SpaceX executives worried Elon Musk was on drugs during 'cringeworthy' all-hands meeting, WSJ reports
The Journal reported executives at SpaceX worried Elon Musk was on drugs after an "unhinged" all-hands meeting in which he slurred and rambled.
https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-drug-use-cringeworthy-spacex-meeting-wsj-2024-1Open linkView original on kbin.social865
Comments242
This is the way he’s always been and it’s only getting worse.
Employees have always had to manage him not the other way around; a perpetual petulant toddler banging his hands on the table; ruining everything he touches with his Reverse-Midas-Touch so they keep him at bay.
This is increasingly the characterization of so many rich and powerful people.
Soooo weird…
If you have money, then in the business world you have intrinsic value.
When you have enough, you reach the tipping point where it doesn't just need to be the only thing you provide, but it outweighs others ways you hurt the business.
The less your ideas are useful and the more money you hoard, the faster it changes.
It can go quickly downhill when the CEOs wealth is tied to stock price.
And ends disastrously when they go somewhere that workers aren't used to them. Because the CEO was never told they used to be babysat just for their money, they legit believe they're a genius
It's impressive then that the starship stack is stainless steel not carbon. Musk planned a giant carbon fibre rocket. The engineers he hired got him to change size and change material
You have to think who gets that wealthy and is like "Let's go to work!" You have to be psychotic to have more wealth than you can ever spend and not go fuck off somewhere and enjoy it. I would never go back to a job even if I was running the place, I'd just do whatever I wanted to do for the rest of my life.
See, idk if I could do that the rest of my life. I'm dreading retirement, even though it's a long way off, as I have no idea how I'll handle it...
I could do maybe a month of nothing then I start getting antsy and depressed. Working gives structure to my life, and while I really hate getting up and going to it, it's better for me than the alternative...even when I don't have to worry about money.
No, but I'm neither rich nor a narcissistic prick, just a regular asshole.
Always thought Musk was a piece of shit, glad my initial thought is being proven correct.
I feel you. On the other hand, you might find something different to pass/spend your time with. Maybe you return to your job. Maybe you start a new company, maybe you start to do arts and crafts, or...
I feel you. On the other hand, you might find something different to pass/spend your time with. Maybe you return to your job. Maybe you start a new company, maybe you start to do arts and crafts, or...
That’s a pretty sad revelation. We’ve been so beaten down that we can’t imagine being happy pursuing whatever we’d like to do day after day without “creating value.”
And we only get this one go at life. One life to live and we’ve been so sapped of the entire concept of “living” that work is our life. How sad that is.
It just seems crazy. I don’t know, it just feels so wrong to hear people think this way.
Ehhhh. I'm a Stone Mason working in conservation, my job is really satisfying and rewarding. I enjoy my work generally, and passing on the skills to the next generation is an extra bonus feel good. I wish I was able to structure my own life enough to not want to go to work if I was independently wealthy, but currently struggling with possibly adhd or autism spectrum stuff, and while I would love to be able to work on stuff for myself I need external structure....
Yes, I know that last sentence was a bit fucky, I'm in bed and lazy, not changing it.
Get some hobbies.
Like building things? Have a workshop that you go to to keep routine and build things for fun.
Yeah, I'm a Stone Mason. Guess I could make faerie castles out of pebbles....
Generations of inbreeding will do that to you.
Birds of a feather got to stick together.
And yet yall make it sound like a bad thing
We call it the Mierdas Touch.
Phony Stark and his Mierdas Touch. nice
I enjoy it, but I prefer calling him Terrence Howard because he's a fake iron man who is going to be replaced.
Mr. “If one times one equals one that means that two is of no value because one times itself has no effect. One times one equals two because the square root of four is two, so what’s the square root of two? Should be one, but we’re told it’s two, and that cannot be.” Terryology Howard?
Refuting thousands of years of knowledge and science and saying we’ve, ‘been doing math wrong this whole time’ takes a whole nutter level of nutter.
See? He and Elon need to get together and compare science notes. Imagine the new Tesla/SpaceX Cyber Rocket Truck those two could come up with together!
@cybervseas @Uglyhead Ah, a fellow shitty pun connoisseur
And I thought Twitter was going to be his biggest fuck up.
And of course, businessinsider doesn't blame the rich guy... they blame the 'snitch'
Did we read the same article? Can you point out where you think they're "blaming the snitch?"
They actually are referencing a different article, this one I believe :
https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-tesla-ceo-denies-drug-use-allegations-2024-1
Elon be like: Fuck them.
Fuck Them! They can’t blackmail me to stop taking drugs!
—Musk, probably
More like "me" if he really loses money because of some of his actions
Really though, what's the point of having "fuck you" money if you don't tell people "I don't care. Fuck you" every once in a while? (Or.... daily)
I always thought of "fuck you" money as a statement being made up the chain. Saying "fuck you" to all the employees below him is not cool.
the point of having "fuck you" money is that you can say "fuck you" to anyone and it won't impact you. If you would like to say it to the people up the chain, that's fine. If you'd like say it to someone else, that's fine too. Who gives a shit? You certainly don't. You've got "fuck you" money.
I don't think Twitter was a fuck up. It's likely he had $20B or something insane in cap gains (maybe from selling Tesla shares or other investments).
He took Twitter private sold it on paper to same private shareholders, now can claim $17B or whatever it is in losses. Now he pays nothing in taxes, has one of the largest Internet mouthpieces he can use to sway elections, etc. The only people who took losses are banks he used to swing purchase and the twitter landlord he is refusing to pay.
Musk tried everything possible not to buy twitter, and now it's worth 20bn less.
I wouldn't call a planned success.
I mean, it single-handedly ruined everyone's understanding of who he is and what he can do in the most humiliating ways imaginable. But if you want to spin it as a tax write off supermove, okay. It can be two things I guess.
We can excuse the racism, the transphobia, and the antisemitism, but we draw the line at drugs!
Don't you see? All of those other things were BECAUSE of the drugs! It's exactly like what happened to Roseanne and her Ambiens!
He's always been a racist, homophobic, sociopathic capitalist. Aligning with fascists is the trajectory of most like him. The drugs just make it more obvious..
(Yes is read the /s but I still felt an opportunity to get a jab in because fuck this guy)
Anyone else would be fired for coming into work while high.
Oh, they're probably okay with certain drugs, but slurring speech indicates he's taking the wrong kind.
This is different from normal?
Also:
How much do you want to bet those dogs are never allowed up in the executive suites?
What kind of company has such a bad drug problem that they need to bring in dogs to find it? Absolutely ridiculous.
I'd probably be shooting up junk too if my boss was Elon Musk.
In normal corporate environments I’ve seen people abuse everything from codeine headache tablets to crystal meth.
Not defending Edolf Twitler, I’m just saying it’s not unusual for these environments to be so toxic that people look for ways to manage.
I don't find the drug use abnormal so much as them bringing in drug sniffing dogs to catch it rather than dealing with it on an individual basis.
Probably less for actually finding drugs than for checking a tickbox on an insurance form for "taking measures to combat drugs" or something. It's probably just Ricky from HR's dobie-doodle mix.
that's the best I've seen since Adolf Musk
I don't think it's that they had such a rampant drug use problem. I think it's just that they wanted to appease Uncle Sam so they could keep sucking on that taxpayer teat. Uncle Sam's a bit of a stickler about such things, especially when it comes to people who build rocket ships.
It's always projection.
Elon takes care of all the drug sniffing in there personally. No need for dogs.
Well the smart money can only go inverse, and tripling down with a "I'll see your bet and raise it 500%" that a drug dog absolutely will find a shit ton of drugs in the executive areas. I'd take out the largest loan I possibly could, then go to a loan shark and do a blood contract, and absolutely muster every possible cent I possibly could after whoring my own ass out, on THAT bet.
Can we make bets on how successful you will be?
Sure, just as soon as I find where I could make that bet.
Guys let's not make taking drugs look even worse by association it with that guy
Drugs are the innocent bystander here.
I don't know, this might make a few kids skip taking drugs. Maybe his cringeworthyness is finally doing something good.
Explains....soooo much. Still an asshole, though.
That’s a good point. He’s clearly not taking enough
Sounds like the man is really bored with his life and all he has left are drugs to keep him entertained
I mean, with that kinda dough, you kinda run out of normal things to do.
Drugs are probably the most normal thing he does.
Which is why dumbasses pay millions to go see the wreck of the titanic and have pedo orgies in private islands.
Yeah, and sure he can pass a drug test if you consider:
LSD: 12 hour wash-out time for a blood test
Cocaine: 24 hour wash-out time for a blood test
MDMA: 24-36 hour wash-out time for a blood test
Ketamine: 24 hour wash-out time for a blood test, and it's easy to get a prescription for off-label use to treat depression
So basically, do all the drugs you want Friday night, by Monday morning you'll be clean enough for a blood test.
You think musk worried about drug tests? Interesting.
What are they gonna do? Fire him?
Isn't that a queens of the stone age song
It doesn't explain why I can sense an OD on him soon
Only if you got into his stash of lsd again,
He was on Rogan smoking a joint. Not that weed is a particularly harmful drug but I bet you would catch 0 other CEOs doing it so brazenly.
Only one of those is physically addictive, and the withdrawal can kill ya.
100% an upper or “microdosing” on a hallucinogen. Just a nibble of psilocybin every day before impregnating a secretary and after bed.
This is entirely unrelated, aside from the stupidity of the subject, but I’m reminded of that fella who repeatedly injected mushrooms to try to get high. He sterilized the mushrooms by boiling, then blended, loaded into a hypo, and slowly plunged the mixture into his arm. He ended up with a complete systemic fungal infection but survived. I wish Musk would get creative with it.
Nightmare fuel, or back story for a superhero... idk.
What does his glabella have to do with anything?
Wait, you're telling me he's not on drugs 24/7?
No. We're saying the SpaceX board is not on enough of them. Because they're going to light up the whole business by leaving him in place rather than figuring out what it's going to take to launch him into the sun. I mean remove him.
The guy was a decent salesman, heavilly empowered by daddy's money and connections, who had a bit of luck, even though he only had one kind of salesmanship technique - the Techbro Brew: heavy on selling "high-tech" and "innovation" as inherently good and always trumphing other considerations - and kept walking the grey legal area between lies, exageration and Fraud.
However he seems to have started believing his own schtick that he's a special golden boy whose farts smell of roses, and here we are now.
Know this: having that amount of money is deeply not normal. None of us could do it. We'd save people. We'd build things that helped instead of giant toys. Billionaires are a type of sociopathy. And this guy's got it bad.
100% tax after 999 million. Full stop.
Exactly. Musk and Trump are the poster children for why you shouldn't leave your kids everything if you're wealthy. It'll ruin their lives and the lives of their children.
Not trying to defend excessive wealth, but Trump and Musk were both ruined by their fathers.
The regular model for self aware billionaires is to keep your head down. How much do you know about the Johnson and Johnson heirs? Or the Walmart heirs? They know their necks will be on the chopping block is they're well known and a revolution comes.
"One tiny step for mankind and one giant leap for me personally" -- Jason Alexander during a skit about piece of shit billionaires making dick shaped rockets going out into space.
The irony of course is Jason, Jerry, Julia, and Larry are all billionaires.
edit: apparently Jason only has a net worth of 50 mil despite being on the most popular sitcom of all time and the comparative net worths of his colleagues. I guess he got nothing on the back end for syndication. Shitty.
Julia was rich before Seinfeld even aired.
Larry and Jerry definitely got paid but I doubt either of them are billionaires.
edit: She's the daughter of French-born business magnate Gérard Louis-Dreyfus.
In comparison, that's absolutely shitty and I agree. On the other hand I look at his net worth though and it reminds me of a recent article about Tesla's cofounders, and how out of 5 only two "got rich". Within that same article the guy with the lowest net worth was still worth 200 million. Jason's hilarious and I love his work, but at the same time if he "only" is worth 50 mil, congrats to the guy for getting rich anyway.
Good point though about the irony of it.
Musk spent a lot of money trying to teach people that that doesn't work.
He's a billionaire because he owns the majority of Tesla and Tesla is very valuable. He has no taxable income unless he draws a salary or liquidates some of his Tesla shares
He demonstrated it by liquidating some shares and getting a tax bill
Billionaire spending money comes from a deal with a bank - the billionaire gets as much credit as they like, the bank is paid back by their estate upon death
So chatgpt doesn't know what a fart is?
As a large language model I cannot weaponize bodily emissions in order to diminish others.
The #2 law
The image generator doesn't know how to spell, basically. It's trying to create the word farts based on all the times it's seen it in an image.
chatgpt is like Jon Snow
I have a couple of acquaintances that are PayPal Mafia and what I've put together from them and anecdotes around the Valley is pretty much spot on what you've got here. He's not special. Life just had a course that worked out for his douche ass.
So id wager he is an asset of the intel community.
He’s pretty highly valued by the incel community too
I^2^
Lmao didnt see this when I wrote the same under my sibling comment a second ago. 100%
I'd typically respond "aren't they all?" But the MF has more money than God. I really don't know what to make of him. I think he's just a legitimate piece of shit incel king edge lord who lost the thread and doesn't know he's no longer just a troll. Maybe the daddy issues are so bad he cant see his own power. Why else act like this?
He grew up as a child of an emrald miner in South Africa under the aparthied regieme.
Super rich kid in a historically notoriiously dehumanizing society.
Its like perfect conditions for a narcisistic mental disorder.
So im not really suprised by his bizzare conservative appeals against poor people, employees, regulators and the like.
Comic books need villains too.
Nailed it. They always think they're the victim hero saving us from ourselves. Who needs Kang and Doc Oc when you have jabronis like this guy and orangeman
Yeah, that's the problem. Honestly, a lot of people would do this. That's why corporations are supposed to have checks and balances.
I will admit, him being on drugs did not occur to me as a possible explanation for his 'taking tesla private' tweet that torpeedoed his networth, but having been confronted by it now I am having a hard time not believing it.
Just FYI
Means "We have no source for this and are probably making it up"
Business Insider is a tabloid shitrag these days
Just FYI, "according to people familiar with the matter" generally means people who are speaking on background and asked to have their identifies protected. I guarantee you that the reporters and their editor(s) know the people involved and have good reason to believe they're familiar with the situation and are reliable sources of information.
Were it a respectable publication I'd agree, but Business Insider has gone rapidly downhill the last couple of years, and is now Daily-Mail-Level tripe
So is the Wall Street Journal also “Daily Mail level tripe”? Because they are the Business Insider’s source for the story.
SO POST THAT THEN AND STOP GIVING BUSINESS INSHITER CLICKS 😂
Did you just miss the reply to you where I said point blank I linked to BI instead of WSJ because of a paywall, or naw?
OP already said they did that to avoid the paywall.
Attacks the source. Then attacks the publication. Then complains further despite that this publication link is just to avoid linking the original paywalled article (from a publication you apparently trust) wherein the same sources provide the same info.
You could have just downvoted and moved along, but instead gestures all around thread.
This is based on a Wall Street Journal report (which I didn’t link because it’s paywalled), so your strange anger at BI is a wee bit misplaced.
Dude is hanging out in a dedicated misogyny porn community.
10 to 1 a MuskRat and just angry his man is being talked about badly.
"Hey there nice post. Unfortunately, here is some bullshit I dug up from your comment history which clearly demonstrates that you are unworthy of expressing your opinion"
Not defending that guy, just really wish this type of behavior would just die along with the rest of r*ddit already. Something something ad hominem falacy
Oh I tend agree, if I was arguing directly against him it would be foul.
However looking through peoples past comments and where they tend to hang out can infer a lot about the person.
No. Media bullshit is sitting at the core of a lot of today's problems and the massive polarisation on basically any topic.
Anger at low level journalism rags and even more at outlets trying to look respectable while actually having a similiar quality (and that definitely includes Business Insider ever since they were bought by the shithole of journalism that is Axel Springer SE) cannot be misplaced at all.
I mean, I'm all on board with anger at BI. It's not that. It's the WSJ article is the OP topic, it's like ranting about Star Trek at a Star Wars convention. Not that it's wrong, just misplaced or at least out of context.
And? Its only a crime when regular people do it, for rich people its just 'eccentric'
Until it starts hurting the other rich people- the investors. Eventually, Musk's erratic behavior will have to be dealt with. He will never be anything but a multibillionaire, but he may not be CEO of his companies much longer at this rate.
Has there ever been an all-hands meeting where the CEO was not cringeworthy?
I just assume it's the minimum amount of yearly cringe you have to endure to stay employed.
I've been in some. Plenty of small companies with CEOs
If a C-level meeting ends up getting more than average press coverage, it turned into cringe.
Hasn't he been relatively open about his habitual micro and macro dosing of ketamine?
There's a world of difference between a micro and a macro dose. You don't want to be anywhere near work with the latter.
The difference being, with one you get a light, pleasant, happy, drunk adjacent feeling. With the other, you're sitting on the ground staring into the infinite void of nothingness, head lolled to one side, while your friends dab the back of your neck with a cool towel, hoping you don't puke and asphyxiate on it.
I'd argue that once you are feeling effects of the drug, you are no longer micro dosing.
Micro dosing started out as a way to describe the maximum amount of substance you could take without feeling primary effects.
Yeah the whole thing is dumb. Let me eat as many mushrooms as I can without tripping balls so I can kinda work and think I'm a genius. That was hard enough to balance with weed in the office. Real drugs?? Are you fucking kidding me?? Worst case, nothing happens. "Best case," I lose my career??? No thanks man. Maybe I'll use them to clear my head on a Friday alone and use the sober new perspective on Monday. During work with no upside??? Nobody has to drive during the day??? End old man rant
Ketamine driving can't possibly be safe.
Neither is Tesla's Full Self Driving feature
I know that the rules for spravato (esketamine nasal spray, for depression) include no driving until after you’ve had a full night’s sleep.
I didn't drive regularly when I was younger and fucked around. But both then and sober old man now, I couldn't fathom driving within 48 hours of any drugs. Even day after drinking, it's not safe.. if you're drinking until last call, tomorrow isn't tomorrow
Jfc, driver might as well be asleep
Slightly Fuzzy but not stoned is my go-to with dosing.
But as your body builds up resistance you're gonna have to increase the dose
Also I imagine it's like super sugar where people say "a little sweeter would be fine" and keep increasing the dose.
which is also why the doses need to stay micro; so the body doesn't percieve it as something worth building resistance to.
I definitely don’t want to be anywhere near Level 2 of a mushroom trip when I’m trying to actually function.
Just keep it nice and low; measure out 3.14g and split it 4 ways; have a quarter piece of Pi and all that cheesy goodness or wotnot.
Drugs are bad mhkay
Yep, college was great!
Lol my friends would 100% let me asphyxiate.
It'd be surprising if he could even manage talking with the latter.
That's what the uppers are for.
A micro dose of those, a macro dose of that, a pinch of meth a day keeps the voices away
His dealer likely doesn’t even know it’s going to Musk.
Yeah, the buyer always securely disguises himself as Melon Usk
giggles helplessly in billionaire
I heard some of the really wealthy Silicon Valley types kit out their own private laboratory and hire chemists.
I heard aliens are real. That doesn't exactly make it true. I doubt anyone with half a brain would have a full blown narcotics lab. At least, I've never heard of such a thing.
Small batch boutique narcotics are a market just waiting to be milked in Silicon Valley.
The purest of pure cocaine,..charge 10x the price of the best on the street.
Any and all RC’s you’d ever want at your fingertips, etc etc.
It’s just far too lucrative to think nobody is doing it.
Esp when you consider that most street drugs are laced with fentanyl/carfentanil.
That almost guarantees the rich and famous have their own supply line.
I've been wondering how this could make sense as I've seen it claimed more and more often (feels very similar to the original war on drugs hysteria of the 80s and 90s), and I admit I haven't looked too deeply, but it seems this is once again something being overblown due to the war on drugs.
There is lots more info on the article linked, I just cherrypicked these two summary statements.
There's far more detail in the article.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/8xyzkp/the-truth-about-drug-dealers-lacing-cocaine-with-fentanyl
Obviously, you aren't around drugs/drug users that often. Fent definitely is a real issue. A lot of my drug using friends(that are still alive) have conspiracies about why its in everything thats "not natural"(weed/shrooms/etc) for lack of better term... But it has started to show up in everything the last decade. Uppers/downers/psychs. Shits ridiculous
But for anyone dabbling.. Test strips are cheap. Use them. Mix the shit up good and test, even if you gotta break down the rock. Your friends and family dont want to find you dead covered in your own shit, piss and puke cause you were to lazy and cheap to test the shit.
Who needs repeat business? Just twirl your mustache at your dead clientele.
That's the qualifier. I have no idea why anyone would think marijuana would be contaminated with fentanyl.
Fair, but that qualifier seems to be missing on billboards I see and even in this statement:
This gives the impression that cannabis, LSD, shrooms, etc etc are also at risk here.
Especially when there are (semi-) legalized dispensaries that have to go through certified laboratories. Hey, maybe that's the solution.
I don't know... Some of us common folk put a lot of what money we have into little hobby pot farms and greenhouses. If a billionaire just keeps throwing money at it, they can have a pretty nice setup of whatever drug manufacturing they want.
You're right, though. Never heard of it, but I won't be surprised if we ever do.
John McAfee did.
Yeah but he was trying to make a new super meth Viagra to fuel his week long orgies, he's not really a typical case
Typical among multi millionaires and billionaires? I'm not so sure. Especially when they're named Elon.
Also, McAfee was a known poster to certain forums where home drug lab questions were common, so it's certainly a thing.
That's totally what I'd do.
What would be scarier is if he wasn't on drugs. Being on drugs means that there is a "normal state" for him to return to.
Doesn't he slur and ramble most of the time? I have never heard him make a sentence without stuttering.
Which means this must’ve been really bad for it to stand out so much.
If you watch the recent hour long interview where he told advertisers to fuck off, something seemed off about how he was talking then as well. I've watched my fair share of interviews and what not with him and even I thought something was up there.
Not saying it's drugs, but something is going on with him
Edit: late edit after watching the all hands in question. This didn't seem unusual for Elon and I didn't get the same weird vibes I got during the interview I mentioned above. They did cut off the Q&A though so maybe something happened in that. Also the whole thing seemed unneeded. More of a public facing thing for people/media and not an all hands.
It think that he is slowly realizing the change in public perception of him and as a narcissist it's getting to him. This could also explain the drug use too.
Yeah, I've heard a psychologist say he's showing clear signs of social media addiction (which is a pretty interesting/funny case when you're also rich enough to buy the entire media company).
I wouldn't be surprised if he has other addiction going on at the same time. I mean who can tell this guy he has a problem? Who can say no to this guy, nobody has any authority over him...
Technically? Any cop.
But cops aren't obligated to tell someone they have a problem. Apparently they aren't obligated to do anything... (but that's another rant). So there's really nobody who can tell him to get his life together until a cop has reason to tell him he has the right to remain silent.
Companies perform drug checks for a reason. People who lead large organizations while regularly getting off on drugs are usually the biggest psychopaths around.
Drug tests are just to keep their boots on the faces of the workers. It's disgusting and invasive.
Because there are no instances in history where forcing drug use had been weaponized at the international level. Man, sometimes it's so easy to see how lemmy is close to the same dark web that spams drug adverts on matrix.
You're seriously suggesting that drug tests are designed to protect employees from employers forcing them to do drugs? That's ridiculous.
False username, not sentient.
Don't be silly. Drug testing is largely for worker's comp. Think the insurance wants to pay out on an accident a fucked up employee got into? That has nothing to do with the employer.
That's why the vast majority of jobs coded as "clerical" do not require a test. Employers don't want to pay for all that if they don't have to.
EDIT: Lemmings who know nothing of the employment field, but want to get righteously angry.
If I smoke a joint on the weekend that has nothing to do with an injury on a Thursday.
but thanks to decades of war on drugs propaganda, if you smoke a joint on the weekend you're a bad and dangerous person and it's not just acceptable but incumbent upon Real God-Fearing Americans(c)(tm)(r) to hurt you however they can.
I'm sorry you're eating downvotes but this is the absolute truth in a lot of cases. I put in 18 years at various restaurants, worked every position except manager. I've never needed a drug test to get a job, and every job I ever had in that industry people were definitely on drugs at work, but drug tests are mandatory after a workplace injury. The reason being they don't actually care whether you're high at work but they can use the fact that almost everyone in a restaurant is high in order to cut costs under the guise of "workplace safety".
I can't imagine trying to cook while stoned. It just doesn't work that way for me.
They don't really cook in a lot of kitchens (chain ones anyway), it's more like they're microwaving it for you.
lol I worked at a place whose name rhymes with "Sad Tex" because they're called Mad Mex where the cooks were literally hitting the bowl on the line and blowing it into the hoods
There are exceptions, though. For instance, anyone who works in any capacity in the aviation industry is legally required to be tested for drugs. That includes, for example, software engineers working on booking systems.
Yep! Aviation is a whole nother world.
The higher up you go, the less likely it is that you'd be tested for drugs. We could empty board rooms if we insisted on drug testing at that level.
Yes, but I'm not really arguing against that claim. The higher up you go, the more psychopaths you have as well. They can have all the drugs they want, the real work usually doesn't depend on them, and psychopathy helps them make money if not contribute to society.
And that reason is to keep insurance premiums down.
So why do insurance premiums go up if people use drugs? Imaginary reasons?
10 downvotes on this comment, because they either mis clicked, they're guilty of the same thing and the truth hurts, or they're bootlicking scab motherfuckers.
Probably because routine mandatory tests are bad, and the comment you replied to is an endorsement to it. It's a gross violation of your constitutional rights under the 4th amendment. Also, why do you care to make assumptions on why people downvoted if you're not even making an effort to broaden your views?
https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/mandatory-drug-testing-public-sector-employees-constitutional
No argument there, I'm not an advocate for drug testing against any intrinsic right as spelled out in the constitution, but there are many situations where companies need some type of enforcement against people who get high and go to work. Industries from utility, security, heavy manufacturing, or construction are just a few off the top of my head that the public trust demands those employees be "fit for duty" regardless of the public/private sector distinction due to the potential for fatal harm and/or destruction of property.
The comment highlights the "rules for thee and not for me" mentality that C-suites have, to which I emphasize that while my viewpoint may seem narrow and extreme, it's not due to a lack of broad views. I read that abstract and it's a collection of concepts that does nothing to address some well understood concepts like "do you want a crane operator to be allowed to get high as a kite, jeopardizing lives?" as just one of many potential examples. If mandatory drug testing becomes ruled as illegal under the constitution, then we had damn well better amend it and figure this shit out......to which my and their point stands. I might even add that there are some ignorant assholes who apparently think it would just be great if we can all just be allowed to get high and kill people by accident. "It wasn't a big deal, they just got some bad weed and the pilot killed himself and 200 people, what's the big fucking deal?"
My source discussed your concerns, I think you did not read it.
"Most courts have ruled that mandatory urinalysis, at least in the absence of probable cause or reasonable suspicion, is invalid as a violation of the Fourth Amendment. While some courts have concluded that government workers may have a diminished expectation of privacy in comparison with the public at large, other courts have required some quantum of individualized suspicion before drug testing can be conducted. States have attempted to uphold mandatory drug testing by arguing that government employees voluntarily consent to drug testing and voluntary consent does not violate the Fourth Amendment. Courts have not accepted this argument, however, finding that consent obtained under the threat of disciplinary action is coercive and thus unconstitutional. The real issue in mandatory drug testing involves balancing individual versus government interests. Most courts hold that, absent probable cause or reasonable suspicion, individual constitutional rights are not outweighed by governmental interests"
I did, actually, so let's break it down:
This is my issue right off the top, hence I bring up fit for duty requirements as a measure of preventing the loss of life and/or property. All reasonable suspicion and disciplinary issues arise after a major loss of life happens, and random UA testing has been viewed as a tool that functions preventatively in encouraging people not to show up under the influence of a substance, ie fit for duty.
Had you displayed a modicum of understanding, you could see that point rather clearly, but it seems you like to use a stupid fucking red herring to detract from the point altogether. If it's unconstitutional, then it ought to be amended, and while we're at it, keep people accountable especially scumbag C-suite execs who are often making decisions that demonstrably lead to death and/or loss of property in various ways.
Your reading comprehension is horrible, to say the least. Let me highlight the keywords for you so it's easier.
Most courts have ruled that mandatory urinalysis, at least in the absence of probable cause or reasonable suspicion, is invalid as a violation of the Fourth Amendment.
In most cases I agree, with the exception of security clearances. That's a give and take.
It's only a violation of the 4th amendment for government employees, because only the government is bound by the 4th amendment. It's still bad, but not because of the Constitution.
Huh??? "Bound by the fourth amendment?" Have you ever read the Constitution? The fourth amendment protects you against unlawful search and seizure. As in, a protection afforded to all Americans. Please read a little.
https://constitutioncenter.org/the-constitution/amendments
Yes, I have. Have you?
The Bill of Rights is all about limiting what the government is allowed to do. The text of that particular amendment is more vague about who it applies to, but let's say for the sake of argument it is the law that prevents private employers from drug testing you without your consent. What it absolutely does not do is prevent your employer from firing you if you don't consent to a search they want to do.
Thankfully, smarter people than you and I decide what the law "applies to." That's what the courts have ruled, there can be no "consent" if it's a condition for employment. There must be articulated suspicion.
Given that SpaceX is a private company, where Musk owns the vast majority of voting rights, I'm not sure what can be done here. The same goes for Twitter, and I doubt Musk is stupid enough to have bylaws in a company he bought 12 months ago that would oust him for drug abuse (although I would fucking love it!)
Tesla, though, is only 21% owned by Musk (assuming Wikipedia is up to date). While it's tight, I imagine the board could request he take a drug test, and if he refuses/fails, call a vote to remove him. Given that Tesla execs have been worried about his unhinged behaviour for years, it could be the blessing they've been hoping for.
I think the issue is that SpaceX has government contracts. NASA and the military are probably more likely to be authoritarian about drug use among their contractors. He got in some hot water for smoking a joint in a Joe Rogan episode a few years ago too.
I think it's ridiculous of course. Let people do drugs. If he becomes incompetent then oust him for incompetence. Don't bring drug dogs in, especially since they're really only going to find low-level employees self-medicating while the execs weasel around it.
That's it exactly, SpaceX isn't using Elmo's bank account to fuck around, it's using ours.
It's using both
The drug-use aspect is irrelevant here. I don't care if govt contractors are using drugs, as long as their work is effective. And the Falcon 9 rockets are unmatched. And the Starship prototypes are groundbreaking.
I could make some moral complaints about Musk as a military contractor and grifter, but specifically regarding SpaceX and drug use... I 100% support it. I mean, he should get a grip, but drug use is not where I want the govt to focus.
Nothing, and nothing needs to be done. It's his company, he can run it how he wants and that will result in how successful it is. Personally I wouldn't be anywhere near him and unless I had a dire need not to, I'd quit working for whatever company he owns and find somewhere more sane to spend my time
These are the same people that let him fire a car into orbit around Mars with an "empty" space suit in the driver's seat.
Wdym "empty"? Did he sneak a person inside or something? I wouldn't put it past the guy.
Perfect way to get rid of a body.
That would be the news of the 24th century.
“The 21st century vehicle was rescued for placement in the Mars History Museum. DNA testing has confirmed that the man in the digital dark ages era space suite is in fact the formerly unknown half brother of Elon Musk. Mr. Musk is primarily remembered for creating the Xitter we know today. The xit posted by scientists is popping with more than 4 billion bursts around the two worlds. If you enjoy our content, don’t forget to link your brain, think hard about that like button, and focus on that bell for notifications.”
Apart from every single gram of weight having to be accounted for when you're talking about rocketry.
I get the joke, but it's the perfect way to have a body never found again. There would be many times during the whole thing he could have been caught if he had in fact done so. Think there are a few better ways to get rid of a body with less eyes on the situation.
Yeah, but would it be in a egocentric Musk way?
I really do think he started doing drugs a few years back.
He smoked pot on Joe Rogan's show.
He doesn't seem like the sort of person who can have the self-control to stop there. He's try uppers and downers and anything else to make himself feel good now that people are calling him out on his bullshit.
The dude was on top of the fucking world in February 2018 when he launched his car into orbit. In July of that year, he called a guy a pedo because the guy said Elon's toy submarine idea was worse than useless.
If he had kept his dumb mouth shut, we would all still mostly believe in Elon's bullshit myth.
Instead, it's mostly common knowledge that Elon is a narcissistic man baby, and has been for his entire life.
He would rather we didn't know about the emerald mine, but everyone knows. We know he bought his way to every success he's ever had, and that he has zero natural talent.
And that has to drive him mad. So he does drugs and plays video games to escape from reality. A reality where he isn't loved, and is actually viewed as the prime example of the problem with allowing billionaires to exist at all.
He use to do drugs. He still does but he use to too.
Can we please not associate the comic genius that was Mitch Hedberg with the painfully unfunny idiot who is Elon Musk?
You mean the heroine addict that ruined his own career? Kinda like Elon is doing with ketamine, and other hard drugs?
Sometimes the truth hurts.
And? Does that make him less of a comic genius? Does that make Musk any less painfully unfunny?
It was that Joe Rogaine interview, marijuana was his gateway drug.
I guess that Marijuana that he awkwardly smoked to be "cool" was a gateway drug to much worse.
What a sad downspiral for the guy. There's no way this ends well and we're all forced to attend the party.
Of all the problems I have with this man, drugs are not one.
I guess it depends: is he a more awful person because of the drugs, or would he be a more awful person without them?
Proprecia so his plugs don't fall out 😅
Honestly I can't blame him. I couldn't imagine not doing drugs if I was in his position.
Drugs and models are all I'd do if I were in his position and it'd be an improvement.
$44 Billion dollars buys enough Hookers and Blow to last the rest of your life.
$44b is enough for 25 guys to spend $50k per day on hookers and blow for more than 96 straight years!
Bold of you to assume Musk has 25 friends.
I'd be his friend for free drugs.
I'd be R&Ding exciting new drugs!
His position? Hell, if I were him specifically I’d never come down again
Sounds like he's having his Howard Hughes moment...
You mean... he isn't aways on drugs?!
Maybe he should be
There are them that shouldn't take drugs. And there are them that NEED to be taking the proper ones under medical direction.
I've been thinking Musk needs to be taking some under a Doctor's care...............
And permit a human being to be smarter than him in any field, regardless of how little experience he has in it?! Heresy!
Maybe the problem was that he wasn't on drugs during the meeting
Yeah, the most powerful drug: money ...joking, he was probably under the best mix his personal lab could have created
Is it a joke? Seems like money makes rich people do crazy things, babble incoherently, act like they're superheroes... like a lot of other drugs. And, of course, they go through serious withdrawal if they lose even a little of their money.
Yes, he is probably doing "real" drugs, but his biggest drug is money.
Yeah was a joke, I am well aware and you are totally right about the narcotic effect of money (and power itself)
“Hey! Are you on drugs?!??”
“No!”
“Well… Would you you like to be?”
Well yeah. The dude never sleeps.
He IS on a drug, and it's called: CHARLIE SHEEN.
Charlie Sheen did enough drugs to kill Two and a Half Men though.
Oh wow. I just had the weirdest reddit flashback. Where's the gold button.
Buy yourself a crack rock instead.
The downvoters must clearly not remember the Charlie Sheen "winning!" drug debacle. Strikingly similar to Elon, if you think about it.