'The Bear' writer arrested on train after complaint from white woman
In the caption of the Instagram post, he wrote, "An old white woman got on the train and immediately pointed at me and told me to correct how I was sitting. I refused, so she went to the conductor and complained. The conductor called the police and stopped the train," he said.
O'Keefe also says in the caption that the friend of the woman who called the police had said to him, "You're not the minority anymore."
A separate video about the incident has been uploaded by the user, Nalae, on TikTok, where it has quickly gone viral, having been viewed over 160,000 times as of reporting.
They said I was disturbing the peace by not leaving the train. They pulled me off the train and arrested me without even talking to the Karen who reported the one black person on the train. On the platform, the police detained me and interrogated me. Only black folks stayed nearby and recorded the arrest. When I demanded a lawyer and reminded them they didn't even take a statement from the woman who complained they eventually released me. This country is growing more psycho by the day. What will you do about it?"
https://www.newsweek.com/alex-okeefe-bear-writer-arrest-connecticut-white-woman-complaint-2133564Open linkView original on slrpnk.net
Jesus fucking Christ.
This says so much. They think “minority” means a person who gets special treatment. That’s how fucking deluded they’ve become.
That... explains so much. Racists are fucking jealous that black people get to be oppressed??? Is it like some martyrdom by proxy fuckedupedness?
Sorta. I was raised with this bullshit, so I can see the distortion of reality. I'm still unpacking all this in therapy myself, because it's a whole worldview.
First off, they're woefully uneducated about history. My high school in Oklahoma briefly touched on the Civil Rights Movement and tried to pass it off as something that was over and done. Rosa Parks got arrested, the white people were shocked that this could happen, they had a sit-in party at a milkshake stand (they didn't talk about any of the pushback that got), MLK did his speech and now everything is fine for black people, no more institutional racism, literally being taught in schools. Now, combine that with your own needs not being met, and the talking heads/politicans say that you're not getting the aid you need because it's going towards making hurt feelings better. There's only so much money in the coffers, and you gotta be really hard up if you're white, but it's easy to get if you're black.
There's also a heavy religious framing about ancestral guilt. Like, if God can make life suck for everybody because Eve ate an apple, and libs are trying to play god, it follows to reason they'd want to make your life suck for the sins of your great-great-great grandparents. It's never outright stated, but if you listen to enough sermons, the puzzle fills in. Like, again, they think the civil rights movement fixed everything, so they think white people have atoned for their transgressions, but the pastor says libs are in consort with satan and can't forgive like jesus, so that's why they want white people to suffer.
Edit: I want to make it clear that I do not personally believe any of that, it's just what I was taught as a kid.
I appreciate you identifying where in the GOP's propaganda they lead young people astray.
People like you doing a retrospective autobiopsy via therapy can help those of growing up in other contexts protect young people from propaganda, and distribute to them the truth.
Speak your truth! It's only becoming more important as time goes on in this increasingly fascistic world.
My favorite part of this is the only people making the ignorant racist lives suck are the Republicans taking everything not the left asking them to be tolerant...
It's like that comic about the guy with a plateful of cookies telling one guy that ta third guy is going to take his singular cookie. There are 2 types of republicans - one that takes, and one that gets taken from just as much as the left. The prior group has convinced the latter group that the actual thief is the left, who are in just as bad of a position as they are, if not worse. That's why they can't believe it. They're not taking everything, at least not enough to make ends meet most of the time, same as us. It's the much smaller fraction of rich republicans that are doing the taking. The issue is that they can't believe that truth, and so they lash out and become a completely different problem.
This is why the term "color blind" is used by someone trying to go the right way, but still not getting it, which leads to the ignorance of their racism. In being blind you are blind to the fact that racism still exist and isn't fixed. Then that leads to incorrect beliefs like "minorities are getting special priveleges and when they don't have the same quality of life it is because of their own poor behavior" as opposed to acknowledging the systemic racism still in place.
Sometimes, but not always. I used to call myself colorblind, but I could see how the cops treated my black friends worse than they treated me. At one point, they rounded us up waiting at the bus stop (there was an abandoned restaurant by the bus stop, and the cops said we were trying to break in), and all my POC friends got frisked, but I was the only blonde girl, so I just got a talking to about how "hanging out with the wrong crowd will ruin my life". Some of those kids are working on their PhD now, so "wrong crowd", kiss my ass.
I understood "colorblind" as a "skin tone has no bearing on how I interact with you, we're all human".
I always thought that "everybody gets treated the same at first, adjust as we go along" was respectful, but then moved to the west coast and it's apparently a horribly racist thing to do here, and I don't understand why?? Something about how black people are going through struggles I can't understand, but I also thought that everybody had struggles I don't know about?
Like, if I don't make assumptions about somebody in a wheelchair, it's a good thing and not ableist, but if I don't make assumptions about a black person, it's a bad thing and racist? I have never been able to understand how people up here think it's less racist to stereotype an ethnicity.
There's also the problem with white "leftists" up here not actually knowing any POC and getting it from fucking facebook memes. Like, I had a white person once tell me, in all seriousness, that me saying "hey, what's up" is appropriating AAVE and the correct thing to say in greeting to a black person is "I see and respect our differences". I said that sounded patronizing as fuck, and she said I should join the kkk with that attitude.
Unlearning racism has been an awful experience, really. I'm listening to what black people say they want, but that's somehow still racist, and I'm so close to just giving up and doing what feels right to me.
Colorblind is removing their identity.
You are still a black, white, brown, etc. person (I’m using {color} from now on cause I don’t want to type an array of colors each time). The person’s experiences as a {color} person are valid.
While you shouldn’t treat someone different because they are {color}, you should validate that they ARE different and celebrate those differences in an appropriate fashion.
It’s like a friend coming out to you and you reply “I don’t care”, while that is not the worst way to respond and you mean well, you are invalidating WHO they are.
I think this is much more eloquently illustrates my point: https://youtu.be/91O7q7D4xnU
Consider therapy. It helps
Thanks, you must have missed where I said I'm slowly unpacking all this in therapy. My therapist says I'm doing good, and that I'm not a racist monster because I'm putting in the effort, but that doesn't seem to be a common definition. In any case, I don't call myself colorblind any more, even if I don't understand why, people do react poorly, so I don't do it any more. This is retrospective.
But when I called myself 'colorblind' I wasn't saying "I don't care", I was saying "Okay, tell me what that means".
Like, when I came out, I absolutely hated how big of a deal people made about it. I had people "validate that I was different", but it felt like they were just making fun of me for being different because it was all weirdly patronizing. All this nonsense about "it's okay that you like boys and girls, you're still my friend" when I'm an adult who is into men and women, and I wouldn't have started hanging out with you if I thought you didn't like gay people? I'm still me, I haven't changed, and stroking my ego is just telling me that you feel weird around me now that you know I'm not 'normal'.
I still felt stereotyped and unwelcome, even though they were being "inclusive", and I don't want to do that to black people. I don't understand why that's racist.
They honestly think that black people and minorities have it on easy street.
thats because they are afraid of the power and riches they accumulated through subjugating minorities, will be used against them in retribution, so they go the extra mile , with the help aristocrats/oligarchs to keep the status quo. also white people are extra defensive when discussing racism as well. even if they arnt outwardly racist(closeted racist), i witness how they act around people that are not white , especially when they either look or approach near them.
during covid, like in the midst of it a older white lady dint like i was getting on the train the same time i was, she said it was not nice to go before "an older lady", i muttered bitch under my breath, you would do that to another white man or lady, but you would do that to a POC, because you will get immediate clapback from a white person over a POC. AS FAR as covid was concerned she wasnt masked, or properly masked. the entrance to train was large enough where 2 people can get on the same time.
Yep. It’s like a child fighting for the attention of an abusive parent.
on reddit, people said racist white people like that are afraid they do the same thing to them, of how they persecuted the blacks, so they act extra "im not racist, your being racist for calling out my race". they also try to deflect white privilege as a non-existential issue.
They should be made to understood what it means to be a minority if they want that status.
Moreover, throw them in jail legitimately, since they misused the justice system.
I honestly had trouble parsing that statement until I read this comment; it was nice being stupid and ignorant for a minute.
Its a tale as old as time that they'd strip protections against racism, implement racist laws, and then pretend as if slavery was so long ago that it didn't matter anymore. It was literally happening not a decade after the Civil War ended
Thank you. I've been looking for a single comment to explain the lunatic doublespeak she was using.
MAGA is literally a cult of fascism.
Cops are racists.
I mean what the actual fuck?!? If this is only half as egregious as this is being portrayed I wish I had been there. I would have told that old white Karen to shut the fuck up. And I don’t even know who this dude is. And I’m an old white dude.
Us old white dudes have a responsibility to get involved in these events.
Exactly…
The only thing better is some old white grandma getting involved. Pretty sure sweet old ladies outranks an old “Susan”.
I’m only 42 but I hope to be brave enough one day to be such a “sweet old lady” who kicks some ass.
Sounds like there's a market for "Comfy Steel-toed Boots For Ass Kicking Old Ladies". Let me find that 100k I put under my mattress...
I know cops are scary, but white people need to realise their power in a situation like this. Being white gives you like a +80% modifier in interactions with the police. Even just getting in the space and being a clueless white dude asking questions spreads that modifier to allies in proximity, including those being arrested.
By getting involved you raise the expectation of civility, because our fucking society is racist.
"I was there and heard that Karen screaming (fill in a bunch of racist shit). She said no one would take his word for it. You see that trash on the ground? She threw it at him and missed. He was minding his own business and tried to walk away, but she wouldn't let him be. Then she started going on about (aliens or jewish lasers or some real schizo shit). I think she's having a breakdown or fit."
Can confirm. I regularly cuss out and yell at cops that are harassing homeless people, not even violating their rights, other than their 14th amendment rights to freedom of movement.
There are clips online of crazy white people straight up attacking the cops, and the cops are just like "well shit, now what?"
It's so fucked up that this is true
Indeed and I do (60, 6'2" 100kg white guy) here in Australia, and it's most often some old white entitled woman. (My 82 yr oldmother is one of these, she doesnt think our First Nations people should be allowed on the same sidewalk as her)
Problem is I then get called out for being a pedo/rapist , this has happened a couple times for calling out some racist bitch.
He literally says he refused to sit right on the MTAs seats. They decided how he was sitting was not appropriate conduct and HE refused to adjust for the MTA.
You don't get to put your feet up on the seats just because you're a "celebrity writer", or black, or have a tiktok.
If you refuse their rules, they can refuse you service.
No he did not. This is what he said.
Yes, trains have rules... Like elections...
And if your sense of rules breaks down, your country might turn to shit.
I don't know how to tell you this buddy..
Hehe, yeah... When even the Holocaust museum is self censoring, there might be err.... Something wrong.
https://lemmy.world/post/36319688
Slippery slope. First people are putting their feet up and then we descend into chaos. That's pretty unhinged theory.
Yeah, we get that. The thing is, there’s no rule that says how you should sit on a train, that’d be ridiculous (ofc you shouldn’t invade other seats or put your feet on them).
The article explains that an entitled white woman told a black man that she didn’t like the way he was sitting, and because the white is always right in America, that poor man got pulled out from the train and arrested: no questions asked whatsoever.
Imagine that someone tells you “I don’t like the way you word your comments” and then you get reported and banned for that without way to defend yourself; it’s the same here except that this involves racism.
Yes there are:
https://www.mta.info/document/17001
How often is that rule applied equally across all riders and by all conductors?
Was the specific rider caught doing this singled out for a specific reason? Was it a random selection?
Should riders enforce rules, or should that be left up to the conductors?
A rule only exists if it is enforced.
It's probably applied whenever a conductor is told... And that is the conductor enforcing the rules.
How was he sitting that was so improper?
https://www.mta.info/document/17001
Conveniently left out that it's a $50 fine and not removal or arrest.
Yes, you'd have to escalate and be beligerent to have that happen. Happens everyday, with people who don't believe themselves celebrities.
Oh no! He's getting mad because he's getting removed for no reason! Very stupid.
You've been told the reason Sir, and given the option of moving your feet off the seats. If you continue to refuse I'll have to ask you to get off the train.
Since you're in here making claims, I'm positive you have a source that backs your started claim up? Something I'm sure you'd love to share with the rest of the class? Hmm? Got some proof...?
That the issue was how he was sitting, and that he refused to change that is not disputed by anyone in the story.
He states it himself:
The MTA isn't a country club, they deal with people of every race everyday. They also deal with people who refuse the rules everyday.
Show me where he violated your holy rules. I'll wait. "The old bag said so" doesn't count as a source, young man, so, it won't be accepted as one.
if the MTA worker also decides you're in the wrong, then you're in the wrong...
So this clearly isn't just the old lady. It's someone who works a low paid public facing job and doesn't need this shit.
If old people AND customer service people are against you, you might be the problem.
"Correct how I was sitting" could literally mean ANYTHING. Maybe she wanted him to sit up straight, maybe he was "manspreading", it's really impossible to know from the description here.
If camera footage shows him taking up two seats or putting his feet up or something, fine, but stopping a train because someone "refuses to sit 'properly'"? Seriously?
Yeah, we can conclude from the MTA workers actions that it probably wasn't a posture or slouching issue - and that it was probably something much more common... Like having your feet up on the seats.
The MTA isn't stopping a train because someone is slouching.
Which of those things was he doing?
Why choose, they're all against the rules. The MTA decided which one, and he says himself he refused to change his position.
His words, not mine.
So you're saying we don't know that he actually was doing any of them, then.
MTA workers deal with 1000s of people everyday. They're not singling people out on any grounds but whether you're following the rules or not.
Those two bitches had bags on the seats in front of him....fuck you!
He should have complained to the MTA officer then. But they can have bags on their seats when they're not sitting on them. You can put bags on the seat you're sitting on, just not on a separate seat.
It's one seat per passager.
Yeah! I mean sitting incorrectly in the train?? He's lucky they didn't shoot him on the spot!
Apparently having rules and accepting when the conductor asks you to follow them is just a thing in public transport etiquette:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-bear-writer-handcuffed-train-after-allegedcomplaint-white/story?id=125829965
What you're missing is that the response was out of proportion. If I park my car in a street sweeping zone, they don't cart me off to jail, they write a ticket.
No one was carted off to jail. He was removed from the train, released and told to get the next one.
Where do you people get this misinformation?
Reading comprehension: 0%
A ticket isn't a free pass to keep breaking a rule.
Well there's your problem, the conductor should have told this woman to do one. Let's say that he had his feet up on a seat, or whatever, in what world do you stop the train service entirely for that.
Imagine grounding a plane for this.
Interrupting everyone else's life because yours is inconvenienced, not even impacted, should not be allowed.
Entitled mess of a human
I am thinking she didn't go to the conductor with the actual complaint. Instead, like the Central Park Karen, she probably came up with some horror story of the man assaulting her or some such. He noted, after all, that they didn't even take her statement when arresting him (for no reason).
There's an "aggressive" man on the train... each time we say something racist we feel in even greater danger. Halp.
Yeah, you'd just ask him to not do that, explain that it's a rule ...and that'd be that!
And if it's bothering her so much, change train cars! Sit a few seats down. Get on another train.
Admittedly, this is harder when you don't have robust public transit.
The way you get more robust public transit is people using it though (and voting for it). Enforcing rules in this works against that imo
Why should some old lady move because some young guy is breaking the rules. Why can't she try to tell him then go tell the conductor when he refuses to obey the basic rules of public transport.
That sounds like a good way to approach the situation.
Ask the other rider to fix their behavior. If they don't, ask the conductor to ask the other rider to fix their behavior. If they don't, I don't think you need to call the cops.
The conductor could just as much charge the rider some fee that can be posted in the rider policy of the train, in the train, in the ticketing app for the train, at the station, etc. This way the train owner/operator can collect some remedy for the rider's violation of the rules to help fund remediating the rider's impact to the train environment (like cleaning their specific seat when that's usually outside the conductor's responsibilities), including a markup if they want to add that.
Now, I don't think charging fees will work for every violation. But I still think it's a valid lever the train owner/operator could make use of instead of bringing the entire train to a halt.
If the rider refuses to pay up, then call the cops. Or, the conductor could also ask the rider in violation to exit the train at the next stop. That's another option. If that fails, call the cops.
Additionally, if cops are needed, the conductor could call them and ask them to meet the train at one of the stops coming up. This way the arrival of the cops could be timed with the arrival of the train to the station. Minimizes impact to everyone else's schedule, and ensures cops have access to the train since most of the time spent on a train is in between stations which often isn't accessible by road.
I think there are ways to better manage this than to stop a train as soon as a conductor witnesses a violation and start a train only after cops arrive to that specific location and escort the rider violator off the train.
A reasonable take. Others in the thread have cited the rules call for a fine for infractions like this anyway.
It's a code for "you're in Trump America, now."
It also makes 0 sense while still sounding racist, so definitely trumpian
💯
its also a codework, its okay for us to say the N-word with the hard R.
That'd require them to be educated about the law but it seems awfully convenient to keep them ignorant of it.
But then how could they arrest you for resisting arrest?
The police are now trained to say “stop resisting” for their body cameras, which provides the pretext for additional charges. They throw as many charges as they possibly can hoping one or two stick if it gets plead down.
I haven’t watched the video but I totally agree that it’s inappropriate to order him off the train in this instance. They can conduct their criminal investigation right there. The fact that these incidents are allowed to get to the police is the frightening part; that people who reported him need to go to jail, and the conductor should be at a minimum investigated.
they frame evidence all the time, either by making it up, or trying to use it as an excuse to escalate. i suspect the latter.
Sounds like they created the violation in this case. They threatened arrest for disturbing the peace if he didn't comply and remove himself from the train. They are always able to manufacturer reason for detainment and threatening arrest.
So cops shouldnt be called when drunks and racists on planes get start yelling and delaying flights?
Like that Burger King guy? Cops just shouldn't have been called? Do Americans just not understand egalitarianism any more? You're all deranged.
Everyone gets the same rules, transport companies can kick you off, or get the police to detain-you-off the plane/train.
There's literally thousands of videos of people being thrown of public transport, it happens EVERYDAY whenever anyone refuses to obey the rules.
Fucken, Americans are mentally ill, I swear. This shit is obvious in the rest of the world.
Not what happened here though. He was taken off the train, released and told to get the next train.
He was refusing to obey the MTA rule of no feet on the seats:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-bear-writer-handcuffed-train-after-allegedcomplaint-white/story?id=125829965
Everyone's defending this asshole like crazy. Y'all are mental. Broke ass nation.
Black MTA workers kick white passangers off trains and call the cops if they're refusing to obey the rules - literally every day.
If a white guy has his feet on the seats, and an old black man or woman comes and gets the black MTA worker to step in - and the white guy STILL refuses to sit up properly - the MTA worker is put in the position of saying *"okay the rules don't apply to this one guy, you can refuse the rules, they're meaningless" * or getting physically involved (which they're not supposed to do), so the only resort if the passanger is still REFUSING the rules to the MTA worker's face is to call the cops.
They're low paid MTA workers, not bouncers at a KKK meeting. This shit goes down regularly this way, it's just most of the time a "celebrity" isn't involved. Some drunk asshole is.
Edit: Here's a white MTA worker dragging a white guy off a train. Beligerent customers are an everyday thing. That's how the public are. MTA worker punched in the face, after asking someone to get off the train.... MTA worker sucker-punched at random.
Maybe because it should've been a matter for whatever passes for transport authority or the conductor/inspector and not the police.
Being an asshole isn't a crime ya know...
The conductor was looking the other way, the old lady made the conductor intervene, Okeefe CONTINUED to refuse.
So it was the MTA dealing with it, and Okeefe CONTINUED to refuse. Continued his personal stouch with the lady.
Well, the rules apply to all MTA passangers. MTA trains serve thousands of people each day, the MTA worker wasn't picking him out. The conductor was leaving him alone until the old lady brought the conductor in, AND OKEEFE CONTINUED TO REFUSE.
So "Racist MTA" doesn't work as a theory. It doesn't fit the facts of what happened.
That’s what they’re saying. They’re saying that the police should need more than just the bare minimum investigation of a potential crime to remove you from transit. You’re saying that he was released as if the only two options were not taking him off the train and jailing him indefinitely.
You resorting to ad hominem insteading of sticking to the facts and the arguments paints you in bad faith.
If you want upvotes next time, maybe don't do that.
I don't care about imaginary Internet points... And I've linked and quoted multiple articles. People don't care for the facts, they're stuck in political perspectives
People don't read on Lemmy, yes.
You should know this if you post evidence.
If you EXPLAIN your evidence, and point out specific inconsistentencies with the majority's beliefs, then that'll fly further than shutting shit down because you're pissed.
You want to do this fine, but I'm not here to argue about arguing. You can argue with people your way if you want.
I don't like the headline. He has a name, you know, and it's Alex O'keefe.
The headline makes it sound like he did something wrong too. Instead he was harassed because of a Karen
Idk to me it was clear he did nothing wrong. In that case it would have said "because he did X ans Y" instead of basically "because of a Karen"
Yeah, total bullshit.
the final form of a karen, an old/ elderly white lady.
Conveniently, the officer body cam footage is “not available”. Absolutely insane they are making it sound like it’s his fault the train is delayed.
Sitting? While black? That's a paddlin'.
sitting menacingly, -COPs
He's sitting right towards us!
Luckily he is American. If he was a legal migrant having been booked would be considered a visa offense and he could be sent to a concentration camp.
The usual story here for Americans is that they get arrested for resisting arrest and assulting a police officer and then get sentences to 10+ years in the local gulag.
Immigrants instead get sent to the camps for deportation.
He's well enough known, there were enough cameras and he's media/white american savvy enough to avoid the worst outcomes.
He will just be labeled "antifa" now, without proof. This is how fascism usually works.
wouldnt he still be "deported" to africa, because of his skin color, potentially.
Nah, we don't deport people anywhere they might have tires to.
Based on his skin color this man is clearly Laotian, send him straight to Vientiane! He can go peddle his scripts by the Mekong! (I'm joking)
Jesus Christ. Probably gave the bitch a bit of nostalgia for the "good ol days". Also, what seating position was he doing that she took offense to? Because I don't think there's any seating position that could be considered offensive.
Sitting while black probably.
For WASPs any position that isn’t upright, knees together, feet on the floor is disrespectful. Whether he was just slouching or maybe leaning over in the seat, who knows other than him.
And even if he was, who fucking cares? The entitlement to think you get control over how random strangers sit in public is crazy. The only official rule I could even think of to begin justifying this is to not lay down completely when there are no seats available, but nothing in the article indicates anything like that. And attempted arrest is an insane overreaction.
What is a WASP?
White Anglo Saxon Protestant
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant. It's a term that's typically used to refer to blue-blood old money New England types.
Maybe this is why we need humanoid robots. So bigots have a decoy to be shitty to.
Fuck man.
This just after a lynching happened in Jacksonville, Mississippi.
Does the idea of a lynching happening in the US seem particularly far-fetched to you? If so I'd say that you're extremely uninformed. Also that's a weirdly specific alternative you're presenting lol
I totally believe he was probably It should be investigated and I support which ever actor or whatever is paying for the second autopsy however it is hard to know if that is even what you are referring to.
https://abc11.com/post/javion-magee-21-year-old-truck-driver-found-dead-henderson-north-carolina-death-ruled-suicide-nc-medical-examiners-say/16351111/ Again all you really know at this point is he died and had a rope around his neck, correct? Well at one point that's all they knew, but then they investigated.
i don’t know about you but if i was a black guy hanging myself in a tree is not how i commit suicide
lmao that this is even being considered
They're financing an independent autopsy. Assuming we're talking about the same case.
I believe there is a different case they’re referring to. I don’t know the details.
Don't get the downvotes. Are we at the stage where asking for a source is bad now?
Oh fuck off. Read the comment again and tell me he's "just asking for a source".
I approve of asking for a source. I downvoted because they were a dick about it.
Fair.
If the claim were contentious, ask for a source. If you can find it with a web search in ten seconds, that's your own laziness (or malice) talking.
i suspect malice, its the same reddit comments of trolls that do this "im looking for a source thats no biased", when show they keep asking for a source thier bias side with.
no, but when you ask it in such a disingenuous tone, like when someone gives you examples and source, and you keep saying what source? and ignoring the evidence, you're trolling. this is the same thing on reddit, dont act like that. you are obviously fishing for a reaction.
Maybe add a notification for mod deletion?
Most Americans don't realize just how deeply racist some people are in this country, I've seen similar behavior before from white women, towards a black kid who was just hanging around in a library, and now these shitty people feel even more emboldened.
The "You're not the minority anymore" part was what made me do a double take. The level of delusion these people engage in is absolutely insane.
There's a lot in this story that could use clarification, but that quote takes the cake. And I would love to know, were that even true, how in the world it justifies what was to follow. I'm not deranged enough to just get this.
Yeah I can't make sense of it... Does she mean like, great replacement theory happened, and that white people were the minority now?
So he was sitting improperly? They didn't say exactly why it was 'improper' to begin with?
He did it while black. That's clearly an arrestable offense.
The dropdown menu just doesn't offer them the option for 'was on a whites only train', prob an admin error that will be soon corrected.
/s
But dickishness does/should have some consequences. Obviously not handcuffs consequences tho.
Someone not occupying more than one sit on a public transport isn't the worst thing to gatekeep.
How it can escalate to calling the police idk.
The story never specified what the guy did though.
It's important to know enough facts, yeah.
The article is purposely misleading.
From another article: The Bear’ writer booted from MTA train for refusing to take feet off seats — he blames ‘old white lady’
Maybe he had his shoes on the seats and is now crying racism.
If he had his feet up on another seat, and said "go fuck yourself" instead of "no" (which is a scenario compatible with the description). He still shouldn't have been arrested.
I disagree. If the conductor tells someone to stop being an asshole and they curse back, they’re belligerent and noncompliant, and it’s reasonable to have the police remove them from the train.
Remove from the train ≠ arrested
Cool, but that's not disagreeing with what I said.
Shit like this happens every fucking day. This is news because the victim is famous.
I feel for the MTA worker most of all, they probably see this shit all the time.
Look at their other responses. KKK lost a klown.
MTA rules apply to all passengers.
https://www.mta.info/document/17001
It's highly unlikely you can get kicked off without violating the rules, and it's not disputed that how he was sitting was the issue (not who he was).
Oh yeah, if someone brings attention to you doing it - it gets way more attention.
Same as breaking the rules anywhere. Schoolyard rules.
Do you really believe that? Do you believe that the conductor and the cops would've acted in the same way if he, a 30 year old black man, was complaining about how an old white woman is sitting? Would they have stopped the train and detained the old woman in your opinion?
You can literally watch videos and videos and videos of problem passangers being removed from planes, trains, and buses... Is it your first day online or something?
https://sopuli.xyz/comment/19242346
Calm down.
*CTA
This is just stupid. And I mean, the arrest. You Americans seem to be subject to arrest for the stupidest things.
Putting your feet on a seat is gross. The guy should have complied with the indication to put them down. Non compliance should have resulted in -at most- a fine. This is what would had happened in my country, and my guess, in the majority of places in the world.
Laws are written in ways they can be used at the discretion of the power. Their discretion, their prerogative, their biase, their bigotry. All laws written to apply only when the power chooses are not law, but privilege.
That must be the "freedom" everyone is talking about...
Still trying to figure out which felonies get you deported and which ones get you a seat at the table. Starting to think its not about laws at all here.
It'$ not ju$t about badly-written law$, and it help$ if you do it the white way.
A "seat at the table" these days requires a heady mix of culpability, and wealthy/connected enough to be useful to someone more powerful. Just monied or just a phone-call away from prison ain't gonna cut it. That said, the clowns we see doing this are at the kid's table.
They hate us for it.
non-compliance should result in getting booted from the train, not just a fine
And if they won’t, especially if they’re belligerent (we don’t know), it’s fair for the operator to have the police remove them.
There’s a lot missing from the story and it is written for racist outrage, but it’s also plausible it was some self-centered asshole getting what he deserved
Sigh. Where's the video?
There isn't much to it. Its up here:
https://files.catbox.moe/k8gx1m.mp4
The video does clear one thing up, which is that he was sitting in a single row, which means he wasn't putting his feet on the seats in front of him like you'd do in a double row with seats in front of you (like some dude in another thread jumped to the conclusion to).
But that would mean less people viewing ads on the website!
Searched the article and not one video link. Fantastic.
“over 160,000 times as of reporting”?
What, do they think the number is gonna go back down somehow and make their reporting inaccurate?
No, but if they only said "has over 160,000 views" you know there's going to be some pedant waiting to say "well ACKSHUALLY it has 300,000 views, why are they under-reporting it?"
Damn if we see segregation you owe me a trillion
Welcome to the new witch hunts. This time all over the US, not just Salem... the new improved forth Reich.
This isn't a "witch hunt". It's racism. And it's been happening for quite a long time.
The irony being the Atlantic slave trade had being going on around 150 years before the Salem Witch Trials
Idk if thats irony considering the majority of the "witches" tried were black, including in Salem. Witch trials might be older than slavery, extrajudicial persecution is old.
and the witch trials was caused by ERGOTAMINE poisoning causing delusional paranoia.
This is just a theory some people have come up with, I'm not sure there's any hard evidence for it.
If it is safe for you to do so.
Some of us can't. We know who we are.
with each other
It helps with organization, which is what actually wins both movements and wars
It’s expensive but worth it.
While I agree in general, that wouldn't have helped in this case, and likely would have just made things worse. He couldn't draw on the Karen for being a racist piece of trash, and his next interaction was with the police, whom he certainly couldn't have drawn on. Then the cops would have trumped up the charges because he was armed, and he never would have seen the gun again after it disappeared into the evidence locker.
That should have been real easy:
“Ma’am, fuck off to another train car if you have a problem with the way someone is sitting and don’t ever waste our time again. Sir, have a nice day.”
Yeah, why didn't the MTA worker just do that!
They would have if it hadn't been a white passenger complaining.
Apparently he had his feet on the seat and was refusing to move them. Anyone doing that to a conductor is getting kicked off. That's just the facts:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-bear-writer-handcuffed-train-after-allegedcomplaint-white/story?id=125829965
Hope he finds that woman, conductor and police chief and sues their ass (like any good it will do, but at least the internet can make a public example of her).
The article is purposely misleading.
From another article: The Bear’ writer booted from MTA train for refusing to take feet off seats — he blames ‘old white lady’
lmfao jesus the misleadingness of it
get your fucking feet off the seat or get off the train
if they leave that out, I trust nothing they said about how the rest of it went
Sure it sucks, but involving the police in someone having their feet on the seat? Way to overreact.
Pretty standard for disorderly passengers in the subway. Nothing really novel about this.
I've rode the subway for over 20 years and have not once ever seen the cops called for anything less than a fist fight.
I've ridden the subway in sf probably about 10 times, or so, total in my life and I've seen the cops called twice. I know on at least one occassion it was because a homeless person was basically just agitated and making people uncomfortable.
There was a video about attempting to arrest someone eating a sandwich when it wasn't allowed. You have to enforce the rules for people who refuse to stop after a warning otherwise there's no point in having any rules at all.
It seems petty but it's only petty by the person refusing to follow them
The conductor was being ignored, he controls what happens on his train.
Her comment of "you aren't the minority anymore" starts to make some sense maybe.
Like I infer his refusal to take feet off seat and then claim persecution when consequences happen, are nothing to do with him being black minority being picked on. So she is inferring he is being treated just like anyone else.
But I have no way to verify that assumption
I feel like a crazy person reading all of your comments saying it's justified to call the cops and arrest someone for having their feet on the seats.
Anti-social behaviour on this level should not have people reaching for the state violence button.
I'm not saying cops need to come, but a conductor or ship captain gets to make the rules and people have to follow them or get asked to leave, like he was. If nobody has to listen to travel provider authority then there is zero order. Imagine being on a plane and refusingbto buckle up...you get removed, because ifbyou can't follow an easy rule you are going to be a bigger problem in flight
Why do you trust that article more than this one? Did you see his feet on the seat?
Real question, is feet-on-the-seat something people are typically arrested for there?
Commentators here acting like this is new racism under Trump. Racist police have been around since the 1992 song "Killing in the name" by Rage Against the Machine came out.
The lyrics clearly state that some of those who work in said forces, are actually the very same who burn crosses. AND now you do what they tell you.
Pretty sure racist police have been around as long as police, which predates 1992 by a few centuries.
https://ibw21.org/editors-choice/slavery-and-the-origins-of-the-american-police-state/
I don't know. Did they have songs back then?
Yes, this one is from 1851 and was later used in 12 Years a Slave. You may be unaware, but American policing was born from the roots of slave catching.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Run,_*removed*,_Run
Edit: adding Google share link since word filters censor this
Run, removed, Run - Wikipedia https://share.google/160z56VcnYtEeyBoW
And they still serve to keep the masters' slaves in line.
Nothing has changed.
Everything I've said was in jest
I LOVE BEING CENSORED I LOVE BEING CENSORED
Fuck them, I won't do what they tell me! (repeated 14 times in a row)
How does one sit "offensively" on a train? All the coverage of this seems to just skip over that. Was he sitting with no pants? Laying across 3 seats? This is a novel one for me.
The article is purposely misleading.
From another article: The Bear’ writer booted from MTA train for refusing to take feet off seats — he blames ‘old white lady’
Aha, there you go. I don't think anyone should put their feet on the seat, but I also wouldn't alert the police about this.
I can tell why he seemed to leave that bit out of the story. His story is a lot less sympathetic if you frame it as:
"I was sitting on the train and had my feet up on a seat. I refused to take my feet off the seat, so she complained to the conductor. Then ??? and I was getting arrested."
People with their feet on the seats really bothers me. It's extra crass if the train was full and he wouldn't move his feet, but I am not sure if this was a packed car or not. Either way, it's disrespectful to have your feet on the seat in public transit, and I'd be curious what his exact language was when refusing. Definitely not an arrest-able offense, but this guy sounds like a jerk. I hope we get to see bodycams at one point.
They didn't call the police, they went to the conductor, who in turn called the police.
Where I live, and you don't listen to the conductor, they will call the police that specifically handles train security. Not to arrest you but to get you off the train. In most cases it's to fine the people that get caught without a ticket. If you really misbehave they can legally hold you until the real police arrives.
Yeah, its a different story where we need more context. Racist old lady has blackman arrested, vs entitled idiot was too arrogant to allow others to sit down by placing his feet on open seats. Somewhere in both of those lies the truth.
she meant he should sit at the back
What is your source for this? Even the quote from above says "how" he was sitting, not "where". Did someone else have better coverage?
It's just a reference to racism and Rosa Parks
Err, what?
Sorry I thought you were answering another comment!
It's a stupid question, I gave it a stupid/nonserious answer. It's like someone else mentioned a reference.
Yeah, except it fundamentally changes the situation under discussion. Turns out he had his feet on the seat NOT that the woman wanted him to move to the back. Totally different.
ok, my bad
whoever wrote the article sucks
This is what happens when a malignant narcissist emboldens abd enables the racist sociopaths.
At least they didn't shoot him. (laugh/cry transition)
OK, so, I literally just finished watching Lovecraft Country and I was thinking "this was so tragic, it's good to know history made things right and this kind of institutionalized racism doesn't exist anymore, now lets check Lemmy", oh shit...
If you really think institutionalized racism doesn’t exist anymore, I have some bad news for you…
thats why CRT was so heavily criticized by the right, eventhough its a concept mostly taught in law school, and the right cant really DEFINe what it was, because its such a complex legal term, they dont have a basis to argue on it. CRT trolling lasted like what 6 months, before it was dropped from the media. because CRT exposes the "racism' by the government/right wingers as an actual definable term, unlike WOKE.
After reading that headline, for a second I was wondering how Anton Checkov had come alive again and was on a train.
So who is the minority now? And what flex does she think that means?
This thread is strange- is this some kind of palintir/fsb operation to spread rage and despair? I'm so sick of having my emotions manipulated. Also some people should reflect on their misogyny maybe. And ageism, Americans have been trying to sell me their toxic ageism my whole life. And their racism, obviously, but also race shit stirring. Anyway fuck the internet, I left reddit because my brain was being messed with.. Back to books, Tony Morrison today.
Stay on the train and punch the Karen in the face before getting off at the next stop.
Don't let me catch you slipping now
What is this world coming to?
Fascism.
But the US is way ahead on that.
Racist old gal? not in this times where holy persons like Kirk exist. /s
He was sitting with his feet on the seats and refused to take them off, so the conductor did have cause, since it takes a space from somebody else
Plus who wants to sit in whatever mess you may have stepped in
This guy would have definitely thrown a fit if somebody else had their feet up on his seat.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-bear-writer-handcuffed-train-after-allegedcomplaint-white/story?id=125829965
I think part of the problem is black people being forced into situations where they can't be sure whether it's racism or not... And even then, to what degree.
According to the abc he was refusing to take his feet off the seat, even when it was the conductor asking him to. So I suspect he got racist vibes from the first lady (being old, and a woman) and then dug in, and got trapped (by the woman, then the conductor, and the cops aka triangulation. The pile on leading to entrenchment).
He may have only had his legs on the seat, but not his feet ....but taking up two seats is still against the rules (so again it would feel like persecution).
So the feelings of persecution and injustice (which will have other experiential memories attached) conspire to make one feel crazy, penned in, and act out.
It's childish (as systemic racism is a form of paternalistic infantilisation) but a type of childishness that may be somewhat justified, or at least understandable. He wouldn't be the first person to dig in when feeling persecuted. It's very normal and natural, and hopefully these puzzles of behavioural entrapment are better understood and discussed in the future.
Solid and fair analysis IMO. His feelings were valid. He had a moral right to nonviolently push back against what he perceived as injustice, and presumably knew he might face consequences. Presumably felt it was worth it.
Wonder if the train was full. And if his feet were on a jacket/other barrier (allowed on some systems whereas direct contact is not). Also wish I knew whether the older woman has ever asked white women to comply with little rules.
WTF. She probably wears that face mask all the time, you know those weirdos that wears them even if they're not sick.
You mean that white pointy one with the eye holes?
Seemed odd about his own testimony, as quoted in this article, that he keeps avoiding to mention HOW he was sitting and whether he complied when told to stop it. Makes me picture one of these assholes who put their dirty shoes on a second seat in a full train.
His odd avoidance of the core of the issue made me search for other sources. Not surprising that a quick search supports most of this. Also, he refused to stop doing that, which he also does not deny as far as the quotes from this article go.
Then, he tries to use his celebrity status to order cops to harass an elderly woman, whose statement is irrelevant because apparently there are plenty of witnesses, including the train personnel and his own confession.
Then, he seriously tries to pull the race card.
And this is the hero of Lemmy?
Hat off the elderly woman and the police, though! Wish this kind of justice would happen when I'm on the train.
This has become a cesspool of disinformation. All the out of context Kirk quotes from the past few days (was still somewhere between nonsense and disgusting in context, but an entirely different statement), and another post claims that every day 0.25 % of the US population gets shot, and this lie somehow supports the trans agenda.
Disclaimer: Judging the situation as presented in available articles, as I don't know what really happened.
You think a person should be harassed and arrested if they sit in public transit in a way someone doesn't approve of?
If someone takes off their shoes, I should feel justified in calling the cops and subjecting them to police custody?
Doing what? You made an assumption about how he was sitting and decided it has heinous enough to havw police sicc'ed on him.
This better be some well-crafted bait because I bit.
Thanks for bringing Kirk into this. Was most def needed.
🤡🤡
He clearly says he did not comply.
OTOH, I'm glad to see some magas showing up at Lemmy actually, maybe we can curb the infighting a bit.
How he was sitting? Really? Fuck right off with your ridiculous ass.
Who writes such a scathing comment, and then admits that they have no idea what actually happened. For fuck sake
I was about to agree with you, in that its kind of hard to really judge whats going on in this video without seeing exactly what happened prior to the recording -- but then you just jumped completely off the deep end into crazy.
You're making a lot of assumptions. All we know is that in the end he was released, so they didn't actually have any reason to arrest him. Whatever the issue was with how he sat, there was no basis for arrest, and probably no basis to call the police at all.
Maybe he did put his dirty shoes on the seat, but the article doesn't tell us. Nobody does. All we know is that they wanted to arrest him, but couldn't. Whatever he did wasn't serious enough for it and yet they tried and held up a train for it.
It is of course only his side of the story. More info would help. But without more info, there's no reason not to believe that he was harassed mostly just for being black. It's not like this is the first time that happened.
Maybe he was harassed for his skin color, but this article did leave out the core of what happened. It’s just as likely the treatment was deserved: we have no information either way. The article jumps right to we should be outraged, without actually saying enough of what happened. And yes, I’ve seen assholes on the train where I really wished the conductor would intervene
I’m trying to envision a scenario that would warrant the arrest and I just can’t. Maybe you can contrive one for us. Loud music or bare feet, and I’m all for it; to the gallows. But sitting wrong? What?
all I've found so far:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/former-bear-writer-handcuffed-train-after-allegedcomplaint-white/story?id=125829965
It sounds like he was being an asshole TBH. I can sorta understand why the police wanted him off the train. Not completely sure why they had to handcuff him. But I mean, we've seen footage of plenty of disorderly passengers being escorted off planes for being jerks. This doesn't sound too dissimilar. That said, without seeing any actual evidence, who the hell knows.
Presumably for not listening. We’ve all seen assholes on the train where we wish the conductor would intervene. Whether deserved or not, this time they did and if you get belligerent whebpn the conductor tells you to do something, they may call the police, who will escort you off the train. I’m not saying that’s what happened, since we don’t know. Maybe this was a clear case of sitting while black, but I’m not ready to follow the herd of lemmings off the cliff when the story has such an obvious gap
How are theseKirk comments out of context? I'd like to see the context where these are not what they sound like?
So you're just a piece of shit racist, got it
Hol up, you can't just refuse to follow MTA rules on an MTA train and expect the service to go along with you.
Arresting someone for having their feet on the seats is truly excessive. Racism almost certainly was a factor in every step of this process. The woman noticing the man, deciding to police his behavior in public, the MTA and police not just letting it go with a warning. All of it.
If feet were on a seat in violation of MTA rules they can ask you to leave. You don't get to refuse or argue your case. If that is the case here, a white person could ostensibly go through the same process. There's plenty of videos of white people doing just that and not acknowledging their own attitude and behavior and getting arrested.
That's not to say racism didn't play a role. Just that there could be a plausible explanation given the facts seemingly available for the outcome.
Edit: How many of you downvoters immediately jumped to Jussie Smollet's defense? I understand racism is a thing.
Part of racism's power is the unequal application of rules. Plausibility is often on the side of racism. While the rules may prohibit feet on the seat (were his feet on the seat here?), it is unlikely this rule is enforced against white people as often as it is for minorities. I'm sure it happens, but the point isn't "sometimes the rules are applied to white people too". The point is "the rules are more often and more extremely applied to black people".
Tangentially related, "the new jim crow" is worth reading.
I also haven't seen anything about how he was sitting "improperly", only the accusation that he was, somehow.
Which leads me to believe he wasn't, really. But even if he was, that doesn't mean race wasn't a factor. He could be sitting sprawled out, but if the conductor says "yeah I'm not dealing with this I'm calling the police" I'm very much inclined to believe the officer was likely racist, just by sheer historical precedent.
This
There's a lot of "if"s in there.
Someone posted the video above and they're sitting in a single row, typically putting your feet on the seats it's something you do in a double row with seats facing each other.
Just take your feet off the seats when the MTA worker tells you to.
If you look at the video, he was sitting in a single row, I don't see how he could've had his feet on a seat, that's something you do in a double row with seats facing you in front of you.
And a seat next to him.
People like you need to heave some sense slapped into them.
Yes, everyone should follow the rules. This is about how we as a society handle situations where people break the rules. I'm sure you've been pulled over for a traffic violation before. Imagine the best case interaction and the worst case interaction that's still within the bounds of enforcement regulations, and there's a spectrum of everything in-between. The problem people are pointing out is that one privileged group of people statistically get better interactions and another group statistically gets worse interactions.
This ends with a police interaction sure, but I just don't believe a run of the mill MTA worker who was ignoring how he was sitting prior to the complaint is forcing the interaction.
The old lady sure, ignore her. But when the train conductor tells you to sit right, just do it. Don't make it some low paid service workers problem, and force a whole train full of people to stop over it.
That's just a dick move, and I'll die on this hill pointing that out.
P.S No wonder you guys ended up with Trump in power. All sorts of exceptions to egalitarianism over there. No suffering normalcy for you lot. Stupid Americans.
There it is.
Have fun with Trump, and not following the rules because freedom, corruption and mass poverty are the same thing to you guys.
Go wave a flag (star spangled, rainbow, or both) and be for or against woke politics or Trump, anything but follow the fucking rules ... Even the basic ones like not putting your feet on the seats on public transport.
Little wonder your society is collapsing when the basics don't apply because of politics.
You sure do live in a rich imagination. What color is the sky?
What a deranged dipshit
Sure, it's a dick move. People should follow the rules and not be stubborn dicks. The point of the comparison is how we can expect the whole interaction, from the woman being upset to the arrest, to play out more likely one way than the other depending on whether the person being a stubborn dick is black or white.
Holy fuck, your privilege is showing, sweety.
MTA rules apply to all passengers.
https://www.mta.info/document/17001
Your copy pasta skills are impressive. Comprehension, not so much.
Praise challah we has you here!