Quiet Changes in Bitwarden
I have been using Bitwarden for around 7~ years. Subscription for this long too, at 10USD p/year. I will be switching due to lack of transparency, and would love to hear others thoughts on this.
The linked article goes into further detail, but here is a small summary that very much concern me / are sus:
- that 10USD per year has gone up quietly . I just checked and I have no email telling me it's increased. It renews in like 2 months, so this is good timing for me
- Originally Bitwarden had values as apart of the acronym "GRIT". Gratitude, Responsibility, Inclusion, and Transparency. They have changed the last two words to "Innovation, Trust"
- There is now a new CEO, this was not announced and the only reason people outside of Bitwarden know is that someone saw this change on LinkedIn
- The free tier momentarily disappeared from their product page for about a month (april14-may14). People were likely still able to make free accounts during this period. Bitwarden says it was a marketing mistake
The price hike is one thing, but for me the acronym change is most concerning, which is why I will be looking at another password manger (probably keepassxc)
https://itsfoss.com/news/bitwarden-quiet-changes/Open linkView original on lemmy.zip440
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The CEO apparently is a big private equity guy, and those bloodsucking ticks only know how to do one thing: Suck every last drop of money and goodwill from the company and its customers as quickly as possible.
Breaks my heart, I've been a massive Bitwarden advocate for years. Been happily paying for the individual paid plan. I'm now working on setting up KeyPassXC with syncthing.
Does KeyPassXC have passkey and TOTP support?
Yes. For passkey, you need to install the browser plugin and enable support in the preferences.
Both, yes
Do you know if I can get KeePass working on both PC and Android in sync with Syncthing?
I have been using it that way for years and it works well (for this scenario no problem). Only recently I switched from Syncthing to using mounted SMB share. I switched partly because of the Syncthing for Android maintainer switch (though I still think its safe) and because Syncthing sometimes didn't sync on my Iodé custom rom and I got tired of having to open the app to sync.
Lol.. From Transparency to "Just Trust Me Bro".
I know right. Even in an Enterprise environment why would trust be a better word to represent your values over transparency
Yeah, I switched to KeePass for the same reason. The only way I trust software is if they'll show me the code, and the only reason to replace "transparency" with "trust" IMHO is because they want to go closed source. Innovation also tends to just mean 'we're going to be charging you for features that used to be free '
It much work to get all the names and passwords and stuff from BW moved over to keepass?
Not really, just had to install KeePass on my computer and export my bitwarden passwords BW makes that easy to do) and import them to KeePass. I haven't set up the browser extension yet, as at a glance it says it doesn't work with browsers installed with flatpak and that's how I have LibreWolf installed. Setting up syncthing was also pretty straightforward.
Whoa no flatpak support is a problem. Thanks for the heads up.
Sweet. Thanks.
I never use browser extension for my pwm anyway. Just the pwm apk on my phone and thats about it. Seems less likely for any shenanigans to happen that way.
I tested this a few weeks ago, but one thing I struggled with was having custom fields imported. Don't know if I somehow did something wrong, but while the export data had them as expected, KeePassXC just didn't import it all? The standard Notes did get imported, but none of my custom fields.
It got bought by a company owned by Vista Equity partners, a private equity firm.
The loss of values happened at Citrix when it was Vought by Vista. They installed Tom Krauseasthe CEO to gut it from the inside out.
Everybody should have an exit plan ready to be able to leave bitwarden
If you or someone you trust happen to have a home server, just install Vaultwarden, which is the community fork of Bitwarden without any fees, shady stuff or reliance on Bitwarden infrastructure.
If you look real close side by side there is a subtle difference....
Suuuper easy to stand up, took me about 20 minutes to get it up and running
Well, when u say supereasy to set up, i don't know. The need for reverse proxy was driving me nuts. For someone that doesn't expose anything to the outside world, the need for a reverse proxy is overkill in my opinion. But i did hive up fairly easily, so i'll have another go in the future when i have time. For now my Syncthing + Keepass setup will have to do but i do find its not 100% robust. If i have keepass open on both mobile and laptop, i'm at risk of loosing changes. If the change is made on one device and i close after change, i won't see the change until i close keepass on the other device. But by then syncthing thinks that the latter is the most recent change and marks the file of first device as conflict file. So the chsnge is not lost but its not in the most "recent" version of the database.
If you have several, it really is convenient to set up an internal reverse proxy for all your internal-only services. One place to set up let's encrypt and set up subdomains or different paths for the different services. No need for URLs with different port numbers or IP addresses.
Yeah this is why I don't want to bother self-hosting. There are just too many ways to fuck it up. I'd rather pay a small fee for professionals to handle it for me 🤷 If Bitwarden goes to shit, I can always move to something else - I never heard of a password manager that didn't let us export passwords.
I know this options exists, but honestly I don’t think I have reliable enough infrastructure. It’s hardly ever offline, but my backup game is super weak, and I have had to rebuild from scratch once in the past three years.
What happens if I fuck up again and have to rebuild? Just feels like a massive potential failure point.
Your backup is all your clients. Every client has a blob. If you loose it export and then import. That is if everything else fails.
Bitwarden app is fully compatible with Vaultwarden and stores copies of all your passwords for offline access, so as long as you have access to the app somewhere, you'll have them.
Also, Bitwarden can export your passwords as a file in several formats, readable by Bitwarden, KeePassXC etc. You can have that stored somewhere safe.
How do you use it on mobile? I didn't find an app version
You use the normal Bitwarden app and point it to your server
Use the Bitwarden app, it is compatible. Under the email field, choose a custom server and set it up there.
Totally agree. I've been a multi-year paying customer of bitwarden for the family, always happy with their service, especially when compared with the 1pass I use at work. But that CEO avatar picture alone gives me enough bad vibes, let alone his credentials, the acronym change, so yea I too reckon I've been putting off the switch long enough now.
I came from keepass, can't go back there, even if I now have syncthing set up everywhere. Also, how would that work for the family, you force everyone to set up their own file and hope they manage it well? Highly doubtful.
I saw aliasvault pop up too, this last week. Haven't looked into it yet, and although a great contender, it's probably too young to seriously consider.
These are the alternatives according to selfh.st/apps :
Anyone here had some bad experiences with any of these?
vaultwarden allows you to keep using the bitwarden client i think, just with your own server. should be the most seamless for the family.
If bitwarden went completely rotten could they cease and desist vault warden?
I'd asked a similar question. Basically, the response I got was: if the something goes sideways, the community can hard fork all their clients and use vaultwarden as a server (their current licenses would allow that).
Another suggestion was that you can always use the web ui bundled with vaultwarden directly (heh, I've been using vaultwarden for years and I don't think I ever used the web ui - just the applications, CLI, browser extension).
Good point, that is a big factor indeed, ease of migration. Vaultwarden should get bonus points for this, so I'll be sure to add it to the list of alternatives to try out. Thanks!
Switched from keepassxc to vaultwarden a while ago (mostly due to the horrible syncing experience, and to use the same password manager as my family so I could help out better).
It's a selfhosted and open source version of the Bitwarden server, you'll use the (open source) Bitwarden clients. So its all features of Bitwarden plus full transparency
oh so if Bitwarden eventually locks down their app, the folks over at vaultwarden could just spin up their own f-droid app?
Yes, the clients (Desktop, Web, Browser, Mobile, CLI) are published by Bitwarden under GPL3 license, so you can always fork them.
Bitwarden could delete the repos, but the code is out there.
Password Pusher is no password manager, only for securely sharing information.
Running on Vaultwarden, though that still depends on the official BitWarden Clients. Works great though, and can be selfhosted on pretty small machines. Very satisfied with it.
Passbolt was not on my radar when I was in the market for a new password manager, but would be a serious consideration today.
If considering a self hosted alternative, remember that backups are your responsibility then as well.
Good point about the backups. I snapshot the important VMs daily on Proxmox, I reckon that should suffice for this, right?
It’s not a backup if it’s stored in the same place as the original
It's stored on the network, but yea, still same building.
Exactly what i do but have replication across machines and save the VM backup resository on external hard drive in different building. Outside garage.
I use the 3-2-1 rule.
still in beta (stable) but im using aliasvault for a couple of months now and i don’t have any issues
any idea when they will release a major version?
That does inspire confidence, so I'll add it to the list!
This is the email I received at the begining of the year when there were multiple articles about the price increase.
I think it's important to note that you may have missed or deleted the email, or it potentially could have gone to your junk folder, but they did send out emails letting people know.
I got the same email with 25% discount for this year. Can't argue with lack of transparency on that and it's a bit unreasonable to expect no price increases ever
Yeah. If you're using the services that might required a paid subscription, it's not out of the realm of possibilities for there to be a price increase eventually.
I'm not discounting that there's the potential for a pivot to less transparency and auditability going forward, I just wanted to point out that this wasn't done with no warning.
I don't trust the company that bought them. Private equity is almost always a bad time for consumers/users.
I don't think I received one of these. Only heard about the price increase on Lemmy before I was invoiced with the increased sum.
Yeah. I obviously can't be positive that they didn't mess up, but I got an email about the price increase so it was more of a "for the record" rather than a "you're a liar" comment. I don't work for Bitwarden so I can't say they didn't miss a bunch of customers or something like that when they notified people.
I will conti UE to self-host Vaultwarden and use the BitWarden clients until I feel the clients are not trustworthy or they are forked.
Sure, Go for it. I've been using KeePass for a long time now and I am very satisfied with it. Aside from the security and privacy (Which you know is BEST out there), It comes with many customizations too. I used to use BitWarden but now I use KeePass.
Can keepass store files?
Yes, you can add multiple files to an entry.
Great, then I will probably switch to that then.
Great to hear. One thing I liked about Bitwarden is that you change choose Aegon2id and its KDF iterations, etc. Is that standard? Can you do that in keepass?
Don’t be evil!!
In the same boat as you.
I don't like how it's changing, I also don't like how the UI is changing and, sadly, as a EU citizen I can't trust it any longer since it is made in the USA.
But I'm no hurry to switch. I mean, I won't rush or worry about paying one more year subscription if I have to. I'll try alternatives as long as I have too. So far, there is
Both work with Linux.
I sync it with Synching with no issues.
Interesting! What do you use to open it on your phone?
KeePassDX-libre
Disappointing, but I'm still going to be running the free tier of Bitwarden for the time being. Thanks for the heads up.
Migrated to Keepass shortly before the price increase ( not because of it) just for the reason of wanting my vault fully offline. Seeing these changes at BW still makes me sad, was a long time paying user & truly enjoyed it
Keepass is fantastiic, my vault is pretty static so just manually copy to other device as needed. And of course, have your full backup plan in place as with all things
I guess it's time to move on, I'll check PrivacyGuides for a better alternative while I compare by myself too.
I'm not gonna allow a quiet price hike, this is scummy and anti-consumer.
Bit warden is undergoing enshittifcation in real time. It’s interesting to watch.
Great resource. However, I remember one of them recommending straight up poor advice (and I think suspected sponsored recommendations), and the community shunned them for it. I just can't remember if its https://www.privacyguides.org/en/ or https://www.privacytools.io/
The bad one is privacytools.
Thnx
The price hike was announced months ago iirc and brings bitwarden in line (still cheaper) with all the other services after being the same price over years and years of inflation.
I got my eyes on em because of the vc money but the price hike isn’t out of line.
VC money is the end of the product. The enshittification has started and will never stop.
I am testing out Syncthing right now and will switch to an offline password manager
As a former subscriber since today, I didn't get an email about it so it's wasn't announced enough imo.
Idk what to tell you, the price hike was announced months ago and I had to field a lot of questions from people I help with computers about it.
Another person posted the receipts for when emails got sent out and I remember warning people about this when it first “hit” the news cycle in January.
What would have been enough announcement?
didn't KeepassXC go full into vibe coding?
https://lemmy.world/post/47036606/23815574
otherwise that would be the most appealing alternative to me too
I mean they recently posted a pretty reasonable explanation about their usage of AI (https://keepassxc.org/blog/2025-11-09-about-keepassxcs-code-quality-control/ ).
I'm not sure what the guy in your link is referring to since he didn't provide any additional context.
thanks, I haven't seen this before
Well that would make sense. I was actually going to switch to bitwarden back in May after keepassxc decided to corrupt my entire database along with the backup. I had to begin the lengthy process of resetting every single password I have, I was pretty furious and never wanted to touch keepassxc again. But when I went to bitwarden's website I noticed only paid options, so I decided to continue researching alternatives.
So still has these issues. Glad I went to vsultwarden.
I’ve asked this before but does any of this enshittification affect vaultwarden?
None of the above effects vaultwarden (how could it?), but it does raise concerns about long term FLOSS-friendlyness. I got bit by the sudden price increase earlier this year and decided that is the 1 year warning to migrate to either self hosted vaultwarden or something else. I move slow, so need some time anyway.
Well since most if not all use the Bitwarden client they could lock that down. Which would suck.
The GPL3 clients? They can relicense and stop developing those, but we would still have them in their current state.
Since we still need to use the official clients with Vaultwarden, I'd say time is running short, even if these changes don't directly affect it yet. Definitely need some FOSS alternative clients for it.
Even if it doesn't affect it directly Vaultwarden is strongly linked to Bitwarden, for example I think you're using official clients on your devices, Vaultwarden is not self sustainable (for now)
I think in the worst case they fork the client as well.
The price is still reasonable for me. I don't want to switch services because they might enshitrify someday.
Out of a desire not to switch, I'm going to ask what I know to be a naive/dumb question: what's the worst that can happen? It's a mature gpl codebase
They become another LastPass.
Was LastPass open source to the same degree that Bitwarden is? It's super easy to run your own Vaultwarden server already, and it shouldn't be a problem for the community to fork and maintain unofficial clients either. Doesn't seem like there's much Bitwarden as a company could do about that, even if they wanted to.
I'm surprised that nobody has (meaningfully) forked the clients yet, it seems like all the warning signs are there
When the clients start changing for the worse I'm sure there will be forks..
Yeah for sure, I'm just thinking that it can be a little rocky to get governance and contribution processes set up, sometimes those last minute forks flop because the person who decided to advertise their fork ends up being ill equipped to handle running the project. If we can get a libre warden client project working before hand then it'll make the process a lot more seamless when issues with bitwarden arise.
I don't remember last pass being open source.
you should get a notice no later than 2 weeks before the actual renewal
Yea this is what has likely happened to me, just haven't got the email about it. Then I was thinking: If I never heard any news about the price hike (which I didn't) it would be good if I got an actual email from Bitwarden - perhaps when they decided the price would be higher, therefore I could actually choose to stay with them or have time to research other options
I ran away from Bitwarden a few weeks ago due to other controversies and started using GNOME Secrets and KeePassDX. I couldn't be happier, it's slightly less convenient but I'm glad I did that.
I am looking at aliasvault.net or keepassxc. Vaultwarden I'm not super interested in either as one of its big developers works at Bitwarden, they could be pressured to stop working on it etc. Potential conflict of interest
That’s true, but as long as I have it hosted locally and it keeps working I’m fine with it. I have really gotten used to the bitwarden client simply working on all the devices/browsers.
Exactly. We can just fork it, if the need ever arrives.
There's no reason for is to suffer through a more clunky solution when this is all open source.
That's a good point
Aliasvault seems cool. I wonder how mature it is. Its the clients though that matter too when the wholr family is using it.
Cross that bridge if it happens. So many its and coulds in this thread.
I’ve been very happy and impressed with Proton Pass.
Have you gotten it to fill out credit card stuff right? I can’t figure out what’s up with that.
There was actually some recent improvement with that. It isn’t perfect in all places yet, but even if I have to click into the browser extension, it feels quick.
hello, quit using centralized services
Yep seems to be the way 🙏
https://psono.com/
although its advertised as self hosted & for companies, you can create a personal account on their server.
That's cool I haven't heard of that one. I personally will be avoiding Enterprise products from now on since Bitwarden
fair enough brother, Keepass + syncthing is a great alternative also:
for PC: https://keepassxc.org/
for Phone: https://www.keepassdx.com/
for syncing: https://syncthing.net/
Just FYI there's two KeepAssDX versions in FDroid: the square key and the round key logos. The round key is the Libre one you want, whereas the square one is aka the Google Play version. IzzyOnDroid mirrors the square one and it shouldn't.
Are you sure it's not the square key one you want? I just checked and that one is available from both Izzy and f-droid itself, whereas the round version is only available from Izzy (though that one has foss in the name and the other doesn't)
The repo does mention "free" and "libre" apks and it would appear the only one available on Fdroid (as far as I can tell?) is the libre version.
Edit: I mention it because the official website has round logo, but this version doesn't so not sure that's a good indicator
if you're into self-hosting i've been using vaultwarden for a while now. it's an open-source implementation of the Bitwarden server
What happens if the electricity goes out or your server craps out?
That's it. Thank you for your service until now.
I've already decided to move away from Bitwarden for these reasons but I'm still looking for what comes next.
Curious what did you move to?
Oh that really sucks. Does anybody know any alternatives that support Addy.io integration and shared vaults? I use those heavily
I have switched to aliasvault.net myself ; which works better anyways.
You're quitting over some words? All this questionable shit and you're quitting cause they changed an acronym? Sheesh....
They are quitting becuase they see another lastpass happening. The new CEO is a toxic private equity leech.
Last pass was not Foss though.
True, but FOSS software is not immune to enshitification from private equity.
It's true - apart from the price hike, Nothing really has happened. And yet I ask you, which are you more comfortable with:
In this case I don't care. I selfhost. What Bitwarden does doesn't affect me.