Why do people act like coffee in the morning is such a sacred routine but soda in the morning [basically the same drink] is lowbrow and unhealthy?
like, it's caffeine and water and brown, who cares. i drink diet soda so it's no calories, no sugar. versus the stereotype starbucks order, why is soda so demonized
the whole sort of basically woo stuff about oh there's antioxidants there which give you a 3% lower risk of skin cancer after the age of 65 like come on that doesn't count
Coffee is healthier than soda if you take your coffee black. Black coffee is basically just water. Soda will have either sugar or artificial sweeteners in additional to sodium and other additives that make it a less healthy option.
Coffee with milk would still be better for you than soda, but you've got a good point about coffee with sweeteners essentially being just as bad as soda. Maybe the reason people treat coffee differently is because there is a healthy way to drink it and they incorrectly extrapolate that fact to any type of coffee (no, your coffee with eight sugars is not healthier than a can of Coke). Add in the fact that coffee is an acquired taste and now you've got one drink that only adults tend to drink (coffee) and one drink that kids love (soda) and people incorrectly assume that coffee is a more "grown up" thing to drink.
I think a coffee with 8 sugars is still WAY less sugar than a soda.
Yes and diet soda isn't a perfect alternative. We're still learning about the long term effects of artificial sweeteners. It's a headache trying to navigate the options.
There are seltzer waters that have caffeine. I would guess those are comparable to black coffee in terms of healthiness.
I'm not saying you're totally wrong to be suspicious but aspartame is the most scientifically examined substance in the history of the world, and so far its only damaging if you consume it undiluted in large quantities, which is also true for like vinegar or alcohol etc.
it would be equally true to suggest we don't know the long term effects of exposure to mobile phones, even though they seem perfectly safe.
Sure been studied but anything with this much profits on the line is bound to be massively influenced by it, and the fact that its gotten to even possibly a carcinogen is enough of a sign to me.
Andsalso 'most studied' what? Wheres that number even from
it's a quote from the FDA's website.
Absolutely true. Aspartame is generally regarded as safe under 40mg/kg and still researching long term effects doesn't mean it's dangerous, just that there may be more to discover. To be fair, science is constantly evolving and new discoveries are being made every day for... well, everything. Still, if you want to find the "healthiest" way to get your daily caffeine, there are options out there with minimal additives. Black coffee, tea, seltzers, even pills.
Basically the same drink? How?
Cup of black coffee and a cup of cola look similar, I guess..
Because people aren’t pouring 30-40 grams of sugar into their coffee. Also artificial sweeteners taste like shit and haven’t been proven to not cause other health issues.
Drink water.
I've seen people try. 🤢
If you have a large coffee with oat milk (which has tons of sugar/carbs) and sugar, it’s pretty damn close to that.
Your reasoning is on level with religious people claiming that atheists have to prove that god doesn't exist.
How do you prove that you are not a murderer?
Oh god dude you'd kill us so quick in the pharmaceutical industry.
EVERYTHING is trying to kill us, were lucky when something doesn't - so assuming a chemical we randomly made that tastes like sugar doesn't emulate it 100% isn't unreasonable
(and what do you know, there even are links between aspartame in diet coke and cancer)
The statement you think is supporting your belief is actually saying the opposite. WHO specifically does not claim that aspartame cause cancer.
However, what they did state is there was no reason to change the recommended acceptable daily intake level of 40 mg per kg of body weight per day .
Also, The FDA disagrees with IARC’s (what you refer to as WHO) conclusion that these studies support classifying aspartame as a possible carcinogen to humans. FDA scientists reviewed the scientific information included in IARC’s review in 2021 when it was first made available and identified significant shortcomings in the studies on which IARC relied. FDA also pointed out that JECF (also WHO) did not raise safety concerns for aspartame under the current levels of use and did not change the Acceptable Daily Intake (ADI).
So yeah.... Just believing journalists trying to click bait you is probably more likely to give you cancer than following the recommendation from WHO regarding daily intake of aspartame.
I didn't mention any regulatory bodies specifically, cause health should be generally referenced from as many sources as possible - but all those numbers are based on theoretical doses on rats, your coefficient of safety is gonna be that close to the theoretical??
Especially when there's probably billions in companies like coke and Pepsi on the line, yet were still trending in the direction of stricter classification - you're gonna risk your entire health on there being no bias???
You use a (heavily questioned) statement of an organization as a base for your claims when the organization explicitly doesn't support your conclusion. It's a fact that WHO still claims there is no dangers consuming the recommended daily amount.
The method used on rats to estimate the dangers is the method used when estimating dangers every other substances. So the argument is valid as long as you claim that every other substance cause cancer.
Then you end up nibbling on edges of the classic "the great aspartame conspiracy" but what you totally miss that "big sugar" is even more powerfull...
Nah I was lying to sound smart they almost for sure do human trials, but you're totally lying too is the funniest part
Oh... More unsubstantiated claims from you... Well .. have a nice Friday evening.
You’re the type of person who thinks plastics are perfectly safe because they are BPA free.
Everything is safe until it’s not.
I remember when doctors used to recommend smoking. I remember when doctors used to prescribe opiates for minor issues.
Basically, your logic sucks and I have zero reason to listen to you.
I just love how you end with "I have zero reason to listen to you" when no one has claimed such a thing and you were the one choosing to do the listening.
All of this because of me pointing out that WHO still claims that there is a daily amount of aspartame that is safe to consume and that the only thing you can prove is that something is unsafe and not the other way around.
By the way... If you think we should avoid aspartame because there is a suspicion that it might cause cancer I can imagine what you think about sugar, animal fat and protein which there is actual proof that it can cause everything from heart disease to cancer.
Sodas have high fructose corn syrup which is a type of sugar. One soda contains 18 packets of sugar [1]. This is far more than coffee for the average person. Now if you consider diet sodas those use aspertame as a sweetener and so it’s basically sweet’n’low packets. So on a pure sugar content perspective coffee is healthier.
Soda has been known to eat away teeth [2]. While coffee does so as well, it’s to a lesser degree[3]. So long-term physically, coffee is better.
If you consider nutritional benefits and ignore the antioxidants like you said, coffee is still mostly water and therefore can count to your water intake [4]. Soda is also water as you might imagine, it being a drink, but again, to a lesser degree.
That said, if you drink diet soda in the morning you do you. You shouldn’t feel judged for wanting to eat something in moderation. But know that coffee has proven health benefits and soda has proven health detriments. These things apply to sodas at whatever time of day.
A cup of coffee also has about 2g of fibre, which is actually quite a lot in the context of the average American diet of highly processed food. IIRC the average American only eats about 15g of fibre per day - which is fucking terrible BTW.
People care? Do what you want to do, it's your life. Have fun.
Sugar.
Or sweeteners, we know now that Aspartame is bad for your health.
We don't. It's been studied for decades and all they could come up with was that "in massive quantities it's possible it might cause cancer". Which is shit. Everything in massive quantities breaks something.
It's not recommended to intake more than 40mg per day per kilo of body weight. For a kid that could be two cans of coke.
I hope no one is giving their kid two cans of coke in a day, but I bet you a thousand pounds that they are.
That's actually really bad...lol
here's a link for anyone interested
Breaking news: everything gives you cancer (possibly)
So... you should like... avoid obvious signs of it? We have little wiggle room? wdym by this dog there's defiantly an area between cancer riddled and 100% healthy
That WHO study is highly problematic. It has some fairly serious methodological flaws. It's been disputed by the FDA. It is biased due to the panel comprising:
Source
Corn syrup and chemicals but I’m not sure why people are downvoting your reasonable question
“Chemicals” is a description for literally everything.
In this context I guess non-natural chemicals? Maybe the artificial sweeteners.
In this context may also be relevant discussions among coffee enthusiasts who talk about this and that chemical process during the brewing process, lending it a bitter or rich taste -- the coffee is full of chemicals.
I'm allergic to the word "chemicals" in discussions such as this, because it is too vague to define anything specific. It generally is used as a degradation of a thing that the speaker doesn't like. But that's all there is to it. The speaker can just as well say "I'm suspicious of this thing that you hold there", and this communicates exactly the same thing, maybe with a bit more care about ones words.
The distinction between natural and artificial is just as arbitrary. All the "plant derived" non-sugar sweeteners taste super weird to me and some give me a headache
Exactly. That's just marketing to groom the naturalistic fallacy.
Additives?
I downvoted because this doesn't feel like a casual conversation, more like trying to start an argument.
Pineapple belongs on pizza
Right there with jalapeño.
Thank you. I thought I lost my craving for pizza but I just got it back!
People will try to tell you to add meat too, but nah, not on this one. Enjoy!
I was going to add meat but I just love meat.
Username, as they say, checks out!
You misspelled "Watermelon"
Yeah I guess depending on whether honestly asking a question or making a point. Coffee is a bean. There is no Pepsi bean 😂
The Coca bean is great though
Coffee isn't even a bean https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffea
Yea seed ok
they're really proving my point. just this pure implicit bias for the stodgy adult drink that is functionally the same as soda - it's liquid with caffeine
You probably should've asked this in !NoStupidQuestions...
The two beverages are not the same. Coffee can be served with or without milk/cream and sugar, but even with sugar, it has far less than is in soda. It also has a significantly higher quantity of caffeine.
People aren't downvoting you because you drink soda; it's because you asked a dumb question with a ridiculous and blatantly incorrect take. Just drink soda and don't worry about what other people think. There's not some mass of people judging you. No one cares if you drink soda in the morning..
But it's just preposterous to be claiming they're the same beverage or that soda is as effective as coffee at waking people up. How about milk and soda? Are they the same beverage? What about root beer and beer? Your argument is just blatantly false and silly. That's why you're being downvoted.
i was under the impression that 'casual conversation' meant 'not necessarily being chastized for asking a lighthearted question without literally citing sources like i'm writing a thesis'
You made an absolutely absurd claim. It didn't seem like it to you, whixh is obvious now, but that was not a lighthearted comment more like it was a slap in the face.
At least, all the people responding seem to have taken it as a challenge
Lots of sodas, most in fact, doesn't have any caffeine in them at all.
People downvoting your question proves your point? That's all it takes? Then what the fuck have we been wasting our time for?
Someone, call science quick! We can save them so much time and energy if they don't need to do all that rigorous testing anymore, they can just ask the internet and see if it gets upvoted and downvoted!
Call the judges and cops and lawyers! They don't need evidence or proof anymore, we can all just vote and that will prove if someone committed triple homicide clear as day on camera or not!
It's filled with sugar man
I don't think they're the same. One is warm, one is cold, one is sweet, one is bitter.
Who’s drinking warm soda?
Idk, but cold coffee is great in summertime.
Brits, what else would they drink with their cold hotdogs?
591.471 mL of Coke contains like 187.5 g of sugar. Sweet coffee is healthier.
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Actually I looked it up, a 20 US fluid ounce Cola has 14-18 [teaspoons] of sugar, 65 grams in normal units (for Coca Cola). So you completely botched it.
All that said, I will have a soda instead if we run out of either coffee or creamer. Vanilla Coke zero sugar is my go-to in that instance.
See, I only drink coffee in the morning during the fall/winter. I can't do it during the hot parts of the year.
Most sugar alternatives used in soda really messes with your guts.
and dna
They're both completely wrong. Hot chocolate is the sacred beverage of the morning, the holy breakfast.
[basically the same drink]
Fr, I know I already put too much sugar in my coffee (2 cubes for a full mug), but it's nowhere near the equivalent of ~10 cubes per can in soda
soda is gross. coffee is excellent. that is all.
Counterpoint: Coffee is gross.
You're onto something.
counter-counterpoint: adding white shit to coffee makes it gross.
You're likely drinking bad coffee. It's unfortunately the most accessible type.
I'm not drinking any coffee.
Black coffee and tea are considered the healthiest options because no sugar, no sugar substitutes, no preservatives or other additives, and they've been used long enough that the health implications are well researched.
Diet sodas have ingredients that are considered safe in moderation by the FDA, but we are still learning about the long term effects of artificial sugars and different additives. There are caffeinated seltzers out there with just natural flavoring and caffeine. That would probably be a better comparison to black coffee and tea.
Maybe a bit of context would be in order because I don't know anyone who would even blink if you started your day at work with soda.
Though I think if you started your average morning with drinking a soda first thing would be a bit weird. But it's the same kind of weird that having hamburger meal or a full roast as breakfast is. It's just not customary.
Carbonated anything is bad for your bones and teeth, long term. That's not avoidable by drinking diet soda. Artificial sweeteners have been shown to still cause simular effects in the body to actual sugar in some cases, and other health issues over time.
Coffee drinks as typically ordered at Starbucks are also filled with unhealthy additions and should be treats, not daily staples. Plain drip coffee taken black is healthier, but rather gross, yet I know people who drink it
I'm team tea, myself. Definitely the superior drink. Actually strengthens your teeth (stains them yet makes them stronger) if you dont add sugar. Just don't carbonate it or add too much other stuff to it if you're after health.
I drink black coffee, americanos or espresso. No milks, no sugar. Either you like coffee or you like milk and sugar. Might as well have a hot chocolate at that point.
Plain coffee with unsweetened almond milk!
Hmm almond milk, I've always wondered how you milk an almond.
Is it from the pointy end?
Carbonated drinks are not good for your teeth. Even if they are of the zero sugar variant. The CO2 basically increases the acidity in the drink. They add a shit ton of sweetener or sugar to hide the sour taste. Drinking sodas right after brushing your teeth just negates the positive effects toothpaste will have on your teeth. Even worse if you brush your teeth after drinking a soda. The acidity of a soda makes your teeth softer then when you brush you basically scrape the enamel away.
And yes this is also true for fruit juice like orange juice.
Water and co2 combine to make a weak acid. But that isn’t the acid that is the issue. The real issue is that soda makers like coke intentionally make the soda more acidic, to cover up the overly sweet. Without the added acid the soda would taste way too sweet.
The real issue tho is all the sugar they put in it. All the added calories and triglycerides is what kills you over time.
It's not the same drink, your premise is flawed. Coffee has way more caffeine, is generally served hot, and most importantly, tastes completely different.
Diet soda is also still not good for you.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-healthy-eating/expert-answers/diet-soda/faq-20057855
Basically, black coffee tastes better (subjective), has more caffeine, and is less bad for your health. Alternatively you could go the tea route but personally I prefer coffee.
The quote that you've included doesn't say that diet soda is bad for you, only that it's "not clear if it's effective at preventing obesity".
People love their social norms. You wouldn’t believe the shit I got when I stopped eating breakfast. “Most important meal of the day!” I feel great fasting and don’t miss it at all. I’ll eat cereal for dinner. You have a fucking diet soda in the morning if you want.
Breakfast has always been my least important meal of the day... I'd rather have an extra 10 minutes in bed.
that's why breakfast for dinner is where its at
I like my coffee like I like my women.
Hot, strong, and a little bitter.
Imported from South America in sacks...
I like my Coffee like I like my women: without someone else's penis in it
Sugar
Coffee helps me poop.
red bull does the same for me lol
Diet sodas are fine!
https://youtu.be/iIAFe7zaCRU?si=Zxkdo6cnHEOaK_kP
I really don’t care about how people feel about something I drink and I don’t care what they drink. I think coffee tastes nasty so I stick to sodas and tea for breakfast
The main risk of sugar isn't the calories themselves, but rather their effect on our fullness perception. That is, the more sugar we eat, the harder it is to feel full after eating something. This in return cases a vicious cycle, one that can easily lead into obesity. I don't know if that same issue can happen with sweeteners but I don't generally trust anything that tricks our senses to such a degree. I don't consider coffee the holy grail either, it's just that its negative health effects have been tested for ages and are acceptable for its overall benefits. But that's my own risk assessment, with only my health in the line.
It's hard to get a good grip on the health neutrality of diet soda when the companies who make them have lied to us about sugar for decades. Maybe sweeteners are just their next lie, who knows. Much of the research done on sweeteners is funded by the ones who profit from it. The food industry have far more power than anyone should be comfortable with them having.
drinkin drinkin drinkin
drinkin coka coka cola
I can feel it Rollin right on down
a'Right on down my throat
You're too modest.
If you ain't chugging the glass of water off your night stand as the very first drink of the morning, y'all are missing out.
After that, I have a NOS. Energy Drinks are the socially acceptable morning beverage that isn't coffee. Or orange juice. Or milk.
That's how I got my first and hopefully last kidney stone.
what is a NOS?
Brand of energy drink with packaging designed to resemble a nitrous oxide tank found in aftermarket automotive industry.
Everything anout energy drinks' branding screams unhealthy. Even their advertising is focused on partying and extreme sports, it's like they want you to increase your chances of dying young.
That being said, the actual evidence of energy drinks being particularly unhealthy is kind of mixed.
They are indisputably unhealthy on account of the amount of sugar they contain.
There are sugar-free variants.
"Coffee in the Morning" is a cultural phenomenon. You can argue the relative merits of different beverages and times to drink them, but the status of coffee has nothing to do with nutrition or biochemistry.
I wonder what those at ![email protected] have to say about this.
Hi there! Looks like you linked to a Lemmy community using a URL instead of its name, which doesn't work well for people on different instances. Try fixing it like this: ![email protected]
I don't understand how people can have sugar with their primary source of caffeine. Caffeine just doesn't hit me right with any calories. I also hate coffee, so I live on those Celcius powders.
I think it's fine. You do you.
Contrary to popular belief, diet soda is completely fine in moderation (like 20 cans per day limit), assuming your teeth/guts can handle the acidity. Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCDqqVwYMa4
Coffee typically doesn't have much or any sugar in it. It's caffeine, water, milk. It has more caffeine than soda so it feels better to take it in the morning
20 cans a day is moderation to you? Wow.
That's the limit of safe intake.
You should spend some time learning how to vet sources. That's not a reliable source.
I get that it's a youtube video but Dr Mike knows his stuff. He goes through WHO's recommendations and gives his practical input on the matter.
His background -
I rarely drink coffee and sometimes drink soda, but never in the morning. I’m concerned about developing a need for caffeine.
Once I thought coffee was giving me migraines so I quit it cold turkey for 2 months. Turns out it wasn't so I started again. I just like a warm drink in the morning. Caffeine itself doesn't really do anything to me I don't think. I can drink a coffee at 11pm and pass out at 1130 no problem.
I've heard caffeine can have a calming effect on people with ADHD.
It can. I have a friend who let her preteen son drink coffee, because he had ADHD and it had a positive effect on him.
Lol, I do sometimes wonder if I have that
Also the amount is important soft drinks are packed in 300ml or 500ml where coffee you get only 30ml shot and glass of water