Ha, fuck you. My life was destroyed by disability, and the only drug that was helping me went from $250 a month to $3000 a month between 2015 to 2017. Everything got worse, to the point I can’t even afford to live.

This especially pisses me off.

Fuck you Vance and fuck everything you just said. It’s all lies.

Walz: "Well I don't run Facebook and Trump lost."

"Under Kamala Harris' leadership."

I wish Walz would say that JOE BIDEN IS THE FUCKING PRESIDENT.

I will say that I worry about Vance as a candidate when he’s no longer directly tied to Trump and his madness. He’s the face of non-truth leading to fascism.

"Did he lose the 2020 election?"

"OH YEAH?!?! Well did Kamala Harris censor people?"

vance won't answer if trump lost the 2020 election. oh its the lauph into cry now. man he is so weasily.

"Should we force catholic hospitals to do abortions?"

No. Because there shouldn't be catholic hospitals.

It's crazy how... like. Normal? This debate is. I mean they obviously disagree on stuff, but there's at least a baseline of respect here so far.

"She hasn't accomplished what she set out to do in three years" is kind of weird for the running mate of the guy who accomplished fuck all in terms of his campaign promises for four.

Vance after the Debate

Listening to these idiotic "uncommitted voters" in the focus group are the absolute worse. It's a collection of people that love the attention of being an indecisive moron.

Vance lies like he breathes, but he isn’t mentally addled like Trump. He’s a threat. A long term threat.

Attacking Walz on his military record while Vance had a mostly clerical job, never saw combat, was of a lower rank and was in the military for 4 years compared to 24 years? Bold move...

To Vance's credit, he's doing a monumental amount of damage control and sanewashing for Donald Trump and is doing a decent job at it. Yes Vance is lying through his teeth with each answer but he is markedly better at keeping his cool compared to the former Narcissist-in-Chief against VP Harris. It's a position Walz wouldn't envy. So overall I think this is within the best range of events Vance could expect.

They both did well at acknowledging each other and keeping this like a somewhat normal debate, can you imagine. That said, if any viewer can hold a thought without focusing solely on whatever deflection each candidate is doing, Walz is giving better answers, and Vance is putting way more false equivalencies in.

Walz is doing very well with his answers, he's not as calculated and rehearsed as Harris, and you know having a heart makes you mess up more than the recently changed telephone options menu, but he is doing a fantastically better job at connecting with voters than Vance did. Walz's jabs are quick and easily missed ("Wharton") but even with apolitical people, if they understand Walz's language then they'll get when he is jabbing at Vance.

Obviously I was hoping Vance would fold up into a chair and was disappointed for that to not happen. More than that though is that I'm crossing my fingers the news cycle doesn't begin pretending it's a normal election cycle just because the VP candidates could actually look each other in the eye for a night. Idk, give it 48hours and Trump will be starved enough of attention to break the spell and make people glare at him again in disgust.

Walz drove it home on the threat to democracy, and Vance had nothing to respond.

Vance: I did wanna answer your question, because you did ask it...

Narrator: He did not answer her question.

Walz should have just called it out right there: your running mate is a reality denying narcissist, and you're his lapdog. You won't say he lost because you're scared daddy will yell at you if you do.

It just occurred to be that Vance is running for president not VP. I don't think he thinks Trump will get through his term if elected.

Vance digging deep into the reddit school of debate. ‘Explain to me how my lie is untrue please. I’ll derail all other talk until then.’

“Why won’t you rebut my lies?”

“They aren’t true”

“Ok but like why won’t you explain how?”

Vance literally said nothing about Trump's healthcare plan. They still have nothing.

A little more than an hour in...

Vance has been exactly as polished as expected, other than a slightly rough start coming off as robotic. He's managed a few genuinely human-seeming moments, too, especially upon learning that one of Walz's kids witnessed a shooting. But he's been lying nearly constantly.

Walz isn't as polished, but he's been doing much better in that department than I would have expected, while still coming off as very nice and genuine. He's had a couple of flubs, but none of them were debate killers, while he's gotten in far more actual hits than Vance, by far. Like, it's not even close.

There's another thing: Vance is legitimately boring to listen to. I didn't realize this before, but his voice could be used as a sleep aid.

I'm biased. I'll own that. So take from this what you will: I think Walz is winning. It's close, but I think he's coming off as more honest and more real, while Vance is coming off as dishonest and plastic.

Who is banning books right now JD?!?

“We have well developed views on public policy so we don’t have to prepare that much,” Vance said in a Teamsters press call on Wednesday morning. “We feel a lot more confident and frankly, you don’t have to prepare if you don’t have to hide what you say.”

-Jd "we make stuff up" Vance

😂🤣😂🤣

Vance: "Women don't trust us because we are against abortion. We'll make them trust us by making fertility treatments more accessible."

What?

The housing shortage is caused by illegal immigrants and not drilling for oil? I have no words.

lol Vance did not want to answer that elector question.

LOL! "Thank you, senator, for describing the legal process."

The pregnant pause from the moderator followed by her mystified question made me laugh out loud.

What a crazy attack from Vance, why isn't the Vice President fixing the housing crisis? Wasn't Trump President and didn't fix real issues with in his purview.

Vance: "The white guys shooting up schools with legally purchased guns are the fault of immigrants."

“NRA used to teach gun safety” is a great line for purple states.

I did it. I opened a private tab and checked Truth Social. Trump is obsessed with Walz misspeaking on school shooters. He also screamed in all caps that he would veto a national abortion ban. Also his usual weird fixation with the moderators’ ratings in other shows, and still asserting that anyone who said he lost in 2020 is lying.

I'll be asleep which I suppose I should be thankful for (I've already voted by mail as an overseas voter). I'm still disappointed about the whole fact-check thing.

Finally Waltz telling him the VP isn't responsible, Congress is. I think he's slipped that in a couple times now.

"from AOC to Dick Cheney to Taylor Swift."

Taylor Swift confirmed more right-wing than Cheney!1!

I'm enjoying the fact that CBS brought receipts about Vance's past statements about Donald Trump.

No, you dick. Walz was right and everything you said wasn’t true. Everything got worse under trump, and I have fucking receipts.

Wait there’s more? I am going to bed.

Mics got cut. Nice.

"Do you want to support Catholic hospitals to perform abortions against their will?" FUCKING YES.

Guns are flowing into the United States from Mexico?

Wat??!

Vance: “Our policies aren’t our policies. We actually support your favored policies. You’re not allowed to fact check me. I’ll go back to our real policies tomorrow.”

Guns go from the US to Mexico, not the other way. Another blatant lie.

Vance is trying really hard to convince people they're getting paid better than they did before Trump.

Damn I was a bit worried that we weren't going to get the decisive soundbite, but all anyone is going to talk about tomorrow is going to be the "did Donald Trump lose?" mic drop. Absolutely savage.

Maybe let’s fund national health care!

Housing too expensive? DRILL BABY DRILL!!

"Our number one export cannot be topsoil" - Walz

That is a hell of a good line.

I’m a knucklehead at times.

Girl, same.

walz is getting so annoyed at vance bald face laws. vance trying to distort walzs own law. man walz is doing a good job of restraining himself though.

How is it Kamala Harris's policies!? She's not the president! How much power does Vance think the Vice President wields!?

"I don't really want to talk about the 2020 election, so Google sucks and also Tulsi Gabbard and RFK, Jr. likes me."

Jd vance: the biggest threat to democracy is censorship

Fucking wild take

Electric bills are what he thinks Americans are worried about right now? Really?

Kind of interesting that the "get under his skin" thing is kind being deployed against Walz a bit here. He's not Trump, so he's not flying off the handle, but he's losing his cool occasionally. I actually think that could work in his favor if he can channel it effectively. I think an angry Walz, within reason, could be really effective to counter robo-vance.

Walz is knocking it out of the park on guns.

Fuck that "I've become friends with school shooters" misspeak is gonna be clipped to hell isn't it

Morning after thoughts:

• Walz is not actually a bad debater. He's not polished and practiced, but his command of policy and numbers means he still comes across as fairly confident. He knows what he knows, and that can stand in for polish.
• Vance didn't do badly, but I genuinely can't remember any of his answers, and that's kind of weird. I think it's because he answered like he'd been raised by a generative AI instead of human parents. Seriously, can anyone actually remember anything he said, without looking it up?
• Walz had more flubs. But he also got in a lot more hits. It remains to be seen which will stick in the minds of voters more, if either.
• The lack of Trump on the stage made this one a lot more mature. It's amazing what a difference it makes when one of the debaters isn't a demented man-baby.

The way I see it, Walz's clearly superior command of policy details, and the way that fact-checkers are counting nearly everything Vance said as a lie, gives Walz the technical win, while Vance gets the nod for being more polished. In the end, I don't think this debate will matter much to the election.

Those with an interest in history might remember that back during the 1988 election, Lloyd Bentsen absolutely demolished Dan Quayle, George H.W. Bush's pick for VP, in a debate. But it was forgotten in a matter of days - if not hours - and Bush went on to win handily.

I think this debate will likely be forgotten soon, too.

"You say trust the experts, but experts are wrong sometimes and Trump thinks with his gut brain and also I have kids." -- Vance

I feel like Walz's answer re: The ACA is his best response so far.

FYI, parody accounts are firing up, don't get suckered:

Jack Kimble is a parody account.

https://x.com/JakeSherman/status/1841151195198435344

California doesn't have a 54th district:

https://www.jackkimble.com/home

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/California%27s_congressional_districts

you want to help people to afford babies vance. how about funding education nationally with three meals provided each day. oh and maybe healthcare. that would help.

Does anyone think this "she's the vice president, so why didn't she implement these policies" thing convinces anyone?

I’m beginning to think he doesn’t even have a family… he brings them up at the weirdest times.

ok im getting some chuckles now. vance. "pamela harris as the sitting vice president". well there is a phrase you never hear because the vice president as an advisory role and to continue the polocies if they take over so its not to disruptive. my lucifer he is an idiot (yes I already knew)

Many women who want families or already have families are devastated by your draconian ‘care’.

How are you wrong? In every single way, Vance. Just like on nearly everything, you have no empathy and can only see black and white when the world is many shades of grey.

Vance just appears like a slick televangelist. Smarmy.

Fuck you, you don’t know difficult.

I don’t know how much more of Vance’s bullshit I can listen to. And especially his church bullshit. We’re not all young girls (my son is 27) wanting to be livestock in a church community. Some of us are atheists. But I guess I should just go die because I’m not useful anymore.

Take a shot every time Walz says something reasonable and Vance give the camera that “are you buying this shit” grin.

Oh nice! Walz mentioned Wall Street speculators driving up housing prices. Then he literally quoted the Bible.

"Were not going to fix this listening to experts, we need to listen to common sense." - Running mate of the old man yelling about immigrants eating pets.

vance keeps going with that bs that obamacare was not working till trump fixed it. it was doing great till they kicked out the leg. they do need ot not allow companies to own more than one leg of healthcare though (looking at you cvs)

Vance: Smoke and mirrors, we want to do better.... but we won't.

Did you know that JD Vance has "three beautiful kids?" Because he's told us three times. I'm wondering if he knows their names.

LOL! "All Trump has said is that he wants to debate whether or not he won the 2020 election." Sure, JD. Sure.

vance is hilarious suggesting you get rid of the workers by deporting them. Obama showed you have to go after the employers which actually works.

Phew. This debate does not have enough pee breaks.

“Where is the firewall?!?” Well put, Walz. Well put.

Vance: "We can't tell you what the concepts of the healthcare plan are because it's boring."

No kids here, but I have many nieces and nephews, and it makes me so depressed to think of a school run like a police state.

Immigrants making almost nothing and sending everything they make (after taxes) back home and living with 10 people in a small apartment are the problem? Not Blackrock and corporate landlords buying everything on the market?

I love the way vance/trump likes to take credit for the economy they inherited and then blew up just as they left. if, satan forbid, trump got in again any successes will be on the coattails of biden. my devil it still drives me nuts what he did with interest rates which is a dead simple thing for a president to do, which is not to pressure or interfere with the fed.

one thing I love is walz matter of fact way with things. some people villify regulation but you want to be able to have time to get out of your house if theres a fire. I love hearing a debate with quotes like that. point out the dumb.

Moderator: "How long should companies pay for family medical leave?"

Walz: "That's negotiable."

Vance: "What if their church wants to pay them for childcare?!"

"I've been consistent" says JD.

Consistently lying.

Sorry... what? Houses are expensive because of diesel fuel prices?

This has been such a tame debate that the argument my neighbors are having about one of them masturbating to much distracted me.

Pikachu face

Pass the bill!

This is probably the best moment of this debate.

Oh yeah, tariffs. Please, increase inflation for all of us who can’t even afford shit now.

And your orange god sources his shitty Wish watches from China, what are you talking about?!?

I was unaware that the vice president directly controls food prices.

Vance won't answer the question about the 2020 election fraud by trump

Stronger locks!!

Good lord, what a moron.

Random thought: I wonder if that 23-and-me data gets bought up by the healthcare industry when they go under. 🤔 I wonder what they will do with it when they can know if predisposed to heart disease…

oh he is ducking the will he certify results as a vice president. ok so I got two good laughs.

PBS pundits are complaining that they were too nice to each other and agreed with each other too much. Sigh.

Okay, guys. I get it. You're both way into Jesus.

Moderator: "How do you stop gun violence?"

Vance: "Stronger windows in schools!"

Senator Vance, are you a traitor?

Forget everything I said before. I have a new answer now. I will go back to my old answer the second I step off of this stage. You aren’t allowed to fact check me.

walz is owning this one. he is doing great and vance goes between evading and just lying. Hes better and more consistent with his lies which makes this no where near as entertaining as the presidential debate.

Will the fly be there to fact-check?

I can’t watch anymore. Vance is riling me up too much and I’m not seeing enough pushback.

Cheers all, it’s been … interesting.

Well, what about Facebook though? What about censorship? What about that baby hippo on Tiktok? What about Flintstones vitamins?

We'll have tremendous healthcare, and I'll make China pay for it!

Solar panels from China make “dirty” clean energy, while American fossil fuels create “clean” dirty energy.

did vance just say he thought the american people don't know much about him or waltz???

How will we handle child care at a federal level?

Vance: Long stream of bullshit, followed by “give federal money to churches.” Tax credit? Paid leave? Fuck you.

Thank god, they actually muted!

Vance: "Build the wall."

Yeah, no... I don't think you understand how big the southern border is or what terrain it's on, pal.

Vance, that's Congresses job not the vice presidents

here we go. hold onto your buts.

Vance is now pro-abortion exceptions? Are you kidding me?

Edit: typo

I really hope Walz hammers Vance on women’s rights and LGBTQ issues. Just make that the focus of the whole thing, because those are the issues that will win in the margins of historically nonvoters. I really hope this campaign can finally understand why many voters are disenfranchised, and start finally enfranchising them.

Vast swathes of voters are unaffiliated because nobody cares about them. I know the dem candidates are capable of caring, but they need to show it.

The borders aren’t open, you numpty twat. Just keep lying.

Walz nailed the immigration question. Vance is making up lies and using buzzwords.

GOP was setting the bar low for Vance before the debate, and he easily cleared it, so with low expectations, the consensus will be that he was fantastic. Walz was no surprise, he was fine, so I think folks are going to call it a slight Vance win. It won't matter, neither got hit hard enough, it won't move anything.

They will have the study in 2 weeks. Also, was it done by the evil experts we can’t trust?

vance. those economic experts have PhD's but they don't have common sense.

Walz just dropped the pet eating bomb back on JDs head.

First question is about the Middle East and Iran's attack on Israel. Walz is talking about how we need steady leadership for dealing with that, contrasting it with Trump.

Started a little stumbly, but already seems to be finding his footing.

Excellent answer. Humanizing the issue, giving practical information, and raising project 2025.

“Shortage” more like venture capitalism and artificially limiting supply.

Vance trying hard to pull off Kamala’s faces from the last debate and only looking constipated.

There’s the attack on intelligence by dismissing PhDs by basically calling them stupid and replacing intelligence with “common sense”, feels before reals.

The “experts” said shipping jobs overseas would save Americans money?

That wasn’t experts, that was business lobbyists and CEOs who wanted higher profits.

Does Congress need to pass bills to help border patrol?

Vance: The president has to solve it by helping law enforcement.

JD, isn't that what the bill passing through Congress would do?

Here we go. Yes, women’s rights.

We're ~25 minutes in, and so far I would say this debate is close, but Walz is edging out Vance. He's not as polished, but he's coming across as more genuine, and he's directly answering.

Waltz really just needed to say "I goofed." And moved on. That was embarrassing.

Call ing out Vance’s disdain for trump, good

Do people actually believe the Vice President can single handily pass legislation?

"We're the cleanest economy in the entire world." What the fuck does that mean?

"You said you wouldn't call me out on my bullshit!" - JD

Dude, you admit to lying about stuff.

I love vance pointing out that maybe they don't want to be with their baby after its born.

now vance is trying to make it that its the democrats who don't believe in climate change. His argument is ridiculous given the signature ombudsman bill.

Here we go, reproductive rights.

woohoo. vance. lets just say its true carbon emissions cause global warming. lets just say.

Walz is friends with school shooters? Lol whoops

No one’s answering the question.

I will say, I'm enjoying this debate more than I thought I would, simply because the moderators seem competent and both debaters are behaving like actual adults, even if Vance is a makeup-wearing Yale-bot.

Why always do this crap, where they act like they're not going to let just babble at their leisure and then they just do it anyway.

"I'm rootin' for you." What? Rooting for me to do what?

Remember that Walz by his own admission is "bad at debates" and that Vance is (an admittedly insane) Yale law school graduate. Walz has done few difficult interviews, almost every mainstream interview Vance has done has been difficult because he has to defend Trump. I just think it's important to have realistic expectations.

I'm honestly not sure what to expect, but I imagine Vance will seem like a more polished politician and debater. He is awkward and supports ugly things, but he doesn't seem to get goaded easily. If Walz can summon his "everydad" persona effectively to make it appear like there's a normal candidate and weird candidate up there and use his knack for a folksy phrase or comeback, that will probably be the "takeaway."

Due to the format, these debates have kind of turned into tiktok video farming events, so let's see who gets the most meme-able sound bytes. Let the games begin.

exactly . Trump wants issues to run on, not solutions. We just saw this as he tried to manipulate the senate to not fix things so he’d have the problem to rail against and run on. This is anti-American.

Walz pointing out that Trump jokes about big storms creating more beachfront property.

Walz directly quoting Trump's promises about the wall, including the "Mexico will pay for it."

Not being “used” maybe the wildlife needs it?

It’s great that vance keeps heaping responsibility on Harris for events that happened while she was VP, events which were nothing a VP could affect.

Also, the world was “stable” under trump because tens of millions of people were dying from covid and the world was locked down. If trump wants to take responsibility for the covid virus, go for it.

Springfield Ohio.

Please bring up cats and dogs. You know you want to. Fucking racist.

woohoo. walz brought up the bill and how its doing the things vance is suggested they are not doing. looking good.

There it is, "I don't know the details. But let me tell you about my kids again"

It was okay. Walz was the nice dad. Vance was the slimy, mudslinging worm he is, a true politician in every negative sense of the word.

Walz was too nice and charitable towards Vance and gave him credit on certain issues, and Vance didn't return it in kind.

Vance lied through his teeth and wouldn't answer a single goddamn question. Spent most of his time saying how terrible Kamala was and almost none about how Trump would be good for people.

I left thinking it was an okay performance from both, but I suspect people will remember Vance being a greasy little weasel and Walz being a nice dad. Overall, a net positive for Harris/Walz, but only a little.

Walz pointing out that Trump does diplomacy by tweet.

Conclusion: Tim Walz is just too nice a guy to say what needs to be said.

Kamala Harris is not the president, and you’re a liar.

Your party has relentlessly fought against the working class, which is why we’re struggling and destitute, even after decades of working for the scraps we have.

You’re a liar Vance.

Vance is... just not answering the question. His delivery is weirdly robotic.

Walz hitting his stride now

I think this is how the evening is going to go. Vance simply won't directly answer any questions.

The way this evening is going for Vance:

MODERATOR: [DIRECT QUESTION]

VANCE: "I'm going to talk about something completely different now."

That was a really good answer from Walz, actually.

LOL at Walz just out there on his own and ready and Vance like, "WTF? He's already out here?!"

He’s not going to answer the question….

This is marketing word salad, which is all you can expect from someone like Vance.

Vance is slick, but Walz is honest. I hope people can see the difference.

Trump got the house republicans to turn against their own bipartisan immigration bill so he can run on the issue. Hammer that hard.

Well, first of all.
Well... First of all.
First of all.
Well. First of all.

oh snap. walz pushing back on anti expert rhetoric from the right.

Walz just comes off as so goddamn nice. I wish I could meet him in person.

That is 3 AM or 03:00 Central european time or Paris mean time.
https://www.worldtimebuddy.com/est-to-cet-converter

We bought Beer and snacks, looking forward to Walz walzing all over Vance. 🍺🍺😀

Bingo cards here:

https://www.wired.com/story/bingo-how-to-watch-vp-walz-vance-debate/

If you get the square with "The Cathedral" and are wondering what THAT Is:

It's a term related to extremist blogger Curtis Yarvin, who's in the J.D. Vance/Peter Thiel orbit:

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/04/inside-the-new-right-where-peter-thiel-is-placing-his-biggest-bets

More on Yarvin here:

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/23373795/curtis-yarvin-neoreaction-redpill-moldbug

so obsessed with impeaching donald trump. yeah well that happens when you use the us presidency for blackmail. Its not obsession when a person is actually being corrupt.

Ha, Walz didn’t just accuse trump of being an agent of chaos – he used YOUR words to point that out, idiot.

first of all let me not answer the question and go off on a tangent.

Walz was way too soft on Vance and let him control most of the debate. I'm tired of Dems positioning themselves as diet Republicans, then acting like they are nothing like while saying how much they agree with a guy like Vance on things lol. Vance also loudly saying you weren't supposed to fact-check me was embarrassing. Walz laid out actual plans and policy but that is not going to reach that crowd they are targeting.

Is he capable of answering a single question? This is just tedious.

Trump said blah, pls respond. Lol no, here’s what I imagine Kamala might do in some alternate reality.

Walz has the receipts on improving the lives of the middle class.

Yup. Keep going Walz, attack Trump over and over. That's all you need to do.

Walz Pro Tip of the Day!

Vance:

I want the entire Minnesota law dealing with abortion spoken verbatim, sir or my lies and misinterpreting said law will be true!

Minor Vance win overall since he had lower expectations going in and Walz got that one unfortunate extremely clippable misspeak. Vance refusing to admit Trump lost in 2020 and his Springfield...thing though cost him any chance of a rout, which is basically required for a VP debate to have significant upballot effects. Still the Republicans probably appreciate getting Vance above Sarah Parin and Aaron Burr and getting the media distracted for another day or two.

So far, I like the way the moderators are handling things.

Great point from Walz on trusting experts.

Good lord. Can he answer ONE FUCKING QUESTION? Just one.

Do we care or not care about the future? Vance what?

But he said he would have a plan 8 years ago… I think he should have more than a concept. No?

A winning comment by Walz here.

So are we voting for Vance or Walz???

hey so if vance/trump is going to have things done here instead of overseas why did trump not get that done when he was president. this is the problem (well outside all the others) with his campaign. He had his time at bat and he did not do any of these things.

Vance: mah family, so relevant

Venture Capitalism! Name the monster.

guys I thought Walz would be doing better

Maybe people don’t agree with you because you’re a misogynistic dipshit.

So your ex-baby mama is watching. I feel bad for her for ever having crossed your path.

Solving those things in the past! Stop worrying about the future!

Federal land? We don’t have a land problem.

Ouch on the Haitian call.

Cutting both their mics was great. I want more of that, please.

Oh shit, Tim just sunk JD's battleship.

but Trump isn’t actually going to work to make solar panels in the US or anywhere. This is a non answer that “they haven’t solved all the problems, so we should do nothing.”

Lol.. number one export being top soil from flooding.

I guess I shouldn’t be surprised. Walz gave good answers about 90% of the time but definite dodged a few. Vance, otoh, made shit up constantly and harped on fear topics. Always about the border, blaming Harris for policy she wasn’t responsible for, and offering up an economy that the republicans have zero plans to create.

And Vance is simply refusing to answer the question about child separation. He simply won't.

"First of all..."

I don't think the experts Walz was talking about and the "experts" Vance is talking about are the same experts.

I don’t know the details, but I’ll talk about identity politics instead of addressing the number 1 problem right now.

e: and loop back to the border!!

Really, by getting rid of the EPA?

Wtf is Vance talking about? So he’s going to continue separating families, got it.

Your running mate tried to refuse aid to natural disasters a few years ago to areas that didn’t rim him hard enough. Were you not paying attention?

Another non answer. No plan

Bust unions and give the rich tax breaks is the spirit animal of not just Trump, but all the GOP.

Vance talking over the moderators, now. That won't play well.

What is Vance talking about?

lol what “experts” said that? You mean greedy business executives? Pretty sure they aren’t considered experts.

Vance has only been speaking for a few minutes and it already looks like he has robot hands.

What the fuck does empowering the border agents mean? They are doing their jobs.

CNN pundits saying "Vance was obviously the better debater" and "Walz really dropped the ball and let Vance get away with too much"

Walz suddenly appears in the followup.

You mean like the fucking bill Trump killed!? Ok i am done. I’ve seen enough

And yet you somehow turned out to be a gross little shit

Walz is stumbling early on a bit

Is that what he thinks trump is saying or is that what he knows his running mate his saying?

There is this face that Vance makes while Walz is talking where he looks at the camera and sort of rolls his eyes.

Idk why but it's kind of funny to me

Moderators lost control

Fuck off. It’s not about wanting families. Your policies turn women into walking coffins!

e: not even one woman anywhere, ever, should have to endure that, if it’s at all preventable. For anyone who doesn’t know, this can easily fall short of all legal exceptions for weeks, because the mother’s life isn’t actually in danger at first – though her sanity is, and it’s inexcusably barbaric.

It's really annoying that JD had a valid point about economic experts being wrong about pushing neoliberalism. That really weakened Walz'es otherwise great point that we should be listening to the experts about climate change and allowed the couchfucker to push the "follow common sense" bullshit.

This clown just going to pretend he’s a democrat for this answer?

I think they're both full of shit about the ACA. Vance delivered lies and a nothing burger of a proposal. Walz said the system works. Pre and post trump it never worked. When it was mandatory, I was on the benefits cliff and couldn't afford the awful insurance that covered nothing (that also had an enormous deductible). I missed rent because of my state mandated health insurance. When trump made it voluntary, I had more money in my pocket and I still couldn't afford healthcare.

The ACA is fucked and needs to be replaced with a real socialized health system. Health insurance is corrupt and contrary to healthcare on a fundamental level. It should be abolished and outlawed.

It's pretty freaking hilarious that Vance is already planning to be in the "spin room" after the debate.

I need Vance’s makeup artist

But seriously , why is he dodging the question?

Ouch on calling other parts of the world dirty

That was a weirdly meandering non-answer.

Fentanol?

Mic cut

Walz answer was really good.

Why does Vance look so airbrushed?

Polymarket currently has Walz at 59%

https://polymarket.com/event/who-will-win-the-vp-debate-according-to-polls

Does this moron think the VZp is a god in the system? Why didn’t trump do these things when he was president???

Economics experts have PhDs don't have common sense?

We'll induce more people into child care!

(Aunt Lydia has entered the chat)

Does anyone know how to watch MSNBC’s coverage of this (i prefer their commentators) without having any subscriptions?

Walz seems really nice. And the VP doesn't usually matter that much. But it sure would be nice if that was Buttigieg or Shapiro up there. Buttigieg loves sparring with Republicans. He is a great attack dog, but thats not really what Walz's role seems to be, and that's OK, but considering the election is a coin flip, I just want every fraction of a percent of support Harris can get.

Honestly, that was a solid debate from both candidates. They both did a good job dancing around direct answers. They both could throw and take jabs. The humbleness and relatability of both candidates was a breath of fresh air. I think they both did a good job trying to sway anyone on the fence, and overall, I think this benefits the Republican Party most. Vance is just a much more personable person than Trump. Democrats are really going to need to turn up if they want to win this election. I really think productive right-specific voters are going to show up from both sides and determine it.

Here's to hoping personal autonomy wins out. Govement rules over ones personal body is a slippery slope. Allowing one to choose, that's freedom.

Vance doesn't matter. Walz needs to go after Trump and remind viewers how dangerous he is.

Stiff and stumbly out of the gate. Nothing awful though.

Here we go. Thoughts and prayers.

I feel like there's a history of these VP debates being pretentiously "more civil" than the main event, because the stakes are lower, etc. So there was that, here, in vance and walz being so nice and agreeing with each other.

But this shit was boring crazy. Vance just lied and was unable to hold Walz to account.

They’re both soft-balling this. Lean harder, Walz. He’s giving you ammunition!

Vance probably has marching orders to attack Harris at the cost of making himself look bad. The question is whether he passes on the chance to change his own narrative.

NBC News just started their live coverage: https://www.youtube.com/live/eMXffUh8mHo

Not a great start

Walz doing great going after Trump.

I wish that these two were the presidential candidates. They’re both coherent and seem to actually care about the things affecting us. The presidential candidates are playing partisan politics and parroting the same talking points on repeat.

7 minutes

Funnily enough, I think Vance had a savvy answer on climate change and Walz has dominated on immigration

It’s pathetic that these important events have become channel exclusives sponsored by ads.

Hella canned closing comments.

Vance isn't sounding quite as robotic now.

OMG. Walz just fumbled.

Vance just dunked. Yikes.

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Vance won that round. He's just a much more polished speaker/debater.