But that's the opposite of "society"...
This just goes to show how "engineering ethics" course requirements are extremely underrated (and how engineering ethics courses themselves don't go far enough).
It would have to be a society that isn't driven by profit. A society where everyone has the basics guaranteed to them, like housing, food, water, utilities, and transportation. A society where working is optional instead of one where you have to "earn a living".
Just the phrase "earn a living" alone means to me that in capitalism, nobody deserves to live unless they work.
You underestimate how many talented people are in the world. I get that being on Lemmy for so long though lol.
It seems like so long that Roku was not a horrible company. Simple little box for a good price with a small static ad on the home screen to make money.
Seems like a lifetime ago.
Guess I'll never buy a Roku TV then: Get all the way fucked!
Is this why they made people waive their right to sue them?
Yeah... Fuck Roku.
"Wow, this Roku TV is so cheap!"
Your selling your privacy and basically leasing the disposable tv.
I wish a pox on these capitalist pigs.
Every day I get a step closer to dropping all this trash, going back to piracy.
This is gross. I cut my cable because of ads. Have about 3 types of adblockers on my computer to stop them. This hyper marketing is why so many have turned away from traditional entertainment to begin with.
I am more than the ability to spend money and it’s goddamn time everyone say this and boycott companies that do shady garbage like this
A TV is a device that shows you what you want. This is no TV.
Just because they patented it doesn't mean it will happen. Sony patented this evil idea.
We are not far from “please drink verification can”
error! user is attempting to steal lemmy premium™
If Sony patented this idea, does it mean nobody else can use it until it expires? Good guy Sony always looking out for us
I kind of feel like starting a non profit that solely creates patents for evil ideas with no intention of ever licensing them
Patent trollery, but white hat? I can get behind that
I think you can still pay to license patented technology for commercial use if the patent holder is willing. Just because they haven't used it yet doesn't mean they won't though!
If McDonald's needs a surefire way to make me not go to a McDonald's ever again, that's perfect.
MCDONALD'S!
Never connect your smart TV to the internet. Just don't do it. Get a third party device or ideally use an old PC with an appropriate HTPC Linux distro or something.
so glad i never bought into roku
and i never fucking will
good riddance.
This is how you get people to start rooting their TVs
Great, so Smart TVs won't even function as basic displays anymore.
I'm done with Roku. I have one in every room, but they all need to go.
Oh please don't misunderstand my post. I'm in total agreement that this bullshit can't go unchallenged and that posting about it is necessary and good. It's just that, like public comment town halls, all the complaining in the world does not affect change.
Instead, I meant to imply that more needs to be done and in a way that people who have already paid can use to fight against them.
Like encouraging all Roku TV owners (and eventually all Smart TV owners) to contact their local, state and federal representatives to demand they enact consumer protection laws against post purchase forced software changes to functionality of the product (aside from security patches) or forced acceptance of 'terms of service' that essentially take away your right to your preferred method of recourse.
I mean, the idea that we buy something for the features and capabilities it gives us just to have it changed at the whim of a corporate moneymaking scheme is insane. Even moreso when policy changes mean you accept something you don't want to or lose what you paid for (i.e. Roku's forced arbitration acceptance that would otherwise brick the TV).
It's fine to vent frustrations but in the long run, jailbreaking and looking to buy something different doesn't resolve the root problem. Greed overcoming consumer protection in the name of shareholder interest (most of which are corporate C level douches).
Sorry if I wasn't clear with my opinion but my posts usually are already too long before they even start. lol
Enshitification gold rush continues. It's like now there is a word for it, all these companies are exploring how they can do it.
Roku, somehow becoming shittier than Twitter
Roku still gives me a lot more valuable content
I wish I could find a TV for sale that isn't a Smart TV. It's not necessary and you get issues like this down the road. I'm sure it isn't too long until the other TV manufactures do the same thing.
You know what people tend to forget?
Shareholders = Consumers of the product too
Marketing departments that come up with these assinine ideas are staffed with consumers of the product too.
As long as enough people are making bank from this stupidity, it will not stop.
The only right answer is not to give them your money. Hard to do that when they all do it and after purchase protests are kind of pointless since they already got paid. So, how to actually impact their bottom line? That's the only language they listen to.
I don't get it.... Wouldn't it be easier for Roku to just declare bankruptcy and saves themselves the trouble?
Looks like I'm about to go buy another used computer to setup my streaming services using Kody.
I've given them money and now I want it back.
Page 42069 of the TOS makes this legal.
Didn't know I'd have to drink a verification can just to turn on the TV
All I heard is keep my current TV I'm using as a monitor alive for as long as possible.
If they can do that, then nobody can say anything about devices doing the reverse.
Can you just not connect your Smart TV to the internet at all to bypass this? I never connect my Smart TVs to the internet, just my Apple TV since it’s my streamer platform. Seems like this would hamstring their ability to push ads.
But what if I want to have ads playing while I'm playing XBox? Can the Roku analyze the image, identify 3d surfaces in the game I'm playing, and plaster ads on them so that they look integrated with the game?
Once more games are pixel streamed, that's probably possible
Roku: Furiously takes notes
Exactly what people want: more ads.
Hardware that is supported by ads or requires a subscription should be free, or better yet, not exist at all. Fuck paying $800+ for a TV that leeches forced ad revenue on top of the sale.
And fuck the TV manufacturers for enabling this behavior. Bring back non-smart TVs. I’ll never use Roku or Google built-in streaming, so they shouldn’t be on my TV at all.
you have to boycott all of the HDMI consortum and the streaming services who demand HDMI for full features. The idea of widevine levels on android are put to prevent "stream piracy" and why all the streaming services push you to use their apps.
basically all TV manufacturers are part of the HDMI consortum, or adhere to it.
A simple PC, you can also use it to browse, download stuff, Steam stream etc. The possibilities are endless
Any used office pc from Craiglist for <$200, wiped and reinstalled with linux.... self contained mini PC NUC boxes are also a very good bang-for-buck these days
I’ve always loved my Apple TVs.
Is nVidia Shield an alternative?
That's what I've been using for years now. It's great.
I blocked my TV from using WiFi, but there have been times I have need to unblock it (like using AirPlay or Google Cast), so it gets updates occasionally. I'm open to throwing my TV straight to the dump and buying another TV to avoid this at all costs.
Personally looking at dumb panels and building OSMC machines to run them.
I run an LG OLED TV (disconnected from network), AppleTV, and my own media server. I haven’t seen an ad in my TV for years.
Get an A/V receiver, a computer monitor or dumb TV, and speakers. Then you can get a Roku streaming player and it cannot show you anything when you do not have its input selected on the receiver.
Even an inexpensive pair of bookshelf speakers placed on either side of the TV will sound better than built-in TV speakers. Add a center speaker and a subwoofer drastically improved sound.
Non-4k AV receivers are dirt cheap used.
Nothing, all TVs are crap.
The best options are usually buying large "monitors" or digital signage. However these both tend to be more expensive than a similar TV. Monitors also often lack a remote which may be valuable for a TV and digital signage may have less input ports than you may want.
I would love if a major manufacturer made a TV that just displayed what signals I put into it.
Right now the best option still seems to buy a Roku TV and never connect it to the internet. But some features will be disabled. For example Miracast doesn't work for some explicitable reason until you connect it to the internet. (Then again it barely works anyways, so no major loss)
No, your best option is to buy any other TV than a Roku TV, and not connect that TV to the internet.
Roku is pretty great for what it is, but the day I see such an ad is the day it hits the bin. That would finally bother me into driving the TV with an actual PC.
As a former Roku fan, forced arbitration or a brick was the breaking point. Roku can fuck off.
Forced arbitration is a cancer and should be illegal, but at least it’s useful and technically my 5 yo agreed to it, so how is this legal again?
Isn't Netflix locked at 720 on pc? I can't go without 4k hdr Netflix
It's limited to 720 unless your entire playback system end to end is fully drm secured... this means hdmi certified devices only, single monitor, running unmodified, legit windows. It's extremely restrictive and even the tiniest system change (like adding a second monitor, or using the wrong cable) almost always breaks it.
Streaming is a cancer.
I’m not sure. These old eyes can’t see the difference and I don’t own 4k hardware. It is possible that you need a locked down system for some content levels.
That's a fantastic way to guarantee my TV will not be connected to the internet
Get a CEC TV and a separate streaming box that supports that. Get a Shield and install an ad free launcher, or pick up an AppleTV.
Playing Xbox or PS5: "Game on with power thirst"
Watching Xxx content: ((Jergens ad))
Watching a movie: "Don't forget the popcorn"
No. Fuck no. All of my fuck no's that have ever fucked no
I hate this timeline
Roku, I already had you blocked at Pihole, but now I’m just straight up turning off your network access.
Is there some open-source replacement for Roku? All I really use it for is a portal to my streaming services that’s easy to navigate with a remote. I’ve noticed my Roku become increasingly more overrun with ads ever since I started using it 4-5 years ago to my dismay, and it’s obviously not stopping any time soon. I’m vaguely aware of Plex but I have no clue where to start with setting it up or if it would even meet my needs
Am I the only one who gets the feeling that this is kinda dystopic? Like come on, this just gets crazy. It amazes me that some people think this is an ethically acceptable way to earn money.
Well, that would be a way to guarantee I buy a new TV...
Mutually assured destruction if they were able to do this, because every other company that has a device that interfaces with HDMI would immediately implement their own ad-hijacking system that would fight for the same screen space during those "breaks".
Not to mention that if Roku saw some unknown time to monetize the screen, surely the host device they're trying to draw over would've done it by now.
Maybe they could plaster ads over their screensaver to ruin their own experience before trying to do it to someone else.
Lmao, Roku can go suck on a lemon... Never buying any of their shit ever again.
I swear to fuck, in 2030 we're going to be spinning our own homebrew crts. 640x480 is better than ads.
I'm so glad I made the switch to projectors. They have yet to be riddled with this horse shit. My current projector does 1080p, 60fps, makes an 85" screen in my room, can be used just fine during the day, works great with my Deck, and with the Kodak branded screen cost me less than 600 bucks.
Wow! Not since Xitter have we seen a brand so aggressively shoot itself in the crotch!
Amazing, Roku. That’s . . . something.
That is definitely way too invasive. Plugging something on to a Roku TV shouldn't enable them to show you ads through that other device.
I was actually thinking about getting a Roku once too. Really dodged a bullet.
The article says Roku is attempting to detect breaks, which are the only places Roku will try to show you an ad. So you open your inventory in the pause screen to fight a boss and an ad pops out.
It slowly dawned on video game developers that a lengthy loading screen was actually just a wasted opportunity for a digital billboard.
I wonder if they’re prepared for Microsoft’s lawyers to come knocking when they find out their screen space is being highjacked by another company for profit…
Sounds like popcorn hour to me.
It's not as bad as Dhark thinks, but still pretty bad. Read my last sentence and fully immerse yourself.
It's absolutely insanely horrible and probably some of the most invasive drm I have ever seen even proposed.
This would require doing deep analysis on all of the content going through the stream. That analysis sure as hell isn't being done locally since smart TV's can barely run their own operating systems, so everything getting offloaded to Roku servers and then they get to put ads on whatever they determine to be an appropriate time.
This technology enables censoring and blacking out signals that Roku decides you don't get to see, or preventing the release of the hijacked stream unless you perform certain actions, or just not releasing the stream at all unless you pay, effectively extorting you.
These cheap smart TVs already give you the worst panels and the worst processors. And now get to be extorted out of your own data being delivered the ten feet from your computer or PlayStation to the TV.
It's beyond ridiculous.
Dark souls players in shambles.
If this happens I will find the person responsible and punch their dad in the cock
Unless that person happens to be with their dad, that would then require finding their dad. That's a whole extra person to find. It might be easier to skip straight to finding their dad.
The real treasure is the cocks we punch along the way.
The only reason I liked using their remote app was being able to do Bluetooth listening. Now the app no longer runs on my phone, and after reinstalling and rebooting I deleted that and am back to using the Chromecast. Time to cut the internet to the TV so I don't get an update with this ad feature
I will buy any other brand or a try to find a dumb TV if they do this.
I just had a horrifying thought while wondering what these TV manufacturers will do with the TVs if you just never connect them to the Internet.
I know people are worried about them jumping on your neighbor's WiFi without prompting, or even hacking your own connection, etc but I think that seems unlikely because of how deeply illegal it is...but my horrifying thought was that they could just create a new, free mesh network that only serves up ads.
You'd need a fucking faraday cage wrapped around your TV in order to not see ads.
Now if you'll excuse me I'm gonna go throw up. 🤮
Our TV can fortunately bypass all the "smart" shit, and run like dumb monitor, maybe because it's an older TV? We use it with an external computer with Linux mediacenter, where we have full control and no adds.
Would it even be possible to run a new "smart" TV as a dumb monitor?
We are very happy with our TV, because we can run it as a plain monitor no problem, but it could break.
Never connecting the TV to the internet and never updating the firmware usually works. If they are determined to show you ads, they may not let you use the TV without an internet connection though. I would suggest that you avoid buying a roku TV.
Okay but they can also mesh the TVs with your neighbour’s tv of the same brand so that if your neighbour’s TV has internet, your TV can leapfrog onto his tv to download the ads
Open the TV, find the antenna, desolder it and replace it with a 50 ohm resistor. Now the WiFI will no longer have enough range to connect to your neighbors.
You’re hired!
Wow... Roku found a way to dig a deeper while and somehow make Samsung look good by comparison.
I doubt that Roku is the only one exploring this option though. Heck Samsung displays ads everywhere in their UI, including the individual, source selection items.
Ugh, well what are the best Roku alternatives?
To be honest, a mini pc/wireless kb and the internet.
Alternative Question: What the best alternative that can be controlled by a Remote Control.
Nobody except me wants to break out a Keyboard and Type in websites they wanna visit.
A mini PC with a USB IR receiver and whatever old remote you have to spare. It takes a bit of setup to map the remote with something like LIRC, but it works great once that's done.
Pi4 with Kodi installed supports HDMI-CEC (I can use my Samsung TV remote to control media player)
I agree, but you'd be surprised how a mini-PC can be made pretty good. One method is to buy something like this: ::: spoiler expand for picture :::
I ran a similar setup decades ago when it was more popular. Logitech used to make something like this that was pretty cool.
As a bonus you can sail the seven seas for high-quality live cable feeds from around the country...and basically have free everything forever.
EDIT: This is what I used to have: https://www.ifixit.com/Device/Logitech_diNovo_Mini
You might be able to use something like an LG magic remote with a full computer too, especially if you could figure out how to get it to display an on-screen keyboard.
We're a non-iPhone household and went with the AppleTV when my Nvidia SHIELD died.
Ads were getting put on the SHIELD and I definitely didn't want to buy another one because of that and it has been a while since its had a refresh, so went with an AppleTV instead.
The device itself is fantastic, the UI is so smooth and so much nicer. OTOH, I miss being able to cast to the TV more than I expected. It works decently with the Macbooks though (we're a weird household ... like Macs, hate iPhones).
So ... if ya'll have iPhones or don't care about casting, I'd definitely recommend an AppleTV with Plex (the Dropout, Youtube, Disney+ apps are all good too).
ETA: Apple is also making some pretty awesome TV content as well and IIRC you'll get a couple months free with the purchase ... verify that yourself though in case they've removed it, but Foundation, Severance & See are fantastic shows if you're looking for something to watch.
+1. We are a household of sysadmins/engineers. Sure I or my wife could design a PC for media in an afternoon - but I don't want to deal with it.
An apple TV was a no fuss, no headache media box that can interface with the servers that store my media.
Yeah I used to have a PC and a Harmony remote that would send macros to a custom script and Kodi would do different things or it could switch to Netflix and ... Like, we just want to watch a movie or TV show not have to perform tech support whenever Netflix changed their webpage!
Id say if it's in your budget - get one. We have no other apple products in the house but that. The biggest annoyance was making an apple account (for some stupid reason they require it...)
I'm thinking of buying one of these after ditching two Roku TVs. I bought LG OLEDs instead and am just using the apps for now, but who knows how long it'll be before WebOS follows Roku down enshittification avenue?
I quit with apps on LG after whatever I was watching or doing would cut out with an error message saying that the TV was out of memory. It was particularly egregious when I was playing video games. Now I have a Roku sound bar, but look where that’s gonna get me.
My SHIELD would just randomly restart itself until eventually it stopped coming back online.
I definitely got my monies worth out of it, but didn't like that a device with no ads all of a sudden became a device with ads (and this is a Google thing not an Nvidia one, but still)
"ads on shield"
Uhm explain? I use a 3rd party launcher and do not have any ads
You specifically said you use a 3rd party launcher. You know why you specifically mentioned that.
It was a guess. Shield doesn't have ads but the Google launcher does kinda...is that what you are talking about?
Ah, my apologies for the assumption, it's been almost a year but I'm still too used to Reddit apparently!
Yes, the default launcher had ads, the SHIELD itself didn't, but I also didn't like any of the 3rd party launchers I used but I don't remember specifically why. Then, the SHIELD stopped booting so I didn't want to buy another one and went with the ATV instead.
As I mentioned, I wouldn't necessarily recommend it to someone who knows they'd regret not having the cast functionality, but, if you just want a device that works very well and doesn't ever have so much as a hiccup during navigation, it's been great!
I would still recommend the SHIELD for someone that wants cast or who wouldn't have a problem with (mostly) relevant ads being shown on the device (stock).
I still have an "air mouse keyboard combo". Used a dongle to transmit but worked great. One side had arrow buttons, 2 buttos for clicking, I wiggled my wrist to point the cursor, and a keyboard sat on the back. I think I paid like $10 for it. Went from stick pc to Amazon due to specs vs price. Considering migrating back though.
There's also phone apps that do the job and they just hook up via wifi.
Can that easily stream HDR and things like Dolby vision? In research a while ago I thought it was only certain CPUs/GPUs and chrome could play things like Netflix at 4k/HDR
...Viewed on what? A Roku TV?
Commercial viewing board or something like that. Basically what they sell to restaurants and what not for displaying simple things and which don't require an internet connection.
I absolutely botched the term, but thats the general idea.
Signage displays usually
Just never connect the actual TV to the Internet
Imagine scrolling through the pornhub video that you spent half an hour searching for and then Bam! "Clean those pesky cum filled tities with Downy! Now with strawberry flavor, Downy is the only official pornhub gangbang body odor control soap and lubricant. Get your official pornhub bottle filled at the Costco sample counter today!"
Sounds like a good way to get open source tvs
I'm so crotchety if your site so much as makes me click an extra X for an ad, promo, or even a coupon I'm fucking out homie.
patents don't mean shit tho, companies usually just patent whatever they want without any plans of implementation
Bro Wtf If this happens I'm litterly buying a new tv
First, fuck Roku. This is exactly why my roku tv is not connected to the internet and never will be. My kodi box handles my entertainment needs.
all the more reason to not connect your smart TV to the internet and let it update.
Not only can they hold your TV hostage until you agree to their terms, but now they want to hijack your signal and inject their own ads to monetize all the content thats not theirs.
Roku, the company that’s literally puts streaming service ads on your remotes.
At this point who would ever trust Roku products.
The next step is they have cameras installed on them so they can watch you and detect the best time to play ads.
How much further are we away from commercials beamed into our dreams?
what an excellent extra reason to not use hdmi
Bring back S-video!
I mean, we do have DVI and it works great TBH.
Uhhhg
Someone tell me there's an OSS Roku like system out there >_>
I mean, there are open-source systems to provide TV-style functionality. I'm not really current, but it looks like Kodi is an option.
Well, I wonder if this can be like RaspberryPied or something to make it a set top box...
Well, at the bottom of their front page, it has a list of things that it can run on and lists the Raspberry Pi on that list, so I'd imagine so.
If they decide to go through with this I will literally replace every Roku TV I own, fuck that shit!
Yeah fuck that shit
This would only effect people who are using the roku service built into their tv, yes?
For now, yes. The patent discussed in the article suggests that the Roku TV reads the input HDMI signal even if you aren't using a Roku App to determine whether you are idle and show ads when the screen doesn't change much.
It sounds to be the situation but I wouldn't put it past them to try and fuck everyone who owns their devices not just people who bought roku tvs
Xiaomi has been doing that as well, except it's whenever.
Now, the TV is forbidden to access my Wi-Fi because screw that.
Any info on how to make it dumber would be appreciated.
Wish I could uninstall it from my television
I was permitted to close my account....without any hassle. Sign into my.roku.com and delete account is as the bottom. Selecting "don't want to use this anymore" gives you a box with 255 charachter limit (because of course they don't want to hear a real reason) and then when you hit send you just get "Thank you, account closed, if you come back you will need a new account"
Surprisingly, suspiciously, painless.
My cousin wanted a Roku TV as a wedding gift. I said no. Got Sony instead. I like to think he's thankful for that with all the shit Roku has been doing
ಠ_ಠ
is an HDMI feed like an rss feed? How does this "supposed" feed work here?
Alright, time to stay with Google Chromecast. At least I know they inject me with ads in their apps
Yeah now I'm never buying a roku I think when amazon eventually manages to wreck my cube (which they really seem to be trying to) I'll have to try something like a raspberry pi or maybe a small ryzen card.
I'm really not sure but The one thing I've decided is to take it out of another company's hands.
Are there major limitations of using a computer monitor as a TV if I plug another device into it (eg Apple TV) apart from the screen size?
I feel this would be a good way to go for small cheap TVs at least.
You've got a great UI Roku, but now stop being evil.
😂😂😂
Welcome to 2024 people!
They'll have a hell of a time with that. My roku TCL's don't even know the internet exists over here.
https://youtu.be/YqQ6D0Bu-a8?si=LbULiyEWAmbknARy
To be fair Roku is just aping on futuristic depictions of TVs.
Why can't the propriety run the world instead of the proprietary :/