Hey, give them some credit, they have some diversity - there's place in europe, new place in europe, mispronounced place in europe, british ruler, catholic saint in spanish, american president, explorer related to america, and of course native american place/tribe, and random native american word
These days you can't even tell the name comes from the area. They use old words to describe it. An area with a hill could be called a "Something-bjer". Bjer means hill and is close to the modern word Berg but if you don't know about it then you don't think about it.
Sure, we could have old barn road. But I am not talking about roads. More like City names, local village names, local area names and such.
Unless you are from Sweden it's not that surprising you never heard about "bjer" haha. I only learned about it pretty recently and I am born and raised here 😅 The majority of people probably never think about why places are named the way they are
In Oklahoma we just use the name of whatever tribe was forcibly relocated there. Although I know of one town that was named after a misspelling of an indian chief's name. The Apollo 14 CSM pilot lived there.
i think i'm kind of superimposing the prayers and acknowledgements because (1) the last one i was at was at a church and it was kind of both, (2) i'm a church musician and when all you've got is a hammer, and (3) like, statesia. prayers. you know.
one of my grandfathers was one of the kids stolen from his tribe (fuck if we know which one) by the mormons as part of their Indian Placement Program (theologically they wanted to turn the natives white. don't get me started). so like, i don't want to sear all white people with the same brand, but like, sometimes the acknowledgements feel like a bandaid. okay most of the time.
all i know is it fucked up my grandfather something terrible
Yeah, people from that city or place moved there and named their new home after their old home. There's a very Dutch area of Michigan with many immigrants from the Netherlands still there. Want to know a couple town names? Holland and Zeeland.
Can't forget Noordeloos, Vriesland, Overisel, Drenthe, and Borculo. Been to Borculo a few times. Lotsa folks with Dutch/Frisian/Low German surnames in the area, including the (in)famously wealthy Van Andel and De Vos families of Grand Rapids.
Supposedly, the phrase "if you ain't Dutch, you ain't much" used to be common here, but I've never heard it used unironically. Likely died off with time.
And at some places they even reassign them new genders: The coat of arms of Berne Switzerland has a bear with a red penis. The US town: New Berne has a bear without a penis as a coat of arms. This means during the sea transport, Berne's bear outed themselves as Transgender and changed their sex to a lady-bear. (At least in my head cannon)
It would be amazing if they had arrived to the Americas and ask some natives about how they call a place and they said "this? This is New Amsterdam. We don't know what's Amsterdam but this is a newer version of it"
This reminds me of a story about a French ship that landed someplace, and a native of the area walked down the beach and greeted them, saying "Bonjour." Shocked that the locals spoke perfect French, the sailors asked "Parlez-vous francais??" and the local, confusedly asked "what did you say?" in the local language.
As it turns out, both the local language and French had apparently arrived at more or less the exact same word for a greeting by pure coincidence.
That sometimes leads to confusing results. When Europeans arrived on the Saint Lawrence river they asked what they called the place. The indigenous people thought they were asking about what the word for village was so told them that word. Then every village they went they thought they were asking the name of the place but were actually asking "is this a village?" and the response was "yes, this is a village." So that led to the assumption the entire region was called that.
Yeah so the indigenous word for "village" was "canada". Woops! When they figured out the mistake it was already on all the maps, so whatever I guess.
There's a lot of places in America that are named after native American tribes. I guess it's the least our predecessors could do considering how badly they fucked over and slaughtered the natives.
"Yeah, we're naming this river after you guys in honor of your stewardship of the environment. No, it's not going to catch on fire or anything like that. How could a river catch on fire?"
Sure but calling them Americans is likely, mostly, sorta true but also ignores an important fact... They were Europeans (or near descendants of) calling the places that. Often a place was named that place because it reminded them of home / to honor their parents home.
True, but I think we may be the only country other than India to name a major city after another major city in the same country. Portland Oregon was named after Portland Maine
Don't forget the number of places named Springfield. A quick search pulls up an article that puts the number at at least 30 different places in the US.
"Ink, AR" because when it was time to name the town a questionnaire was circulated to solicit suggestions, and the top of the form said "write in ink". Except not really goddammit.
First read this as “naming new borns” and I was thinking of names like Paris or London, and all of the comments kind of made sense but were still slightly off. It was a fun, confusing time for me, until I scrolled up and re-read OP. Thanks for listening to my story.
To be fair, many Spanish words are bastardizations of Arabic words. This is just how languages evolve. For example the word Guadalupe is believed to derive from Arabic wādī al-lubb (hidden river). When people in my town pronounce it "Guadaloop," it's actually closer to the OG than the Spanish is lol
I think there’s a difference between happenstance and purposefully doing it though. What you said is very true, but not purposeful. The people in buena vista know they are mispronouncing it, yet they still call it Spanish and they still do it. Either don’t call it Spanish or don’t do it.
I mean, the Christian precursors to Spain were at war with a series of Islamic Caliphates on the Iberian Peninsula for the better part of 800 years. They didn't like each other very much. It's totally likely they intentionally mispronounced words
I don't know how to tell you this bud, but willful ignorance is a global phenomenon. For instance, some people think US Americans are the only dumbshits in the world, when, in fact, they are just the loudest
Ohio also has a town named Versailles. Imagine the worst way to pronounce the name of the historical palace in France. That's right, they pronounce it (VUR - SAY- els).
Well, the Capitol of Minnesota could have been called Pigs Eye after a French Canadian fur trapper if it wasn't for a Catholic priest changing it to St Paul.
and the original European names are also pretty functional:
I believe Amsterdam is just "River Dam"
And York is just "Yew", presumably named after trees that grew there. (Eburacon -> Eboracum -> Eoforwic -> Jórvík -> York)
But New York in the United States isn't even directly named after the English city of York, but rather a person (James Stuart) who was the Duke of York when England took control of the territory from the Dutch.
Lots of inland American cities are named after the famous port city of China, Canton, which is formally known as Guangzhou.
I don't know why it was such a popular pick back in the day, but I'm guessing it has to do with this:
The port of Guangzhou serves as a transportation hub. Guangzhou is also one of China's three largest cities.[10] For a long time, it was the only Chinese port accessible to the Europeans
Canton and Cantonese is actually the english name derived from the Portuguese transliteration of the region when they first started ocean trading with China.
I checked and nah, most of them explicitly state China as the name origin and one of them is even close to another town called Nankin which was named after Nanjing lol.
170 replies
Hey, give them some credit, they have some diversity - there's place in europe, new place in europe, mispronounced place in europe, british ruler, catholic saint in spanish, american president, explorer related to america, and of course native american place/tribe, and random native american word
I think you're just describing how the etymology of most named places works.
In my country we name places after the surrounding area/environment. If it's an area with a big hill it will probably have a name to reflect that.
I love visiting other areas "Old Barn Rd", and "Swamp Rd"
These days you can't even tell the name comes from the area. They use old words to describe it. An area with a hill could be called a "Something-bjer". Bjer means hill and is close to the modern word Berg but if you don't know about it then you don't think about it.
Sure, we could have old barn road. But I am not talking about roads. More like City names, local village names, local area names and such.
Gotcha.
That's interesting, I've never heard of bjer before
Unless you are from Sweden it's not that surprising you never heard about "bjer" haha. I only learned about it pretty recently and I am born and raised here 😅 The majority of people probably never think about why places are named the way they are
I was thinking you meant in the US, like in New England or something. Glad I learned a new thing already today
Now way, are suggesting about Matamoros what I think you are suggesting? ( ◕_◕)
Americans can't pronounce Illinois
Illin-wah
N’wah!
Kansas
Arkansas
Kansas
Arkansas
Kansas and pirate Kansas
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U7X7cEh5au8&pp=0gcJCUECo7VqN5tD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVPsbr9tz60
There's a town in Illinois called Sauget with an ongoing debate over how to pronounce it. None of the dozens of pronunciations are what you'd think.
I vote they settle on changing the name to sausage.
The Spanish names barely count because those were originally Mexican and had been named before USA was born.
In the west coast we typically just used the name of the native tribe we killed in order to take the land.
Or the Spanish name from when the Spanish took the land a couple hundred years before.
In Oklahoma we just use the name of whatever tribe was forcibly relocated there. Although I know of one town that was named after a misspelling of an indian chief's name. The Apollo 14 CSM pilot lived there.
I wouldn't know anything about that here in siʔaɬ.
That's OK though /j
Yes, I visited Themdamninjuns last time I went through Illinois.
If you are making multiple asides, the standard approach is to use square brackets within the first parentheses, not double parentheses.
e.g.
footnotes^1^.
^1^gotta use^2^
^2^go^3^tcha
^3^ better footnotes
Thank you. I think I have it now.
Nah I prefer feeling like I’m reading a 90’s chain email.
I had not heard of this before. Usually those are used when adding text to a quote for clarification. Is this mainly a British English thing?
It's professional writing. It's like when people complain how titles have capital letters in them, is just a form of writing.
and then we say a prayer thanking the tribe every sunday at church, don't forget that
They do it before everything from sports to classical music where I am.
do they explicitly thank the tribe in the prayer?
i know they're trying, but it's kind of ridiculous.
It's not actually a prayer, just an acknowledgement. But yes.
i think i'm kind of superimposing the prayers and acknowledgements because (1) the last one i was at was at a church and it was kind of both, (2) i'm a church musician and when all you've got is a hammer, and (3) like, statesia. prayers. you know.
one of my grandfathers was one of the kids stolen from his tribe (fuck if we know which one) by the mormons as part of their Indian Placement Program (theologically they wanted to turn the natives white. don't get me started). so like, i don't want to sear all white people with the same brand, but like, sometimes the acknowledgements feel like a bandaid. okay most of the time.
all i know is it fucked up my grandfather something terrible
And yet you still support the religion of the colonizers. You should take your talent elsewhere.
i do? lay out your stupid argument. I'll hear it ONCE.
It was Europeans who named those places.
Yeah, people from that city or place moved there and named their new home after their old home. There's a very Dutch area of Michigan with many immigrants from the Netherlands still there. Want to know a couple town names? Holland and Zeeland.
Can't forget Noordeloos, Vriesland, Overisel, Drenthe, and Borculo. Been to Borculo a few times. Lotsa folks with Dutch/Frisian/Low German surnames in the area, including the (in)famously wealthy Van Andel and De Vos families of Grand Rapids.
Supposedly, the phrase "if you ain't Dutch, you ain't much" used to be common here, but I've never heard it used unironically. Likely died off with time.
Well, Americans citizens were all immigrants, most were European
Don't let ICE read that!
Will they do self-harm if they read that?
And at some places they even reassign them new genders: The coat of arms of Berne Switzerland has a bear with a red penis. The US town: New Berne has a bear without a penis as a coat of arms. This means during the sea transport, Berne's bear outed themselves as Transgender and changed their sex to a lady-bear. (At least in my head cannon)
Almost certainly typical American Puritanism.
Wow, history is fascinating!
You can still see it, it just became bigger and black and moved a bit backwards
Behold the BBBBBC (Berne’s Bear’s Big Black Backward Cock)
Meanwhile, Alexander the Great: You'll be me lol
"Americans" as in white Europeans?
It would be amazing if they had arrived to the Americas and ask some natives about how they call a place and they said "this? This is New Amsterdam. We don't know what's Amsterdam but this is a newer version of it"
"It's called Noo Amsterdam, I don't know why you think it's referencing some place we've never heard of, it just means big harbor"
This reminds me of a story about a French ship that landed someplace, and a native of the area walked down the beach and greeted them, saying "Bonjour." Shocked that the locals spoke perfect French, the sailors asked "Parlez-vous francais??" and the local, confusedly asked "what did you say?" in the local language.
As it turns out, both the local language and French had apparently arrived at more or less the exact same word for a greeting by pure coincidence.
That sometimes leads to confusing results. When Europeans arrived on the Saint Lawrence river they asked what they called the place. The indigenous people thought they were asking about what the word for village was so told them that word. Then every village they went they thought they were asking the name of the place but were actually asking "is this a village?" and the response was "yes, this is a village." So that led to the assumption the entire region was called that.
Yeah so the indigenous word for "village" was "canada". Woops! When they figured out the mistake it was already on all the maps, so whatever I guess.
My ancestors had great names for places. Then the white invaders killed most of us and named our land after their home.
I think this meme would be better suggested to say white European immigrants to America.
A lot of states are named after the natives they genocided
Exactly - they weren't "Americans" yet.
Let's name our town "New [someplace we miss back home]."
Other than the earliest settlements, most cities in the US were named by people born in North America.
Memphis, Tennessee has entered the chat, y'all.
Along with Paris, Tennessee
I’m fairly sure Paris is Europe, not Africa.
Tennessee just loves being cultured. Did you know that Nashville has a full-scale replica of the Parthenon?
They say of the acropolis where the Parthenon is ...
Did you know Bourton On The Water model village even has its own model village? It’s like model village Inception.
Paris, Texas has a pace in my cinematic heart.
TIL it’s an ancient Egyption capital.
I mean haven't you seen the Bass Pro Shops Pyramid? It's obviously a tribute to ancient Egypt.
There's a lot of places in America that are named after native American tribes. I guess it's the least our predecessors could do considering how badly they fucked over and slaughtered the natives.
"Yeah, we're naming this river after you guys in honor of your stewardship of the environment. No, it's not going to catch on fire or anything like that. How could a river catch on fire?"
Sure but calling them Americans is likely, mostly, sorta true but also ignores an important fact... They were Europeans (or near descendants of) calling the places that. Often a place was named that place because it reminded them of home / to honor their parents home.
Some other notable examples: New Zealand
São Carlos, Brazil
Munich, Saskatchewan
Liverpool, New South Wales
Nueva York, Colombia
So is nueva York named after York or new York?
Even old New York was once New Amsterdam.
Why'd they change it?
I can't say...
True, but I think we may be the only country other than India to name a major city after another major city in the same country. Portland Oregon was named after Portland Maine
Super interesting. Didn't know that. Thanks.
Don't forget the number of places named Springfield. A quick search pulls up an article that puts the number at at least 30 different places in the US.
"Truth and Consequences, NM"
"Dinosaur, CO"
"City of Industry, CA"
"Why Not?, NC"
Springfield, yes
"Ink, AR" because when it was time to name the town a questionnaire was circulated to solicit suggestions, and the top of the form said "write in ink". Except not really goddammit.
Upstate NY I went to Rome, Alexandria, Mexico, Florence, Norway, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, Denmark, Coppenhagen, etc
EDIT: don't forget Swastika, NY
Don't forget Ithaca
Well-travelled.
First read this as “naming new borns” and I was thinking of names like Paris or London, and all of the comments kind of made sense but were still slightly off. It was a fun, confusing time for me, until I scrolled up and re-read OP. Thanks for listening to my story.
But you forgot, we also have to mispronounce it then get mad if you don't mispronounce it the right way.
-someone that was born in New berlin, not "new berLIN", But "new BURlin".
How about naming the town after a city in Austria, but still the Roman way? Not just once, not just twice, but
(EDIT: I'm having déja vu after the last time had I brought up the several dozen Springfields)
That's just how Wien is spelled in English. We also pronounce it how it's spelled in English. No different from calling Österreich Austria
For a better example: Versailles, Kentucky. Guess how that one is pronounced.
I will go with ver-sales
Winner!
Oh God,I had an ex from Georgia that would hit me with these. Let's go with "verse-ay-lees".
Verse-ales
Shit like that is embarrassing imo
Strong levi-o-sa energy.
100% it's all in the emphasis. It's subtle, but just different enough that you can tell if someone is from the area based on their pronunciation.
Yea apperantly Worcester is pronounced "wis-tah"
If you think of Worcestershire sauce it make sense.
With a mangled pronunciation if the place is French!
TBF, the French should pronounce their own language right if they want the rest of us to as well.
French is the language of "we paid for the whole alphabet so we're going to use the whole alphabet"
Boom. French roasted.
Yeah, like "Pointe au Roche", "Isle La Motte"
There is a small village in Ohio named Buena Vista.
The locals pronounce it in a way that rhymes with Loona Fista
Wow, really? We have a own with the same name in CO as well. We pronounce it like, "Byoona Vista" too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buena_Vista,_Colorado
Yeah those people are idiots though. They even claim it’s the Spanish words, they just don’t want to pronounce them like Spanish. So fucking stupid.
To be fair, many Spanish words are bastardizations of Arabic words. This is just how languages evolve. For example the word Guadalupe is believed to derive from Arabic wādī al-lubb (hidden river). When people in my town pronounce it "Guadaloop," it's actually closer to the OG than the Spanish is lol
I think there’s a difference between happenstance and purposefully doing it though. What you said is very true, but not purposeful. The people in buena vista know they are mispronouncing it, yet they still call it Spanish and they still do it. Either don’t call it Spanish or don’t do it.
I mean, the Christian precursors to Spain were at war with a series of Islamic Caliphates on the Iberian Peninsula for the better part of 800 years. They didn't like each other very much. It's totally likely they intentionally mispronounced words
We also have a town named Limon.
Guess how that's pronounced.
Shit like this is just so typical American. I hate it.
I don't know how to tell you this bud, but willful ignorance is a global phenomenon. For instance, some people think US Americans are the only dumbshits in the world, when, in fact, they are just the loudest
There is a town in Georgia called Martinez.
They pronounced it Mart-inn-ez
Lol there's a "byoona vista" is south Ga as well.
And a Bone-a-Vista in NC.
Ohio also has a town named Versailles. Imagine the worst way to pronounce the name of the historical palace in France. That's right, they pronounce it (VUR - SAY- els).
Michigan and Ontario both have Bois Blanc Islands. Michigan's is "Boys Blank" and Ontario's is "Bob Low".
Home of Bob Loblaw's Law Blog.
Wasn't Bob Loblaw's Law Blog the place where an anti-obesity statute was first proposed referred to colloquially as the Bob Loblaw "Blob Law"?
Lima Ohio. Pronounced lime-uh
Well yeah, like a lima bean
A new place of europe.
More evidence that Egypt is European.
insert flex tape meme slapping "New" onto the European name
Hebron, Lebanon, and Bozrah CT have entered the chat.
Jamaica, VT has entered the chat
I see your Jamaica, VT and raise you Jamaica Beach, TX.
As does Medina OH. We have a lot of middle eastern names in the country actually.
Also Memphis TN is named after the city in Egypt, and I swear I've seen some Cairos around this country.
Consequently people from New England are the only ones who know how half the current English place names are pronounced.
It's "Wooster"
Also Glosster and Lester
Paris, Texas is a personal favorite.
Were staying in Paris! ...at the Hilton.
In Paris! ... Texas.
...on our way to see Paris! ... Hilton.
Indeed.
And yet we don't have a Shitterton
Thats the S in USA
When you get to the south west it becomes a place in Mexico which is a place in Spain or straight up just named after a Spanish conquistador.
In Québec they were a bit more diverse and also named lots of places after saints.
We also have a few original names, like bucksnort, horsethief basin and truth or consequences
Here in South Carolina we have Pumpkintown, Sugar Tit, and Possum Kingdom
Just add new to the name
There are also a lot of places that kept the original native names. Not as numerous as the "New [European place]" ones, but enough that you notice.
Well, the Capitol of Minnesota could have been called Pigs Eye after a French Canadian fur trapper if it wasn't for a Catholic priest changing it to St Paul.
Rest assured, there are universes out there with St. Paul, Minnesota going by Pigs Eye.
Meanwhile in the UK they have Bath and Bedford
Not to mention my whole country is named after a place there. New Zealand
Ridiculous. How could a place named in 1645 be named after a WWII anti-aircraft platform?
I don't even know
Zeeland being in the Netherlands, though. The way you replied made it sound UK.
my bad
As much as Europeans don't like it, Americans are your children.
Hey hey, we did call it "New". Well, sometimes anyway. I definitely lived in town just called York.
and the original European names are also pretty functional:
I believe Amsterdam is just "River Dam"
And York is just "Yew", presumably named after trees that grew there. (Eburacon -> Eboracum -> Eoforwic -> Jórvík -> York)
But New York in the United States isn't even directly named after the English city of York, but rather a person (James Stuart) who was the Duke of York when England took control of the territory from the Dutch.
I was down at the New Amsterdam
Staring at this yellow-haired girl
Mr. Jones strikes up a conversation
With a black-haired flamenco dancer
You know, she dances while his father plays guitar
You should check the city names in Florida, no idea what they were thinking
Probably "we're not sharing these drugs, no".
There were no Americans when many of those places were named...
I always assumed it was where the people who settled it were originally from.
Also of note: the name of Important Train Company Man
That explains Philadelphia and Memphis
I don't get it.
Lots of inland American cities are named after the famous port city of China, Canton, which is formally known as Guangzhou.
I don't know why it was such a popular pick back in the day, but I'm guessing it has to do with this:
Canton and Cantonese is actually the english name derived from the Portuguese transliteration of the region when they first started ocean trading with China.
Are we sure it doesn't come from the word "canton" as in another word for "state", e.g Swiss Cantons?
I checked and nah, most of them explicitly state China as the name origin and one of them is even close to another town called Nankin which was named after Nanjing lol.