I mean most of all human civilization has had those very things though. The climate change part is a bit more recent, but housing has and always will be problematic, and women along with anyone that looks 'different' are typically the first people subjugated in human civilizations. When you think about it at a high level, humans kind of suck overall.
at least two years ago they were trying to grow meat (for consumption) and body parts (for implantation, so i guess consumption too) in vats. ain't heard much about that, but there has been bigger stuff to worry about.
Cyberpunk is lowlife and high tech. It's completely dystopian. The early 1980s was the height of the Cold War with Reagan in power. People were not optimistic about the future in the 1980s, they were just hoping that it wouldn't end in a nuclear war.
Don't worry, we were fucked since before you were born. We overshot our ecosystem long, long ago, it just takes decades for the consequences to catch up.
Tell that to the vast swathes of the globe, including China, due to face lethal wet bulb temperatures within the next 10-20 years. Which, along with mass death, means massive breadbasket failures on multiple fronts. Ain't politicking our way out of this one, chief.
Yeah, and someone was just arguing with me in a different thread saying vertical warehouse farming is stupid and we should just grow our crops in the ground outside 🙄
Like, I'm trying to be helpful here, but sure let's continue to make no systemic changes to the way things are done and just be frustrated when our problems only continue to get worse...
One country is producing all of the world's air conditioners. I wonder if they're in a better position to endure wet-bulb temperatures than their peers.
Ain’t politicking our way out of this one, chief.
They absolutely can and will. This is a country that can build the infrastructure to keep people from dying of overheating. What's more, this is the country that can export that infrastructure globally, such that its allies will see improved survivability. And that will have cascading knock-on effects.
The ability to survive climate change is the ability to operate as a global center of gravity.
I think you missed the 'massive breadbasket failures' part of my comment. You can't air condition a field of rice. Well, you could, but good luck trying that on the scale needed to feed everyone once crops begin to fail globally.
You do realize how many people in the world live in houses that aren't even fully-enclosed, right? Usually in some of the places that will be most impacted by climate change, too. Air conditioners won't be of much help to them.
Also, do you know how much coal China burns each year?
Are we talking about the same country here? Where in "southern" provinces like Sichuan there is no heating provided in buildings? And people rely on electric heaters and blankets to stay warm?
High temperatures don't preclude large lifeforms. Just ask the dinosaurs.
But you need the ability to adapt at speed and scale for the entire ecological colony. You can't rely on biomes that cater exclusively to a handful of apex predators.
The planet has been undergoing the 6th global extinction event in its history for over 30,000 years. During this time period, humanity has flourished even as millions of other species have died out.
I mean the ability to survive it will be based on where you are located. And for the billions that are unable to survive it, they will either start wars with those who can, or will die in the process, or both.
Or peacefully migrate to areas that are sustainable and contribute to the project of rebuilding.
But, again, the capacity to build and supply life sustaining amenities and the political willingness to distribute them in order to curry political favor rather than just generate profit will be central to a country's power projection into the late 21st century.
So where is that going to be? If the rest of the world doesn't run that way (which isn't possible), what do you think happens then? When sea rise lifts things a couple of meters, billions are displaced. You aren't simply going to put them somewhere else. Europe currently is struggling with climate and war migrants, the US is the same.
the rest of the world doesn’t run that way (which isn’t possible)
It is possible. And the bitter irony is that it would be better for everyone on average. Just not better for a few specific people on the whole.
When sea rise lifts things a couple of meters, billions are displaced.
Where will they run to? Not the US Gulf Coast or the Dutch flatlands. Not to the low lying Caribbean Islands or the coastline of Japan or Australia.
The most Climate Change friendly regions are going to be high altitude but still retain access to lots of potable water. Curiously enough, that looks like... Iran, Venezuela, Afghanistan, and the Horn of Africa.
All those Western yahoos screaming about illegal immigrants are on track to become ones. And right back to the countries they spent generations pissing off.
If you believe me or not, I looked it up by myself on wikipedia, and movies i remember well:) to be fair, probably this is what chat gpt would do as well
This is exactly what those who are broadly portrayed as visionaries want.
Unfortunately, it never seems to have dawned on the general public that those who market themselves this way were never the visionaries.
Take Dennis Ritchie, for example, one of the original creators of C, who died just days before Steve Jobs: The media went out of their way to emphasize what a loss humanity had suffered, while failing to acknowledge that someone had died to whom humanity owes a great deal. They celebrated only the greedy capitalist who knew how to market a technology, but not at all the rather humble man who made a tremendous contribution without enriching himself at the expense of the common good.
That was a long time ago, but today’s world is still exactly the same - it even got way worse from there: no recognition for those who actually achieve great things, but only for those who step into the spotlight and thus appear to be the ones to whom humanity owes something.
In my view, this encapsulates everything one needs to know about our time—the absurdity of charlatans desperately wanting to be billionaires or even trillionaires.
This attitude has nothing to do with the real world, and it is a hubris that no halfway decent person would ever presume to have—yet humanity is ruled by exactly these megalomaniacal monsters because it collectively allows it.
So we are ruled by the worst that humanity has to offer—by unscrupulous opportunists who live only for themselves, have no sense of community, and have set up a system of undeserved triumph in such a way that only their own despicable kind can follow them.
It is a system that is directed against humanity itself.
I'd love a site full of sources of the real inventors of shit I can shove into the faces of people who think fucking musk is actual iron man 🙄🙄🙄🙄 the disinformation is so strong.
I'm afraid that's just as hard—if not impossible—as figuring out which artists created all those iconic Disney characters. That's just how soulless corporations are.
I could never handle building a site like that myself because just doing the research would be so absolutely depressing.
We need to bring back reverse dominance hierarchy. Even in systems more "fair" like democracy, many of the most popular politicians are just shitty people very good at manipulation. Just picking people at random to serve would probably produce better results.
You mean the rich and powerful who could've solved the systemic environmental issues didn't, who got it told directly all the time. Who could've done something against Exxon and the others.
Don't lump the masses together with such assholes.
There /is/ a large portion of the masses who are perfectly aligned with the goals of the rich and powerful and are happy to shit on their own doorstep for even a moment's convenience
I mean 'we' as everyone collectively, as society. It's just manner of speaking. I wasn't even alive for most of the time frame mentioned, so I'm perfectly aware not everyone was actually able to 'listen' to the warnings.
I mean... people have been calling the apocalypse since ancient times. Because that's reality. Every civilization falls, every society fails, and it's often via war and violence. We simply have been able to become more connected and harm each other on larger scales over time.
We still don't have the ability to destroy the planet. We just will make it uninhabitable for the number of humans that are currently here, which has happened quite a lot in human history.
i mean, this mostly applies to american mindset. "work hard" is a function of progress; in the absence of progress, it stops making sense. and people who only knew how to work hard their entire life suddenly see that way of life ending.
there's a lot of americans who think that way. "work hard and you can make it". nah
I think I'd cum if I stepped into that 2000's future. Place looks hella cool. 1950's future just looks like car dependent AI slop and 1980's future looks really bright and light polluting
Yeah, where are the trees? The third one just looks like cities surrounded by endless manicured lawn, what a horribly twisted perversion of idealized nature.
The futuristic ones ignore the fact that all of the homeless and destitute are not present because they’ve either been enslaved, or they’re relegated to the old decrepit previous version of the city, as the Sylvester Stallone Judge Dredd showed us.
Edit: Altered Carbon and even The Fifth Element demonstrated this too. You saw the poor living below the smog line.
Curious if this is from a game? I tried to do an image search and the AI says it's just some AI art and not from anything but I had those half life 2 vibes.
If the rich end up in doomsday bunkers while the rest of us have to deal with the shit world they ruined for the rest of us, we better make it our mission to... plug any holes we find, if you know what I mean. Not suggesting violence that could get me banned or whatever, just make sure that the outside air don't get in. Public service.
Not suggesting violence that could get me banned or whatever, just make sure that the outside air don't get in.
this is Lemmy, nobody cares.
when the Apocalypse happens, and all the rich Nazis go down into their bunkers I'm going to become Lee Marvin, Charles Bronson, Jim Brown from The Dirty Dozen. I'll pour gasoline down the air vents and then start chucking grenades down them.
The 1970s and 80s sadly was the start of the apocalyptic shithole future. Look up cyberpunk. The 90s economic computer boom really lead to a lot of optimism, but that is long gone now.
These are all just the optimist's dream. Following that, you could imagine "how people in the 2020's see the future:" and then put the AI techno-optimist view of a post-work utopia where robots do our bidding.
I was listening to that old song called Dust in the Wind by Kansas and there's that line that goes nothing lasts forever but the Earth and Sky, and I thought, those lucky bastards thinking that the Earth and sky would last forever, what a comfort that would be. I can deal with the natural inevitability of death, but knowing that the Earth will die because we're killing it really fucks me up.
You might want to read the old book Earth Abides. Sure, humans may screw things up, but just like the meteor that killed the dinosaurs, the planet will be just fine.
136 replies
Terminator (1984), Terminator 2 (1991), and The Matrix (1999) have entered the chat...
Don’t forget Mad Max
Soylent Green. Alphaville. Logan's Run. A Clockwork Orange.
Planet of the Apes.
I hate every chimp I see, from chimpan-a to shimpan-z
Rock me Dr. Zaius!
Dr. Zaius KICK!
I love legitimate thee-ay-ter
"Can I play the piano anymore?" "Of course you can!" "Well I couldn't before."
Oh man. Soylent Green is pretty fucking close to what we're living right now.
I mean most of all human civilization has had those very things though. The climate change part is a bit more recent, but housing has and always will be problematic, and women along with anyone that looks 'different' are typically the first people subjugated in human civilizations. When you think about it at a high level, humans kind of suck overall.
Yeah. Humans suck big time.
at least two years ago they were trying to grow meat (for consumption) and body parts (for implantation, so i guess consumption too) in vats. ain't heard much about that, but there has been bigger stuff to worry about.
Yeah. Lab grown meat is a thing.
So is meat created from feces.
dammit science the long way was better
Spoiler for Planet of the Apes
Mad Marx
Terminator: "War is inevitable."
Terminator 2: "Actually, maybe not."
Terminator 3: "Oh yeah, never mind, there it is."
Terminator: Arnie is the bad guy
Terminator 2: no wait, the first one made him a huge star so he's the hero now!
Terminator 3: Quick, let's squeeze one last one out before he becomes The Governator in a few months!
I thought Terminator 4 was pretty good, but I like that you didn't even give an opinion on Terminator 5
Would be pretty unfair of me anyway, since I've only seen the first two myself 😁
MelodiousFunk: They made a Terminator 3?
Apparently 🤷🏻
Me putting the 3rd in to rewatch if it was that bad:
True Names (1981), Software (1982), Neuromancer (1984), Hardwired (1986), Wetware (1988)
Cyberpunk is lowlife and high tech. It's completely dystopian. The early 1980s was the height of the Cold War with Reagan in power. People were not optimistic about the future in the 1980s, they were just hoping that it wouldn't end in a nuclear war.
Lest we forget Blade Runner (1982)
Blade Runner still had civilization. I’m not sure we’ll be that lucky.
Gad civilization... in the far flung future of 2019! 😉
Deckard missed Covid!
that's a cool chat. I'd smoke a blunt with em
The third, believe it or not, windows 95 desktop background.
I do miss feeling optimistic about the future
Don't worry, we were fucked since before you were born. We overshot our ecosystem long, long ago, it just takes decades for the consequences to catch up.
You're just in the wrong country, aligned with the wrong set of politics, speaking the wrong language.
The future isn't American anymore. The future is Mexican and Brazilian. The future is African. The future is Chinese.
Climate change doesn't stop at the border, lol.
The ability to endure it and survive - even thrive - in the face of it will vary heavily based on national leadership.
Tell that to the vast swathes of the globe, including China, due to face lethal wet bulb temperatures within the next 10-20 years. Which, along with mass death, means massive breadbasket failures on multiple fronts. Ain't politicking our way out of this one, chief.
Yeah, and someone was just arguing with me in a different thread saying vertical warehouse farming is stupid and we should just grow our crops in the ground outside 🙄
Like, I'm trying to be helpful here, but sure let's continue to make no systemic changes to the way things are done and just be frustrated when our problems only continue to get worse...
Europe wants to rebalance trade with Beijing, but can’t quit Chinese air conditioners
One country is producing all of the world's air conditioners. I wonder if they're in a better position to endure wet-bulb temperatures than their peers.
They absolutely can and will. This is a country that can build the infrastructure to keep people from dying of overheating. What's more, this is the country that can export that infrastructure globally, such that its allies will see improved survivability. And that will have cascading knock-on effects.
The ability to survive climate change is the ability to operate as a global center of gravity.
I think you missed the 'massive breadbasket failures' part of my comment. You can't air condition a field of rice. Well, you could, but good luck trying that on the scale needed to feed everyone once crops begin to fail globally.
You do realize how many people in the world live in houses that aren't even fully-enclosed, right? Usually in some of the places that will be most impacted by climate change, too. Air conditioners won't be of much help to them.
Also, do you know how much coal China burns each year?
It's crazy that you treat this as an insurmountable obstacle. Much less that there's no political cache in surmounting it.
Are we talking about the same country here? Where in "southern" provinces like Sichuan there is no heating provided in buildings? And people rely on electric heaters and blankets to stay warm?
Kind of, I guess. Depends on if there any animals larger than a cat left after the temperature change stops and levels off.
Depends if we can adapt them quickly enough to survive.
Brazil has been dismantling our biotech sector for 20 years now, so I'm not optimist, but YMMV.
Anyway, I'm more optimist on avoiding problem than on dealing with it.
Yeah just do your best and help others while you're here, lol.
High temperatures don't preclude large lifeforms. Just ask the dinosaurs.
But you need the ability to adapt at speed and scale for the entire ecological colony. You can't rely on biomes that cater exclusively to a handful of apex predators.
The rate of change is faster than any in the planet's history, I don't have high hopes for many species surviving.
The planet has been undergoing the 6th global extinction event in its history for over 30,000 years. During this time period, humanity has flourished even as millions of other species have died out.
That, and natural resources. Idk how many freshwater lakes and rivers Mexico has but it's not looking good for the ones they do have.
I mean the ability to survive it will be based on where you are located. And for the billions that are unable to survive it, they will either start wars with those who can, or will die in the process, or both.
Or peacefully migrate to areas that are sustainable and contribute to the project of rebuilding.
But, again, the capacity to build and supply life sustaining amenities and the political willingness to distribute them in order to curry political favor rather than just generate profit will be central to a country's power projection into the late 21st century.
So where is that going to be? If the rest of the world doesn't run that way (which isn't possible), what do you think happens then? When sea rise lifts things a couple of meters, billions are displaced. You aren't simply going to put them somewhere else. Europe currently is struggling with climate and war migrants, the US is the same.
It is possible. And the bitter irony is that it would be better for everyone on average. Just not better for a few specific people on the whole.
Where will they run to? Not the US Gulf Coast or the Dutch flatlands. Not to the low lying Caribbean Islands or the coastline of Japan or Australia.
The most Climate Change friendly regions are going to be high altitude but still retain access to lots of potable water. Curiously enough, that looks like... Iran, Venezuela, Afghanistan, and the Horn of Africa.
All those Western yahoos screaming about illegal immigrants are on track to become ones. And right back to the countries they spent generations pissing off.
Doubtful. Climate change as well as its economic impact will affect most of these areas especially hard
This might possibly the dumbest thing I've read today. Maybe even this entire week.
Elder millennial here. I knew I was in an earth destroying dystopia the entire time.
Yeah we grew up causing and then fixing an ozone hole.
lol ignoring the entire Cold War
Finally, all the time in the world to read my books.
(1953) The War of the Worlds
(1966) Fahrenheit 451
(1973) Soylent Green
(1984) 1984
(1999) Matrix
(2004) Children of Men
(2012) The Hunger Games
Thanks for the list, ChatGPT.
Also if you want to be an asshole, the title is Nineteen Eighty-Four.
its 1984 arsehole
i think i saw that one. whole lotta booty in it
If you believe me or not, I looked it up by myself on wikipedia, and movies i remember well:) to be fair, probably this is what chat gpt would do as well
Guess I was expecting the book release date
Figures they’d have released a movie of it on the eponymous year.
Apologies for the snark.
Apology accepted :-) Honestly when I see text as list format, often it also gives me AI vibes
Hmm, I think you've got a mistake in there bud. /s
It's a fair joke.
I'm reminded of the futurama time lapse when Fry is first frozen. Destroy, rebuild, destroy, rebuild, and so on...
In the year 252525...
The backward time machine still won't have arrived...
I mean the rich are building bunkers so the bottom Fallout 1 death screen is appropriate if you know the lore of the vaults/bunkers.
This is exactly what those who are broadly portrayed as visionaries want.
Unfortunately, it never seems to have dawned on the general public that those who market themselves this way were never the visionaries.
Take Dennis Ritchie, for example, one of the original creators of C, who died just days before Steve Jobs: The media went out of their way to emphasize what a loss humanity had suffered, while failing to acknowledge that someone had died to whom humanity owes a great deal. They celebrated only the greedy capitalist who knew how to market a technology, but not at all the rather humble man who made a tremendous contribution without enriching himself at the expense of the common good.
That was a long time ago, but today’s world is still exactly the same - it even got way worse from there: no recognition for those who actually achieve great things, but only for those who step into the spotlight and thus appear to be the ones to whom humanity owes something.
In my view, this encapsulates everything one needs to know about our time—the absurdity of charlatans desperately wanting to be billionaires or even trillionaires.
This attitude has nothing to do with the real world, and it is a hubris that no halfway decent person would ever presume to have—yet humanity is ruled by exactly these megalomaniacal monsters because it collectively allows it.
So we are ruled by the worst that humanity has to offer—by unscrupulous opportunists who live only for themselves, have no sense of community, and have set up a system of undeserved triumph in such a way that only their own despicable kind can follow them.
It is a system that is directed against humanity itself.
I'd love a site full of sources of the real inventors of shit I can shove into the faces of people who think fucking musk is actual iron man 🙄🙄🙄🙄 the disinformation is so strong.
I'm afraid that's just as hard—if not impossible—as figuring out which artists created all those iconic Disney characters. That's just how soulless corporations are.
I could never handle building a site like that myself because just doing the research would be so absolutely depressing.
We need to bring back reverse dominance hierarchy. Even in systems more "fair" like democracy, many of the most popular politicians are just shitty people very good at manipulation. Just picking people at random to serve would probably produce better results.
That last example is from the original Fallout game, which came out in the late 90s, not the 2020s.
That's not the implication or reason it's being used, at all.
Yeah we know, but nobody cares, because this post is ridiculous
Please do elaborate
Educated people saw the 2020 vision as far back as 1950s. They warned us many times, but we never listened.
"we"
You mean the rich and powerful who could've solved the systemic environmental issues didn't, who got it told directly all the time. Who could've done something against Exxon and the others. Don't lump the masses together with such assholes.
There /is/ a large portion of the masses who are perfectly aligned with the goals of the rich and powerful and are happy to shit on their own doorstep for even a moment's convenience
Propaganda, indoctrination, and de-education, especially when applied over generations, are a hell of a force.
I mean 'we' as everyone collectively, as society. It's just manner of speaking. I wasn't even alive for most of the time frame mentioned, so I'm perfectly aware not everyone was actually able to 'listen' to the warnings.
I mean... people have been calling the apocalypse since ancient times. Because that's reality. Every civilization falls, every society fails, and it's often via war and violence. We simply have been able to become more connected and harm each other on larger scales over time.
And when exactly did humanity ever had the power to destroy the planet prior to the industrial revolution?
You're just repeating one of the usual shit arguments climate deniers are spouting daily.
We still don't have the ability to destroy the planet. We just will make it uninhabitable for the number of humans that are currently here, which has happened quite a lot in human history.
i mean, this mostly applies to american mindset. "work hard" is a function of progress; in the absence of progress, it stops making sense. and people who only knew how to work hard their entire life suddenly see that way of life ending.
there's a lot of americans who think that way. "work hard and you can make it". nah
a lot of people are realising that hard work != success. A lot of people are quiet quitting and other shit.
i wish my personality let me do that. i'm kinda loud. i wrote a (bad) song about that stupid boss and played it at open mic night.
Quiet quitting fell out of favor when businesses simply started laying people off. Wild how that works.
Bizarre lack of reflection
I think I'd cum if I stepped into that 2000's future. Place looks hella cool. 1950's future just looks like car dependent AI slop and 1980's future looks really bright and light polluting
All of them are dystopias
Change my mind
On looks alone first one has car infrastructure, public infrastructure, healthy amount of artistic marketing and high quality housing.
For current US, from descriptions I see, that's actually utopia. xD
Yeah, where are the trees? The third one just looks like cities surrounded by endless manicured lawn, what a horribly twisted perversion of idealized nature.
The futuristic ones ignore the fact that all of the homeless and destitute are not present because they’ve either been enslaved, or they’re relegated to the old decrepit previous version of the city, as the Sylvester Stallone Judge Dredd showed us.
Edit: Altered Carbon and even The Fifth Element demonstrated this too. You saw the poor living below the smog line.
I guess there’s some solace or hope to be found in the fact that all the previous predictions weren’t accurate?
"We can take shelter from the flesh-eating mutants inside the data center!"
gets turned into hamburger by the automated turrets protecting the data center
Sounds basically like an average run of Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead, lol.
If Project Zomboid would let me build a gigantic mobile zombie murder base like you can in CDDA, I would be so happy.
Curious if this is from a game? I tried to do an image search and the AI says it's just some AI art and not from anything but I had those half life 2 vibes.
it's from Ai art,sir
Search up Simon Stalenhag, they made a bunch of art that might interest you
If the rich end up in doomsday bunkers while the rest of us have to deal with the shit world they ruined for the rest of us, we better make it our mission to... plug any holes we find, if you know what I mean. Not suggesting violence that could get me banned or whatever, just make sure that the outside air don't get in. Public service.
this is Lemmy, nobody cares.
when the Apocalypse happens, and all the rich Nazis go down into their bunkers I'm going to become Lee Marvin, Charles Bronson, Jim Brown from The Dirty Dozen. I'll pour gasoline down the air vents and then start chucking grenades down them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdWdqZwC_bc
killing Nazis is hard work, but it's honest work.
Christ that movie didn't hold up
Counterexamples:
How people in the 50s saw the future: GlobalCommunistDystopia.jpg
How people in the 80s saw the future: PostNuclearHolocaust.jpg
How people in the 2000s saw the future: WarAgainstTerror.jpg
How people in the 2020s see the future: ![email protected]
Well, if we had risen up against the rich, instead of letting them rule the world at least the last image would have been avoided.
Keep dreaming m8
Oh hey! It’s me! I’m people in the 2020s!!
Understandable, but ysk that it is an illusion. You always think the past was better than it is now.
The 1970s and 80s sadly was the start of the apocalyptic shithole future. Look up cyberpunk. The 90s economic computer boom really lead to a lot of optimism, but that is long gone now.
Last time the wealth disparity before rich and poor was anywhere close to current one, we call it "medieval dark ages".
In the future, only the lucky ones get to keep their bones.
The 2000's future is so unsettling.
These are all just the optimist's dream. Following that, you could imagine "how people in the 2020's see the future:" and then put the AI techno-optimist view of a post-work utopia where robots do our bidding.
I was listening to that old song called Dust in the Wind by Kansas and there's that line that goes nothing lasts forever but the Earth and Sky, and I thought, those lucky bastards thinking that the Earth and sky would last forever, what a comfort that would be. I can deal with the natural inevitability of death, but knowing that the Earth will die because we're killing it really fucks me up.
The Earth will be fine. Humans, not so much.
You might want to read the old book Earth Abides. Sure, humans may screw things up, but just like the meteor that killed the dinosaurs, the planet will be just fine.
I'm in my 50s, I've always expected the desolation and scavenging.
I see we're still being optimistic in the last panel. Why isn't everything on fire?
Accurate
Don't worry, every generation has had the edgelord who thinks their conception of the future is the dystopian one
Said op who is 12 and can't name 10 books.