Installed GrapheneOS for the first time
I have not any prior experience with installing custom ROMs, but after trying it out (and getting stuck, and googling and finding answers) I successfully did it. Below is my home screen if anybody is curious:
I use OpenBoard for my keyboard. Unfortunately I am still dependent on Play Store since some of the apps I need can only be found there. Sometimes it feels meaningless committing to this whole thing because I'm not perfectly private; then I think this is better than using a regular iPhone or Android phone.
So far I'm liking it. I am naturally inclined to feel hesitant about using this as my main phone and plugging in a SIM since it's custom, but I'm slowly making the transition.
Feel free to share any beginners advice or your own experience using GOS for the first time. Cheers!
OpenBoard is no longer maintained. Heliboard is a good alternative.
I think Google Play on Graphene is a good compromise, since at least it does not have root access. Unfortunately it is very crippling to completely avoid Google on Android.
That being said, I heard others are using work profiles to isolate all apps using Google Play from their more private apps. I'm not doing that, but work profiles are nice for ... well work apps.
Thanks for the heads-up!
As someone who has a profile only for Whatsapp (used to also be Instagram), a profile for banking & finances, a profile for some stuff that needs play services, and a profile for most other stuff (main profile).....don't use profiles unless you're only creating one more at the most, and you're absolutely certain there's no need to share information between the profiles.
Graphene has had a long-standing bug from upstream AOSP, if I recall correctly, where it'll always ask for your pin when changing profiles, and only sometimes will it allow you to use your fingerprint or alternative methods to get into your profiles. I almost never get the fingerprint option for my main profile, and have to tap back from the pin input on other profiles to get the option to use fingerprint, and not always. They do sometimes push something that loosely resembles a fix, but it'll go back to not working after another update.
Regarding communicating between profiles, that's hard to pull off. The curveball of having to send screenshots from banking apps, say, confirming transactions, it's made a lot worse with profiles. I'm currently relying on my nextcloud instance to upload screenshots from finances, then downloading those screenshots from nextcloud into my WhatsApp profile, just to send a proof of transfer to someone. I'm definitely not keeping my phone like this for much longer.
All else considered, however, I'm not going back to a ROM that doesn't respect me as the owner of my device. I'm happy to have switched to graphene and I am here to stay.
Thank you for sharing this. Honestly, right now, I simply don't feel a need to use profiles for my apps. I understand some people claim I probably should considering I use both FOSS and Google apps, but I'm just getting started with this whole privacy thing and I don't feel like rushing. Using only one profile probably isn't the absolute worst thing you could do, eh?
I was wondering about that. Seems like 90% of the time it flashes the finger print reader then fails and goes back to pin. Also 75% of the time can't read my fingerprint reader when just unlocking but that's not a grapheneos issue... :(
I use Gboard with network permissions toggled off
Openboard updated for me recently. When did they stop maintaining it?
https://github.com/openboard-team/openboard
Last commit is two years ago. I'd recommend checking what you have installed. A quick search on GPlay finds what appears to be a clone that may or may not leak user data.
version 1.4.5
org.dslul.openboard.inputmethod.latin versionCode 19
targetSdk 31 minSdk 19
Installed: May 8, 2024; 3:17 PM Updated: May 8, 2024; 3:17 PM
Is this an AHH SHIT moment or I'm good? Lol
1.4.5 is the latest—and last—OpenBoard version, released 8/8/22 per app on F-Droid.
Did you fresh install it? Your log makes it look like you just installed it.
Yes I forgot I did. My phone bugged out one day about it. I don't know why. Whats a good FLOSS alternative?
Heliboard is recently restarted sucessor
Futo is another option, I am not sure if it is Foss Lois rossmann backs it though
It is not, just source-available:
https://gitlab.futo.org/keyboard/latinime/-/blob/master/LICENSE.md
I like FlorisBoard
I'm using a work profile for Google Play. It was surprisingly easy to setup and there are few guides around. But basically you install Shelter, then clone Apps to the work profile. Open up Apps on the work profile and install google play services normally.
Tbh if you don't do mobile gaming, I think this is entirely doable. I say this as someone who uses Aurora Store for about 3 or 4 odd apps. I could live without them on my phone, but I just choose not to for the convenience of having a mobile client for some proprietary services I use. And I don't have Google Play services at all.
I found a separate profile with google play was too much of a pain in the ass unfortunatly.
To install apps from the Play Store you could maybe look at Aurora Store?
You can use the aurora store for most of your play store need's.
Should be all, its simply a frontend. I have never seen an app be "missing" so to say.
I was referring to features, like adding money to your account. Not that they are needed in aurora.
Some apps are not available in my Google store due to geoblocking. Can aurora circumvent this? Or is it a front end of the "local" google play store?
A reputable VPN can block this. I'm not sure if the store can solely. I don't believe so. If your blocked for any reason you need a good VPN. ****
You are correct, re-loading the aurora store after shifting my vpn to the target country (and anonymous login) seems to change the aurora storefront too :)
Nah, I prefer F-droid wherever I can. The mentioning when an app has anti-features is so helpful.
But Aurora is a great second option.
vouch for aurora store being awesome
Every step you take towards a more private digital life is essential. I mean you have to start somewhere right? And the phone is in my opinion the biggest privacy thread out there. I am not on GrapheneOS but I’m considering switching soon.
I switched over a year ago and have no regrets. It does everything I want (including android auto now) and gives me at least a little but more privacy than a stock android image.
The more people who use it the more impetus there is to further develop it.
Give it a go! Its a great.
Aurora store is also pretty cool. You can download from there without a google account.
I just keep Play store installed with all permissions disabled, including network, and use Aurora store instead.
What is the main difference between using Play Store and Aurora store (logged in with your Google account)?
Aurora store has a cleaner interface with no ads and can be used without a google account.
I’m more curious about the privacy aspect of using Aurora over Play, especially considering since I will be logged into my G account.
When starting Aurora, you can choose between an anonymous account or your own. You can still use the anonymous option even if you are logged in to other services with google. If you go logged on anyways, I guess Google will not know your every tap with Aurora? I would think logged in, google play store and aurora would be comparable (not private).
Do you know if it's safe to download banking apps from third party stores (in this case Aurora)?
It does download from google (servers), so it is safe enough
I have heard Aurora is more insecure and you can risk getting your Google account blacklisted or banned using it. Do you have any experience with this or know how common it is?
I do not know on a technical level.
Excuse my ignorance, but why not use your own G account?
Aurora is a foss wrapper with fewer anti-features like ads. You could trust the client more ig if you're using Aurora. I use F-Droid for most things and then Aurora for like 3 apps I'm not willing to give up and have no foss alternatives. I mostly just use Aurora out of principle for the apps I can't get from F-Droid, but also I guess out of a lack of trust for Google (which I suppose is related to the principle of not using proprietary software anyway)
Even if apps you use depend on play store one of the things you can do on GrapheneOS is temporarily disable it and only turn it back on when apps refuse to run, another option is just keeping those apps in a separate work profile.
all android phones can temporarily disable an app until you turn it back on.
No, that only applies to (some, not all) system apps. GrapheneOS allows this for all (including user-installed apps): https://grapheneos.org/features#user-installed-apps-can-be-disabled
adb shell pm disable-user PACKAGE_NAMEworked for me with Signal on a stock pixel
Sure you can do it through adb, but Graphene exposes this option in the settings. They also recommend against enabling developer settings and using adb for security reasons.
But you said "no" before... I was just showing that it is indeed possible with non-system apps.
Yeah you're right, I didn't think of adb while writing that comment. It's not possible through the settings is what I meant.
yes also including uaer apps: for example I can disable whatsapp by putting it in deep sleep and disabling its allowed network for extra measures, then it wont ring, wont update store version, wont recive calls, nor messages all while I'm online watching youtube for 2 hrs, then I can enable allow mock location and once online I'll appear in brussel. btw I all non-rooted Androids can but Apple Users cant do any of that with their phones
Not all of them can disable google play service apps
I would argue you shouldn't be using those apps in the first place since they all contain proprietary blobs (yes that includes Signal, see Molly-FOSS for a non-blobbed fork).
Absolutely, my suggestion was just for folks who have apps that still require play services, not everyone can avoid it, but you can minimize usage if you do need them.
Molly also includes other useful features like database encryption and UnifiedPush support.
Yes but for me it is a non-starter for legal reasons because screenshots do not work with fingerprint lock turned on. I don't understand why the user cannot choose to enable this or not like other apps can (including Signal).
Not google services
I suggest Droid-ify over the F-Droid store for ease of use, but both work fine
I personally like the F-droid app way better. It is pretty polished and has the benefit of being first party
You don't need Play Store if you've purchased something. I had to use a paid app for a few years and installed it through Aurora. You can install paid apps on Aurora if you log into the google account you bought it on.
I like neo store
Automatic updates were added about six months ago. https://gitlab.com/AuroraOSS/AuroraStore/-/issues/719
They've been working well enough for me.
To me I love to have control over what I update, I agree with it not being inconvenient. For other it might so it's not really necessary to be mean about it!
Unfortunately I'm experiencing the same thing :( Not too big of a deal for me to do manual updates once every two weeks or so but still an annoyance
every small change matters
Check out Heliboard (also on F-Droid) and follow the instructions to enable gesture typing. I also suggest Futo for on-device voice to text.
What specific apps are you using that you can't deal going away from? Other than some social media or gamr or something. Even then it seems like there are replacements a lot of the time
I'd love to try out GrapheneOS (or another OS), but I can't afford a second phone, and there's no way I'm gonna dive head-first into something entirely unfamiliar to me when it's my only method for telephony.
It does function just like any other phone so far I've tested. No app that simply doesn't work. And if it doesn't, you can simply exploit the GOS hardening in settings to improve compatibility. You overall have more control over any app, which I like
One of my biggest concern is banking apps not working. Is that still an issue with Custom ROMs?Edit: Nevermind, answerd belowI can add that ive also had 100% success with that setting, but I've only needed it 2 or 3 times.
I feel the same. If I try to install a different ROM and it falls I could be without a phone for a bit.
I was shocked to find out that the hardest part of the installation was finding a Chromium based browser on PC lol
All you have to do to install GrapheneOS is press one button in the WebUI. No other 'ROM' has been easier to install.
You can also use a Chromium-based browser on another Android device
Exactly.
Ironically it was when the stock android upgrade on my pixel 7 completely bricked my phone (due to the multiple user profiles bug) that I decided to jump in to Graphene head first.
Compared to my experience running random ROMs on Samsungs back in the era of galaxy note 1 to 4, Graphene installer was so easy!
It is really similar to stock android in terms of functionality. It's just degoogled and hardened. It's designed to be user-friendly and not for tech-savvy people (though tech-savvy-friendly—which is part of being user-friendly imo). I promise you you can use it out of the box once installed just like a stock android install. The only thing to be aware of is to install some kind of package manager like fdroid or aurora store, or even grapheneos's unprivileged google play store, to get apps, unless you just want to use the stock apps it comes with i guess in which case you probably shouldn't waste money on a smartphone.
Really? That's awesome! I think I'll check it out. :)
Edit: ...Seriously? They only support Pixel devices? Wow. Fuck this.
Yes, only Pixels are officially supported. If you want to add support for other devices, it's a foss project and you're welcome to write the code yourself. For other devices there are other degoogled OSes you can use. Graphene is generally considered the most secure but if you have another phone you can install one of the other AOSP forks or turn it into a linux phone or something
Don't forget to change your DNS provider to something such as NextDNS for added benefits
Does it have any benefits over just running pihole, other than reliability?
You aren't always home, therefore when you aren't home it's useful.
I have not yet looked into the DNS topic. What are the risks if I use the provider's default DNS? Or what are the advantages of using a different DNS?
ISP DNS servers often lies, depending on your country, a lot do DNS blocking so it's a way to evade basic censorship. Also some alternative DNS can lie in useful ways, for adblocking or malware protection. You can also check mullvad DNS.
NextDNS even let’s you customize your DNS filter. You can choose which blocklists you want to use, and you can manually whitelist/blacklist individual domains. It also has other cool features like parental controls and malware protection.
You can still use PiHole as your DNS when not home if you setup a VPN. For me that was the route I went.
or you can allow public authenticated access to dns over https... (just don't expose the raw udp dns server, it's a really bad idea)
(not sure if DoT can also support auth, but if it does that's great because android supports dot natively)
I know I don't want to open up any more ports than I have to, but you're right, that does sound like another alternative to setting up VPN.
Since I access more than just my pihole when connected to my home network. And because I want access to my home services, and don't want to open up access to the public, opening one port and connecting to VPN is the way to do it. I have one port opened up for my VPN, and in order to connect you have to have my IP or my domain pointed at the IP, and you have to have a Wireguard profile setup, and know what port is open. So that does help a tad bit with my security concerns.
Edit: how would I go about that if I felt so inclined? Any tips?
You might be underestimating the OP
It also works when using cellular data or connecting to a different Wi-Fi network. Your Pi-Hole only works when you’re at home or when you VPN into your home network
Fair. I always assumed I could just point to it while I'm out, but i also haven't put a lot of thought into it yet lol
I mean you technically could expose the Pi-Hole from your home network on the internet, but I don’t recommend it. A VPN (either a simple WireGuard setup or something more fancy like NetBird, ZeroTier or Tailscale) could work, but I think NextDNS is the easier solution. Alternatively you could look into running your Pi-Hole on a VPS with WireHole.
http://futo.org/keyboard
Been using that for a few days now, I'll never go back to AOSP, gboard, heli, nor anything else. Saw a video of who I think is the head of futo, giving a no fucks given presentation, says he's tired of non google keyboards that make it feel like your typing drunk. Website has a QR code to add the Futo repo to fdroid, ez pz.
What don't you like about HeliBoard? I have it and FUTO both installed, but I prefer HeliBoard due to its 'hold space bar to move cursor' option. Then I use FUTO for the occasional SpeechToText.
I didn't dislike Heli, just my accuracy to hit the correct key felt immediately better using Futo.
Ooh in that case I may try using it for typing again. My typing accuracy on Heliboard is abysmal.
Can confirm I had the exact same experience moving from Heli to Futo. Immediately noticed I was way more accurate, better swipe and predictions too.
Good to know it wasn't placebo! 😅
Futo also has the hold space bar to move cursor by default. I just wish it had single hand mode.
OMG thank you I didn't know that!
I kept pressing and holding and got annoyed that the change keyboard dialog would pop up. Pressing and moving is the secret!
Unfortunately not FOSS
Gitlab
Which they state is a fork of LatinIME
Source available is not the same as FOSS. Being able to access the source code is only a precondition to software being considered free. Their licence is not a FOSS licence.
I wasn't meaning to conflate the two, as I see your point. I didn't claim it was FOSS, just that the source was available.
I know for me, I don't mind using software that is licensed so that it doesn't directly fall under FOSS. I just like the availability to view the source vs closed source software being a total black box.
I have no plans to monetize their work, nor fork it, only use it.
Well that’s the difference between source-available software, open source software and free software. FUTO’s license may be source-available, but it’s not open source.
FOSS stands for Free & Open Source Software. FUTO is neither free software nor open source.
I understand that. I didn't call FUTO FOSS...
You can set up multiple user profile and install the play services in only 1 profile if you want to jeep other profile more private
Look into the user profiles feature to further isolate any play store apps you still use. I have one profile called gshit and thats the only one I install anything non-opensource on from the Aurora store.
This prevents any playstore apps from accessing say photos, contacts, messages, etc on your main profile.
PS. If you don't like the stock launcher either you should check out KISS launcher (minimal mode)
Hmmm nope I just updated some apps yesterday. I had to uninstall and reinstall Aurora store cause it wasnt showing the anonymous option anymore, but after that it popped up and worked like normal, no sign in.
No issues here.
Logging in via Aurora can get your Google account banned.
Only read about it once or twice, so take that warning with a grain of salt.
I'm glad if they take my account down for me, actually
Have you checked out this?
https://f-droid.org/packages/com.aurora.store/
Yes. The reason I don't use Aurora is because I've heard it's instable sometimes and uses many anonymous Google accounts in order to install apps. I feel safer using my own burner account for that.
You can also use your own Google account in Aurora store.
Interesting. I'll check this out later.
Definitely do! I also suggest Droid-ify for FOSS apps :)
There is also Neo Store which can be used as a F-Droid client.
I recommend you use GrapheneOS as your daily driver. There's not really any reason not to. I have been for years and never had trouble.
I have been using lots of the different private keyboards that have been out for a while but FUTO just came out with a amazing Keyboard that has better then Google Voice typing.
I think I can live without playstore completely but I might need K-9 with Google emails for some stuff on my device, so I guess I'm not escaping Google spying on my IP address anytime soon. Other than that, I don't use Google or apps from the playstore at all
Use a VPN. No reason not to if you're concerned about privacy—otherwise you have no privacy as your ISP can monitor you. If cost is an issue, ProtonVPN has a free tier, otherwise I recommend Mullvad as an affordable and really reliable and decent option imo. I found ProtonVPN's connection to be kind of volatile when I used it (I paid for it too, on the highest tier). Mullvad has always been super reliable though. Whenever I've had connectivity issues it's always been because of whatever network I'm connected to, not because of Mullvad.
Yeah I probably should but the WiFi at work doesn't let wireguard through (I have a wireguard server running on a VPS)
Sorry for the noob question, but are you able to access your banking apps with GrapheneOS? If so, how?
For me, going into the app info and enabling "Exploit protection compatibility mode" worked for banking.
Most apps should work with no issues. There’s a compatibility list at https://privsec.dev/posts/android/banking-applications-compatibility-with-grapheneos/
I've used four different banking apps (admittedly banks which may not operate in your country, but they're popular enough in my country) on GrapheneOS no problems. I currently don't have a banking app installed because I don't need one and it's probably spyware. I just do my digital banking in my web browser. But if you want to install a banking app, it should work completely fine, save for notifications—a lot of proprietary apps seem to rely on Play services for notifications 🤷♀️
I'm still waiting on LineageOS being ported on my phone (SM-A536B).
You are welcome to work on it. However, Samsung devices are a absolute pain to work with.
Yes, I know that, and I tried porting it to PostmarketOS, but the build failed miserably.
You need to mainline the kernel for Linux systems. That is a very difficult job
Today I learned that Vanadium has a search widget, so thanks for the post :D
It gets me wondering, I have never use a search bar widget in my life and I find them rather setting in the way.. My search bar is just 1 tap away inside Firefox, which is also on the desktop... I've not seen many people around me use it
Do people really use it?
Well I used to use it when I was still using normal Android. When I open Vanadium I get greeted with the last page I visited and I get distracted from that, so a search widget helps me.
Makes sense. Whenever I open Firefox, of opens on the (empty) homescreen where I can start typing in the URL bar right away. But everyone has got their own ways!
What are your concerns regarding using your SIM card?
It's actually nothing but beginner paranoia. Will it work properly even on a custom ROM, is the main question spinning in my head.
No reason it wouldn’t as far as I know, assuming your hardware is compatible.
Works for me on Verizon and has for 5+ years. Google Fi even works as I've tried that with a different phone on GrapheneOS.
When I last used Graphene, it was on a pixel 4 XL, and I used a Google Fi sim card just fine. Texting, specifically MMS was borked, group chats would just be massive sentences of spaghetti letters. Other than that though, issue free.
Same issues here. I love GOS but I need basic things like SMS/MMS/RCS to work, and right now they just don't.
Some people apparently got it to work. Maybe check this thread on the Graphene forum: https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/1353-using-rcs-with-google-messages-on-grapheneos/
Thank you! It was interesting skimming that thread.
Damn, not even RCS works?! I'm back to stock Android on a 6 Pro because I don't have the energy, and can't be fucked to deal with tech problems that often.
Apparently it works https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/1353-using-rcs-with-google-messages-on-grapheneos/
RCS works with my Pixel 7
OK, yea a feature that uses data not working didn't make sense.
Welcome! My experience has been seamless, I think most of the idiosyncrasies have been covered in other comments already but Ive had zero issues with base functionality "out the box"
Futo keyboard. Its the best.