Disapproval of Elon Musk is top reason Tesla owners are selling, survey says
The disapproval of Elon Musk is the top reason Tesla Model 3 owners are selling their electric vehicles and going for another brand, according to a new survey of 5,000 Model 3 owners.
https://electrek.co/2023/07/27/disapproval-elon-musk-top-reason-tesla-owners-selling-survey/Open linkView original on lemmy.world2093
Comments408
Tesla spent years building a brand identity that is intimately woven together with Musk. It’s damaged goods now as far as I’m concerned. Every time I encounter one of its products I think about it. It wasn’t too long ago when I was eagerly following product updates in the hopes of eventually buying a car power wall or that solar roof system. I was enthusiastic about rationalizing away the poor build quality and terrible customer support. Now, I would never buy a thing from them and I’m happy to pass judgement on anyone who does. $tslaq
Even beyond Musk the quality of Tesla’s for the price is absolute shit. His presence just makes it even worse. The main selling point for them was the higher range but seems like that may have been a lie the whole time.
Where can I buy an electric Ford Focus?
On the used market? It was discontinued in 2018. A quick Google search found several for sale.
Ford currently has Explorer and Mustang as full EVs, but also the Puma among others from sometime next year.
Ugh I'm so annoyed by the SUVification of vehicles
I am a wagon fan. I had long wondered why Europe had all these nice wagons and here in the US we had countless crappy SUV models and very few (if any) wagons. Back in the 70's and 80's emissions were the reason manufacturers moved from car-based larger capacity vehicles to truck-based. They simply did not have to meet nearly the same emissions requirements. Sucks for you consumer (and environment)!
That was a compliance car and it's not even remotely competitive with a modern EV, so no thanks.
Not hard to be worse than musk when you lived from 1863-1947 lol.
Yeah, being anti-semitic and racist is kinda the default for white folks back then, source half my ancestry is rich white folks the other half is poor white folks.
I have it on good authority that he's not involved in the day to day running of the corporation.
He's been dead for 76 years.
Hello and welcome to the 21st century.
Seeing the new mustang I definitely believe Henry Ford is still at the helm of this ship directing Ford from the depths of hell.
You mean Edsel.
Henry Ford died almost 30 years before Elon Musk was even born.
Yeah? He’s been dead for decades. Who cares?
It sounds like you hate the idea of self driving cars... Weird
When I rent cars I usually reserve a Toyota Corolla, they are usually the cheapest or second cheapest rental category and they come with adaptive cruise with 3 choices of follow distance and I've been really impressed with it, as Subaru driver.
I hate the idea of "self-driving" cars Elon-style with no LIDAR.
Musk's taint on the brand is I think majorly based on this type of thing. His twitter purchase has revealed that he's a serial liar, and now people are seeing all of the ways that it is happening with Tesla. People tolerate assholes all of the time. What they don't want to tolerate is snake oil salesmen, and I'm not sure there has ever been a bigger one than Musk.
Fun fact: teslas are the most recalled car brand in the country.
I don’t discredit the work done by the engineers there, I’d argue they laid the groundwork to usher in the future of electric cars in this country. But of course all the credit goes to musk. Just another situation like Steve Jobs. See Bill Burrs bit on Jobs and replace him with Musk, same exact story.
How many of those are real serious recalls that they didn’t just fix with easy tweaks over the air? I hate Musk as much of the next guy but I follow a lot of EV YT channels and even the ones that don’t like Tesla acknowledge that the media overhyped the recalls given how many of them have been easy OTA fixes. Plus since they iterate very fast and don’t just update the car once every four years often it only affects a small subset. Like 1-4k cars in some cases rather than the typical 100k recall that Toyota would have.
https://youtu.be/1liOZ1fW1F8
As referenced.
If only he had cancer curing nanobots in his fruit salads.
You can't fight P.C. with apples.
Curious what quality issues you mean?
Here ya go: https://insideevs.com/news/549130/consumerreports-tesla-reliability-poor-2021/
Start here and I’m sure you’ll be able to guide yourself in this journey from there.
Tesla is the most recalled vehicle brand. That’s impressive. Looking at you Kia/hyundai and Nissan.
Musk himself admits Tesla has build quality issues
Search “Tesla panel gap issues”. Tons of people complaining and many say that trying to fix the issue causes other, bigger gaps, or just gets worse. I’ve heard rumor that if you try to fix them, you’ll void some kind of Tesla support.
Oh, and one of the most damning ones in my book. During a car fire, which Tesla has had PLENTY of, some genius decided that the door locks should default to LOCKED. Who the actual fuck thought this was acceptable? How did they ever make it into production.
There’s a video floating around of a guy kicking his windows out to escape his burning Tesla.
Dumb dumb musk decided he was smarter than everyone else, (spoiler he’s not) and overrode his own engineers. He decided there were no physical sensors required for auto driving, only cameras. Every other manufacturer knows that not possible yet, but musk knew better
Yes, a lot of car fires are difficult to extinguish, and yes, electric/hybrids more so, but teslas are exceptional. Can’t out out the many teslas that catch fire When the local fire dept came by to inspect our business we got to chatting and they said that they had a Tesla catch fire. They used everything in their arsenal, and a LOT of water. Like more than you could imagine. Then it got towed to a holding yard. Someone parked it up against a building, and next to quite a few other vehicles waiting for legal things/inspections. Tesla reignited in the tow yard and took out everything near it too. The yard is in BIG trouble for damaging a whole lot of evidence/vehicles being held for court cases, etc.
I could go on, but those are the biggest ones.
They've also found out the hard way that automotive grade parts exist for a reason.
https://www.thedrive.com/tech/27989/teslas-screen-saga-shows-why-automotive-grade-matters
Oh, yeah, I forgot about that.
There are also the people who got locked out of their cars because the battery died. Or even better the one that locked INSIDE their tesla when the 12v battery died. Getting locked inside a car, in AZ heat is deadly, VERY rapidly.
That's like the door failing to locked when the car is on fire, or in an accident. Who the fuck let that pass QC?
Leave no whiteness is Tesla motto
No it hasn't. Please point us to a source that shows Tesla having more fires than other EV brands, let alone ICE cars.
The claim isn't that they have more fires than other EV or ICE cars. The claim is that if they do have a fire they will trap you and your family in it.
Burning lithium and other exotic metals are class D fires. They are extraordinarily difficult to extinguish. They burn hot enough to break down water into oxygen and hydrogen. Mainly you let them burn themselves out and try to prevent them from spreading to other more traditionally combustible materials.
When I learnt this was the point where I decided that I didn't want a wall of Tesla fire bomb in my house...
I was trying to keep it short. I get why, I just was trying to avoid an essay.
They kinda remind me of the old VW bug magnesium fires.
I’m not a Musk fan at all but some of these are misleading or just downright wrong.
Tesla is only the most recalled brand if you categorize “recalls” to include software updates. If Tesla can fix an issue via an OTA update, it shouldn’t be considered a recall but it is in the source being used.
Teslas do have build issues but they’re not overwhelmingly more present than other cars. They’re only showing that way because Tesla only has 4 models of car and the build issues carry over from year to year. That’s not the case for other cars where, like with a Jetta, the body is redesigned but the name stays the same.
The door lock thing is also misleading because the case would be the same for any other car where the driver locked the doors. Either way, the fire department is breaking a window. They don’t have magic keys to open every car door out there. The fire department could pull on the handle all day long and it wouldn’t matter. The driver locked the doors and could have opened them but didn’t (and there’s even a special manual override for them along with a Fire Department quick access switch at the front of the car).
Edit: People are downvoting objectively true information.
https://www.autoblog.com/2022/12/29/most-recalls-by-car-manufacturer-2022/
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/smartselect_20191224-132903_adobe-acrobat-jpg.492495/
You missed the part where the driver was conscious and couldn't escape from the inside due to locked doors.
I didn’t miss crap. The cars have a mechanical release on the inside. If the driver was conscious, he could pull the switch which doesn’t need power and would unlock the doors. The OP’s comment and link were referencing the outside of the doors since the Model S has retractable handles that are flush with the door when they’re locked so there’s no handle to grab.
The only exception is the Model X since it has the full-wing doors. Those have a release that is only accessible if you pull off the speaker grill so you’d need to know about that ahead of time.
First and foremost, when you have a vehicle with an electric door lock, you ALWAYS fail it to open. On a "normal" car (yeah there are some that are all electric now too), you have a physical switch that you flip, and it's unlocked. The locking mechanism for the Tesla is electric, so in the case of the wires being damaged, or as witnessed, the car being on fire, you have no MECHANICAL mechanism to open the door. Supposedly, there is one INSIDE the door, lol what? but how many people will know that, and more importantly be able to access it in a panic?
I did a little more digging. SOME models are equipped with a mechanical release on the door (I assume it's something you have to pay extra for), but not all of them. As I mentioned above, there is a mechanical option, but you would have to know exactly to remove the door card trim panel, and access the cable. People don't even read enough of the owners manual to know how shit they really want works, let alone a safety issues.
Clearly you don't understand what a recall is. Recalls are highly regulated, and things like a software update for the aircon do not fall under the recall term. In fact, manufacturers do everything in their power to avoid recalls. They will often issue a TSB, instead, when a recall isn't being forced by the NHTSA. Good try though. As you can see from teslas own website (I don't believe this is even close to all of them) they are ALL safety issues, which is what recalls are for, either voluntary, or forced by NHTSA.
No, they absolutely have more build quality issues than even the lowest trim shit econoboxes. I always say that a tesla is a corolla with a big computer in it, but even the corolla is built WAY better, and I'm old enough to remember 80s cars. Those were pretty damn bad.
Hey... I loved my 80s Corolla. I drove it until it was practically dust. And it was a manual. You can barely even find manuals these days.
Miata is always the answer.
I’m not knocking corollas exactly. But they are what they are. They are cheap point a to point b appliances.
I’d say 80s cars had a lot more character anyhow. They were in a lot of ways more enjoyable.
First and foremost, how does a normal, non-Tesla car fail to an unlocked door? If the car caught fire and was locked, how does the car unlock the doors in your scenario? Teslas have a mechanical switch that’s no different from the situation you’ve described since the driver was passed out. The door needed to be opened from the outside so it’s literally no different for the Tesla.
Also, your digging was wrong. The Model 3, for example has a mechanical release right on the door that doesn’t need any digging or removal of anything. (https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/smartselect_20191224-132903_adobe-acrobat-jpg.492495/)
I know exactly what a recall is and you’re wrong again. In 2022 alone, Tesla came in 7th amongst auto manufacturers for recalls but 2nd in total cars affected because over-the-air fixes are still considered recalls. (https://www.autoblog.com/2022/12/29/most-recalls-by-car-manufacturer-2022/) Regardless of that, under no interpretation of it does Tesla have the most recalls of any car manufacturer, unless you include the OTA update recalls.
So it sounds like you don’t understand what a recall is.
Everything else you’ve said is subjective garbage. Unless you have some evidence to back up your claims, you’re just spreading more of the lies that are exactly what I’m complaining about. Tesla and Musk have enough real problems that you don’t need to make up their problems.
This, I read the article and it lays it out, even though it's misleading in it's title and conclusion.
Agreed. Not having the manual release for the back seats is dumb though.
False
Oh ok.
Probably stuff like this:
https://www.carscoops.com/2023/04/tesla-model-s-plaid-buyer-rants-about-poor-build-quality/
A lot of cheap surface level stuff. For example, my dad has a model 3, and the back of the passenger chair just falls off. And by the back I mean the hard plastic shell that holds the seat pocket for the passengers in the second row to use.
There have also been reports of things like mismatched tail lights, cars leaking when it rains, and bumpers just falling off. But I haven’t seen those in person.
Stuff like that.
Don’t forget when they had the issue with the glass roof flying off on the highway.
https://www.tesla-fire.com/
In addition, almost all big car manufacturers now have far better EVs in terms of quality, features, and looks. Tesla no longer has the monopoly they enjoyed for almost a decade. If you’re selling me an EV with this shit stain on it, I’d just go the shop next door.
Let his fascist followers buy his EVs….oh wait, they hate them. Remember all the rage against EVs in Texas that led to “rolling coal” in Teslas, purposely parking F250s to take up all the Tesla charging stations, vandalism at charging stations, keying Teslas parked at malls? Yeah, those are the people he is fighting for.
I wanted a Tesla for years. I even had stock which helped me buy my house.
I no longer want a Tesla and it 100% has to do with musk. And I decided that before I realized I'm trans.
On the other hand, maybe we should start a foundation to buy Teslas for trans people. Can you imagine how pissed Musk would get if it suddenly became cool to be trans in a Tesla?
I wanted a Tesla. I was ready to get a model 3. Then he went full blown ass clown and at first I thought it was a joke, like he was just messing around being funny. Then I realized how big of a dbag he really is and yeah, no thanks. I bought a CTS-V instead and although it's the opposite of fuel efficient, it's the most fun vehicle I've ever driven.
When we got on the wait-list for Starlink I thought he was a cool innovator type.
Luckily we've had the Starlink for a couple years now and I typically forget that his embarrassing ass has anything to do with it!
Glad we got it back then, I'd probably write it off now and not trust it/him enough to spend the money (it was a decent investment for equipment).
Lol so are the CEOs of all the other manufacturers people to look up to and admire? Would you buy a Volkswagen or did you own one when Martin Winterkorn was running it?
Elon is a man child, I don’t look to him for any insights or knowledge, would I buy a Tesla? Ya if the car itself is good, if it’s not good then I wouldn’t buy it. It wouldn’t have anything to do with Musk however
Who do you bank with? Do you hold those CEOs to the same standards and not use their products?
Good luck buying anything where there isn’t some ethical issues surrounding the people who are the the top of those corporations
Most other ceos shut their mouth and let the product speak. Tesla/Elon’s mo has been to have the product in the background with him at the forefront, that worked well until it didn’t
But what if he is too big to fail? I mean how long have we been talking about musk? And it doesn’t look like anything is changing
Not sure where we disagree here? You are right the jackass just can’t keep his mouth shut I don’t care what his beliefs are though, I don’t go to corporations for my ethics, I go to them because I want to buy a product
Well put you made a great point
I prefer my evil rulers behind the curtain, thank you very much!
*this is in no way a defence of Musk it's a pointing out how ridiculous it is to see a problem with him but not care about the other obscenely wealthy capitalists who not only exploit labour and hoard resources, but also basically own government via either corruption (aka "lobbying") or direct representation (ie all the rich fucks in government making rules for themsleves and their friends), just like Musk, simply because they're "polite" enough to do it behind closed doors.
That's not to say don't buy the things you need, it's to say don't be deluded in to thinking that it matters. As long as capitalism exists, governance by and for the rich isn't going anywhere, and your money will always be going to one of maybe a couple dozen people.
There is no ethical consumption under capitalism
A big lesson from Trump and others like him is that when someone's a piece of shit and brags about it in public, it looks innocuous and at best it may be revealing and may validate your views on power and the flaws of society, but on another level he's likely to give voice to, rally and convince other assholes to feel entitled and protected to act like assholes and then you have an actual problem. So yes, polite amorality is better.
It worked well for a long time but it makes sense if people lose faith in Musk they lose faith in Tesla. Because he is synonymous with the brand.
They haven't built their brands around the reputation of their ceo.
How can you evaluate if a car is good? It has recently been revealed that Tesla/Musk was exaggerating their range so severely that Tesla owners thought their cars were defective. Tesla has been trading on a reputation of 'goodness' that it didn't deserve.
Tesla is seeing repercussions from risks they took tying their brand so tightly with Musk.
If anyone bought a Tesla because of Musk they were idiots, so same logic applies the other way
You could argue Apple built its brand around Jobs (who died because of his moronic beliefs about natural cures) and now Cook… pretty sure Apple kowtows to Chinese censorship and also does shitty things (I’m typing this on an iPhone right now) so I’m no fan of Jobs or Cook I just don’t give a fuck about them, I bought it because it’s the best phone for me
The range issues are pretty funny, people thinking they were defective is comical, I will however point out that is nothing new all auto manufacturers have done this for the decades with fuel economy numbers, I can’t tell you how many people we would have come through the dealership complaining about fuel economy after buying a new car
As far as evaluating if a car is good or not of course you can do that, do research on reliability issues, check recalls, ask friends and family who have actually owned them if they are any good, if you have a mechanic that you know ask them
I object to giving my hard earned money to evil people. I recommend the same.
Nothing wrong with that but.. again do you do that across the board all the time because if you do congrats it’s not an easy thing to accomplish
And I’m not dumb I know it doesn’t have to be an all or nothing, doing it when you can is great I just can’t stand people who pontificate about shitheads like Musk but buy all their shit from Amazon
Easier said than done, unless one doesn't have money to begin with
In that case you must then remove yourself from society, since not only does at least 90% of the money you spend end up in the pockets of evil people, but evil people are also keeping much if not most of your hard earned money for themselves before you ever know it existed by paying you less than your labour is worth (what you earned them).
This is a feature, not a bug.
You have a choice. I choose to vote with my wallet.
Ah the ole "you're a hypocrite because your life contains contradictions"... Elon musk shoved his way into my life but according to you my buying decisions are wrong if I don't actively ignore that douche
It’s less about hypocrisy and more about what’s wrong with just buying something and not having it also have to be an existential moral crisis, don’t buy a Tesla because you think Musk is a genius but if you already own one and are gonna sell it because of Musk then that’s also ridiculous, if you are looking for an electric car and strictly won’t buy it even if it’s the best option based on the money then that just seems over the top to me is all
I have a bank account yet I’m no fan of banks, I’m typing on an iPhone, apple does shitty things, I buy shit from Amazon when I have to… I despise billionaires
it's really easy just to let people not spend their money where they don't want to.
Biggest issue is social. Buying a Tesla associates you positively with musk (by design), and from my experience most Tesla owners are incredibly annoying about it. I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to avoid the stigma. Same reason people buy Harleys - the brand name and cultural associations on a vehicle matter a lot, sometimes even more than the car itself.
I can see what you are saying but that’s not a universal thing, like when it comes to Tesla I never associated that with Musk he’s just the shithead that owns it, to me it’s more about the most widely available semi affordable electric car you could buy since the legacy manufacturers dragged their asses wasting time with hydrogen and hybrids
I guess the difference I have here with people is exactly that, I don’t attach him as being Tesla
That was a good way of putting it describing it like a Harley, makes sense. I ride motorbikes and I dgaf about what brand I own, I’d ride anything including a Harley
You can't have a rational discussion about Tesla on lemmy. So many people are so sick of hearing about Musk that only those who REALLY hate him will click on an article about him. Those people can not separate the product from the vocal dirtbag that is its CEO.
It's not worth even trying here.
The most upvoted comments certainly are not.
Because you disagree with them?
No, because they are clearly wrong.
Yes, people will throw reality in your face. Horrible.
Musk is a horrible person, so anyone who likes a Tesla is wrong for liking the car.
Totally rational.
This, coming from a user base on Lemmy who is supposed to be the opposite of facist conservatives.
I don't care about downvotes for giving my opinion, but so many people in this thread are intrenched in their beliefs as any MAGA fool.
Yes, people don't like supporting a horrible person. How irrational.
The fascist conservative mindset is to support horrible people, so yes, lemmy is against that.
It's ok, I hear Truth Social is a safe haven for your belief system.
I personally think Musk is a massive pile of garbage but that wouldn’t make me not buy a Tesla, I’ll buy it if it’s a decent car, if I had the money right now it would be between a Tesla and an Ionic
People trying to tie their purchases to the ethics of the people who run the companies are divorced from reality imo
If I already had a Tesla I don't know that I'd sell it because of him, but he was one of the major factors in me not even considering them when I was shopping for my EV. The other reasons being shoddy quality control, shitty practices, and dumb design decisions. All of which probably stem from him anyway.
I'd be looking to sell it, specifically because of him.
The willingness for him to make executive decisions to fuck people using his platforms is what frightens me. He'll cut starlink for people he doesn't like. He'll snipe twitter accounts of people he doesn't like.
Since Teslas can be remotely force fed new updates, I genuinely believe it's just a matter of time before he starts fucking with peoples cars. I expect as a way to use Tesla owners as pawns to apply political pressure in areas w/ high ownership that enact tax policy he doesn't like.
My friends already sold their Teslas a few months ago.
It was such a wild ride watching them go, "Surely he's not serious" to "I'm embarrassed to drive this".
I wouldn't doubt he'd try that, but if he did he'd be in for a world of hurt since people need their cars to get to work. I imagine the government wouldn't take kindly to people's 5 digit dollar purchased not working on the whims of a crazy billionaire.
It doesn't have to be as blatant as turning them off. Just garnishing features. Nerfing sentinel, range, top speed, etc.
I can almost hear the bullshit. "X state's lithium recycling tax policy means we have to limit discharge to 80% to avoid premature battery degredation. Drivers may notice a range reduction but it is required to operate within this new regulatory environment"
Yeah, if my car was beyond repair tomorrow and I needed a new one, I'd be getting either a Hyundai Ioniq 6 or a Silverado EV. A few years ago, I would've been leaning toward the Model 3.
I really want a bolt euv but I’m put off by them cancelling and then uncancelling it. I’m worried what will happen when they stop making the car (and therefore parts for it) a year or two after I bought it…
No car is made forever, even a next generation isn't going to use the same parts and this has regularly happened with cars when they make new generations, it's not a new problem.
Please don't buy that one due to significant safety concerns with the i-pedal driving mode feature https://youtu.be/U0YW7x9U5TQ
First, that's the Ioniq 5.
Second, they've updated it.
https://mobilesyrup.com/2023/06/16/hyundai-update-ioniq-5-brake-lights-more-responsive-with-regeneration-on/
THANK GOD. Also thank you for sharing this information. That fact scared the actual shit out of me
Yeah, hopefully other EV designers learn from this.
Just don't use one pedal mode.
So. What's your plan here exactly? Are you just going to tell all of the owners don't use that feature or ?
I'm saying if you want an EV6 and you don't care about one pedal driving, then you don't have to worry about that problem. It's an optional driving mode that I personally don't use since I dislike it.
While I understand your perspective I don't think you're seeing mine.
I understand I don't have to use that feature, I'm concerned about the (now fixed) safety violation the feature presents by not indicating that someone is breaking when those drivers who want to use it choose to do so.
Simply saying "don't use it" only fixes it in one instance.
I'm concerned about it too, but telling people "don't buy it" isn't any more helpful than saying "don't use this feature."
Same. I had to get a new car recently. Prices were crazy and I wish I had gone with a new instead of a used. But Tesla was off the list from the beginning. I figured I'd wait one more car to get electric. Should be in a new place by then where I can install a home charger too, and the prices will probably be drastically lower by the time my current car dies again.
teslas were cool when they were the only practical electric cars, especially sports cars. but that's no longer true and it's becoming less so every year. may as well get a mach-e or a ioniq and ditch muskyboy
its funny how selling a car brand as “eco” friendly backfires when you’re a fascist cunt
I will probably buy an EV in the next year but I have zero interest in a Tesla. Musk is the reason.
Yeah I think this is a bigger risk for Tesla than current owners selling.
I'm not in the market for a car right now but there's a decent chance that the next one I buy will be an EV. Up until maybe 2 years ago I'd have said a Tesla would have been top of the list for options. I don't really feel that way anymore, and Musks instability is the primary reason.
I think his antics will have a snowball effect on future sales.
make the whole brand about me as a person
act like an insufferable prick
?????
profit!
I think it's more about how those types of buyers view the manufacturers reliability long term. The man is unhinged and has proven with Twitter that if given the chance he will willingly fuck over users. Imagine giving a bully the ability to limit your driving range or disabling your vehicle on a whim because he decides he doesn't like you or what your local govt says.
Not saying he would do it but he has proven repeatedly to be unstable enough to believe he could escape punishment for doing it.
I aspired to own a Tesla before musk started showing his colours now I would find it embarrassing
I used to want a Tesla... Now I don't. That's 60% Elon and 40% their poor build quality.
The second percentage should be higher. It's not, though. Elon is a very hateable person due to his low IQ, and astronomically high level of arrogance.
I’m sure the anti-woke crowd he is pandering to is going to jump in and buy up all the teslas
My partner needed to buy a new vehicle. A Tesla Model was easily in budget. But they opted not to buy one because they want zero affiliation with Musk or any connotations that they may endorse his behavior by owning one of his products.
FWIW, they're also terribly made cars that keep poorly.
Anecdotally I have to disagree.
I really enjoy our Model 3 and Model Y. After renting an ID.4 for a week in Norway I find that the Tesla setup is a lot more "no nonsense" than other OEMs.
For example the ID.4 has many "safety" features that help center the car in the land if it detects that you are leaving the road. In Norway that have very narrow roads and you often have to pull over to the shoulder (far past the lane edge) to let a car pass.
To turn those settings off in an ID.4 I had to dig through a menu and disable them every time I get into the car. Every. Time.
Tesla's UI experience is much more like a smart phone with persistence like one would expect. Like or hate the form factor, the infotainment on Tesla's are done about as well as you can with a giant touch screen in my opinion.
I really fucking loath Musk these days though and wish he would be ousted from Tesla.
Not really fair to compare the ID.4 against your Teslas. The Audi Etron on the other hand has a far superior infotainment system compared to the Tesla and none of the issues from the base model VW.
I'm not accusing of intentionally comparing apples to oranges, but given the price brackets you made a really terrible argument.
The price brackets seem the same to me. Our Model 3's config is actually cheaper than it's similar ID.4 spec, where as an etron is like $30k MORE.
Oh no doubt that was also a big factor, but even if they were well built high quality cars, it would still be a non-starter as long as Elno has anything to do with the company.
I hear a range of issues with Teslas that mostly come down to shoddy manufacture.
Either way all cars are bad, EV or no, and only collective transport solves any of our problems. Short term, buying a used gas vehicle is still less harmful to the environment.
Same experiences here since 2018.
Musk is a fuckwad but he's not hand building the cars, these comments reek of children and ignorance.
Decades of traditional automakers sabotaging the whole concept of EVs should make them the bad guys when it comes to EVs.
Elon has managed to make them the good guys.
That's the risk when your brand is a "status symbol" and the company is closely linked with your personality.
Steve Jobs knew how to do this well. Elon is no Steve Jobs...
Imagine Steve Jobs taking to Twitter calling all doctors pedos for trying to fix cancer with chemotherapy instead of fructose syrup.
Funny that you mention the fructose as Jobs died from treating his cancer "..with a vegan diet, acupuncture, herbs, bowel cleansings, and other remedies that he found online. At one point, he even reached out to a psychic."
https://allthatsinteresting.com/steve-jobs-death
At the Trader Joe's, it used to be 20% Teslas but now it's like 1 or 2.
Leased a tesla MS in 2017 because I knew 250mile battery was not going to be the max in 2020 and guessed 350mile was possible (i was right). Right around then Elon came out as a conspiracy twat, so I was more than happy to turn my car in when he went full right wing twat.
3 years on, I’m the proud owner of an ebike with a few thousand miles on it, created by a company not owned by a twat. My insurance is $50 a month and my uber rides fall far below anything I spent monthly on my insurance and lease payment ($1300 or so). Helps to work from home and live 5 miles from most places I need to go to or from the public transit.
Honestly, had he kept his insane ideas to himself I might still own that car or it’s newer version. I do miss it, but I just can’t support people like that. Also, 3 years on I don’t miss the car payments…
Funny but when I see a Tesla, I now judge the owner. Never used to care one way or another but.
Ngl, I wouldn't be caught dead with a Tesla these days.
Since the seeing ordeal someone went through here in Canada and his Telsa, I wouldn't own one if given to me.
Water condensation dripping from the AC compressor on top of the batteries is just bad design and lack of foresight.
Transport Canada said that was awful and the reason for his faulty battery/batteries and Teslsa still said, nah you on your own.
Forget that noise.
I love my Tesla, but I don't think my next car will be one because of Musk and what he's done to the brand. Really disappointing that he's put the same people who've coal rolled and iced chargers instead of his loyal, reservation making, early adopting FSD clients like me. I'm watching the expanding market with excitement as other companies are rolling out vehicles with nicer features and comparable pricetags than current Teslas.
For Tesla, it's a bad time for the cult of personality to fall apart as more electric car competition comes out every year.
I was an early tesla fanboy and always wanted one, I finally have my finances in a place where a new car isn't an awful decision and went with the ID4 just so I didn't have to deal with that guy in any way shape or form.
His last name is being used as a verb now from what I'm hearing
Its when you are delusionally confidet and try to do something but you mess it up so bad that it would have been better if you did NOTHING!
Friend 1: I'm the best cook ever! I'll make you the best meal!
Friend 1: Burns box mac and cheese
Friend 2: "You really Musked that up!"
He's the reason I didn't even entertain the thought of buying a Tesla when I was in the market for an EV. I ended up buying a Kia EV6
How is it?
I got one this year and really love it - the drive is quite peppy, range is much better than advertised, and it's a comfortable car. There are a few minor downsides, such as I've encountered a few glitches along the way (occasionally the driver side mirror won't go back to the normal position automatically after backing up), but these seem to be pretty minimal and are getting fixed with software updates.
We got one. it's absolutely awesome. My only complaints are the automatic seat changes not occurring until after I'm wedged into my short wife's seat and select myself as the driver, and the soft button selection that controls both radio and AC. The number of times I've frozen my butt off instead of turning down the volume is too high.
Other than that, it's fast, very spacious backseat, great amenities (cooling/heated front and heated back), and has great range, and rapid recharge capabilities (20->80% in 18 minutes with a fast charger). We call it the spaceship.
I'll echo the other replies. I'm really enjoying it.
I was going to buy the GT just because it's dumb but come to find out you miss out on some features of the "lesser" models, as well as losing a decent amount of range. You can't get power or cooled front seats and its estimated range is down to ~200 miles.
I ended up with the AWD GT-Line which is still pretty quick but has 50+ miles of range over the GT as well as the power/cooled front seats.
Like @geogle said, the climate/radio screen is weird but I got used to it pretty quickly. The one thing that bugs me the most is the skip forward/backwards buttons for music or podcasts are (what I think) backwards. They are up/down arrows and the down arrow skips forward and the up arrow skips backwards.
The only other thing I'm somewhat annoyed by is the lack of wireless car play/android auto. You can buy an adapter but it feels silly they wouldn't have included it on a 2023 $60k vehicle
Maybe Teslas will come with disguise kits, where you can switch the Tesla logo with a different brand. Just like Twitter created the option to hide the Twitter blue checkmark...
Isn’t it also the fact that everything he touches explodes and ends up being an unsafe product? I’d rather buy any other brand before buying Tesla, even regardless of his extremely unlikable personality and dumbass choices.
i wouldn't buy a pack of cigarettes from that wannabe supervillain
They totally selected the most punchable face photo of his.
You say that as if there are face shots of him that aren't extremely punchable
Yah, I had to laugh at that statement. I think the media folks go out of their way to find the punchable-face pics too as all of them seem to fit that bill.
I took an Uber for the first time on Friday, which was also my first time in a Tesla. It didn't seem very comfortable. The driver also didn't signal very often.
Everyone is realising what Phoney Stark really is.
When the cybertruck was first announced I was interested solely due to how unique it was, and for taking it out into the wilderness for camping with a giant battery. Now, I won't even consider even owning anything with the Tesla name. No way in hell.
The thing is so ugly tho, I just can't get behind it. Well, I mean, Elon is a large reason now, but even before that.
That & build quality.
Teslas have horrible build quality.
Said it before. Great cars sadly built in America. Chinese and European ones have no issues.
We are hearing horrible things about the Teslas manufactured in Germany from the people working there. Employees leave that place in droves, not only because of the abysmal way they are treated, but also because of the awful quality they are forced to produce there. The question is not where it’s produced, it is the company.
We? Source? Sounds very interesting.
Not seen anything from owners stating anything like that from EU or Chinese models. I'm not saying it's not possible just it's not being widely reported by credible organisations or by end users as far as I can see.
I've no horse in this race btw, I just hate echo chambers and rampant tribalism. EV are still a hotbed of both.
You're either lying or living under a rock.
There was literal mass protesting and vandalism of Tesla stores in China due to "ghost braking" and other safety/performance items that musk refused to take care of. This started end of last year and continued into the 1H23, just to catch you up on your facts.
It's funny how it's always the ones who don't have a fucking clue, who see consensus and agreement as an "echo chamber and rampant tribalism".
That's a lot of anger directed at someone you don't know about something you don't own by a company you down use owned by someone who you hate who doesn't know you exist. You're going off at a random person on the Internet because what, I didn't immediately side with you? And that warrants this attitude you're throwing out? Not tribalism at all. Continually confirming how right you are isn't an echo chamber.
I'm out. People like you were the worst thing about reddit and you've brought your toxicity here. Good job.
You should give reddit a shot now that Lemmy is growing. There's plenty of more victim groups for people who make up bullshit and then cry when shut down with facts.
Side with me? What are you 12? No one needs you to take sides when there's overwhelming evidence. You just don't like being shown your wrong. Here you go, it was all over every front page/business/automotive/renewable major news source for several months if you cared to actually contribute to a real conversation.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-owners-china-protest-against-surprise-price-cuts-they-missed-2023-01-07/#:~:text=In%202021%2C%20Tesla%20faced%20a,complaints%20in%20a%20timely%20way.
Best of luck on Twitter/X/ Truth Social wherever you find a home making up lies to protect a billionaires fragile ego.
Here's to hoping the Chinese evs come to the usa when the tax incentives end for us car companies. Otherwise I'm leaning to hyundai if that doesn't mature.
I don’t really care where the company hails from but I like NIO’s approach to fast-swappable batteries at service stations over long wait times at charging stations. Wait an hour to recharge or wait 15 minutes for a tech to slap in a fully charged battery, think I’ll grab a drink and snack and by the time I’m done buying that, they’re likely done swapping my battery. They’re already doing it in China and the NIOs are selling well there
An hour?? You lot must have proper rubbish infrastructure. Longest I've "waited" was 24 minutes. I in fact had to nip back and move my car as after a pit stop at the toilet and waiting to get a drink and snack, the car was almost full and my other passengers still weren't back.
That’s great if you can get a supercharger free when you get there and you’re filling from depleted. Pretty much all the manufacturers state 45 minutes zero to full on a supercharger, and in my city at least the super chargers are few and far between and there’s generally a wait for them since they’re somewhat rare. They shouldn’t be rare but I live in the Midwest and there is next to no government appetite for moving away from fossil fuels
Id anyone thinks Elon isnt an unfunny loser go watch his SNL episode again and be reminded.
Yeah, I get the point that Elon isn't Tesla, etc. At the same time, at least for some owners, owning a Tesla isn't just about just owning an EV, it's about virtue signalling. And having the Tesla brand linked to Elon means that it's harder to do this.
"I have money and want to spend it on the world's most recalled car, let alone EV. I'm doing my part!"
From one point of view, yes.
At the same time, rightly or wrongly, some people buy Teslas cos they're the EV, and they get to show what great environmentalists they are (and that they have money haha).
That card got burned out years ago. Anyone who thinks a Tesla makes them look good, needs to join the guys still holding on to their Ed Hardy collection.
Massively support this.
I own and still like the model 3 that I own but I'm not about to sell it just because Elon's douchecanoe, that's just dumb. Now I can guarantee that the next EV I get will not be a Tesla though because Musk's action and values go too counter to my own now.
Not surprising. Elmu did this to himself.
I was in the market for a Model X P100D and decided against it when I heard the irregular door gaps. Added that Elon is a douche, I decided not to buy it.
In other news, Musk remotely disables all used Teslas.
That's a smart call. Working conditions at his companies are wild. You'll be required to work 80 hours a week every week or be fired. But at the same time you'll be working in a pretty building with young people and a great cafeteria where you sometimes go to nice parties.
Also the pay is pretty low. It worked out for those who have been there a while and got RSUs.
I worked there for 3 years... don't. Fucking. Do. It.
This simply says that Elon succeeded. Guys a shithead, but his goal with Tesla was to kickstart the progress of electric cars. Tesla can go under for all I care, they did manage to get other companies to care about producing EVs and now there are tons available. They're no longer a monopoly on electric vehicles and I'm quite happy about that, people have choice now.
My electric vehicle is a bicycle. It's great btw.
I'll eventually get an electric car after my Subaru and Honda die but it'll probably be a Volvo, that EX30 looks pretty nice.
Driving a Tesla is just an expensive MAGA hat.
That's not really fair, it's a big investment, and new cars are wasteful. Also, Musk wasn't like this so openly before he started meeting with Trump in the white house.
Not that long ago he was a dickhead hype man for electric cars and reusable rockets. As billionaires go, that's close to as good as it gets
A new one, post Twitter takeover? Fair.
Lemmy is not a place to rationally discuss Tesla and Space-X.
I can not stand Musk at all, but if every other Auto CEO were as vocal as he is, we would hate them too.
Apple survived losing Jobs just fine. Tesla and Space-X would probably be even better without Musk.
The news that has come out about how Tesla and Space-X have succeeded in spite of Musk, not because of him, has been eye opening. I think there's something to be said for having a front man to be the face of a company. Since Apple has been fine post Steve Jobs, so would Tesla and Space-X be fine post Elon. Frankly I'm kind of terrified that Space-X will get dragged down by this shit too, but it seems to have benefitted from being a side-project and not on Elon's front radar. If Elon gets bored of Twitter and starts doing Space-X stuff again. Thank goodness NASA kept redundancy in their rocket pipelines... At the time, it seemed like a waste, but now it looks very prudent.
Which is why other CEO usually just stay silent to public
Which is why Musk is a fool. Which is why people are not rational about his companies.
Yes, but they aren't as vocal. It's one thing to be an asshole. It's another thing to be an annoying, loud-mouthed asshole.
Tesla and SpaceX seem very different.
Lots of companies are making electric vehicles. Tesla's self driving software advantage is limited by people's high standards of success for AI.
SpaceX, on the other hand, currently has no real world competitor in the reusable rocket space.
You can sort of appreciate his showing his true self so unabashedly. It sheds light upon the ultra-rich mind. Still, he's a dumbo, IMHO.
musk fucking off would improve every business he runs
Teslas are for suckers.
"The survey also found that 87% of Model 3 owners are considering a Tesla for their next vehicles. That means it’s a fairly small percentage of people who are actually walking away from Tesla overall, and only about one in five of those people are doing it because of Musk.
The rest of the survey is quite glowing for the Model 3, as most owners appear to be very happy about their purchase and how their cars are holding up."
He's playing 4D chess, decreasing his net worth by being a Nazi. Libs and demsocs just don't understand. He's not like the other boys.
Just wait until they need service or support.
I still like the cars but dumbass Elon is embarrassing.
I love the car, so do both my parents. We all hate Elon... and would be my only reason to not get another one, but I still havent found another EV i like other than the Polestar 2 but I need more range.
I completely understand not wanting to buy from him, but taking the depreciation hit selling an otherwise perfectly good car that you already own is sort of dim. Just, you know, don't be a repeat customer.
They aren't otherwise good cars. The software updates constantly introduced new, frustrating and unpredictable behaviors, and customer support is the worst I've experienced.
sunk cost fallacy.
why is every comment defending Tesla/Elon some fallacy its either some straw man or 'im not really a fan of tesla BUT ...'
So your suggestion is sell for a loss then buy a new car that costs even more, simply because you don't like the CEO? In your mind this is sound logic?
Sunk cost fallacy is when you don't want to flush your money down the drain.
Considering the prices of used vehicles still (they have come down), you really are not taking a huge hit with depreciation.
From the Romero school for the Obvious: Elmo Husk is a devout shiatbird and should be shunned from polite society. That being said, those cars are freaking neat and NACS is a reasonable standard to use.. Still want one (used MX), but in a manner that would convenience me the most and profit him the least.
Those cars are piles of crap with some interesting features. Tons of recalls and way to intrusive big brother management of my personal property.
The way Musk is acting should have some severe effects on any company he touches. It's pretty annoying that he just so insanely wealthy that he can screw around and still have fuck-you money.
This really just tells us that people who sell their Teslas don't have any real problems.
If liking the CEO of a company is a prerequisite for using the product.... guess I'd better become a hermit.
It is when the CEO makes the company’s identity tied to himself.
I don't see what difference that makes. Elon is a cunt, so that makes it better for me to give my money to another company who'd rather see the world burn than change their core business? Doesn't track for me but maybe I'm missing something.
Seriously. The only difference between Tesla and every other car company is that Musk is vocal.
If you think other CEOs aren't just as big POSs as Musk, you're delusional.
way to avoid responsibility in your choices, you selfish stupid horror show
take some responsibility in your choices, you horror show
I know, I'm monster. I bought a box of biscuits the other day without even recognising which company it was from. Who knows what kind of nasty shit whoever's at the top of that mud heap believes.
once you do know and choose to ignore, it's at that point you become the asshole
I'm making light but I guess I don't really see what difference it actually makes. I vote for inclusive policies and try and model inclusive behaviour as much as I can day to day. Surely that makes more of a difference than giving my money to some other company who's CEO is probably just as shit. I could be wrong though.
EDIT: Also I disagree on your take on knowing vs not knowing. If you're going to hold the belief that you should only buy products from companies with nice CEOs I think you should have the courage to follow your conviction through. Surely not knowing or bothering to research and buying a product anyway would be almost as bad, there's a good chance you'll buy quite a few products from assholes otherwise.
Esse cara precisa ser parado urgentemente.
Subsidizing the EV market and providing access to the common worker!
Just here to say that this man is not Tesla. The people that are making these cars are doing a fantastic job all things considered. I get not wanting to be associated with Elon but he's one man in a giant company of people that are working their ass off to design and build these cars.
And they are the best cars on the road. A generation better than anything else out there right now. The only other car I would consider is a Rivian, but they are so big and use a lot of electricity. If you don't want to buy one than don't, but evaluate the car and not the wack job CEO.
So they approve of zucc, whoever tf runs google, jeff bezos and other pieces of shit, but elon is the breaking point for them? That's a stupid reason if you ask me.
At least half the Tesla owners…. The only reason they got won was the Elon. And wagon was in full swing….
So of course now they’re selling.
sir, this is a Wendy's
i think it's possible to block an entire instance i see a bunch of users from the blahaj.zone soamming shit
Like, fuck Musk all the way to Mars and back (actually, not back), but this is as pointless as when bigots burn sneakers or razors or beer because of a "woke" ad, except replacing a car uses so many more resources than replacing some shoes. And that's if anyone will even buy it off them, if not, then it's a whole car in the dump.
Surely making use of the car you spent tens and tens of thousands to buy, and putting an "I hate musk" sticker over the Tesla emblem is a better way to go about this?
Or is there some subscription shit where owning a Tesla means you continuously pay for features or whatever? Though if that's the case I go back to my earlier point - selling it to someone else won't actually end that.
It's not the same as the idiots who burn sneakers or whatever, because they bought new stuff only to then burn it. This is selling something you already owned. Yes, it's better for the environment to just keep whatever car you have until it no longer works, but it's not as bad as buying something new just to burn it. It's also not as bad as burning something you already own, since someone else gets to use the car.
Oh my, hit a nerve did I?
I genuinely don't believe most of the people burning shit in protest were buying new.
And even if they were, shoes cost tens, maybe hundreds at most, this is tens of thousands of dollars lol (which, being a car, they'll never get anything near that back)
It also doesn't change the fact that getting rid of something that expensive because you've only just realised the guy who owns the company is an asshole (he has been an out and proud asshole before the cars were made, they were just either not paying attention or actively licking boot), is 100% an act of vanity performed by a highly privileged shattered ego.
So maybe even worse than buying sneakers to burn them... 🤔🤔🤔
You know, I'm going to say it and maybe no one likes it, but. Just the feel I get is that we're so hopeless in having our politicians actually do shit. Like, we realize, they're not going to do a damn thing to address jack shit. And the world has been turned so rampant consumerism, that the only way it feels like we have left is to do this non-sense of burning sneakers, shooting beer, and selling cars.
Like we're so past the point that actual advocacy is so ineffective and politicians are so past the point of actually serving the public, it's either we rampant play the game they've set before us with mucho-consumerism or we do the teetotal opposite of "we're killing the Applebees" anti-consumerism.
Now there's tons of in the middle, but say there's some perceived social ill, well to solve it you cannot just send a letter to your Congressional Representative or Senator. That's just going straight to the recycle bin. And you cannot just march on whatever to try and make a point, news cycle isn't going to focus on it unless it drives traffic to their site to sell ads. So how does one solve this "ill", fuck it, let's go consumerism in one or the other direction TO THE EXTREME!! Because, that money, that's what they're listening to. So you and your groupies fucking with it or amping its sales through the roof, oh well that they will listen to suddenly. We've got this notion that the things we own OR don't own define our position of morals and ethics. It's kinda fucked up when you think about it, it's like 11:00am here and while typing this I'm starting to reach for my whiskey flask.
I feel like this is how the Boston Tea party got started. The British wouldn't listen to shit, so fuck it, let's go fuck their tea up! You know, I don't know, all of this is just a feeling. But it feels like people we voted in to listen to us won't listen to us and thus we've got to go fuck with people's wallets so that they will listen to us. Do I think it's a good idea? Nah, this is silly shit. We should be able to address social woes in better terms. But that said, it doesn't feel like we've got a lot of tools to actually address shit. Everyone (that's hyperbole, I just mean to say a good amount of folks) has gone greedy as shit. There is fewer and fewer folks who are looking at "what will this do to the future" and just getting into that "dog eat dog" mentality.
Trying to keep from going off in a long crazy ass tangent, long story short, I think the 1% have amassed so much fucking everything and the rest of us are fighting so hard for table scraps, it's difficult to not be slashing at people's throats. Because if you ain't taking from your brother or your sister, you've got rich fuckers taking from you both. Like I said, it's just feels, but damn it feels like when it comes to solving some sort of problem in society we're a small hungry rodent being backed into a corner by some fifty foot cat. We're at a breaking point, we're either going to do something crazy or be a feline's lunch. Is that the proper way to solve anything, odds are likely "no", but damn I can't blame a person for being crazy. We're in some crazy ass times.
So yeah, I agree with you, but I mean I can't really look around this place and blame a person for being batshit crazy. It's kinda the environment that's promoted now a days. Now me and my whiskey flask are going to go have a heart to heart. Shit.
no step against tyranny is pointless. ever. people who say this are stupid, lazy, evil, and usually a combination of all three.
If that's the reason Regulars are selling their Tesla then this world is doomed.
Who is actually selling their car because the CEO is an online troll douche? Can't really be more than a handful of people surely?
TBF I've considered selling my Model 3 because of his Nazi bullshit. I won't, though, because it's just too much hassle and there's not really many alternatives on the market. My next car very likely won't be a Tesla, though.
And yet, the best selling car in the world is the Tesla Model Y. Despite all the Musk hating.
Elon doesn't care, he flies American astronauts and equipment into space. A few less cars won't put a dent in his vast wealth.be paid for Twitter and regrew to the world's richest man very quickly.
Most of his wealth is Tesla stocks
Ah yes, the beautiful well build tesla
Tesla is a horrible car. The only reason to buy one is because Elon made it a status symbol.
OKAY BOOTLICKER
Wtf?? Yes, he’s a dick and annoying, but who sells their fucking car because they don’t like the companies CEO???
Tesla is not just selling cars; it’s also selling a lifestyle brand about green energy and pro-environment technology. That brand is being damaged by Elon, which its owners accurately perceive and don’t like. So… here we are.
I (and I would imagine most other people) can't even name the CEO for any car company outside of Tesla and maybe a few small niche brands.
And if they all did, we wouldn't be able to buy anything.
Teslas aren't buy-it-and-forget-about-it. They are continually making updates to the software, and building new charging stations. My Toyota hasn't changed since it left the factory (aside from normal maintenance), and Toyota doesn't have significant influence on how I can get gas.
I dunno. Seems smarter and more lucrative than buying shit from companies you don’t like and burning it like a sociopathic child.
Tesla is a horrible car.
Virtue signalers. Weirdly that's what people who bought it because of him were called so I honestly have no idea who to believe.
Buy them, don't buy them. No idea why this has to be such a big thing. He's a bellend. So was jobs. So was Edison. So we're most people you've heard of. That doesn't mean the product isn't good.
At this point if you buy anything you're ostensibly supporting some dick. You just have to pick your battles and at the moment I couldn't give a crap what he says on twitter as I don't use it and can't wait for it and Facebook to be killed off. Doesn't mean they make crap products no one about buy.
Honestly, tribalism is the worst thing on Reddit and lemmy seems to be more and more infected each day
I think he's an absolute donkey, but I see Tesla separately from him. The company itself and their cars are pretty solid.
I've been reading that the QC on Tesla vehicles is actually fairly poor though. Panels not aligned and such. There's also the false range readings.
I mean granted yeah, it's not perfect. But for me and what I need it to be done aka be fully electric and have a good amount of range along with a charging network, they have it all.
When other manufacturers adopt NACS and they open their charging stations there will be a lot more options and that are worth it. But for now I'm happy with the car.
I wouldn't desire or try to change your opinion on the vehicle. I've had wavering interest in them myself but never enough confidence in the companies longevity to make the investment.
Nah, that's all internet myths these days. The first 6 motnsh, maybe 8 from the Fremonth factory has panel issues. That's not a thing from the Chinese or EU fa Tory and mostly gone in the Fremont ones.
Range is the same issue as your petrol one. No one gets that range as it's under "ideal" conditions. If you want to be mad, be mad at your EPA and how they test and rate all cars.
All I have are internet myths and one semi-close friend with a Model 3 to go on. Theirs has some paneling alignment issues but they don't seem to care.
I have only that example and what I've read to go on. The range issue is understandable, I'd thought it was simply more accurate since it's an EV and not BS range we get with combustible fuel.
How i see it, the physical build quality is pretty poor, but the UX is a bit better, as a lot of car companies are pretty terrible at car software.
I haven't been in a car where I feel 100% satisfied with the UX. I guess it takes a different hat.
I definately agree, no car is close to 100%, but at least with tesla, they put more effort into it than some long time names, even if i dont neccesarily agree with some of their choices (e.g digital ac control)
Something as basic as getting maps to function correctly and consistently for some vehicles is a Challenge.
Based on what I’ve heard about the build quality I don’t agree the cars are solid
Agree. They have the best batteries and were ground breaking on the things they provided…but darn, those cars are louder inside than my Toyota Camry.
And yes, to an extent we haven’t invested in a Tesla because of Musk. My wife can’t stand him. We’ve postponed buying an electric and we’re looking to see how PoleStar develops. At least for our entry point.
Volvo’s had really great build quality for decades now. Polestar might be my first EV too, especially if they bring back a sporty hatchback like the C30
They have some of the worst build quality of any cars sold in the USA.
Completely aside but I find this interesting:
I'm surprised hybrids have better reliability given their overall increase in complexity compared to either electric or ICE cars. Though frankly I'm not surprised Toyota does them well...
That is a bit surprising for the reasons you say. EVs having less reliability overall kinda makes sense given the market is still going through growing pains. I'm betting it will improve quickly given that most manufacturers are still ramping up production.
Is this the equivalent of "Kevin Spacey is a horrible human, but produces really good performances."?
Exactly.
So, sell your model 3 and then go buy an EV (or ICE) from one of the other automakers that fought tooth and nail to prevent the transition to EVs and sustainable transportation. Oh yeah, and the entire industry shorted Tesla stock for YEARS hoping they would go bankrupt.
Yes, Elon is a dick but people that get rid of their Tesla for this reason are god damned idiots.
Why? Tesla did what was beneficial for them, the other car manufacturers did the same for them. Now EVs are here to stay, they can't backtrack and Tesla seems like they were shitty in their own way like outright lying about the range and suppressing complaints. That doesn't mean that the other companies are the good guys, the subscription seat warmers are fucking idiotic but that doesn't make Tesla good either.
How is the hyperloop business these days?
Oh, that's right, it was always just a distraction to keep cars relevant so Telsa made more money.
Yeah, I’d rather not support the CEO who has actively scrubbed Marc Tarpenning and Martin Eberhard off of Tesla’s legacy, has actively fucked with Cali’s HSR for his shit idea more or less meant to just prevent HSR in the first place, made a fire hazard into a “revolutionary idea” with that tunnel for Teslas, and calls people pedophiles because they call him out on his bullshit “promises”.
There are EV manufacturers who never made an ICE, like Rivian and Lucid.
Those cars are FAR too expensive for most people to afford. Tesla is the only new car company even trying at making affordable cars.
There are definitely people who could upgrade from a Model 3 to a Model S, and they are choosing a different car because of Musk.
Furthermore, a lot of people have decided that supporting established car companies, with all their faults, is still better than supporting Musk. And they may choose to switch to the Bolt, Leaf, Kona, Ioniq or similar.
Those EV manufacturers would not exist without the work Tesla did to advance EVs over being shorted for years by traditional automakers.
And?
I loved Google. They did a lot of great things for the world, they were the driving force behind all sorts of technology, and were champions of the web, upgradable electronics, and helping individual devs get their side projects off the ground.
Years went by, and now i hesitate to use chrome even though their debugger is the best, am looking at degoogling my phone and watching Linux phones with interest, and I recently realized I trust Microsoft more than them. I even use Bing before I go to Google these days - their search isn't much better anymore, and Bing more than makes up the difference
You can't give corporations or billionaires points for the past - they're always going to go bad eventually. Giving them loyalty is like drinking tap water that used to be good but now is making your hair fall out - maybe it was good before, maybe it'll be good again, but for tomorrow you should probably look at other options
And Lemmy wouldn't exist without Reddit. But I don't like what Reddit has become, and I am not obligated to continue using Reddit when Lemmy exists.
Maybe they're just sick of answering "you support Elon Musk" questions. These are luxuryish cars[1] to begin with, these sort of people can probably afford to change cars based on "I don't like the CEO." Musk always acted like the "Steve Jobs" of the automotive world and sold Tesla as an Apple-like high-end brand. The risk you take is that if you're an asshole instead of a black turtleneck-wearing hipster then your customers will turn on you.
[1] yes yes, I know about the model 3.