Welcome to the mids 2010s, may I take your coat? This was a very common thing to say, down to the word, and was posted everywhere for years since that was the peak of when the American right-wingers had temper tantrums over kids being around lgbtq+ people (mainly drag shows etc.).
This isn't a shower thought, it's just a popular opinion.
Catholics are a pain in the ass... they got a magga cult (low key unnoticed lil cival war) but these evangicals are the issue. libturd as the catholics may be they are nothing like these evengicals... there are exceptions.
To be fair.... Catholics, the followers are not throwing their children to the pedophiles but the catholic church is a corporation... and capitalism sucks ass
God is dead but i wish it wasn't
I fucking hate religion
But can we have order in union with the natural world
Your opinions are a box. They put us there and they make us stand in their shaddow of their ambition which is their self imposed flagellation. Yes big daddy. It is all just one big Kink. Just monkey shit dude. Stupid shit all day every day.. this world is dumb
The problem is that the hierarchy actively protects and covers up those who are, to the extent of moving them to different parishes if people get suspicious. And to be clear, this isn't because popes are necessarily in favour of paedophilia (though I'm not saying none are...), it's because the clergy are more concerned with the prestige and survival of the institution than they are with the well-being of lay believers.
Also the seal of confession. Paedo priests would confess their abuse to all of their colleagues using it. Thus they can't do anything or they'd be accused of breaking said seal
It's been a trope since at least the 1500s that clergy are pedos, "Julius Excluded from Heaven" by Erasmus contains this exchange between Saint Peter and the recently deceased pope Julius:
PETER: [... ] I hope it won't be too tiresome for you to answer a few clumsy questions about the details. Who, for example, are these little curly-headed striplings?
JULIUS: I brought them up for my diversion.
The problem with the catholic church isn't just that a lot of preists are predators, it's that the church covered up these crimes and moved preists to new places where they could continue being predators
How do you even apply for a job like that? If it’s like any other interview, surely there’s some sort of psychological assessment or a background check. Maybe you just need to wear a fanatic facade, and you’re hired… I just have no idea how Catholics roll.
Basically, you need to go to Catholic university to get a degree in theology. There is a while process of attending courses and getting additional qualifications to get higher ranks. Freemasonry was partly modelled on this.
Same with teachers and other child oriented careers. They all attract pedos at more or less the same rates but churches are generally better about covering it up than schools.
It's been over four decades. I think healing started this year when I was able to finally put it into words.
The secondary abuse from everyone else protecting the predators and blaming the victim also leaves deep scars. The Epstein stuff made me realize how extensive that network really is.
My partner's ex abused his little sister for years when they were young (when my partner found out she divorced him). His family ostracized her for making the family look bad.
I'm so glad that you're finally able to start healing, comrade.
At least a slither of a silver-lining for the poor sister that got abused. The cousin made an honourable decision; I guess that the cousin realised that if the family was of that calibre, that she'd be better off without them, and I applaud their rationale.
Even though they both made the best decision from shitty circumstances, life will be hard for them both, without family. At least they're now free of that vile bunch.
When I hear pastor, I can't help but think of pasture, as in "put out to pasture". It's a lot harder to molest vunerable people if they're without an misleading image to hide behind.
This. Ultimately, it's about people having a heavily trusted position (priest, teacher, babysitter, police whathaveyou) taking advantage of the utmost vulnerable: children.
Definitely sexual abuse is not limited to Catholicism, they just had an extraordinarily structured operation of it that was understood and tolerated at the highest levels. It was a system, not a pattern of instances. That’s why they’re irrevocably associated with this.
Recently had to file a report at a state-run insurance and they have a dedicated button on their webpage for "sexualized violence in churches".
I do wonder, is it the churches themselves that are insured that way? Because surely the victims get paid from the lawsuit, not from insurance.
But either way, that is fucking harrowing that they have a dedicated button for it.
I get that it's probably just a matter of "we offer insurance for this, so we'll have a button for it". But even that someone in a government-near position decided "kids get raped in churches so often, and we expect more cases to happen or be uncovered, so we should add an insurance for that to our portfolio", that concept just does not fit into my brain.
Former insurance agent here (personal lines, so I never dealt with churches, but still)
They almost certainly are. Liability insurance usually excludes intentional harm (including sexual assault of any kind), however there are usually ways to acquire coverage for those intentional actions. On a personal level, umbrella coverage will provide it.
They likely don't sell specific "Pastor sexually abusing a child coverage", that button is more there for the victims/their parents to have an easier time filing a claim. Helpful, but depressing.
Not to mention that no one brings their kids to drag shows. But everyone takes their kid to church, and a lot of churches even have daycares attached where you can leave them all day.
Drag performers sometimes do child friendly events such as story time, but there's nothing sexual about those events. In fact, it's no question why kids would be drawn to being read stories by someone in a whimsical costume.
Fwiw, even burlesque performers sometimes do family friendly events (for obvious reason they do an outfit change rather than a strip tease). Anyone who does adult shows is very aware of the line between family friendly and not, and likely knows the local blue laws better than anyone else
Yeah like there are definitely some drag shows you shouldn't take your kids to but there's also movies and concerts you shouldn't take your kids to. There's even kids horror movies vs the obvious r rated adult stuff. If they're old enough to know boys and girls are different they're old enough to understand that sometimes people do other shit for fun the same as they're able to watch fucking Casper and experiment with the idea of death. It's just a fucking genre.
Well if dragshows were populated by powerful people getting heaps of tax free dollars and an opaque system that hides any accountability then kids would no longer be safe there.
Maybe. Im betting not if you are talking per child hour of prescence. I mean if one thing happens to a kid at a drag show its going to blow the percentage off the roof.
What do you all think happens at Catholic mass these days? It's been about 10 years since I've gone myself, but when I was a kid I just sat next to my parents for an hour, went through the service, and left after.
Most priest's are required by law in Australia to be cleared by police and any church workers or volunteers are required by law to report anything suspicious. Training in identification of bad behaviours is also required
Looking at the number of times I've seen a respectable news source report abuse from church members versus the number of times I've seen a respectable news source report a confirmed hellfire burn being treated at the local hospital, I'll take my chances with the hellfire.
Uninformed straight white guy here: Drag does not intrinsically share the sexualization commonly associated with modern use of the term burlesque. But, yes, a burlesque show that doesn't mistakenly assume that burlesque is entirely about stripping/nudity might in fact be available for children.
The drag shows I've seen advertised certainly look sexual. Corsets, push up bras etc etc. Just be trans person and talk to kids if it's to help then. No need to dress up like a 70s transvestite.
As a transgender performer myself who constantly has to deal with people thinking I'm a drag performer because I'm trans, please don't conflate the two. Drag is a costume. Trans is not. It is possible to be trans and do drag, but it's not even the default tbh. It's mostly gay cis men in my experience.
Also, there's nothing inherently sexual about a corset otherwise you wouldn't see them all over renfaires and comic conventions. Same with bras, half the population wears them on a daily basis
Interesting. I get drag performers and have been to a few shows back in the day. I understand trans and trans kids. I don't understand the connection between drag and kids though.
To me it would make much more sense to have regular trans people teach the kids about the issues facing them.
There isn't one. Trans and drag are entirely separate things. We may cross paths often as allies but it's not inherent.
As trans people, we may advocate for better care for trans children (typically in the form of social support and at most informed access to puberty delayers) but that has nothing to do with drag shows. We just exist, much like anyone else, living 24/7 as our preferred gender. You wouldn't notice if you passed us on the street:
Drag performers on the other hand are just that, performers. They entertain audiences much like a juggler or a magician might. Sometimes that's performing in adult-only shows (typically in bars), other times it's reading to children or lip syncing Lady Gaga. They wear over the top costumes and act dramatically but at the end of the day it's just a costume. You'd know if you passed a drag performer on the street:
I don't blame you for any confusion since conservatives have been trying to muddle the waters ever since they learned the word drag, in part as a scare tactic to demonize trans people and make us scarier than we are. But there's no reason to fear either.
No I completely understand the difference and you make complete sense.
I'm asking why the children's drag shows at libraries? Wouldn't trans speakers make more sense? That's the part I don't get .
Btw not a conservative by any means. More of a free loving hippie type who thinks everybody should be loved and treated equally. This trans stuff is new even for us old lefties
I'm asking why the children's drag shows at libraries? Wouldn't trans speakers make more sense?
Why not both? One is entertainment, the other is education. Typically drag reading hours at libraries use entertainment to encourage children to read from an early age. In reality, the real reason you probably don't see more trans speakers is because our existence is seen as "woke"
Btw not a conservative by any means. More of a free loving hippie type who thinks everybody should be loved and treated equally. This trans stuff is new even for us old lefties
Wasn't accusing you of being one, they're just the ones responsible for the current culture war. We just want to live in peace.
I would however like to point out that we've been around for all of humanity. Maybe not in name but in experience. A big part of why there's been so little awareness of trans people is because the Nazis did such a thorough job of eliminating us and any research into us, but the Internet allowed us to find each other. A good starting point to learn more is the Looting of the Institute of Sexology.
The first sex reassignment surgery happened in 1906, before Hitler's rise to power. Going even further back, we're all over ancient mythology. Loki was famously a gender bender, Caenis was an invulnerable trans warrior in the Illiad, Iphis was transformed into a man by an Egyptian goddess. Really it's just the Abrahamic religions that like to exclude us.
So drag performers dress sexually to explain inclusion to children but they aren't trans. Did I get that right?
I thought the whole purpose was so that trans children don't feel outcast or different. Wouldn't it be better to have trans people talking to them instead of drag queens?
"Edited due to horrible typo"
drag performers most certainly arnt trying to be strippers, you are confusing it porn/ stirpper or prostiuition. its only slightly different if you were dressing up as female/male in a show or movie.
Yes, burlesque performers sometimes do family friendly events. They typically do outfit changes or character work, not strip teases for obvious reason.
Regardless, drag isn't inherently sexual. It can be made sexual for an adult context but on its own, it's costuming and character work.
113 replies
Welcome to the mids 2010s, may I take your coat? This was a very common thing to say, down to the word, and was posted everywhere for years since that was the peak of when the American right-wingers had temper tantrums over kids being around lgbtq+ people (mainly drag shows etc.).
This isn't a shower thought, it's just a popular opinion.
maybe not a maga drag/ conservative dragqueen, these do exist.
i think evangelicals, and probably mormon churchs hides more pedophelia, SA.
better of with MS rachel.
I mean they are so big you can't ignore them.
Catholics are a pain in the ass... they got a magga cult (low key unnoticed lil cival war) but these evangicals are the issue. libturd as the catholics may be they are nothing like these evengicals... there are exceptions.
To be fair.... Catholics, the followers are not throwing their children to the pedophiles but the catholic church is a corporation... and capitalism sucks ass
God is dead but i wish it wasn't
I fucking hate religion
But can we have order in union with the natural world
Your opinions are a box. They put us there and they make us stand in their shaddow of their ambition which is their self imposed flagellation. Yes big daddy. It is all just one big Kink. Just monkey shit dude. Stupid shit all day every day.. this world is dumb
Indeed. Never leave your kid alone with a priest. I was that kid.
I'm sure there are some preists who are good people, but enough of them are predators that it ain't worth the risk
Most priests aren't paedophiles.
The problem is that the hierarchy actively protects and covers up those who are, to the extent of moving them to different parishes if people get suspicious. And to be clear, this isn't because popes are necessarily in favour of paedophilia (though I'm not saying none are...), it's because the clergy are more concerned with the prestige and survival of the institution than they are with the well-being of lay believers.
Also the seal of confession. Paedo priests would confess their abuse to all of their colleagues using it. Thus they can't do anything or they'd be accused of breaking said seal
It's been a trope since at least the 1500s that clergy are pedos, "Julius Excluded from Heaven" by Erasmus contains this exchange between Saint Peter and the recently deceased pope Julius:
https://web.archive.org/web/20090326073147/www.history.ucsb.edu/faculty/lansing/classes/hist4b/materials/Week7.pdf
Yes but statistics indicate priests are not more likely to be pedophiles than any other profession that works regularly with children.
The problem with the catholic church isn't just that a lot of preists are predators, it's that the church covered up these crimes and moved preists to new places where they could continue being predators
You're right, my comment didn't address how the church protects predators compared to other professions that work with kids.
Statistics need someone to report them, and someone to record them.
If you haven't experienced it you don't know how tightly faith communities protect the people they worship.
The position just attracts too many pedos to give any one of them the benefit of the doubt
plus they get access to children in other means, like boy scouts potentially, christian/summer camps, "charter schools"
How do you even apply for a job like that? If it’s like any other interview, surely there’s some sort of psychological assessment or a background check. Maybe you just need to wear a fanatic facade, and you’re hired… I just have no idea how Catholics roll.
Basically, you need to go to Catholic university to get a degree in theology. There is a while process of attending courses and getting additional qualifications to get higher ranks. Freemasonry was partly modelled on this.
Oh. All you need is patience and a degree. No wonder why twisted people are able to exploit that system.
Same with teachers and other child oriented careers. They all attract pedos at more or less the same rates but churches are generally better about covering it up than schools.
I'm so sorry, and I hope that you're okay now.
It's been over four decades. I think healing started this year when I was able to finally put it into words.
The secondary abuse from everyone else protecting the predators and blaming the victim also leaves deep scars. The Epstein stuff made me realize how extensive that network really is.
Victim blaming is some fucking shit.
My partner's ex abused his little sister for years when they were young (when my partner found out she divorced him). His family ostracized her for making the family look bad.
I'm so glad that you're finally able to start healing, comrade.
husband family disowned her? or her own family. i think that family was complicit and knew about the abuse.
The son abused his little sister for years.
The family of the children (including grandparents and uncles and aunts and cousins) disowned the sister for making the family look bad.
One cousin cut the family off afterwards because of the injustice, and still maintains contact with the abused woman.
At least a slither of a silver-lining for the poor sister that got abused. The cousin made an honourable decision; I guess that the cousin realised that if the family was of that calibre, that she'd be better off without them, and I applaud their rationale.
Even though they both made the best decision from shitty circumstances, life will be hard for them both, without family. At least they're now free of that vile bunch.
Not a priest, but a southern baptist youth minister, I was also that kid.
I don't know anybody, myself included certainly, who doesn't have a story about a youth pastor.
When I hear pastor, I can't help but think of pasture, as in "put out to pasture". It's a lot harder to molest vunerable people if they're without an misleading image to hide behind.
Pastor means shepherd, and pasture means sheep-field. So yeah.
R/woosh
You could expand beyond just Catholics
Just one example
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/faqs-sexual-abuse-southern-baptist/
This. Ultimately, it's about people having a heavily trusted position (priest, teacher, babysitter, police whathaveyou) taking advantage of the utmost vulnerable: children.
Let's do another religion too
https://www.nst.com.my/amp/news/crime-courts/2025/02/1180698/ustaz-trial-sexually-assaulting-5-students-slapped-another-charge
I do not trust pious people for this reason. The closer to god they claim they are, the further you should stay away from them.
Definitely sexual abuse is not limited to Catholicism, they just had an extraordinarily structured operation of it that was understood and tolerated at the highest levels. It was a system, not a pattern of instances. That’s why they’re irrevocably associated with this.
Mormons too
Recently had to file a report at a state-run insurance and they have a dedicated button on their webpage for "sexualized violence in churches".
I do wonder, is it the churches themselves that are insured that way? Because surely the victims get paid from the lawsuit, not from insurance.
But either way, that is fucking harrowing that they have a dedicated button for it.
I get that it's probably just a matter of "we offer insurance for this, so we'll have a button for it". But even that someone in a government-near position decided "kids get raped in churches so often, and we expect more cases to happen or be uncovered, so we should add an insurance for that to our portfolio", that concept just does not fit into my brain.
Former insurance agent here (personal lines, so I never dealt with churches, but still)
They almost certainly are. Liability insurance usually excludes intentional harm (including sexual assault of any kind), however there are usually ways to acquire coverage for those intentional actions. On a personal level, umbrella coverage will provide it.
They likely don't sell specific "Pastor sexually abusing a child coverage", that button is more there for the victims/their parents to have an easier time filing a claim. Helpful, but depressing.
Oh, really?
•music too loud
•choke on rhinestone that flew off during dancing
•crushed between two sweaty drag queens
•drugs sometimes
Oh, wait, you said safer. Yeah.
Were you describing what happens at church?
Wait, your church has drugs (sometimes)?
Always has.
Kids have a blast at drag shows.
Not to mention that no one brings their kids to drag shows. But everyone takes their kid to church, and a lot of churches even have daycares attached where you can leave them all day.
Drag performers sometimes do child friendly events such as story time, but there's nothing sexual about those events. In fact, it's no question why kids would be drawn to being read stories by someone in a whimsical costume.
Fwiw, even burlesque performers sometimes do family friendly events (for obvious reason they do an outfit change rather than a strip tease). Anyone who does adult shows is very aware of the line between family friendly and not, and likely knows the local blue laws better than anyone else
Yeah like there are definitely some drag shows you shouldn't take your kids to but there's also movies and concerts you shouldn't take your kids to. There's even kids horror movies vs the obvious r rated adult stuff. If they're old enough to know boys and girls are different they're old enough to understand that sometimes people do other shit for fun the same as they're able to watch fucking Casper and experiment with the idea of death. It's just a fucking genre.
Any place where individuals hold a position of trust and authority is going to attract all kinds of abusers.
Which is why people in such positions should be held to a higher standard
Agreed
Well if dragshows were populated by powerful people getting heaps of tax free dollars and an opaque system that hides any accountability then kids would no longer be safe there.
Genuinely one of the kindest gentlest most wholesome environments I've been in.
Not that my experience is super broad or representative, but, maybe because there's so much misunderstanding, they're particularly patient and warm.
Would definitely bring my kid to a drag show before leaving him alone with a priest.
Yes, I know.
However, I would prefer them to be at drag story time.
Because there's no pretender in drag show.
Sprinkler thought, this is a no-brainer
In other news, water is wet.
Words of wisdom, Lloyd. Words of wisdom.
Maybe. Im betting not if you are talking per child hour of prescence. I mean if one thing happens to a kid at a drag show its going to blow the percentage off the roof.
What do you all think happens at Catholic mass these days? It's been about 10 years since I've gone myself, but when I was a kid I just sat next to my parents for an hour, went through the service, and left after.
They're not in much danger during a church service, but they're in danger when left alone with a preist
Is this still happening a lot lately in the Catholic Church?
Most priest's are required by law in Australia to be cleared by police and any church workers or volunteers are required by law to report anything suspicious. Training in identification of bad behaviours is also required
They do now, nice, good on ya's. After 12 moves perhaps they grew tired. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Ridsdale
apparently the church had a worldwide policy to move pedos from dioceses to dioceses hiding their crimes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_transfers_of_abusive_Catholic_priests
Lol that explains all the pedophiles
that's a really hot take
This is quite the take
Not from hellfire
They're equally safe from said fictional punishment
Looking at the number of times I've seen a respectable news source report abuse from church members versus the number of times I've seen a respectable news source report a confirmed hellfire burn being treated at the local hospital, I'll take my chances with the hellfire.
Do you honestly expect anyone to take you seriously?
Kids are safest when they never existed in the first place.
Damn, when did r/antinatalism migrate here
I'm not wrong though.
How bro felt after saying that
No I feel like a regular person.
Can someone be anything, let alone a someone, if they don't exist in the first place?
Exactly.
No problem with trans or drag shows but why do they do them for children? Would a burlesque show be available for children?
What is a trans show? I've never heard of such a thing.
You should see what child beauty pageants are like before you even grab that stone
The Epstein class is really into that type of thing
I certainly don't think they are acceptable either. 😂
I'm gonna throw you a bone for that
Uninformed straight white guy here: Drag does not intrinsically share the sexualization commonly associated with modern use of the term burlesque. But, yes, a burlesque show that doesn't mistakenly assume that burlesque is entirely about stripping/nudity might in fact be available for children.
The drag shows I've seen advertised certainly look sexual. Corsets, push up bras etc etc. Just be trans person and talk to kids if it's to help then. No need to dress up like a 70s transvestite.
As a transgender performer myself who constantly has to deal with people thinking I'm a drag performer because I'm trans, please don't conflate the two. Drag is a costume. Trans is not. It is possible to be trans and do drag, but it's not even the default tbh. It's mostly gay cis men in my experience.
Also, there's nothing inherently sexual about a corset otherwise you wouldn't see them all over renfaires and comic conventions. Same with bras, half the population wears them on a daily basis
Interesting. I get drag performers and have been to a few shows back in the day. I understand trans and trans kids. I don't understand the connection between drag and kids though.
To me it would make much more sense to have regular trans people teach the kids about the issues facing them.
Help me out here
There isn't one. Trans and drag are entirely separate things. We may cross paths often as allies but it's not inherent.
As trans people, we may advocate for better care for trans children (typically in the form of social support and at most informed access to puberty delayers) but that has nothing to do with drag shows. We just exist, much like anyone else, living 24/7 as our preferred gender. You wouldn't notice if you passed us on the street:
Drag performers on the other hand are just that, performers. They entertain audiences much like a juggler or a magician might. Sometimes that's performing in adult-only shows (typically in bars), other times it's reading to children or lip syncing Lady Gaga. They wear over the top costumes and act dramatically but at the end of the day it's just a costume. You'd know if you passed a drag performer on the street:
I don't blame you for any confusion since conservatives have been trying to muddle the waters ever since they learned the word drag, in part as a scare tactic to demonize trans people and make us scarier than we are. But there's no reason to fear either.
conservatives dont know that, they equate drag to being trans people.
No I completely understand the difference and you make complete sense.
I'm asking why the children's drag shows at libraries? Wouldn't trans speakers make more sense? That's the part I don't get .
Btw not a conservative by any means. More of a free loving hippie type who thinks everybody should be loved and treated equally. This trans stuff is new even for us old lefties
Why not both? One is entertainment, the other is education. Typically drag reading hours at libraries use entertainment to encourage children to read from an early age. In reality, the real reason you probably don't see more trans speakers is because our existence is seen as "woke"
Wasn't accusing you of being one, they're just the ones responsible for the current culture war. We just want to live in peace.
I would however like to point out that we've been around for all of humanity. Maybe not in name but in experience. A big part of why there's been so little awareness of trans people is because the Nazis did such a thorough job of eliminating us and any research into us, but the Internet allowed us to find each other. A good starting point to learn more is the Looting of the Institute of Sexology.
The first sex reassignment surgery happened in 1906, before Hitler's rise to power. Going even further back, we're all over ancient mythology. Loki was famously a gender bender, Caenis was an invulnerable trans warrior in the Illiad, Iphis was transformed into a man by an Egyptian goddess. Really it's just the Abrahamic religions that like to exclude us.
Drag IS NOT the same thing as being trans.
Drag artists are performers who can adjust their shows for different audiences.
I personally don't like enjoy drag, but it's more than RuPaul.
im pretty sure drag was a thing long before rupual came onto the scene.
Absolutely. But all that people like the sea lion in this thread know about is RuPaul because that's what the media publicizes.
So drag performers dress sexually to explain inclusion to children but they aren't trans. Did I get that right?
I thought the whole purpose was so that trans children don't feel outcast or different. Wouldn't it be better to have trans people talking to them instead of drag queens? "Edited due to horrible typo"
drag performers most certainly arnt trying to be strippers, you are confusing it porn/ stirpper or prostiuition. its only slightly different if you were dressing up as female/male in a show or movie.
No, you didn't get it right. You did manage to out yourself as a bigoted imbecile though, so grats on that.
Go back to Fox News and jerk off there instead. kthxbai
Why are you so angry Bill?
Because you're being a bigoted cunt.
With all due respect, you have no idea what you're talking about and trying to pick fights instead of learning.
What the fuck does Hamas have to do with anything in this thread?
Grow up or fuck off to the kid's table with Zuckerberg and Musk.
And I'm not trying to pick a fight. I'm trying to understand and be educated.
Oops. Massive typo. Lol. Hamas should have been trans. Wtf
Well thank god the world is not limited to the two or three things you have experienced in your life.
AKA other people exist! And their lives aren't always the exact same as yours! Fucking hell.
There's an aggressive assumption. Geez
You're being an aggressive, Charlie-Kirk-style asshole and by innuendo, you're slandering transpeople.
Take your who-me-aww-shucks bigotry and FUCK RIGHT OFF.
I'm assuming that you're the type of person nobody likes. So I'm aggressive and an asshole. Hrmmm okay. Seems like your projecting
Yes, burlesque performers sometimes do family friendly events. They typically do outfit changes or character work, not strip teases for obvious reason.
Regardless, drag isn't inherently sexual. It can be made sexual for an adult context but on its own, it's costuming and character work.