People care more about CEO's opinion on politics and hate Web3 crypto more than they understand technical browser stuff.
Brave is far from perfect and the company had their contreveries but honestly if you disable all the cryptocrap and tweak it a tiny bit so it does not show you ads and feature you don't use it is the best chromium browser in regards to security and privacy.
Ungoogled chromium by default can't even compare, it's not crap but brave does so much more than it's better for the vast majority of users.
And yet it uses less RAM in Android phones compared to my goat, Firefox... Man FF needs a lot of improvements, all my complaints come from Android, the browser is perfect even on macOS!
Firefox still doesn't support tab groups on mobile. That's a non-starter for me. Hopfully Ladybird has their shit better put together than mozilla when they finally release their browser
I haven't heard about that browser, it seems that it does its own thing, IDK man, if FF that has years in the market and still hasn't caught up, I have no big hopes for "new" projects.
True but he's sparking more interest in FOSS so that's still a good thing. I doubt his advice is perfect but if it gets more people started onto their own journey it's a win.
People on Lemmy seem to be Pewdiepie bootlickers. Idk why but it's really weird. Apparently you can do whatever but as long as you promote Linux, Lemmy will love you. Ridiculous.
I know it's been said, but Brave is a hard no. Replace it with Ungoogled Chromium. I haven't seen the video so I don't understand why it's in the "not ideal for a normal human" list, and I am biased since I use plenty of "not for normal" tools.
qutebrowser and IceCat are real top of the game when it comes to privacy. But then, they break some of the sites functionality, especially IceCat who seems to be going under the "if your site doesn't work, it's your site's problem" motto.
Which is honestly fair? Like, i would enjoy a "unsafe site, access anyways?" button, but if privacy settings break a page that literally is the pages fault for not respecting privacy.
Kinda, but I would like to tailor my experience a bit more than "all or nothing".
IceCat is directly a GNU project, so it's highly ideological - which is important and respectable in a way, but then it gets adoption to near-zero because most sites just don't work out of the box, and to make it work properly means completely removing all safeguards that make IceCat make sense. There's little in between.
I'd rather have something like LibreWolf, but without phone-home functionality, or at least a switch to turn it off. Out of all Firefox forks I know, only IceCat respects user privacy in this way - 0 connections on startup, and then only connection to actual site and whatever it requires.
Opt-in telemetry (ideally - leveled) and manual bug information sending are totally fine, though.
I don’t disagree with that. It’s just that most browsers are built that way, unfortunately. Nothing is free, not even Firefox. If you want to sell it, it’s hard to maintain reasonable expectations that people won’t just build it from source instead of buying it. Something 100% free can’t maintain itself over long time.
Firefox is open source, and while it takes some shady practices to fund it (it sure isn't cheap to run your own damn engine alongside everything on top), I take it as a more tenable compromise. It's not about free as in beer freedom, it's about basic security.
You can also have degoogled Chromium which is open-source if you're into it.
Even EDGE is a ungoogled Chromium (but containing M$ tracking APIs instead).
Vivaldi IS a degoogled Chromium, a small part of the UI (by far the most advanced one of any other browser) is proprietary, but not really obfuscated, they show even in the support forum how the user can modding it, if for him isn't enough what he can do in the most complete setting page ever, the only thing is, you can't use it for other browser projects. It's certainly not a privacy or security issue.
Chromium as is, is 100% FLOSS but because of this isn't more private or secure as a proprietary soft, FLOSS isn't automaticly synonym of privacy and security, a lot of people confuse it, it's not the propósit of OpenSource, privacy and security of an soft depends only of the intentions of the developer or company, not if their soft is OSS or not. The user can audit the soft, which in any case is needed if he don't want or be able to check millons of lines in the code which a complex soft like a browser engine has.
Not of his. This is a known widespread tierlist made by other person (I do not remember if this came from Reddit, a YT video or what, but it is well known)
Ppl focusing on the negative. It's just his subjective list. He doesn't claim to be an expert. Lemmy autism peaking here. More exposure to foss is good guys
The only problem with Ungoogled that makes it "not ideal for a normal human" is that fact that it is still cumbersome af to download it. Regular people don't know github and how to click on "show all assets" and pick the right build.
Isn't installing extensions in it also a pain, since the Google webstore doesn't let you install from it?
I guess to answer my own question, I looked it up - there's an extension to let you do that alongside some flag changes, so I guess not too bad... But it's another step on the list of things you'd want to do as a user
No I did not and I'm not sure what you imagine "regular users" might be. I feel that if someone goes the extra length to get their browser outside of a store, they can do the same with extensions, is it extravagant?
Not a problem in Vivaldi, you can install even pure scripts as extension, without the need of an Userscript Manager, like TamperMonkey or similar. Due to the great amount of features, most extension from the Chrome Store are anyway redundant.
Ngl, feel like his tier list is based on usability while avoiding big tech.
Tbh even if this tierlist is not the best or great, it still is "good enough". Plus the most important thing is to get tons of people interested.
I rather have "good enough" tier list that reaches to millions of people, then have a perfect tierlist that only reaches out to less than a dozen people.
Because amongst the millions of people who are interested, thousands of them will do their own research into privacy and dig deeper into it.
Plus right now, the biggest weakness of privacy is the fact that our community is too small to make an impact.
Having someone give this much outreach and influence to attract attention towards privacy is a good thing. (well, as long as their advice are on the positive end of the spectrum, and pewdiepie's advise surely is, even if its not perfect)
It doesn’t matter whether the list is part of the video or whether it was created by PewDiePie.
The list, in the screenshot of OP, is garbage.
Besides, the same screenshot is of a video that shows the list along with the name of the channel and the video title (which correlates with other news of the creator releasing an anti-Google video). So the list, for all purposes of this discussion, is part of the video.
That's a good find that famous people are getting into FOSS (should be free as in freedom too).
But it's really not a good thing that they spread a non expert speaking to the crowd.
Tier lists are meant to be mainly subjective and pretty relative to the person that made it.
In that way Pewdipie could quote experts but in no case should make a tier list based on what he found the last weeks (I didn't fully watched the video so maybe I'm wrong and he made a big disclaimer)
I didn't find any specifics in that article. What does it mean that the documentation was asked to be more gender neutral? I can't think of any gendered documentation I have read from any other projects.
The user was referred to as "he" in the all the documentation. Random made up example "if the user wants to change his settings he will click this button in the top left" or whatever.
A very normal PR was raised that just changed these uses to be gender neutral and it was declined for being too political.
Thanks for claryfing. I'm not well versed in using git, but does the PR mean that all the work to change the pronouns was already done? All the owner of the repo had to do was accept the changes?
It's a youtuber, who made this, and people feel hurt, because he doesn't put their browser at the top. That's just sad. He puts Firefox at the top - I use Firefox, and I still don't care what he thinks about it. I make informed choices, it's not religion for me...
Quite literally the opposite. The first minute does not answer my question about why he has been appearing all over lemmy. Neither do the comments here.
Sure he's trying to degoogle. Hence this post, but that is not what I asked.
Unclear if you're a troll or just choosing to be dense...
With this, Vivaldi remains as the only usefull browser from Europe. Konqueror is usefull only for certain tech collectives.
List of alternatives
Gecko browsers, nice and valid, but if you need a sync function, if you don't have an own third party or selfhosted one, you need an account with Mozilla, which itself has turned in an advertising company and your account data is shared with Alphabet. They only exist because of the support from Google.
Without sync, maybe Zen or Floorp.
Blink (Chromium) browser
Brave, but ads and some shady relations with crypto companies and supported by Facebook.
Opera is as private as Chrome or EDGE itself, even less
Otter Browser (Qt5), nice one, but with difficults to survive.
SSuite Netsurf (WebView), nice and fast, also reasonable private, but apart the inclusion of the SSuite online Tools, not much possibility to customize (Windows only)
The last 2 maybe usefull in old PC with few resources.
There are also some other marginal forks, but mostly without warranty to be further attended and updated. This is the current panorama, anybody to their like.
Brave is a series scam company.
Exactly I'd even use Chrome before I'd ever touch Brave.
Would you mind giving some context? Ive never used Brave, but my dad does. In which sense is it a "scam"? Would want him to switch if its terrible
People care more about CEO's opinion on politics and hate Web3 crypto more than they understand technical browser stuff.
Brave is far from perfect and the company had their contreveries but honestly if you disable all the cryptocrap and tweak it a tiny bit so it does not show you ads and feature you don't use it is the best chromium browser in regards to security and privacy.
Ungoogled chromium by default can't even compare, it's not crap but brave does so much more than it's better for the vast majority of users.
Good summary! Thank you!
And yet it uses less RAM in Android phones compared to my goat, Firefox... Man FF needs a lot of improvements, all my complaints come from Android, the browser is perfect even on macOS!
Firefox still doesn't support tab groups on mobile. That's a non-starter for me. Hopfully Ladybird has their shit better put together than mozilla when they finally release their browser
I haven't heard about that browser, it seems that it does its own thing, IDK man, if FF that has years in the market and still hasn't caught up, I have no big hopes for "new" projects.
brave search otoh is pretty gud. I believe they even do their own indexing.
Ive used Brave for about 2 years. Its great. I have everything turned off, and all shields up, plus deactivated 'Leo' AI. Whats not to like?
Firefox is a monopoly's pet
all hail lynx
Is there anything emacs cannot do?
sed has left the chat
Y'all are seriously still using the internet?
AFAIK it hasn't been used as an OS yet (meaning init - the thing you start after bootloader). Or a bootloader
Right?
Richard Stallman style!
My brain read this to the tune of Gangnam Style
Making a joke about a ridiculous habit is hardly making someone a hero.
Just because PewDiePie switched to Linux doesn't mean we should listen to his browser recommendations
True but he's sparking more interest in FOSS so that's still a good thing. I doubt his advice is perfect but if it gets more people started onto their own journey it's a win.
You're right about that, I was moreso saying that his crappy browser tier list isn't worth sharing
Very true, I feel like people miss the point of his own experience and/or opinion
not his recommendations
People on Lemmy seem to be Pewdiepie bootlickers. Idk why but it's really weird. Apparently you can do whatever but as long as you promote Linux, Lemmy will love you. Ridiculous.
I know it's been said, but Brave is a hard no. Replace it with Ungoogled Chromium. I haven't seen the video so I don't understand why it's in the "not ideal for a normal human" list, and I am biased since I use plenty of "not for normal" tools.
I believe its this: https://lemmy.world/post/32106925/17916457
Brave 🤮
This is a random screenshot he used in hos video for roughly 2 seconds. This is not his tierlist.
that is not his list, just a random screenshot.
Yeah i just checked the video and it appeared for like 2 seconds as a side note. He never even tried Brave apparently.
probably just his editor put it for the video
What exactly has he done to warrant considering this? He's a yt star, not a privacy expert.
tits no his list
Somehow even less useful, since the source can't even be verified.
He's been getting into FOSS and privacy lately
So explicitly not an expert.
Yeah but he was never claiming to be. I don't think he made any direct recommendations in the video.
Just him documenting his own journey de-googling.
My point is it serves no purpose here.
Brave? Hard no. Vivaldi? Also no.
Also, where are qutebrowser and Zen?
qutebrowser and IceCat are real top of the game when it comes to privacy. But then, they break some of the sites functionality, especially IceCat who seems to be going under the "if your site doesn't work, it's your site's problem" motto.
Which is honestly fair? Like, i would enjoy a "unsafe site, access anyways?" button, but if privacy settings break a page that literally is the pages fault for not respecting privacy.
Edit: typo
Kinda, but I would like to tailor my experience a bit more than "all or nothing".
IceCat is directly a GNU project, so it's highly ideological - which is important and respectable in a way, but then it gets adoption to near-zero because most sites just don't work out of the box, and to make it work properly means completely removing all safeguards that make IceCat make sense. There's little in between.
I'd rather have something like LibreWolf, but without phone-home functionality, or at least a switch to turn it off. Out of all Firefox forks I know, only IceCat respects user privacy in this way - 0 connections on startup, and then only connection to actual site and whatever it requires.
Opt-in telemetry (ideally - leveled) and manual bug information sending are totally fine, though.
What's bad about Vivaldi?
It’s proprietary
The UI is as far as I know proprietary
Nothing in the browser should be proprietary. Any proprietary part is a possibility of malice, and browsers are mission critical.
I don’t disagree with that. It’s just that most browsers are built that way, unfortunately. Nothing is free, not even Firefox. If you want to sell it, it’s hard to maintain reasonable expectations that people won’t just build it from source instead of buying it. Something 100% free can’t maintain itself over long time.
Firefox is open source, and while it takes some shady practices to fund it (it sure isn't cheap to run your own damn engine alongside everything on top), I take it as a more tenable compromise. It's not about free as in beer freedom, it's about basic security.
You can also have degoogled Chromium which is open-source if you're into it.
Even EDGE is a ungoogled Chromium (but containing M$ tracking APIs instead). Vivaldi IS a degoogled Chromium, a small part of the UI (by far the most advanced one of any other browser) is proprietary, but not really obfuscated, they show even in the support forum how the user can modding it, if for him isn't enough what he can do in the most complete setting page ever, the only thing is, you can't use it for other browser projects. It's certainly not a privacy or security issue.
Chromium as is, is 100% FLOSS but because of this isn't more private or secure as a proprietary soft, FLOSS isn't automaticly synonym of privacy and security, a lot of people confuse it, it's not the propósit of OpenSource, privacy and security of an soft depends only of the intentions of the developer or company, not if their soft is OSS or not. The user can audit the soft, which in any case is needed if he don't want or be able to check millons of lines in the code which a complex soft like a browser engine has.
Not of his. This is a known widespread tierlist made by other person (I do not remember if this came from Reddit, a YT video or what, but it is well known)
... I don't think listening to random big influencers is a good way forward (in anything).
(As to the list - others already pointed out everything, y'all nerds know shit! <3)
LibreWolf W. Missing my boy Zen Browser on there tho
Edit: also RIP Mull 😔✊
What happened to mull ? :o
The DivestOS project mostly discontinued. There is a Fork called IronFox
Ppl focusing on the negative. It's just his subjective list. He doesn't claim to be an expert. Lemmy autism peaking here. More exposure to foss is good guys
I've looked into it and it's not even his tier list, just one he found online.
The only problem with Ungoogled that makes it "not ideal for a normal human" is that fact that it is still cumbersome af to download it. Regular people don't know github and how to click on "show all assets" and pick the right build.
Isn't installing extensions in it also a pain, since the Google webstore doesn't let you install from it?
I guess to answer my own question, I looked it up - there's an extension to let you do that alongside some flag changes, so I guess not too bad... But it's another step on the list of things you'd want to do as a user
Yeah that extension should be shipped with the browser to make things easier.
Is https://download-chromium.appspot.com/ not good enough?
I don't use this as a my main browser though, just for testing. I don't recommend Chromium backends due to Google control over it.
That's not Ungoogled Chromium, at all. Not even close.
Right, is https://github.com/ungoogled-software/ungoogled-chromium then? Take like 4 clicks to get a working AppImage.
No I did not and I'm not sure what you imagine "regular users" might be. I feel that if someone goes the extra length to get their browser outside of a store, they can do the same with extensions, is it extravagant?
Not a problem in Vivaldi, you can install even pure scripts as extension, without the need of an Userscript Manager, like TamperMonkey or similar. Due to the great amount of features, most extension from the Chrome Store are anyway redundant.
Ngl, feel like his tier list is based on usability while avoiding big tech.
Tbh even if this tierlist is not the best or great, it still is "good enough". Plus the most important thing is to get tons of people interested.
I rather have "good enough" tier list that reaches to millions of people, then have a perfect tierlist that only reaches out to less than a dozen people.
Because amongst the millions of people who are interested, thousands of them will do their own research into privacy and dig deeper into it.
Plus right now, the biggest weakness of privacy is the fact that our community is too small to make an impact.
Having someone give this much outreach and influence to attract attention towards privacy is a good thing. (well, as long as their advice are on the positive end of the spectrum, and pewdiepie's advise surely is, even if its not perfect)
Sir, this is 2025, we don't do nuanced opinions here anymore.
Superiority complex in the comments.
Never seen anoyone rank brave alongside or even above standard firefox.
No Mull?
Isn't mull dead?
Still can't believe that Pewdiepie became one of those Linux youtubers, only thing missing is linux distro reviews and why he can't use X software xD
I kinda think Floorp is better than waterfox
Floorp is amazing
I'm considering switching to Floorp, I'll need to check of Pewdiepie has his reasons and what those are.
He barely touches on the topic of browsers, it's like 40 second segment, i don't think he even made the tier list.
Kim Kardashian's face care routine.
Putting Cromite at the bottom most tier makes me discard the entire thing.
And Brave at the top lmao.
This dude poopoopie has always been garbage.
Your comment made me look at the list again. I didn’t even realise Brave is located at the very top.
Also, why is “not ideal for a normal human” at the middle of the list?
Garbage, indeed.
Doesn’t matter if it is his list nor did I ever say it was garbage because it is his.
It is garbage, objectively.
What a weird thing to argue.
It doesn’t matter whether the list is part of the video or whether it was created by PewDiePie.
The list, in the screenshot of OP, is garbage.
Besides, the same screenshot is of a video that shows the list along with the name of the channel and the video title (which correlates with other news of the creator releasing an anti-Google video). So the list, for all purposes of this discussion, is part of the video.
That's a good find that famous people are getting into FOSS (should be free as in freedom too). But it's really not a good thing that they spread a non expert speaking to the crowd.
Tier lists are meant to be mainly subjective and pretty relative to the person that made it. In that way Pewdipie could quote experts but in no case should make a tier list based on what he found the last weeks (I didn't fully watched the video so maybe I'm wrong and he made a big disclaimer)
If you watch the video, Felix tells you twice in the same sentence that he uses Arch.
Lemmy had taught me that this means Felix IS an expert on FOSS
How sorry didn't know, so that make him really one of the biggest expert in FOSS 100%
Right? Lol
Why is the open source Chromium ranked worse than Google Chrome?
I like my browser hard AF
Where's ladybird
Edit - I didn't know about the Transphobia going on there. that is unjustifiable.
In the trash with the rest of the transphobes
Wait, something happened with ladybird? Or is just a joke?
This is a fairly unbiased writeup
https://toxigon.com/2025-ladybird-unjustifiable
I didn't find any specifics in that article. What does it mean that the documentation was asked to be more gender neutral? I can't think of any gendered documentation I have read from any other projects.
The user was referred to as "he" in the all the documentation. Random made up example "if the user wants to change his settings he will click this button in the top left" or whatever.
A very normal PR was raised that just changed these uses to be gender neutral and it was declined for being too political.
Thanks for claryfing. I'm not well versed in using git, but does the PR mean that all the work to change the pronouns was already done? All the owner of the repo had to do was accept the changes?
Correct!
Thx :D That was a good read. I didn't know about that
Neither did I. Wow dead before arrival.
Still in development
gimmie a download link
I mean ladybird certainly would be lowest tier, considering you first have to compile yourself 😂 also it's pre alpha state...
But it'll be interesting to see how far they've come on 1 year
Ladybird Trattoria? About 10 minutes away from Linus Media Group.
Not sure why you asked but you now have an answer, hope it helps
No Zen-Browser (though I am not sure when this vid was made), and Pale Moon should be in the "Not ideal for a normal human" at best.
It's a youtuber, who made this, and people feel hurt, because he doesn't put their browser at the top. That's just sad. He puts Firefox at the top - I use Firefox, and I still don't care what he thinks about it. I make informed choices, it's not religion for me...
He didn't even made this, is a screenshot of a bunch of browsers that appears for 2 seconds on a video.
Seeing a lot of criticisms. Is there a better tier list then?
Hey, Cromite is great. Take it under "solid".
Stop sharing and platforming the nazi
Also, this tierlist sucks fucking balls
Oh god how are there so many of you freaks
Instance-based tribalism is stupid. I'd expect as much from a .world-er 🙃
Sarcasm, captain.
Says the banned user.
Why would you even follow his advice, he's found a new way to generate clicks just ignore his advice.
He doesn't even know mull?
Why is this guy popping up so much lately on Lemmy? I remember thinking this guy was a piece of shit about a decade ago...
I haven't kept up with the times. Was I right? Or did I become an angry old man 20 years to early?
You could just watch the video
Watching the video is unlikely to answer my question.
It is quite the opposite. It will answer your question in it's first 30secs. Even reading the other comments here will. Lol.
Quite literally the opposite. The first minute does not answer my question about why he has been appearing all over lemmy. Neither do the comments here.
Sure he's trying to degoogle. Hence this post, but that is not what I asked.
Unclear if you're a troll or just choosing to be dense...
You might be trolling. Good luck leading your life with that wit.
Ah, clearly a degen troll. My lemmy will be a better place with you on the block list.
Slow guy doesn't even know what degen means.
What's with Mull being at the very bottom? It was the best Firefox app
It is no longer maintained
With this, Vivaldi remains as the only usefull browser from Europe. Konqueror is usefull only for certain tech collectives.
List of alternatives
There are also some other marginal forks, but mostly without warranty to be further attended and updated. This is the current panorama, anybody to their like.
Crazy to see how much people on here hate this guy
He did not promote it though. He said he uses firefox.
Librewolf is cancer for regular use
What issues did you encounter?