Why Won’t the US Corporate Media Call a Nazi Salute a Nazi Salute?
The mainstream press failed to accurately describe the hand gesture that Elon Musk made twice at Trump’s Inauguration Day rally, setting a troubling precedent for the second Trump era.
https://www.commondreams.org/opinion/media-musk-nazi-saluteOpen linkView original on lemmy.world746
Comments115
Apologies to whoever originally posted this I downloaded it earlier today
Luigi Mangione made an odd-looking gesture towards a CEO.
If it was something that came out of the blue, I might be more inclined to give the benefit of the doubt, but the man follows, regularly retweets and converses with actual (as in, they call themselves that) Nazis on Twitter.
It just shows that the mainstream media (and the ADL) aren't really interested in the truth.
It was a Nazi salute without a doubt. The only question is if it was accidental or intentional. Musk being a far-right operative and making a bunch of Nazi puns as his response instead of an apology for the misunderstanding makes it clear it was not an accident.
I’m pretty sure what you mentioned are principles used in courts of law. As a rule, journalists can and should call a spade a spade. They don’t need to prove beyond reasonable doubt what he was thinking.
Yeah, I think I wholeheartedly agree with the Die Zeit journalist. If a right-wing person does a Hitler salute in front of a right wing audience... It's probably a Hitler salute... Context matters and it's not like Musk usually shares left-wing perspective on his platform. We know for a fact whom and what he sympathizes with...
I don’t disagree with your point but at least half of America isn’t reading any of those sources and instead live on major tv network and they’re the ones talking about the ‘gesture’
The thing that my stomach drop is the crowd cheered. Not a shocked intake of breath or booing. They cheered. He did a sieg heil and they cheered it. If you cheer a Nazi doing Nazi things, you're also a Nazi. The US has a Nazi infestation. Even if they get another remotely fair election to correct this, it won't be accepted, again, and insurrection2 will have been prepared for, for 5 years. I feel that sieg heil of the richest person on earth marked the end of American democracy.
Republicans will never accept another election if a Democrat wins. This is our future, where every election they lose is contested. That is, if we have another election. I think we're heading to a pseudo democracy like Russia, where they can vote but Putin always wins in a landslide.
To be honest, I don't see them allowing a vote to go against them. It is if this shit can hold together without Trump. He's old and doesn't do diet or exercise. He's the linchpin of it.
The heritage Foundation is trying to make Trump play the part of the anti Christ in the book of revelation. They need him there for 7.5 years i think. Im not sure if this includes his first term or not. They might just decide to go ahead with the lake of fire part in 3.5 years.
I spent the larger part of the day trying to convince my sister. I don’t think it worked and now I’m just depressed about it.
The best argument I've heard so far is "If it's not a Nazi salute, do it at work tomorrow."
I tried that, got promoted to Chief of Police. I didn't even work in Law Enforcement
And if its "just a hand gesture, try giving a cop the finger"
Even better, try giving a cop the full Zack de la Rocha!
(Do not)
You reached towards your waistband and he felt threatened.
No kidding huh.
I said either way the nazis know what they saw. She still double downed gaslighting me some more and changed the subject to how Bernie’s policies are more like the nazis. I never even brought up Bernie. I replied with a sad emoji after that. It’s exhausting.
If you’re really willing, I have some tips:
Best of luck is rescuing your loved ones.
And so it begins
Have you shown her the side-by-side GIF of him doing the same move as the H-man? There's another one where it shows him doing it exactly like a group of neo-nazis on a street demonstration. Mirror image.
I don’t think it will help because she said if you watch the whole Video from he perspective it looks like just an awkward gesture
I think watching the video of just him in isolation leaves room for interpretation because people think of Nazi salutes from movies, etc. plus I think a lot of people don't want to believe that Musk would do this and want to give him the benefit of the doubt. However, when you see him doing it synchronized side by side with H-man and modern neo-Nazis and it looks like he literally practiced the exact movement with them, I think it removes any opportunity for benefit of the doubt.
Edit: here's the video I'm referring to: https://x.com/esjesjesj/status/1881716580876497257
As someone whose mother is a goddamned orange supporter, just implement a no-politics rule to save your relationship.
At this point I don’t know if I want a relationship. I joke all the time about getting adopted by a progressive family maybe with a conservative uncle or two.
I've been saying that voting for the orange makes her somewhat of a bad person. Maybe not the first time because there could be plausible deniability, but this time, there was a lot of information. This is why I might stop talking to her.
A working relationship may be based on mutual understanding, support, values, love.
If it's not working, it can hardly be saved by being based on only sharing some genetics.
Love it, change it or leave it can very well be applied to relationships.
Why would a sane person want to save a relationship to racist, mysogynist, hateful, spiteful, vengeful assholes by simply not letting them show what assholes they are (but yet knowing they are) in the first place?
Because she protected me (as best she could) from an abusive father. I'm still considering whether I'll cut off contact for voting for that piece of shit, but come on, I still love her. Wtf.
Strange how she had the empathy to protect you, but no empathy to protect all those endangered by the Donvict.
As long as you have the energy, try to change it - her view, your view of her view, whatever is possible and helps.
If all fails, you try something else.
All the best!
That's the thing. She has empathy for people she knows; not for people she hasn't met and can't imagine.
Trans people? The Gays? Who could think of that lifestyle?! /s
Also plugged into Fox "News".
I'm out of energy for accommodating her ideology. Thank you for the kind words.
That's the key, you just have to get her to stop ingesting the poison.
My father in law watches Fox news. Whenever he comes to visit us in Europe he spends the whole time oo'ing and ah'ing about life here and swears he understands that Fox news is propaganda.
Then he goes back home and two weeks later my mother in law is complaining that he's got brain worms again because he started watching Fox to get Both Sides™.
If it's not working, it can hardly be saved by being based on only sharing some genetics.
Finally... Blood is thicker than Deez nutz
Because the Nazis own them
Most major corporations are owned or operated by sociopathic oligarchs who would prefer to implement a fascist dictatorship, and be a part of the state capitalist monopoly, than have to pay higher taxes or deal with regulations.
This is what happens when society rewards psychopathy/narcissism with wealth and power.
"BuT cApItAlIsM pRoMoTeS mErItOcRaCy!!"
So stop buying their shit
Great point. That guy does live in a society.
Straight to the heart of the matter.
Because US corporate media is owned by fellow fascists.
Next?
Because he's rich. And a celebrity. Americans love them their rich celebrities.
And more importantly, rich celebrities will sue you for defamation even if you’re right. That can cost a lot of money to defend against.
Wonder what happens when you take everything from a person and feel victimized. Hmmm maybe become a plumber?
You start wearing a ton of green
The corporate press is now just a pro-kleptocracy propaganda outlet. Representing the views of an oligarchy isn't exactly "mainstream" so we should stop calling it that.
I've seen people here on Lemmy, people I don't think are just trolling, that are finding convoluted reasons to excuse it as not a Nazi salute. And I am so fucking tired of it. Listen to virtually everything he has ever said on the subject of race and gender and sexual orientation and other such things. Maybe if he didn't have a really long history of being a racist, maybe if he didn't support the Germany's modern Nazi party, maybe if he isn't trying to get an unapologetic Nazi out of prison in the UK, I would consider that he accidentally did a Nazi salute (twice). But that's not the reality.
"Oh sure, he's a bigot that loves Nazis, but that wasn't a Nazi salute" is some real fucking bullshit.
Internet forums have always been full of contrarians who want to be the only ones to know the "real truth". That explains a lot of it. Others just get lost in the logic of it. I'f I can't prove that he held true Nazism in his heart when he did it, does it count as a Nazi salute?' This is sort of futile question they ask. The fact that there's broad consensus on what this was makes them more likely to try to logic their way into a special minority position.
Because they’re cowards and have been for quite some time.
Fear of retaliation
I'm pretty sure that was the point
+1 to infinity
We are where we are because of fear. On both sides
Exactly. You accuse the richest person on the planet of being a Nazi,the facts won't matter when you've got 3 billion in legal fees.
He can spend 100 billion dollars in legal fees just to spite them without affecting his life one iota.
Exactly.
because a huge part of fascism is the merging of corporations with the government.
the corporate media is covering for nazis for the same reason the leader enshittificator Alphabet, the otherwise twitter's direct competitor Evil Corp, and of course the slavery warehouse Amazon were all represented with their figureheads Sunil Bakshi, the T-600, and Lex Luthor alongside that Troglodyte Phony Stark. they're merging.
That is the precise thing your average true believer right wing "libertarian" doesn't understand about fascism.
It doesn't matter whether the state or the corporations absorb the other, the merging of these power structures (and religion as well) is the goal. The result is still a tyranny that can only be escaped with war.
Lemmy should maintain a list of competent and incompetent news sources. In lots of places.
Well the first part is easy. If their corporately owned. Especially publicly they are by Nature incompetent. The other half though is the interesting half of the question
They're all hoping to become maga state run media.
Also, they have no problem with Nazis.
This isn't complicated. Hardly worth the time it took to post. 🙄
They worked very hard to get the Nazis elected. That's why.
$$$
because they're complicit
Because they are also Nazis, they're just not ready to go mask-off yet.
Because they are saluting right back at him.
"Corporate Media"
Where's the confusion?
For the same reason you never see Bruce Wayne with Batman
Because everyone wants to hope it won't happen to Us. They think/hope that by not acknowledging, it won't exist. A la COVID. Nothing like sticking your head into the sand... 😮💨
Because the same people who are asked to describe who did it are the same people who are paying the people to describe it.
Why was this comment deleted?
" Because they're nazis. Americans were nazis for a long time, they just came out of the closet. "
How is this even a controversial statement??? Lol
Seriously. This election has basically validated every single criticism the left has levied against the United States since Reagan and then some.
I didn’t remove the comment, an admin did. I’m guessing because it is a generalization of all Americans. I do understand the anger though.
Which admin would that be?
Modlog says it was for a ban evasion from the instance.
I can see that, thanks, but that's not what I asked..
That is all the information I have.
Ok, thanks.
Though you did mention that an admin removed it, how can you tell?
I think that you are being distracted.
Hey Elon, do something outrageous so these idiots are looking at you while I'm over here doing this other scary stuff.
And I think you're being fooled if you genuinely believe the orange man is the one pulling the strings, and not literally the richest man on the planet.
Because there's just enough "plausible deniability" that they could face costly legal challenges by oligarchs who have endless money to throw at bogus claims
Same reason they reported everything Harris did as some wild mistake or deeply questionable, and reported every insane thing Trump said like it was just a well meaning elder statesmen making open ended questions to contemplate.
Large Media is part of the same game, they're basically placing stock options bets on the economy and national / unrest to profit as long as they can until the shooting and looting starts
The media is inherently fascist. Wall street military and prison industry profiteers control the narrative of the legacy media outlets they all own and they own our politicians and political process as well. They just keep lying to all of us and since all the maga morons are dumb enough to believe whatever they are told they just hope the rest of us will bend over and accept they are right. they’ve waged aggressive psychological warfare against the us population for decades. Its created a subsection of the population dumb enough to unquestioningly believe whatever musk and trump say so much so that it if they came home to find both musk and trump raw dog tag teaming their wives they would without question accept it as 100% truth when they are told the cum dripping from their wive’s oral vaginal and anal openings is just a little rain from the open window. While pointing to a closed window nowhere near the marital bed they just defiled in the middle of a sunny day during a July drought and heat wave
I was with you until the weird bit at the end objectifying women.
Its an uncomfortable analogy but its 100% accurate. Maga sycophants would sit by while elon and don consensually defile or rape their wives and believe whatever excuse / rationalization they provide. And then call anyone who is there saying “yo dude they are literally gang banging your wife” or offering to help stop them, as an “unhinged woke far left marxist”
The media needs the government to cooperate if they want to get any info from them. As it is, they didn't HAVE to tell us much, but choose to. If might not even occur to some of them not to. It makes the medias' job easier that way. Otherwise they'd have to REALLY hound the administration, or start putting out way more negative stories. So they play nice and the government plays nice. If the government decides if hates you, they'll blacklist you and your boss will have to send somebody else. IIRC the Cheeto in Chief did that last time. And since the media is privately owned and Regan's evil bitch ass killed the fair reporting laws back in the 80s, here we are.
America loves nazis. America wants to be nazis.
Get out before it’s too late.
As an American who fucking hates Nazi's, piss off with your defeatism. I would much rather die fighting against Nazi's than run like a coward because things look bad.
Oh tough guy.
Have fun with that.
Has nothing to do with "being tough" or any kind of posturing. How would you react when told to abandon something you believe in and let it be taken over by the worst of humanity? Do you love Nazi's and want Americans to be Nazi's? (see i can deflect the conversation into bullshit too).
What is it you believe in?
My community, and the idea that we can and should always strive to be better than we are today.
I'm here with this guy.
Fair enough, I don't disagree with your choice to defend what you believe in ( and i doubt you care about my opinion on that anyway, i wouldn't if the situation were reversed ).
Your wording implies you believe that had you chosen differently you would be a coward, are you implying that all people who don't choose as you did are cowards, or is this specific to your choice ?
It’s a lot easier if you stop believing in America.
They let us all down it’s time to let it burn.
"Let it burn" means giving up and letting them win. Accepting defeatism and rolling over for them is exactly what got them into power and is letting them stay there.
I, personally, would much rather keep fighting them.
Lol that's not what it means you sweet summer child
Fuck that. It's my country, I'm not leaving. We've defeated Nazis before we can do it again.
We especially defeated those nazis like Wernher Von Braun!
A lot of country are going the same path. This isn't anywhere near being exclusive to America.
There's no getting out, what happens in America affects the rest of the world too.
Nazis have the federal government in a chokehold but there's a lot of resistance at local and municipal levels. I'm just mid level management but after Trump's announcement on "two genders" I immediately let my trans and nonbinary employees know that they would continue to be seen and respected and validated at work regardless of what the white house says.
The worst I fear is still the issue of global warming, it's already bad and the white house is locking in on releasing all the CO2 it can - and the entire globe will suffer for it.
Unfortunately the globe is already done for.
I have zero faith that humans will stop global warming.
Because of the imperial boomerang. The ruling far-right in Ukraine (which the US installed in the Maiden Coup) has multiple self-declared Nazis in positions of power, erects monuments of & names streets after famous Nazis, has a military covered in Nazi symbols, and required the US Congress to lift a ban on arming Nazis in order to receive military aid. But the media coverage is all denial and gaslighting of ‘it’s complicated.’
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/05/world/europe/nazi-symbols-ukraine.html
And now we’re over a year into a live-streamed genocide, as they tell us to ignore our own eyes & ears.
We are ruled by Nazis, on both sides of the aisle.
Dude does a full sieg heil twice and your reaction is something something Ukrainian Nazis?
You're weird. Stop being weird.
Walk me through the logic that makes you terrified of a Nazi salute, but excuse billions in weaponry to Nazis.
I've read some stupid ass backwards shit before but what the actual fuck are you going on about?
What is confusing you?
The part where Ukraine has anything to do with what we are talking about. Are you autistic cuz that was off in left field.
You can’t understand how funding and excusing Nazis in the media for 10 years has led to more open acceptance of Nazism at home? You struggling to follow that?
The whiplash from the whataboutism must hurt
“Whataboutism” would be defending one party for being Nazis because the other ones also are.
Not defending either. Both Nazi parties need to be dismantled and held accountable.
You just completed started talking about a different topic entirely as a distraction from this issue that's textbook whataboutism. You just went: never mind Republican Nazis, what about Ukraine? And expected no one to notice.
Let me get this straight. The Nazis there are being sent billions in weapons by the Nazis here, and you don’t see the very direct connection?
It doesn’t sound like you’ve read much history. You should read up on how US capitalists were funding and arming the Nazi regime in Europe during WWII. These aren’t separate issues. It’s the same movement.
And it’s the answer to the title. Why won’t the media call it what it is? Because they’re in on it. Why would anyone think the same media covering up Nazism abroad would call it out here? Nazi collaborators aren’t going to draw the line at spreading it domestically. Silly thing to be surprised about.
If we take this as argument all ukrainians are fascists, then those guys should proof all ukrainians are LGBT.
But maybe there are just all kinds of ukrainians fighting together against Russia?
The bad actors always try to deflect from the people openly identifying themselves as Nazis, to ‘are you saying all Ukrainians are Nazis?!’
People aren’t as stupid as you believe.