That was basically the end. When it was only friends and the feed sorted by "new,", it was super fun. When my aunts started joining it became much less fun.
Yeah, and it went from "let's just add some stuff" to outright "we will force feed you this slop and you will like it" from there. It felt like you were a goose being prepped for Christmas' foie gras.
Facebook was a MySpace alternative for “academics” (college students / alums) instead of teens.
LinkedIn was a MySpace alternative for “professionals” instead of teens.
Forums were an evolution of BBSs that predated “social” media because it wasn’t you, it was an avatar, a fake persona you created rather than “first name,” “last name.”
ICQ and Skype were purely chat platforms, competing in a completely different space.
I have no idea what point this rant is trying to make but all the comparisons between services are way off base.
but all the comparisons between services are way off base.
My experience in Russia. No, they are not off base. Just naturally there are different PoVs and for you it may be something entirely else. You can think about that before saying something is wrong.
MySpace
Say, I'm not sure many people even knew of that where I am.
Forums were an evolution of BBSs that predated “social” media because it wasn’t you, it was an avatar, a fake persona you created rather than “first name,” “last name.”
People using real names in the Web were the weird ones, but it was normal to meet IRL those you know via forums.
I have no idea what point this rant is trying to make
I'm 41.....you telling me the kids today don't think of me as the greatest person who ever existed??? Pssshhh that's malarkey! I won't hear of it! EVERYONE thinks I'm the greatest person who ever existed! My lexicon includes words like "malarkey" and "lexicon"! Kids think that's cool right???
Ah, the curse of algorithmic social network. It’s full of angry middle-aged men if you follow those / interact with them. There are / were big communities formed around various pop stars on Twitter and those are quite different demographics.
That is a weird way of describing it. Teens aren't "abandoning" FB & X; they never signed up to begin with. And why would that? They are platforms built for and filled with millennials+.
Look at the graph in the article: it’s the only newsworthy piece. Assuming the numbers are legit, the lines crossed about 6 years ago.
Of course the x axis not having any labeled points there doesn’t fill me with confidence. Perhaps it’s just two points for each and they drew a straight line
Yes, although to nowhere near the same extent as Facebook and Instagram.
The chats are E2EE using Signal's encryption protocol, so very good.
But they will certainly mine everything else they can get. They may not know what you're saying, but they do know who you're talking to, when you're doing it, your contacts, your profile pic, how often you send images, etc. any web links with tracking info embedded in the URL will likely be tracked too, once you open them.
Honestly, I think they just saw that Whatsapp was becoming the standard chat app for basically all of the world outside of the US and China, and just didn't want anybody else to have it.
Additionally, metadata is better than no data, I guess.
If you go only by the metadata, they know all your friends, their phone numbers, your location history, when do you chat, with whom, how often and how long. And I'm fairly sure they index conversation in some form.
Just location history can paint a decent picture of what you do, where do you go, what do you like, which friends are nearby, etc... and all of that was implemented like 15+ years ago, imagine what they can do today with AI. It's fair to say FB knows more about you then you do (FB, IG, Wapp...). And to be blunt, it could probably determine what ppls shit smells like, judging by all the pictures of a meal they post on IG.
That's just it, Facebook is kinda the default option, and almost everyone has an account there. It's why so many clubs arrange everything through a Facebook page.
It might be that I’m looking at this from a US perspective. Craig’s list has been a bit rough when I’ve tried it. Scammy and shadier people. I hope you’ve had better experiences here than me.
I found cash converters out of the UK. Is that correct? It seemed comparable to a pawn shop at first glance.
WhatsApp has channels (public feeds centered around topics, a bit like microblogging), communities (groups about a subject, much like Facebook Groups), and updates (temporal video/photo statuses to share with your friends). You might only use it for DM, but it has much bigger aspirations.
My family has a signal group. I started it two years ago.
Almost no one pays any attention to it, unless they accidentally open the app once a month, but they're all still there and can be spoken to.
I put a PSA out a month ago that I'll no longer respond on Facebook Messenger or SMS after the turn of the year. Tough shit. There was some groaning but, if there's no other way, either use Signal or invest in a Pigeon coop and get training.
RCS is shit, with SMS at least my phone comes with a messenger and I can download one from F-Droid. With RCS only one proprietary app supports it and it functions weirdly on GrapheneOS. In its current state it's practically a downgrade at this point and considering how bad SMS is that says a lot.
Gee I wish they had just left Facebook as a way to share photos and updates with friends and family, instead of turning it into a viral content clusterfuck to capture the youth audience. It didn’t even work.
They’ve been trying to ban it for awhile now, so no. They want to ban it because they can’t directly control the companies that own those platforms overseas whereas Facebook, IG, etc. are very much able to be controlled if necessary by those in power
It's a delicate topic. TikTok collects a ton of data from devices and infers a ton of data from watching patterns. This is really true of most of the modern web apps, but especially true of TikTok because the short-form means more content to churn through, and the algorithm is practically an IV drip of dopamine.
The much, much more important issues are user privacy and truth-in-media, and is something that just as well needs to be pointed at Meta and Twitter and Reddit and Google. TikTok is probably more critical at the present moment, because it's run by a country our president-elect wants to start a trade-war with, and they've got quite an upper hand with all the data that we, the users, give them for free, via a propaganda machine under their control.
I think teens abandoned Facebook like 10 years ago
Surely longer ago than that? Facebook hasn't been cool for probably over 15 years
Has FB been cool since they got rid of signups limited by .edu email addresses?
That was basically the end. When it was only friends and the feed sorted by "new,", it was super fun. When my aunts started joining it became much less fun.
Yeah, and it went from "let's just add some stuff" to outright "we will force feed you this slop and you will like it" from there. It felt like you were a goose being prepped for Christmas' foie gras.
That's when it was cool to teens who didn't have .edu emails addresses (but not long after).
You had a good year or two after that and then it went to shit.
It went downhill when poking and sheep throwing went away.
Poking is still there. I'm trying to bring it back.
I never stopped
Teens stopped using Facebook in 2015.
“In the beginning:”
Facebook was a MySpace alternative for “academics” (college students / alums) instead of teens.
LinkedIn was a MySpace alternative for “professionals” instead of teens.
Forums were an evolution of BBSs that predated “social” media because it wasn’t you, it was an avatar, a fake persona you created rather than “first name,” “last name.”
ICQ and Skype were purely chat platforms, competing in a completely different space.
I have no idea what point this rant is trying to make but all the comparisons between services are way off base.
My experience in Russia. No, they are not off base. Just naturally there are different PoVs and for you it may be something entirely else. You can think about that before saying something is wrong.
Say, I'm not sure many people even knew of that where I am.
People using real names in the Web were the weird ones, but it was normal to meet IRL those you know via forums.
Your failure, not mine.
Because Whatsapp is totally not owned by FB.
It’s not about why owns it. It’s about where young people can be without getting bothered by their parents and other old people.
I'm 41.....you telling me the kids today don't think of me as the greatest person who ever existed??? Pssshhh that's malarkey! I won't hear of it! EVERYONE thinks I'm the greatest person who ever existed! My lexicon includes words like "malarkey" and "lexicon"! Kids think that's cool right???
I'm 39 so I am slightly more rizz than you. I maintain my levels of brat by regularly updating my skibidi vocab.
Yo, your lexicon is making my malarkey happy
Clearly you young people are fine being on Lemmy with old people
That's about phone number requirement for signup. Not about platforms.
OK. Life is life.
I've just had a traumatic memory of one young person, a girl (with possibly undiagnosed ASPD), from 13 years ago.
Feel nausea and want to throw up every time thinking about that kind of places, dynamics, emotions.
Where there any teens on Twitter? Last I was there it was full of angry middle-age men.
before musk came it was pretty full, most of them have moved to threads
Ah, the curse of algorithmic social network. It’s full of angry middle-aged men if you follow those / interact with them. There are / were big communities formed around various pop stars on Twitter and those are quite different demographics.
The Internet- where men are men...
Men? Wait, yall aren't dogs using the internet while the humans are away at work?
Yall are dogs to right?
It's pretty clear. Facebook is now full of crap created by artificial intelligence (and not only).
Tiktok is as well.
463k people actually liked that photo?
It's a video
That's even worse
That is a weird way of describing it. Teens aren't "abandoning" FB & X; they never signed up to begin with. And why would that? They are platforms built for and filled with millennials+.
A decade ago is when teens stopped using Facebook, unless they're counting Instagram in those metrics?
then they would have to count WhatsApp too...
Look at the graph in the article: it’s the only newsworthy piece. Assuming the numbers are legit, the lines crossed about 6 years ago.
Of course the x axis not having any labeled points there doesn’t fill me with confidence. Perhaps it’s just two points for each and they drew a straight line
Isn't whatsapp another data mining app for Facebook?
Yes, although to nowhere near the same extent as Facebook and Instagram.
The chats are E2EE using Signal's encryption protocol, so very good.
But they will certainly mine everything else they can get. They may not know what you're saying, but they do know who you're talking to, when you're doing it, your contacts, your profile pic, how often you send images, etc. any web links with tracking info embedded in the URL will likely be tracked too, once you open them.
This still baffles me. What's Facebook's end game here? They are built on data collection and spying, but they own an app that is E2EE.
Honestly, I think they just saw that Whatsapp was becoming the standard chat app for basically all of the world outside of the US and China, and just didn't want anybody else to have it.
Additionally, metadata is better than no data, I guess.
If you go only by the metadata, they know all your friends, their phone numbers, your location history, when do you chat, with whom, how often and how long. And I'm fairly sure they index conversation in some form.
Just location history can paint a decent picture of what you do, where do you go, what do you like, which friends are nearby, etc... and all of that was implemented like 15+ years ago, imagine what they can do today with AI. It's fair to say FB knows more about you then you do (FB, IG, Wapp...). And to be blunt, it could probably determine what ppls shit smells like, judging by all the pictures of a meal they post on IG.
The metadata. The message content is E2E, but the data about the content isn’t necessarily e2e.
Good point. Figuring out who is talking to who is valuable info for them too.
Yes
Ok, I feel old. The only reason facebook has any relevance to me is the market place. What’s the best alternative?
That's just it, Facebook is kinda the default option, and almost everyone has an account there. It's why so many clubs arrange everything through a Facebook page.
Craigslist, cash converters
It might be that I’m looking at this from a US perspective. Craig’s list has been a bit rough when I’ve tried it. Scammy and shadier people. I hope you’ve had better experiences here than me.
I found cash converters out of the UK. Is that correct? It seemed comparable to a pawn shop at first glance.
I've heard it from dankpods a Australian channel
Okay? But what does Whatsapp has anything to do with the other? DM?
I don't consider WhatsApp social media.
WhatsApp has channels (public feeds centered around topics, a bit like microblogging), communities (groups about a subject, much like Facebook Groups), and updates (temporal video/photo statuses to share with your friends). You might only use it for DM, but it has much bigger aspirations.
My family has a signal group. I started it two years ago.
Almost no one pays any attention to it, unless they accidentally open the app once a month, but they're all still there and can be spoken to.
I put a PSA out a month ago that I'll no longer respond on Facebook Messenger or SMS after the turn of the year. Tough shit. There was some groaning but, if there's no other way, either use Signal or invest in a Pigeon coop and get training.
RCS ain't universal. I only have it with some iPhone users and the rare Pixel.
If it's what's for dinner, I don't care. Musk can know I had some hamburger steak.
If it's the code to your tablet, mom, ask on Signal.
RCS is shit, with SMS at least my phone comes with a messenger and I can download one from F-Droid. With RCS only one proprietary app supports it and it functions weirdly on GrapheneOS. In its current state it's practically a downgrade at this point and considering how bad SMS is that says a lot.
This is news? The article’s own graph puts this about 6 years ago
WhatsApp? The instant messenger boomers use on their phones?
Damn, who saw that coming.
american, right? It's very popular in other places.
Most countries stopped using SMS ages ago. WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram are ubiquitous.
I WISH signal was ubiquitous. Half of my friends are still using Facebook Messenger so I still have to resort to using SMS for them
SMS for everybody not on a self-hostable encrypted messenger. Why fool oneself into thinking a US managed messenger is private?
Belgian?
Is Belgium known for using Messenger?
I thought so, but that might be 10 years ago and in Flanders, so… 🤷♂️
Spotted the iMessage user who routinly cries about dot colour
telegram is one of the worst, privacy wise.
"an iPhone which most youth dont have"
i see you dont live in north america
telegram is for pedos and this one guy i know uses it and i question his motives
I know alot of people in my city and its one of the biggest in north america and they have never heard of it.
In most of Europe WhatsApp is synonymous with text messaging.
Also in South Asia and the Middle East.
Yeah, the other instant messenger owned by Facebook
Weird, considering facebook does all the shit those other sites do.
People go where their friends are. Their grandparents are on Facebook.
Teens are on Facebook?
How else you gonna cyber bully the transfer student
well Facebook still owns them and will own them when they all switch to instagram reels like America wants them to do
Gee I wish they had just left Facebook as a way to share photos and updates with friends and family, instead of turning it into a viral content clusterfuck to capture the youth audience. It didn’t even work.
Craigslist eventually got rid of personals, give it a decade
I guess I'll never know what the kids are saying ever again because there's no way I'm installing either of those apps.
No teens on blue sky, nice
I had to block a few ones on Bluesky.
Sadly Elon Musk remains a threat to us all.
Gyna
it's why politicians want to ban it
They’ve been trying to ban it for awhile now, so no. They want to ban it because they can’t directly control the companies that own those platforms overseas whereas Facebook, IG, etc. are very much able to be controlled if necessary by those in power
It's a delicate topic. TikTok collects a ton of data from devices and infers a ton of data from watching patterns. This is really true of most of the modern web apps, but especially true of TikTok because the short-form means more content to churn through, and the algorithm is practically an IV drip of dopamine.
The much, much more important issues are user privacy and truth-in-media, and is something that just as well needs to be pointed at Meta and Twitter and Reddit and Google. TikTok is probably more critical at the present moment, because it's run by a country our president-elect wants to start a trade-war with, and they've got quite an upper hand with all the data that we, the users, give them for free, via a propaganda machine under their control.
Isn't whatsapp for old people? Drag uses Discord instead. It's not great, but at least it doesn't hack your phone.
As much as I dislike Whatsapp and love Discord. Private messages in Whatsapp are encrypted while Discord messages are entirely collected