This is a technology community, and (whether you like it or not) Twitter being rebranded to X is pretty big news in the world of tech.
Especially with the slipshod way they are doing with it, there is bound to be a lot of articles covering different weird tangential effects from the rush job.
Most people on All don't check what comm a post is from before upvoting. That's why on Reddit all subs that regularly hit r/all are basically the same.
I'm fine with the Twitter news here, but upvotes don't work as quality control.
The point is that news about Twitter rebranding is simply not related to technology. This is a technology community. These submissions should not even be posted in the first place to have the opportunity to be voted on.
Are you really suggesting that we take the low quality Reddit approach to high quality subs like /r/funny?
I suppose this is what happens when the lowest common denominator goes down coupled with ignorance of how the lowest common denominator affects community quality.
Communities lose their niche by catering to the lowest common denominator and become homogeneous with each other. This has been a long-standing phenomena on Reddit, one which I would expect to not be carried over to Lemmy since it's largely a symptom of a user base that has more interest in memes, funnies, and celebrity worship than discussion and real news.
How about the people who stumble across the comm's posts on All but aren't subscribed? On Reddit you could also talk about the original user base from before a sub started hitting r/all but [email protected] doesn't really have an 'original' user base.
It does sound reasonable to prioritize subscribed users when counting upvotes, to reflect the interests of that particular community.
But I don't think that will stop people from bringing up any news involving Twitter. The submission and initial momentum likely happens within the community itself.
That would be cool, never thought about that. Straight up not allowing voting from All/when you're not subbed could also be interesting as an experiment. But yeah, here plenty of people are just interested in Twitter news.
From the way I'm interpreting that... shouldn't that demand for 'just twitter news' lead to a new community for that specifically? Like if it's really that interesting to enough people, wouldn't that be the better outcome?
Could be a solution. But what if that company has an actual tech news, like release a new open source software or started contributing to a given web standard.
Well, then I guess you should put your priorities on a balance before making any filtering route.
If it helps for something I also get tired of repetitive news (especially because I'm subbed to many tech communities), but I just scroll and hide (Voyager and Summit), so not much of my "time is lose".
This is an absurd position. I agree there could stand to be fewer posts. I don't need to hear fifteen times that Mastodon has record increases (which would actually qualify as technology news by your standards, wouldn't it?). But I would like to see it once. A limitation to keeping one popular article (as determined by the mods) per discrete news item would be a far better approach.
I'm not interested in hearing about how Elon took over an X Twitter account yet again. I am very interested however in hearing that companies will lose verification on Twitter unless they buy enough ads. That is currently newsworthy.
It's clear that a substantial number of users are interested in hearing about this. It's also clear that a substantial number of users are sick of hearing about this. There should be a compromise to find a middle ground, not either extreme of "as many posts about Twitter as you'd like" nor "no posts about Twitter at all".
Yeah let's have no news at all about one of the largest and most influential tech companies going through massive restructuring! That kind of thing has no place on a tech community
I don't know if it works, but I found this post where someone claims to have made a keyword filter. https://sh.itjust.works/post/1715366 I don't think you'll be able to filter out "X" though
Yeah I never got the gimmick of that sub because it's actively contributing to the problem. Guy lives rent free in their heads and they have to take it out on the rest of us.
twitter isn't relevant in technological development, it's just a toxic social media site which hasn't changed in any significant way since its inception (technologically speaking)
I agree with you that no one in the tech world is looking at Twitter for advice atm, but to say nothing changed at Twitter in any significant way since it's inception is disingenuous at best. Twitter's rapid growth and adoption led to the development of a number of key technologies needed to run global 24/7 uptime services at scale, just to name one macro example.
Reread what I said: I agree that nothing major has been introduced by Twitter lately, but to say that they contributed nothing to the tech world since their inception, which is what the user above me was claiming, is disingenuous. Both can be true: Twitter can be a flaming pile of shit now (and it is), and it can also have been a very influential and technologically forward-thinking org at one point in time early on in their inception
The side car says this community is about technology news. I don't think they should list everything it's not, but maybe clarify if news about the tech industry are wanted or not.
This would be a welcome development, I feel like social media is something you use tech to do, but it's very rarely an interesting conversation about the tech itself.
Like how a grocery store has food but you wouldn't call it a restaurant.
What technology was developed, explored, integrated, improved, or otherwise innovated or more broadly applied by this?
This is an interesting standard to apply and I'm curious to see how many posts would actually fit that, especially posts which seem to be about tech. Arguably, 30-60% of the top posts right now don't meet this.
No, a rebrand is not a true technological news. It is regular news. Same would apply if Pizza company changed it's name.
Internal policy changes of a website are not technological news either. Appointing a new director or firing staff, is still are not technological. Sure they its news, but have nothing to do with technology.
I agree. I don't use Twitter and I really don't know much about Elon, but when one of the wealthiest people in the world is doing something with a major tech company, Id like to be somewhat informed
I’d rather want to know why we have 10 posts about twitter changing it’s name but the one post about grindr employees unionizing gets removed because it’s apparently not tech related
I get that this is a contentious topic and I agree that Musk gets too much coverage, but....I strongly believe that people should be able to post whatever they want as long as it adheres to the community's topic (technology) and adheres to the rules.
The arguement of, "I don't wanna see {topic here} so stop posting about {topic here}" is a really slippery slope. Clearly there are quiet users here that DO actually want to hear about X news and DO want to dicuss it. What about topics that appeal to you, or like 20% of the community, but 80% couldn't give a shit? Where is the line?
Realistically, this is on you. You don't like it? Downvote and scroll past it. Want a perfectly curated source of news you care about? Use an RSS reader that offers topic filters. This is a community of diverse interests that may not always reflect yours. Deal with it, or go elsewhere.
Your point is absolutely valid, but what's happening at Twitter really is only relevant to social media news. There's no tech changing or advancing, just a really bad marketing decision. I personally do not believe that this is tech news or relevant to it.
That's an even bigger contentious debate. And the fact that there is no one mutually agreed on answer means we either need a formal definition in the rules or the people in this community need to understand that there are people that exist with a broader or narrower definition of technology than they have.
That said, like it or not, go to any major tech blog, podcast, YouTuber, and they all talking about X / Twitter. The tech communities outside of Lemmy have all agreed that Twitter / X is technology. And Lemmy doesn't live in a bubble.
The tech communities outside of Lemmy have all agreed that Twitter / X is technology.
This is an "appeal to authority" logical fallacy.
Personally I think an argument that "Twitter / X is technology" is a very, very difficult argument to make. It's a social media company. Is every company that has a website "tech"?
It's also a generalisation. Perhaps if twitter invented a new decentralised database that might be "tech", but marketing decisions are not.
Marketing decisions of a tech company are valid to be discussed. We discuss marketing and other business decisions of many tech companies and will continue to do so. Your argument is invalid - you're not the arbiter of what are and what aren't valid discussion subjects.
the debate rages on. Frankly, I think you're moronic to complain about Twitter here. They are regularly influencing tech media reporting and they launched as a tech stock.
I think it would help define it or give examples of what it is or isn't intended to include. Should it include biotech, materials tech, or is it limited to computers, Internet, AI? Or...?
Technology to me includes things like papyrus and typewriters and the above and much more. But what I expect to see in a technology community is narrower than that.
....but that's what happens when you call a community "technology". Its a pretty damn broad category and these days, incredibly mainstream.
Communities like " technology" are going to be as mainstream as they were on Reddit. There is nothing you can do about it unless you convince the mods to spend 14 hours a day curating and removing posts from people with mainstream definitions.
If you want a more curated definition, or you have more niche interests, then you probably want to go to a different community. Heck, maybe start your own. Be the change you want to see.
It seems a bit silly to go to a community called "technology" and then complain that it represents what 90% of technology news sources are talking about.
Typewriters are technology, but information about what color of shoes is being worn by the guy who bought the typewriter patent from its inventor isn't technology.
So news of an online store doing shady shit constitutes as "tech news" because they run a web site? Strictly speaking the wheel is also technology, so a post about the history of the wheel seems like a worthy post in a tech community? We might as well post anything here because almost everything you use in your daily life is either technology or related to technology. While I do understand the philosophical aspect of the answer it has no practical value when it comes to defining what kind of content should be posted here.
There needs to be a more practical understanding of what the community considers "tech" so that wrong kind of posts don't get spammed here. For me personally the internet has been around for most of my life. It's not some new a shiny thing, it's as common as the wheel. Therefor I don't consider just running a bog standard website "tech". Similarly I don't consider Twitter / X a tech company, they're a social media company that uses software as a tool. I haven't considered anything about Twitter, except firing the engineers, as tech news since Musk wanted to buy Twitter. Maybe even before Musk tried to buy it, but who remembers things from eons ago. If there was news about some kind of exploit on Twitter or a data breach, that I could consider tech news because that is generally related to the actual tech they are using for their business. But a Twitter rebrand? Has literally nothing to do with tech beyond the tools they used constituting as "tech". But then we're back to square one where I could post about a new bicycle coming out, because the wheels bicycles use are "tech" and the frame material being used is produced by "tech" and there's a lot of "tech" that goes into a bicycle. But somehow I doubt this is what the community cares about.
According to you it definitely does, that was literally your argument for having anything remotely tech related as tech news.
My argument was that it needs to be actually related to tech/art to considered that. If we want to be super critical of art then just writing that at an urinal may or may not be art. For the sake of argument let's say it's not. But if someone takes a picture of it (or turns the entire thing into a composition) and puts it in an art gallery then it is art. It has to contextualized somehow as art to be in a gallery and that contextualization defines it as art. Similarly tech news should be in in the context of tech, which is why something like rebranding a company is not necessarily tech news.
yes, I was using the famous example that broke the Fin De Ciele -era snobbery about art and the distinction between artist and artisan to make a point.
my point is that you can't define it. So you say "should posts about the wheel be included?"
and the answer is if you exclude all things about wheels where do you draw the line? someone creates a new type of ball bearing that revolutionizes manufacturing, but thats not allowed because it's a wheel? Someone uses a new archeological discovery about an ancient device to invent a modern one? No posts about cars, trains etc? No posts about waterwheel generated activity?
Go to any tech site, publication, podcast YouTuber, etc. All of them are talking about Twitter. Mainstream tech has agreed that Twitter / Facebook are tech.
Im not saying I agree. I'm not saying even that I care about these topics. I don't. I think Musk is an idiot and actively avoid news about his BS. But clearly a lot of people do care and a lot of people agree that Twitter is tech.
If this community wants to specify a definition of tech that differs from the mainstream, then they need to put it in the rules and accept that we need to control the acceptable conversation because certain members of the community are getting triggered by having to scroll past posts related to Musk or his properties.
This argument is kind of saying "/c/technology should contain any topics which are interesting to people subscribed to /c/technology".
We're not a publication, podcast, or youtuber. This is a community aggregating posts about the topic of choice. We're not trying to gather up users by posting things that are interesting to our existing users.
This statement indicates that what is technology is decided by popular opinion, not by any inherent meaning in words. Certainly the meaning of words change with time and they have no inherent meaning, so in a very real sense, definitions are decided by popular vote. However, if Twitter is a tech company, then so is every newspaper, magazine, bank, credit card company, any business with a data base for inventory management. It's a useless definition. Let's go with the actual mainstream definition of a tech company, a company that develops, produces, licenses or sells technology or technology services, and Twitter doesn't do any of that. It sells ad space and subscriptions, the business model of a media company.
That's how language works. Language evolves and adapts over time via social pressure. Nobody uses words exactly as they are defined in the Oxford English Dictionary. Words are given meaning by people and inevitably those meanings shift and change as people use them in new and different ways.
Just because you adopted pedantry in order to push out topics you hate hearing about doesn't mean everyone else has to adopt your constructed definitions.
Yes, I've just said that languages evolve. I'm saying that "technology companies" has not yet and will not ever evolve to mean "companies that develop, produce, license or sell technology or technology services, and also Twitter". When Twitter starts getting involved in tech, it will be a tech company.
Politely disagree, in that I suspect this is a hypocritical sentiment. Most users who get off of Elon news will agree with this position now but then cry foul when this community is spammed with a subject not to their liking. And as much as the ideology of free speech (rightly) resonates, just like with free markets, some minimal regulation is needed in practice; otherwise some fanatics could choke this feed up with, I dunno, 99% Microsoft news, all the time, and you wouldn't be able to say shit because you "strongly believe people should be able to post whatever they want". I doubt that you would stand by your lofty convictions so strongly then.
Beyond that, there is nothing wrong with expressing a desire for more or less of something—it's just an opinion. It's a bullshit argument to say, "If you don't like it, instead of articulating why, just use the limited non-descriptive tool provided to reduce your passionate sentiment into a trivial binary value and cast it into the sea of thousands just like it; or else, like, go create an entirely new community or a custom feed or whatever you want. But mainly, just fuck off."
I don't give a FLYING FUCK about Elon. I actively ignore any posts about him or his shitty empire. Stop using the behaviors of his idiot stans to argue with me. I am not them.
What I do care about is a community telling people what they can or cannot post, not through rules changes, not through mod action, but by agreeing internally to bully every person who dares to post what every tech publication is talking about.
I think you need to evaluate why you let this shit trigger you. I mean, this is like going to a coffee shop and raising a stink because they sell pumpkin spice lattes. Don't consume it. Use Lemmy's tools to filter it out if you really need to.
Its not the community's job to cater to your specific content desires. This isn't a news site. Its a place for people to talk about whatever they think technology is. It's your job to moderate what you pay attention to.
Funny enough I think it's a hypocritical sentiment but on the other foot -- users who are tired of this news are going to eventually find some news they are interested in, and then resist having it sequestered somewhere else.
I've tried so many and I'm always on the hunt for better ones. I wss on Pallabre until it went abandonware. Currently on inoreader but still hunting.
Problem is that I want something that can easily sync my feed and subscriptions across devices, but the ones that support that compromise in other areas. I might need to just settle for good import/export functionality. But Inoreader works for me for now.
But the nice thing is there are a ton of RSS apps out there. So, theres bound to be something for everyone.
Currently chatting with the other mods about this and while we don't want the community to be overrun by Elon, the articles are some of the most upvoted in the past few days. It seems, that people do want to hear about what's going on but not at a rate that drowns out other content. We've been careful to prune out duplicates to keep the flow down, but the volume of Elon posts and Twitter / X is definitely... a lot. I do see how some find it annoying so we're keeping an eye on the situation, but I do agree it does meet the criteria of being both news and tech related. I assume that he'll eventually run out of Twitter pieces to break, right :P
Please do keep an open line of communication with us and all replies, feedback and opinions are always welcome!
Cheers!
It's not just an inconvenience. I unfollowed the sub because the quality of the content was poor. I want to learn about technology, not social media companies and every minutiae about their employees bowel movements. I'm getting more value from Linux than from here, despite the fact some of it is more low level than I'd like.
I see the role of moderators as guiding the flow of people's interests. If you went solely on upvotes, it wouldn't matter what you called the community or whether it had moderators. If you want it to be about technology, make it that way. If you want it to be about the business decisions of social media companies tangentially related to technology, at least do the kindness of changing the name so that people don't mistakenly come here thinking they'll hear about new technology.
Great, and thank you for implication and consideration. This community, like any other needs some rules or guide lines. Yet, if people are interested in other topics, they can just subscribe to communities about those other topics.
To be more precise, "technology" "technology news" and "news" are very different subjects that may have their own communities.
Like it or not, it's tech news. When Intel does something interesting, or Google wets the bed again, we'll talk about that a lot, then. Right now it's Elon doing dumb stuff. Last month it was spez. If we ban every hot news topic, what's left to discuss?
I was under the impression that this was a community to discuss technology, not one that discusses the business decisions of companies in the technology sector, and certainly not the decisions of a social media company that is only tangentially related to the technology sector.
Whether we like it or not, it's pretty damn hard to separate technology from business (and also politics)
The direction of technological advancement, as it stands today, is largely driven by businesses. What technologies are developed and what they get used for, depends on who's throwing money at it and how they want to make money from it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sick of hearing about Musk. But the internet is one of the most amazing technological achievements humanity has ever created, and a lot of people use it for Twitter/X, and so their business decisions have pretty far-reaching implications for the rest of the internet. Trying to ignore that leaves out big chunks of the picture.
I was kind of hoping for content about new or interesting technology not news about mainstream tech business stuff.
I want to hear about developments in tech like AI, batteries, biotech, robotics, and so on. Things that give us hope or terror. :)
News about idiot CEOs being douchebags isn't technology. Is business news. It isn't an advancement. It isn't novel. It isn't the most interesting topics in technology.
I think you're missing the point that we're here to discuss technology not the business of it.
Just because technology is driven by business processes doesn't mean that this form must also be consumed by discussion over business processes that are only somewhat related to technology.
I'm not sure why this distinction is difficult. If you want a technology politics community then make one, stop polluting technology with technology politics.
Apparently not, given how many people post and upvote articles about technology business.
But frankly, I don't think you can isolate technology from the business and politics around it. You can choose to only talk about specs and functionality, but it is often being driven by business interests regardless.
Unless you are talking about some social blunder they have done during vacations, "Google CEO does a big dumb dumb" is sure to have implications for the technology and the users of said technology. As Elon Musk's decisions are having to the structure of Twitter's platform and their users.
At this point I think it's very misguided from technology enthusiasts to believe that the matter can be discussed in isolation and detached from human interests. In fact many of the ills of social media, gaming and AI came about because the matters were handled in such a way, and consequently they had political implications.
They were not designed in isolation from business and politics either. Phones moved away from 3.5mm to only have a single USB/Lightning input so that they could sell more wireless earbuds, and iPhones will be forced to change use USB-C due to an European Union decision. Business. Politics. Technology.
But why google created a new standard, what the standard is, how it will be used, what other companies will adopt that standard, when products using that new standard will become available, etc. are all on the business side of things, and so can be directly affected by Google's CEO doing a big dumb dumb. Without the business side of things actually making things happen, a new standard is just a bunch of rules that someone wrote down.
Remove business from the equation, and you're mostly left with technical papers that describe hypothetical technology that no one is actually making, and hobbyists cobbling together gadgets in the basement or writing code in their free time for fun. And don't get me wrong, that's cool stuff too, but it's a much more niche community.
In an ideal world, we'd probably have about 3 different communities, one dedicated to the businesses side of technology, one dedicated to pure technology with specs and technical papers and such disconnected from business, and a 3rd one where we discuss both aspects and how they come together in the real world. Since we only have the one main community though, to me at least, the third approach seems most appropriate for here. If you feel so strongly about it, perhaps you should consider creating those other communities, perhaps call them something like TechBusiness and PureTechnology.
The two are inseparable unfortunately. Business and the actual technology itself are closely intertwined. Talking about technology in a vacuum can be somewhat interesting, but it doesn't work in an online forum. Applications of the technology are going to require business. And if you can't discuss the applications, what will you discuss? An online forum doesn't have enough subject matter experts to solely discuss the technology.
I agree tech and applications of it tend to go together. But dumb business decisions of tech that has gone mainstream like telephones and PCs certainly doesn't have to enter the discussion. And they don't always tie to application of tech.
As a counterpoint, there's still plenty of tech news that isn't necessarily business related for telephones, with constantly developing smartphone technologies. I don't know that going mainstream precludes it from offering good discussion.
Twitter isn't a tech company any more than Visa or the New York Times are. Twitter uses technology. They do not develop, produce, or sell technology products or services. It is a media company that sells advertising space and subscriptions, just like a newspaper, something no one would call a tech company.
Oh, and an interesting follow on, if someone runs a technology consultancy, can they post about their business successes and issues? They're in the tech business after all. Or is this simply limited to the who's who of bad actors? The big, 3 4, 10, 15? What is the cut off?
I disagree. It's not tech news. Twitter or X losing a few subscribers to mastadon or threads is a Sunday. And on Monday we'll get an article about people moving in the other direction. Distilling entire categories of news to one person or company makes us less informed, not more. We're just echoing the same talking points back and forth at eachother.
I'm definitely not saying Elon or Twitter is NEVER tech news but, jesus, I don't need or want to know about every tweet he makes and every shit he takes. I also don't think these things shouldn't be recorded in some way. But the magnitude it's posted is straight up Elon worship whether you hate him or support him.
I do what I'm able and willing by downvoting items that aren't news or discussion-worthy and not interacting with those comment sections but there is just so much. Is there a place to just read news about technology and not tech business tweets turned into "news" stories? This is a genuine question if someone has info.
I guess it's subjective, but from my perspective the weekly thought bubbles of billionaire / millionaire owners of tech companies is not what I think of when I think about "tech news".
Is the solution here to have megathreads?
For me personally I'd be happy enough for someone to create a redditandtwitternews community and then ban any such news from this community - but I'm pretty sure my views on this are not generally held.
Edit: actually no, I don't think it is really subjective. If twitter invented a new database language that would be tech news. A social media company re-branding is not tech news.
Hear, hear! I’m so sick of watching that douche get all the free publicity in the world. It’s like his haters haven’t all figured out that this why he does half the shit he does.
Ex- fucking- xactly! People keep talking about him. I don't understand fucking why. My suspicion is that they have a team of people to open discussions about him, so the media is talking abiut him. Otherwise I cant imagine someone that wants to keep talking about him. Its nuts! Just let him die already.
People don't seem to get this. The downfall of one of the largest tech companies in the world, that became rather well integrated into our society, is a slow motion car accident that's entertaining to watch.
My favorite is any system for writing. That's when we started sending actual information into the future. An argument could be made for art on cave walls, and that does communicate with future humans, but the meaning is interpreted rather than dictated.
Ah, but how did the designer of the first trebuchet have time to perfect their design? Someone else grew extra food for them. How did the farmer produce this surplus bounty? By using the plow!
But you're right, the trebuchet is indeed the superior siege weapon.
I like cement. Roman cement with quicklime. Shit cracks on the limestone flakes which erode and re-calcify within all the micro-fractures. Fuckin Romans were mad smart.
I get why we all talk so much about Elon, but man I wish collectively as a society we could all agree to stop talking about him so he could disappear into obscurity
And by your swiss cheese logic, everything we do these days is tech news.
It's a common fallacy that drops community quality like a rock.
It's like programming horror being flooded with things that aren't even marginally related to programming. But since technically all our technology is programmed, then it's technically programming related.
But what is the "everything" being discussed? A Tech CEO's decisions and changes over a social media platform, which is a widely used technology. Nevermind the business aspects that exist everywhere, is it even reasonable to talk of social media, technology dedicated towards social connections, without addressing the social aspects involved?
Yeah. Just because a tech company does something, that doesn't make it technology news. Call me when there's actual technologic development coming out.
As a last resort maybe. There are also other technology communities on other instances. Let's see who hands this issue best. But for now, mods have taken appropriate action.
Your kinda right. It's more the back to back nature of Elon posts that's annoying.
I kinda found out changing Lemmy's sorting algorithm from Active/Hot to New posts helps spread out the news (and even helps unearth lesser covered issues).
I'm not seeing how this is related. Make a rule in the sidebar which tells the poster to post Musk content that community instead. And if he still posts, it can be auto-deleted/locked (not sure if this capability exists in Lemmy yet).
Edit: Also, the community won't be on your feed if you block it. It can be a nice automod feature to automatically move posts to another community if it detects Musk/Twitter/X keyword in the title.
You are not going to get people who want to see Twitter covered as technology to go into a community made by people who don't think Twitter should be covered as technology
In your mind a company has to sell tech to be a tech company. Is Google a tech company? Were they not a tech company when they developed a sorting algorithm for the web? Were they not a tech company when they started spelling targeted advertising based on that algorithm? Of they were and are.
The laws the company tests are all about the impact of tech.
This could be said of any large multinational.
BHP is a multinational mining company worth 4x twitter which tests laws around the impact of tech. If they wanted to re-brand would that be tech news ?
There's also this pathological thing of posting even the negative crap about these types of toxic figures, all the time. The attention they receive - positive and negative - is like flies swarming around shit.
"Enough musk spam"... then they proceed to carpet-bomb the goddamned place with musk spam.
I want to post a non-news idea I had about verifying people online, though with Google's current destructive proposal for a web standard in the headlines, I am admittedly a bit worried it's going to get conflated.
The idea would be that it serves the same kind of purpose as what a company would ever need - verifying that someone is a unique person, verifying that they are over a certain age - only when the user volunteers that info, and without actually giving said online company actual information about them.
When I read the headlines about such systems being attempted by game companies or web companies, it basically comes with a "Trust us!" caveat that I can't imagine anyone following. BUT, they at least give some respectable PR language about how such things might be useful to combat harassment, fake accounts, etc, and it does give me some ideas. The internet is kind of a limitless place, but having no limits for everyone is in some ways a limitation in itself.
So, I'm curious if people would actually want threads like that in this Community instance.
I think that this is doable for most of the normal population (and likely not novel (which does not diminish its value)) with public private crypto and some authority (eg government issued ids having keys like Portugal) and then using those to authenticate to a service that allows specifically what you want to share. So normally you'd only ever share say age or something
It's odd how many people in this thread are calling Twitter a tech company. It's a media company, closer to the New York Times and Washington Post than to Google or even something like John Deere.
Honestly, Lemmy is starting to really disappoint me. I figured I was leaving most of the circlejerking, reposting, and shitposting behind on Reddit. However Lemmy is every bit just as bad :-/ which is frightening considering how few people are on Lemmy. If it's getting this shitty right now, imagine it if there was a real Reddit migration...
This. It's another link aggregator that focuses on serious discussion rather than jokes. I have invite codes if you want to try it. Too serious for my taste, but if you want to get away from the shitposting and memes you might like it.
Beware Tildes is centralized and has one dictator for life similar to what Spez is to Reddit. They focus on narrow and deep discussion but no free speech, no NSFW and no video/image posts. They are extremely biased and far left-wing.
Half my comments just get downvoted for no reason. I told someone I was sorry their houses got messed up by tornados...two down votes. Like I know karma doesn't matter, but it's not fun or encouraging to see and has genuinely made me post less.
One thing I like about Lemmy is that it shows upvotes and downvotes separately in addition to the composite score.
When I make a controversial post that gets 7 upvotes and 20 downvotes, I think "Man, this was a good post. 7 people liked it". On Reddit, I would just think 13 people downvoted it. If anything, on Lemmy downvotes are just proof that I made someone I don't like mad on the Internet, which is great.
Thanks, I only tried jerboa briefly after switching from Reddit but quickly stopped using it because lift off had a better theme imo, but I may just not care and prefer extra features! Suppose I could do a feature request for liftoff, too.
Yea but then you miss out on 99% of the fediverse. Although if that 99% is just shitposts and bullshit then maybe that is the better solution. I really do not know.
It's not that I wanna get rid of downvotes, I think down voting is a good feature. It just feels like people are more downvote happy here, even though it doesn't mean anything. It's like instead of it not meaning anything making people use it less, it actually make some people use it more specifically because it "doesn't mean anything". I'm not sure if this is just mean people being negative or just trying to get their own post more attention, but I've definitely noticed it.
I could also change my perspective and just delete this app and cut toxic unfriendly stuff out of my life and read more books, instead of changing my perspective just to fit in on the internet with strangers who don't and won't ever know me🤷♂️
You can't have a large, diverse community without all types. If you would like a community that only focuses on specific things, I would look for a more niche site/forum.
Some aspects of it are just as bad because they are the human aspects and will plague anything made by or for humans. Attention whoring, power hunger, confusion, people who see any gathering of people as something they can exploit, things like that will be a part of any community. Though it does seem like there's less of that here (which is why I'm ok with it not being as popular as Reddit became).
There's other things I'm not seeing nearly as much of here. There isn't the same bot presence. Troll farms don't seem to be here yet either (though it's probably only a matter of time). Admins aren't acting like powerful dictators since most of the users here just left a place because of that and will do it again. These things will all likely get worse with popularity, too.
It will be seriously difficult finding a good instance without the shit posting and reddit-like echo chamber. I still think decentralization is the solution against the censorship machinery coming up we just need to support the right instance.
I mean....most of the bullshit on Reddit wasn't due to Spez and corporate stuff. It was due to idiots reposting dumb shit and bots flooding the website at all times from all angles. I don't see how Lemmy would be immune to that unfortunately. Ad in the threat of AI and no website will be safe from ruin :-/.
It's the humans. Humans make things great and shitty. Even AIs that make things shitty will be because some asshole decided that they wanted an AI to do that.
Agreed. Elmo is only in this because he wants that dopamine hit of attention that front-page news gets him. It's why bought Twitter. Getting on the front page, just for a moment is all that matters to him.
Also, it is LONG past time we got over our child-like worship of billionaires. It's embarrassing to watch.
It's a media company. Why are so many people here calling in a technology company - because they have a Web site? They do not develop, produce or sell any technology product. They operate a Web site and sell ad space, just like every newspaper, magazine and TV network. Are we calling the New York Times a technology company?
I would consider social media companies part of the technology realm. What does it take to run all of that? What do they produce to make it functional? What do they research to make it better? Just commercials? No the whole thing has an extremely tech heavy backend wether you see it on your local machine or not. The entire thing is pushed and moved by tech.
But we aren't discussing the tech backend that makes all of that happen; we're talking about business dealings and the politics thereof. Therein lies the issue.
Countless companies that are not technology companies use these same technologies in the same ways. Using technology does not make something a technology company.
Twitter is technology driven. It relies, exists, and improved with technology. They develop algorithms. They create user interfaces. At one point did this become media and not technology?
There are sublemmies that are more niche if thats what you are looking for. I think it is unwarranted to complain in a big general technology sub like this. Its not like this is focused on hardware, or specifically technical specifications.
By your definition, banks and credit card companies are technology companies. Visa has three times as many users and countless more database transactions than Twitter. The finance sector develops and uses algorithms - Fico scores being a notable one. Tons of people use technology. Twitter isn't even notable for it's usage of technology. Tons of companies, including Visa, have more impressive and expansive use of the same things twitter uses. A company is a tech company if it develops and sells technology, not if it uses it.
This is exactly my point. They create, maintain, and develop a technology platform that serves all sorts of media. It is not a media company, they do not make the news. They distribute it. People are just mad they are seeing twitter and elon instead of "Methods for Concatenation in Assembly" or something idk.
It's a media company. The only difference between them and a newspaper is a short word limit and they don't pay their authors. No one is paying Twitter for technology that they produce or for technological services. They get money from ads and subscriptions - the media business model.
I get where you're coming from, but seeing posts like this for so many popular new topics is getting repetitive too. Its definitely tech related. Elon and twitter news will slow down eventually, and people will obsess over something new, guaranteed. Better to just ride it out IMO.
Elon is constantly in the news cycle. He seems to be imitating Trump for some reason. This X rebranding feels like a forced attempt to stay relevant. Maybe he is planning to run for governor in Texas or California. Weird.
I agree, OP. We all know Twitter has the newest cutting edge technology on the planet! Every ounce of information must be reported on about the company here.
This is a technology community, and (whether you like it or not) Twitter being rebranded to X is pretty big news in the world of tech.
Especially with the slipshod way they are doing with it, there is bound to be a lot of articles covering different weird tangential effects from the rush job.
Yeah I don't like this. Can't we just use our upvotes to decide which news are important?
Most people on All don't check what comm a post is from before upvoting. That's why on Reddit all subs that regularly hit r/all are basically the same. I'm fine with the Twitter news here, but upvotes don't work as quality control.
The point is that news about Twitter rebranding is simply not related to technology. This is a technology community. These submissions should not even be posted in the first place to have the opportunity to be voted on.
Are you really suggesting that we take the low quality Reddit approach to high quality subs like /r/funny?
I suppose this is what happens when the lowest common denominator goes down coupled with ignorance of how the lowest common denominator affects community quality.
Communities lose their niche by catering to the lowest common denominator and become homogeneous with each other. This has been a long-standing phenomena on Reddit, one which I would expect to not be carried over to Lemmy since it's largely a symptom of a user base that has more interest in memes, funnies, and celebrity worship than discussion and real news.
Alright, how do you decide who is the "lowest common denominator" who shouldn't get to have a say over what is being discussed?
How about the people who stumble across the comm's posts on All but aren't subscribed? On Reddit you could also talk about the original user base from before a sub started hitting r/all but [email protected] doesn't really have an 'original' user base.
It does sound reasonable to prioritize subscribed users when counting upvotes, to reflect the interests of that particular community.
But I don't think that will stop people from bringing up any news involving Twitter. The submission and initial momentum likely happens within the community itself.
That would be cool, never thought about that. Straight up not allowing voting from All/when you're not subbed could also be interesting as an experiment. But yeah, here plenty of people are just interested in Twitter news.
From the way I'm interpreting that... shouldn't that demand for 'just twitter news' lead to a new community for that specifically? Like if it's really that interesting to enough people, wouldn't that be the better outcome?
I keep downvoting them. But I am apparently alone.
How many posts on Twitter is in your feed? Sorting by Hot, I see only two posts on Twitter, not including your post. Same if I sort by New.
Even if it is only 1 it is more than it should be.
If that's what you think I suggest you to start looking for filter options, maybe some apps already have them.
It’ll be funny to see because he’ll have to block the letter X
Yeah well I bet it is gonna be called Twitter for a while yet (the best option would be they keep calling it Twitter lol).
Could be a solution. But what if that company has an actual tech news, like release a new open source software or started contributing to a given web standard.
Well, then I guess you should put your priorities on a balance before making any filtering route.
If it helps for something I also get tired of repetitive news (especially because I'm subbed to many tech communities), but I just scroll and hide (Voyager and Summit), so not much of my "time is lose".
Then maybe this isn’t the community for you.
This is an absurd position. I agree there could stand to be fewer posts. I don't need to hear fifteen times that Mastodon has record increases (which would actually qualify as technology news by your standards, wouldn't it?). But I would like to see it once. A limitation to keeping one popular article (as determined by the mods) per discrete news item would be a far better approach.
I'm not interested in hearing about how Elon took over an X Twitter account yet again. I am very interested however in hearing that companies will lose verification on Twitter unless they buy enough ads. That is currently newsworthy.
It's clear that a substantial number of users are interested in hearing about this. It's also clear that a substantial number of users are sick of hearing about this. There should be a compromise to find a middle ground, not either extreme of "as many posts about Twitter as you'd like" nor "no posts about Twitter at all".
Yeah let's have no news at all about one of the largest and most influential tech companies going through massive restructuring! That kind of thing has no place on a tech community
It's hard not to upvote because fuck Elon. But at the same time its all dumb shit.
It's a lose lose situation.
I don't know if it works, but I found this post where someone claims to have made a keyword filter. https://sh.itjust.works/post/1715366 I don't think you'll be able to filter out "X" though
I was like, " Yeah! Downvote the musk posts" Then I proceeded to down vote the top post because it's about Elon Musk.
Maybe, but we have seen it now. If every fart of Musk needs a new thread, maybe better to make a Musk group.
reddit used to have r/EnoughMuskSpam lol
There's ![email protected]
Unfortunate how they spam musk themselves
Yeah I never got the gimmick of that sub because it's actively contributing to the problem. Guy lives rent free in their heads and they have to take it out on the rest of us.
Big news, yes. But not tech related at all. Those Elon news should be on TMZ.
twitter isn't relevant in technological development, it's just a toxic social media site which hasn't changed in any significant way since its inception (technologically speaking)
I agree with you that no one in the tech world is looking at Twitter for advice atm, but to say nothing changed at Twitter in any significant way since it's inception is disingenuous at best. Twitter's rapid growth and adoption led to the development of a number of key technologies needed to run global 24/7 uptime services at scale, just to name one macro example.
Ok that was then. What innovations have they put forth lately? Let's talk about that. Changing the company name isn't particularly Innovative.
Reread what I said: I agree that nothing major has been introduced by Twitter lately, but to say that they contributed nothing to the tech world since their inception, which is what the user above me was claiming, is disingenuous. Both can be true: Twitter can be a flaming pile of shit now (and it is), and it can also have been a very influential and technologically forward-thinking org at one point in time early on in their inception
Is it? It doesn't change anything.
Is this place called technology news, or technology? Asking for a friend
It is definitely very big news, but I guess the amount of articles on that topic is overshadowing the rest of tech news.
Maybe we could consider that news relative to Twitter/X should be on their own community, that users can choose to subscribe, ignore or block?
That is not Tech news that is business news.
What technology was developed, explored, integrated, improved, or otherwise innovated or more broadly applied by this?
Nothing, it does nothing, it's a branding decision, business news, not tech news.
Curious, those criteria you listed out are not present anywhere I can see in the community rules.
Perhaps you should petition the mods to change them if you feel so strongly about it.
I think we should or else create a new community to focus on those things so I can join that one.
Many instances have a tech community, I wonder if any of them are like that. [email protected] [email protected] [email protected] [email protected]
The side car says this community is about technology news. I don't think they should list everything it's not, but maybe clarify if news about the tech industry are wanted or not.
This would be a welcome development, I feel like social media is something you use tech to do, but it's very rarely an interesting conversation about the tech itself.
Like how a grocery store has food but you wouldn't call it a restaurant.
This is an interesting standard to apply and I'm curious to see how many posts would actually fit that, especially posts which seem to be about tech. Arguably, 30-60% of the top posts right now don't meet this.
No, a rebrand is not a true technological news. It is regular news. Same would apply if Pizza company changed it's name. Internal policy changes of a website are not technological news either. Appointing a new director or firing staff, is still are not technological. Sure they its news, but have nothing to do with technology.
I agree. I don't use Twitter and I really don't know much about Elon, but when one of the wealthiest people in the world is doing something with a major tech company, Id like to be somewhat informed
I’d rather want to know why we have 10 posts about twitter changing it’s name but the one post about grindr employees unionizing gets removed because it’s apparently not tech related
Are unionization posts getting removed here? That seems against the whole idea of an open internet here.
Wait, what? I dont give a fuck about the elon musk shit, but I care about grindr employees. Seems this community is earning a block from my side
This sort of situation is why I believe the human interests around technology should be covered.
I get that this is a contentious topic and I agree that Musk gets too much coverage, but....I strongly believe that people should be able to post whatever they want as long as it adheres to the community's topic (technology) and adheres to the rules.
The arguement of, "I don't wanna see {topic here} so stop posting about {topic here}" is a really slippery slope. Clearly there are quiet users here that DO actually want to hear about X news and DO want to dicuss it. What about topics that appeal to you, or like 20% of the community, but 80% couldn't give a shit? Where is the line?
Realistically, this is on you. You don't like it? Downvote and scroll past it. Want a perfectly curated source of news you care about? Use an RSS reader that offers topic filters. This is a community of diverse interests that may not always reflect yours. Deal with it, or go elsewhere.
Your point is absolutely valid, but what's happening at Twitter really is only relevant to social media news. There's no tech changing or advancing, just a really bad marketing decision. I personally do not believe that this is tech news or relevant to it.
To be fair it's a tech company though so it can impact those in the tech space. Generally it doesn't but you know what I mean.
I agree. It's more political than technology related.
Its either Business or Political not tech
That's an even bigger contentious debate. And the fact that there is no one mutually agreed on answer means we either need a formal definition in the rules or the people in this community need to understand that there are people that exist with a broader or narrower definition of technology than they have.
That said, like it or not, go to any major tech blog, podcast, YouTuber, and they all talking about X / Twitter. The tech communities outside of Lemmy have all agreed that Twitter / X is technology. And Lemmy doesn't live in a bubble.
This is an "appeal to authority" logical fallacy.
Personally I think an argument that "Twitter / X is technology" is a very, very difficult argument to make. It's a social media company. Is every company that has a website "tech"?
It's also a generalisation. Perhaps if twitter invented a new decentralised database that might be "tech", but marketing decisions are not.
Marketing decisions of a tech company are valid to be discussed. We discuss marketing and other business decisions of many tech companies and will continue to do so. Your argument is invalid - you're not the arbiter of what are and what aren't valid discussion subjects.
How is twitter a tech company ?
https://money.cnn.com/2014/08/22/technology/social/twitter-isis/index.html https://www.firstpost.com/tech/news-analysis/is-twitter-a-technology-platform-a-media-company-or-both-3603227.html
the debate rages on. Frankly, I think you're moronic to complain about Twitter here. They are regularly influencing tech media reporting and they launched as a tech stock.
I think it would help define it or give examples of what it is or isn't intended to include. Should it include biotech, materials tech, or is it limited to computers, Internet, AI? Or...?
Technology to me includes things like papyrus and typewriters and the above and much more. But what I expect to see in a technology community is narrower than that.
....but that's what happens when you call a community "technology". Its a pretty damn broad category and these days, incredibly mainstream.
Communities like " technology" are going to be as mainstream as they were on Reddit. There is nothing you can do about it unless you convince the mods to spend 14 hours a day curating and removing posts from people with mainstream definitions.
If you want a more curated definition, or you have more niche interests, then you probably want to go to a different community. Heck, maybe start your own. Be the change you want to see.
It seems a bit silly to go to a community called "technology" and then complain that it represents what 90% of technology news sources are talking about.
Typewriters are technology, but information about what color of shoes is being worn by the guy who bought the typewriter patent from its inventor isn't technology.
It seems a lot of people here think that anyone who runs a Web site is a tech company.
they... do? it's like the "what is art" debate. the answer is "whatever you want it to mean in that moment and it can be different in the next moment"
So news of an online store doing shady shit constitutes as "tech news" because they run a web site? Strictly speaking the wheel is also technology, so a post about the history of the wheel seems like a worthy post in a tech community? We might as well post anything here because almost everything you use in your daily life is either technology or related to technology. While I do understand the philosophical aspect of the answer it has no practical value when it comes to defining what kind of content should be posted here.
There needs to be a more practical understanding of what the community considers "tech" so that wrong kind of posts don't get spammed here. For me personally the internet has been around for most of my life. It's not some new a shiny thing, it's as common as the wheel. Therefor I don't consider just running a bog standard website "tech". Similarly I don't consider Twitter / X a tech company, they're a social media company that uses software as a tool. I haven't considered anything about Twitter, except firing the engineers, as tech news since Musk wanted to buy Twitter. Maybe even before Musk tried to buy it, but who remembers things from eons ago. If there was news about some kind of exploit on Twitter or a data breach, that I could consider tech news because that is generally related to the actual tech they are using for their business. But a Twitter rebrand? Has literally nothing to do with tech beyond the tools they used constituting as "tech". But then we're back to square one where I could post about a new bicycle coming out, because the wheels bicycles use are "tech" and the frame material being used is produced by "tech" and there's a lot of "tech" that goes into a bicycle. But somehow I doubt this is what the community cares about.
So writing "R MUTT 1917" on a urinal and putting it in an art gallery constitutes as "art" just because they said it is?
etc etc
According to you it definitely does, that was literally your argument for having anything remotely tech related as tech news.
My argument was that it needs to be actually related to tech/art to considered that. If we want to be super critical of art then just writing that at an urinal may or may not be art. For the sake of argument let's say it's not. But if someone takes a picture of it (or turns the entire thing into a composition) and puts it in an art gallery then it is art. It has to contextualized somehow as art to be in a gallery and that contextualization defines it as art. Similarly tech news should be in in the context of tech, which is why something like rebranding a company is not necessarily tech news.
yes, I was using the famous example that broke the Fin De Ciele -era snobbery about art and the distinction between artist and artisan to make a point.
my point is that you can't define it. So you say "should posts about the wheel be included?"
and the answer is if you exclude all things about wheels where do you draw the line? someone creates a new type of ball bearing that revolutionizes manufacturing, but thats not allowed because it's a wheel? Someone uses a new archeological discovery about an ancient device to invent a modern one? No posts about cars, trains etc? No posts about waterwheel generated activity?
It becomes impossible to police.
Go to any tech site, publication, podcast YouTuber, etc. All of them are talking about Twitter. Mainstream tech has agreed that Twitter / Facebook are tech.
Im not saying I agree. I'm not saying even that I care about these topics. I don't. I think Musk is an idiot and actively avoid news about his BS. But clearly a lot of people do care and a lot of people agree that Twitter is tech.
If this community wants to specify a definition of tech that differs from the mainstream, then they need to put it in the rules and accept that we need to control the acceptable conversation because certain members of the community are getting triggered by having to scroll past posts related to Musk or his properties.
This argument is kind of saying "/c/technology should contain any topics which are interesting to people subscribed to /c/technology".
We're not a publication, podcast, or youtuber. This is a community aggregating posts about the topic of choice. We're not trying to gather up users by posting things that are interesting to our existing users.
This statement indicates that what is technology is decided by popular opinion, not by any inherent meaning in words. Certainly the meaning of words change with time and they have no inherent meaning, so in a very real sense, definitions are decided by popular vote. However, if Twitter is a tech company, then so is every newspaper, magazine, bank, credit card company, any business with a data base for inventory management. It's a useless definition. Let's go with the actual mainstream definition of a tech company, a company that develops, produces, licenses or sells technology or technology services, and Twitter doesn't do any of that. It sells ad space and subscriptions, the business model of a media company.
Friendo....
That's how language works. Language evolves and adapts over time via social pressure. Nobody uses words exactly as they are defined in the Oxford English Dictionary. Words are given meaning by people and inevitably those meanings shift and change as people use them in new and different ways.
Just because you adopted pedantry in order to push out topics you hate hearing about doesn't mean everyone else has to adopt your constructed definitions.
Yes, I've just said that languages evolve. I'm saying that "technology companies" has not yet and will not ever evolve to mean "companies that develop, produce, license or sell technology or technology services, and also Twitter". When Twitter starts getting involved in tech, it will be a tech company.
You asked
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/shorts/Jd8cFPyMRf8?feature=share
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
anything including and beyond hitting a nut with a rock to open it
What defines "real piece of shit?"
What defines "nuts"
There are plenty of people who would call Lemmy a "real piece of shit" and all of us "nuts".
Politely disagree, in that I suspect this is a hypocritical sentiment. Most users who get off of Elon news will agree with this position now but then cry foul when this community is spammed with a subject not to their liking. And as much as the ideology of free speech (rightly) resonates, just like with free markets, some minimal regulation is needed in practice; otherwise some fanatics could choke this feed up with, I dunno, 99% Microsoft news, all the time, and you wouldn't be able to say shit because you "strongly believe people should be able to post whatever they want". I doubt that you would stand by your lofty convictions so strongly then.
Beyond that, there is nothing wrong with expressing a desire for more or less of something—it's just an opinion. It's a bullshit argument to say, "If you don't like it, instead of articulating why, just use the limited non-descriptive tool provided to reduce your passionate sentiment into a trivial binary value and cast it into the sea of thousands just like it; or else, like, go create an entirely new community or a custom feed or whatever you want. But mainly, just fuck off."
Let me make this clear.
I don't give a FLYING FUCK about Elon. I actively ignore any posts about him or his shitty empire. Stop using the behaviors of his idiot stans to argue with me. I am not them.
What I do care about is a community telling people what they can or cannot post, not through rules changes, not through mod action, but by agreeing internally to bully every person who dares to post what every tech publication is talking about.
I think you need to evaluate why you let this shit trigger you. I mean, this is like going to a coffee shop and raising a stink because they sell pumpkin spice lattes. Don't consume it. Use Lemmy's tools to filter it out if you really need to.
Its not the community's job to cater to your specific content desires. This isn't a news site. Its a place for people to talk about whatever they think technology is. It's your job to moderate what you pay attention to.
If i could wish one ability/skill, I would wish to have this person's articulation skill
:Chefs-kiss:
I didn't see any proposals to ban them. If anything this post is about what little value they bring to the community.
But maybe it's because I'd rather this community be more about technology and less about technology as it appears in the news.
Funny enough I think it's a hypocritical sentiment but on the other foot -- users who are tired of this news are going to eventually find some news they are interested in, and then resist having it sequestered somewhere else.
What rss reader are you using? I've been using feeder and have like it so far. Also have freshRSS running but don't use it so much
I've tried so many and I'm always on the hunt for better ones. I wss on Pallabre until it went abandonware. Currently on inoreader but still hunting.
Problem is that I want something that can easily sync my feed and subscriptions across devices, but the ones that support that compromise in other areas. I might need to just settle for good import/export functionality. But Inoreader works for me for now.
But the nice thing is there are a ton of RSS apps out there. So, theres bound to be something for everyone.
Yeah, Lemmy is for obsessively shitposting about Reddit, not Twitter.
Also, memes about that movie I was promoting.
Yay oppenheimer
We can keep that Twitter shit over on Mastodon where it belongs.
Or limit it to a pinned permathread?
Just call it "Elon Madness"
One for Elon, and another for Reddit.
Melon ad-ness. It’s partly newsworthy but mostly free publicity.
That's what ![email protected] does: https://lemmy.ml/post/2431344
Currently chatting with the other mods about this and while we don't want the community to be overrun by Elon, the articles are some of the most upvoted in the past few days. It seems, that people do want to hear about what's going on but not at a rate that drowns out other content. We've been careful to prune out duplicates to keep the flow down, but the volume of Elon posts and Twitter / X is definitely... a lot. I do see how some find it annoying so we're keeping an eye on the situation, but I do agree it does meet the criteria of being both news and tech related. I assume that he'll eventually run out of Twitter pieces to break, right :P
Please do keep an open line of communication with us and all replies, feedback and opinions are always welcome! Cheers!
why did you remove the Grindr unionization post
@enu reply to this please
It's not just an inconvenience. I unfollowed the sub because the quality of the content was poor. I want to learn about technology, not social media companies and every minutiae about their employees bowel movements. I'm getting more value from Linux than from here, despite the fact some of it is more low level than I'd like.
I see the role of moderators as guiding the flow of people's interests. If you went solely on upvotes, it wouldn't matter what you called the community or whether it had moderators. If you want it to be about technology, make it that way. If you want it to be about the business decisions of social media companies tangentially related to technology, at least do the kindness of changing the name so that people don't mistakenly come here thinking they'll hear about new technology.
Great, and thank you for implication and consideration. This community, like any other needs some rules or guide lines. Yet, if people are interested in other topics, they can just subscribe to communities about those other topics.
To be more precise, "technology" "technology news" and "news" are very different subjects that may have their own communities.
I believe the upvotes mainly come from rage engagement. I don't wanna see them either, but they provoke a reaction.
It's not rage, it's amusement from watching the slow motion train wreck.
Yeah, still doesn't belong here though.
Like it or not, it's tech news. When Intel does something interesting, or Google wets the bed again, we'll talk about that a lot, then. Right now it's Elon doing dumb stuff. Last month it was spez. If we ban every hot news topic, what's left to discuss?
I was under the impression that this was a community to discuss technology, not one that discusses the business decisions of companies in the technology sector, and certainly not the decisions of a social media company that is only tangentially related to the technology sector.
Whether we like it or not, it's pretty damn hard to separate technology from business (and also politics)
The direction of technological advancement, as it stands today, is largely driven by businesses. What technologies are developed and what they get used for, depends on who's throwing money at it and how they want to make money from it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sick of hearing about Musk. But the internet is one of the most amazing technological achievements humanity has ever created, and a lot of people use it for Twitter/X, and so their business decisions have pretty far-reaching implications for the rest of the internet. Trying to ignore that leaves out big chunks of the picture.
I was kind of hoping for content about new or interesting technology not news about mainstream tech business stuff.
I want to hear about developments in tech like AI, batteries, biotech, robotics, and so on. Things that give us hope or terror. :)
News about idiot CEOs being douchebags isn't technology. Is business news. It isn't an advancement. It isn't novel. It isn't the most interesting topics in technology.
Maybe it's just me idk.
I think you're missing the point that we're here to discuss technology not the business of it.
Just because technology is driven by business processes doesn't mean that this form must also be consumed by discussion over business processes that are only somewhat related to technology.
I'm not sure why this distinction is difficult. If you want a technology politics community then make one, stop polluting technology with technology politics.
Apparently not, given how many people post and upvote articles about technology business.
But frankly, I don't think you can isolate technology from the business and politics around it. You can choose to only talk about specs and functionality, but it is often being driven by business interests regardless.
"Google invents a new standard" is very different from "Google CEO does a big dumb dumb"
Unless you are talking about some social blunder they have done during vacations, "Google CEO does a big dumb dumb" is sure to have implications for the technology and the users of said technology. As Elon Musk's decisions are having to the structure of Twitter's platform and their users.
At this point I think it's very misguided from technology enthusiasts to believe that the matter can be discussed in isolation and detached from human interests. In fact many of the ills of social media, gaming and AI came about because the matters were handled in such a way, and consequently they had political implications.
They were not designed in isolation from business and politics either. Phones moved away from 3.5mm to only have a single USB/Lightning input so that they could sell more wireless earbuds, and iPhones will be forced to change use USB-C due to an European Union decision. Business. Politics. Technology.
But why google created a new standard, what the standard is, how it will be used, what other companies will adopt that standard, when products using that new standard will become available, etc. are all on the business side of things, and so can be directly affected by Google's CEO doing a big dumb dumb. Without the business side of things actually making things happen, a new standard is just a bunch of rules that someone wrote down.
Remove business from the equation, and you're mostly left with technical papers that describe hypothetical technology that no one is actually making, and hobbyists cobbling together gadgets in the basement or writing code in their free time for fun. And don't get me wrong, that's cool stuff too, but it's a much more niche community.
In an ideal world, we'd probably have about 3 different communities, one dedicated to the businesses side of technology, one dedicated to pure technology with specs and technical papers and such disconnected from business, and a 3rd one where we discuss both aspects and how they come together in the real world. Since we only have the one main community though, to me at least, the third approach seems most appropriate for here. If you feel so strongly about it, perhaps you should consider creating those other communities, perhaps call them something like TechBusiness and PureTechnology.
The two are inseparable unfortunately. Business and the actual technology itself are closely intertwined. Talking about technology in a vacuum can be somewhat interesting, but it doesn't work in an online forum. Applications of the technology are going to require business. And if you can't discuss the applications, what will you discuss? An online forum doesn't have enough subject matter experts to solely discuss the technology.
I agree tech and applications of it tend to go together. But dumb business decisions of tech that has gone mainstream like telephones and PCs certainly doesn't have to enter the discussion. And they don't always tie to application of tech.
As a counterpoint, there's still plenty of tech news that isn't necessarily business related for telephones, with constantly developing smartphone technologies. I don't know that going mainstream precludes it from offering good discussion.
Would not be opposed to a new community that focuses on the business side of tech companies!
Twitter isn't a tech company any more than Visa or the New York Times are. Twitter uses technology. They do not develop, produce, or sell technology products or services. It is a media company that sells advertising space and subscriptions, just like a newspaper, something no one would call a tech company.
Oh, and an interesting follow on, if someone runs a technology consultancy, can they post about their business successes and issues? They're in the tech business after all. Or is this simply limited to the who's who of bad actors? The big, 3 4, 10, 15? What is the cut off?
A post about a tech company would at least be relevant, but Twitter isn't a tech company.
I disagree. It's not tech news. Twitter or X losing a few subscribers to mastadon or threads is a Sunday. And on Monday we'll get an article about people moving in the other direction. Distilling entire categories of news to one person or company makes us less informed, not more. We're just echoing the same talking points back and forth at eachother.
I'm definitely not saying Elon or Twitter is NEVER tech news but, jesus, I don't need or want to know about every tweet he makes and every shit he takes. I also don't think these things shouldn't be recorded in some way. But the magnitude it's posted is straight up Elon worship whether you hate him or support him.
I do what I'm able and willing by downvoting items that aren't news or discussion-worthy and not interacting with those comment sections but there is just so much. Is there a place to just read news about technology and not tech business tweets turned into "news" stories? This is a genuine question if someone has info.
I guess it's subjective, but from my perspective the weekly thought bubbles of billionaire / millionaire owners of tech companies is not what I think of when I think about "tech news".
Is the solution here to have megathreads?
For me personally I'd be happy enough for someone to create a redditandtwitternews community and then ban any such news from this community - but I'm pretty sure my views on this are not generally held.
Edit: actually no, I don't think it is really subjective. If twitter invented a new database language that would be tech news. A social media company re-branding is not tech news.
There is now a megethread about said site.
I support your idea.
What technology from Twitter is being discussed?
You mean like non-reactionary content? Stuff that teaches us, and we learn, and we feel hope? Quality rather than hyperbole.
Hear, hear! I’m so sick of watching that douche get all the free publicity in the world. It’s like his haters haven’t all figured out that this why he does half the shit he does.
Ex- fucking- xactly! People keep talking about him. I don't understand fucking why. My suspicion is that they have a team of people to open discussions about him, so the media is talking abiut him. Otherwise I cant imagine someone that wants to keep talking about him. Its nuts! Just let him die already.
I watch because it's my favorite train wreck
People don't seem to get this. The downfall of one of the largest tech companies in the world, that became rather well integrated into our society, is a slow motion car accident that's entertaining to watch.
My favorite technology is bronze smelting.
What about you guys?
My favorite is any system for writing. That's when we started sending actual information into the future. An argument could be made for art on cave walls, and that does communicate with future humans, but the meaning is interpreted rather than dictated.
But it isn’t. Culture and technology was transmitted into the future for millennia prior to writing was developed.
Personally I'm more of an irrigation fanboy. I just love an efficient way to get water to my crops.
The plow. The greatest of all inventions.
I personally feel the trebuchet is the pinnacle of engineering, which is the superior siege weapon.
Ah, but how did the designer of the first trebuchet have time to perfect their design? Someone else grew extra food for them. How did the farmer produce this surplus bounty? By using the plow!
But you're right, the trebuchet is indeed the superior siege weapon.
Pff, where's my lever gang at?
Where my fulcrum bros at
They're fighting the inclined plane gang
Screw them, they're going downhill.
They're attached via an inclined plane wrapped helical around an axis.
Do you smelt bronze from bars or can you smelt directly from ores?
I like cement. Roman cement with quicklime. Shit cracks on the limestone flakes which erode and re-calcify within all the micro-fractures. Fuckin Romans were mad smart.
Huge fan of lead refinement.
Laden or unladen?
I'm a pretty big fan of food preservation. Ancient methods like smoking and pickling, to modern ones like freeze drying. Shout out Steve1989MREInfo!
Typewriters and fountain pens for me.
Seriously idgaff about how a media business is performing.
Agreed. News about X is not news about technology.
I get why we all talk so much about Elon, but man I wish collectively as a society we could all agree to stop talking about him so he could disappear into obscurity
Yes! Social media gossip is NOT "technology".
But it’s news about tech.
It is not
It’s about a website that is on the internet that runs on technology
Electrons go zoomy through the internets
Tubes or something like that
And by your swiss cheese logic, everything we do these days is tech news.
It's a common fallacy that drops community quality like a rock.
It's like programming horror being flooded with things that aren't even marginally related to programming. But since technically all our technology is programmed, then it's technically programming related.
Well now all I can think of is cheese while I’m on a technology community. My day is ruined.
Sounds like an improvement though.
Production of cheese is a technology, so...
Are you seriously trying to argue that social media is not technology?
No, they are arguing that everything is technically technology. So we should turn this community into a basket weaving forum.
I call the underwater basket weaving sub community
But what is the "everything" being discussed? A Tech CEO's decisions and changes over a social media platform, which is a widely used technology. Nevermind the business aspects that exist everywhere, is it even reasonable to talk of social media, technology dedicated towards social connections, without addressing the social aspects involved?
Why don't we have articles about Burger King then? They have a website on the Internet that runs on technology.
Found a handy script to minimize this:
https://greasyfork.org/en/scripts/471718-lemmy-post-keyword-filter
Yeah. Just because a tech company does something, that doesn't make it technology news. Call me when there's actual technologic development coming out.
my coffee maker has Bluetooth
So that it can hear music and take work calls without disturbing you while it makes you coffee?
Now this is the sort of hard hitting technical news that I come here for /s
I am automatically down voting everything with musk in title
Please and thank you.
Too late for that. Technology has been redefined to mean whatever Si valley IT tech bros are up to.
I recommend to unsub and build topical communities.
As a last resort maybe. There are also other technology communities on other instances. Let's see who hands this issue best. But for now, mods have taken appropriate action.
Agreed whats more annoying is getting double X posts back to back
Your kinda right. It's more the back to back nature of Elon posts that's annoying.
I kinda found out changing Lemmy's sorting algorithm from Active/Hot to New posts helps spread out the news (and even helps unearth lesser covered issues).
We need c/enoughMuskSpam
No, it's about telling the posters to post Musk related content exclusively in that community.
I'm not seeing how this is related. Make a rule in the sidebar which tells the poster to post Musk content that community instead. And if he still posts, it can be auto-deleted/locked (not sure if this capability exists in Lemmy yet).
Edit: Also, the community won't be on your feed if you block it. It can be a nice automod feature to automatically move posts to another community if it detects Musk/Twitter/X keyword in the title.
I guess it might help channel all the effort and energy into one dedicated community that you can simply unsubscribe from. Like a honey pot trap.
You are not going to get people who want to see Twitter covered as technology to go into a community made by people who don't think Twitter should be covered as technology
Joining a community centered solely around content you want to avoid seems counter-productive.
Well, it is tech, what do you expect?
twitter isn't any more "tech" than Nanna's blog about knitting.
It's literally a tech company. The laws the company tests are all about the impact of tech.
They are not sellung technology. If i could buy a license to run twitter on my server then you would be correct.
Twitter is a socialmedia company . Just as uber is rideshare company
In your mind a company has to sell tech to be a tech company. Is Google a tech company? Were they not a tech company when they developed a sorting algorithm for the web? Were they not a tech company when they started spelling targeted advertising based on that algorithm? Of they were and are.
This could be said of any large multinational.
BHP is a multinational mining company worth 4x twitter which tests laws around the impact of tech. If they wanted to re-brand would that be tech news ?
Exactly. And when BHP tests laws in ways that are newsworthy people can discuss them here. The disconnect in your logic is hilarious.
Why are there so many Elon bootlickers anywhere?
There's also this pathological thing of posting even the negative crap about these types of toxic figures, all the time. The attention they receive - positive and negative - is like flies swarming around shit.
"Enough musk spam"... then they proceed to carpet-bomb the goddamned place with musk spam.
I want to post a non-news idea I had about verifying people online, though with Google's current destructive proposal for a web standard in the headlines, I am admittedly a bit worried it's going to get conflated.
The idea would be that it serves the same kind of purpose as what a company would ever need - verifying that someone is a unique person, verifying that they are over a certain age - only when the user volunteers that info, and without actually giving said online company actual information about them.
When I read the headlines about such systems being attempted by game companies or web companies, it basically comes with a "Trust us!" caveat that I can't imagine anyone following. BUT, they at least give some respectable PR language about how such things might be useful to combat harassment, fake accounts, etc, and it does give me some ideas. The internet is kind of a limitless place, but having no limits for everyone is in some ways a limitation in itself.
So, I'm curious if people would actually want threads like that in this Community instance.
Yes! That sounds like a very interesting discussion!
I think that this is doable for most of the normal population (and likely not novel (which does not diminish its value)) with public private crypto and some authority (eg government issued ids having keys like Portugal) and then using those to authenticate to a service that allows specifically what you want to share. So normally you'd only ever share say age or something
Discussing user generated ideas is actually a pretty fun concept
This community's best use case is finding niche and/or new and exciting tech ideas and tools
I’m almost ready to block this domain. Bunch of Musk shit and bad news all around.
Well most big tech is going to shit so bad news is still news.
True, the antics of a social media site shouldn't really be the focus of this community
It's odd how many people in this thread are calling Twitter a tech company. It's a media company, closer to the New York Times and Washington Post than to Google or even something like John Deere.
Seriously. At least put the twice daily Elon Musk stories in one thread.
It's fucking ridiculous.
Honestly, Lemmy is starting to really disappoint me. I figured I was leaving most of the circlejerking, reposting, and shitposting behind on Reddit. However Lemmy is every bit just as bad :-/ which is frightening considering how few people are on Lemmy. If it's getting this shitty right now, imagine it if there was a real Reddit migration...
Lemmy has the same users that Reddit has. What the fuck were you expecting?
Come to Lemmy as an alternative to reddit!
... No don't use it like reddit!?!
Sounds like you might prefer tildes.
What is that?
This. It's another link aggregator that focuses on serious discussion rather than jokes. I have invite codes if you want to try it. Too serious for my taste, but if you want to get away from the shitposting and memes you might like it.
Interesting. I'll check it out. Is it federated? It's invite only?
Not federated, but open source. And yes, invite only.
Beware Tildes is centralized and has one dictator for life similar to what Spez is to Reddit. They focus on narrow and deep discussion but no free speech, no NSFW and no video/image posts. They are extremely biased and far left-wing.
Half my comments just get downvoted for no reason. I told someone I was sorry their houses got messed up by tornados...two down votes. Like I know karma doesn't matter, but it's not fun or encouraging to see and has genuinely made me post less.
One thing I like about Lemmy is that it shows upvotes and downvotes separately in addition to the composite score.
When I make a controversial post that gets 7 upvotes and 20 downvotes, I think "Man, this was a good post. 7 people liked it". On Reddit, I would just think 13 people downvoted it. If anything, on Lemmy downvotes are just proof that I made someone I don't like mad on the Internet, which is great.
Oh? I use Liftoff and don't see that information! I think I'd like that better, too, I think all it's showing me now is the composite.
What do you use so I can check it out? Or is it the default web browser?
I use Jerboa on mobile and the native Lemmygrad UI on desktop.
Thanks, I only tried jerboa briefly after switching from Reddit but quickly stopped using it because lift off had a better theme imo, but I may just not care and prefer extra features! Suppose I could do a feature request for liftoff, too.
You could always go to an instance like beehaw that disables downvotes.
Yea but then you miss out on 99% of the fediverse. Although if that 99% is just shitposts and bullshit then maybe that is the better solution. I really do not know.
It's not quite that bad but hey, tradeoffs.
It's not that I wanna get rid of downvotes, I think down voting is a good feature. It just feels like people are more downvote happy here, even though it doesn't mean anything. It's like instead of it not meaning anything making people use it less, it actually make some people use it more specifically because it "doesn't mean anything". I'm not sure if this is just mean people being negative or just trying to get their own post more attention, but I've definitely noticed it.
If it doesn't mean anything, maybe what you could do is charge your perspective and stop caring. I get downvoted all the time and it doesn't stop me.
🤡 🥲 wait
I could also change my perspective and just delete this app and cut toxic unfriendly stuff out of my life and read more books, instead of changing my perspective just to fit in on the internet with strangers who don't and won't ever know me🤷♂️
I mean, lemmy is just reddit with fewer users haha
You can't have a large, diverse community without all types. If you would like a community that only focuses on specific things, I would look for a more niche site/forum.
I mean, I'm not sure why you expected any different. This is what the internet is now; A bunch of ads, hate, and shit posting.
Some aspects of it are just as bad because they are the human aspects and will plague anything made by or for humans. Attention whoring, power hunger, confusion, people who see any gathering of people as something they can exploit, things like that will be a part of any community. Though it does seem like there's less of that here (which is why I'm ok with it not being as popular as Reddit became).
There's other things I'm not seeing nearly as much of here. There isn't the same bot presence. Troll farms don't seem to be here yet either (though it's probably only a matter of time). Admins aren't acting like powerful dictators since most of the users here just left a place because of that and will do it again. These things will all likely get worse with popularity, too.
Tildes is, I think faring well for what it's worth
Tildes is anti free speech and has a dictator for life as Deimos, it is well know they can ban you without reasons.
It will be seriously difficult finding a good instance without the shit posting and reddit-like echo chamber. I still think decentralization is the solution against the censorship machinery coming up we just need to support the right instance.
Like the stupid beans memes
I mean....most of the bullshit on Reddit wasn't due to Spez and corporate stuff. It was due to idiots reposting dumb shit and bots flooding the website at all times from all angles. I don't see how Lemmy would be immune to that unfortunately. Ad in the threat of AI and no website will be safe from ruin :-/.
It's the humans. Humans make things great and shitty. Even AIs that make things shitty will be because some asshole decided that they wanted an AI to do that.
But my Techno Daddy news?... No, yeah. Reddit had the same issue. Enough with musking up tech subs.
Y'all know there's a voting system so people see the kind of posts they would want from a tech sub
Does downvoting actually demote posts here? There's no karma.
"they would want" or "whatever drives engagement more"?
Agreed. Elmo is only in this because he wants that dopamine hit of attention that front-page news gets him. It's why bought Twitter. Getting on the front page, just for a moment is all that matters to him.
Also, it is LONG past time we got over our child-like worship of billionaires. It's embarrassing to watch.
It's time to yeet the rich
deleted
When we first got here, people were complaining about that everything was about reddit all the time, then it slowed down until r/place happened again.
Just let the news happen naturally, Musk shenanigans with 𝕏 is the tech headline right now.
Twitter is the scape goat here. We want technology content, not general news.
It is technology news, it is not general. The Platform Formerly Known As Twitter is a technology company.
It's a media company. Why are so many people here calling in a technology company - because they have a Web site? They do not develop, produce or sell any technology product. They operate a Web site and sell ad space, just like every newspaper, magazine and TV network. Are we calling the New York Times a technology company?
I would consider social media companies part of the technology realm. What does it take to run all of that? What do they produce to make it functional? What do they research to make it better? Just commercials? No the whole thing has an extremely tech heavy backend wether you see it on your local machine or not. The entire thing is pushed and moved by tech.
But we aren't discussing the tech backend that makes all of that happen; we're talking about business dealings and the politics thereof. Therein lies the issue.
I will concede on that point. Because we aren't talking about their backend. I imagine it gets posted because it sparks engagement like this.
Countless companies that are not technology companies use these same technologies in the same ways. Using technology does not make something a technology company.
Twitter is technology driven. It relies, exists, and improved with technology. They develop algorithms. They create user interfaces. At one point did this become media and not technology?
There are sublemmies that are more niche if thats what you are looking for. I think it is unwarranted to complain in a big general technology sub like this. Its not like this is focused on hardware, or specifically technical specifications.
By your definition, banks and credit card companies are technology companies. Visa has three times as many users and countless more database transactions than Twitter. The finance sector develops and uses algorithms - Fico scores being a notable one. Tons of people use technology. Twitter isn't even notable for it's usage of technology. Tons of companies, including Visa, have more impressive and expansive use of the same things twitter uses. A company is a tech company if it develops and sells technology, not if it uses it.
It is not a media company. Twitter doesn't manufacture the content, they provide the platform. The platform is the technology.
This is exactly my point. They create, maintain, and develop a technology platform that serves all sorts of media. It is not a media company, they do not make the news. They distribute it. People are just mad they are seeing twitter and elon instead of "Methods for Concatenation in Assembly" or something idk.
It's a media company. The only difference between them and a newspaper is a short word limit and they don't pay their authors. No one is paying Twitter for technology that they produce or for technological services. They get money from ads and subscriptions - the media business model.
Twitter is a stage for attention and the "news" posted here is more about the ego than the technical aspects of the stage.
Man this post is full of a lot of really angry people that take seeing stuff they don't like in their feed way too seriously.
I get where you're coming from, but seeing posts like this for so many popular new topics is getting repetitive too. Its definitely tech related. Elon and twitter news will slow down eventually, and people will obsess over something new, guaranteed. Better to just ride it out IMO.
Reddit was the same way. The King is dead, long live the King!
Elon is constantly in the news cycle. He seems to be imitating Trump for some reason. This X rebranding feels like a forced attempt to stay relevant. Maybe he is planning to run for governor in Texas or California. Weird.
Every trend will slow down, but what if the next is also about Twitter/X? Or for Meta, or some corporate move from another company.
The reddit sub always seemed to be a lot more about the business side of technology and I just remember a lot of arguing.
It would be nice to have an actual technology sub that discusses actual technology.
How about the mods unsticky the Twitter/Elon megathread?
Could you guys at least find other billionaires to obsess over? A bit of variety would be nice.
LMAO it's hard when he does so much stupid shit
one for c/juxtaposition (does that exist yet?)
No, I want to acquire all the wisdom of the successful super genius tech guru playing 9D chess. /s
I totally agree
I agree, OP. We all know Twitter has the newest cutting edge technology on the planet! Every ounce of information must be reported on about the company here.
Twitter renaming to X is definitely something high on tech news. Would love to have a run where similar headlines are removed.
Agreed
b-but muh circlejerk
...
If anything, its a "reflection" of the current state of "online communities" -- circlejerk and "follow the hivemind above all else"-fiesta.
Nobody wants to have "fun" in here -- but to be/feel validated by randoms.
Thanks
Why not ignore the messages about shithead and his shitty stunts?
No.
Yei
Watching Elon work is like watching a snake eat a rat. Horrible, but you can't look away.
Maybe we could restrict it to one Elon thread per day?
One per year to a decade.
Yeah, how dare people talk about current events.