‘Pure arrogance’: anger in Finland as Google illegally fells 250,000 trees for datacentre
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/ng-interactive/2026/oct/22/finland-google-felling-trees-datacentreOpen linkView original on lemmy.mlSyndicated from the fediverse. Read and engage on the original instance.
View original on lemmy.mlhttps://www.theguardian.com/environment/ng-interactive/2026/oct/22/finland-google-felling-trees-datacentreOpen linkView original on lemmy.ml
75 replies
I read about the displaced wildlife. This is really horrific. Their government should ban Google from the country, take back their land and make them pay to reforest. Fuck Google. I was a little complacent with my Gmail but I'm done. This is just fucking awful. In this state of global warming these assholes ripped up a whole forest. Fuck them.
The government knew this was coming when they approved the data center. This is purely theatrical outrage. Those Representatives have been bought and paid for.
It’s only illegal if you do something about it.
Fine them $1 Billion per tree, AND they have to pay to replace every single tree at its market value for it's age.
Once that's all done, then they can request permission to build a new data center, which will be declined. Fuck Google.
I used to work in a municipality that had a fee of $2000/caliper inch for illegally removed trees and placed a conservation easement over the critical root zone, preventing the developers from being able to just cut down the tree and pay the fee.
Is this the actual plan or are you just making suggestions?
Fuck you Pichai, you fucking banchode.
I bet their politicians allow it to happen.
That understanding being "it's more profitable to just do it and pay the fine"
Process the fine for each tree individually. And of course they can't do anything with the land until the whole thing is processed.
This is a nasty thing to do without proper permits and I fully support Google getting slapped for it. For a country who has practically relied on forestry for 100+ years, the native Finnish subcontractors that everyone uses for these things are surprisingly bad at doing it properly. Last year another company casually crushed over some protected freshwater pearl mussels while doing cuts -- which was enviromentally speaking actually a much worse thing than what Google did this year. Nobody outside of Finland probably heard about it though, because there was no "big evil company" involved.
The final responsibility is still Google's though, of course, but those subcontractors really should have more sense and understanding in what they're doing.
All that said, let's calibrate the magnitude of this disaster. They felled 300-400 hectares of commercial forest. That's about 0.06% of the annual forest harvest in Finland.
Are you nuts? They deserve the guillotine. Every single one of them. Fuck them. Pieces of shit.
So do something.
Yes, please. Fellow Europeans do something. It's so easy. /s
Will only get worse from there, if no action will be taken now.
I really hope Finns will find organizers to stand up.
almost as easy as rebelling against an orange shitstain.
The "move fast, break things" shtick. They mean laws with it. Worst case, you pay a fine.
If the world was a just place they'd pay a fine and pay to have new trees planted where the old ones where removed. Anything short of that is simply the cost of doing business.
You're not wrong, but Google didn't just take the trees. They stripped the topsoil:
Wonder why. Wouldn't have anything to do with making sure Google could not be ordered to replant the illegally felled trees, I'm sure.
So now they should be ordered to replace the topsoil, then replace all the trees, and to pay a massive fine as well.
So I assume just a minor fine and some angry words?
Knowing Finland's governments, it won't be even those. They'll more likely take Google's side and tell the population how it's a price we must pay for being competitive, and how we need these foreign corporations raping Finnish nature to create jobs and shit. No European bougie gives a shit about the countries they lead or the populations they claim to represent.
There's a datacentre being planned in Skellefteå I think and this is exactly what's being said. "It'll bring 4000 jobs" like fucking what? Will they have 4000 people standing there caressing the circuits or something? Get fucking real. 🙃
Yeah, they're building one in my home town atm. They talk a big talk how this shit is beneficial for everyone, how our electrical grid is "one of the most stable in Europe", how this shit will bring more jobs. Lies, lies, more lies. That's all the bougies know how to do. They just fucking lie.
Yeah. It's the same here. They're building it in the north because the electricity is cheaper and there are fewer people that'll complain. It's the same reasoning why they're building them out in the desert in the U.S., fewer people and a local government that's easier to bribe.
The proponents are all "we're going to need this compute power in the EU too!" right so let's buy it when it's hideously inflated in the middle of a bubble. Fucking fivehead.
Yeah it's absurd. A horribly flawed, inefficient attempt by the politicians to claw back some semblance of relevance on a global stage, while serving their own class interests. Just throw more money at the problem, that should fix it. What do you mean the energy grid collapsed?
Well, the current government is run by corporate puppets and right wing nutters that were willing to do anything just to be called ministers.
Not very hard to guess how this is gonna go.
Yup, that's true. For me it seems that even the nominally leftist and ""socialist"" seem to be of like minds with the corporate stooges.
Shocking... You can't vote in socialism. Unfortunately, people jerk the Nordic countries so hard they can't see they're run off imperialism, resource extraction, and the same awful capitalist system.
I'm not directing this at you BTW, I can assume you're probably a socialist or communist based on your instance. It's just sad to see libs continue to think that Europe is somehow this wonderland utopia. But it's still run by the Epstein class, many of the families there of far older influence than in the Western hemisphere.
Old money, new money... the problem is capitalism, the answer is proletariat organizing. It's true though, many people in Europe see the problems of unfettered capitalism in America, but somehow seem to fail to consider that it could, will and is happening here also.
"Petteri Orpo, said attracting investment was a 'top priority' and 'the value of the data economy extends far beyond direct investment'" Bull. Shit. Unless they have a plan to tax the snot out of this DC they'll get nothing but resource drain and a handful, maybe two handfuls, of jobs.
I think what happens is that governments look at the plans and their brains light up thinking it's like an old-time factory. The AI company then shows how many people will be employed in construction and let's the official go on and think that work will continue.
They do have that spreding fine system that scales to income. We can hope...
Oh, dagsböter is for normal people. Companies don't pay them. Here in Sweden there's also a limit both in amount of days and the value for them. I think the max is 150 days and the value is 1000 crowns (~$100).
So for a rich person, getting 150 dagsböter would be paying a fine of ~$15000, not a huge deal for people with several million available. Dagsböter exist for us regular workers, my friend.
Don’t the ai data centers run at a loss? A negative fine would be called subvention then…
/s (hopefully)
No that's just for the poors and proles. The corporations will never face repercussions because the politicians are in their C-suite
Each tree is probably more than $10,000+. Doing the math, they'll probably pay a fine of about $100, give or take $100
Even if they were charged a $10b fine, that's a miniscule percentage of their profits each year and corporations that big always look at them as operating expenses
Prime example: Verizon
Nah just some rage click farming as a distraction from telling everyone only America is this pathetic.
So then remove the data center once it's built. Tit for tat.
Or not allow it to be built in the first place.
Each tree is priceless, and the forest is more than the sum of its parts.
Expropriate Google's assets to make up for some of the loss.
Ban them for a year and fine them for triple what is a fair penalty.
Otherwise it's a business expense
There should be criminal investigations over that and prosecution of Google employees or their contractors, whoever was operating in Finland (and someone had to). If that was indeed all legal, than laws need to be changed.
250,000?! Jesus Christ
Tried that, doesn't work on trees
I think they nailed him to a cross, not trees. Still didn't work... but, the more you know!
nah today we worship muppet jesus
'See when you're rich, they let you do it".
All because normies can't take it upon themselves to do any research and change search engines and stop using google products...we gave them this power.
I hate people.
Individual action as a way to effect change or "voting with your dollar" is a myth that these large corporations benefit from. Sure, we should stop using their services, but you're never going to convince people to individually give things up in the hundreds of millions.
You gotta force legislators into actually doing their jobs, and failing that, burn down the fucking data centers.
While I agree, its apathy and stupidity that led us to this point. Big tech would have nowhere near this much power if every single person didnt willingly hand out all of their data at every turn and use every big tech product that was advertised to them.
Sure they would. They don't need every single person, they just need a lot. Most people are apathetic and stupid, this kind of hypothetical doesn't really get us anywhere. If your mechanism for change doesn't work when most people are apathetic and stupid, it isn't going to work.
I mean the issue is the stupid people. As always. The crazy thing is its never before in The history of humanity been easier to learn all there is to possibly know, and we still have dumbasses running around. Like, how.
It's never been easier to disseminate propaganda and misinformation. Billionaires own the media companies and the digital infrastructure.
Good point. However....dont people know this and take it upon themselves to be wary of media thats owned by billionaires and Instead find independent real journalism and actual news and/or talk to actual people? No, just me ? OK then. This is why the world is on track to pure fascism.
You are wildly overestimating the media literacy of the average person.
Collective misbehavior requires collective correction.
Lol blame people while a whole government does fucking nothing but be concerned.
Well yeah but the people elected the government...but yes theyre all corrupt so it doesnt matter much.
It is capitalism that got us corporations and data centers. nobody voted to live under capitalism, and the last time people tried to do anything else we had a civil war over it. blaming the actions of a government and the completely undemocratic system it derives its power from on the people it governs is stupid. you should blame those in power, the politicians and their capitalist overlords, instead of the people who mostly have no say in what their government decides to do to them.
I've been using DDG.
I'm doing my part.
Even made a video to help people get away from Google search.
(TLDW: If you're stuck using Google, switch to udm14.com. For a good commercial search alternative, use Mojeek. For a non-commercial search alternative, try Marginalia Search.)
Wonderful! Nice work!
“When will these Fins rise up and do something? Don’t they see what is happening and they are just sitting around doing nothing. They voted for this.”
Looks to me like YOU guys voted for this, not the Fins
USA does not have jurisdiction over Finland, just sayin'
Those who control the USA control other places as well
Sure do, assuming we’re talking about the billionaire Epstein class.
It’s almost like while people outside the US are watching what’s happening there and judging they’re ignoring the rise of the same in their own backyards.
Will the Finns show Americans how to appropriately respond to quashing this behavior, or will they capitulate?
Finns need the global protests to come closer than Belgium to act
You know who’s well poised to bring protests to Finland? The Finns.
They can't get convoy again after the prices are up for drivers. Antifascist (counter-) protesting them have been comparatively better but orgs and left alliance are not activating
There he is
Well Finland you do want to keep making anti-Russia hysterical propaganda, yes? AI is the way these days.
Russia doesn't need anyone's help to make people anti-russia. The thieving warmongering orcs are doing a good enough job all by themselves.
can we talk about the amount of trolls on the lemmy.ca and piefed.ca instances?