Just chatted with someone I know. How can one say something like that? (for context, we were talking about veganism and they said: "pescetarian makes more sense.")
I mean, it's (EDIT: it's actually not possible) possible that they don't, but still, who gives you the right to decide whether an animal shall live or not? Also, the fishing industry is harming the planet and (many) fish contain toxic metals.
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"I mean, it’s possible that they don’t," no it isn't.
The easiest way for humans to feel superior, is to claim that other animals are inferior. Some people even choose to believe that humans are not animals.
Humanity is a species that is happy to have human slaves, as long as it is legal and socially acceptable to do so. They have even fewer qualms treating other species as objects.
Yeah, I'm not informed on that topic, so I wasn't sure.
We were all born equal.
I have not watched Dominion, but I am curious as to how they arrived at the conclusion that fish do not feel pain.
Chances are, they are in cognitive dissonance, and they do not want to think/act about all this. So, despite knowing the philosophical arguments around it, they can rationalise by just saying "but it tastes good", and "lol, they are not human". I, personally, have found no way to talk to such people. So, if your friend is anything like that, good luck, fellow vegan!
This is not a healthy way to talk to people or make friends.
Lol! What do you mean? How else can one speak rationally to people?
As I see it, I have not been rude or disrespectful in my comment. I merely want to understand their reasoning (or lack thereof) for eating meat. If their reasons are strong enough to overcome the opposition (i.e., vegans), I will start consuming meat as well.
Also, appealing to emotion does not work on everyone (as OP showed in their case). In such cases, if the person you are talking to intends to engage in a healthy discussion, the best approach is to work out the argument logically. Look for any contradictions in their reasoning (or yours). While the person may still not follow your proposal, at the very least, they will realize that their stance contains logical contradictions (hence my point about cognitive dissonance).
I'm not saying that OP should be unfriendly or lose their friend. Friends can have healthy debates, and OP is the best judge in their case.
From the pictures, it's seemed like a very casual chat. I'd be turned off if someone broached the subject with your 3 points. I've never asked my friends for sources when chatting with them. Granted, I only chat with people I know in real life, it just feels a bit hostile is all.
Have you heard of discussions/arguments?
They also state that they have watched dominion and nothing clicked.
Your friend's username is on that picture. Just a heads up.
omg, I did not see that. Sorry!
Fish do certainly feel pain but there's an important distinction to be made between pain and suffering and I think your friend is confusing the two. Suffering is harder to define but it could be defined as the ability to understand pain - if an animal can become depressed, can remember it's pain, can develop phobias, can grieve. It's less clear to what extent different fish can suffer. Despite how callous their reasoning may sound to an experienced vegan they actually sound like they're engaging morally with the issue and it's a great starting point for further reflection. I would encourage them to go pescetarian to start with and then gently introduce them to fish welfare and harmful fishing practices when they are more comfortable with a meat free diet.
@Dagobah @t3kkm0tt
@TheDarkQuark
I Eat Specific Fishes (Like Sardines or Herrings) 2 Meals a Week because I don't Want to Buy Artificial Industrial Supplements especially for Critical Nutrients : EPA/DHA, B12 and Iodine
I think there are species that are in the Animal Kingdom that the ethics of veganism don't apply to. Corals for example are - just as plants - better described as robots but as feeling animals.
The discussion where this robot behaviour ends and emotional life begins is very hard (fish have feelings imo). I avoid this gray area by how unhealthy eating marine, filtering animals has become (for example due to mercury).
Oh, and also the awful practices of maritime fishing that endanger the biggest and most robust ecosystem on earth.
I talked to this old lady once and she asked me if i like certain foods. I always said no, because it was some animal. I told her that i don't eat animals at all. She told me that means i eat a lot of fish then. I said no, these are animals too. She said: no, they don't even have blood in them
Never estimate stupid.