Spyke
lemmy.world

Who the fuck will trust the US when they bomb you during peace talks

252
Mirshereply
lemmy.world

Trump did this last term too, we killed their intelligence chief when he landed for peace talks with Iraq.

This is a war crime, BTW. Attacking someone under a perceived state of truce or ceasefire is called "perfidy".

236
Aqariusreply
lemmy.world

And was, IIRC, widely praised for it by the pundit class.

28

I still remember 2017, when Donald decided to drop the MOAB on Afghanistan and Fareed Zakaria praised him effusively on CNN.

Guess he learned the lesson.

18
DaMummyreply
hilariouschaos.com

I think the "beauty of our weapons" and "Trump became president today" was a different instance from the Soleimani killing.

2
Aqariusreply
lemmy.world

There were multiple instances. I remember... I think it was Isikoff, asking "are you celebrating" or something to that effect. The only thing stopping universal praise was how scared people were it would start a war. That's currently starting.

4
DaMummyreply
hilariouschaos.com

Hmm maybe, don't know much about him personally(but probably do his work) I just remember TV media pundits, especially the so called anti Trump media pundits, having an orgasm on TV over bombing on Syria I think.

1

Oh, yeah, that one definitely happened. The minute it looked like Trump was gonna play ball on their plans for Syria, the entire foreign policy apparatus stopped giving a shit about anything else he did.

2

Its like, I want my country to be better but I know the millions looking for karma arent going to let it happen.

1

What did Trump say recently? Something like: "I have no need for international law. The only thing that can stop me is my own morality." (Obviously, the wrong words, because he doesn't speak that well, but the same meaning.) We all know what his morality is like. He's OK with fucking little girls, and, possibly, killing them. The only morals he has is doing things to benefit himself.

12
chocratesreply
piefed.world

War crimes don't mean anything. It is a cudgel the victor uses to do more damage after they win.

9
kreskinreply
lemmy.world

disagree. What Israel did to the palestinians has meaning and is legally defined globally as war crimes. I am not willing to say those laws and global agreements have no real meaning.

8

I hate to disagree, but laws and rules have no actual meaning if there isn't an enforcement mechanism. Considering how long Israel and the US have been committing war crimes without even the lightest of punishment for those in charge, whatever enforcement is in place is obviously insufficient.

6

For decades American kids were taught that the Japanese were the lowest of the low because they bombed Pearl Harbor with no warning, also while discussing peace.

Trump would have heard the story over and over as a lad.

52
Furbagreply
lemmy.world

This is the second time they've bombed Iran during peace talks. I know it feels like a million years, but it only happened last June.

8

with everything going on, it does feel like it was a million year ago

3

Who the fuck would trust America with Donald Trump on charge. Dude lies to he's suit tailor. That's how vain he is. Add in the fact that he's being blackmailed into this and is a pedophile. I wouldn't trust trump to watch my dog for an hour, let alone nuclear war.

2
mander.xyz

For any US soldier reading this thread: you are attacking another country to cover up for your pedophile president.

159
Eximiusreply
lemmy.world

Considering the average soldier is likely not the brightest bulb, and not the most morally compassed... Isn't it likely the only thing stopping the US from invading EU-ish countries, is our skin color?

41
fedia.io

Well, Trump has now dragged us into a World War on behalf of Israel. Meanwhile people in America starve, are homeless, addicted to opiates, and have no jobs and no healthcare. Everything is unaffordable and the American people are hopeless, and now another endless war.

Fuck Trump. America First? America fucking Last....

138
axhreply
lemmy.world

Don't worry, the AI bubble will probably export unemployment to the rest of the world before it bursts, so everyone can starve

47

More or less, but it looks like the majority of the countries is not willing to do that (I only heard of real results at scale in Finland, tbh)

1
Rothereply
piefed.social

I'm not seeing any reason why a world war would erupt over this. China and Russia are glad that the US has entered into another stupid military mess, they have no reason to actively engage, the US is destroying itself all on its own.

39
lemmy.world

Saying this is the start of a World War is such a USA-centric brain dead take. Ukraine war is closer to World War than anything that might happen in Iran will ever be.

13
Eximiusreply
lemmy.world

Ugh.... China is constantly itching while constantly glaring at Taiwan, and (recently) eastern Russia... Distracted 'murica makes braver China

WW started not suddenly, everybody kinda slowly joined the party

16
lemmy.world

China is likely to attack Taiwan while the U.S. is distracted. Pakistan and India could get into it while there's no one available to intervene.

7

US has been distracted many times when they attacked and invaded like a dozen countries since WWII?

5

Unlike the US, China isn't governed by a attention-span lacking moron. They want Taiwan, and will not rest until they have it, but they also don't want a war with the US over it, unless they can be certain to win it. This isn't it.

3
skulblakareply
sh.itjust.works

I think it is likely that the Ukraine war will be widely considered the beginning of a series of events that will later be labeled "the ramp up to WWIII", of which this is an indirect extension.

2

Exactly my point. The Americans ignore an actual war that has the involvement of multiple countries across the globe, while focusing on some bombing runs done by their HeRoIc fighter jets. Silly and ignorant America-centrism.

1
mrmaplebarreply
fedia.io

If you can't connect the dots between Ukraine, Iran, Taiwan, and Venezuela then I simply don't know what to tell you...

-3

I can. But if you think that the start of WW3 was bombing of Iran, while managing to connect Iran with the war in Ukraine but still think that the actual war in Ukraine was not the start of WW3... I don't even want to know what I would need to tell you...

1

Yeah, I don't know that this will cause a world War, but it does give a pretty nice opening for China to do things it wouldn't be able to do under normal circumstances. They can attack a, supposedly, belligerent neighbor and say it's the same thing the US did to Iran, and the US will be tied up with this conflict for an unknown amount of time. World wars don't start from a single thing. They start from rising tensions across the board. The war with Ukraine and Iran are pieces of a larger conflict.

5
someguy3reply
lemmy.world

Despots back each other up and form an alliance network, because an alliance network is the only way to be powerful against the West. This hits their alliance and long term makes their alliance weaker. However Russia is busy, and China is too reliant on exports.

5
Rothereply
piefed.social

There is no alliance between China and Russia and Iran. Iran is a minor player in this. You are regurgitating Bush "axis of evil" nonsense as if it was actually true. China and Russia doesn't care about Iran, and they were never allied to them. They benefited from Iran in various ways then, they will benefit in various ways from this US disaster.

1

While the US is distracted on two other fronts (Central America and the Middle East) China can take Taiwan with ease.

4
sh.itjust.works

Why does it have to involve the big powers for it to be a world war?

IMO that implies that less powerful countries being in chaos doesn’t matter.

I always thought world war just meant a lot of countries in a related conflict.

0

Because it is a pretty basic and factual definition of world war. War occurring in different places in the world at the same time does not equal a world war.

1
lemmingreply
anarchist.nexus

Just desperate enough for the promises of the benefits received by military service to start sounding very appealing.

11
lemmy.zip

Huh, every single recipient of the FIFA peace prize is a rapist and convicted felon. Odd.

86

A trophy, photoshoot and bribe for stolen land, all paid by working class. Brilliant. Art of the deal - never trade with your money, lives are worth nothing (on wall street)

19

agreed they are really making a mockery out of the FIFA peace prize.

/s

4
lemmy.world

Iran signaled thgat they were going to give them everything they asked for so they attacked instead. They never wanted a deal, they wanted a reason to start a new zionist war on the American taxpayers dime.

80
floofloofreply
lemmy.ca

Iran already had a nuclear agreement with the USA and other countries, which Trump tore up during his first term before he bombed them. Then a few years later they're about to agree to his replacement deal and, as they prepare to sign, Trump bombs them.

No one will want to negotiate anything with the USA after Trump's behaviour in the past year. No agreement with the USA is worth the paper it's written on.

37

This just taught the world when dealing with the USA you strike first. I'm of the mind this is the start of WW3 now because I doubt the other BRIC countries don't get involved.

9

I'm of the mind this is the start of WW3 now because I doubt the other BRIC countries don't get involved.

What? None of them are going to do that for Iran.

Also what are they going to do...? Even the UK is attacking Iran at this point. And almost every other country doesn't actually give a shit. And hated the Ayatollah.

Even Iran is going to respond halfheartedly.

This is why the bullies are doing it.

1
CanadaPlusreply
lemmy.sdf.org

Iran signaled thgat they were going to give them everything they asked for so they attacked instead.

When? It was more like they were signalling they'd be willing to go to the mat rather than become a US puppet or whatever Trump had in mind.

-9

Ah, thank you. I have a strong feeling Oman is leaving bits out, though. Since when has a nuclear deal with Iran been that easy? They have no reason to trust the US, especially after they blew up their own deal the last time. And Trump is hard enough on people who aren't US enemies at a vulnerable moment.

I'm not the only one who's been saying a confrontation was inevitable. The only real question is how far Trump is willing to go before he TACOs.

-7
lemmy.world

Who was voted into office by 77 million Americans (knowing full well who he was and what he would do once in office) while 83 million stayed home. 75 million did at least the bare minimum, but they'd spent decades allowing their party to descend into controlled opposition to the point where the best tactic they could think of to oppose Trump was to wave little round signs around in Congress.

Trump is the full embodiment of the American spirit. He's proudly ignorant, arrogant, petty, and a firm believer in a might-makes-right philosophy. He's also wealthy due to circumstance but firmly believes that he earned it. America has never had a truer representation of their values as President.

10
lemmy.world

I didn't vote for him. should I be included in the "full embodiment of the American spirit"?

2
lemmy.world

Well, think of it this way: does the fact that some parts of the brain of a serial killer protested their acts really matter to the victims? Does it matter in court when they’re sentenced to death? Should that part of their body be judged separately?

-1
lemmy.world

sounds an awful lot like you're just making excuses to be xenophobic.

are you saying that all Germans are Nazis, or all Africans are savage tribesmen, or maybe that all Australians are criminals?

0

Nope. I’m saying that your platitudes on the internet mean nothing to the victims, because you’re still a contributing member of the entity victimising them.

1

Dont forget the US democrats, who also ran a pro genocide campaign while still pretending as hard as they can that they never had anything to do with any genocide, and certainly arent compromised in their pursuit of democracy or justice, no sir-ee. This would have happened nearly the same if they had been elected-- just with more theater. The whole American governance system is fundamentally broken and unlikely to fix itself.

1
lemmy.world

US: "You can't enrich uranium!"

Iran: "We reluctantly agree to this term."

US: Bombs Iran anyway

We live in a clown country 🤡

61

US: "You can't enrich uranium!"

Iran: "We reluctantly agree to this term."

US: "Oh fuck, we were hoping for more resistance, it's only a cover for stealing your oil."

8
Atomicreply
sh.itjust.works

That's not entirely what happened. Though you do live in a clown country.

After US withdrew from the Iran nuclear deal, Iran did continue to still follow the terms for quite a while in hopes that the US would once again rejoin (presumably).

Then the US assasinated an Iranian general or major, could be mistaken. Either way, they assasinated someone. Iran, shockingly, wasn't all too impressed and quite upset about the whole ordeal, so they said fuck it... if that's how you wanna play, we're gonna do whatever we want.

And then now, you have US and Israel both striking Iran, with the justification that Iran was "about to strike us first".

8

I would link the meme of Kim Jung Un telling his daughter this is why we have nuclear weapons, but I didn't save it.

2
aussie.zone

Invite diplomats for peace talks then start bombing their home while their away. So typical.

57

Yeah... Funny... That's what Putler has been doing each time he was invited for peace talks.

Tyranny has the same playbook.

8
startrek.website

Whelp, it looks like Star Trek was on the nose. This is probably the year World War III begins.

EDIT: WWIII last 27 years.

54
lemmy.world

You forgot Eugenic Wars.

Instead of genetically engineered superhumans we get kleptocratic asshole billionaires and AI.

Instead of charismatic Khan Noonien Singh future gets a sickly pale Mark Zuckerberg.

28
Watabareply
sh.itjust.works

We're in the Confederation Timeline from Picard S2. Khan didn't happen in that iteration of events.

It fits. Awful season, awful reality.

12
hopesdeadreply
startrek.website

If you’ve been watching all of Trek, you’ll know that the Eugenics Wars no longer have a fixed point in time. WWIII on the other hand hasn’t changed.

3

Kurzman Treks don't exist for me. There's nothing Star Trek in them.

Horrible acidic projectile diarrhea of storytelling.

0
lemmy.world

I find this WW3 aspect rather ridiculous and America-centric thinking. Pretty much everyone is staying out of this and theres no signs of the US sending troops in. This is just a repeat of the last operation they did, maybe in a bigger scale

3
AlDentereply
sh.itjust.works

In regard to WWIII, focusing only on the current Israel/US-Iran conflict seems like rather America-centric thinking. Russia invaded Ukraine over four years ago and is still fighting in their territory. A foreign-backed civil war is raging in Sudan with massacres large enough for civilian satellite imagery to see large scale blood stains. Pakistan declared "open war" against Afghanistan just this month. China is continuing to claim the territorial waters of their South-East-Asia neighbors and engage in regular ship rammings to secure it. Israel has bombed Palestine, Iran, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen, Qatar, and Tunisia in just the last year. Russia-backed ships have been cutting undersea telecom cables. And a Chinese invasion of Taiwan seems imminent.

7
piefed.zip

Shoutout to Evan Vucci who made the photo that heads the article. It encapsulates the whole situation perfectly: The Don behaves predictively like an angry, lying troll, making smugly grinning Netanyahu's wishes come true.

They really deserve each other. I just wish somebody gave them a sandbox so they wouldn't have to destroy the world.

46

I can't find it rn but an Israeli newspaper was openly stating that "files that could still come to light" finally changed Donny's mind on Iran. Wouldn't surprise me tbh. 🤷

6
feddit.org

So that's why they gave Anthropic that deadline, huh? I should have seen that one coming, that's on me.

42
maplesagareply
lemmy.world

I knew it was coming when they said there were bears on the moon with ak47s.

12

It proves once again one cannot trust the USA and Israel under their current regimes.

16

Selected excerpts from:

THE THEORY AND PRACTICE OF

OLIGARCHICAL COLLECTIVISM

by

Emmanuel Goldstein


Chapter III

War is Peace


The splitting up of the world into three great super-states was an event which could be and indeed was foreseen before the middle of the twentieth century.

[...]

The frontiers between the three super-states are in some places arbitrary, and in others they fluctuate according to the fortunes of war, but in general they follow geographical lines.

[...]

In one combination or another, these three super-states are permanently at war, and have been so for the past twenty-five years. War, however, is no longer the desperate, annihilating struggle that it was in the early decades of the twentieth century. It is a warfare of limited aims between combatants who are unable to destroy one another, have no material cause for fighting and are not divided by any genuine ideological difference. This is not to say that either the conduct of war, or the prevailing attitude towards it, has become less bloodthirsty or more chivalrous.

On the contrary, war hysteria is continuous and universal in all countries, and such acts as raping, looting, the slaughter of children, the reduction of whole populations to slavery, and reprisals against prisoners which extend even to boiling and burying alive, are looked upon as normal, and, when they are committed by one's own side and not by the enemy, meritorious. But in a physical sense war involves very small numbers of people, mostly highly-trained specialists, and causes comparatively few casualties. The fighting, when there is any, takes place on the vague frontiers whose whereabouts the average man can only guess at, or round the Floating Fortresses which guard strategic spots on the sea lanes.

In the centres of civilization war means no more than a continuous shortage of consumption goods, and the occasional crash of a rocket bomb which may cause a few scores of deaths. War has in fact changed its character. More exactly, the reasons for which war is waged have changed in their order of importance. Motives which were already present to some small extent in the great wars of the early twentieth century have now become dominant and are consciously recognized and acted upon.


To understand the nature of the present war -- for in spite of the regrouping which occurs every few years, it is always the same war -- one must realize in the first place that it is impossible for it to be decisive.

[...]

In any case each of the three super-states is so vast that it can obtain almost all the materials that it needs within its own boundaries. In so far as the war has a direct economic purpose, it is a war for labour power. Between the frontiers of the super-states, and not permanently in the possession of any of them, there lies a rough quadrilateral with its corners at [...] containing within it about a fifth of the population of the earth. It is for the possession of these thickly-populated regions, and of the northern ice-cap, that the three powers are constantly struggling.

In practice no one power ever controls the whole of the disputed area. Portions of it are constantly changing hands, and it is the chance of seizing this or that fragment by a sudden stroke of treachery that dictates the endless changes of alignment.

All of the disputed territories contain valuable minerals [...]. But above all they contain a bottomless reserve of cheap labour.

Whichever power controls equatorial Africa, or the countries of the Middle East, or Southern India, or the Indonesian Archipelago, disposes also of the bodies of scores or hundreds of millions of ill-paid and hard-working coolies. The inhabitants of these areas, reduced more or less openly to the status of slaves, pass continually from conqueror to conqueror, and are expended like so much coal or oil in the race to turn out more armaments, to capture more territory, to control more labour power, to turn out more armaments, to capture more territory, and so on indefinitely.

It should be noted that the fighting never really moves beyond the edges of the disputed areas.

[...]

11

Traitor AND yellow bellied sneak attack commie puppet. Nice. "I wish I could give myself one of these medals. I deserve one." . Four deferments as 4F. Draft dodger. Maybe had he gone he'd have come back an American.

6
leminal.space

If only anyone could've known that america is a piece of shit county full of cowards.

5
kreskinreply
lemmy.world

The world is pretty short of upstanding countries at the moment. They are all compromised by far-right facsist supremacist zionism and the pedophilia honey traps Epstein conducted (in service of Zionism). Are you from some place thats free of that?

9

Mass surveillance has everyone in a honey trap, but it will be more like petty blackmail to supress dissent. My favorite thing is that none of it really matters if they raped kids and got away with it. Like, I don't really care that my neighbor had an affair if the president's a kiddie diddler.

2

they have internal issues, and genocide going on as well, just hasnt expanded thier borders.

1

I can just see this happening while literally negotiating at the table. Like US and Iran are there, the mediator mediating, someone walks in and whispers into the US sides ear, they say carry on everything is fine and continues. A few minutes later someone walks in on Iran's side and whispers into their ear and they freak out.

0
lemmy.world

Good. Iran needs to change. The regime is too oppressive killing any Protestant how can anyone expect change other than violence. It would be good for the world too, no terrorism and more western Iran would great.

-34

This backpack (CW: Blood) belonged to an elementary school kid who was killed yesterday after the U.S. and Israel targeted her school.

Take a look at the picture, and tell us all again how it's a good thing.

10
lemmy.dbzer0.com

You think that the US bombing Iran is going to reduce terrorism? What the fuck do you think inspired alqaeda and ISIS? This will validate every terrorist organization's hate for america.

Please read any amount of history before regurgitating talking points on a subject that you clearly do not understand.

9

Iranians (I'm from Iran and lived there 5 years) are unable to change regime cuz they are killed by their own nation! 30,000 people+ past two months. This is nothing yet this war. They can't even travel abroad freely like any free human should be able to!!! They aren't allowed. They filter internet. What are u talking about. So leaders there must die and the normal people need to take over! No other option of anyone normal getting in power in this situation. Plus the economic growth. Iran needs to westernize, needs to progress and become a free country. Not fucking going BACKWARDS in human progress! By blocking any American product, internet, traveling abroad, not allowing hair to be shown, not being able to touch a woman in public, or tv show or movie, wtf! The majority of Iranians are not like that, but they are forced to accept it.

-1

Just because an end result can be positive (this is yet to be seen here), the means to that end are highly arguable. The US is not, despite what they seem to think, the world police.

Just like with overthrowing the dictatorial former president of Venezuela, this is not the US's place.

9

Because if the last 25 years have taught us anything, it's that the US going to war with Islamist nations creates regional peace and stability...

6

Good. USA needs to change. The regime is too oppressive killing any minority how can anyone expect change other than violence. It would be good for the world too, no terrorism and less racist ICE would be great.

FTFY. Maybe start preaching at home.

Edit: fixed it even more. Also that account is a sleeper troll from the post history seems like, but I stand by what I said.

4