And some contemptible people who have more free time and resources than they know that do to with - they must focus all efforts on acquiring more resources AND making it harder for others to catch up.
It would be reason to pity the emptiness of some lives, were they not so destructive.
I am not talking about people that find their work or their career fulfilling and keep working hard at it. That’s different than a billionaire who spends millions every year to bust unions and prevent raises to the minimum wage. (Or assassinate whistle blowers, as the case may be)
I don't disagree, just a quite reminder that not everyone can afford this. The meme doesn't say it but it gives "money doesn't buy happiness" vibes and while this isn't false, a certain amount of money is required for this.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding the picture, but I thought that's why they were called luxuries - because not everyone gets to have them. Though they aren't what we usually associate with a luxurious lifestyle.
E: just to be clear, everyone should have them, but many are too occupied with the daily battle for survival.
In capitalism, one must first pay for basic necessities like food and shelter before anything else. For some people who make low wages this requires an amount of time and effort that interferes with their leisure time.
That said, there are also some people who think they are in this category when in reality their stress is due to self-imposed standards of living that are higher than necessary. Or anxiety and other psychological problems that could be addressed through non-material strategies.
there are also some people who think they are in this category when in reality their stress is due to self-imposed standards of living that are higher than necessary. Or anxiety and other psychological problems that could be addressed through non-material strategies.
also encouraged and exacerbated by capitalism (the former - to create the illusion of a "middle class" for people to aspire to and vote against their own actual material conditions, the latter - by commodifying health care and pathologizing anything that harms "productivity")
How much money does one need to not have to choose between spending their evenings on a long walk listening to birds vs delivering pizzas as a third job to avoid eviction?
Why add a symbol that is almost solely used by totalitarian governments?
The hammer and sickle remains commonplace in self-declared socialist states, such as China, Cuba, North Korea, Laos, and Vietnam, but also some former Soviet republics following the dissolution of the Soviet Union, such as Belarus and Russia.
Are there any countries that use the symbol that are actually nice places to live with good governments?
Angola has made a conscious decision to stick to this symbol as if transitions to a liberal democracy and stable economy. There were some efforts to change the flag recently because as you said it's often associated with totalitarian regimes. But those efforts failed because to Angolans it symbolizes the Angolan triumph over the colonial oppression of Portugal and resistance to apartheid South African invasion.
It could change in the future, Angola is still moving towards "good government" and "nice place to live" as you said. But for now it remains their national flag.
Interesting. That being said I don't understand the lemmygrad peoples desire for the Hammer and sickle as a symbol. Like almost nothing good has come from it. Even in Angola it seems to be viewed as a somewhat tarnished period in their history.
I get what you mean, I'm helping to add nuance to the discussion. Also a bunch of white people coming in and telling Angolans what symbols they can and can't use to represent their triumph over colonialism and apartheid isn't a great look either.
Meaning is also contextual - different cultures put different meaning in symbols. To represent global ideas we need some consensus.
Baltic neo-pagans were rigtfully culturally suppressed from using swastika as "symbol of Sun". Hammer and sickle also signifies millions of deaths and decades of repressioms. It is even forbidden in some post soviet countries along with swastika. Lets find something less damaging to represent marxist ideas.
@Humana
I think the only system to believe in here is sensitivity to feelings and histories of others. If you don't mind triggering literally millions of people whose families were hurt by soviets, it is your choice.
And wouldn't you be against public display of swastikas if they are displayed by "neopagans" and supposedly symbolize Sun?
Do you ban them from museums? Textbooks? Documentaries? No because they are in an appropriate context. I would never wear or display a swastika and I feel disgusted to see one displayed by anyone with pride. Context and motive matter...
I can't tell if you're being ignorant or disingenuous. The Ⓐ should be a clue as to my opinion on government in general, no? As for ☭ - check the first sentence of the article you linked. Or the description written under it, for what I meant to invoke.
I am no USSR apologist. I just consider that symbol useful as a marker for worker solidarity.
I understand what it means, and I support what it is trying to do in theory. The problem is there has never been a government, to my knowledge, that has embraced the ideology that has not turned to corruption/totalitarianism. In these countries, the proletariat are deprived of their rights and fare far worse. That is what the hammer and sickle represents.
I'm happy to change my mind if an example can prove otherwise, but to my knowledge the most effective form of government is that of a social democracy, which is represented by a red rose.
The hammer and sickle (Unicode: U+262D ☭ ) is a communist symbol representing proletarian solidarity between agricultural and industrial workers.
This sentence is the entire and only reason I used that symbol. You have zero reason to continue to ask me for "good governments using this symbol". It is not a symbol of government. Communism is stateless, ergo no government. Just like anarchism.
The swastika is thus understood to be a symbol of auspiciousness and good fortune
Symbols can have meanings that are different than what they turn into. Hammer and sickle is almost unanimously considered to be a symbol of Stalin USSR totalitarian communism where millions perished.
We have made it so that having the freedom to choose, a most basic human need, feels like doing incorrect stuff.
Like, just choosing to leave a relationship subjects you to so much pain and hate that you'd rather not do it.
It sucks, but sadly a lot of these things are luxuries. Some are getting better but others worse (for example, there are less birds now than in the past, or at least it seems that way).
This. Especially in modern first-world nations. There are plenty of resources for the wealthy to still be wealthy and everyone to have at least economic security.
a mother in ar who had kill her three kids, they are taking the three babby back to new york too lady to rest. my pary are with the father who lost his chrilden ; i am truley sorry for your lots
Yeah I think it's been found that there is a sweet spot for income and happiness. Having billions of dollars won't make you any happier, but I think it's something around $120K per year that provides everything needed to have a happy life without having to stress much about paying the bills.
Unfortunately the vast majority of people fall way below the level of income needed that's necessary to be able to have a stress free long walk and a good conversation that's not about how to make ends meet, etc.
Yeah, truth. Nobody has complete freedom in a world of other people. I don't get to run around being an ax murderer, for example (not that I want to be). There are plenty of guardrails and rules and laws, many for good reason.
I'm on the fence about hearings birds singing. It is really annoying to get woken up way too early by a bird who just knows two tunes and sings it over and over and over again. Like what the fuck?! Didn't they teach you a third tune at bird school to make your song a bit more melodic and less irritating? Fucking twitter.
There's this big male cardinal who lives in my rhododendron. He's not the problem. The problem are the loud, brash younglings who show up and try to muscle in on his territory. They start before dawn, screaming at the top of a tree, making up for their lack of style with sheer volume.
Plus they sound like fucking car alarms. The Big Boy has a gorgeous call, and perches on the fence between the houses to take advantage of the acoustics, and starts at least an hour after dawn because no lady wants to be woken up early by a fuckboy.
He must be back early this year because there's only been one asshole bird who woke me up.
Hard to have a slow morning and day naps when you're rushing between two jobs because you don't have money.
If you had money, you could be more selective in finding work that provided the balance and flexibility needed to appreciate the things in life that are free.
But all of these things are too expensive when you're time-poor, and most people are time poor because they're desperately trying to avoid being financially poor.
I think you're underestimating how much labour the global poor perform in a 24 hour period, 7 days a week.
But yes, many of these things can be possible if you prioritise them for your mental health, my point is just that it's not always easy to prioritise mental health when you're focused on physical survival.
But obviously, if you can include these things in your routine, you absolutely should, there are virtually no downsides.
I think it's almost impossible to miss every single one of these all the time. I have worked with the extremely poor, and watched documentaries of people in third world countries regularly. Most people even those who are literal third world slaves (indebted for life) can still regularly enjoy at least 2 of these things regularly.
I'm not saying it's not shit and that ideally everyone should experience all of them, but it's unrealistically cynical and nihilistic to think everyone poor is just miserable and doesn't enjoy anything.
My god you are clueless. Have you moved out of your parent's home yet? I'm just curious where you are in your life? If you moved, were you given a stable and well funded childhood? I'm just trying to understand the disconnect.
Yeah I've lived out of home for close to 2 decades.
I think people here are being extremely dramatic if they say they never are able to sleep in or never have a chance to hear birds singing though, or to watch a sunset. That is absolute hyperbolic bullshit.
Unless this post is about doing it every day (which it isn't), then everyone gets to enjoy these luxuries at least semi-regularly.
A lot of people cannot get a good night of sleep because they have to wake up super fucking early in order to arrive at their work on time. A number of them might then go from work straight to classes (like a cheap college-level graduation, in hopes of getting a better paying job sometime in the future), so by the time they get home, their free time is spent caring for the home and prepping for tomorrow. Even those that have "free nights" may not end up spending that time for leisure
Birds singing are rare in big cities. You know, the so called concrete jungles? They'll have a number of pigeons and sparrows, but depending on the city, the lack of trees means that's the only 2 kinds of birds you'll see or hear, period.
People are missing the forest for the trees. These are luxuries yes, but missing every single one of them is an extreme poverty of life as it'd be extremely hard to do.
So, you live on a desert island? because if you don't, and you don't, there is plenty you can do about it... I guarantee that wherever you are, there is a supportive community to be a part of.
Oh yeah I'm part of a couple of fantastic support communities, but those take more time, not give it back to you. The independent time without a child is what has evaporated.
If you're into fantasy, look into The Wheel of Time series. It's dense, absolutely packed with characters, and the world has a ton of detail. It's also 14 (rather large) books long, 15 if you count the prequel, so if you like it it'll keep you busy for a good long while.
If you've seen the Amazon series based on the books and were turned off by it, maybe give the books a try instead. The Amazon series doesn't do it justice, in my opinion.
If you like sci-fi, I recommend The Expanse books and novellas.
The audiobooks narrated by Jefferson Mays are also good, as is the TV series, though they tried to cram too much into the last season, IMO, without actually finishing the story. The ending in the books is tons better.
If you like sci-fi, I recommend Project Hail Mary. It was written by the author of the book that became the movie “The Martian” (also supposedly a real great book, and on my list). Same guy wrote the short story “The Egg” that’s a pretty good and quick philo-fi.
A friend literally just gifted me a copy of this because I've been feeling so burnt out by capitalism, and let me tell you, I devoured that book. It spoke to my weary soul. And made me want to quit my job (I already was wanting to quit my job)
Read the Vorkosigan Saga. Lois McMaster Bujold. The audiobooks are also outstanding. Long series with fantastic characters, each one distinct. It's a big space opera. Totally worth it.
I read Moby Dick once and it was not enjoyable in the least. It is boring as fuck. Maybe it's imitating through prose the long monotonous stretches between whale sightings, but that's not an engaging read.
I agree these are the real luxuries but they CAN be supplemented by a little happy consumerism here and there. I love to have a good conversation with friends over a good lunch at a restaurant, or going to a nice dinner. Have meals out is a nice luxury also.
I’d also add science - a subset of reading I suppose, but it can lead to experiments and theoretical models. I love it, costs me nothing (thanks Wiki supporters) and there’s still so much to learn and discover.
The weird thing about this is, a few of these things are rather hard once you have kids.
Don't know the last time when I slept alone in my bed or had a slow morning.
But well, you get other things in return, like the pure love of you children so it's fine haha.
That's because we destroyed the primitive communal family to create the nuclear family. Humans throughout most of history would raise their children collectively, rather than all the responsibility just being dumped directly onto the parents.
That's true, we also have the unfortunate situation that we don't have any relatives that could support us. All grand parents live at least ~5 hours away. Moving isn't really an option for my wife because of her work currently.
Just saw a meme today (can't find it again or I would share it) where a bird is threatening to commit all this violence against another bird, a la Gus Fring talking to Walter White, and all the human hears is a happy bird song.
The other morning my dogs woke me up way too damn early, but it meant I got to watch a very fat pigeon on the power line behind my house, and I got to see the finch population rapidly increase around it. (I swear I saw one little bird and by the time I got out of bed there were 5 jetting around. Pigeon did not move.)
I agree that these are luxuries for a lot of people. Some of them can be found with mindset shifts (from "fuck you dogs" to "oh look, pretty birds" for example) but it's also hard to shift your mindset to positivity when our society tries its damnedest to beat happiness out of you.
I'll substitute sunrise in place of sunset and remove naps because I rarely sleep during the day because it fucks up my circadian rhythm. Everything else is spot on.
Something about naps I discovered I that there is two kind of naps
short naps around 20-30min where you don't get any deep sleep
long naps around 1 or 2 full sleep cycles, so for most peoples 1.5 or 3 hours nap.
Waking up from a short nap should be easy and you should feel energized almost immediately, if its not the case it probably means that your body started a full sleep cycle.
So to be able to nap during the day we need to find a way to tell or body that this is just a short break and we are not going for a full sleep, usually sleeping somewhere different like the couch or in a different position in the bed
Fuck solarpunk. I buy carefully, not mindlessly, based on what I'm getting and for how long, with the intent of not having to replace what I buy. So let's get that out of the way, this isn't about the merits of environmental preservation or efficient use of our resources.
I need mass media because I ENJOY PLAYING VIDEO GAMES. I don't want to live in the fucking "gay space commune", I want to live in a world that feels good to me, and you solarpunk assholes seem to say people like me who escape from reality because they've NEVER been capable of supporting themselves should start a fucking garden?!
Newsflash. I. Don't. Like. Your. "Utopia". I never will. If you ever succeed in making your idea of a future a reality, I'll burn it to the fucking ground as my revenge on you bastards. I hate your idea because all it does is change how I am oppressed as a disabled adult to how I was oppressed as a special needs child illegally taken from my parents by a corrupt mental health system.
You want to see a real utopia? A place where everyone is happy in the world they live in? Fucking find an oneirogenic drug that induces lucid dreams or create a VR metaverse.
Who I am in reality does not matter. Who I am in my mind can't be expressed in a solarpunk world, only online. At least that's how it used to be.
Why am I named the same as an Open Source Game? Cyperprep doesn't have to mean "the future megacorps are not so bad!" but rather "megacorps control this dystopian future but they can't always stop the signal and that means Open Source Software is the way to fight back".
The difference between FOSS for smart devices and social networks and FOSS for games is that games are art and that means paid food production will take precedence over volunteer video games.
And no, you don't get to say "get another hobby". I know myself. I like technology. I don't like preachy people. I stopped buying Apple when I stopped seeing unique-looking devices. I am a gamer. Most importantly, I am a sci-fi writer who wants optimistic stories that don't assume the reader is a fully-capable person.
I am not demanding you write what I want to see. Only that you not try to turn reality into it. If you see this, once again, fuck solarpunk.
No one is talking about you, mass media and consumerism has nothing to do with anything you described. Video games as a whole does not equal consumerism or mass media. Micro transactions and other terrible patterns do.
I didn’t even think there were serious solar punk stories, and even if so, aren’t all of them like technological utopias? Why would entertainment ie video games be gone from them? Even if they aren’t the focus (which makes sense) what reason would a solar punk society have to do away with video games?
Read "Project Hieroglyph" and the way one of its "optimistic" stories ("Girl in Wave: Wave in Girl") shows a multiplayer superhero game and the main character hates it. That's not how mental illness works, computers used to be GOOD for providing social contact. That's not education, that's "fix yourself".
I am not broken. I am unhappy because I don't want to live in a world where I face reality, whether that's "IRL" or "social media". You know why I like the 4th Matrix movie? It reminds us that this image isn't what the world provides, it's what the Matrix - real life - forces us to work towards. The Matrix isn't just the fake world, it's the fake world on top of a real one and the real escape is to change, not break, the system that binds us because there is nothing in the real but vast lifeless desert. Mars, the Moon... Dead rocks. There is no evidence of an afterlife nor any point to "accepting" a secular life you hate because you will still hate it and "scientific evidence only" doesn't fix anything or change who you are.
Also are you ok? I find it rather odd to be this intensely invested about what is generally a fairly niche community in solarpunk. Not that the mission and ideology aren’t worth being passionate about, but I mean we are talking about video games and green societies nothing crazy.
I’ll definitely have to give that a read, though some quick reading of opinions about that work are fairly mixed.
Also no one has said you’re broken or that you need to face reality. The whole point of solarpunk is that will be no world to face unless we take action. And none of that has anything to do with video games or anything you have described.
Um, but the majority of video games are not made by big tech? What is your point? Indie games are usually just better overall anyway. I’m really failing to see why any solarpunk society would stop people from making video games
Because solarpunk writers are rarely, if ever, gamers. Gamers are a niche subculture in the solarpunk works I've seen and as you're seeing, people in the solarpunk community seem to like it that way.
My confusion continues to compound. Many of the people in this thread have zero issue with video games or actually play them. I really gotta see a source for
Asshole, I never said that. I'm well aware TTD was originally a commercial product, that's my entire point. You can't make games for free, and yes, I value video games more than continued lifespan because art allows me to ignore a reality I despise for being defined by everyone else.
You don't have the right to fucking judge me for the tiny little quirk of liking a game, I only mentioned it because it was mildly relevant.
Actually, I believe you can make games for free to consumers, and I believe systems inspired by solarpunk would, if anything, do a better job of encouraging this over our current political system. Art, including video games, doesn't just disappear in solarpunk societies.
I'm not judging you for liking a game, I never said anything of the sort, lol. Although I find it hard not to judge you if you just bark insults.
Edit: actually they feature even more prominently in the sequel #Missing Mermaid, where the investigators interview a full time gamer and possible witness who was streaming some kind of dark souls sequel near the dissapearance/possible kidnapping.
Also the rulebook for the TTRPG Fully Automated specific mentions that playing videogames full time is an accepted lifestyle in their post-scarcity society, and the contacts character stat tracks online contacts independently from offline, so you can make a character who has no Internet presence, or who lives entirely in games and basically only makes friends through videogames, or anywhere in between.
I'm a shut-in, with untreated health issues, someone who partakes in escapism, and even someone who likes the idea of programming but can't really do much (I tinkered on rendering polygons from text input last September and didn't even finish it enough to be usable for me).
I haven't seen much solarpunk but I've never thought to myself that it'd be worse for me. If I existed in an environment like that (particularly from birth or at least for a long time) I don't think I'd be the same escapist shut-in. I could see open-source games still existing, and maybe programming being better even if people are less likely to have videogames as their most common activity. I've taken care of already-growing plants before, but it seems to me like a lax solarpunk environment would offer more options/opportunity than employment currently offers. Probably actual opportunity to travel, too.
Even carrying over my current mindset and (lack of) capability, I can't see a solarpunk environment being even half as restricted as my experience now. I mean the whole idea is better community and technology used to help people (not strictly for money) so it seems to me you wouldn't be required to garden.
To be fair, it seems like I may have had bad luck in the first three solarpunk works I ever experienced. My issue against the whole idea is "this is a society that can no longer afford to value non-practical pursuits, it is the future we are headed towards, therefore our present society can no longer afford to value non-practical pursuits" that was somehow in all three solarpunk works I encountered.
The three in question were Girl in Wave: Wave in Girl, the Necroverse by "RichM", and a story that a fair-weather friend wrote that I no longer have a copy of that showed a dystopian cybersolarpunk hybrid where "Covid-19 has ended the modern age and now everything is powered by wind turbines because most of us are dead".
As a result of such bad luck, I may have overestimated how central that theme of "self-sufficiency or die" is to the genre.
So you think hurting people to make things the way you want them is acceptable? Because of video games? You are a dangerous man child (or maybe just a child).
Confirmation indeed. It's really too much to fucking ask that you NOT build another fucking prison? You, not me, are the sociopath. At least I reserve my angry rampage for if you succeed.
You judge me for liking what I like? You are literally trying to control my life by redefining society, and no, I'm not some rich skullfucker nor do I think people aren't entitled to the same basic level of comfort I enjoy regardless of race, gender, eromantic orientation or anything else; they may not have it, but if you wanted real equality then you NEED to uplift people's minimum living standard.
Apparently you care more about organic produce and trees than children or the homeless.
Who's talking about building a prison? You've imagined an enemy in solarpunk that has nothing to do with solarpunk and are getting upset at an internet stranger that has made no claims about wanting to stop you from playing video games.
Then don't build it and we're fine. I'm angry because I'm disabled and Solarpunk is usually Ableist yet everyone is obsessed with social media detox and lumping all technologies in with it.
In a world where most must sell their time for money to survive, free time is true luxury.
Sell your kids on the black market. Poof! Free time.
President Milei I didn't know you were on the fediverse!
Good man Javier wants to buy all the kids for his special orphanage in a secluded island, such a good guy!
Pedophilia isn’t in the Criticisms section of Public image of Javier Milei - maybe you were just joking?
Loads of other harsh criticisms!
And some contemptible people who have more free time and resources than they know that do to with - they must focus all efforts on acquiring more resources AND making it harder for others to catch up.
It would be reason to pity the emptiness of some lives, were they not so destructive.
Isn't it wild how we let people heavy with psychopathy have positions of power?
I don't disagree, just a quite reminder that not everyone can afford this. The meme doesn't say it but it gives "money doesn't buy happiness" vibes and while this isn't false, a certain amount of money is required for this.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding the picture, but I thought that's why they were called luxuries - because not everyone gets to have them. Though they aren't what we usually associate with a luxurious lifestyle.
E: just to be clear, everyone should have them, but many are too occupied with the daily battle for survival.
Yes, I read it the same way, that's why I said that I don't disagree. Still there is this other reading I wanted to "debunk"
Re-reading your comment I see that I must have meant to reply to someone else. I apologise, my social media timer sometimes makes me hasty.
Yeah this is lowkey a boogie meme - the majority of people don't live in a work situation that allows for day naps!
How do we call something that the majority of people can't afford ?
A luxury
We call it expensive, which is a subtlety that the title of this meme poopooing on "consumerism" is missing out on.
Hence, a boogie meme. Those of us down here in the dirt don't have time for these luxuries; we consume imitations.
You're in solarpunk territory. They want to rid us of money entirely. Sounds pretty nice but requires huge cultural and lifestyle changes.
How much money does one need for a long walk and listening to birds?
Time is money. If you work 2 jobs to provide for your kids alone, good luck finding the time and headspace to not worry about anything.
Parks and forests aren't evenly distributed. Not everyone can afford living near one or going there.
In capitalism, one must first pay for basic necessities like food and shelter before anything else. For some people who make low wages this requires an amount of time and effort that interferes with their leisure time.
That said, there are also some people who think they are in this category when in reality their stress is due to self-imposed standards of living that are higher than necessary. Or anxiety and other psychological problems that could be addressed through non-material strategies.
also encouraged and exacerbated by capitalism (the former - to create the illusion of a "middle class" for people to aspire to and vote against their own actual material conditions, the latter - by commodifying health care and pathologizing anything that harms "productivity")
How much money does one need to not have to choose between spending their evenings on a long walk listening to birds vs delivering pizzas as a third job to avoid eviction?
Roughly $75,000+ a year to live comfortably as a single person in the US. Depending on location.
Do you answer all rhetorical questions? Is that your thing?
Yes.
Thanks for clarification! I wasn't sure
Thank you for moving day naps higher on the list.
Ⓐ🏴✊
Why add a symbol that is almost solely used by totalitarian governments?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hammer_and_sickle
Are there any countries that use the symbol that are actually nice places to live with good governments?
Angola
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angola#Angolan_Civil_War
Yes I'm aware of the history of Angola.
You asked
Angola has made a conscious decision to stick to this symbol as if transitions to a liberal democracy and stable economy. There were some efforts to change the flag recently because as you said it's often associated with totalitarian regimes. But those efforts failed because to Angolans it symbolizes the Angolan triumph over the colonial oppression of Portugal and resistance to apartheid South African invasion.
It could change in the future, Angola is still moving towards "good government" and "nice place to live" as you said. But for now it remains their national flag.
Interesting. That being said I don't understand the lemmygrad peoples desire for the Hammer and sickle as a symbol. Like almost nothing good has come from it. Even in Angola it seems to be viewed as a somewhat tarnished period in their history.
I get what you mean, I'm helping to add nuance to the discussion. Also a bunch of white people coming in and telling Angolans what symbols they can and can't use to represent their triumph over colonialism and apartheid isn't a great look either.
@laverabe
Meaning is also contextual - different cultures put different meaning in symbols. To represent global ideas we need some consensus.
Baltic neo-pagans were rigtfully culturally suppressed from using swastika as "symbol of Sun". Hammer and sickle also signifies millions of deaths and decades of repressioms. It is even forbidden in some post soviet countries along with swastika. Lets find something less damaging to represent marxist ideas.
@Humana
I don't believe in these sweeping absolutes. Context and motive are important parts of any equation of what's "acceptable".
@Humana
I think the only system to believe in here is sensitivity to feelings and histories of others. If you don't mind triggering literally millions of people whose families were hurt by soviets, it is your choice.
And wouldn't you be against public display of swastikas if they are displayed by "neopagans" and supposedly symbolize Sun?
Do you ban them from museums? Textbooks? Documentaries? No because they are in an appropriate context. I would never wear or display a swastika and I feel disgusted to see one displayed by anyone with pride. Context and motive matter...
I can't tell if you're being ignorant or disingenuous. The Ⓐ should be a clue as to my opinion on government in general, no? As for ☭ - check the first sentence of the article you linked. Or the description written under it, for what I meant to invoke.
I am no USSR apologist. I just consider that symbol useful as a marker for worker solidarity.
I understand what it means, and I support what it is trying to do in theory. The problem is there has never been a government, to my knowledge, that has embraced the ideology that has not turned to corruption/totalitarianism. In these countries, the proletariat are deprived of their rights and fare far worse. That is what the hammer and sickle represents.
I'm happy to change my mind if an example can prove otherwise, but to my knowledge the most effective form of government is that of a social democracy, which is represented by a red rose.
I'm not talking about any governments.
Like I already told you:
This sentence is the entire and only reason I used that symbol. You have zero reason to continue to ask me for "good governments using this symbol". It is not a symbol of government. Communism is stateless, ergo no government. Just like anarchism.
You're trolling. Fuck off.
Nice civility
Symbols can have meanings that are different than what they turn into. Hammer and sickle is almost unanimously considered to be a symbol of Stalin USSR totalitarian communism where millions perished.
The Hindu one is, yes.
Not denying that.
Only to people ignorant of what communism actually means.
But do you understand how much money you can make if you make them paid Add-ons or subscription based?!?! Think of the money! Think of the riches!
Treat yourself to a two-hour nap without our latest Life DLC™! Only $29.99*!
*Per nap. We cannot guarantee you will fall asleep or stay asleep. All DLC is non-refundable.
We have made it so that having the freedom to choose, a most basic human need, feels like doing incorrect stuff.
Like, just choosing to leave a relationship subjects you to so much pain and hate that you'd rather not do it.
It sucks, but sadly a lot of these things are luxuries. Some are getting better but others worse (for example, there are less birds now than in the past, or at least it seems that way).
Most of these should be rights
This. Especially in modern first-world nations. There are plenty of resources for the wealthy to still be wealthy and everyone to have at least economic security.
Are other people just ignoring this or am I the only person who is distracted by this?
Didn't go back to look so it doesn't exist
Didn't notice until you pointed it out
Ignoring
Ignorig
It was on the news this mroing
a mother in ar who had kill her three kids, they are taking the three babby back to new york too lady to rest. my pary are with the father who lost his chrilden ; i am truley sorry for your lots
Using Linux
That's just good anti-capitalism practice, so yeah that tracks.
When I read this, my dyslexic read luxuries as linux
Same thats why i wrote the comment lol
You do need time and money, apparently.
Yeah I think it's been found that there is a sweet spot for income and happiness. Having billions of dollars won't make you any happier, but I think it's something around $120K per year that provides everything needed to have a happy life without having to stress much about paying the bills.
Unfortunately the vast majority of people fall way below the level of income needed that's necessary to be able to have a stress free long walk and a good conversation that's not about how to make ends meet, etc.
Interestingly, my personal calculations agree with that general figure.
I like the implication that freely expressing myself involves flames.
It does for me 🔥
“The ability to freely express yourself”
—with fire.
Yeah, truth. Nobody has complete freedom in a world of other people. I don't get to run around being an ax murderer, for example (not that I want to be). There are plenty of guardrails and rules and laws, many for good reason.
I was talking about how the image above “express yourself” looks like fire.
what are you a millionaire?
Might you by chance be American?
I'm on the fence about hearings birds singing. It is really annoying to get woken up way too early by a bird who just knows two tunes and sings it over and over and over again. Like what the fuck?! Didn't they teach you a third tune at bird school to make your song a bit more melodic and less irritating? Fucking twitter.
There's this big male cardinal who lives in my rhododendron. He's not the problem. The problem are the loud, brash younglings who show up and try to muscle in on his territory. They start before dawn, screaming at the top of a tree, making up for their lack of style with sheer volume.
Plus they sound like fucking car alarms. The Big Boy has a gorgeous call, and perches on the fence between the houses to take advantage of the acoustics, and starts at least an hour after dawn because no lady wants to be woken up early by a fuckboy.
He must be back early this year because there's only been one asshole bird who woke me up.
Gigachad birb. O7
Whenever I see him in the summer he's got at three or four females following him around.
The birds here are really confused lately and have just been singing all night without a break, it's driving me crazy.
Light pollution?
everything on the list requires money. but I get the point you're trying to say
I didn't realize I needed money to sleep well... Or to have a slow morning... Or to listen to birds sing?
Even in third world countries you'd have this...
Hard to have a slow morning and day naps when you're rushing between two jobs because you don't have money.
If you had money, you could be more selective in finding work that provided the balance and flexibility needed to appreciate the things in life that are free.
But all of these things are too expensive when you're time-poor, and most people are time poor because they're desperately trying to avoid being financially poor.
We're talking about a very small amount of people who have to work multiple jobs 7 days a week, with many more poor people who don't do that.
And you didn't cover the birds singing, which you can do pretty much any place...
I think you're underestimating how much labour the global poor perform in a 24 hour period, 7 days a week.
But yes, many of these things can be possible if you prioritise them for your mental health, my point is just that it's not always easy to prioritise mental health when you're focused on physical survival.
But obviously, if you can include these things in your routine, you absolutely should, there are virtually no downsides.
I don't think I am actually.
I think it's almost impossible to miss every single one of these all the time. I have worked with the extremely poor, and watched documentaries of people in third world countries regularly. Most people even those who are literal third world slaves (indebted for life) can still regularly enjoy at least 2 of these things regularly.
I'm not saying it's not shit and that ideally everyone should experience all of them, but it's unrealistically cynical and nihilistic to think everyone poor is just miserable and doesn't enjoy anything.
My god you are clueless. Have you moved out of your parent's home yet? I'm just curious where you are in your life? If you moved, were you given a stable and well funded childhood? I'm just trying to understand the disconnect.
Yeah I've lived out of home for close to 2 decades.
I think people here are being extremely dramatic if they say they never are able to sleep in or never have a chance to hear birds singing though, or to watch a sunset. That is absolute hyperbolic bullshit.
Unless this post is about doing it every day (which it isn't), then everyone gets to enjoy these luxuries at least semi-regularly.
A lot of people cannot get a good night of sleep because they have to wake up super fucking early in order to arrive at their work on time. A number of them might then go from work straight to classes (like a cheap college-level graduation, in hopes of getting a better paying job sometime in the future), so by the time they get home, their free time is spent caring for the home and prepping for tomorrow. Even those that have "free nights" may not end up spending that time for leisure
Birds singing are rare in big cities. You know, the so called concrete jungles? They'll have a number of pigeons and sparrows, but depending on the city, the lack of trees means that's the only 2 kinds of birds you'll see or hear, period.
People are missing the forest for the trees. These are luxuries yes, but missing every single one of them is an extreme poverty of life as it'd be extremely hard to do.
Stress ruins everything
I love me some slow mornigs too
Spell check is the real real luxury.
Of all the ways to misspell that, that is probably the worst way.
These are great but aren’t colorful sunsets (at least in part) a side effect of air pollution? ;)
Or when blood has been spilled that night
Sailor's delight
love my slow mornigs
I know you’re making a joke about the typo but low key slow mornings are for sure one of the greatest subtle pleasures of life
I agree lol. had one today myself
Sooo being a Hobbit? Yeah I'm good with that
Most of those shouldn't be luxuries, but rights.
Would also add hugs to this list 🤗
I miss hugs. One of the nicest underappreciated aspects of human connection IMO
And healthy body
Aye... :(
Parklife!
Yes, I love when birds wake me up at 5 am from their incessant singing because they can't shut up. It makes me so happy to not be able to sleep.
Bruh they aren't that loud
people rejecting these ideas as a whole as they continue to doomscroll online 👌
This is just all the stuff I don't have time for after kids.
reminder that it takes a village to raise a child, it's so fucked up that people are expected to raise kids on their own and just have no free time
My work moved me away from family, not much I can do about that for the next 3 years.
So, you live on a desert island? because if you don't, and you don't, there is plenty you can do about it... I guarantee that wherever you are, there is a supportive community to be a part of.
Oh yeah I'm part of a couple of fantastic support communities, but those take more time, not give it back to you. The independent time without a child is what has evaporated.
I had most of these things before having a kid :( life was good back then
stop having kids
I did after 1
Anybody know some good books? Have been pretty disappointed for the longest time
I know hundreds but I don't know your tastes.
Honestly, I'm into anything if it's good. I just like really good art, but more towards fiction than non-fiction.
If you're into fantasy, look into The Wheel of Time series. It's dense, absolutely packed with characters, and the world has a ton of detail. It's also 14 (rather large) books long, 15 if you count the prequel, so if you like it it'll keep you busy for a good long while.
If you've seen the Amazon series based on the books and were turned off by it, maybe give the books a try instead. The Amazon series doesn't do it justice, in my opinion.
If you like sci-fi, I recommend The Expanse books and novellas.
The audiobooks narrated by Jefferson Mays are also good, as is the TV series, though they tried to cram too much into the last season, IMO, without actually finishing the story. The ending in the books is tons better.
If you like sci-fi, I recommend Project Hail Mary. It was written by the author of the book that became the movie “The Martian” (also supposedly a real great book, and on my list). Same guy wrote the short story “The Egg” that’s a pretty good and quick philo-fi.
A Psalm for the Wild-Built by Becky Chambers. It's quite uplifting.
Everything by Becky Chambers is pretty uplifting. She's probably my favorite author right now.
@TheKingBee @toaster Completely agree. Am working my way through all her stuff and I’m loving it .
A friend literally just gifted me a copy of this because I've been feeling so burnt out by capitalism, and let me tell you, I devoured that book. It spoke to my weary soul. And made me want to quit my job (I already was wanting to quit my job)
The Both Die in the End
The Goldfinch by Donna Tartt! Really, all her books but this one especially.
And anything by David Mitchell, though my favorite is 1000 Autumns of Jacob de Zoet.
If you read these I hope you enjoy them as much as I did!
Got any preferred genres?
Mainly Fiction
That's half of "Science Fiction" so I'll start with that.
You looking for a series or something standalone?
Either or! A series might give me a lot more material.
Read the Vorkosigan Saga. Lois McMaster Bujold. The audiobooks are also outstanding. Long series with fantastic characters, each one distinct. It's a big space opera. Totally worth it.
Ooh, I'm piggybacking on this. Been looking for a good sci-fi audiobook. Thanks.
Her Five Gods fantasy series is also exquisite.
“What the Hell Did I Just Read” is as advertised
Busy maybe, but will the be entertained.
I read Moby Dick once and it was not enjoyable in the least. It is boring as fuck. Maybe it's imitating through prose the long monotonous stretches between whale sightings, but that's not an engaging read.
Definitely has the vibe of the original Princess Bride. I might have to look around for an abridged version.
Mornigs 🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
Need to add 'a long hot shower' to this list.
My good night's sleep was cut short by listening to birds singing...what now?
Your morning just got longer. Slow morning 🤗
College ruined books for me. I no longer wanna touch those things.
Omg naps... I get like 2 per year. 2 more if I'm sick.
I realized I needed to change my life when I broke my collarbone and those 2 weeks of not doing much were so outrageously enjoyable
I agree these are the real luxuries but they CAN be supplemented by a little happy consumerism here and there. I love to have a good conversation with friends over a good lunch at a restaurant, or going to a nice dinner. Have meals out is a nice luxury also.
I agree although ideally we should create public spaces where you don’t need to pay for a meal to have good conversation if you don’t want to.
I’d also add science - a subset of reading I suppose, but it can lead to experiments and theoretical models. I love it, costs me nothing (thanks Wiki supporters) and there’s still so much to learn and discover.
The weird thing about this is, a few of these things are rather hard once you have kids. Don't know the last time when I slept alone in my bed or had a slow morning. But well, you get other things in return, like the pure love of you children so it's fine haha.
That's because we destroyed the primitive communal family to create the nuclear family. Humans throughout most of history would raise their children collectively, rather than all the responsibility just being dumped directly onto the parents.
And they wonder why we don't have kids lol
That's true, we also have the unfortunate situation that we don't have any relatives that could support us. All grand parents live at least ~5 hours away. Moving isn't really an option for my wife because of her work currently.
Really sucks...
it's so wild because we still have the saying that it takes a village to raise a child!
don't have kids
Congratulations, they are GenLast.
(The planet is dying from an overpopulation hug of death for those that didn't figure that out yet.)
Larry, I’m on Ducktales.
Some species of birds are singing some really complicated non-repeating songs.
Just saw a meme today (can't find it again or I would share it) where a bird is threatening to commit all this violence against another bird, a la Gus Fring talking to Walter White, and all the human hears is a happy bird song.
Yea, mockingbirds are lit!
How very un-21st century of them. I swear most music today is four minutes of two constantly repeating chords.
Still need money for most of these. Otherwise you'll be working for the basics
The other morning my dogs woke me up way too damn early, but it meant I got to watch a very fat pigeon on the power line behind my house, and I got to see the finch population rapidly increase around it. (I swear I saw one little bird and by the time I got out of bed there were 5 jetting around. Pigeon did not move.)
I agree that these are luxuries for a lot of people. Some of them can be found with mindset shifts (from "fuck you dogs" to "oh look, pretty birds" for example) but it's also hard to shift your mindset to positivity when our society tries its damnedest to beat happiness out of you.
I'll substitute sunrise in place of sunset and remove naps because I rarely sleep during the day because it fucks up my circadian rhythm. Everything else is spot on.
Something about naps I discovered I that there is two kind of naps
Waking up from a short nap should be easy and you should feel energized almost immediately, if its not the case it probably means that your body started a full sleep cycle.
So to be able to nap during the day we need to find a way to tell or body that this is just a short break and we are not going for a full sleep, usually sleeping somewhere different like the couch or in a different position in the bed
But my time for fun and play is spent on mass media and consumerism!
Slow mornig
I'm an IT person and it's all jumbled up.
I'll decide what makes me happy and what I need, thanks mate.
Imagine being this smug when yourself.
Fuck solarpunk. I buy carefully, not mindlessly, based on what I'm getting and for how long, with the intent of not having to replace what I buy. So let's get that out of the way, this isn't about the merits of environmental preservation or efficient use of our resources.
I need mass media because I ENJOY PLAYING VIDEO GAMES. I don't want to live in the fucking "gay space commune", I want to live in a world that feels good to me, and you solarpunk assholes seem to say people like me who escape from reality because they've NEVER been capable of supporting themselves should start a fucking garden?!
Newsflash. I. Don't. Like. Your. "Utopia". I never will. If you ever succeed in making your idea of a future a reality, I'll burn it to the fucking ground as my revenge on you bastards. I hate your idea because all it does is change how I am oppressed as a disabled adult to how I was oppressed as a special needs child illegally taken from my parents by a corrupt mental health system.
You want to see a real utopia? A place where everyone is happy in the world they live in? Fucking find an oneirogenic drug that induces lucid dreams or create a VR metaverse.
Who I am in reality does not matter. Who I am in my mind can't be expressed in a solarpunk world, only online. At least that's how it used to be.
Why am I named the same as an Open Source Game? Cyperprep doesn't have to mean "the future megacorps are not so bad!" but rather "megacorps control this dystopian future but they can't always stop the signal and that means Open Source Software is the way to fight back".
The difference between FOSS for smart devices and social networks and FOSS for games is that games are art and that means paid food production will take precedence over volunteer video games.
And no, you don't get to say "get another hobby". I know myself. I like technology. I don't like preachy people. I stopped buying Apple when I stopped seeing unique-looking devices. I am a gamer. Most importantly, I am a sci-fi writer who wants optimistic stories that don't assume the reader is a fully-capable person.
I am not demanding you write what I want to see. Only that you not try to turn reality into it. If you see this, once again, fuck solarpunk.
No one is talking about you, mass media and consumerism has nothing to do with anything you described. Video games as a whole does not equal consumerism or mass media. Micro transactions and other terrible patterns do.
When was the last time you saw a video game in a solarpunk story?
I didn’t even think there were serious solar punk stories, and even if so, aren’t all of them like technological utopias? Why would entertainment ie video games be gone from them? Even if they aren’t the focus (which makes sense) what reason would a solar punk society have to do away with video games?
@TeryVeneno I can't imagine a solarpunk universe *without* games honestly. In my head-cannon they're a vital part of education.
Agreed, it seems really odd for any such society to do away with something so beloved
Read "Project Hieroglyph" and the way one of its "optimistic" stories ("Girl in Wave: Wave in Girl") shows a multiplayer superhero game and the main character hates it. That's not how mental illness works, computers used to be GOOD for providing social contact. That's not education, that's "fix yourself".
I am not broken. I am unhappy because I don't want to live in a world where I face reality, whether that's "IRL" or "social media". You know why I like the 4th Matrix movie? It reminds us that this image isn't what the world provides, it's what the Matrix - real life - forces us to work towards. The Matrix isn't just the fake world, it's the fake world on top of a real one and the real escape is to change, not break, the system that binds us because there is nothing in the real but vast lifeless desert. Mars, the Moon... Dead rocks. There is no evidence of an afterlife nor any point to "accepting" a secular life you hate because you will still hate it and "scientific evidence only" doesn't fix anything or change who you are.
Also are you ok? I find it rather odd to be this intensely invested about what is generally a fairly niche community in solarpunk. Not that the mission and ideology aren’t worth being passionate about, but I mean we are talking about video games and green societies nothing crazy.
I’ll definitely have to give that a read, though some quick reading of opinions about that work are fairly mixed.
Also no one has said you’re broken or that you need to face reality. The whole point of solarpunk is that will be no world to face unless we take action. And none of that has anything to do with video games or anything you have described.
Simple. Because most solarpunk is written by people who hate technology corporations.
To be fair, big tech is evil. Doesn't change my point.
Um, but the majority of video games are not made by big tech? What is your point? Indie games are usually just better overall anyway. I’m really failing to see why any solarpunk society would stop people from making video games
Because solarpunk writers are rarely, if ever, gamers. Gamers are a niche subculture in the solarpunk works I've seen and as you're seeing, people in the solarpunk community seem to like it that way.
My confusion continues to compound. Many of the people in this thread have zero issue with video games or actually play them. I really gotta see a source for
All video games are made by technology corporations! Except for Open TTD of course.
Asshole, I never said that. I'm well aware TTD was originally a commercial product, that's my entire point. You can't make games for free, and yes, I value video games more than continued lifespan because art allows me to ignore a reality I despise for being defined by everyone else.
You don't have the right to fucking judge me for the tiny little quirk of liking a game, I only mentioned it because it was mildly relevant.
Actually, I believe you can make games for free to consumers, and I believe systems inspired by solarpunk would, if anything, do a better job of encouraging this over our current political system. Art, including video games, doesn't just disappear in solarpunk societies.
I'm not judging you for liking a game, I never said anything of the sort, lol. Although I find it hard not to judge you if you just bark insults.
Murder in the tool library
Edit: actually they feature even more prominently in the sequel #Missing Mermaid, where the investigators interview a full time gamer and possible witness who was streaming some kind of dark souls sequel near the dissapearance/possible kidnapping.
Also the rulebook for the TTRPG Fully Automated specific mentions that playing videogames full time is an accepted lifestyle in their post-scarcity society, and the contacts character stat tracks online contacts independently from offline, so you can make a character who has no Internet presence, or who lives entirely in games and basically only makes friends through videogames, or anywhere in between.
I'm a shut-in, with untreated health issues, someone who partakes in escapism, and even someone who likes the idea of programming but can't really do much (I tinkered on rendering polygons from text input last September and didn't even finish it enough to be usable for me).
I haven't seen much solarpunk but I've never thought to myself that it'd be worse for me. If I existed in an environment like that (particularly from birth or at least for a long time) I don't think I'd be the same escapist shut-in. I could see open-source games still existing, and maybe programming being better even if people are less likely to have videogames as their most common activity. I've taken care of already-growing plants before, but it seems to me like a lax solarpunk environment would offer more options/opportunity than employment currently offers. Probably actual opportunity to travel, too.
Even carrying over my current mindset and (lack of) capability, I can't see a solarpunk environment being even half as restricted as my experience now. I mean the whole idea is better community and technology used to help people (not strictly for money) so it seems to me you wouldn't be required to garden.
To be fair, it seems like I may have had bad luck in the first three solarpunk works I ever experienced. My issue against the whole idea is "this is a society that can no longer afford to value non-practical pursuits, it is the future we are headed towards, therefore our present society can no longer afford to value non-practical pursuits" that was somehow in all three solarpunk works I encountered.
The three in question were Girl in Wave: Wave in Girl, the Necroverse by "RichM", and a story that a fair-weather friend wrote that I no longer have a copy of that showed a dystopian cybersolarpunk hybrid where "Covid-19 has ended the modern age and now everything is powered by wind turbines because most of us are dead".
As a result of such bad luck, I may have overestimated how central that theme of "self-sufficiency or die" is to the genre.
Bro, what does any of this have to do with solarpunk?
Just normal stuff...
This is a Wendy's
So you think hurting people to make things the way you want them is acceptable? Because of video games? You are a dangerous man child (or maybe just a child).
You build my dystopia, you're imprisoning me. I am a cornered animal, do not fuck with me.
Ah confirmation.
Confirmation indeed. It's really too much to fucking ask that you NOT build another fucking prison? You, not me, are the sociopath. At least I reserve my angry rampage for if you succeed.
You judge me for liking what I like? You are literally trying to control my life by redefining society, and no, I'm not some rich skullfucker nor do I think people aren't entitled to the same basic level of comfort I enjoy regardless of race, gender, eromantic orientation or anything else; they may not have it, but if you wanted real equality then you NEED to uplift people's minimum living standard.
Apparently you care more about organic produce and trees than children or the homeless.
Who's talking about building a prison? You've imagined an enemy in solarpunk that has nothing to do with solarpunk and are getting upset at an internet stranger that has made no claims about wanting to stop you from playing video games.
You'll understand when your 13.
Then don't build it and we're fine. I'm angry because I'm disabled and Solarpunk is usually Ableist yet everyone is obsessed with social media detox and lumping all technologies in with it.
The solarpunk you've imagined in your head is ableist. Solarpunk is but an aesthetic. Don't assume so much and try to understand more nuance.
Cool story, bro.