Changing for P.E. in U.S. public schools
I'm 60. I was in U.S. public grade school in the 70s and early 80s.
Starting in Junior High, which was grades seven and eight, we were all required to take Physical Education (P.E.) classes, and we were all required to change into P.E. uniforms. The dress code for the school otherwise was minimal.
We changed in the locker room in front of each other, that meant we were nude in front of each other. This was true for girls and boys, of course, we had separate locker rooms.
Furthermore, after class, we were required to shower, which we also did together.
For both junior high and high school it was very much like this. Rows of lockers and open showers at one end. There were high windows along the ceiling to let the steam out.:
It took two or three days for everyone to get comfortable with being nude in front of each other, and that was the end of the problem. It was a small hump to get over, and everyone did, easily. By the end of the week we were all goofing around naked in the shower, like you may have seen in movies or wherever.
I'm curious about your experiences, and whether you think it's harmful or beneficial for kids to be forced to get nude in front of each other for this purpose.
34 replies
I used to have a skin tag on my nipple, it looked like a third nipple. I tried to get out of changing in front of others, but they made me. Merciless bullying ensued, it was already pretty bad because of neurodivergence differences. My home life was abusive so I never got a break. If this were still a thing, I would do everything I could to prevent it from happening to my kids. People got bullied about birthmarks, baby fat, you know how kids are, any excuse. That is not an environment to throw vulnerable children into.
We didn't have time to shower. Our under garments always stayed on. Not a single person ever showered.
Edit: Anecdotal, but my mom grew up in the same decade as you, but she's the most body negative person I know. She even harps on people just for not wearing a bra.
We had mandatory shower days when we got sweaty or muddy. The PE instructor actually made sure of it in the locker room. He later came out as gay. I don’t think he ever touched anyone but we were all eye molested by a pedo.
Showers at school are fine but privacy is good too.
We had this at my school too!… However they never actually gave us time to truly change or shower, so we just changed shirts and moved on to our next class smelling like shit
Enter Axe Body Spray
CK one
Thank GOD I’m pretty sure no one used it in any of my classes. We were all required to have deodorant, though it was not enforced
My kid told me everyone changed in the toilet stalls. I guess they had time to do that.
Holy hell, those shower poles were real?
Still are at my local public pool, but there's only two of them. (In the men's shower room at least)
wow. so different than mine. showers were seperated and there were benches between the lockers. Everyone sorta change quickly and often did not shower. No one wanted to be naked that much in front of the other kids. Had to go through the shower area to get to the pool and the teachers required a shower coming into the pool area but that just meant you had to be wet. Many showered in their swimsuit. Teachers had a whole talk on good shower hygenie but it did not move most of the students.
why are you changing your underwear for PE?
Sweaty balls
Boys were required to wear jock straps, and weren't allowed to wear briefs under them. B.O. is my guess. But, also, as I said, we showered together so we didn't wear underwear in the shower, either, of course.
It wasn't a problem after the first couple of days. We just got used to it. Not a big deal at all.
being required to wear different underwear (jockstraps) makes sense to then change them
???
i understand why you needed to change.
Because the whole thing was a weird grooming ritual. The whole "locker room culture" shit was considered some critical part of manhood. This is incidentally why conservatives are obssesed with the idea of grooming children now, because they invented the concept.
Same age and similar experience. We basically grew up without body shame. So yes I will walk around naked and drop my towel to put on underwear.
Showers never worked. People just changed out of gym clothes and back into normal. Lots of body spray.
That's absolutely disgusting
Back in the early 2000s when I was in middle/high school there was never enough time after PE to both take a shower and get to your next class if you wanted to. There was barely enough time to change back into regular clothes.
7 minute passing period between classes.
Also, my conspiratorial mind makes me think this is intentional. That those who ultimately control what is taught in U.S. public schools want people to be more anxious and less confident. Don't help kids face their fears, let those fears fester and even foster them.
Early 90's I had to change for gym class. I've also been to clothing optional campgrounds, to me nudity isn't harmful at all. If anything social nudity would be beneficial.
My family spent two summer vacations at a nudist camp when I was about five. I don't remember much, but I do remember I didn't want to put clothes on at the end of the trip. It wasn't optional, nudity was required, clothes weren't allowed.
When I was just entering in high school in mid 90s there was a tight knit group that would play ping pong in there. The club was called the NPPA, the naked ping pong association, they had shirts made up with the Discobolus sculpture but a paddle replaced the discus in hand.
I think nudism is great, but it shouldn't be forced on people
I'm fairly comfortable being nude now, it's more society that stops me than internal pressures, but if I'd been forced to be naked in my school years it would have made me very dysphoric, and there are still things I'd be dysphoric about in certain contexts these days, so the people involved would make a big difference.
We make kids do a lot of things they don't want to do, because we know it's good for them, and we know it's just irrational fear that stops them. Why is this any different? Here's one: public speaking. That caused much more anxiety than changing for P.E. for a lot of kids.
10-20% of the population is LGBT in some manner. The idea of forcing kids to change in front of each other comes from a world where we had not problem assuming everyone was straight. That's why it was no big deal for boys to see other boys naked and girls to see other girls naked. But it's not 1950 anymore. And just like traditionally we wouldn't force girls to change in front of guys, we shouldn't force kids to change in front of other kids they might be attracted to or those who may have attraction to them. Plus the gendered changing rooms cause all sorts of issues for trans kids.
It's a whole lot of headache for very little benefit. Putting kids through that much trauma just isn't worth it because, in the abstract, it might be ideal if kids were more comfortable with their bodies.
"Force all the kids to get naked around each other" only works if you ignore the 20% of kids that aren't straight or cis.
This is still reinforcing the idea that sexual attraction is intrinsically linked to nudity, as well as just excusing inappropriate behavior by altering the environment instead of the actual behavior. Putting aside the gender and sexuality debate entirely, because I want it to be clear that showering is a practical matter and shouldn't be sexualized in the first place, body positivity begins and ends with people accepting themselves and ending the bullying and teasing is a completely different discussion.
People have been completely ignoring the practical aspect of this whole thing this whole thread, BO is a serious problem for people after exercise. Not a lot of schools have the space or resources to have individual shower stalls. Plumbing is expensive, those post showers are a single water hookup and a single drain for 6-10 showers versus one each for stalls.
We do need to address issues regarding acceptance as a society, but introducing strawmen just ignores the issue at hand.
Oh, now you don't want to link sex and nudity? On the one hand, you intrinsically link sex with nudity when you separate changing rooms by sex. That's the entire reason we have separate changing rooms. And then on the other hand, when I point out that this creates real issues for 20% of the population, you had waive it away saying those vitally important issues can be just dismissed out of hand, crassly dismissing the needs of 20% of the population as "a straw man."
You need to check your privilege.
No one wants to answer whether it's harmful or beneficial. I expected that.
I say it's beneficial. Body shame is not healthy. No one should be ashamed or shy about how they look nude. It's a byproduct of how we're raised in western society, and this ritual of forcing kids to face and overcome the mild shame is important to self-esteem. Proof-positive that we're all alike under our clothes, and learning that clothes are used as a divider. When the richest kid in school stands next to the poorest in the shower, they're equals. Can't tell them apart, and they see that too.
I feel sorry for you "youngsters" who didn't have this experience. Unnecessary additional anxiety. "What happens if someone sees my pee-pee?!" The answer is nothing happens. Yes, I'm mocking you, it's a childish fear, and it should be left in childhood.
Fucking awful take. It's very clear you weren't bullied in school, and that last sentence shows to me you were doing the bullying.
"The answer is nothing happens. Yes, I’m mocking you"
... Did you not read your own words?
The public swimming pool also had goup showers so I was already used to it before middle school.
I had this in middle and high school after gym in the early 90s and maybe I was lucky but the gym teachers were hardcore against body shaming. Had a few incidents where someone made an inappropriate comment about someone else and the teacher shut it down and explained why it was wrong every time.