People can not actually grasp so many people existing. We were never meant to live in such large societies, historically, we only had a tribe that consists of maximum ~150 people.
It has been scientifically proven that we can't hold effective social relations to a larger number of people. The exact limit is not clear afaik, but what this essentially means, in a community of millions, we abstract away groups of people into "the left", "the bourgeoisie", "the poor" which allows our brain to form social relations to these groups of people with the limited capacity it has, essentially treating each group as a single person.
Now of course, this abstraction is entirely inadequate, as each collection of people is always much more diverse than the abstract concept we use to replace them, and they aren't really single individuals, they don't act with a collective mind.
But most people do not understand this. They just work with these abstractions, these groups of people, as if they were real single people, because in some manner, it does work. If the abstraction actually groups correctly, then the ability to reason like this works decently well. But everyone is always wrong about these abstractions. They are always too general. They always fail to consider that there's not a single mind at work.
It's such an easy mistake to make. I see smarter people than Musk do it all the time. The enemy, like always, is missing knowledge, missing humility, missing self-awareness, unreasonable confidence, fear of the unknown/being wrong. All of which Musk falls into.
I don't see any solution but to educate about this whenever possible. To speak to people about it. To raise the education about stuff like this wherever, whenever we can. I'm trying to do my part.
Good ted talk, but it could be boiled down to how many millions is a billion to blow most people's minds. And even if you know it's a 1000 million, our minds just can't grasp that.
Things can always be boiled down. But the more you boil it down, the more previous knowledge you assume people have in common, and it might happen that they don't understand because they didn't have knowledge you assume they had.
Conversely, if you include too much information, not boil it down enough, you lose people by being bored of getting told things they already know.
In any case, it's not an easy balance and I'm just doing my best here to guess which amount of "boiling down" is "just right". But thanks for your comment, I'll take it into consideration.
Says the one actually doing a whole nazi salute, buying presidency despite not being able to hold office due to nationality, carving up entire programs and departments in a very incompetent way, and attempting to shamelessly buy a seat in the supreme court.
And that's not mentioning how I personally believe he may be doing all this due to his God-Iron-Man-Savior complex which makes him believe he'll be remembered as a modern messiah. Notice how he's revived his desire to put mankind on Mars, and by next year no less. He knows under current laws he'd at best help pave the way to Mars, but not live to enjoy it himself. "Maybe if I change the whole rulebook - in the end despite the suffering they'll thank and revere me", I bet.
Poor Elon. I bet he's crying right now for being a misjudged angel, drying his tears in green paper.
Yeah, because supporting and claiming the AFD is Germany's only hope (Germany's Nazi Party, which is not called Nazi Party because that would be illegal in Germany) is exactly what a none Nazi would do!
And that's why you'd never be the richest person. Think about the qualities that lead one to become the richest person on earth. Really think about what that title represents. It's an unfathomable amount of wealth. Any sane, compassionate person would have funneled that into charity work and the well-being of others.
Nah, that's bullshit. You're no fucking saint. The problem with billionaires is you cant possibly live a normal life once you get there. That kind of power corrupts your thoughts, actions, and importantly the way every single person you ever interact with behaves.
I'm very curious to see how all this whining plays with his fan boys. Doesn't seem very based or chad or whatever the fucking incel children are saying these days.
He didn't just get a billion dollars though, its just unrealized gains in stocks, and those stocks represent his influence/control in the company.
If you helped build a company, and were passionate about it, you'd give that all up? If your vision was to build XYZ and you gave up those shares and you knew XYZ wouldn't happen anymore, would you give that all up?
He DID get 300 million dollars from PayPal, and he decided to fund Tesla and build SpaceX and almost lost it all. Was it wrong of him to use all his money to try and build something? (He actually didn't want to build SpaceX but no one wanted to do the inspiration project sending a plant or something to Mars he wanted to do)
We need a way to separate the stock value/holdings from company ownership/influence when companies get this big.
Honestly: Being a massive, public spokesperson for electric vehicles that had a huge following with the well-off nerds brought us where we are today with electric cars, I'm still convinced about that. But yeah, that's about the only thing I can think of.
I don't care how positive the apparent outcome; I simply cannot agree with giving somebody credit for propaganda. Because essentially, that's what you're talking about.
We don't need confidence men like Musk or Trump. They have nothing but their own interests in mind. So he accidentally had a small positive influence? Big deal. If he hadn't spoken up, another would've taken his place.
He deserves no credit, just as he deserves no sympathy.
That sounds very black and white. With age I've come to the conclusion that black and white thinking while very satisfying has never led to anything good in my life. I avoid it where possible. It's a bit harder and it can bring me into situations where I don't feel the righteous vigor of being on the correct side, but I find that I've ruined more with that vigor than what I've fixed taking a detail oriented approach.
I do not see any benefit on looking for the illusory middle ground in this case.
It all comes back to the paradox of intolerance I think. If you fail to see an overwhelming every such as fascism in very strict black and white terms, you are not only putting yourself in harms way, you are actively allowing others to come Uber fire as well.
Yes. I approach the issue of Nazi shit stains like Musk in a very black and white perspective. And you should to. In fact, given the context, I find your response honestly deplorable. Even if we forget about Musk and focus on the propaganda issue, your response opens the door to assisting the spread dangerous misinformation that very realistically can cause actual pain and suffering.
Jeezus christ, kid, I just said that the guy with his attitude and the right target group made EVs cool and therefore created the market back in the 10s. Which enabled the beginning of the EV revolution as we see it today. You make it a personal attack on me. Please be a lot calmer and gentler with other humans in the future.
I make no apology for my tone. However, although I do object strongly to your started position on this matter, I have no quarrel with you as an individual!
And again, any positive effect from his actions was not his goal nor his intent. So giving him credit for that is foolhardy at best. We should stop normalizing putting self absorbed sociopaths on any pedestal, for any reason. Nothing this man has ever done or accomplished is in any way praiseworthy. And we should not encourage him or others who might wish to emulate him, not even unintentionally.
Well, in short, by definition it spreads misinformation. Even if a particular propaganda message is technically truthful, by design the message has been alerted to focus on certain things while obscuring others. In other words, it's not only inherently subjective, but it's designed to be misinterpreted as objective.
Finally, I do not support any of the common causes or ideas that propaganda is usually intended to reinforce (e.g. patriotism sounds harmless, even positive, but largely is used to encourage bigotry and xenophobia).
all media is propaganda. no org can tell you everything that's happening, every human interest piece, every corporate move, every government policy, etc.
by necessity, they choose stories they think matter or will get clicks. it is up to you to understand the bias inherent in all media and distinguish fact from opinion, and draw your own conclusions.
propaganda, media, whatever you call it, isn't The Truth even if it's true.
so there is nothing wrong inherently with propaganda, even self-aware propaganda.
no no, that's different. you're right, on one hand they claim superiority and on the other they're victims etc... but what I'm talking abouts this sniveling, cowering, tattletale crybaby shit... it just looks and feels so pathetic that I don't understand how they don't look at him and think he's subhuman. I guess he has too much money to kick away.
It's so unfair that everyone keeps referring to his neo Nazi salute that he gave at a neo Nazi convention.
Just so unfair to bringing up his neo Nazi salute constantly. Just patiently unfair to mention his neo Nazi salute he gave twice at the neo Nazi convention.
Tbf, I don't think you can do anything worse to his reputation than him literally throwing up two Nazi salutes on live tv. At this point, people's opinions lie where they lie, although with a shocking amount being very, very disturbingly positive of him...
I don't disagree with you at all. I think a significant amount of Reddit, Twitter, etc. traffic are wildly inflated by bots that want to push narratives. Why wouldn't they be? It's so easy to do now and costs a minimal amount for the return.
That said, I also know people in real life that dismiss his gesture to him being "autistic" and just "throwing his heart out" even though we have unequivocal video proof of him doing that exact "my heart goes out" gesture in the past that is uh...not a Nazi salute.
I do wonder where the crossover is though. Like, do the people I know who dismiss Elon's clear Nazi behaviour do so due to seeing narratives on the internet that back up the idea of "oh no, he's not a Nazi, it's fine, he's just autistic!!1", or would they have arrived at the same stupid ass conclusion on their own?
Oh so that nazi salute was leftists & liberals simply hallucinating ?
Or what about the fact that you (as in Elon) literally tried to Whitewash Hitler's crimes ?
I haven't used it much but the point was some far right Musk fanboi asserting Nazis were socialist when even Grok, ostensibly under the thumb of Musk, doesn't pretend they are.
That said I wouldn't trust it as an AI and there are plenty of other free AIs to choose from if you want that kind of thing. Install ollama and you can even download and run a bunch offline.
For a short couple years Musk actually was doing legitimate engineering work at SpaceX. Yes it was high level, but it did involve proper work and deep understanding of the systems. And yeah, Shotwell had to stop him from making several critically bad decisions during that time (like canceling Falcon Heavy).
I know all the Musk haters will disagree with me on the idea he did contribute to the engineering, but it’s extremely well documented by both the employees at the time and spaceflight journalists.
But honestly before and after that, I can’t think of anything else he really did at a technical level though.
If this is any way true, then they need to be shut down immediately. He is not an engineer. He does not understand anything. I've heard him speak about things I know and pretend he's knows about, and it's obvious he's a moron.
Sigh, just because he’s a moron about most things doesn’t mean it’s true about everything. Just watch some of his interviews with spaceflight journalists and you’ll see he knows his stuff for a while and then slowly loses it over the years.
Humans have this infuriating habit of believing that because someone is distasteful they must be stupid in every possible way, but this is very rarely true. Oh, I wholeheartedly agree that he’s remarkably stupid, and I agree that at this time he knows very little about what’s going on at SpaceX, but you are ignoring the evidence if you believe it has always been this way.
Let’s be better than this and actually look at the facts, not the emotional reaction. You’ll come to the same conclusion either way - Musk is a horrible human being who has no right being anywhere near government, or even industry for that matter.
What kind of engineering work? That's a really broad category.
Like, are we talking aerospace engineering? Software engineering? Systems engineering?
I don't think the interviews angle means anything. Just because he was able to convince a journalist he knew the right words doesn't mean that he was actually contributing to the actual engineering of the rockets. If he spent 20 hours a week in engineering meetings, he might have absorbed enough to talk intelligently about it.
I also wouldn't give much credit to employees saying that he did engineering work. This is the same guy who bought the title of "founder" when he bought Tesla, and loves using NDAs to muzzle people.
I'm not saying I have doubts about his actual engineering because I think he's an asshole so he must be an idiot. I'm saying it because I've never heard him say anything technical that wasn't basically Star Trek technobabble, and at the same time I have seen him do a lot of shady things to make it seem like he's more involved than he is.
My feeling is that he sort of lives for creating impressions like this, so people treat him as if he is, well Tony Stark basically. He gets off on that. And that is also why he is so obsessed by getting respect from the gamer, nerd, and geek communities. So fuelled by this motivation, he reads a lot on technical topics and is intelligent enough to absorb the superficial level details. Superficial but nevertheless enough to impress people who don't know any technical details (journalists) and enough to impress engineers etc too because they are surprised to see that he knows anything at all on a technical topic of their expertise. I have had the same feelings before, if someone which I know is unrelated to my field comes and talks about some basic technical details of it, I get a mixture of surprised feelings and respect. But all it really takes to get that information is just reading some wikipedia articles.
Let's paint with a broad brush and say everything you said is true and completely ignore the part where he has to be stopped from making stupid decisions. Let's give him so much rope that we can ignore it.
What good stuff is he doing now? Like is he feeding the homeless? Hell, I'll take doing the dishes when it isn't his turn.
I genuinely want to know what he considers "good things he's doing".
Not as far as I can tell, he’s doing squat other than tweeting and dismantling the government at the present. And he’s fried his brain with drugs so far it’s going to be impossible to recover.
He's still a hero in his own mind, thinking "Can't people see I'm trying to improve society? Sure, several million people might lose everything and maybe die, but you can't make an omelet without breaking a few eggs. It's for the greater good!" Now he's shocked the few million people scheduled for demolition strongly disagree.
"Fake nazi stuff" lol. Elon Musk has no skills at all for dealing with people who aren't on his payroll and don't have to kiss his spoiled rotten ass lol
Elon Musk is text book example of a complete sociopath. He lacks empathy, he chronically lies and manipulates people, extremely impulsive, has no behavior control, has no idea about what is right and what is wrong, is extremely aggressive and hostile (called Tim Walz a loser, the cave rescuer as Pedo), has superficial charm to fool MAGAs, and consistently breaks and defies rules and laws.
.world was banning people for it right around when it happened by then they backed off. I'd be a little careful when posting stuff like that on .world but other instances are fine with it.
MTG would be saying the "Demonrats" and liberals were using their space laser or weather control machine.
The religious folk that eat this shit up basically sort things as such:
1.) If it's good for me or who I like: God's blessing
2.) If it's bad for me or who I like: The Devil did it.
3.) If it's not all bad for me or who I like: It's part of God's plans/He works in mysterious ways.
If Elon were hit with lightning, even if he was in the middle of a thunderstorm holding a giant metal rod while standing on the roof of a skyscraper they'd say someone they didn't like did it.
Musk is that kid in middle school who went out of his way to act smug and edgy in a desperate attempt to impress the other kids but it was all so cringey and irritating that it just made everyone hate him, but he was so dysfunctional that all he could do was try even harder to be smug and edgy, which just made the other kids hate him even more, and 'round and 'round it went until finally somebody decked him and then his mom complained to the administration because the other kids were bullying her baby.
You're make this sound like it's a metaphor or something...
But Musk is that kid literally, and last year one of the other billionaires did try to fight him for being unbearable until his mom literally stepped in and helped him back out
He's a rich manchild who people put up with when he let them play with his cool toys. Then he went from the weird rich kid to a total asshole the second he thought this was loyalty... Now he's crying about being bullied because everyone is turning against him, despite continuing to fuck absolutely everyone over
Man, who would have thought that throwing a Nazi salute, and then when people point it out, making a bunch of Nazi jokes instead of denying it would get you labeled a Nazi?
That's the damning part for me. If it really was a screw up, why would you not immediately say "Oops, that was not what I intended! I just got caught up in the moment and definitely was not trying to give a Nazi salute!" Like, I'd still hate the guy because he's got a shitty ego, but I wouldn't consider him a full-on Nazi. People make grand gestures when in front of a crowd, and let's face it, a Nazi salute is not exactly a complicated gesture. I can see someone making that mistake when they're just trying to be animated.
But he didn't deny it! He instead went on Twitter and immediately started saying shit like "I did Nazi that coming." What the fuck did you expect would happen?
If you call fact checking, calling out your lies and listing facts negative propaganda, then sure. And it's not "fake" nazi stuff, it's just nazi stuff.
I loved his whining a few weeks back that he hadn't "physically harmed" anybody and the implication that all the haters were big meanies. Meanwhile his minions at his direction were slashing programs that were saving people's lives through their existence - health, welfare, medical research, disease prevention, pollution & air quality, road safety, food aid etc.
So did he straight up murder people? No, he did it indirectly. But he may as well have. Thousands and thousands of people will die because of him. But let's all feel sorry for the billionaire douchebag who never cared about anyone else once in his entire life.
I mean he's not wrong about the first part. But as for the second part, the Nazi stuff and lack of anything positive is more cause than effect. Third part depends on the eye of the beholder.
"The mercy that was quick in us but late
By your own counsel is suppressed and killed.
You must not dare, for shame, to talk of mercy,
For your own reasons turn into your bosoms,
As dogs upon their masters, worrying you."
They talk about "the left" as though there's any kind of leadership or organization or solidarity.
Motherfucker, people just don't like you, all on their own, because of who you are.
People can not actually grasp so many people existing. We were never meant to live in such large societies, historically, we only had a tribe that consists of maximum ~150 people.
It has been scientifically proven that we can't hold effective social relations to a larger number of people. The exact limit is not clear afaik, but what this essentially means, in a community of millions, we abstract away groups of people into "the left", "the bourgeoisie", "the poor" which allows our brain to form social relations to these groups of people with the limited capacity it has, essentially treating each group as a single person.
Now of course, this abstraction is entirely inadequate, as each collection of people is always much more diverse than the abstract concept we use to replace them, and they aren't really single individuals, they don't act with a collective mind.
But most people do not understand this. They just work with these abstractions, these groups of people, as if they were real single people, because in some manner, it does work. If the abstraction actually groups correctly, then the ability to reason like this works decently well. But everyone is always wrong about these abstractions. They are always too general. They always fail to consider that there's not a single mind at work.
It's such an easy mistake to make. I see smarter people than Musk do it all the time. The enemy, like always, is missing knowledge, missing humility, missing self-awareness, unreasonable confidence, fear of the unknown/being wrong. All of which Musk falls into.
I don't see any solution but to educate about this whenever possible. To speak to people about it. To raise the education about stuff like this wherever, whenever we can. I'm trying to do my part.
Good ted talk, but it could be boiled down to how many millions is a billion to blow most people's minds. And even if you know it's a 1000 million, our minds just can't grasp that.
Things can always be boiled down. But the more you boil it down, the more previous knowledge you assume people have in common, and it might happen that they don't understand because they didn't have knowledge you assume they had.
Conversely, if you include too much information, not boil it down enough, you lose people by being bored of getting told things they already know.
In any case, it's not an easy balance and I'm just doing my best here to guess which amount of "boiling down" is "just right". But thanks for your comment, I'll take it into consideration.
A million seconds is 12 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. A trillion seconds is 31,688 years.
Try 100 billion.
For a guy who thinks empathy is a weakness, he sure demands a fucking lot of it for himself.
Left is deeply deeply organized, otherwise it wouldn’t be all the lefties controlling every house, chamber, & office in the land
Says the one actually doing a whole nazi salute, buying presidency despite not being able to hold office due to nationality, carving up entire programs and departments in a very incompetent way, and attempting to shamelessly buy a seat in the supreme court.
And that's not mentioning how I personally believe he may be doing all this due to his God-Iron-Man-Savior complex which makes him believe he'll be remembered as a modern messiah. Notice how he's revived his desire to put mankind on Mars, and by next year no less. He knows under current laws he'd at best help pave the way to Mars, but not live to enjoy it himself. "Maybe if I change the whole rulebook - in the end despite the suffering they'll thank and revere me", I bet.
Poor Elon. I bet he's crying right now for being a misjudged angel, drying his tears in green paper.
Two whole Nazi salutes.
He is named Elon after a character in a novel by Wernher von Braun. The boy had no chance.
How was Errol Musk aware of the book (in 1970 something) if it was unpublished until 2006 ? (According to the wiki link below) ?
Were they doing nazi catch ups with Von Braun in the 60s or something ?
Maybe because of the excerpts that were published in the 1950s?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mars:_A_Technical_Tale#The_%22Elon%22
So the inauguration Hitler salute was AI generated or what?
No, it was real. He is complaining that the left is misrepresenting him by claiming that the Nazi stuff was fake, OBVIOUSLY!
He's admitting that he's a fraud, a fake, a phony.
He obviously just greeted everyone enthusiastically.
It obviously meant "my heart goes out to you"
/s
And by "push negative propaganda", you mean use direct quotes and actual video of you.
Fake nazi stuff?
Yeah, because supporting and claiming the AFD is Germany's only hope (Germany's Nazi Party, which is not called Nazi Party because that would be illegal in Germany) is exactly what a none Nazi would do!
Positive?
Anything?
i was confused as well, i only know the real nazi stuff
As a trans woman, I'm only giving back what he's been dishing out to me - except that when we talk about him, we're actually telling the truth.
On that note, Elon is a whiny nazi pissbaby.
If you were truly telling the actual truth you would need to include at least 4 more negative adjectives in describing Elon.
And that's why you'd never be the richest person. Think about the qualities that lead one to become the richest person on earth. Really think about what that title represents. It's an unfathomable amount of wealth. Any sane, compassionate person would have funneled that into charity work and the well-being of others.
You see what I'm getting at?
Or they’d invest, retiring while traveling and living off the dividends. It’s a sickness.
If you’re rich you can both invest, retire, travel, live off dividends AND donate your money and support the well being of others.
You can do that with like, 10 million usd or even less (1% yearly interest means 100k usd a year), and still have money left over to donate
Musk has about 30 000x that
Yes. We are saying the same thing.
Nah, that's bullshit. You're no fucking saint. The problem with billionaires is you cant possibly live a normal life once you get there. That kind of power corrupts your thoughts, actions, and importantly the way every single person you ever interact with behaves.
If you become a billionaire I'm coming for you.
The thing is... slashing welfare, trying to erase trans people, hoarding billions in government subsidies are positive things in his book.
So.... we're helping him by taking about it? That just feels wrong.
No, he simply can't wrap his head around what's going on
I'm very curious to see how all this whining plays with his fan boys. Doesn't seem very based or chad or whatever the fucking incel children are saying these days.
They’re really going to be upset when their moms lose their social security and get foreclosed on rendering them basement less
Upset, but unwilling to regret their vote admit their part in their moms losing their livelihood or home.
Dude literally posts his stupid thoughts on his own platform. No one is making that shit up and making him type it out. What a dolt.
He won't even apologize for it but instead doubles down. Maybe we should double down on this, too.
Case study in money not buying happiness. Richest man in the world by a wide margin. CONSTANTLY whining and crying about something.
If I had even a billion dollars y'all would never catch my ass on social media on in the public eye at all.
I'd very quickly no longer be a billionaire because I'd be donating to hospitals and trying to build affordable housing and helping people.
It's the most deranged of us that seem to climb by using the people around him as steps. Shit floats.
With that kind of attitude you will never have a billion dollar /s
Not /s, literally
Billionaires have a selection bias
He didn't just get a billion dollars though, its just unrealized gains in stocks, and those stocks represent his influence/control in the company.
If you helped build a company, and were passionate about it, you'd give that all up? If your vision was to build XYZ and you gave up those shares and you knew XYZ wouldn't happen anymore, would you give that all up?
He DID get 300 million dollars from PayPal, and he decided to fund Tesla and build SpaceX and almost lost it all. Was it wrong of him to use all his money to try and build something? (He actually didn't want to build SpaceX but no one wanted to do the inspiration project sending a plant or something to Mars he wanted to do)
We need a way to separate the stock value/holdings from company ownership/influence when companies get this big.
That and not having a working dick.
Sounds like he wants some...... Empathy?
List of positive things that he's done:
Honestly: Being a massive, public spokesperson for electric vehicles that had a huge following with the well-off nerds brought us where we are today with electric cars, I'm still convinced about that. But yeah, that's about the only thing I can think of.
I don't care how positive the apparent outcome; I simply cannot agree with giving somebody credit for propaganda. Because essentially, that's what you're talking about.
We don't need confidence men like Musk or Trump. They have nothing but their own interests in mind. So he accidentally had a small positive influence? Big deal. If he hadn't spoken up, another would've taken his place.
He deserves no credit, just as he deserves no sympathy.
That sounds very black and white. With age I've come to the conclusion that black and white thinking while very satisfying has never led to anything good in my life. I avoid it where possible. It's a bit harder and it can bring me into situations where I don't feel the righteous vigor of being on the correct side, but I find that I've ruined more with that vigor than what I've fixed taking a detail oriented approach.
I do not see any benefit on looking for the illusory middle ground in this case.
It all comes back to the paradox of intolerance I think. If you fail to see an overwhelming every such as fascism in very strict black and white terms, you are not only putting yourself in harms way, you are actively allowing others to come Uber fire as well.
Yes. I approach the issue of Nazi shit stains like Musk in a very black and white perspective. And you should to. In fact, given the context, I find your response honestly deplorable. Even if we forget about Musk and focus on the propaganda issue, your response opens the door to assisting the spread dangerous misinformation that very realistically can cause actual pain and suffering.
Shame on you.
Jeezus christ, kid, I just said that the guy with his attitude and the right target group made EVs cool and therefore created the market back in the 10s. Which enabled the beginning of the EV revolution as we see it today. You make it a personal attack on me. Please be a lot calmer and gentler with other humans in the future.
I make no apology for my tone. However, although I do object strongly to your started position on this matter, I have no quarrel with you as an individual!
And again, any positive effect from his actions was not his goal nor his intent. So giving him credit for that is foolhardy at best. We should stop normalizing putting self absorbed sociopaths on any pedestal, for any reason. Nothing this man has ever done or accomplished is in any way praiseworthy. And we should not encourage him or others who might wish to emulate him, not even unintentionally.
What's wrong with propaganda?
Well, in short, by definition it spreads misinformation. Even if a particular propaganda message is technically truthful, by design the message has been alerted to focus on certain things while obscuring others. In other words, it's not only inherently subjective, but it's designed to be misinterpreted as objective.
Finally, I do not support any of the common causes or ideas that propaganda is usually intended to reinforce (e.g. patriotism sounds harmless, even positive, but largely is used to encourage bigotry and xenophobia).
What's wrong with propaganda? Everything.
all media is propaganda. no org can tell you everything that's happening, every human interest piece, every corporate move, every government policy, etc.
by necessity, they choose stories they think matter or will get clicks. it is up to you to understand the bias inherent in all media and distinguish fact from opinion, and draw your own conclusions.
propaganda, media, whatever you call it, isn't The Truth even if it's true.
so there is nothing wrong inherently with propaganda, even self-aware propaganda.
I take issue with the presence of that bullet. It implies he has the space to have ever done a positive thing.
Oh, no, you see it's just a placeholder for when he dies.
Nazi says what?
Jokes on you...he's far too busy doing Nazi salutes at the nearest mirror to say anything.
Elon "empathy is the great failing of the west" Musk wants people to feel sorry for him?
Musk doesn't think you should care about other people because he doesn't care about other people.
Musk thinks you should care about Elon Musk because he cares about Elon Musk.
Musk does not have the ability to understand that there is a contraction there.
"Evil I think is the absence of empathy"
aren't nazis supposed to hate weakness? oh my god whiny fucking weasel, literally just crying and bitching and moaning constantly... disgusting.
ModernThis is property #8 of fascist ideology.
no no, that's different. you're right, on one hand they claim superiority and on the other they're victims etc... but what I'm talking abouts this sniveling, cowering, tattletale crybaby shit... it just looks and feels so pathetic that I don't understand how they don't look at him and think he's subhuman. I guess he has too much money to kick away.
It's so unfair that everyone keeps referring to his neo Nazi salute that he gave at a neo Nazi convention.
Just so unfair to bringing up his neo Nazi salute constantly. Just patiently unfair to mention his neo Nazi salute he gave twice at the neo Nazi convention.
Just so unfair. Nazi.
Tbf, I don't think you can do anything worse to his reputation than him literally throwing up two Nazi salutes on live tv. At this point, people's opinions lie where they lie, although with a shocking amount being very, very disturbingly positive of him...
I don't disagree with you at all. I think a significant amount of Reddit, Twitter, etc. traffic are wildly inflated by bots that want to push narratives. Why wouldn't they be? It's so easy to do now and costs a minimal amount for the return.
That said, I also know people in real life that dismiss his gesture to him being "autistic" and just "throwing his heart out" even though we have unequivocal video proof of him doing that exact "my heart goes out" gesture in the past that is uh...not a Nazi salute.
I do wonder where the crossover is though. Like, do the people I know who dismiss Elon's clear Nazi behaviour do so due to seeing narratives on the internet that back up the idea of "oh no, he's not a Nazi, it's fine, he's just autistic!!1", or would they have arrived at the same stupid ass conclusion on their own?
And at no point has he attempted to claim it was a mistake. He was just really feeling that heil high.
Oh, why would you mention his neo Nazi salute so publicly? Can't you see he - the neo Nazi - is suffering from his neo Nazi action consequences?
Poorneo Nazi...Nobody accused him of being a fake nazi
Oh so that nazi salute was leftists & liberals simply hallucinating ? Or what about the fact that you (as in Elon) literally tried to Whitewash Hitler's crimes ?
Geee, I wonder why we keep calling you a Nazi.
Yeah, he comes from a nazi family. He knew exactly what he was doing. No need to give him the benefit of the doubt
I engaged with one of his idiot followers who proclaimed Nazis were socialists. I suggested he run that theory by Grok if he was so certain.
Is Grok really that reliable though ?
I haven't used it much but the point was some far right Musk fanboi asserting Nazis were socialist when even Grok, ostensibly under the thumb of Musk, doesn't pretend they are.
That said I wouldn't trust it as an AI and there are plenty of other free AIs to choose from if you want that kind of thing. Install ollama and you can even download and run a bunch offline.
wow been a while since this
Ya and Britney actually didn't deserve all that bs just like none of us deserve to be this old.
Comparison of Nazi salute circa 1940 to Musk salute circa 2025:
Video of repeated Nazi salutes at Trump's Inauguration
Wow, look at that fake nazi in the background smh my head
Itsthesamepicture.jpg
Excessive wealth concentration is an existential threat to humanity on the scale of the atomic bomb or supervolcano.
What positive stuff? Like I'm legitimately asking.
He is cartoonishly evil.
He's not cartoonishly evil until he gets a pet cat and holds it all the time.
Right now he's just evil
See how he trots his son out in public
aka .... his human shield
Also that thing he does with his hands now.
I wouldn't wish that on any cat though
For a short couple years Musk actually was doing legitimate engineering work at SpaceX. Yes it was high level, but it did involve proper work and deep understanding of the systems. And yeah, Shotwell had to stop him from making several critically bad decisions during that time (like canceling Falcon Heavy).
I know all the Musk haters will disagree with me on the idea he did contribute to the engineering, but it’s extremely well documented by both the employees at the time and spaceflight journalists.
But honestly before and after that, I can’t think of anything else he really did at a technical level though.
If this is any way true, then they need to be shut down immediately. He is not an engineer. He does not understand anything. I've heard him speak about things I know and pretend he's knows about, and it's obvious he's a moron.
Sigh, just because he’s a moron about most things doesn’t mean it’s true about everything. Just watch some of his interviews with spaceflight journalists and you’ll see he knows his stuff for a while and then slowly loses it over the years.
Humans have this infuriating habit of believing that because someone is distasteful they must be stupid in every possible way, but this is very rarely true. Oh, I wholeheartedly agree that he’s remarkably stupid, and I agree that at this time he knows very little about what’s going on at SpaceX, but you are ignoring the evidence if you believe it has always been this way.
Let’s be better than this and actually look at the facts, not the emotional reaction. You’ll come to the same conclusion either way - Musk is a horrible human being who has no right being anywhere near government, or even industry for that matter.
What kind of engineering work? That's a really broad category.
Like, are we talking aerospace engineering? Software engineering? Systems engineering?
I don't think the interviews angle means anything. Just because he was able to convince a journalist he knew the right words doesn't mean that he was actually contributing to the actual engineering of the rockets. If he spent 20 hours a week in engineering meetings, he might have absorbed enough to talk intelligently about it.
I also wouldn't give much credit to employees saying that he did engineering work. This is the same guy who bought the title of "founder" when he bought Tesla, and loves using NDAs to muzzle people.
I'm not saying I have doubts about his actual engineering because I think he's an asshole so he must be an idiot. I'm saying it because I've never heard him say anything technical that wasn't basically Star Trek technobabble, and at the same time I have seen him do a lot of shady things to make it seem like he's more involved than he is.
My feeling is that he sort of lives for creating impressions like this, so people treat him as if he is, well Tony Stark basically. He gets off on that. And that is also why he is so obsessed by getting respect from the gamer, nerd, and geek communities. So fuelled by this motivation, he reads a lot on technical topics and is intelligent enough to absorb the superficial level details. Superficial but nevertheless enough to impress people who don't know any technical details (journalists) and enough to impress engineers etc too because they are surprised to see that he knows anything at all on a technical topic of their expertise. I have had the same feelings before, if someone which I know is unrelated to my field comes and talks about some basic technical details of it, I get a mixture of surprised feelings and respect. But all it really takes to get that information is just reading some wikipedia articles.
Okay but is he doing any work in SpaceX now?
Let's paint with a broad brush and say everything you said is true and completely ignore the part where he has to be stopped from making stupid decisions. Let's give him so much rope that we can ignore it.
What good stuff is he doing now? Like is he feeding the homeless? Hell, I'll take doing the dishes when it isn't his turn.
I genuinely want to know what he considers "good things he's doing".
Not as far as I can tell, he’s doing squat other than tweeting and dismantling the government at the present. And he’s fried his brain with drugs so far it’s going to be impossible to recover.
The left trying to destroy the influence of a plutocrat is pretty normal
Bro maybe you're just a fucking loser
How is he this dense? Seriously dude you could be the greatest hero the world has ever seen but you chose to be a villain.
He's still a hero in his own mind, thinking "Can't people see I'm trying to improve society? Sure, several million people might lose everything and maybe die, but you can't make an omelet without breaking a few eggs. It's for the greater good!" Now he's shocked the few million people scheduled for demolition strongly disagree.
"Fake nazi stuff" lol. Elon Musk has no skills at all for dealing with people who aren't on his payroll and don't have to kiss his spoiled rotten ass lol
Elon Musk is text book example of a complete sociopath. He lacks empathy, he chronically lies and manipulates people, extremely impulsive, has no behavior control, has no idea about what is right and what is wrong, is extremely aggressive and hostile (called Tim Walz a loser, the cave rescuer as Pedo), has superficial charm to fool MAGAs, and consistently breaks and defies rules and laws.
The first man to unite the left on anything.
List 5 positive things you did last week.
Positive for my interests or what?
He's so sad, it's kinda remarkable. He's like the epitome of a narcissistic billionaire CEO.
The insecurity is palpable. I sincerely hope this will be remembered and studied.
Do we get banned here if we insinuate we need another Luigi?
Bruh, Luigi did nothing wrong. He was here with me pounding Coors Lights and swapping out the tranny on my F150 Raptor the whole time.
But if you want someone murdered, you can say that.
.world was banning people for it right around when it happened by then they backed off. I'd be a little careful when posting stuff like that on .world but other instances are fine with it.
It depends on the instance and sub, but overall it's a lot less likely than on Reddit.
MTG would be saying the "Demonrats" and liberals were using their space laser or weather control machine.
The religious folk that eat this shit up basically sort things as such:
1.) If it's good for me or who I like: God's blessing
2.) If it's bad for me or who I like: The Devil did it.
3.) If it's not all bad for me or who I like: It's part of God's plans/He works in mysterious ways.
If Elon were hit with lightning, even if he was in the middle of a thunderstorm holding a giant metal rod while standing on the roof of a skyscraper they'd say someone they didn't like did it.
Show us your titties Elon, you little bitch
Talk is just talk. What you DO is what you get called out on. Loser
There’s nothing fake about a public Seig heil x2
So he thinks he is a Fake Nazi as well, real ones were good at making cars, it's rumoured.
Musk is that kid in middle school who went out of his way to act smug and edgy in a desperate attempt to impress the other kids but it was all so cringey and irritating that it just made everyone hate him, but he was so dysfunctional that all he could do was try even harder to be smug and edgy, which just made the other kids hate him even more, and 'round and 'round it went until finally somebody decked him and then his mom complained to the administration because the other kids were bullying her baby.
You're make this sound like it's a metaphor or something...
But Musk is that kid literally, and last year one of the other billionaires did try to fight him for being unbearable until his mom literally stepped in and helped him back out
He's a rich manchild who people put up with when he let them play with his cool toys. Then he went from the weird rich kid to a total asshole the second he thought this was loyalty... Now he's crying about being bullied because everyone is turning against him, despite continuing to fuck absolutely everyone over
It's funny because Obama and Biden went their whole terms without a single time being associated with Nazism
His tears are fuel, I woke up tired, but now I feel energized to go troll Elon some more....
Elon. C'mon...give us a little salute. You know you want to.
Man, who would have thought that throwing a Nazi salute, and then when people point it out, making a bunch of Nazi jokes instead of denying it would get you labeled a Nazi?
That's the damning part for me. If it really was a screw up, why would you not immediately say "Oops, that was not what I intended! I just got caught up in the moment and definitely was not trying to give a Nazi salute!" Like, I'd still hate the guy because he's got a shitty ego, but I wouldn't consider him a full-on Nazi. People make grand gestures when in front of a crowd, and let's face it, a Nazi salute is not exactly a complicated gesture. I can see someone making that mistake when they're just trying to be animated.
But he didn't deny it! He instead went on Twitter and immediately started saying shit like "I did Nazi that coming." What the fuck did you expect would happen?
I’m not so sure being ok with Nazis if they had better PR is a good take.
He wants to save us from the tyranny of check notes trans people existing and women having basic rights.
If he wasn't rich, he'd be an incel, Dude just radiates those nice guy vibes.
If people were truly trying to destroy his influence, he wouldn't be around for much longer.
There is a video. Two Nazi salutes. Denial is just a blatant lie.
The richest man on the face of the planet is actually a victim.
He's going to break down now that literally the entire non-maga world loathes him. lol.
Aw gee, does somebody want some empathy? Somebody who says that empathy is the big problem in the USA?
If you call fact checking, calling out your lies and listing facts negative propaganda, then sure. And it's not "fake" nazi stuff, it's just nazi stuff.
What a pathetic manchild
Bullying and whining are two things that are not what a real man would do. Speaks volumes of Elon and Trump.
If it’s so fake, why did he say that the German neonazi party is the only hope for Germany?
I loved his whining a few weeks back that he hadn't "physically harmed" anybody and the implication that all the haters were big meanies. Meanwhile his minions at his direction were slashing programs that were saving people's lives through their existence - health, welfare, medical research, disease prevention, pollution & air quality, road safety, food aid etc.
So did he straight up murder people? No, he did it indirectly. But he may as well have. Thousands and thousands of people will die because of him. But let's all feel sorry for the billionaire douchebag who never cared about anyone else once in his entire life.
Its ben proven he did the salute to gain favor with maga. So this is all lies by association
"Lugenpresse"
Uh huh. Fucking Nazi.
Name one good thing you've done in the last year, Melon Husk.
I like the style of that crying face emoji; anyone know where I can find the pack?
I'm happy to push anti Elon musk propaganda. I actually don't, I just do anti trump/Republican propaganda
The tears of a clown.
I mean he's not wrong about the first part. But as for the second part, the Nazi stuff and lack of anything positive is more cause than effect. Third part depends on the eye of the beholder.
It's weird how Elon is crashing out so hard. I would have thought he'd just be eating up the negativity, as he clearly wants attention.
Nazi cunt says what?
You shouldn't have any influence. You're no more deserving then a used car salesmen or a mlm founder.
In terms of knowledge and experience.
"The mercy that was quick in us but late By your own counsel is suppressed and killed. You must not dare, for shame, to talk of mercy, For your own reasons turn into your bosoms, As dogs upon their masters, worrying you."
Play stupid games win stupid prizes. Aka FAFO
No matter how rich he gets he will always be a sniveling little brat.
Sure you are doing good things. You're also doing bad things. They are not mutually exclusive, dumbass.