Spyke

Writing as a fan of the americano, I think we should just call it what it is. After all, what's more american than taking something good and watering it down?

Alternatively we could call it the italiano since that's where it originated. Or "café à l'eau" perhaps, what's more Canadian than randomly adding french. Calling it "canadiano" feels too "freedom fries" to me.

111
Optionalreply
lemmy.world

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caff%C3%A8_americano#Origin

That said, why not Canadiano. Sometimes you want more and a litttle hydration in there. It's hard to sip an espresso for more than a couple of minutes.

Agree it feels kind of "freedom fries"-ey but remember that freedom fries were a US republiQan idiocy in a pathetic attempt to mock the French for being too smart to get balls-deep in the Iraq II war. No one but complete koolaid-drinking Qanuts say 'freedom fries' now because (a) the French were correct anyway and (b) fries are Belgian.

In that sense, this is probably better and has a chance of sticking.

18

It's not the same situation as freedom fries at all, but it has the same sort of cringe feel to me. Just like french fries, the americano isn't really american. We're not 'sticking it' to anyone here, so it rubs me the wrong way a little. I hardly have a strong opinion on it though.

11
Optionalreply
lemmy.world

It refers to the US (American) servicemen stationed in Italy during WWII.

6
lugalreply
lemmy.dbzer0.com

According to the link in my parent comment, I quoted in my first comment, it doesn't but what do I know

1
Optionalreply
lemmy.world

There is a popular belief that the name has its origins in World War II when American G.I.s in Italy diluted espresso with hot water to approximate the coffee to which they were accustomed.[9] However, the Oxford English Dictionary cites the term as a borrowing from Central American Spanish café americano, a derisive term for mild coffee dating to the middle of the 1950s.

Yeah but 1950s > WWII so

Bonus points: what was the lemon peel for?

7

I suppose if Google is the authority and "taking off" means . . what, 1980? Then yeah.

I don't agree, but that's okay too.

1

Because a Canadiano is a much stronger, beefed-up caffeinated beverage — coffee with two shots of espresso. Let’s just call an Americano what is is — snowflake fuel.

1

"Canadese" is "Canadian" in italian, so that would also change compared to Americano (American in Italian)

4

It should be left Americano. It’s called that because Americans couldn’t handle the stronger coffee or espresso and wanted it watered down. Weak. “Americano” is kinda insulting by itself. But whatever works for you.

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semreply
lemmy.blahaj.zone

I used to look down on the Americano, but as I got older I realized sometimes I'm more in the mood for one than espresso or a milky drink.

It's the same amount of coffee, just in lower concentration. You can also sip on it longer before you run out.

19
semreply
lemmy.blahaj.zone

At home I do but a lot of places that have great espresso make awful, neglected, drip coffee.

"Go to better places" yeah whatever

14

Sometimes those cheap less than perfect places are the best place around

It's not just the product, it's the atmosphere that matters too

4
lime!reply
feddit.nu

an americano is supposed to be a facsimile of filter coffee.

1

It doesn't really taste like filter coffee though. It tastes like mellowed-out espresso, which is nice sometimes

2
Gloomyreply
mander.xyz

This one is ironic because the macho-mindset of needing to be STRONG and therefor only consuming hard stuff is realy American interpretation of manhood in itself.

1

Ya, the macho-mindset is what was offered when joes asked for the rations they were used to, not the other way around and not unique.

1
NotSteve_reply
lemmy.ca

I like them :(. They’re very similar to coffee but a bit stronger

19
sh.itjust.works

yeah, it's one of my favourite coffees. I like perc-brewed black coffee already, americano has all the, uh, "perks" of it but also the richer flavour of an espresso. So good.

11
sh.itjust.works

Dunno if I'd say I prefer perc coffee but I have a really good quality moccamaster that makes very fine perc, it's great. I never got behind the French press superiority arguments, I find it tends to bring out the acidity in the roasts i prefer. I do love a good watered down espresso though, probably more than perc cup-for-cup, but i couldn't drink four of them over the day

3
siipalereply
sopuli.xyz

Does moccamaster make percolators too? I've only seen their filter coffee makers.

1

Oh, that might be regional terminology. Drip coffee makers are called percolators where i live, but I see from google that the terms aren't always synonyms

1
IninewCrowreply
lemmy.ca

I thought the same thing .... I thought Americano was basically just an espresso with a lot of water added to it

One of the reasons why I enjoyed espressos and why a lot of Europeans preferred it was due to the fact that it makes you pee less ... same hit of caffeine but no need to go pee every half an hour.

I will sometimes have a pot of coffee a day at home and every time I do, I end up heading to the toilet to pee just about every hour. I really should just switch to espressos but my wife prefers the drip stuff.

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corvireply
lemm.ee

If the espresso isn’t making you pee, you might just be dehydrated. Caffeine is a diuretic, so it’s going to make you lose some water.

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IninewCrowreply
lemmy.ca

The espresso will still make you pee ... just less often because there is less liquid to pee out ... if you drink two or three cups of liquid, you're more likely and more often will be going to the toilet.

If you drink an espresso, you got the hit of caffeine but there is less liquid in the system to want to flush out.

I spent several holidays in the south of Spain and they have about ten different types and amounts and concentrations of espresso. A Spanish breakfast is basically just an espresso and maybe a pastry because they want to be able to work all morning without a toilet break interrupting them. I learned early on from Spanish people that you can just drink an espresso and then go walking around a city for an hour or two without a break for anything for the toilet or even to eat because you're so hopped up on caffeine (it acts as a hunger suppressant as well).

The opposite of that is Americano. I work in a bit of construction and renovation and before going to Europe, I'd fill myself with drip coffee and go to work .... work for about an hour then have to take pee breaks. Nothing worse than being on top of a roof with all your gear, in middle of a ton of work and you have to head down to pee ... only to do it again and again (it's the main reason why you will often see construction workers peeing in a corner on the lawn or just out a window or into a gravel pit or use piss jugs around the job site).

Now I drink an espresso or two if I plan on working at a site for a few hours.

2

The espresso will still make you pee ... just less often because there is less liquid to pee out ... if you drink two or three cups of liquid, you're more likely and more often will be going to the toilet.

You just explained dehydration bro

9

Caffeine isn't a true diuretic the way alcohol is. It doesn't dehydrate your body. But it still makes you pee because it irritates your bladder, causing you to pee out whatever was in there.

1

I thought Americano was basically just an espresso with a lot of water added to it

I think they mean it's like a regular "instant" coffee but stronger, rather than like an espresso but "weaker".

6

I think it's because most people don't put as much coffee in the filter as they should and they end up making a weak coffee.

1
MisterFrogreply
lemmy.world

This took me a second to process. Is filter coffee "coffee" in north America?

7

More or less, yes. Decades ago, the dominant kind in the US was perk (percolated) but that fell by the wayside^1^. The only time it makes sense to order an Americano by name here is at a coffee bar where it's wise to specify how you want your cup made.


1. Honestly, it's a tad more eco-friendly but many coffees are just not to people's tastes like this - you get a very bitter cup this way.

2

It's not to say they can't be delicious and can certainly be nicer than a lot of preparations if it is rooted in a nice espresso shot.

However, the origin story is that American GIs couldn't handle espresso and made Italians water it down to make it more like "coffee back home", hence the name.

I'd imagine an authentic Canadiano would at least have some cheese curds in it.

2
lemmy.world

I'll back you up: This likely upsets the right (in both senses of the word) people. This and all the upside-down merch. Keep going you glorious-and-upset-yet-polite people north of the border.

PS: please keep sending maple syrup, and thank you.

8

PS: please keep sending maple syrup, and thank you.

It'll have a tariff, and if things ever go back to normal and the tariff is removed the price will not go down again

5
filcukreply
lemmy.zip

What desperate soul invented this, I hope they're doing better now, wherever they are

4

Considering that Finns drink far more coffee than Italians, it might have something to do with living close to the pole. Those dark winters are brutal and the long light in the summer isn't exactly great for sleep quality, either.

1
lemmy.world

while I support Canada boycotting the US, you have to admit this in particular is "freedom fries" tier patriotism. it was embarrassing then, and it is embarrassing now.

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pyrereply
lemmy.world

I would agree if this was Mexico doing it as a response to the gulf thing... then it would have made some sense in context.

0
pyrereply
lemmy.world

Yes. Please refer to my original comment, once again, clearly in support of boycotting the US in actually meaningful ways. I say this would be more understandable coming from Mexico because then it would be a jab, against the US unilaterally trying to rename the Gulf of Mexico, so it would make sense to rename something named after America(ns) in return.

"Oh, you did tariffs and threatening annexation, I shall no longer call this coffee Americano" just doesn't follow logically. And compared to the threat it is the weakest, lamest, most pathetic form of protest imaginable. That's my point.

1

You are being too literal.

A better analogy is to say that it's as lame as Freedom Fries, but it being aimed at the country that re-labeled the French Fry, so that makes it ironic and much funnier.

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Gloomyreply
mander.xyz

We changed the nane of a product because you haven't joined us wilding an unjustified war on brown people

vs.

We changed the name of a product because you waged an unjustified trade war against us for no reason, even tough we have been your closest alley.

Not the same.

16

You understand how despite the differences in justification, someone can find both examples cringe, right?

1
pyrereply
lemmy.world

I didn't question motivations. I already said I support boycotting the US. this is not a method of protest that does anything. it's lame and stupid. Americano is not even American, nor is it Canadian. it's just dumb. it's like saying you remember watching Canadian Pie as a teen.

-1
pyrereply
lemmy.world

I didn't say it isn't. i said it's not American, as in it doesn't come from the US.

3

Americano is not even American

I mean that's a pretty specific phrasing.

I said it’s not American, as in it doesn’t come from the US.

Those are not the same things, but i know what you mean now, so thanks.

3
parrhesiareply
sh.itjust.works

If politicians are pushing this particular change, it would be a bit cringe imo but I chuckled when I saw it.

7

Agreed that it would definitely be much worse, and maybe I wouldn't have found it as cringe if I hadn't seen the push for "Freedom Fries" back in the day.

5
sh.itjust.works

Yeah, no. If you didn't support their pointless wars back then, they would call you a traitor. Fuck me for not wanting my friends to die.

6

You could not support their wars, and also not stoop to their level of pettiness.

5
pyrereply
lemmy.world

I don't understand what this has to do with anything I said.

2
lemm.ee

The "freedom fries" 20 years ago occurred because France did not want to support our stupid middle eastern wars. That spawned the stupid movement to stop calling them French fries. If you were not pro-war in the US in the early 2000's, a lot of people would suggest you were unpatriotic.

That is why they said. Because you brought it up.

6

I know what Freedom Fries is. That's why I brought it up. I don't understand how that's relevant to my comment that calling Americano Canadiano is dumb.

3
itslilithreply
lemmy.blahaj.zone

Except back then the US was the aggressor, and now the US is the aggressor. I wouldn't equivocate "you don't want to blindly follow me into a pointless war" to "you're targeting me in a trade war"

3

My point is that neither name change actually sends either message. They're both weak and pointless, literally inconsequential and completely self contained. Imagine the French being ... hurt? annoyed? ... that some fuckwits on the other side of the world don't call fries French Fries... as if they gave a shit before. Same here.

2
lemm.ee

I mean an Americano is just watered down espresso and AFAIK was coined to make fun of the Americans.

15
feddit.org

But what does that say about yourself when that's apparently the kind of coffee you want?

2
Whitebrowreply
lemmy.world

Means you had (likely) cruddy coffee that was normalized for you since a young age, probably with loads of sugar and or milk/cream to boot.

Just the normal cycle for most people tbh.

The comfort of the known combined with an underdeveloped palette is what makes it attractive to a lot of people

It often changes and evolves with time as you grow older, kind of like when you try foods that you hated as a kid only to discover they’re really good.

Granted that only happens if you explore and experiment, otherwise you never really grow out of it

0
feddit.org

Pretty snooty outlook on coffee, especially considering that café au lait, cappuccino etc. exist.

3

Coffee snobs are the most hilarious variety of snob.

It's the sincerity of the nonsense that really sets them apart.

3
cactopusesreply
lemm.ee

Obviously, everyone is entitled to enjoy the drinks they like, but at least in Canada where I am from, Tim Horton's reigns supreme, and before I started drinking my coffee black I drank their coffee all the time, but as soon as I took all the sugar and cream out of it I realized it was frankly pretty terrible.

I think that's what Whitebrow is referring to (not even Tim's specifically, just lower tier coffees from such chains) I also see Folgers, and Maxwell House get consumed a lot here, and I find those particular brands to be fairly low quality as well.

A Cappuccino made correctly with espresso is quite delicious, but that's a very different beverage from brewed coffee with a lot of cream and sugar.

1
feddit.org

A well-made americano tastes great without cream and sugar, too. When Tim Horton makes a bad americano that doesn't mean that americano is a bad drink, it means that Tim Horton makes a bad product.

2
Whitebrowreply
lemmy.world

Timmies coffee used to be better back in the day, but then they changed suppliers and since then it just tastes like somebody forgot it in the oven for a few hours too many.

1

I think you missed the point.

If you never tried cafe au lait, cappuccino and others, you’d never know if you liked them or not and wouldn’t seek them out or bother to experiment with the other drinks.

Has nothing to do with being snooty, and has everything to do with sticking to the things you know and tried as opposed to going out of your way to try and discover new things.

Point is some people never go out and explore new flavours at the risk of not liking something.

0
feddit.org

Americano is not (supposed to be) drip coffee, it's a shot of espresso with added hot water.

3
cactopusesreply
lemm.ee

I don't know if it was so much "Make fun of" as the sentiment was "They can't handle it" similar to how certain cultures eat relatively spicy food tease those who can't handle it. I don't have direct evidence for that part, and my source was a friend of mine who was a foreign exchange student from France who explained it to me as such.

0

Except freedom fries was over morons being upset France that didnt invade another country.

This is people upset over America being an awful country.

12
lemm.ee

Bold Black Canadiano? I'm pretty sure that's what it is.

3

The difference is the order: long black has water on the bottom, espresso on top. Canadiano is the opposite.

Long black's better because it preserves the crema better (it doesn't get murdered by pouring the water on top)

3

Turkish coffee has been called greek coffee(in Greece and Cyprus) ever since the turkish invasion of Cyprus (50 years ago). New generations of greeks probably arent even aware of that(or it is a neat trivia that some might have heard).

11
lemmy.ca

It's funny and the Americans being salty about this one, when their country is becoming more and more fascist every day, are even funnier. Get mad about real important things, not this 😂

10
madjoreply
feddit.nl

Those Americans need to look in a mirror first, with their "freedom fries", because France decided not to back them in their needless war in Iraq.

5

The last bit of this song always comes back to me whenever I hear that phrase…

Freedom fries and burns and scars Liberator goes too far Freedom fries and screams and yells The promised land is a promised hell — Robert Plant from the album Mighty Rearranger

4

Americano sweetened with maple syrup. And if that's not a thing it should be.

5

Weirdest experience I ever had back in my barista days was an older gentleman approaching my counter and ordering a "GI Coffee". I had no idea what he meant and he had to explain it to me. It's an Americano.

8

Nowadays GI is more likely to be associated with gastrointestinal. In that context, "GI coffee" takes an interesting meaning.

6
lemmy.zip

But...isn't the Italian word for "Canadian" "canadese"?

6
pulpyreply
feddit.it

Yes, in Italian it doesn't ot sound right... Anyway...

2
JasonDJreply
lemmy.zip

As someone who knows very little of other languages...what sounds "wrong" about it?

I mean, if we called them Canadese, it would be fucking weird...but that works for countries like China, who we call Chinese.

But English is fucking weird. We are five languages duct-taped together and making up rules as we go along. We don't even have woke gender rules like most of Europe.

1

No, I'm Italian and this sounds fake Italian, that's all.

3
lemmy.world

This reminds me of when americans renamed French fries "Freedom Fries."

This level of pettiness is something I am truly proud of, and love to see. When Canada floated that idea of welcoming in California, Oregon and Washington state as territories, my first thought was "I would move there so fucking fast, I'd leave a me-sized cloud of dust in this shithole regressive country and never once look back"

4
hopesdeadreply
startrek.website

Where does the “French” in French fries come from? What made it French? I’ve never seen it associated with French cuisine. Only American.

2

French fries

Well,

Thomas Jefferson had "potatoes served in the French manner" at a White House dinner in 1802. The expression "french fried potatoes" first occurred in print in English in the 1856 work Cookery for Maids of All Work by Eliza Warren: "French Fried Potatoes. – Cut new potatoes in thin slices, put them in boiling fat, and a little salt; fry both sides of a light golden brown colour; drain." This account referred to thin, shallow-fried slices of potato. It is not clear where or when the now familiar deep-fried batons or fingers of potato were first prepared. In the early 20th century, the term "french fried" was being used in the sense of "deep-fried" for foods like onion rings or chicken.

One story about the name "french fries" claims that when the American Expeditionary Forces arrived in Belgium during World War I, they assumed that chips were a French dish because French was spoken in the Belgian Army. But the name existed long before that in English, and the popularity of the term did not increase for decades after 1917. The term was in use in the United States as early as 1886. An 1899 item in Good Housekeeping specifically references Kitchen Economy in France: "The perfection of French fries is due chiefly to the fact that plenty of fat is used."

Americans coined a phrase and ran with it, it seems 🤷‍♂️

7
lemmy.ca

In Canada we just call it black

Watered down espresso is just regular coffee

2

If you’re having water + coffee then it’s black whether drip, press, or pour

I don’t really want to get into ratios to differentiate between espresso, I think you can figure that out

7

Australia sort of agrees: espresso is short black, espresso + water is long black

Filter coffee of any type is black or white

3