First Presidential Debate Megapost!
Here we go, the first Presidential debate between Biden and Trump begins at 9 PM Eastern/6 PM Pacific.
How to watch it:
https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/25/politics/how-to-watch-cnn-debate/index.html
"The CNN Presidential Debate will air live on CNN, CNN International and CNN en Español, and via streaming on Max for subscribers and without a cable login on CNN.com. CNN will make the debate available to simulcast on additional broadcast and cable news networks.
You can also follow CNN’s live debate coverage on CNN.com, which will include analysis and fact checking."
"According to parameters set by CNN in May, all participating debaters had to appear on a sufficient number of state ballots to reach the 270 electoral vote threshold to win the presidency and receive at least 15% in four separate national polls of registered or likely voters that meet CNN’s standards for reporting.
Polls that meet those standards are those sponsored by CNN, ABC News, CBS News, Fox News, Marquette University Law School, Monmouth University, NBC News, The New York Times/Siena College, NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist College, Quinnipiac University, The Wall Street Journal and The Washington Post."
Edit And that's it! Thanks for watching everyone!
tl;dw:
Consensus is Trump didn't so much as beat Biden as Biden beat himself.
The real loser is CNN who failed to fact check anyone, and there were obvious fact checks on both sides.
Oh. My. God.
It's literally two old-as-fuck fucks arguing about their golf swings. This is literally how the debate is coming to a close. I just... I don't even know what to say.
The moderators should be ashamed of themselves.
Trump hasn't answered a single question in 20 mins.
"I just wanna go back to that."
They are allowing gish galloping like a motherfucker and Biden has to defend himself from a thousand lies AND answer the question asked while Trump spews bullshit unending.
Not a single fact check. It's not that hard to state when something is inaccurate and challenge the speaker
Oof, yes, we need opponents for this guy who understand the fundamentals of how he and his rhetoric work. The better way to deal with him is to flip the frame. Specifically, in the opening statement, Biden needed to call out very explicitly that Trump was going to lie constantly, and furthermore, point out that you can recognize his lies when he says "best, strongest, biggest, greatest." That little bit of verbal jiu jitsu would've ensured that it was no longer Biden calling out the lies, but the viewers' own ears, and by bringing them to conscious attention, draining the power of those statements. (Trump spews lies and nonsense that don't parse analytically, like that alphabet-soup closing statement, but he's really aiming his words at the subconscious mind.)
Yes, they should have been fact checking Trump or better holding him to his answers - but to be fair maybe they should have been asking Biden to actually clarify if he's beating Medicare or getting COVID passed.
This was a shit show.
And it was such a shit show that Trump was a complete clown and getting away with it - not just because of the moderators, but because his opponent was as on point as a tree stump.
Why? They accomplished what they were there to do.
I keep tryna tell people Zazlov wants CNN to be right wing
Source
The Onion from the top rope!
and that is exactly why he is bad at it. i don't see a problem 😂
God bless the onion.
WE ARE SO FUCKED
Fucking no fact checking is insanity.
This is literally constant stream of bullshit from Trump.
Let's be honest, fact-checking doesn't matter to the American people watching this. The people who need to hear these facts have already been preprogrammed to believe CNN is biased and lying.
It is about not forcing Biden to spend half of each response regarding to blatant lies like... Biden being pro Palestine.
"Well, we can't let Republicans say we're pro-Palestine! Guess we
get togotta support Netanyahu even harder!"Trump demanded the debate, Biden should have demanded thorough fact checks with graphs and balances.
I personally would not have stepped in any debate setting with a certified liar and scammer without any sort of fact checking, it's just foolishness.
I seriously doubt it but I really hope this is a wake-up call for Democrats. I remain convinced that Biden voluntarily stepping down and permitting a younger more charismatic figure in his place will be all that is needed to win, and I say this for a few reasons:
Call it a reverse-October surprise.
That being said, this is the earliest debate ever and Trump still needs to go through sentencing in July. People won't really remember this debate, but it certainly did not help Biden in any capacity.
What the fuck are the moderators even there for?
So much time is being taken with, "let me keep talking about the question from ten minutes ago and ignore what you just asked."
Sorry people with children. The question that focused on your issues were just skipped over.
I'm going to vote for policy, not a person. I don't agree with Trump on anything, so I'll vote for Biden.
I’m voting for Biden still bc Trump is a piece of shit, but Biden is coming off old and weak in this debate. Trump is lying his ass off about everything and not getting called out on any of it, and because he’s spouting so much of it so quickly rapid-fire, it’s obfuscating and confusing the issues.
Yeah watched after his last rant the moderater said he had 37 seconds to answer the actual question asked and then allowed him to rant for another fucking minute and half. Then gave Biden 30 seconds to give a weak ass answer.
Why is Biden acting like he doesn't know where he is? What the fuck.
It’s a torrent of bs from trump. It comes out so fast that there’s no way to cover it all and still get facts out along with future policy statements.
Gish gallop.
Jon Stewart was kind of brutal:
"Lots of people have 'resting 25th amendment face.'"
Trump is playing pigeon chess. Strutting around, telling lies, shitting all over everything, and will leave telling everyone he won.
No policy debate. Zero.
We live in a world where Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Camacho is more electable than the candidates we have.
I figured Idiocracy was prescient, but it's coming true awfully fast.
He’s not answering Jan 6 directly.
And he’s blaming Pelosi? For Jan 6? Did I hear that right?
Yep. And no fact check means it's true in Trumpland.
Or just anyone who's not clued in. Trumpland will vote even if they know he's lying. It's the people that barely pay attention to politics that will hear a confident politician say something and assume it's true.
and biden is not jumping on it. Fucking worthless old man just fucked us back to president trump.
This country is cooked with these two as the choices. Biden looked awful, and Trump didn't answer anything at all. Trump gets a pass on never having any substance to his replies. It is just jokes and insults.
I guess...
Biden fucked up. But I don't think this really changes anything.
Nobody is voting for Biden because we like him. We are voting for him because we give a shit about human rights and democracy. And democrats generally are good at actually listening to what is being said because... we want things.
republicans hate biden and are just happy they heard that brown people are killing and raping everyone. Nothing changed there
What Biden needed to do was win over the dumbass moderate/"undecided" voters. Which... is not talking points or policy. It is strongman bullshit. And that... is going to almost be entirely up to The Internet. Do we focus on Biden stuttering and having aphasia that he has had for decades? Or do we focus on trump blatantly lying and still talking about asking Nancy Pelosi to lead an insurrection for him?
John Oliver and the rest of the late night hosts are going to be working overtime to remind the country that having a deranged fascist in charge is bad. The Hasans of the world are going to keep talking about "Genocide Joe" because they are useful idiots, at best. But... I don't know beyond that.'
That said, I do think about the questionably accurate story that nixon (ugh) won his debate against kennedy (lesser ugh) among radio versus television listeners.
Biden mostly won in terms of text. He lost in terms of audio. But... people live on twitter and social media. How many people are going to be watching clips versus reading excerpts and tweets?
The quote of the night: “President Trump, the question was…”
"I had the best environmental numbers ever," whatever that means, is hilarious for Trump to say
If Biden is going to be replaced it has to be a huge name like AOC or Bernie. It’s too late to campaign anyone newer
This was the single hardest thing to watch in my entire life. RIP usa your fates sealed
Pains me to say I agree with you. Biden with that slack jawed confused look, looking down, off into nothing, barely moving. This is Nixon/Kennedy debate x 100.
Why are you focusing on Biden? At least he's answering the questions. Trump can't answer the correct question.
He's usually on the previous one. For one response Trump didn't answer it at all and ended early. The moderator was like "uhh you have 80 seconds left". That's dementia. Biden's hoarse throat is not.
Edit: another one "uhh sir, the question was about addiction. You have 67 seconds left."
It's already forgotten. No one cares. Biden has had a stutter since childhood. No one cares.
I understand you’re trying to do damage control. Look, most of us are still voting against Trump, but don’t piss on us and tell us it’s raining. What Biden demonstrated wasn’t a stutter, it was clearly severe cognitive decline.
Uh what? Of course he's declined. He's old, just like trump. Trump is also clearly not his former self, from 2016 or even 2020. They are old af and that's not news.
The difference is that Biden did occasionally answer the question, and his answers were pretty good. Trump barely stayed on topic, let alone made sense. After the debate I know more about what Biden wants to do and nothing about trump's policies.
For an undecided voter, Biden losing his train of thought or mumbling some words is not terrible because he always recovered on the next question. Trump started out ok but definitely ignored important questions (abortion, his criminal conviction, Ukraine, etc.). Biden said what he needed to and has room to improve in the next debate.
"Occasionally answering the questions" is not a passing grade for this debate. The minimum bar was "appear competent" and Biden couldn't pull it off. Trump didn't "win", but it's easy to see that Biden lost. I'm still going to vote blue, but Biden/Harris WILL lose us the election.
Biden must be replaced. He is no longer mentally capable of being president.
Lol, by who? You, Chungus from the peanut gallery?
Give me a break.
Did he? Were they? I couldn't understand most of what he said because he was hoarse and lost his train of thought often enough that what I could make out was hard to follow.
Biden didn't stutter when he was Obama's VP and his brain was still intact. Seems like everyone but you cares.
He did. He was also known as a gaffe machine. Just because you didn't notice doesn't mean everyone else didn't.
This was the only part I saw because of someone posting a clip. Jesus Fucking Christ, the man is full fledged potato
All the post-debate commentary basically says everyone they're hearing from in the party and undecided voters were like... yeah, we are fucked.
They have even made the point that he's not technically the nominee until the convention twice so far. I.e., we need a new candidate.
And it CAN'T BE KAMALA.
The problem is that the debate doesn’t really change much… except for low information and undecided voters. They don’t know what Trump is spewing and whether it’s a lie or not. When he makes up wild claims that Biden is unanimously declared worst president in history, they don’t know that’s a lie, or that Trump is lying about capping the price of insulin or the existence of 9 month elective abortions, etc. Trump’s confident lies actually win over a lot of undecided people who don’t do any research into the topic.
I served in the military, this made me sad for our country. I'm angry at Trump and embarrassed for Biden.
Trump keeps dodging questions by going back to the previous topic. It gives him as much time to talk as he wants. And then he doesn't have to spend as much time on the issues where he is weaker.
What a great line to go to commercial on. "Something snapped when you lost". Probably one of Biden's best moments
The elimination of the First Past the Post voting system would allow voters to support third-party candidates without the fear of causing a spoiler effect. This change would promote greater competition in elections, improving the caliber of candidates available to all voters. Also, it is likely to boost voter turnout and increase political engagement.
Electoral reform has already been achieved at the state level; Alaska and Maine have successfully implemented changes to their electoral systems, demonstrating that broader reform is feasible.
However, Republicans have taken steps to preserve the First Past the Post voting system. For instance, Florida recently outlawed Ranked Choice voting. Despite this setback, there are numerous alternatives to First Past the Post, ensuring that bans like Florida’s do not obstruct progress toward electoral reform.
This raises the question: why do predominantly Democratic states continue to utilize First Past the Post voting? Why continueto use a voting system favored by Republicans? In states controlled by Democrats, there are no Republican obstacles preventing these reforms.
It is evident that Democrats recognize the shortcomings of First Past the Post voting. Mentioning third-party voting on social media often prompts numerous Democrats to caution against “wasting” votes that could inadvertently benefit Republicans. It is perplexing to acknowledge flaws in the voting system yet fail to take action to address them. Lecturing others about the drawbacks of First Past the Post voting while neglecting to pursue solutions is contradictory and counterproductive.
Here are some videos on the topic if you’d like to know more:
First Past The Post voting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo
Other electoral systems to choose from:
Alternative vote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE
Ranked Choice voting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Z2fRPRkWvY
Range Voting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3GFG0sXIig
Single Transferable Vote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8XOZJkozfI
STAR voting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-mOeUXAkV0
Mixed Member Proportional representation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QT0I-sdoSXU
I voted for Biden and I'll vote for him again to keep a fascist out of office, but it is quite clear that the best thing Democrats could do is to have Biden back out and put forth a younger charismatic candidate. Age and the excitement about someone fresh would be enough to sweep this. That's just a reflection of what polls are already telling us. The debate just started, but it's quite clear that the optics of a debate thus far are going to Trump.
100% agree. Imagine Buttigieg up there running circles around Trump.
Buttigieg, Booker, Abrams, fuck even Warren despite her age would mop the floor with Trump.
I know Warren did that goofy Indian thing, but I’ll forever remember her as the person who fights for regular citizens.
Walz. Added benefit is that Walz used to be a school teacher, he definitely knows how to deal with a child throwing a tantrum.
Wild that I got downvoted to hell like 9 months ago for suggesting such a thing
Me too, my friend. Me too.
They're just letting Trump lie about shit on stage.
Why is there no fact-checking on air? Why even have moderation if they do nothing to challenge the two?
Republicans threw a shitfit and it got cancelled.
CNN wants it's ratings cow back
I like how they also promptly stopped cutting off candidates by muting mics. Several times both talked over.
They always intended to.
His corpse would be surrounded by intelligent and decent people, all of which are more capable of governing than T**** and his fascist reality show contestants. It's unfortunate Biden didn't take his top secret brain drugs tonight, but it changes nothing for me.
Kamala Harris is neither of those things
Kamala Harris is a reincarnation of the hyena of auschwitz. Actual, factual psychopath.
That sucked, my dudes. u_u
Commercials, during the debate, how American.
God, Biden was just pathetic and old in this debate and got steamrolled by a coked up, orange fat ass old man.
Bidens closing statement wasn't strong... but nothing about his performance has been strong.
Wow, I didn't see it as I was working. It was somehow worse than I thought even after reading all the threads. Biden should not be there. I will be voting for whomever the democrats nominate because the alternative is worse, but the US is so fucked.
“The fact checkers will fix my performance,” says the guy running for president.
Underestimating Trump was the death of Hillary Clinton. This time it could be the death of free and fair elections.
You can always hide the hunt for a replacement as the hunt for VP.
So they're gonna replace Biden now right??
The gish gab is out of control. Trump didn't even answer the last question. These moderators suck.
If there wasn’t a convicted Felon on the stage right now, the mishandling by the moderators would be the biggest criminality right now.
Watching the PBS stream and they show the attack ad against Biden;
"Are you financially better off since he became president."
Is your family safer?
Is our country more secure?"
Yes to all three in my family's case.
Thanks to Democratic legislation I dodged nearly $35,000 in emergency medical expenses and instead had to only pay about $750. Thanks to the IRA legislation, I was able to invest in both solar and an energy-efficient A/C for my house for which I got 30% off through deductions that I otherwise wouldn't have obtained.
I definitely feel safer in this border state, my elections more secure, and I appreciate a leader who stands up to global tyrants.
Lol...it took 3 minutes after the debate for ABC to essentially call for Biden to step down. Finally someone said the quiet thing out loud.
That might have been the worst debate performance in the history of US presidential debates. When Kennedy won might be the only other death swing in polls like we will see tomorrow.
I can't believe his debate camp didn't work on Biden not doing that confused, slack-jawed stare all the time.
That is the expected facial expression when sharing a stage with Trump.
These gentlemen are debating each other with the confidence and energy of a 6th grade debate club. This is simultaneously the most hilarious and terrifying thing I've ever seen.
I hate everything about it. I wish it wasn’t happening. That demented orange convicted felon rapist should be in prison, not promoted from every media orifice.
I disagree Joe is going to get anything from this. But, the die is cast so - baby needs a new pair of shoes!
At the very least, it's not going to be fun for Trump. If they actually mute his ass it's going to drive him insane. I will enjoy that.
Biden is hammering home a lot of important shit. I'd say he's warmed up by now.
Though him lying that Hamas is the only group that wants war between Israel and Palestine was a disgusting, vile lie, when it's been constantly reported that Netenyahu and those around him are rabidly in favor of continuing it
Jesus Joe!
JUST TELL HIM HE HAD THE BOARDER BILL KILLED!
And that Convicted Felon and Sex Offender Treason Trump said he is going to give unlimited green cards to foreigners to work American jobs because billionaires gave him money.
He should have said both of those things every single time immigration was brought up.
"We had H2O", what is he even talking about? It's scary to realise his cult just accepts anything he says.
And then a confused attack on Trump on climate change that was so softball and not to the point... oof... Biden, why?
the best h2o. the best environmental people told him just before he jumped on the stage!
Why do we only get 90 minutes. Why do they only get 1 minute to answer. Sit the down and have an actual discussion damnit. You're trying to run a country not win a talent show. I want hear how their brains work, not their mouths.
Of course, Trump completely deflects on the climate change question.
While Biden talks more sense than Trump (not a high bar), he looks like he’s gonna drop dead any minute, and his hoarse voice isn’t helping.
If you don’t try to understand what they are actually saying, Trump sounds like the better candidate just by confidence and speaking clearly. SMH
Well, it's easy to speak strongly when you don't have to worry about what you say being in any way factual.
My god let the poor old man rest, this is senior abuse and torture at this point
I keep tuning in and out. I tune out when Trump speaks because everything he says is just such an affront to objective reality. But then I also tune out when Biden speaks because... He just comes off as so old it's making me cringe. Like, this is the best we could come up with to combat a literal fucking fascist.
Then I wonder, what part of this am I listening to? The questions?
Listen to the substance.
Debates aren't about substance unfortunately, debates are performance. That's all people take away from them. Information needs to be conveyed but it's got to be conveyed in a way that resonates.
and I say it's time to stop carrying the exact thing you're complaining about by perpetuating it
I'm not complaining about it and I don't have to perpetuate it. It's just a fact. It's not a scenario we can change. If you want it to be based on substance you should read position papers. Oratory has always and will always be performative. That will never change, because that's its nature.
Fair!
I tried muting the TV and just reading the captions for a little, and it made me a fair bit more confident in Biden. And he did have some good moments after I turned the sound back on. I'm just worried it won't be enough. Maybe it's the anxiety of realizing that we've actually reached election season.
Trump can’t lie fast enough.
This is awful without fact checking.
I hope one of the tracked statistics is Trumps lies per minute speaking.
Jesus, Trump bringing up the idea of post-birth abortion. I hope people see through it.
This debate makes me want to BE a post-birth abortion.
Yes, women can have abortions now up to 48 months.
Nah they all believe that
Enough? No.
Edit: It's really not good. He's pulled it together a bit, but there's no way around it. At least Trump unraveled to his usual form. It would've been worse if he kept his composure he had in the first 15 minutes. My heart sank when Joe looked like he was watching cartoons dance around the room and TRUMP was the cool and reserved candidate.
He got a little more energetic, but not enough, really.
Not really. Still muttering.
No, not really. He still looks confused and is still muttering.
His performance has improved tremendously, but the damage may have already been done. I’m wondering how many people kept watching past the first 20 minutes.
Agreed. One strategist on PBS pre-debate show put it succinctly: "The debate is won or lost in the first 30 minutes."
I made it about five minutes. Embarrassing to watch Biden stumble around and Trump just non-stop lie as usual.
Yes. Stop helping the fash.
https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-misinformation-election-debate-trump-biden-577507522762aa10f6ee5be3a0ced2bb
This is promising. Trump just lies (surprised face), Biden just exaggerates or makes small speaking errors. (Among all the brain farts and studdering)
I watched some of it. Super embarrassing for Biden. Added all the fodder Fox needs to make edits and clips until the end of time.
I hope the fact that the current SCOTUS just legalized bribery comes up.
Trump will be advertising.
Welp I'm going to find a bridge and throw myself off of it.
I am a European who has just woken up and started watching the news. I think it is a good time to look for alternatives to NATO
Of All the debates ever of all time, this has certainly been one
Biden is a manchurian candidate says the guy sucking putins dick
Did Trump call Biden a criminal?
Multiple times.
There’s literally no fact checking going on by the moderators. This is so dumb.
Also, Biden seems to be warming up.
Thank God. Biden did not look good. Trump can just spew lies and do it loudly and it makes him look good even though what Trump is saying is nonsense and lies.
Glad of that, but the format is just awful. I couldn't stand it anymore and bowed out.
I'm tapping out for my sanity
That was disappointing.
This is elder abuse. How did we end up with these two candidates?
I can't wait to find out tomorrow how it's pro-Palestinian protestors fault that Biden can't speak above a whisper.
“I don’t think he knows what he said either.”
That was a fucking kill shot.
It just goes to show, that rhetoric and charisma are important. They aren't the only important thing, but Jesus, if you have good points to make but can't make them properly, you will be bulldozed.
Yup.
Two words: brokered convention.
I almost wonder if Biden's staff suggested this super early pre-convention debate so he would be forced to acknowledge he needs to step down. I can't see any other explanation.
The right thing to do would be for Biden to step down. The smart thing to do would be a brokered convention. Neither will happen. This is a disaster.
There's about six weeks to the convention. That's enough time but barely. Harris will want to take the top spot, and maybe she should, but Newsome is the one that could beat Trump, maybe.
What a disaster.
Kamala would lose. She’s too transparently fake. Give me Newsom.
I think Whitmer is the better choice. It locks up Wisconsin and brings in the woman vote. It's also an aspirational vote, like Obama was in 2008.
That didn't help Clinton, obviously, but Whitmer is no Clinton (in a good way).
That would be an interesting outcome. I doubt it, but if it were to happen, I don't think it would have been planned, just a panic reaction.
I think he just pooped his depends
Biden is really struggling to communicate. Likely will only get worse as time goes on. The fascist is much more eloquent. When selling something, its usually better to be well spoken. When doing something, its usually better to keep your mouth shut and hands busy
The nail in the coffin
[I want to believe.jpeg]
Fuck you Frank! ;)
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Fuck%20you%20Frank
Oh yeah, Frank is highly flawed; but his new “job” as an undecided focus group “expert” gives me a little hope.
Welp. Good thing we had this debate early enough for everyone to forget about it.
Oh shit. The height and weight comment was amazing.
So, does this mean we'll have an even larger conservative SCOTUS majority?
This should have been on CSPAN.
Take a shot anytime someone says “by the way”. No one will have to vote because we’ll all be dead
I'm on my second beer of the night, does a six pack of Modelo have enough alcohol to kill me? I'm small if that helps.
Did they change the formula ratio for modelo, it doesn’t taste the same anymore for me? I’m currently searching for a new amber lager.
Now they’re talking about golf handicaps, we’re screwed.
Maybe if you actually take it as a shot... like a syringe.
In some weird alternate universe where we have a 3rd party candidate, that candidate is killing it. I have redneck neighbors that would look qualified standing next to these two.
Even the brain worms guy?
That's why they're not allowed to participate.
Oh my lord, I will never, ever understand how and why Democrats argued that Biden was "the more electable" candidate. This is painful.
To the people who are calling Biden "toast" three minutes into the debate: Fuck off.
First impressions matter. Most people won't watch the debate. Of the people that do, most people won't watch all of it. He isn't doing a good job.
It sounds like trump won. And that is enough sadly. Its over for the country.
Yup checkmate. America was a good experiemnt while it lasted.
Trump is literally insulting him to his face and all he can do is look old and stupid. Fuck this.
Coming up next: 40 years of dystopian Fascism. This is going to suck so much for people still in their 20's. My advice is to start organizing the Resistance RIGHT NOW. I am absolutely stunned to see the most successful country in the world completely collapse in a single day.
Not in a single day by a long shot - this has been decades in the making.
It was bad.
He's given one bad answer. His first answer and responses were good. A sore throat isn't a reason to declare his candidacy over.
I tapped out 10 minutes into it. I just couldn't take it anymore. I'm sure I'm not the only one. And let me tell you, those first 10 minutes looked BAD
I've since learned that Biden warmed up after that first ten minutes, so I went back and watched some of it, and it's true. His performance was never great, but he did ok and got in a few solid hits.
I think he's old, he's tired, the format sucked, and he's not my first choice... But I'll still vote for him over the orange felon.
FUCK YOU.
Does Biden sound sick to anybody else? Like he has a sore throat?
To me he sounds like his throat is sore from talking. He's been campaigning a lot.
Outlets are confirming he was sick
Really? Source?
Dude, Google “Biden cold”. The Hill, Politico, WSJ, NBC, all have articles on it
Fair. Found multiple sources. Well, that's actually a bit of a relief. If he was genuinely sick last night, that explains the hoarse voice, especially early on.
He sounds like shit and I assume that's what's going to stick, not the actual content of his words. Great. 🙄
The words are really weak too. Biden's stutter and aphasia are fucking him as he tries to figure out what lie to respond to first.
Might have been practicing too much this week. Not that it shows.
Good lord all trump does is do “this guy over here…” bs and drags up every right wing meme piece of “fact”, and they’re all garbage.
It’s all right-wing terminally-online stream of consciousness…
Good news. Biden might be getting angry enough to go super Saiyan. Won't be good for the talking points but those are out the window with the endless lies anyway.
If he gets angry enough to get some more strength into his voice and inflection, who knows, he might not crash completely. It seems a little different than in the beginning at least right now.
I really wish Americans weren't ignorant enough to fall for someone who looks better on TV even though they're a convicted felon who tried to undermine and overthrow a free and fair election, but history tells me otherwise.
I seriously hope there are high level discussions within the Democratic party and with Biden about putting someone else forward.
This just makes me so uncomfortable. Trump isn't going to win this election, Biden is going to lose it.
Trump still doesn't understand tariffs.
Neither do his voters.
It is just Bullshit bullshit bullshit out of Trump. It's fucking wild.
Biden has to bring up Trump killing the border bill for political reasons. That should have been a top 3 talking point.
So Trump's going to be reelected. I don't even know if I want to keep watching this this is just sad
Sooooooo... if this is what has finally shaken your faith in American bourgeoisie democracy, good news (sorta)! Alternatives exist, although the struggle to achieve them will be long and arduous. Our current system of propping up billionaire-approved octogenarians to give
our stolen wealthtax breaks and investment incentives to defense contractors, cops, and landlords exists very explicitly to preserve a system of private property that keeps you poor and desperate.The alternative to this is to build class consciousness and working class power in order to contest this awful system and put political and economic power directly in the hands of the working class before our impending environmental collapse. Join an organization that exists locally that's building that working class power. Seriously, don't even get caught up on which -ism best fits you, just join whatever exists locally that you can contribute to. Democratic Socialists of America, the Party for Socialism and Liberation, Socialist Alternative, the Industrial Workers of the World, Food Not Bombs, even a small community mutual aide network that supports a few of your unhoused neighbors.
This debate should be your wake-up call. The state is a fuck and you're just a sacrificial pawn in a system designed to funnel wealth upwards. It's a big club and you ain't in it.
They lowered expectations for Trump way too much.
And if Biden doesn’t get it together immediately, it’s time to consider a new candidate. This is a disaster so far.
Agreed.
Let’s say Biden doesn’t make it to the election. Who would the democrats put forward? Harris?
Harris would likely be the DNC pick and she has a lower favorability rating than Biden.
Yeah. It is a rock and a hard place. On the one hand, replacing her is acknowledging Biden administration failed. On the other hand, she is a brown she.
But his administration hasn't failed. It's been immensely successful.
Replacing Biden with a cop would be the most DNC thing imaginable. We're so fucked.
Gavin Newsome has been positioning himself to be able to run.
This abortion response started good... and then he just lost it. My god he's so fucking old.
Biden is basically the cryptkeeper, but there’s a good president in there when he’s not losing his train of thought.
Trump was supposed to be weaker, but he’s doing his homework and memorizing answers. His freedom is on the line. Trump has been underestimated, and as things stand, he’s probably going to win.
Great answer for Biden on Ukraine and NATO. Hopefully, he’s starting to wake up.
I'm kind of reminded of that West Wing episode, where Leo McGarry keeps leaking stories about how bad he's going to be. That seem to be exactly what Trump did this last week or two. Or the people around Trump probably. Cuz as much as he's lying piece of shit he's staying on his message, which admittedly I wasn't sure he could do. On the other hand Joe Biden is a train wreck. This is extremely demoralizing.
His message is blatant lies and ignoring the prompt.
Biden is debating. trump is giving an unhinged speech.
Yeah of course that's his message, what are you new here?
“Ushered in by the police” CNN is a failed news organization for allowing this to be said unchallenged
Well my stomach hurts after watching that. Open convention for dessert anyone?
Ouch. That last one hurt. Biden started strong on that answer, but lost the thread.
Biden is not speaking well and is making a number of mis-statements and wavering.
Trump is the personification of confidentlywrong, but he's speaking much more strongly.
Yep. Hoping we see some of the Biden we had for the SOTU.
Afraid to watch thanks for summarizing for me yall lol
Stop with the data. Joe! Short and sweet because your stutter hits.
“You are a child.”
A moment of unscripted honesty.
...Both presidential candidates did an old man stroll to their podiums. Joes pointed at his like, is it this one? And Trump walked with the confidence of a man with one podium to pick from.
Stop with the stories, Joe! Keep it simple!
Right wing fascists are taking hold around the world. And the countries holding out are juicy targets for a military needing a win
Listening to more of the analysis and clips from the debate, Biden's performance reminded me of high school and college presentations where students over-prepared by following a very rigid, memorized script but derail because they forget a single key word or trigger. This isn't a very robust presentation strategy that can easily fail even with younger minds, let alone someone in their 80s.
Joe studdered, and it broke his rhythm.
Joe needs a glass of water.
He needs to clam down too. He's all over the place.
Joe is pissed, I think. He can’t get the rebuttals out quick enough and it’s messing up his composure. That’s the problem though, trump tells so many lies so fast that Biden simply cannot cover them all.
Agreed. He's not putting on a good showing.
Biden is on point for the topics, where Trump is just full of shit, but he needs to slow down. One might think he really is on some kind of speed.
Don't worry, after the debate they'll give him a plate of creamed corn and a bingo card.
This format really, really sucks. None of the answers can actually be thorough.
The short sound bites are exactly what Trump is best at.
They are also actively ignoring the structure to catch all the trump sound bites.
CNN is fucking us all
My man Biden needs a drink of water.
Ugh. I can't watch this shit anymore. This format is making it impossible to even follow a single answer. It's awful. Good luck, folks.
Trump is flailing now. It’s a double sundown debate.
We need another epidemic at this point.
Pneumonias been a mother fucker around here recently
Oh, we’re leading into trump word salad. He’s just spooling off stream of consciousness of trump great + Biden bad and he just strings together whatever thoughts pop into his head. That’s all he’s got.
Well, Biden's Charlottesville attack on Trump wasn't too bad all things considered, Trump did deflect of course, but maybe it invigorated the old fart.
Biden got fucking body slammed in this debate. It doesn't matter that Trump is nonsensical. No one expected him to make sense. Biden just looked weak, confused, and mumbled his way through most of the debate.
I can't see how this possibly convinced anyone to vote for Biden. But I can definitely see how it probably demoralized democratic voters. This is just so awkward to watch.
But the DNC said Biden was fine all the time and he wasn't senile
MSNBC ran live footage of the Bidens at the post-debate watch party... WHY THE FUCK DID HE NOT SOUND LIKE THAT DURING THE DEBATE?
This might be good, he pissed off Trump, now Trump is going off on his paranoia. If he keep him in that mode, that might help.
How long is this debate? 90min?
Yup! 90 minutes, so another 1/2 an hour.
Biden really needs a glass of water
They start so well and like they're going to make a solid point and then it devolves into belligerence or mumbling.
“This guy is stupid” is the rebuttal trump uses most.
Hi everyone. I am sick of the culture war. I wish boomers would stop watching the news. Have a nice day
https://youtu.be/djzR7594I1U#t=3m33s
All you get is today
Try to see it that way
Don't hold on too tight
Loosen your shoes
Don't listen to news
That keeps you up at night
Don't try to explain
Try not to complain
No one really cares
And don't try to find your place in line 'cause it's everywhere...
You don't need to find your place in line 'cause it's everywhere.
I'll be at work and avoiding the break room. I live in Utah where my options for candidates are usually "Über-Mormon Tr*mp Fascist" or "Obviously Mormon Fiscal Conservative Wealth Gospel Hate the Poor" or "Token Democrat who would shove a homeless person in front of a bus evangelical."
I'll catch the memes afterwards.
This is just embarrassing. I can't believe Biden is the democratic nominee.
I can't believe these are our choices. We get to pick between quiet and mumbling or loud and belligerent.
No, we’re also choosing who they will be surrounded by in charge of departments. Biden will have sane people in charge, Trump will have Project 2025.
“Trump admits he suffers from cardiomegaly”
Dammit joe. Say "you've decimated the middle class, and that's demonstrated by the fact that you can't even address the question of how you'll help people struggling to pay for childcare even when you were given two chances."
Right?
STOP WITH THE STORY! JUST SAY:
"I will do everything I can. My opponent wont."
"he is lying. He hurt the middle class. All of them want to vote for me"
There is no win here. Anyone with a brain knows this is a shit show. The rest just want a strong man fascist.
Biden needs a Smith Brothers Cough Drop or Sucrets.
RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICOLA!
Trump and Biden take the stage.
Everyone in America swallows an edible.
"president xi of China" versus "Putin".
Orange fuck has a new sugar daddy and he loves him some honey
Will be interesting to see how many dozens of comments we get here tonight.
Felon!
Its over, we lost. Biden lost to fucking trump. I want to blow my brains out right now.
enjoy your fascist hellscape pal
It's everyone's problem, lol.
Fascists don't stop at their borders.
We should assume Biden will do well in the debate and get as many eye balls watching it as possible. If you know people who might otherwise not watch the debate, consider sending them the how to watch link. Biden needs the debate win for his campaign where as Trump would prefer if everyone tuned out. It would be a missed opportunity if no one watches.
I'm sure people will be watching to see if Biden pulls a Mitch McConnell freeze or if Trump devolves into his mumble-core slurred speech.
Where it gets interesting is if none of that happens.
I still expect Trump to be yelling even if his microphone is muted, we'll probably hear him through the other micrpphones.
Yeah, I think there will be people watching for that. I think they both will be trying to avoid that though so I doubt that we'll see much of that. Also, the muted mics were a good call. Even if Trump does start shouting Biden should have no problem talking over him.
There might be a lot of people who aren't paying attention still. So I would rather not be quiet. We won't know for sure until the election, but it still seems reasonable that we are sleep walking into fascism. =(
I will say, this debate has the bigger potential to hurt Biden than Trump.
If Biden has a freeze moment, it will be clear he can't continue.
Trump could literally drop trou and shit on the stage and his audience not only wouldn't care, they'd cheer him for shitting on CNN.
This debate has the potential to hurt or help Biden. Biden needs a win. People need to be energized about his campaign, because he needs high voter turn out to win the election. A loss for Biden, a neutral performance, or no one watching, in this debate all functionally do the same thing. Any of those cases is a missed opportunity. Biden skating by in this debate isn't going to cut it.
Trump succeeds when other people fail, so Biden's performance will matter more than whatever Trump does. Trump has a cult. Since there won't be a live audience, he could put a cap in Jake Tapper and Dana Bash and his supporters would cheer. So this debate isn't really for the MAGA crowd. It's for the rest of us.
I'm going to be incredibly frustrated if the headlines for the coverage after the debate is 'no one watched', because that can only help Trump.
It gets really interested if both happen simultaneously and we as a nation have to all just sit in awkward silence for 3 minutes wondering how we got here.
Just FYI, you can also watch it on YouTube on the USA Today channel.
Did Trump just lament that we couldn't "stop Israel"?
I assume he meant "what happened in Israel" lol
Biden looks and sounds like absolute shit. And he's mumbling and running all his sentences together. Sounds like a kid giving a speech in high school.
Looks like the skin on his face is trying to meet his feet. Just cramming as many talking points as his been trained to memorize as possible into his 3 minutes.
We talking ‘bout golf handicaps???
Trump is becoming more incoherent. Biden at least is staying consistent.
Immigration talking-points for Biden:
"I tried passing the strongest border security bill in decades, and your party blocked it"
"White American citizens commit more crime than undocumented immigrants. Let's worry about the right-wing extremists already inside our country that the FBI warned us about."
"These immigrants actually help keep food prices lower. Donald doesn't seem to care that this action on this overblown fearmongering will make your grocery bill even higher."
"Let's focus on the big fish like Russia, Saudi Arabia, Japan, and Chinese foreign nationals buying large swaths of American soil. Heck even the King of Jordan owns beach front Malibu mansions that subtracts from the average America's chance at the American dream."
Is the stream awful for anyone else? USA Today feed is skipping and going blank.
PBS feed seems to be good. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n89KRvz6Tdw&pp=ygUKY25uIGRlYmF0ZQ%3D%3D
Thanks, that's much better.
Goddamnit Biden is toast
Good first answer from Biden. Trump starting off with lies about the economy.
I think the fact that Trump managed to actually not get mic-cut and generally didn't fly off the handle probably works in his favor as well. A bar so low you can trip over it.
Thanks Obama and capitalism. Without the Obama's behind the scenes phone call bullshit intervention in the last primary which ended up giving us Biden we would have had Bernie as the president and none of this would have happened.