And so it begins
I installed Linux Mint for the first time on my personal Laptop just a few months ago, and it ran so well that I didn't want to mess with it to try out different distros.
But today, my company's IT department announced that they have some spare old Laptops to give away (technically because they didn't meet the specs for Windows 11, didn't stop the IT department from giving them out with Windows 11 pre installed though)
So now I got a few devices to play around with!! They're a Precision 7530 and a Latitude 7390 2-in-1!
I already got ZorinOS running on the little guy because apparently Zorin is nice for Touchscreen support. For the big guy I was initially thinking that I could try Bazzite, but the installer was like "Intel UHD Graphics aren't really recommended" so I might try something else first. Any recommendations? I mainly just want to try as many different flavors of Linux as I can haha
I don't understand... It wasn't even an Arch-based distro!
I always wonder why mint is the one people try. It seems so out of date.
Fedora these days works really well and is really up to date.
Mint is very boring and middle of the road, exactly as a default recommendation should be. They are also very protective of the user experience. They are unlikely to embarrass me.
Mint has a familiar UX if you are new to Linux. It is not nearly as foreign or locked down as GNOME. It is not as configurable and complex as KDE. There are good GUI tools for most common tasks.
Mint does not change too rapidly or have too many updates but the desktop and tools are kept up-to-date.
They are being very conservative with the Wayland transition. But nobody on Mint is moaning that Wayland is not ready. They are very protective about the user experience.
And there is really no desktop use case that Mint is not suitable for.
I do not use Mint but it is a very solid recommendation for “normal” users.
I think Pop!OS is back to being that too and COSMIC is Wayland only (so no future transition to manage).
See this one is confusing to me. It is very different.
You are greeted after install to configure mirrors. What is a mirror? The dialog offers no help, there is no apply, or maybe this one. so you click "restore to the default". What does that do? And then down the side what is a PPA? Should I have a PPA (answer is NO, you should not). Additional Repositories, auth keys, maintenance.....Fix merge lists.....
Where is the clipboard? Oh there isnt one. And typing clipboard doesnt offer one. Typing clipboard into software sources offers too many (25 of them!).
Mint is alright I don't want to come across as bashing them. I just am surprised it is so highly recommended that is all.
I always broke it before long, but that is the Ubuntu curse: super fragile and always breaking.
There is a Mint based on pure Debian if you think the Ubuntu-based one is "too fragile" as you put it. You actually made me curious in how you keep breaking Mint, I've been using it for several years, incrementally upgrading it since 2021 with little to no breakage at all.
So trying it again recently on a VM, seems like they changed their upgrades? Used to be a series of priority ranks. I think that confused the users. I think the ppas confused the users.
And making poor choices there broke it.
Ubuntu is just broken out of the box on the other hand. Every damn time since version 4 something stupid happens.
Yeah, PPAs usually complicate things. IIRC the advice is disabling them before upgrading major versions, but this can be a pain if you use many repositories simultaneously
Is there something wrong with mint?
Personally the ui looks a bit outdated and there's less customization than most other distros
The installer if pretty nice as is the post install I will give it that. Maybe that is the most important part.
I guess I just am surprised by how many people choose it as their "windows replacement" when it is very non windows like.
Also: it is ubuntu tainted, that is never good. Then cinnamin, mate, or lxde which are kind of a pain in the ass unless you are willing to put up with it because you like it.
Lack of any real searching in the ui, a terrible file manager, an older kernel, and so on.
I migrated my mother to GNOME (on Debian), that's very much unlike Windows, but she immediately got it. The overview of open programs is similar to what she knows on Android, for example. She is someone that struggles with email attachments from time to time, but GNOME works well for her.
It does not have to look like Windows to work for people. People use phones a lot more these days and those do not run Windows (hopefully, at least, cause that's dead).
If they have never used windows, most things will work. It is people coming from windows and doing more than email. Gnome is fine... If you don't do anything with it. If you do you are adding extensions.
Oh, you can do serious work with GNOME, most people try to force it into something that it is not.
This video gives a good overview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbDLfRjam0E
I know many people that prefer GNOME for their work in IT. I prefer Sway, but use GNOME on phones and tablets, where it works great for me.
Yes I know gnome. Linux has been my primary OS since around 2001. It is funny because even in the video you shared, he suggests adding Gnome tweaks, which was kinda my point.
Personally, Gnomes constant movement drives me nuts, and the focus on one thing at a time is really a pain in the ass. But I do happen to have a laptop with it on it, and given the smaller screen real estate and the type of tasks I do with it, it works ok. Like you mentioned.
But for a windows user coming to linux It is all the little things, particularly the file manager and context menus. Why do I need to open an application when I should be able to right click extract to zip folder name, delete zip in one move?
Clipboard: Gnome has no clipboard. Unless you add an extension. This one drives me a little crazy because the clipboard I use is shared with my phone and tablet and has functions and actions.
And if you are fancy (like using Windows attempt at tiling) Gnome doesn't do that either.
I get people use gnome, but I find it tries to hard to be not enough. Why isnt the terminal in the file manager window when I want to work that way for example.
GNOME has a clipboard by default--actually it has two: Ctrl-C/X and middle click send to both clipboards.
As for terminal in the file manager, by default you can right click on empty space in the file manager and "open in console".
A matter of preference.
1 reason it's wrong to me: https://nosystemd.org/
Under "Notable bugs and security issues" there is a big list of issues which were all (afaict) fixed many years ago.
There have been reasonable philosophical objections to systemd, some of which are still relevant, and as that site shows there are still many distros without it, but for the vast majority of desktop users who want something that JustWorks... using a mainstream distro with systemd is the way to go.
This blog post from pmOS covers some of the pain of trying to use KDE or GNOME without it.
I suspected nosystemd.org had not been kept up to date with the issues... indicated by it proposing some distros that kinda dont exist any more.
Still worth consideration.
Some may realise they do not like that philosophy, and prefer a philosophy that empowers them more deeply with simpler software they could comprehend more easily in its entirety, than mere convenience of going with the popular thick opaque plastic wrap over complexity. Some may prefer a more unix-philosophy of "do one thing, well", than a gestalt of a pretense of that in a complicated monolith doing all things (arguably if not poorly, precariously, with a single point of failure/usurpation).
It’s interesting there’s still resistance against systemd in 2025. It’s running just fantastically in many distros. I don’t get the hate against it.
have you actually tried it? trying mint after using arch for a year (btw), it's actually really well made and the consistency is crazy good. The UI looks and feels better in person than in screenshots
Yes. And they improved the updater it used to be much more confusing.
Its too out of date and doesn't have KDE so it really isn't for me.
A lot of beginners (like me) use mint because it is very simple out of the box and user friendly. It just works (unless, like me, you try using commands from arch on mint, and you break it)
Except when it doesn't. And really people are missing out, because there is so much more out there. I was playing with it today and I wonder how many people think that is what linux is? Fedora Gnome or KDE is even simpler and also just works.
But choice is good. I am just always surprised how often it is the default linux for new people. When it would be pretty low on my choice of distros. I set it up as a spare computer for guests a few years ago and it turned out to be more of a chore than I wanted to deal with.
...yeah it does break sometimes. Right now my grandma has it on her spare computer, which is a potato, and she said she didn't know it was linux on there, even though I told her when I installed it. It's mostly used as a bootloader for the browser, and it's dual booting whichever windows and mint
It doesn't always work, I agree, but for some people it does what they need.
If it's broke, I will absolutely try to fix it anyways, but not on anyone elses stuff.
I have mint as a safe distro, so if I mess up my stuff trying to use a distro I'm not ready for, I can take 3 minutes(ish) fixing it and hoping I didn't wipe the bios or anything else important off my computer when I tried installing arch with no clue how.
I've become quite the fan of Fedora with KDE. Running Fedora 43 on both my couch Thinkpad and my gaming desktop. Only issue I'm having with it is sleep functionality on the desktop, which just sucks (it likes to not wake up from sleep) so I have that set to not go to sleep, just turn the screen off when idle.
Yeah, I’m normally an Arch guy, but gave Fedora with KDE a shot when I bought Framework. It's pretty sweet, does everything I want and never bothers me
For some time... but nowadays I would never go for anything not rolling release anymore.
Because those distro upgrades were traditionally when something broke (or there were just too many changes requiring my attention at the same time), triggering a fresh install... usually combined with trying another distro.
Fedora's almost rolling though
Do you find that Arch bothers you in any way, would you say? How if so?
No, not really. If it's set up right, it pretty much just works. I use it on my work computer and never mess around with anything, just use it and sync packages every month or so.
Honestly a distro called Nobara was a huge let down for me compared to Arch. It was effortless to install and came out with cool tweaks, but in just 6 months of usage it randomly broke like 4 times, every time I was supposed to check their discord server to get info on what broke and how to fix it. From Plasma not loading and opening crash report window indefinitel, to bootloop with update screen, to experimental drivers being shipped causing hard GPU crashes. And this is recommended for newbies? I'd rather give preconfigured Arch (like CachyOS) to newbie than this.
Yikes on the Nobara experience. Will avoid. Not that I ever felt the need to explore or hop beyond Arch. Discord as the main communication channel? That screams immature project IMO.
I have the same experience as you with Arch. In probably a decade of use I've only reinstalled when buying new computers. It's just so solid. I use it both for work and at home. 👌
I had the same problem until I installed the nvidia drivers. KDE will install some that gets things to work but I had that sleeping problem you mention. I can't remember the exact package name but I can try and figure it out if you need help finding it.
AMD GPU over here.
can you do gaming on fedora? like, run pirated games or use steam?
yes, it's linux...
You can on nearly all distros
oh sweet
I play a bunch of Steam games on it. I also have some Epic and GoG stuff through Heroic Launcher. I haven't tried any pirated stuff.
I've had a really poor experience of Fedora and KDE. It really felt like third-class experience as they push so much for GNOME. Once you try a more desktop neutral or pro-KDE distributions you can't go back to Fedora.
KDE got upgraded to a mainline version in 43, not just a separate spin.
Try out Debian. Stable, base of many other distros, loads of documentation, huge helpful community, just runs and barely ever breaks (I can't even remember the last time I had issues).
debian's netinstaller is great
For desktop I run debian sid (unstable), despite the name it very rarely breaks. And once in a blue moon when it does it gets fixed in a few hours/a day. Usually it is just some package that doesn't play nicely with something else, so not like it is unusable during that time.
The unstable part is that they do not guarantee that it will work, it is still more stable than most other distros and you get new packages.
Why doesn’t anybody ever recommend Debian testing? It has stricter quality criteria than unstable while being almost as up-to-date.
I agree that Debian Stable is not a great fit for desktop as the packages get very old between releases.
Testing doesn't get security updates as quickly as unstable, or even stable sometimes.
Testing does not have dedicated security work and issues could be unsolved for a couple more days. You can use testing, of course, but read Debian security advisories. Upgrade packages from Unstable if there's something critical and do not wait days for a fix.
It's called unstable because packages are constantly upgraded, unlike Debian Stable, which stays the same until the next release and only gets patches. It is NOT called unstable "because they do not guarantee that it will work", for that you'd need paid enterprise support from some company.
Umm... With 2 free computers and nothing on them.
Run down the list and install all the different distros. Test them out for a few weeks then onto the next. Pretty soon you'll one that you prefer.
This is the way.
The only way to find the right distro is to try them out, on the end device, with the end user.
Advanced distro hopping form, distro rotation.
Installing one distro on one laptop and then only using that laptop to figure out how to install the next distro on the other laptop! That would give me an actual goal in each distro I install too, since I'd have to get the wifi and browser working and figure out how to run that program that burns iso files onto a usb stick :0
... that would be such an entertaining youtube video concept too, I wish I was into video making haha
Good advice.
Can install any/all Desktop Environments on the same install, and switch to them at login. XFCE, Trinity, Mate, KDE, LXDE, LXQt, Enlightenment, Cinnamon, COSMIC, etc, etc. ... And/or, Window managers, of which there are dozens and dozens.
It depends on the distro but generally yes. If you want to do this, choose a distro with up-to-date packages. I would recommend either EndeavourOS or CachyOS.
I've been an XFCE loyalist for so long, finally gave GNOME a go and now that I've got something more simple and less customizable, it finally feels like Linux is a daily tool and not a project that I have to keep tweaking.
Yes, I'm a Debian person lol
I've tried a few desktop environments and ended back with XFCE... all the whizzy snazzy stuff breaks over time, or get's "up"graded to something I don't like... XFCE just works...
Yeah I'm pretty minimal on GNOME plugins for that reason too. XFCE will always be my backup at least. KDE is just too much.
You should try Fedora. It's the one used by Linus.
Because Bazzite is gaming oriented and Intel UHD is barely good enough to render a display?
I have a Dell with UHD+Nvidia, took me a while to get Prime working to switch video cards. Even on UHD, it could do basic Steam games and Minecraft if you didn't have high expectations.
Well, it works for MC, older games, even stray runs somewhat (from my experience). It's decent for a 300€ laptop with a quad core like the ones in the post.
Ah, the newer UHD?
I actually have tried it on the bigger laptop by now and somehow Bazzite runs Sekiro more smoothly than my "Gaming" Lenovo Legion Y530 that has an actual GPU and is from around the same time ever did. 🫣 It was completely unplayable on my other Laptop... which makes me think that maybe I misconfigured it to not actually use the GPU back in the day??? I'll have to experiment with that a bit more haha
OpenSUSE is very less recommended but I would suggest it
https://media.ccc.de/v/5012-the-first-encrypted-steam-deck-runs-opensuse#t=0
Also check out their AEON it is still in RC but worth looking out for. Meanwhile Fedora immutable can be used with Intel.
Suse has such a corporate feel to her.
If you are tach savvy want to tinker look for NetBSD or Ironclad OS
dont forget your programming socks
Man I wish I could participate in the programmer socks joke, but I feel like it just doesn't really hit the same when an afab person does it :(
well, we can't let you out of this, we're all in this together. Let's make programming "tidy whites" a thing! XD
https://cdn.cliqueinc.com/posts/302806/kylie-jenner-tighty-whities-paris-fashion-week-302806-1664826983479-image.700x0c.jpg
funny that thr most feminine socks are asociated with boys now :3
Snagged a thinkpad today for just over 100$. Guy mentioned it was because of windows 11. Its hippie christmas for linux!
If you wanna have fun, i woild recommend bedrock linux, haven't tried it, but it sounds cool and interesting. Also nixos might be fun to try in my opinion.
Nix might be a bit overwhelming when his first installation of linux was only a few months ago, I guess :D
It might be overwhelming but still fun to explore new things, right?
Ooh, Nix looks interesting, I'd be down for the challenge!
I use NixOS myself and I love it, i'll never use another distro again. plus with distrobox I don't even need to use another distro, I already have all the major ones on my NixOS System.
If you do decide to go the Nix route keep in mind there's really no right nor wrong way to have your system set up. it's all personal preference. Some people will say flakes are the way to go, some people will say the opposite. Some people like having their system in modules, some don't. Some like using the home-manager, some don't. It's all up to you. All I will suggest though is if you do try Nix set up a Git repo somewhere like on codeberg for it. Just makes things easier.
Nix is such a cool project. If I had more time I'd definitely give it a go.
NixOS (and GuixSD) is a whole operating system. But base guix and Nix is a package manager that you can install into any existing distro and use for as many or as few packages as you want.
So you can give it a shot in roughly no time, is what I'm saying.
The main difference between the full system ones and the package manager ones is obviously that it manages system level packages and the kernel, but also that they have configuration systems setup to run daemons and manage system config. But other than that it's just the same paradigm as the package manager version.
There's GuixSD too.
Basically the same as NixOS, but purely Free Software only, and, instead of being configured by a bespoke configuration language unique to it, GuixSD is configured in Guile, so you'd be learning a transferable skill at least. I hear NixOS's package repository's unbeaten though.
Listen, I use guix so I'm not against you, but claiming that Guile, or even any scheme / lisp, is a transferable skill is a stretch 😛
As a software developer for 20 years, configuring guix is the only time I've encountered guile. And the only time I've used any kind of lisp is when I forced myself to during a coding challenge or advent of code thing, just for interest's sake.
So again, I know what you're saying, but for me, deep in the industry, guile might as well be a bespoke language for configuring guix 😅
But, that you did not transfer those skills to any of the things, or write your own from scratch, nor make use of that superpower seems to be just on you, and while that may be true for you, that it might as well be just a bespoke language only for configuring guix, the skills still remain transferable, if not yet transferred. ;)
(And, I do get what you're saying... I have similar for haskell, the effectively bespoke configuration language just for xmonad (~ plus a chatbot)).
😛
I mean, pushing pennies up my nose is a transferable skill in that I could push pennies up anyone else's nose, and I could even make a whole TV career out of a show where I push pennies up people's noses on the street.
So I'll instead amend my statement to say that guile isn't a common or often sought after skill. 😉
Yeah! I was just coming here to recommend GuixSD or NixOS! Not because they're normal, but because they're not, and you have an opportunity to screw around 😅
Fedora and Debian are different but also pretty similar. Arch or Gentoo are more different. The atomics like bazzite and silverblue are even more different. And then there's NixOS and GuixSD that are basically a completely different paradigm of how to setup a system. And that might be frustrating if it doesn't work for you, but as a test computer go wild! Heck, try NixOS and GuixSD to experience their differences from each other!
The only other thing I might recommend for a challenge is something like Linux From Scratch where you don't have any distro and you just build everything yourself. Definitely not recommended for normal people! It's a project rather than something you can just try out for a weekend. And it may be frustrating, who knows. But if you're into that kind of thing it may be enlightening!
I've been Bedrock Linux daily driving since its second alpha release, and, it's difficult to see its use for a newbie to Linux, since it's usefulness naturally only seems to become apparent once familiar with at least two different distros. But... perhaps, if one were keen enough to learn, and read carefully... it's plausible, even if only ever used one distro... even if only still intending to use only one distro (yes, can have multiple strata of the same distro (handy, e.g. for staggered upgrades across major versions, different arrangements and so on).
... Like I said in my review on distrowatch:
But that's probably some time away yet for the OP.
I just got a new laptop for my work (which I also use for personal stuff, it’s a family business).
It came with Windows 11 but I’d got a bigger SSD which I’d installed before I’d even turned it on so Windows never even got a chance to boot.
I installed one of the Fedora atomic distros and it seems to be pretty good, though I’m trying to figure out how to tune battery life. I’ve setup TLP but haven’t noticed any improvement, though, it’s still much better than when I first tried Linux on a laptop.
I’d never used Fedora before, but the first distro I ever used was Ubuntu Dapper Drake and I’ve dipped my toes occasionally since then, but never fully committed until now
https://distrowatch.com/
try 'em all.
Edit: PS: distrowatch's search is handy: e.g. https://distrowatch.com/search.php?defaultinit=Not+systemd [Edit: PS: maybe try {in approximate increasing ambitiousness] antix, devuan (or other respins of devuan, like expiron, peppermint, vendefoul, shebang, gnuinos), pclinuxos, salix, slackel, slackware, calculatelinux, artix, obarun, voidlinux, decibellinux, gentoo, crux (or kwort), sidelinux(?), milis(?),bedrock, guixSD, LFS. Or whatever... :) Have fun exploring.
https://vendefoul-wolf-linux.sourceforge.io/index_en.html / https://sourceforge.net/projects/vendefoul-wolf-linux/ back on my radar, with its IceWM/Xlibre/OpenRC release, after seeing the intro to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGf5OeL4YHE
All this saves [computer and headspace] resources for what you really want to do. :)
GL! Hope you have a great time.
Check out https://www.wesnoth.org/ and https://supertuxkart.net/Main_Page :D
Yes.
Have fun.
Check out https://pioneerspacesim.net/ and https://flarerpg.org/ and https://www.luanti.org/en/ :D
(If on a distro with apt, easy to
apt searchfor these, andapt installthem. Probably.)I'd say try fedora. Then give Debian a spin as it will expose you to more technical details.
I ran bazzite on a Lenovo flexpad with Intel und 630 graphics and it ran perfectly. I even ran mechwarrior 5 on it, albeit with the graphics details turned down so low that it looked like a mechwarrior game from the 1990s.
I'd give bazzite a go. Learning about how to install and use distroboxes is also lots of Linux fun.
Edit: also, you literally cannot break any of the immutable fedora distros. Very newbie friendly.
warning for bazzite: It's very restrictive and doesn't let you actually manipulate it like most distros. if you're even remotely tech savvy and want to explore/play around in Linux, do NOT install bazzite.
if you don't care, and want their team to 'protect you' from doing pc damage, the. use bazzite.
(backstory; I went to modify my fstab, it allowed me to with no issues. I broke the file.. fine, went to edit it to revert back.. root access was revoked and I was told to f myself by bazzite. I had to enter grub? (can't fully remember) to modify it back which worked but was a pain in the ass I should have had to do. promptly uninstalled and never looked back.)
I would say that most people fall into this category. They just want to install the operating system and start working or gaming.
You do a massive disservice to the overwhelming majority of computer users.
To everyone else: if you want a computer that just works and don’t want to fuck around with the command line, Bazzite is perfect. It should be recommended over Linux Mint.
it was a 'warning' for current Linux users or tech savvy/computer literate people like I stated... it's still good, just restrictive in that it protects you from yourself, hut actually can be a hindrance to power users. nothing wrong with what I said.
By explicitly telling the rest why Bazzite probably isn't for them?
Well now I want to install it just to try to break it lol
Did you try CachyOS ? https://cachyos.org/ I'm impressed by how snappy it is on older computers.
Not yet, but I have seen that it is very popular on Distrowatch! :D It's definitely in my backlog
Computertruhe could be happy about well working laptops! Dont hoard ;) you can try distros with external SSDs
That's actually an awesome project and I'm coincidentally moving close to one of their locations soon :o
USB pendrives are good enough.
Or even DVDs. :D
Try many distros without installing them.
Everybody was distro surfing. :)
You can, if you have far to much time in your hands, install arch, gentoo, vor any other distro with a non graphical installer. I believe its a great experience, especially because you learn a bit more about the internels, and a few cool bash commands.
Void linux xfce. Just uses so little ram I love it.
Very reasonable in this economy!
Maybe not exactly what you are asking for but try out yunohost. Since you have some spares, one can be self-hosting stuff
That's a neat pointer! I have been meaning to look into self-hosting anyway since my AWS free tier is running out pretty soon and I need a new place to cheaply plant down my in-development website project haha
That seems to be something a cheap Raspberry Pi 4 can easily handle. I even use mine as an SMB share. Sure, the speed is limited by the network port and USB port sharing data lanes, but it's fast enough for my needs. Needs tiny amounts of eletricitiy, so I don't burn the planet that quickly.
Bazzite is the more gaming oriented flavour of Universal Blue's distros, but take a look at Bluefin if you wanna try something similar (but not focused on gaming, although gaming also works fine on it). I've used it for about a year or so myself, and I love it. It's immutable so it "just works", but I can still play around and tinker with distroboxes or VMs.
Nice! If you like tweaking stuff you should try Arch or Endeavour OS. Another weird but cool choice is Void Linux.
I trialed several distros on my Precision 3550 and settled on Garuda. No regrets!!
And end with Vanilla Arch, for me atleast I distro hop every week when I got into Linux for the first time and I thought I'm going to use Fedora, Debian, OpenSUSE, EndeavourOS as my main but ended up using Arch Linux permanently instead. For me it's the "just work" distro easy to use and troubleshoot
Entry point: Manjaro. Yes, many will tell it's not super stable in the long run, but since you plan on jumping from one to the other, this doesn't matter. What does matter is that it's simple, fast, and gets you up to speed with latest Linux developments without any stress. It's easy, it's fun, and you can go anywhere from there
After some experience: OpenSUSE Tumbleweed. This thing is a tinkerer's paradise. Solid foundation and the newest software, snapshots beautifully configured by default so you could unwind everything, and no unnecessary guardrails so you can do whatever you want. However, it expects the user to know at least a little of what they're doing, so it's not a novice choice.
An OpenSuse distro. Something like Tumbleweed should run quite well on a machine like your Dell.
Well, Microsoft do the most of all for Linux.