Me an my GF sometimes make jokes like this, from both ends, just to have a laugh at expense of those who mean these types of comments seriously. Its unimaginable to me to say, in serious manner "Woman, make me coffe, go back to the kitchen where you belong!", and when I do, we both know its a joke, I go to the kitchen and make my self a coffe because how incompetent I'd have to be if I can't pour some water in a fucking cup. We sometimes watch Czech Wife Swap and come people are just insufferable assholes.
That is just satirizing people say these things seriously, so it's perfectly fine. I do this too, but obviously only with people who know me well enough to know I'm not serious.
Made misogynist jokes with ex-wives and girlfriends, but you made me realize I can't do that with my wife. She doesn't understand some American humor and would take such a joke literally. If I said, "Go make me a sammich woman!", she'd ask what kind I would like.
100% and the same applies for people who make racists jokes. I used to have "friends" that would call their n-word slur and send me like kkk lynching videos with these like dumb ass captions. They arent "making fun of people who believe that stuff" they are just racist.
If I reverse it and the opposite isn't true, then I don't take the bait.
Does:
If you are a woman who thinks it's funny to make misandrist jokes purely to make your male friends uncomfortable/angry then you're a misandrist. It's not "just a joke". You literally are finding humor in the discomfort and dehumanization of men. You are not helping, you are not making satire. You are just being misandrist.
Feel right? Because I feel like we can make both misandrist and misogynist musings from time to time, and a lot of us genuinely do this as satire and/or to push buttons in the right company.
Yeah, it would be equally awful for women to make jokes about men simply because they are men. However, I’m having a hard time even coming up with an example of a misandrist joke a woman could say, let alone of any girl friends who base their sense of humor around it (the way some guys base their humor around making fun of women.) I’ve heard tons of guys say some variety of, “Woman, go in the kitchen and make me a sandwich” but I’ve never heard a woman say, “Man, go outside and chop me some firewood” or whatever the equivalent “joke” would be.
To be clear, I’m not saying it can’t happen, just that it has to be so rare compared to the reverse situation. The closest thing I can think of would be small-dick jokes, which women hardly have a monopoly on.
Ever heard of a workplace? You don’t always choose who you’re around. Or…. Anything really. Ever played a video game? With other people on voice chat? A girl speaks up and then shitty jokes abound?
Fair enough. I guess I added context to the post that wasn't explicitly there. But no, I don't really play online games anymore, and when I've worked in an office, it's been a really long time since I've worked with anyone who would do something like this.
The worst kind of misogyny isn't the kind that is easy to point out, it's the kind that is hard to explain to the person who said it without them feeling offended about it. It's the kind that you can't explain it to them without seeming petty, because one comment alone isn't a big deal, but it adds up over time and cuts just as deep.
No one is immune to implicit bias. Sometimes, even feminist men say things they don't mean in an attempt at humor. Women are putting up with this far more than you can imagine because you simply don't notice the emotional labor that goes into processing what they said and accepting that this is their best attempt at being an ally which is worth something in a time when there is far worse misogyny out there.
Hello, I'm a man, I'm not riled up by this post. I even looked through her profile and did my very best to get angry, alas, it was mostly just memes, usually without political contact anyways.
I mean, Butterfly does post some things that are kinda "all men are bastards" from time to time, but it's not every post, and there is an unspoken understanding that if you are not one of those people, then the joke or the post doesn't apply to you.
Some of her, (assuming since she is "Lady Butterfly") posts have actually triggered me, making me go, "I'm not one of these people. Why are you posting stuff like this?" So I kind of get it. I had to step back and really process to understand.
The subtlety gets lost sometimes, but if you're not one of the bastards, then the statement doesn't apply to you.
Maybe some of these people need to be reminded that they are not being picked on for being born male, they are hearing the rage of people who were being picked on for being born female.
I agree this post is fine, and 'all men are bastards' isn't. Yes, it likely comes from a lot of repressed rage after a lifetime of misogyny, but that doesn't change the fact that she is posting this on a platform that is predominantly feminist-leaning men, and this message only serves to hurt the very people who would care enough to introspect on it.
It's also regressive message dressed in a feminist trench coat, because the idea that 'all men are bastards' deprives men agency over themselves, and by extent responsibility over anything they say or do. The idea that 'men are just like this, you should know better' is a common victim blaming tactic. So really, saying this is helping noone and hurting everyone.
there is an unspoken understanding that if you are not one of those people, then the joke or the post doesn’t apply to you.
The subtlety gets lost sometimes, but if you’re not one of the bastards, then the statement doesn’t apply to you.
But it does apply to you, you even admit it. Maybe we should just condemn all sweeping generalizations? Nobody should have to deal with being triggered because someone is raging against your race, gender, nationality, etc
"girls were being mean on the internet so now I'm a fascist" is a terrible argument and you should feel bad for attempting to legitimize it. You can criticize women without blaming them for all your problems, you know.
No, they should stop posting the shit. Is decisive and feeding the fascism train. All the subtly and nuance of these conversations is lost and it ends up every fucking time everyone vs white men. Zero empathy for a child growing up just hearing how he is the reason for everyones woes and problems his entire life. Getting more mad with every post that doesn't describe him or his friends. Made fun of and called a pussy because he likes trucks.
And then this place wonders where these men who now hate everyone else and feel attacked come from.
It's like watching the US bomb Afghanistan and Vietnam and expecting the populace to magically become democratic.
I don't have an answer how you fix this shit but constantly blaming white men and looking for boogymen to hang with purity tests ain't fucking it.
Nah, I'll typically head to the real world where words have consequences and usually people will think twice about what they're saying. This place is just filled to the brim with the most angry disenfranchised population, it's rare to find any sort of moderate opinion trying to demonize the imaginary enemies or someone who isn't running some sort of political purity test.
42 replies
They are testing the room.
Yep!!! They're seeing what they can get away with
Example:
A: offensive joke
B: that's offensive
A: it was a joke don't be a snowflake I don't mean it
A: (secretly I meant that and I think even worse things, that was just a small glimpse of my power level)
Example 2:
A: offensive joke
B: haha
A: long string of hateful nonsense
B: you are so right
Do you?
Schrodinger’s Misogynist
Me an my GF sometimes make jokes like this, from both ends, just to have a laugh at expense of those who mean these types of comments seriously. Its unimaginable to me to say, in serious manner "Woman, make me coffe, go back to the kitchen where you belong!", and when I do, we both know its a joke, I go to the kitchen and make my self a coffe because how incompetent I'd have to be if I can't pour some water in a fucking cup. We sometimes watch Czech Wife Swap and come people are just insufferable assholes.
Yeah but you also know her and specifically aren't doing it to make her uncomfortable.
Right, but you both know each other well and know each other's intentions when making such jokes.
That is just satirizing people say these things seriously, so it's perfectly fine. I do this too, but obviously only with people who know me well enough to know I'm not serious.
Made misogynist jokes with ex-wives and girlfriends, but you made me realize I can't do that with my wife. She doesn't understand some American humor and would take such a joke literally. If I said, "Go make me a sammich woman!", she'd ask what kind I would like.
you don't have to be a man for this to be true.
100% and the same applies for people who make racists jokes. I used to have "friends" that would call their n-word slur and send me like kkk lynching videos with these like dumb ass captions. They arent "making fun of people who believe that stuff" they are just racist.
Can you type louder, can't hear you from the kitchen. I'm making a sandwich.
If I reverse it and the opposite isn't true, then I don't take the bait.
Does:
If you are a woman who thinks it's funny to make misandrist jokes purely to make your male friends uncomfortable/angry then you're a misandrist. It's not "just a joke". You literally are finding humor in the discomfort and dehumanization of men. You are not helping, you are not making satire. You are just being misandrist.Feel right? Because I feel like we can make both misandrist and misogynist musings from time to time, and a lot of us genuinely do this as satire and/or to push buttons in the right company.
I have a hard time with this because I would feel the same way about purposely making my friends and loved ones uncomfortable in this situation.
I’d definitely make anti-nazi jokes to make a nazi uncomfortable though, but that’s beliefs and not gender. I’d also not call a nazi my friend.
Nazis actively break the social contract, so that's an exception and an open invitation to turn the tables, as far as I'm concerned.
To be clear, your Nazi example is entirely consistent:
If you are OK with some of these and not others, that just reflects your value judgement on those groups.
Yeah, it would be equally awful for women to make jokes about men simply because they are men. However, I’m having a hard time even coming up with an example of a misandrist joke a woman could say, let alone of any girl friends who base their sense of humor around it (the way some guys base their humor around making fun of women.) I’ve heard tons of guys say some variety of, “Woman, go in the kitchen and make me a sandwich” but I’ve never heard a woman say, “Man, go outside and chop me some firewood” or whatever the equivalent “joke” would be.
To be clear, I’m not saying it can’t happen, just that it has to be so rare compared to the reverse situation. The closest thing I can think of would be small-dick jokes, which women hardly have a monopoly on.
Saving for reference.
I wonder when was the last time I heard a back to the kitchen/washing machine joke?
thatsbait.jpg
Yup
What is even an example of this? I struggle to understand what this would even refer to
You're asking for examples of misogynistic jokes?
This isn't the place to repeat them. You could try Google if you're really that confused.
I don't think you're confused though.
Ever heard of a workplace? You don’t always choose who you’re around. Or…. Anything really. Ever played a video game? With other people on voice chat? A girl speaks up and then shitty jokes abound?
Fair enough. I guess I added context to the post that wasn't explicitly there. But no, I don't really play online games anymore, and when I've worked in an office, it's been a really long time since I've worked with anyone who would do something like this.
The worst kind of misogyny isn't the kind that is easy to point out, it's the kind that is hard to explain to the person who said it without them feeling offended about it. It's the kind that you can't explain it to them without seeming petty, because one comment alone isn't a big deal, but it adds up over time and cuts just as deep.
No one is immune to implicit bias. Sometimes, even feminist men say things they don't mean in an attempt at humor. Women are putting up with this far more than you can imagine because you simply don't notice the emotional labor that goes into processing what they said and accepting that this is their best attempt at being an ally which is worth something in a time when there is far worse misogyny out there.
Thanks for putting it this way. I get what you are saying and I appreciate you not assuming I'm coming in bad faith here. Because I'm not.
She's just sexist. She posts sexist shit to rile men up every day. It's a game to her. She's sitting in her seat laughing at all the angry men.
Hello, I'm a man, I'm not riled up by this post. I even looked through her profile and did my very best to get angry, alas, it was mostly just memes, usually without political contact anyways.
It's says 'if you're a man who thinks it's funny to make misogynistic jokes'.
If you're a normal man, why would you be riled up by this? In what way is she being sexist?
I'll assume you're reading this as 'all men make misogynistic jokes', which is not what she wrote at all.
I mean, Butterfly does post some things that are kinda "all men are bastards" from time to time, but it's not every post, and there is an unspoken understanding that if you are not one of those people, then the joke or the post doesn't apply to you.
Some of her, (assuming since she is "Lady Butterfly") posts have actually triggered me, making me go, "I'm not one of these people. Why are you posting stuff like this?" So I kind of get it. I had to step back and really process to understand.
The subtlety gets lost sometimes, but if you're not one of the bastards, then the statement doesn't apply to you.
Maybe some of these people need to be reminded that they are not being picked on for being born male, they are hearing the rage of people who were being picked on for being born female.
I agree this post is fine, and 'all men are bastards' isn't. Yes, it likely comes from a lot of repressed rage after a lifetime of misogyny, but that doesn't change the fact that she is posting this on a platform that is predominantly feminist-leaning men, and this message only serves to hurt the very people who would care enough to introspect on it.
It's also regressive message dressed in a feminist trench coat, because the idea that 'all men are bastards' deprives men agency over themselves, and by extent responsibility over anything they say or do. The idea that 'men are just like this, you should know better' is a common victim blaming tactic. So really, saying this is helping noone and hurting everyone.
But it does apply to you, you even admit it. Maybe we should just condemn all sweeping generalizations? Nobody should have to deal with being triggered because someone is raging against your race, gender, nationality, etc
God forbid we stop feeding the fascism train.
"girls were being mean on the internet so now I'm a fascist" is a terrible argument and you should feel bad for attempting to legitimize it. You can criticize women without blaming them for all your problems, you know.
No, they should stop posting the shit. Is decisive and feeding the fascism train. All the subtly and nuance of these conversations is lost and it ends up every fucking time everyone vs white men. Zero empathy for a child growing up just hearing how he is the reason for everyones woes and problems his entire life. Getting more mad with every post that doesn't describe him or his friends. Made fun of and called a pussy because he likes trucks.
And then this place wonders where these men who now hate everyone else and feel attacked come from.
It's like watching the US bomb Afghanistan and Vietnam and expecting the populace to magically become democratic.
I don't have an answer how you fix this shit but constantly blaming white men and looking for boogymen to hang with purity tests ain't fucking it.
I'm a man but I'm not going to come into woman centric community and start defending misogynistic "humour" like come one, dude.
If you get riled up by this, maybe her posts are a needed breeze of fresh air in your feed.
Edit typo
Nah, I'll typically head to the real world where words have consequences and usually people will think twice about what they're saying. This place is just filled to the brim with the most angry disenfranchised population, it's rare to find any sort of moderate opinion trying to demonize the imaginary enemies or someone who isn't running some sort of political purity test.
More scheduled second by butterfly. News at 11.
I’m not going to call you an AI, but I am going to call you an asshole.