I have to say that I feel like the Chinese Revolution of 1949 has been utterly betrayed and sold out. Things used to be great. Now? A Marxist-Leninist? Truly dark and unprecedented times in China. I supported them until now, I can’t support Extremism smh Free TaibetJiang
Pack it up guys, gals, and everyone in between, some lib slammed poor Xi with a verbal accusation that he is what he has always been. Communism will never recover. China will collapse tomorrow.
'When reached for comment, the lemmygrad user claimed that the libs anger actually was making him stronger. He then said he was going to lift some weights while listening to Parenti lectures.'
Tankies are people who defend China (and originally the USSR)/any "communist" countries actions no matter what. While Xi is undoubtedly a tanky, the meme is just calling him a communist. Which isn't even accurate honestly. I really wish we could move past communist/socialist being an insult. It isn't. Any student of economics knows that the US and every European nation uses several of Marx's 10 pillars of a communist society and socialist ideas.
Pure capitalism hasn't been around since the great depression for a reason. We've slowly matched back that direction since like the 50-60s. Which is a reason for a lot of the economic issues experienced in the West lately... We're back to the age of robber barrens. It's pretty lit.
That has improved and continues to improve over the last several decades, and the wealth disparity is a whole order of magnitude less than the U.S.
Billionaires in China are rich in name only. The only things they can get with money are a slightly fancier car and house, they aren't able to buy elections.
The wealth disparity has been roughly the same for the last 20 years...
China is an authoritarian one party state. There are not really elections to buy. And you would be daft to think a Chinese billionaire can only buy a slightly better house.
This rhetoric is common with actually existing socialist (AES) states. The reality is the world is very complex and transitions from one system to another can sometimes take centuries.
Here is a brief video from Prof. Richard Wolff that explains some things about China and it's system over the last few decades:
I've seen all of this over the years, I'm not ignorant to Prof. Wolff nor the repeated claims that the socialism with Chinese characteristics is some 4-dimensional chess to deliver communism within some inspecific timeframe.
But even in the CCPs own language and actions, it's clear they're much more interested in entrenching capitalism with a welfare state than they are transitioning to socialism.
For a "socialist" state they seem very keen on repressing the Filipino maoist insurgencies, propping up the fascist Russian regime, and maintaining a domestic system of capital accumulation that was introduced as an infamous regression from socialist principles established after their numerous revolutions.
China is objectively a lot better than many countries on dozens of metrics but calling it "actually existing socialism" is to misunderstand all three constituent words in that infamous acronym.
Respond or not, I don't expect to turn anyone's mind here. Just sad that being a different brand of capitalism that is marginally more concerned with social development than its competitors is somehow the bar for socialism among some circles.
Then why do you come here and offer only platitudes? There are plenty of things to criticize about China, about the USSR, etc. We could have nuanced discussions about these topics.
Why do you believe the things you say? What is shaping your worldview? Can you point to a government you think is doing thing well currently, or at least heading in the right direction?
Because they are here to tell us that they are the only PURE and TRUE Marxist around, the noble Maoist, here to tell us ignorant revisionists how wrong we are for supporting a country that has undertaken the greatest poverty alleviation effort in human history.
If Xi was really communist, he would've just pressed the big red communism button already! People's QOL doesn't improve over time, it's a binary, you either have it or you don't! And China clearly don't! Love me, I'm a liberal Maoist!
No one ever responds to these real questions lol you ask for sources they disappear, you ask why they believe what they believe they check right the fuck out
I've often suspected that libs and maoists tend to say exactly the same shit about China, though granted, Maoists tend to at least understand what they're talking about. Still strikes me as a little weird that this attitude has more in common with a liberal one than an ML one.
Almost like a westerner lambasting China for not being communist enough does nothing but reinforce the average westerner's perception of the place as an "evil hellhole."
I'll explain: the Comunist ideology is like one the big religions - there are lots of breakaway groups who sometimes even hate each other more than they hate everybody else.
So Xi is supposed to be a Maoist Communist and he just got called a Marxist-Leninist, about as insulting as calling a Catholic in Northern-Ireland a "Protestant".
Stay and learn about the beauty of Marxism-Leninism.
One Maoist critique of modern China is that they 'betrayed' Mao (perhaps during Deng's era but it may depend who you ask). While Mao is good for theorising revolution, he didn't say too much about socialist construction, hence the need to develop new theory. Maoists reject the notion of moving past/building on Mao; in part because they theorise revolution/socialist construction differently. Marxist-Leninists accept that Mao was an ML, as was Deng and as is Xi. This doesn't mean there aren't disagreements among MLs. But they see themselves as part of a single tradition.
In all fairness, my "knowledge" on the mater mostly hails back to the post-revolutionary period in Portugal (so the decade or so after people overthrew the fascist dictatorship in 1974) and how the communist groups which were inspired by Mao's Revolution didn't quite get along with the ones inspired by the Russian Revolution.
Some acquaintances of mine were part of some communist movement or other back then, both before and after the revolution, and the whole thing is massivelly fragmented nowadays (plenty of Communists detest the present day Communist Party in Portugal, which was inspired by 50s Soviet Union version and which they see as self-serving, autoritarian and not really fighting for the greater good).
That said, it is quite superficial knowledge, quite local and a lot of water has run under the bridge since :/
China is a dictatorship regardless of what you want to believe.
And only because you have nine parties by name it's no democracy when they form a united front and they're all just subordinate to the CCP.
I can’t tell if you’re joking or serious, since you could swap “China” with “(insert European country)” and “CCP” with “bourgeoisie” and that would check out
I could but it would be a massive stretch. I could explain it to you but it would be a massive waste of time so just enjoy your time in your surveillance state and I hope your social score stays high enough so Xi may suck your dick at some point.
but I thought Xi was an arachno-Bidenist
Xi is more far far left than vanguard of the revolution, Joe Biden 😨
whoa
who remembers? 🤔
I like how many 'staunch anti-communists' have no clue what marxism-leninism is 😂
'material...conditions? Is that like a Madonna song from the 80s?'
Modanna was the original dialectical material girl.
Cool shirt idea right there.
Liberals: "marxist-leninist? I though he was a communist!"
I have to say that I feel like the Chinese Revolution of 1949 has been utterly betrayed and sold out. Things used to be great. Now? A Marxist-Leninist? Truly dark and unprecedented times in China. I supported them until now, I can’t support Extremism smh Free TaibetJiang
Pack it up guys, gals, and everyone in between, some lib slammed poor Xi with a verbal accusation that he is what he has always been. Communism will never recover. China will collapse tomorrow.
My first downvote from a salty lib on my new account 🥹
This just in, Liberals have SLAMMED lemmygrad user @MCU_H8ER with a SCATHING downvote. More to come an 7.
'When reached for comment, the lemmygrad user claimed that the libs anger actually was making him stronger. He then said he was going to lift some weights while listening to Parenti lectures.'
just the logical thing to do 🤷
(Shocked gasp)
i can't find this video on f*x's channel, probably fake but i also didnt search very well bc it's still funny and i dont care.
but if someone does have a link share it here, it look hilarious
Something something redfash tankie something something
Crying, shaking, and shitting my pants rn. I don't want this to be true
Tankies are people who defend China (and originally the USSR)/any "communist" countries actions no matter what. While Xi is undoubtedly a tanky, the meme is just calling him a communist. Which isn't even accurate honestly. I really wish we could move past communist/socialist being an insult. It isn't. Any student of economics knows that the US and every European nation uses several of Marx's 10 pillars of a communist society and socialist ideas.
Pure capitalism hasn't been around since the great depression for a reason. We've slowly matched back that direction since like the 50-60s. Which is a reason for a lot of the economic issues experienced in the West lately... We're back to the age of robber barrens. It's pretty lit.
If he is a communist, few is doing a shit job at it. China's wealth disparity is on par with the US.
You realize that China has eliminated extreme poverty right? Also this: https://lemmygrad.ml/post/1275827
It's not a classless utopia yet, so it's a failure.
It has not and there is still massive wealth disparity.
That has improved and continues to improve over the last several decades, and the wealth disparity is a whole order of magnitude less than the U.S.
Billionaires in China are rich in name only. The only things they can get with money are a slightly fancier car and house, they aren't able to buy elections.
The wealth disparity has been roughly the same for the last 20 years...
China is an authoritarian one party state. There are not really elections to buy. And you would be daft to think a Chinese billionaire can only buy a slightly better house.
Not true.
Author-onion-tar-elon-izuhm is a buzz phrase. All politics is authoritarian.
Calling China a authoritarian one-party state is a non-insult. Its like calling a scientist intelligent and rational.
China allows multiple parties and factions. The difference is that only socialism is allowed as the baseline.
the communist party of China is about as communist as the democratic republic of the congo is democratic
I'm going to attempt to reply to this earnestly.
This rhetoric is common with actually existing socialist (AES) states. The reality is the world is very complex and transitions from one system to another can sometimes take centuries.
Here is a brief video from Prof. Richard Wolff that explains some things about China and it's system over the last few decades:
https://youtu.be/_nY3VSmA-l8
Also if you're going to mention the Democratic Republic of the Congo, do you know about Patrice Lumumba?
I've seen all of this over the years, I'm not ignorant to Prof. Wolff nor the repeated claims that the socialism with Chinese characteristics is some 4-dimensional chess to deliver communism within some inspecific timeframe.
But even in the CCPs own language and actions, it's clear they're much more interested in entrenching capitalism with a welfare state than they are transitioning to socialism.
For a "socialist" state they seem very keen on repressing the Filipino maoist insurgencies, propping up the fascist Russian regime, and maintaining a domestic system of capital accumulation that was introduced as an infamous regression from socialist principles established after their numerous revolutions.
China is objectively a lot better than many countries on dozens of metrics but calling it "actually existing socialism" is to misunderstand all three constituent words in that infamous acronym.
Respond or not, I don't expect to turn anyone's mind here. Just sad that being a different brand of capitalism that is marginally more concerned with social development than its competitors is somehow the bar for socialism among some circles.
Then why do you come here and offer only platitudes? There are plenty of things to criticize about China, about the USSR, etc. We could have nuanced discussions about these topics.
Why do you believe the things you say? What is shaping your worldview? Can you point to a government you think is doing thing well currently, or at least heading in the right direction?
Because they are here to tell us that they are the only PURE and TRUE Marxist around, the noble Maoist, here to tell us ignorant revisionists how wrong we are for supporting a country that has undertaken the greatest poverty alleviation effort in human history. If Xi was really communist, he would've just pressed the big red communism button already! People's QOL doesn't improve over time, it's a binary, you either have it or you don't! And China clearly don't! Love me, I'm a
liberalMaoist!No one ever responds to these real questions lol you ask for sources they disappear, you ask why they believe what they believe they check right the fuck out
It's largely because they haven't actually thought about these things.
On the state capitalism myth: https://chinareporting.blogspot.com/2009/11/class-nature-of-chinese-state-critique_26.html?m=1
On SWCC: https://www.qiaocollective.com/education/socialism-with-chinese-characteristics?rq=Socialism%20with%20Chinese%20characteristics
On international cooperation: https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202305/1291329.shtml
I've often suspected that libs and maoists tend to say exactly the same shit about China, though granted, Maoists tend to at least understand what they're talking about. Still strikes me as a little weird that this attitude has more in common with a liberal one than an ML one.
Almost like a westerner lambasting China for not being communist enough does nothing but reinforce the average westerner's perception of the place as an "evil hellhole."
I'll explain: the Comunist ideology is like one the big religions - there are lots of breakaway groups who sometimes even hate each other more than they hate everybody else.
So Xi is supposed to be a Maoist Communist and he just got called a Marxist-Leninist, about as insulting as calling a Catholic in Northern-Ireland a "Protestant".
Unfortunately, you are wrong about everything except for leftist infighting.
Yeah, just noticed this is post on a Lemmygrad forum.
I'll yield to the experts!
Stay and learn about the beauty of Marxism-Leninism.
One Maoist critique of modern China is that they 'betrayed' Mao (perhaps during Deng's era but it may depend who you ask). While Mao is good for theorising revolution, he didn't say too much about socialist construction, hence the need to develop new theory. Maoists reject the notion of moving past/building on Mao; in part because they theorise revolution/socialist construction differently. Marxist-Leninists accept that Mao was an ML, as was Deng and as is Xi. This doesn't mean there aren't disagreements among MLs. But they see themselves as part of a single tradition.
In all fairness, my "knowledge" on the mater mostly hails back to the post-revolutionary period in Portugal (so the decade or so after people overthrew the fascist dictatorship in 1974) and how the communist groups which were inspired by Mao's Revolution didn't quite get along with the ones inspired by the Russian Revolution.
Some acquaintances of mine were part of some communist movement or other back then, both before and after the revolution, and the whole thing is massivelly fragmented nowadays (plenty of Communists detest the present day Communist Party in Portugal, which was inspired by 50s Soviet Union version and which they see as self-serving, autoritarian and not really fighting for the greater good).
That said, it is quite superficial knowledge, quite local and a lot of water has run under the bridge since :/
Have a pleasant day.
He's just another dictator regardless of what colour he paints the regime in
take your opinions elsewhere
I love how big it is here. Really gets the message across.
Said by individual who I would bet €100 couldn’t explain even the basics of how PRC government or democratic process is structured
I'd bet $100 they would struggle to point China out on a map.
"Its the Japanese one, right?"
China is a dictatorship regardless of what you want to believe. And only because you have nine parties by name it's no democracy when they form a united front and they're all just subordinate to the CCP.
I can’t tell if you’re joking or serious, since you could swap “China” with “(insert European country)” and “CCP” with “bourgeoisie” and that would check out
I could but it would be a massive stretch. I could explain it to you but it would be a massive waste of time so just enjoy your time in your surveillance state and I hope your social score stays high enough so Xi may suck your dick at some point.
🥱
Dictator is when you raise the standard of living.