Its crazy that we have literal proof that these countries have tens of thousands 9-5 employees who's entire job is to fuck the internet with lies and its just so normalized an accepted.
It's an irrelevant question. Two wrongs don't make a right. It just makes things more toxic. It's wrong when the US does it, like anyone else. None of these governments with corrupt centralized power should exist. And this sort of propaganda doesn't help people.
Leading governments launching campaigns to destabilize countries of millions of people while promoting their preferred fascist takeover has ultimately the same effect.
The working class suffers and loses while the elite endlessly benefit.
They're indisputably doing the same, except that the flow of instructions and money follows the US model instead.
You won't find a government-signed paycheck anywhere (well... maybe), but the people who Congressman and Senators and their PACs have to beg for money, are the same people funding dark astroturfing movements.
People still get mad at me when I point this out to them, like I've just told them the Earth is flat.
No, Biden didn't lose just cause he was old. No, Labour UK isn't tanking in the polls just cause they're disappointing (the Conservatives were awful for 13 years and still won plenty elections). There's more. There's foreign meddling. And these people just refuse to believe it, as if their countries are impenetrable bubbles.
I used to work in organic growth and it's crazy what you could do in astroturf or brand growth as just a normal person. To think that governments that cannot be challenged would restrain themselves from using this weapon is sadly too optimistic.
The reason why EU and US arent so blatant because they can't just start a troll farm with publics approval.
Why would the U.S. need public approval for a troll farm? That shit is highly classified. If you think the U.S. doesn't do the same thing we accuse Russia and China of doing, I gotta bridge to sell you.
Cus with the military you already have a readymade pool of labor to work from, with basicaly zero democratic civilian oversight. Plus, a lot of them live on base.
It's literally the American "Pledge of Allegience" on steroids. In fact, when I first immigrated to the US, I just thought the pledge was a "normal" thing, like a ritual, that every country does (I was a non-citizen at the time so I remained silent of course). But then Europeans told me it wasn't normal.
I agree. Who IS Job? Entirely. Just a fictional man or the basis of a remade Sumerian fable repackaged by the Greeks for the Essenes and their conquest?
I find it hard to believe they really want it that much. Keeping Trump where he is will slowly do all the damage they need. On a global scale support for the U.S. is degrading, and things like Chinas currency being used for global trade is accelerating. At the rate things are going it is likely best for China to just let things take their current course. The wealth divide growing in the U.S. is going to do a lot of damage in the next 15 years. The conservative choices are just accelerating our downfall or complete need to move to a Universal base income and spread of wealth, if not a complete flop to a socialistic society. (Which will have a lot of backlash and possibly the civil war).
If another country really thought just one leftist would start a civil war and destroy the U.S., they would just blackmail or pay someone off to do it.
Oh yea that shit is absolutely insane. They are literally sending propaganda to the overseas Chinese Diaspora that promotes trump and demonizes Democrats on Wechat. My parents keep parrotting right-wing talking points. So uncanny.
I mean criminals use psychology and business now too... You can make your enemy kill themselves without touching a weapon. You can make a kid kill an influencer too... But that's probably criminal feds...
I'm not Russian. I'm not Chinese. And I don't think I'm a bot. All I want is for that orange kiddie fucker to be imprisoned.
If the lazy fucking americans do that then all is forgiven on my part. Until they come out and officially acknowledge that he's a disgusting blob of human scum then I'll never forgive or forget.
In general, I'd advise you to now get everything you need, whether a civil war is coming or just tyranny.
You will need:
a passport or actual ID, your driver's license is basically useless here
a list of all prescribed medication
You might find useful:
all your certificates of education, be it from school, college, university or vocational training, Germany in particular is a stickler for formal education in every sector of work
a bank account with a european bank which you have already set up and can wire money to before that is blocked for some reason
start learning any European language, French and German are particularly useful
some geographical knowledge of Europe might prove useful
find out where the next EU-member state's consulate is. Do note however that the country you first apply for asylum in, is the one that has to take you - technically that is.
Trust me on this one. These have been the most frequent problems that refugees in europe had since 2015. But they also had the language barrier where there documents weren't even understandable to European administration.
Now in your case that is much easier. Just make a folder with your essential documents, either the originals or proven copys. You will need them whether you flee the ship or go down with her. Having those records is essential in the aftermath of any catastrophic situation
I'm Canadian and don't really wish it because it would be a very messy thing, but in a way, I'm thinking, if the US is stuck in a civil war, at least the chances of it invading my country should be much lower.
Like, it would be shitty, but at least countries that are now threatened to be annexed or invaded by the US could maybe breathe a little easier, and see Americans killing Americans for once, instead of people in other countries.
Typically when a country undergoes a violent internal conflict that depletes the coffers, the neighboring country's resources start looking really nice.
I would very much like for USA to be much more stable than it's currently so that it could help us with Russia. And this is of course why Russia is trying (and looks like succeeding) to make USA into a internally bickering cesspool.
I have been thinking US probably requires a hard reset. But then I realised, this will only benefit Russia and China. Well, more for China. Russia's expensive war in Ukraine won't make the country last long in the future. No one worth their salt could replace Putin. If US breaks up or goes on civil war, China will be the ultimate winner.
It would (probably? I wanna say certainly) benefit the rest of the world too, Western Europe included (to the dissatisfaction of our current American bought, obscenely corrupt and greedy leaders, ofc).
It wouldn't benefit the rest of the world. If your country has a business that makes anything, the US buys it. Europe and the US did half a trillion in business in 2024. A destabilized US hurts just about everyone. Makes you think it's worth a hard look at who it doesn't hurt, and I don't just mean nations, but I diciduals and corporations.
Europe is still too dependent on the US military to decouple and be more independent own, unfortunately. The EU agreed to a trade deal/not-trade deal (according Von der Leyen) with Trump in European investment in the US military. I know Europeans were angry at that, but in the near term the EU doesn't have the capability to arm itself sufficiently, while simultaneously arming Ukraine. IMO that deal was buying time for the EU to remilitarise independently (I'm not a fan of remilitarisation as a Euro but what can we do).
Europe doesn't have the same size of military industrial complex that US has at the moment.
I think it's for the best. The US military industrial complex is not something that I would like to see replicated in Europe. Of course if the American standard is "police departments should have armored vehicles" then we are not on the same "level", but do we really need that in order to have an effective military?
Your choices are to not decouple from the US or have a comparable MIC as a collective. You don't have a comparable MIC because the US does it for you. But if you're against the Trump administration, you have to support getting one.
I won't go as far to say Europe "can't survive" without the US, but Europeans seem to think the transition away won't significantly change things and that's not realistic.
You mark my words: Russia is one thing, but the very second the US is suitably distracted with internal affairs and can be counted on to be unable to respond, Taiwan gets invaded over night. And that shit will spiral out of control very quickly, because China won't stop there, and nobody else wants to have to learn Mandarin in the mandatory reeducation camp (or at all). Oh, I do beg your pardon, I meant to say "Harmonization Retreat". In Mandarin, obviously. Wouldn't want to compromise my social credit score.
Why? They want Taiwan for its leverage in the silicon industry and for reinforced access to the Pacific Ocean. They really don't have any other military targets on their radar, unlike the USA which spent the last 70 years basically pissing all over the world even after the USSR fell. If you want proof, look at Pakistan. They threw billions of dollars at it, yet its a 100% shill platform for the US. They don't really care about controlling it so long as they are getting paid and Pakistan continues to buffer India.
US is suitably distracted with internal affairs and can be counted on to be unable to respond
You seriously overestimate the US being "distracted" by internal affairs. I even doubt they'd recall forces around Taiwan during a hypothetical civil war. If anything, they'd see the insane value of ending a civil war by baiting China to attack.
Why? Because CCP and dictator Xi literally said they would countless times. Taiwan is an emberassment for CCP and the authoritarians can't have that. The only reason China didn't invade Taiwan as of yet is because they couldn't and as soon as they can they will, that's literally the official stance.
I don't deny it, even though I'm not sure what 'empire' you're referring to. The US presumably? Yeah, I live a little closer to China than that, and am generally not inclined to agree with the US on anything much these days.
LMFAO, you don't even know what real Sinophobia looks like. People like you are delegitimizing all the actual racist encounters I've faced as an ethic Chinese in the US.
The truth is that the U.S. civil war never really ended, it just went into a "cold" phase. If you don't believe it, just look at all the Confederate flags still flying all over the South. Nixon's "Southern Strategy" was all about keeping the war going, under the radar. It has only gotten more obvious since then.
This is something that has been well known and well documented for a very long time now. We've had reports and evidence from dozens of countries, not just the US. We've even had both Russia and China publicly admit that they're doing this.
The only people who deny this are either far left tankies who just happen to to simp for Russia and China or far right neo nazis who also just happen to simp for Russia and China. I sure wonder where Russia and China are focusing their propaganda campaigns...
I don't think it's simply Russia and China though... I think it's just global wealthy business people, along with criminals. Basically the overlap of those two types of people.
Nations are used by the wealthy like the fed use the Mafia and the Mafia uses the street gangs and the street gangs use the simps and homeless. It's all the same evil from the bottom to the top. The same dark part of human nature. This element of human nature resides in all tiers of the human social caste system.
russia makes up the lionshare of propaganda of the world, they have many propaganda troll farms all over to push a divisive narrative. china doesnt have that much of an influence compared to russia. most conspiracies you can trace back to russia eventually if you look deep enough.
With both parties working against the most of the american people and most of the media being in the pocket of some rich guy I don't know how this is going to change other than rewriting the constitution to change how the american political system works. And being defeated in a war seems to be one of the only moments in time where this can happen. And as a non american I'd prefer if they duked it out amongst themselves. Pulling others into it seems unfair and the US might actually win. I'd much prefer if an alternative to war though since its one of the worst things that can happen to a person. I don't know how it would look though. Please enlighten me me if you do.
The problem is that our armed forces are specifically structured to prevent civil war, while there aren't strong regional divisions right now. It's an all or nothing where you're either in control or you're not, and that will take a long time to change.
That said, Trump is absolutely destroying the institutional stability of our entire government in a way no one has done before. This won't allow for a civil war under him, but a decade or two down the road might be a different story.
If governors like Gavin Newsom are as sinister in their power grabs as I suspect, there might be an increase in regional divisions that could make battle lines exist. If other empires are smart, they'll encourage ambitious governors and local officials to lay the groundwork for a regionally divided civil war in the future. That'd be how an American civil war can happen; in the aftermath of a dictator like in the century of unrest after Caesar died.
This is the Liberal's version of "blame the foreigners" similar to how the Fascists blame immigrants.
It couldn't possible the fault of insiders, many incredibly wealthy including some who actually own most of the fucking Press, plus yet others in positions of power and influence.
Of course not, those are "our" people. The country couldn't possible be fucked up because of "our" people. The only explanation is those filthy foreigners.
It's the exact same tribalist bollocks being deploye to protect the real monsters which are very much inside the walls, it's just that one group of right wingers blame immigrants and the other blames foreign states - one arse, two cheeks, same shit.
Even more funny when this bollocks is used for America as done here is that thr one single country which American politicians support unwaveringly even when it's against the very interests of America - Israel - ain't one of the "filthy foreigners intervening in our nation". I would looove to hear an explanation of how Russia or even China influence America more than Israel.
Whatever those nations are trying to do to manipulate America and Americans, it's nothing compared with what some specific Americans are doing to the rest, especially the ones which own parts of the Press - China and Russia have very little influence in the country compared with those extremely wealthy people towards whom the Liberals point no fingers.
Of course Russia and China are trying to interfere like crazy - they too want to get their desired outcomes and their governments are as sociopathic as the rest.
Yet, judging by the outcomes they're getting, they're minions at this next to insiders and even "allied" foreign powers like Israel.
Knowing that, ask yourself the question "why so much focus on messages that it's China and Russia damaging America when those countries aren't getting much from America compared to the likes of Israel or even more compare to very wealthy insiders?"
As I see it, it serves the dominating Propaganda forces to get the riff-raff distracted with the "usual suspects" (which have a long history as antagonists of America) and it's a very easy thing to do because it dovetails with the usual nationalistic tribalism ("Americans" v "foreignes") and America is insanelly big on Nationalism compared to all other countries but the overty Authoritarian ones.
So the Fascists in America are fed the "immigrants want your jobs" variant of "foreigners bad", whilst Liberals get fed the "foreign powers are making our country worse" version - it keeps both groups looking away from those actually pillaging their country and undermining whatever little Democracy the country still has.
You're find plenty on very wealthy and well connected insiders who gain from having the plebes - both those aligned with the Fascist Party and those aligned with the Neoliberal Party - focused on the "evil foreigners" rather than looking for blame in their own house.
There are several people in America with Means, Motive and Opportunity to push "foreigners are fucking up our country" narratives, both a Fascist-appealing version and a Liberal-appealing one.
That meme is outdated. The people behind those bots have moved into USA a long time ago already. All they do is glaze over Trump nowadays. Civil war or not, you do you, but don't blame us for your choice of pedophile for president.
not sure what you're trying to say here, many Europeans and USians will act like they are. the 'russian bot' accusation is an automatic response to shut down dissenting speech that taps into that xenophobia.
I don't blatantly accuse a person of being a bot. In fact I might not have done it once in Lemmy. However it is by now an established fact that many countries use bots to stoke extremism in far right, spread disinformation and meddle in foreign elections/referendums; Russian government spearheading it and countries like US, Israel, Turkey in close pursuit. So fuck all those power hungry leeches who would kill half the world to live forever and see no problem in fucking up the world with right wing extremism. I hope they die suffocating in their own shit. That is what I am trying to say.
One of the reasons why I put up with this shitty platform is because of the entertainment that I get by watching brain dead tankies being the clowns that they are.
Its crazy that we have literal proof that these countries have tens of thousands 9-5 employees who's entire job is to fuck the internet with lies and its just so normalized an accepted.
True, but question: do you believe the US is doing the same or not? Whether it's the actual government or companies
It's an irrelevant question. Two wrongs don't make a right. It just makes things more toxic. It's wrong when the US does it, like anyone else. None of these governments with corrupt centralized power should exist. And this sort of propaganda doesn't help people.
Agreed!
It doesn't matter if its the US, Russia or China.
Leading governments launching campaigns to destabilize countries of millions of people while promoting their preferred fascist takeover has ultimately the same effect.
The working class suffers and loses while the elite endlessly benefit.
Of course not! The US is probably using LLMs.
They're indisputably doing the same, except that the flow of instructions and money follows the US model instead.
You won't find a government-signed paycheck anywhere (well... maybe), but the people who Congressman and Senators and their PACs have to beg for money, are the same people funding dark astroturfing movements.
and yet some instances get triggered when you state this fact
People still get mad at me when I point this out to them, like I've just told them the Earth is flat.
No, Biden didn't lose just cause he was old. No, Labour UK isn't tanking in the polls just cause they're disappointing (the Conservatives were awful for 13 years and still won plenty elections). There's more. There's foreign meddling. And these people just refuse to believe it, as if their countries are impenetrable bubbles.
I used to work in organic growth and it's crazy what you could do in astroturf or brand growth as just a normal person. To think that governments that cannot be challenged would restrain themselves from using this weapon is sadly too optimistic.
The reason why EU and US arent so blatant because they can't just start a troll farm with publics approval.
Why would the U.S. need public approval for a troll farm? That shit is highly classified. If you think the U.S. doesn't do the same thing we accuse Russia and China of doing, I gotta bridge to sell you.
You can't really hide thousands of employees under some maticsl "classified" seal.
Yeah you can, they do it all the time.
Nope
Doesn't reddit use heavily correspond to US military bases?
Why would it correspond to military bases? They can pay their people to shit post and host bots from home.
Cus with the military you already have a readymade pool of labor to work from, with basicaly zero democratic civilian oversight. Plus, a lot of them live on base.
The meddling is foreign and domestic and it comes from $$$$$$$.
There is definitely foreign meddling but Keir Starmer ain't making it any harder too
5th generation warfare. https://digital.sandiego.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1293&context=ilj
These lame ass civil war pushers don't realize we are already in a war. They talk there shit as if we are going to be packing muskets in the street.
Shit is almost as bad as American mainstream media.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Pioneers_of_China
It's literally the American "Pledge of Allegience" on steroids. In fact, when I first immigrated to the US, I just thought the pledge was a "normal" thing, like a ritual, that every country does (I was a non-citizen at the time so I remained silent of course). But then Europeans told me it wasn't normal.
These countries don't typically do 9-5 but yes...
I agree. Who IS Job? Entirely. Just a fictional man or the basis of a remade Sumerian fable repackaged by the Greeks for the Essenes and their conquest?
I find it hard to believe they really want it that much. Keeping Trump where he is will slowly do all the damage they need. On a global scale support for the U.S. is degrading, and things like Chinas currency being used for global trade is accelerating. At the rate things are going it is likely best for China to just let things take their current course. The wealth divide growing in the U.S. is going to do a lot of damage in the next 15 years. The conservative choices are just accelerating our downfall or complete need to move to a Universal base income and spread of wealth, if not a complete flop to a socialistic society. (Which will have a lot of backlash and possibly the civil war).
If another country really thought just one leftist would start a civil war and destroy the U.S., they would just blackmail or pay someone off to do it.
Oh yea that shit is absolutely insane. They are literally sending propaganda to the overseas Chinese Diaspora that promotes trump and demonizes Democrats on Wechat. My parents keep parrotting right-wing talking points. So uncanny.
In part paid for by wealthy Americans.
Nations are just a tool for the wealthy.
They stopped fighting over land and just decided to buy
I mean criminals use psychology and business now too... You can make your enemy kill themselves without touching a weapon. You can make a kid kill an influencer too... But that's probably criminal feds...
Nepal just proved the tech for implementing a Direct Democracy works and is possible in the current world.
Hopefully, soon, we can have political systems where we remove the problem of having to have representatives.
I'm kinda skeptical of "voting" online.
I mean, how do you preserve ballot secrecy and vote integrity while being online at the same time?
In nepal's case, they had a consensus, and they didn't really have ballot secrecy, and what if it was 51/49 split?
There are already countries that have implemented this system officially. It's probably inevitable.
Cybersecurity works when it's actually funded, same as physical election security
Works for Switzerland. Why not Nepal?
American bots:
Everything is normal
American bots:
Keep doing nothing. Resisting is what the Russians and Chinese want.
I'm not Russian. I'm not Chinese. And I don't think I'm a bot. All I want is for that orange kiddie fucker to be imprisoned.
If the lazy fucking americans do that then all is forgiven on my part. Until they come out and officially acknowledge that he's a disgusting blob of human scum then I'll never forgive or forget.
Don't forget all the Europeans here on Lemmy
But if the US is in a civil war, the EU will accept war refugees... right? Right? 👀
(pls lemme in 🥺👉👈)
We might let you in, but if other war refugees are an indicator, it probably depends on your skintone.
In general, I'd advise you to now get everything you need, whether a civil war is coming or just tyranny.
You will need:
You might find useful:
You can help by expanding this list
Wow, I don't have the energy for all that.
Kinda feel like I just wanna go down with the ship. I'm tired man.
Trust me on this one. These have been the most frequent problems that refugees in europe had since 2015. But they also had the language barrier where there documents weren't even understandable to European administration.
Now in your case that is much easier. Just make a folder with your essential documents, either the originals or proven copys. You will need them whether you flee the ship or go down with her. Having those records is essential in the aftermath of any catastrophic situation
I'm Canadian and don't really wish it because it would be a very messy thing, but in a way, I'm thinking, if the US is stuck in a civil war, at least the chances of it invading my country should be much lower.
Like, it would be shitty, but at least countries that are now threatened to be annexed or invaded by the US could maybe breathe a little easier, and see Americans killing Americans for once, instead of people in other countries.
Typically when a country undergoes a violent internal conflict that depletes the coffers, the neighboring country's resources start looking really nice.
I would very much like for USA to be much more stable than it's currently so that it could help us with Russia. And this is of course why Russia is trying (and looks like succeeding) to make USA into a internally bickering cesspool.
I have been thinking US probably requires a hard reset. But then I realised, this will only benefit Russia and China. Well, more for China. Russia's expensive war in Ukraine won't make the country last long in the future. No one worth their salt could replace Putin. If US breaks up or goes on civil war, China will be the ultimate winner.
It would (probably? I wanna say certainly) benefit the rest of the world too, Western Europe included (to the dissatisfaction of our current American bought, obscenely corrupt and greedy leaders, ofc).
It wouldn't benefit the rest of the world. If your country has a business that makes anything, the US buys it. Europe and the US did half a trillion in business in 2024. A destabilized US hurts just about everyone. Makes you think it's worth a hard look at who it doesn't hurt, and I don't just mean nations, but I diciduals and corporations.
Europe is still too dependent on the US military to decouple and be more independent own, unfortunately. The EU agreed to a trade deal/not-trade deal (according Von der Leyen) with Trump in European investment in the US military. I know Europeans were angry at that, but in the near term the EU doesn't have the capability to arm itself sufficiently, while simultaneously arming Ukraine. IMO that deal was buying time for the EU to remilitarise independently (I'm not a fan of remilitarisation as a Euro but what can we do).
I often read "Europe needs the US military to defend itself" online, but is it actually true? Or just the US themselves saying that?
For now at least. Europe doesn't have the same size of military industrial complex that US has at the moment. Europe needs more time to gear up.
I think it's for the best. The US military industrial complex is not something that I would like to see replicated in Europe. Of course if the American standard is "police departments should have armored vehicles" then we are not on the same "level", but do we really need that in order to have an effective military?
Your choices are to not decouple from the US or have a comparable MIC as a collective. You don't have a comparable MIC because the US does it for you. But if you're against the Trump administration, you have to support getting one.
I won't go as far to say Europe "can't survive" without the US, but Europeans seem to think the transition away won't significantly change things and that's not realistic.
Again, says who? I do not believe we need to have a comparable spending, when that spending is >20% of the GDP during times of "peace".
You mark my words: Russia is one thing, but the very second the US is suitably distracted with internal affairs and can be counted on to be unable to respond, Taiwan gets invaded over night. And that shit will spiral out of control very quickly, because China won't stop there, and nobody else wants to have to learn Mandarin in the mandatory reeducation camp (or at all). Oh, I do beg your pardon, I meant to say "Harmonization Retreat". In Mandarin, obviously. Wouldn't want to compromise my social credit score.
Why? They want Taiwan for its leverage in the silicon industry and for reinforced access to the Pacific Ocean. They really don't have any other military targets on their radar, unlike the USA which spent the last 70 years basically pissing all over the world even after the USSR fell. If you want proof, look at Pakistan. They threw billions of dollars at it, yet its a 100% shill platform for the US. They don't really care about controlling it so long as they are getting paid and Pakistan continues to buffer India.
You seriously overestimate the US being "distracted" by internal affairs. I even doubt they'd recall forces around Taiwan during a hypothetical civil war. If anything, they'd see the insane value of ending a civil war by baiting China to attack.
Why? Because CCP and dictator Xi literally said they would countless times. Taiwan is an emberassment for CCP and the authoritarians can't have that. The only reason China didn't invade Taiwan as of yet is because they couldn't and as soon as they can they will, that's literally the official stance.
Jfc this comment is dripping with empire-sponsored fearmongering sinophobia
I don't deny it, even though I'm not sure what 'empire' you're referring to. The US presumably? Yeah, I live a little closer to China than that, and am generally not inclined to agree with the US on anything much these days.
"CCP Bad" = Sinophobia?
LMFAO, you don't even know what real Sinophobia looks like. People like you are delegitimizing all the actual racist encounters I've faced as an ethic Chinese in the US.
Jfc this comment is dripping with empire-sponsored fear mongering americanophobia.
It's interesting how the term"sinophobia" is exclusively used by CCP bots or simps trying to deflect from any criticism of the Chinese government
The rubes keep falling for it and they get all emotional and violent about it rather than getting informed.
What choice do they have? You think they can just wake up one day and like... not be a useless stupid tool in society?
If you're not familiar with where this image came from, here's the White Ninja archive. One of the most insanely great webcomics ever.
The truth is that the U.S. civil war never really ended, it just went into a "cold" phase. If you don't believe it, just look at all the Confederate flags still flying all over the South. Nixon's "Southern Strategy" was all about keeping the war going, under the radar. It has only gotten more obvious since then.
This is something that has been well known and well documented for a very long time now. We've had reports and evidence from dozens of countries, not just the US. We've even had both Russia and China publicly admit that they're doing this.
The only people who deny this are either far left tankies who just happen to to simp for Russia and China or far right neo nazis who also just happen to simp for Russia and China. I sure wonder where Russia and China are focusing their propaganda campaigns...
Exactly this is what’s happening.
Too many are eating it up.
I don't think it's simply Russia and China though... I think it's just global wealthy business people, along with criminals. Basically the overlap of those two types of people.
Nations are used by the wealthy like the fed use the Mafia and the Mafia uses the street gangs and the street gangs use the simps and homeless. It's all the same evil from the bottom to the top. The same dark part of human nature. This element of human nature resides in all tiers of the human social caste system.
It’s Russia and China, and there are people who benefit from the rhetoric within who amplify it as well.
This is well documented.
russia makes up the lionshare of propaganda of the world, they have many propaganda troll farms all over to push a divisive narrative. china doesnt have that much of an influence compared to russia. most conspiracies you can trace back to russia eventually if you look deep enough.
Well, if it gets the constitution changed so that the president can't act like a dictator.....
i'm a ukrainian bot, thank you very much
With both parties working against the most of the american people and most of the media being in the pocket of some rich guy I don't know how this is going to change other than rewriting the constitution to change how the american political system works. And being defeated in a war seems to be one of the only moments in time where this can happen. And as a non american I'd prefer if they duked it out amongst themselves. Pulling others into it seems unfair and the US might actually win. I'd much prefer if an alternative to war though since its one of the worst things that can happen to a person. I don't know how it would look though. Please enlighten me me if you do.
The problem is that our armed forces are specifically structured to prevent civil war, while there aren't strong regional divisions right now. It's an all or nothing where you're either in control or you're not, and that will take a long time to change.
That said, Trump is absolutely destroying the institutional stability of our entire government in a way no one has done before. This won't allow for a civil war under him, but a decade or two down the road might be a different story.
If governors like Gavin Newsom are as sinister in their power grabs as I suspect, there might be an increase in regional divisions that could make battle lines exist. If other empires are smart, they'll encourage ambitious governors and local officials to lay the groundwork for a regionally divided civil war in the future. That'd be how an American civil war can happen; in the aftermath of a dictator like in the century of unrest after Caesar died.
This is the Liberal's version of "blame the foreigners" similar to how the Fascists blame immigrants.
It couldn't possible the fault of insiders, many incredibly wealthy including some who actually own most of the fucking Press, plus yet others in positions of power and influence.
Of course not, those are "our" people. The country couldn't possible be fucked up because of "our" people. The only explanation is those filthy foreigners.
It's the exact same tribalist bollocks being deploye to protect the real monsters which are very much inside the walls, it's just that one group of right wingers blame immigrants and the other blames foreign states - one arse, two cheeks, same shit.
Even more funny when this bollocks is used for America as done here is that thr one single country which American politicians support unwaveringly even when it's against the very interests of America - Israel - ain't one of the "filthy foreigners intervening in our nation". I would looove to hear an explanation of how Russia or even China influence America more than Israel.
Whatever those nations are trying to do to manipulate America and Americans, it's nothing compared with what some specific Americans are doing to the rest, especially the ones which own parts of the Press - China and Russia have very little influence in the country compared with those extremely wealthy people towards whom the Liberals point no fingers.
Hey bud, both are possible.
Yes, but clearly only one fits in their world view.
Of course Russia and China are trying to interfere like crazy - they too want to get their desired outcomes and their governments are as sociopathic as the rest.
Yet, judging by the outcomes they're getting, they're minions at this next to insiders and even "allied" foreign powers like Israel.
Knowing that, ask yourself the question "why so much focus on messages that it's China and Russia damaging America when those countries aren't getting much from America compared to the likes of Israel or even more compare to very wealthy insiders?"
As I see it, it serves the dominating Propaganda forces to get the riff-raff distracted with the "usual suspects" (which have a long history as antagonists of America) and it's a very easy thing to do because it dovetails with the usual nationalistic tribalism ("Americans" v "foreignes") and America is insanelly big on Nationalism compared to all other countries but the overty Authoritarian ones.
So the Fascists in America are fed the "immigrants want your jobs" variant of "foreigners bad", whilst Liberals get fed the "foreign powers are making our country worse" version - it keeps both groups looking away from those actually pillaging their country and undermining whatever little Democracy the country still has.
You're find plenty on very wealthy and well connected insiders who gain from having the plebes - both those aligned with the Fascist Party and those aligned with the Neoliberal Party - focused on the "evil foreigners" rather than looking for blame in their own house.
There are several people in America with Means, Motive and Opportunity to push "foreigners are fucking up our country" narratives, both a Fascist-appealing version and a Liberal-appealing one.
So you're saying that you're an Iranian bot and you're upset you weren't mentioned in the meme?
LOL!
Keep up batting for the ultra-rich!
That meme is outdated. The people behind those bots have moved into USA a long time ago already. All they do is glaze over Trump nowadays. Civil war or not, you do you, but don't blame us for your choice of pedophile for president.
Wat
Lemmy users 🤝 governor of Utah
"I wish we could blame foreigners"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_web_brigades
clearly everyone who says something you don't like must be a Russian bot, Wikipedia says it
clearly unless Putin himself says it, everything is a lie.
I don't care what Putin says, just pointing out xenophobia when I see it
Nice of you to equate Putin and the Russian Government with a complete foreign culture. I am sure he appreciates it.
not sure what you're trying to say here, many Europeans and USians will act like they are. the 'russian bot' accusation is an automatic response to shut down dissenting speech that taps into that xenophobia.
I don't blatantly accuse a person of being a bot. In fact I might not have done it once in Lemmy. However it is by now an established fact that many countries use bots to stoke extremism in far right, spread disinformation and meddle in foreign elections/referendums; Russian government spearheading it and countries like US, Israel, Turkey in close pursuit. So fuck all those power hungry leeches who would kill half the world to live forever and see no problem in fucking up the world with right wing extremism. I hope they die suffocating in their own shit. That is what I am trying to say.
libshits never beating imperialist allegation
Nah. We can be more surgical than that, you hamhanded barbarians
Do you know anything about the civil war? The military was built off of WWII, not the civil war, lol.
Lol the eViL RuSSiAnS and ChInEsE fearmongering 🤣
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_web_brigades
One of the reasons why I put up with this shitty platform is because of the entertainment that I get by watching brain dead tankies being the clowns that they are.
That's just .world for you, lib haven
Good luck spreading fascism when you're likely gonna die from another maga bullet.
Shoo fascist .ml shoo, go earn your 50 cents somewhere else 👏
And here they are, the lib .world users ha ha!
Return to your social reject cave .ml beast. Shoo shoo