What exactly is the specific conspiracy you're alleging? AIPAC exists. There's nothing secret about what it does. This is like calling the existence of the Republican Party a conspiracy.
You have it backwards. Yes Israeli interests are a top priority for US politicians. Why? Because Israel is a component of US interests. Much like it would not be correct to say that Lockheed controls senators but rather that Lockheed is a component of the interests that senators have, Israel is doing things that the US needs it to do to advance the US's interests
I think it would be completely correct to say that Lockheed controls senators. Lockheed and Israel pay shitloads of money to get candidates elected that will stay loyal to them. What the fuck do you think lobbying is?
I think it would be completely correct to say that Lockheed controls senators. Lockheed and Israel pay shitloads of money to get candidates elected that will stay loyal to them. What the fuck do you think lobbying is?
It's not a conspiracy by Lockheed to control the US government to meet Lockheed's ends, and it's not a conspiracy by Israel to control the US government to meet Israel's ends. Both Lockheed and Israel serve the US, not the other way around. Lobbying is a coordinating function within the complex of factionalized collaborative/competitive dynamic of elite reproduction.
Thank you for the needlessly wordy definition of lobbying, it still exists to create loyalty within the government. Idk why you're trying so hard to let these groups off the hook for their share of the bad behavior.
I get that you obviously want to appear Super Smart and superior, but you're just wrong here.
I just don't think it's appropriate to say that Israel is controlling the USA, like the USA is some sort of victim. It's like saying the finance department is controlling the company. It's just a weird framing that leads to all sorts of misunderstandings. Israel isn't controlling the USA. The USA and Israel are collaborators with the USA in the dominant position and Israel doing what it can to maintain its function within the empire against competing shared interests.
It's completely appropriate when AIPAC is spending millions of dollars to influence elections. I don't understand why you are being so dismissive of brazen interference by a foreign entity. The US is both a perpetrator and a victim. Is the wound self inflicted? Absolutely, but that doesn't make it not interference.
THE US GAVE THAT MONEY TO AIPAC IN THE FIRST PLACE. AIPAC spending money is not foreign influence, it's domestic influence. Israel is a domestic policy issue, not a foreign policy one. Israel is far closer to the status of Puerto Rico vis-a-vis the USA than it is to say France or Australia. It's literally a vassal and a proxy without any possibility of existing independently of the USA. It's a subdivision of US interests, not outside of US interests
Both are true. Yes, the genocide in Palestine is ultimately a US choice, and Israel is ultimately a puppet of the west scapegoating Judaism for colonialism. But Israeli leaders are also slavish conspiratorialists hellbent on their singular goal of enabling never-ending war by keeping western politics locked in.
I don't understand. So they lost once? That means that it undoes all the decades of funding for politicians to send weapons to Israel? Like it's a verifiable fact that Israel has spent a ton on US elections.
OP is cherry picking a single data point to attempt to discredit a trend. It's like the climate change denialists going "Last winter was the coldest on record. Explain THAT, libtard!"
Counterpoint: it took genocide and dragging the US into another forever war for them to lose a Senate seat. I don't think Jews are trying to conquer the world or anything crazy, but they have undue influence on Congress, and that's not even debatable.
I agree with you, but you refer to the nation state of Israel, not Jews. Said nation state would love for you to conflate the two so that they can hide genocide behind cries of antisemitism, but there are millions of Jews who oppose the nation state.
No I refered to a conspiracy that Jews want to conquer the world. I concede my phrasing was ambiguous. "They" in my comment referred to the state of Israel.
Israel doesn't control the US, but I think OP misunderstands conspiracy.
Spending millions of dollars through a network of political action committees to try and manipulate elections in a foreign nation is a quintessential conspiracy.
36 replies
Failure of a conspiracy to achieve goals does not mean there is no conspiracy.
And do you mean to say that Israel does not care about and throw money at US elections? Cause that is a verifiable fact...
You want to hear a real conspiracy? You cant be this dumb, you must be one of 'them' pretending to be this dumb to throw people off
Def sock puppet account.
They have been growing in numbers on Lemmy
I see that I've triggered the conspiracy people.
Yes, this is a good example of conspiratorial ideation. You're inches away from self awareness.
What exactly is the specific conspiracy you're alleging? AIPAC exists. There's nothing secret about what it does. This is like calling the existence of the Republican Party a conspiracy.
Yes, that's right, you cant possibly be that dumb so you must be part of the conspiracy. Ya got me!
Woosh
I wouldn't say that Israel controls the US, but they do seem to control a large amount of legislators.
You have it backwards. Yes Israeli interests are a top priority for US politicians. Why? Because Israel is a component of US interests. Much like it would not be correct to say that Lockheed controls senators but rather that Lockheed is a component of the interests that senators have, Israel is doing things that the US needs it to do to advance the US's interests
I think it would be completely correct to say that Lockheed controls senators. Lockheed and Israel pay shitloads of money to get candidates elected that will stay loyal to them. What the fuck do you think lobbying is?
It's not a conspiracy by Lockheed to control the US government to meet Lockheed's ends, and it's not a conspiracy by Israel to control the US government to meet Israel's ends. Both Lockheed and Israel serve the US, not the other way around. Lobbying is a coordinating function within the complex of factionalized collaborative/competitive dynamic of elite reproduction.
Thank you for the needlessly wordy definition of lobbying, it still exists to create loyalty within the government. Idk why you're trying so hard to let these groups off the hook for their share of the bad behavior.
I get that you obviously want to appear Super Smart and superior, but you're just wrong here.
I just don't think it's appropriate to say that Israel is controlling the USA, like the USA is some sort of victim. It's like saying the finance department is controlling the company. It's just a weird framing that leads to all sorts of misunderstandings. Israel isn't controlling the USA. The USA and Israel are collaborators with the USA in the dominant position and Israel doing what it can to maintain its function within the empire against competing shared interests.
It's completely appropriate when AIPAC is spending millions of dollars to influence elections. I don't understand why you are being so dismissive of brazen interference by a foreign entity. The US is both a perpetrator and a victim. Is the wound self inflicted? Absolutely, but that doesn't make it not interference.
THE US GAVE THAT MONEY TO AIPAC IN THE FIRST PLACE. AIPAC spending money is not foreign influence, it's domestic influence. Israel is a domestic policy issue, not a foreign policy one. Israel is far closer to the status of Puerto Rico vis-a-vis the USA than it is to say France or Australia. It's literally a vassal and a proxy without any possibility of existing independently of the USA. It's a subdivision of US interests, not outside of US interests
Both are true. Yes, the genocide in Palestine is ultimately a US choice, and Israel is ultimately a puppet of the west scapegoating Judaism for colonialism. But Israeli leaders are also slavish conspiratorialists hellbent on their singular goal of enabling never-ending war by keeping western politics locked in.
Israeli leaders are LITERALLY Western politicians. They don't control they West, they are a faction in the West
I think we are both saying true and fully compatible things.
I don't understand. So they lost once? That means that it undoes all the decades of funding for politicians to send weapons to Israel? Like it's a verifiable fact that Israel has spent a ton on US elections.
Losing one primary election doesn't mean they haven't captured a significant number of others currently in Congress.
Awful logic
Yup, AIPAC bought and supported a rep in WA state. She won her primary in a landslide and will no doubt win the general unopposed.
OP is cherry picking a single data point to attempt to discredit a trend. It's like the climate change denialists going "Last winter was the coldest on record. Explain THAT, libtard!"
So you're attempting to downplay the severity of Israeli interference in American politics.
Why don't you take on a simpler task, such as insisting that the sun rises from the west and sets in the east?
Counterpoint: it took genocide and dragging the US into another forever war for them to lose a Senate seat. I don't think Jews are trying to conquer the world or anything crazy, but they have undue influence on Congress, and that's not even debatable.
Israel*
I agree with you, but you refer to the nation state of Israel, not Jews. Said nation state would love for you to conflate the two so that they can hide genocide behind cries of antisemitism, but there are millions of Jews who oppose the nation state.
No I refered to a conspiracy that Jews want to conquer the world. I concede my phrasing was ambiguous. "They" in my comment referred to the state of Israel.
Oh I see, "they" in your second sentence referred to the they in your first, and the they in your first sentence was intended to refer to Israel.
Yeah, bad grammer good intentions.
We just gonna ignore a beloved congressperson that was blocked by AIPAC again?
Israel doesn't control the US, but I think OP misunderstands conspiracy.
Spending millions of dollars through a network of political action committees to try and manipulate elections in a foreign nation is a quintessential conspiracy.
5/7 perfect shitpost
What the frick are some of these comments
And Democrats control the government, right?
Is this 1 of those jew AI posting?