I wonder if this is why I’ll see a post has a larger comment count than the comments I can read, too.
If you've blocked someone, that person's comments and all comments replying to theirs are hidden from your view. This is my only guess why you might be seeing this. The comment count you see on your instance should be accurate, since it only counts comments it knows about and it doesn't know about defederated ones.
This is something that I consistently see that people still haven't gotten used to with Lemmy and other federated sites. People often complain about what they see on their feed or sometimes attack an OP for reposting. I assume people just aren't thinking about it since we're all still used to Reddit and using a centralized platform where everyone can see the same stuff. But with Lemmy, it seems that people forget that their feed will be completely different, based on which instance they are in.
Is startreck.website federated with hexbear? When sh.itjust.workes got federated by hexbear a few days ago, about a third of all was tankie memes and discussion from hexbear. They mostly stayed to their communities, but sometimes I would come across comments on memes from .ml.
No a third of posts were people complaining they saw someone that might have been a tankie and demanding to live in a neo lib echochamber, I barely saw any actual tankie talking points
I'd estimate maybe 10% of posts were responding to the 35% of posts. But that's just rough estimates. The tankie taking points were in the comments, the memes were often just saying America bad in different ways.
I have seen my fair share of tankies here, so there definitely is a presence of them here. But I also do think a lot of the complaints come from people who assume any leftist user or post is also a "tankie."
Like I do see a lot of leftist memes posted to [email protected], which might be where a lot of the complaints are coming from. Likewise there has been a lot of drama with hexbear federating with a lot of communities that were previously shielded from them.
I'm talking about hexbear as tankie specifically. I haven't really seen any reasonable leftists on that instance. They use lib as an insult to give an idea.
I only came across tankies. I couldn't find anyone in the few days we were federated who would condemn Russia's invasion or China's treatment of the Uyghurs. Maybe they're on there, but I didn't find any.
I think a lot of people don't realize that the .ml in lemmygrad.ml and lemmy.ml stands for "Marxist Leninist". They actually ARE Communist instances so their anti-capitalist stuff is perfectly fine in their instances and communities. If you don't want to see their stuff then block it, otherwise some of us occasionally find it funny and / or thought provoking.
I've never seen them be "thought provoking", which is what I would have expected. Instead they just whine about "libs" and recommended you go read some novel from 1890 while giving exactly zero reason for you to be interested.
I'm interested in hearing different points of view. Hexbear wasn't that. It was 2015 r/the_donald style propaganda.
I'm actually surprised at how devoid of substance they were. I expected more.
It's nice that the "all" list has vastly improved in quality in a day.
There was a wave of tankie on Reddit and here during the reddexit. It was like, “where the fuck did stalin/mao/pol pot loving, atrocity denying weirdos come from en masse?” But you’re right the shock was bigger than the phenomenon.
Hehehe, thank you. EDIT: I didn't realize that Pol Pot's atrocities in trying to convert Cambodia into an agrarian communist paradise were not the right kind of atrocities for standard tankies.
Leftists or tankies? I'm talking about those that pretend Stalin and Mao didn't murder millions of people in pursuit of their communist state, while creating a corrupt one party government of haves. There's a difference between leftists and tankies.
It doesn't help that the tankies are trying to push the idea that "Tankie is a slur against all communists/leftists!" The word "tankie" was invented by communists as an insult against those specific "communists" the cheer on brutal oppression of civilians -- particularly when those civilians are communists themselves.
The irony is tankies hate the "wrong kind of leftist" just as much as their other ideological enemies.
I've known many tankies (myself included) and I've never met a single one that thought it was a slur, but ok. Those civilians were fascists uprising BTW.
Yes, the famous "fascist uprisings" where students demanded things like a return to democracy with free elections, putting local communist politicians in power in the interim, end of occupation by a foreign power or state military, end to media censorship and oppression of dissidents, and the return to local rule.
Those are the things tankies defend. They self identify as communist, because anyone can call themself a communist. Tankies are the "communists" that blindly celebrate the instances of failure and oppression instead of denouncing or learning from them -- that is what separates a tankie from normal, sane communists.
I think that sort of speaks to how toxic and horrible they can be when you do encounter them. I don't see their posts often but when you do, it's a omg kill it with fire moment. Makes you want to just shut it all down and go touch some grass.
There needs to be a fenced in instance where the pathologically knee-jerking US Democrats can circle-jerk themselves to sexual exhaustion in too. I'm actually way more sick and tired of seeing their mouth breathing takes than anyone else's.
Communists are very aware that social democracy exists. Social democracy very famously split out of socialist thought. Originally social democracy was another term for socialism.
Communists take issue with the very real fact that social democracy preserves capitalism and thus the exploitation that comes with it. Social democracy simply exports that exploitation. Without the subjugation of the global south, social democracy could not exist. Just because you have exported that exploitation doesn’t mean it went away.
The actual academic take on this is that capitalistic forces are inevitable in the presence of scarcity. We've already proven pretty conclusively that mass murder also doesn't end capitalism, and social democracy has arguably gotten much closer and is far more sustainable.
Capitalist forces absolutely are not inevitable with scarcity. Native Americans lived in societies that have been described as primitive communism. Did they not have scarcity?
Further, mass murder is not a prerequisite for communism.
Communists are very aware that social democracy exists.
Never said they weren't. Said they pretended it doesn't exist since SocDem provably fixes everything they claim communism does, but it just isn't fascist enough for them.
Without the subjugation of the global south, social democracy could not exist.
Where we're going we don't need to cite our sources! Though admittedly this is better than the one guy who told me social democracy exists because USA spends money on their military. Dude was just as clueless as you'd think a communist is haha fucking funny lads you fascists.
Social democracy does not fix every problem communism claims to because it preserves capitalism. Social democracy, but without capitalism is no longer social democracy. That is socialism. Believe it or not, communists are pro-socialism.
All of the Scandinavian social democracies that are supposedly the gold standard are former colonial powers. Colonial powers extract wealth from their colonies to the detriment of the indigenous inhabitants of the colony. This is referred to as primitive accumulation and is a direct precursor to capitalism. These nations built their wealth through colonialism and continue to maintain wealth through neocolonialism. This is really only unheard of or controversial if you have your head in the ground. Look up the WTO and the IMF and how they fuck over the global south at the benefit of wealthy nations if you’re interested in more information (spoilers: you’re not)
Where are your sources that all communists are fascists? Are the communists in the Philippines fighting their fascist government also fascists? What about in India? The list goes on. You’ll find that neither of these groups of communists are particularly fond of China by the way.
All of the Scandinavian social democracies that are supposedly the gold standard are former colonial powers.
Dude read too much into finno-korean hyperwar.
Look up the WTO and the IMF and how they fuck over the global south
Bailing out countries that fuck themselves over with communist policies is now fault of the helper. Alright next time the west should just let them starve :)
Where are your sources that all communists are fascists?
Reality. It's this weird fringe thing you've delusioned yourself out of
Are the communists in the Philippines fighting their fascist government also fascists?
Yep
What about in India?
Yepparino
neither of these groups of communists are particularly fond of China by the way.
Lmao communists aren't fond of other type of communists, what a revelation. My country of Finland has at least 5 different communist parties, each with like 10 total members and they hate each other more than they hate the ruling pro-NATO parties.
God I live for redfash attempts at argumentation, the nazi ones get really stale after a while.
You really are not as informed on communist thought as you think you are. Nor are you very informed on the very real problems with the IMF or WTO saying that these organizations save countries from “communist policies” is so hysterically wrong that I can’t believe it’s an actual thought that someone had. This discussion clearly isn’t going anywhere because it’s like I’m talking to a brick wall. Have a nice life.
They've now "you can't fire me I quit" defeded with at least two instances who were voting on defending them. I believe that's what's being referred to here.
We have so many communities about drama and not a single one seems active. I wonder if these users, who poured hours and hours of their lifetime into creating a bazillion dead communities the last few months, feel stupid for doing that.
We need more people on lemmy from all different backgrounds to balance these debates out. Defederation may still occur, but the majority will not be a bunch of radical lefties.
As tankies would say "diversity is our strength!", so lemmy needs more diversity of opinion.
If you can't coexist with people that have an opinion different from yours, you can't coexist with anyone. And if you post controversial takes or memes, you better expect and accept the controversy. Oftentimes both sides
can learn from it.
Edit: Since this is apparently not clear, I'm not "siding with the tankies" or whatever. Actually I was specifically addressing them, you know, exactly like the very meme this is posted under. But I guess if you want to be offended, you will be. Please spare me the work and block me then.
There are certain "differing opinions" that nobody should have to coexist with.
Should I really coexist with the opinion that I should be put to death because of my sexual orientation? Does it make me intolerant that I don't want to hear the shit that comes out of a fascist's mouth?
Exactly. There’s opinions…..and being an intolerant biggot (“not everyone should have civil rights”) or in the context of Russia, being a genocide apologist (…”from my point of view Ukraine is the fascist Nazi country!”)
Folks who unironically deny the atrocities of Stalin and Mao (but have no problem denouncing Pol Pot, not because of his atrocities but because of his lack of ideological purity to Marxism/Leninism) aren’t interested in honest debate, nor worthy of my time or respect. Hence my assumption that you were a starry-eyed idealist.
it might be your instance not being fed'd with them
If you've blocked someone, that person's comments and all comments replying to theirs are hidden from your view. This is my only guess why you might be seeing this. The comment count you see on your instance should be accurate, since it only counts comments it knows about and it doesn't know about defederated ones.
No it's mostly people going nuts over little to nothing.
Depending on the instance you are on and the blocks you have set up, your feed can be very full of the stuff
This is something that I consistently see that people still haven't gotten used to with Lemmy and other federated sites. People often complain about what they see on their feed or sometimes attack an OP for reposting. I assume people just aren't thinking about it since we're all still used to Reddit and using a centralized platform where everyone can see the same stuff. But with Lemmy, it seems that people forget that their feed will be completely different, based on which instance they are in.
Is startreck.website federated with hexbear? When sh.itjust.workes got federated by hexbear a few days ago, about a third of all was tankie memes and discussion from hexbear. They mostly stayed to their communities, but sometimes I would come across comments on memes from .ml.
No a third of posts were people complaining they saw someone that might have been a tankie and demanding to live in a neo lib echochamber, I barely saw any actual tankie talking points
I'd estimate maybe 10% of posts were responding to the 35% of posts. But that's just rough estimates. The tankie taking points were in the comments, the memes were often just saying America bad in different ways.
Oh, I guess if you count any criticism of America to automatically make somthing tankie then I guess maybe
Tankies really are just stupid and can't read, huh?
and I had to block all those hexbear communities, cuz suddenly they flooded my feed
Still shitty that everyone else also has to see and block that stuff... It surely doesn't make an instance inviting for new users.
I have seen my fair share of tankies here, so there definitely is a presence of them here. But I also do think a lot of the complaints come from people who assume any leftist user or post is also a "tankie."
Like I do see a lot of leftist memes posted to [email protected], which might be where a lot of the complaints are coming from. Likewise there has been a lot of drama with hexbear federating with a lot of communities that were previously shielded from them.
I'm talking about hexbear as tankie specifically. I haven't really seen any reasonable leftists on that instance. They use lib as an insult to give an idea.
So the instance that has anarchists and syndicalists on it (as well as, MLists, MSMists, and Stalinists, and more) are all tankies?
I only came across tankies. I couldn't find anyone in the few days we were federated who would condemn Russia's invasion or China's treatment of the Uyghurs. Maybe they're on there, but I didn't find any.
I think a lot of people don't realize that the .ml in lemmygrad.ml and lemmy.ml stands for "Marxist Leninist". They actually ARE Communist instances so their anti-capitalist stuff is perfectly fine in their instances and communities. If you don't want to see their stuff then block it, otherwise some of us occasionally find it funny and / or thought provoking.
(this was a joke, ml stands for
malaysiaMali).Mali.
Thanks. I knew it was one of those countries with M and L in the name, in that order.
I've never seen them be "thought provoking", which is what I would have expected. Instead they just whine about "libs" and recommended you go read some novel from 1890 while giving exactly zero reason for you to be interested.
I'm interested in hearing different points of view. Hexbear wasn't that. It was 2015 r/the_donald style propaganda.
I'm actually surprised at how devoid of substance they were. I expected more.
It's nice that the "all" list has vastly improved in quality in a day.
That's a pretty lib response imo.
There was a wave of tankie on Reddit and here during the reddexit. It was like, “where the fuck did stalin/mao/pol pot loving, atrocity denying weirdos come from en masse?” But you’re right the shock was bigger than the phenomenon.
The commies were here first—we created Lemmy, lol
Big difference between being a commie and being an atrocity-denying commie that has no sense of historical perspective.
I challenge you to find a single person anywhere on Lemmygrad or Hexbear who expressed a favorable opinion of Pol Pot.
Hehehe, thank you. EDIT: I didn't realize that Pol Pot's atrocities in trying to convert Cambodia into an agrarian communist paradise were not the right kind of atrocities for standard tankies.
This could be a moment for you to realize you don't know what leftists actually believe, but I'm getting the sense you won't.
Leftists or tankies? I'm talking about those that pretend Stalin and Mao didn't murder millions of people in pursuit of their communist state, while creating a corrupt one party government of haves. There's a difference between leftists and tankies.
Thank you for your service; now move along.
Smh more settler colonialism
Wtf, lmao. The only people calling pol pot communist are liberals.
No one called them communist here, they are just calling out people who are apologists for genocide.
TIL Marxist-Leninists (which Pol Pot was) are not communist.
It doesn't help that the tankies are trying to push the idea that "Tankie is a slur against all communists/leftists!" The word "tankie" was invented by communists as an insult against those specific "communists" the cheer on brutal oppression of civilians -- particularly when those civilians are communists themselves.
The irony is tankies hate the "wrong kind of leftist" just as much as their other ideological enemies.
I've known many tankies (myself included) and I've never met a single one that thought it was a slur, but ok. Those civilians were fascists uprising BTW.
Yes, the famous "fascist uprisings" where students demanded things like a return to democracy with free elections, putting local communist politicians in power in the interim, end of occupation by a foreign power or state military, end to media censorship and oppression of dissidents, and the return to local rule.
Yep, all of those revolutions were clearly the work of fascists.
Those are the things tankies defend. They self identify as communist, because anyone can call themself a communist. Tankies are the "communists" that blindly celebrate the instances of failure and oppression instead of denouncing or learning from them -- that is what separates a tankie from normal, sane communists.
I think that sort of speaks to how toxic and horrible they can be when you do encounter them. I don't see their posts often but when you do, it's a omg kill it with fire moment. Makes you want to just shut it all down and go touch some grass.
I don't even know what a tankie is
Tankies are communist state sympathizers.
They aren't just communists, they will actively defend China and the Soviet Union.
If you were to go to China and find a bunch of guys wearing MAGA hats, that would be their version of a Tankie
Got a follow up, possibly dumb question, Is "Tankie" a reference to that famous tiananmen square photo with the tank?
I assume so? I avoid tankies and I've never asked.
I say this as an extreme socialist, tankies are a problem.
Are you complaining about not seeing racism and genocide denial?
Like most hexbear users denying the ongoing genocide of Uyghers.
Keep your political bullshit on hexbear and lemmygrad!
fr. the only political post I ever made was mocking tankie propaganda being posted to a non political meme community
That's for that post btw. Was called for.
There needs to be a fenced in instance where the pathologically knee-jerking US Democrats can circle-jerk themselves to sexual exhaustion in too. I'm actually way more sick and tired of seeing their mouth breathing takes than anyone else's.
My old neighbor's cat sounded like that a couple of times a year, good ol Meow Zedong.
It's funny because Māo is actually Chinese for "cat"
i’m so sick of these goddamn tankies
they’re literally just fascists painted red
they went so far into the spectrum that they overflowed into the opposite side
Word, anyone that thinks China should be the hegemon is deluded.
And absolutely positively has never in their entire life been to China.
I think you are confusing facism and authoritarianism.
Y’all calling hexbear tankies is proof that word don’t mean anything anymore 🤷🏿♂️
They are unironically Marxist-Leninists and actively chase away democratic socialists, and say things like "nuking American is based."
I'm not sure what else you want.
None of these commie-subtypes mean anything lmao
They are all fascists who pretend social democracy doesnt exist
Communists are very aware that social democracy exists. Social democracy very famously split out of socialist thought. Originally social democracy was another term for socialism.
Communists take issue with the very real fact that social democracy preserves capitalism and thus the exploitation that comes with it. Social democracy simply exports that exploitation. Without the subjugation of the global south, social democracy could not exist. Just because you have exported that exploitation doesn’t mean it went away.
The actual academic take on this is that capitalistic forces are inevitable in the presence of scarcity. We've already proven pretty conclusively that mass murder also doesn't end capitalism, and social democracy has arguably gotten much closer and is far more sustainable.
Capitalist forces absolutely are not inevitable with scarcity. Native Americans lived in societies that have been described as primitive communism. Did they not have scarcity?
Further, mass murder is not a prerequisite for communism.
Native Americans made war with each other. It wasn’t an idea that was introduced to them by colonizers.
And Native Americans were at near constant war with each other prior to European settlement. No competition at all eyeroll
Never said they weren't. Said they pretended it doesn't exist since SocDem provably fixes everything they claim communism does, but it just isn't fascist enough for them.
Where we're going we don't need to cite our sources! Though admittedly this is better than the one guy who told me social democracy exists because USA spends money on their military. Dude was just as clueless as you'd think a communist is haha fucking funny lads you fascists.
Social democracy does not fix every problem communism claims to because it preserves capitalism. Social democracy, but without capitalism is no longer social democracy. That is socialism. Believe it or not, communists are pro-socialism.
All of the Scandinavian social democracies that are supposedly the gold standard are former colonial powers. Colonial powers extract wealth from their colonies to the detriment of the indigenous inhabitants of the colony. This is referred to as primitive accumulation and is a direct precursor to capitalism. These nations built their wealth through colonialism and continue to maintain wealth through neocolonialism. This is really only unheard of or controversial if you have your head in the ground. Look up the WTO and the IMF and how they fuck over the global south at the benefit of wealthy nations if you’re interested in more information (spoilers: you’re not)
Where are your sources that all communists are fascists? Are the communists in the Philippines fighting their fascist government also fascists? What about in India? The list goes on. You’ll find that neither of these groups of communists are particularly fond of China by the way.
Dude read too much into finno-korean hyperwar.
Bailing out countries that fuck themselves over with communist policies is now fault of the helper. Alright next time the west should just let them starve :)
Reality. It's this weird fringe thing you've delusioned yourself out of
Yep
Yepparino
Lmao communists aren't fond of other type of communists, what a revelation. My country of Finland has at least 5 different communist parties, each with like 10 total members and they hate each other more than they hate the ruling pro-NATO parties.
God I live for redfash attempts at argumentation, the nazi ones get really stale after a while.
You really are not as informed on communist thought as you think you are. Nor are you very informed on the very real problems with the IMF or WTO saying that these organizations save countries from “communist policies” is so hysterically wrong that I can’t believe it’s an actual thought that someone had. This discussion clearly isn’t going anywhere because it’s like I’m talking to a brick wall. Have a nice life.
Wait till they call you a Nazi because you didn't agree with them.
All I can hear is the sweet silence of defederation.
If a tankie complains on a lemmy instance and no one is federated with that instance, do they even make a sound at all?
Oh ffs, what now?
Drama between Hexbear and ShitJustWorks. Have some popcorn.
So who is the person on the bicycle in this scenario?
Hexbear. They're an instance that exists mostly to troll and harass others, and have been defederated by most of Lemmy.
So... they're not the ones defederating everyone?
They also tend to defederate in turn with anyone who blocks them.
They've now "you can't fire me I quit" defeded with at least two instances who were voting on defending them. I believe that's what's being referred to here.
my home instance hasn't defederated them yet. super small instance, but still
We have so many communities about drama and not a single one seems active. I wonder if these users, who poured hours and hours of their lifetime into creating a bazillion dead communities the last few months, feel stupid for doing that.
We need to preserve our instance of 7 people using lemmy like a group text from the corruptions of the outside world.
can sombody explain what a tankie is i live under a rock
We need more people on lemmy from all different backgrounds to balance these debates out. Defederation may still occur, but the majority will not be a bunch of radical lefties.
As tankies would say "diversity is our strength!", so lemmy needs more diversity of opinion.
Tankies (commies) are like this everywhere it seems :D here orban from hungary:
ORBÁN: 2021 We dont'T NEED EU LOANS, THE ECONOMY IS RUMBLING!
2022 THE COUNTRY IS NEAR BANKRUPTCY, INFLATION IS IN THE SKY, FOOD PRICES, GASOLINE
ORBÁN-2022 EU GIVE ME A SMALL LOAN, STOP BEING JERK PLS
2023 GIVE ME EVEN MORE LOAN
you go first, shitwad
You can do better than that
If you can't coexist with people that have an opinion different from yours, you can't coexist with anyone. And if you post controversial takes or memes, you better expect and accept the controversy. Oftentimes both sides can learn from it.
Edit: Since this is apparently not clear, I'm not "siding with the tankies" or whatever. Actually I was specifically addressing them, you know, exactly like the very meme this is posted under. But I guess if you want to be offended, you will be. Please spare me the work and block me then.
There are certain "differing opinions" that nobody should have to coexist with.
Should I really coexist with the opinion that I should be put to death because of my sexual orientation? Does it make me intolerant that I don't want to hear the shit that comes out of a fascist's mouth?
Exactly. There’s opinions…..and being an intolerant biggot (“not everyone should have civil rights”) or in the context of Russia, being a genocide apologist (…”from my point of view Ukraine is the fascist Nazi country!”)
Way to twist the word's inside my mouth. I literally neither said nor implied any of this. But go ahead an be offended by whatever.
I can coexist, I just would rather not feel the need to spend 6 hours explaining why Russia invading Ukraine is bad actually. (True story)
Spot the idealist.
I'm actually a very anti-idealism pragmatic, but I'm sure with your level of deduction skills you already knew that.
Folks who unironically deny the atrocities of Stalin and Mao (but have no problem denouncing Pol Pot, not because of his atrocities but because of his lack of ideological purity to Marxism/Leninism) aren’t interested in honest debate, nor worthy of my time or respect. Hence my assumption that you were a starry-eyed idealist.
That is such facile garbage. There are opinions that can be tolerated and there are those that should not.
Say anything they disagree with in some random thread and you'll have an inbox full of pig poop balls and rage replies
you are a fascist plain and simple