At the time I switched, the built-in blocker worked on a site I regularly used while Firefox+ublock did not (I think it would just prevent things from working or cause infinite ad-loops). If I wasn't looking for an alternative adblocker, would probably have never bothered switching. There's also the "get pocket change from using our browser" thing. Some may have been speculating on the value of BATs?
This is honestly the first valid drawback I've seen in this thread about Firefox. Personally, I have to disable most gesture-based features on my device due to my big clumsy hands and perhaps a bit of an inherited neurological problem, but I understand that most users are not like me.
I'd encourage you to share your needs with the Firefox community. I've seen some amazing features and add-ons born out of someone simply stepping forward and pointing out how useful a certain feature would be.
Your information is probably no longer accurate then. Firefox has undergone many significant updates even within the past year, and it's very likely those tools are now fully functional, as I'd suspect at some point they'd have been reported on Bugzilla.
I have to access many US government web sites regularly, including the US IRS web site, and I never have a problem.
Back when I was studying computer engineering I was also an avid fan of firefox and I also kept hearing and parroting those lines. Eventually I gave up and stuck with chromium based browsers. (Also because of other reasons, like some extensions only being available for chrome, html games support, etc)
US and portuguese governments are in different leagues. I would assume that yours has better funding and spends more on their virtual infrastructure. I doubt they are comparable, but it is possible that they fixed those issues that I had meanwhile
It's probably been fixed. I'm not just "parroting those lines" -- I'm suggesting that if you find it's still not functioning on Firefox, the thing to do is to report the issue. (I had previously said Bugzilla, but they get reported to Web Compat now.) I will mention that our IRS is not known for its efficiency and being up to date lol.
I can see that you’re enthusiast and care about firefox, it’s thanks to people like you that these tools get better. But me, for lack of better words, can’t bring myself to care that much about any piece of software that ain’t related to my job, nevermind reporting issues. I’ll use whatever gives me less trouble in my personal time, if in the future things change for chromium, I’ll come back to firefox.
When I get home I’ll check my extensions and pass you the ones that don’t exist for firefox. Right now the only one I remember isn’t really an extension, it’s the text to speech function of Edge, that uses their AI voices.
From what I remember, autoridade tributaria had some buttons or links that wouldn’t do anything on firefox. I remember suspecting it was javascript, but then noticed that Chrome didn’t have issues.
Seg social and fundo ambiental had odd behaviors but I can’t remember exactly what they were.
I remember having to use Internet Explorer to do some actions on the autoridade tributária website, like simulating and submitting IRS (even had to download an external application) but that was like 10-12 years ago. More recently, I had to do some stuff with regards to opening and closing my activity (I was on recibos verdes for a while) and did it all through Firefox. Haven't had to do much else beyond this.
As for seg. social, I just tried to log in and it said my password expired and I had to create a new one. But when I filled in the password fields and tried to click on the button to submit it, it didn't work. In any browser. Because there was no fucking link associated with the button. So the button did nothing. I had to manually click on the "recover my password" link so I could a create a new one.
When I logged in, I just clicked on a few things, even simulated my retirement pension and everything worked. It's not much of a test, I know, but it's something.
Never entered fundo ambiental so I have no idea if it works or not.
That's in your head. I cannot think of anything Firefox won't do for me. And if I came across something I needed chromium for, I would open it that one time. My privacy is worth that tiniest bit of effort.
As an independent computer consultant full time, I operate heavily through my browser for a good 60% of my work.
For me, there are a few plugins that don't exist on Firefox, which I need. The plugin environment isn't nearly as robust or kept up-to-date as chromium-based browsers.
Fair enough. That's a fairly niche case, but I could see myself using a chromium browser if I had to use this tool at work, but then switching back to Firefox for everything else.
I still wouldn't use Brave, though, and it would be even better if more developers started supporting Firefox instead.
I’d be interested to hear which plugins you are referring to as my experience with Firefox has been much the opposite. I often find the plug-in selection lacking when required to use a Chromium based browser.
Tabs folders on Android is a big reason to use Brave instead of Firefox. Tab management is way better. Not some habit. Straight facts. But Firefox has different benefits. F.E. multiple search engines to use in search bar.
Tab folders became such a nuisance for me on Chrome Mobile I started using Firefox. I keep only 5-6 tabs open at a time, webpages opening in the same tab group thing was just too confusing for my very lean tab management mind. Now my 5 tabs really had "9 tabs".
Chromium browsers could one day be forced to adopt Google Chrome’s updates to maintain their licenses. This could mean that Chrome’s war against ad-block could spread even to Brave. That gives Google too much control over the internet for any one company.
It definetly can happen. Using Firefox is very important this days. Definetly. So do I. Giving all control about WEB to Google is too bad idea. But it is reality we see.
Firefox Android extension support is a killer feature. Use it extensively. I was talking about some extensions that are not available on desktop Firefox compared to chromium browsers.
For me, everything is OK. But I heard people that needed very specific extensions for work/hobby/productivity that are not available in Firefox. So Brave will be just better on desktop then 🙂
I've never had a problem on Firefox. What is the complaint people have about browser tabs in Firefox? The only complaints I've seen have been strictly cosmetic.
I do agree it would be nice to have more folders for my mobile bookmarks. It's actually one thing that perplexes me. Seems like such a basic thing. It definitely would not make me switch browsers, though, especially not to Brave.
Edit: Perhaps ironically, I just remembered the thing that made me switch from Chrome on Android once and for all was their insistence on displaying browser tabs as cards. At the time, I had heard many of the same myths and half-truths about Firefox that are being shared in this thread (slow, buggy, won't recognize certificates). Happily, I discovered none of these things were accurate, and in fact if anything it ran faster and more efficiently on my device. It was at that point that I also started becoming more concerned about my privacy, and I subsequently learned that I was already using the best browser where privacy is concerned -- I just had to adjust a few settings and switch to a different branch. Funny how "better browser tabs" is hailed as a reason to use a chromium-based browser, when I found the better browser tabs in Firefox all along!
I don't trust Brave one bit. Its whole approach reeks of a bait-and-switch (think "we won't share or sell your data" pre-9/11 Google). Its founder is a massive homophobe and crypto-bro, and I have a massive learned distrust of homophobes and crypto-bros.
Moreover, I see no reason to use it when we already have far superior options (Firefox).
Absolutely not. Brave is a bloated mess with feature creep and stealing advertisements. It's ran by a right wing nut job that got fired from Mozilla after publicly stating he hated gay marriage. And the greatest sin of them all: it's chromium.
No idea why people consider them private over Firefox. Literally just install uBlock Origin on Firefox and you'll have a way better experience.
The red flag is that they quietly added crypto and made it opt-out by default. They have a history of shady things like this over the years, such as using ad referral links. Immediately after they get caught, they go on a marketing campaign and drown out the controversy with an influx of new users.
They basically act like it would only take a small sack of money to get them to sell all their users down the river.
Crypto is nothing but a scam that the lowest common denominators are constantly fooled into thinking its their get rich quick method, only to be shocked when they lose all their money.
Anyone involved in crypto is a scam.
anyone pushing crypto is either a scammer or a brainless moron.
Any company or group sneakily putting crypto in their shit deserves to be burned to the ground, metaphorically speaking, and the ashes pissed in .
I agree, but it’s a shame that crypto has garnered this reputation as a get rich quick scheme. It reaally had the potential to upend digital currency and end our reliance on banks.
Currency only has value when people think it has value. And at this point, the current state of bitcoin, the largest crypto, isn’t very great.
Monero is a good contender for digital currency, as it has privacy set on default and it follows the spirit of the bitcoin whitepaper than bitcoin ever did, imo. Its value is stable, and more privacy companies are accepting it as a valid currency for their services (mullvad, for example)
Crypto has garnered that reputation, because thats all it is. Since its inception. Its never been anything but.. Anyone who thinks otherwise were just people who fell for the scam.
Its nothing but a MLM for idiot techies who think they are smart, but would totally pick up a USB drive in the parking lot and plug it into a critical system to find out whats on it.
They implement profile syncing (bookmarks, cookies, history, etc) using blockchain. AFAIK the data is encrypted with your private key which is derived from a mnemonic phrase, so it’s probably ZK.
if only I can access it anyway, why the hell does it need to be on a blockchain in the first place? I still don't want everyone to have a copy of it even if it is encrypted. Nobody else should ever need it. I'd rather just sync that data between my own devices, and not everyone else's
You mean the crypto-bro browser funded by billionaire Peter Thiel, who runs the corporate intelligence agency Palantir, which contracts with the Department of Defense to spy on Americans?
Can you provide contradictory evidence? I tried to no avail. I would stop using Brave if it turns out that Thiel is having a bigger stake in Brave than I knew so far.
Its entire business model is a protection racket wrapped in a crypto scam, so no, I don't trust it!
It also doesn't help that that it's run by the incompetent dipshit who inflicted JavaScript on the world and who later got kicked out of Mozilla for being a bad person. Furthermore, being based on Chromium instead of Firefox is an unforgivable sin by itself. Really, from my perspective there's basically nothing in its favor at all.
Mozilla has made a lot of bad decisions recently(laying off 50% of staff a couple years ago), they gave up on their XR browser, and numerous performance issues on Mac. I love what Mozilla stands for, but the management has degraded quite a bit in the last 10 years. The only thing I use these days from Mozilla is Thunderbird but even that is showing its age.
I just switched to Librewolf from Brave because fuck Chromium and fuck Google.
Did I trust brave as a Browser? Yes, at least enough to use it as my daily driver. Because the worst thing they’ve done that I’m aware of is add affiliate links. When somebody noticed they didn’t bullshit their way out of it, they apologised and fixed it:
There is a lot of hand wringing about various aspects of their browser and the personality of their CEO but the browser is open source and the code is watched by a lot of eyeballs. If they went truly bad somebody is going to notice quickly.
I know it’s not going to be popular to criticise Firefox and I understand it’s importance as the last true alternative to chromium but my point is that none of the options are whiter than white. And in so far as the available options, Brave and Firefox stand head and shoulders above the rest.
I imagine product managers at Google and Microsoft would be very happy to see us shitting on one of the few open source browsers to gain any kind of traction, instead of focusing our outrage towards their behaviour.
I use Brave on my work machine. Tried Firefox, but it just collided with too many internal web tools I need to use. I also heavily use tab grouping, and last I checked, it was a no-go on FF.
People are desperately looking for a hero browser. In the end, you just may wanna roll with the browser that ticks the most boxes…
God bless Firefox. Definitely. I use Brave as a second browser sometimes. But my main browser is Firefox (Fennec) with uBlock Origin and Skip Redirect.
It has very good ad blocker / fingerprinting protection out of the box. Pretty useful! Brave Search is definetly exciting with it's own index, pretty good results and AI summarizer.
Duckduckgo had trackers in it and didn't tell anyone, proton gave away data to the swiss government. If a company is for profit it is not to be trusted.
Well, Proton is a Swiss company and, as such, is obligated to comply with legally binding orders like the one they received in the case of the arrested activist.
Expecting someone (or, in this case, a company) to risk legal repercussions just to protect one of their thousands of users is simply ridiculous, even more knowing that similar data access orders are normally issued by the Swiss authorities for really serious crimes.
As for the IP logging, everyone can turn it off in the account settings and Proton, not being subject to data retention requirements under the Swiss law, will delete all the previously saved data.
hardly even coerced. they were following the law, you know those things you have to follow if you want to continue to remain in business and functional. they also gave data post subpoena, nothing before it, so it's not really anything to be afraid of.
iirc it was interpol on behalf of French government as well, not swiss but I could be wrong on that as it doesn't matter much.
Brave as a whole? Brendan Eich is the next Elon Musk. Not in wealth, mind you, but dude's got the antics, is all I'm saying. (Not a good look. Look just what's going on with Reddit.) Also, a dipshit of EPIC proportions.
Brave Browser? Hell no. The whole marketing point is "oh, it's a web browser, but with ad blocker". ...installing uBlock Origin is a 2 minute job on Firefox and even on Edge. Have literally walked elderly people through the process. (It got even weirder when they talked about replacing ads with approved ones. I don't know if they still do that.)
I do draw the line on the whole BAT nonsense. "Oh, you can use cryptocurrencies to support your fave content creators? Even if they didn't opt in to the program in the first place, and you still make it seem like the donations go to them? And then say 'oh yeah the donations will eventually go to them IF they sign up for the program' oh FUCK YOU you're just deceiving fans aren't you."
I don't know about this take. I'm not sure how serious you are about it, but imagine a web without Javascript. Perhaps we'd all be using proprietary abominations such as Java or Flash today, not knowing what would've been possible with a more open, albeit somewhat clunky, programming language that's supported by every browser.
The way Brave goes about making money seems more shady to me than Google. Google tells you exactly what they are going to do if you're paying attention, Brave on the other hand spends its time trying to convince everyone that they are more privacy focused than the likes of Google because they have a more off the radar money making scheme with all of the Crypto junk.
If they are not doing something underhanded with it already, they are one management shakeup from starting to.
Definitely not. The whole "allow some ads to earn rewards" thing doesn't sit right with me. The only adblockers that do that are in bed with the ad companies. Firefox with UBlock Origin and NoScript + Strict security settings is all you need.
I like choice. I use Librewolf with Adnauseam for sites that are in the super sketchy category, and Brave for everything else.
Using Noscript is safe, sure, but I’m not into 1992 web browsing, except at nerdout parties where we try using an old 486 laptop running Windows 95 and Netscape 4.01 to browse today’s web.
My point is that there are reasonable steps and compromises one can take to protect their privacy somewhat. Achieving Snowden level protection is cool, but not my cup of tea; too much of a compromise and loss of functionality, sorry. Sure, you can drop a nuke (like NoScript) in retaliation, but that’s overkill and will break most modern sites out there.
Brave, on the other hand, is based on uBlock Origin with actively maintained filters. It’s also 100% compatible with custom filters too. It’s also nicely deGoogled out of the box, so that’s definitely a bonus.
What's their incentive? A crypto token that relies on you viewing ads to gain more of said token.
They probably don't track you if you have all that crap disabled, but they definitely don't want you to have it disabled. So no, I don't trust them, it's like trusting a wolf that says it's vegan.
It could be saying the truth, but just like how they murdered Braver/Bold, that wolf is probably eating your neighbouring farm's sheep
Firefox/Librewolf +containers should really be the end of the conversation every time a Chrome Clone is brought up. Throw FF a few bucks their way and you can add a different VPN per container. Shopping container with a USA VPN, social media container on an EU VPN, etc.
I'm kinda ambivalent about Brave. They're a bit too into crypto for my comfort, but the search works well and the browser seems to do what it's meant to.
I don't use Brave though. I use Firefox (or a derivative) or Gnome Web. If a site doesn't work in either of those I don't use that site.
I'm just not willing to contribute the Blink monopoly.
I don't particularly trust any Chromium-based browser, because that affords more power to Google and their efforts to bully the rest of the world with Chrome.
Nope. Iceraven or Firefox forks or just Firefox in general are the ones I use. Don't trust those guys either but at least it's better than everything else out there.
No, I don't trust them. Their idea to replace people ad with their own ad (https://archive.is/W0k4j) and their experiment with cryptocoin are two of the biggest red flags.
Just use firefox instead of brave if you wanted a privacy respecting browser
I personally do trust Brave as a company. I don't think they're perfect by any means, and I strongly disagree with and dislike their CEO, but overall I think their browser is the best Chromium option out there, and search engine is probably 2nd best to Kagi. I don't primarily use Brave's browser, I do mainly stick to and recommend hardened Firefox (as I dislike and am strongly against Chromium and it's monopoly), but for the rare times I run into a site that needs Chromium, I use Brave. I do also primarily use Brave's search engine because I think it's just currently the best option out there for search (Kagi is excellent overall but its paid and too expensive imo), and I love that Brave Search has its own index, so no reliance on big tech like Google and Microsoft, unlike other options like StartPage and DDG. I've never bothered with Brave's VPN.
I just think overall a lot of Brave as a company's controversies have been blown out of proportion and aren't as big of a deal as people make them out to be. Their browser is open source which means it can be fully audited, they have very strong privacy protections in place out of the box, and they're even recommended by trustworthy sources like Privacy Guides. Their browser and search engine is really solid from a technical standpoint, and I don't think that should be overlooked just because of a few fuck-ups as a company which were walked back and fixed.
When I have to set up one of my not-so-privacy-conscius friends' system, I usually install Brave and turn most of the shit off. Not because it's the best choice out there, but because it basically doesn't have a learning curve for ex-chrome users and is still probably the best, when it comes to chromium-based browsers.
I never trust a company that pretends to provide a browser that respects my privacy for free. "Free" and "privacy" are mutually exclusive in the corporate surveillance economy.
Not really. I used it for ~2 years but after a conversation on irc 5 months ago I switched back to Firefox and I have been mostly using it ever since. Search I trust slightly more and the VPN I dont really trust at all. Also it is better to support firefox and other smaller browser engines so chromium does not have a monopoly on web browser engines. Now that I don't use mobile as much and I don't really care about syncing I am happy with firefox. I originally started using brave because I used an iPad a lot and brave was the only free ios browser with ad block back then. The history with injecting referrals into urls and all the crypto crap makes me not trust it much anymore.
Trust is a sliding scale. The majority of Braves code (at least for their browser) is open source, this means you should at least trust them more than companies whos products are wholly proprietary.
It absolutely is a sliding scale, which is why you trust some people more than others. You have friends you can trust with some things and not others. Same thing with companies. I realize their somewhat shady but a far cry better than those I mentioned.
In order of trust I put it third for browsers that I expect to work with most of the internet. It goes Tor, Firefox, and finally Brave. I like Brave's direction and appreciate them trying to find ethical and sustainable funding models, but they're just not as heavily audited as the first two
I don't trust VPNs that I don't run, Tor is the answer here for me too. Search I am not sure how it compares to DDG tbh so no idea
In terms of level of trust, it's enough for a threat model that doesn't include state actors or any other APT, but nothing more. it shouldn't be ran with elevated privileges and should be sandboxed (i.e. flatpak) and if possible on a separate system from sensitive information. I could be convinced otherwise but I haven't seen a reputable organization discuss an audit of it's code nor have I audited it's code
Brave is (or at least, was) a good browser technically (as good as any Chromium implementation), at least while it still has the ability to turn off their crypto crap, the proxy/vpn integration and run a "clean" version, but I highly doubt those options will remain forever the way their wankbag of a CEO seems to want to go with it, he can not be trusted.
So no I cant say I trust them anymore, they will make money from you, in increasingly devious ways.
There are many, many better "Clean Chromium" browsers out there like Librewolf that are a better way to go.
Yes except for the VPN as I know nothing about it but that doesn't mean I'll go and blindly recommend any product they release, as with every other company I will read about the product as much as necessary to make an educated decision
Such a good answer. Thank you! It is always neccesary to read terms of service/privacy policy before using some product, even if it is from trusted company. Agreed!
I'm surprised that Vivaldi isn't more popular next to Brave tbh.
You get Chromium with a bunch of other features if you want them, but no crypto crap. They even run their own Mastodon instance with built-in functionality out of the box.
By default, sure. But uBlock is way more powerful when you configure it.
Seriously, take a look at their wiki. I doubt that Brave lets you choose exactly which domains to connect to on a per-site basis.
And do you really want an advertising company to make your adblocker? They’ve done shadier stuff.
Their point is to be an ethical ad company. So i still kinda trust them. Also, I use Firefox + uBlock Origin on Hard Mode both on PC and Android. Brave has really good, balanced ad blocker which does not break sites but block ads and trackers.
It is just convenient, open-source, still private, with very good adblocker and extension support. Why not to recommend (instead of chromium monopoly but it is definetly another story).
Not their browser or VPN. But I do like and use their search as default on Firefox. Other popular search engines leech off big tech's index (DDG: Bing, Startpage: Google), at least Brave maintains their own index. Their AI summarizer is pretty good.
I'm using Firefox & Brave Search which is kinda ironic. I'm open to other suggestions if anybody can recommend anything close to Google and with good support for searches in other languages (I speak Polish)
I use Firefox sometimes, but for personal certificates it doesn't work. The lack of updates on Kiwi and some ads that Brave blocks and Kiwi not made me stop using it.
Well I have been looking for brave replacement on Android.
Brave has been slowly degrading itself for the past 2 years with shit ton of bloat being put in the browser.
I do have FF but for some unique sites, I have to use a chromium browser. Cromite (Bromite's Fork) seems interesting for now. I will wait for it to get more stable as things like auto-fill pass don't work and more.
this is testing privacy. not security. security would moreso fall under sandbox strength and trust placed on web content, which chromium beats Firefox a bit (fission being rolled out by default has decreased this metric, however.)
the thing about brave is whenever a company markets itself as privacy forward with no obvious business model/monetization strategy, it's safe to assume that, if they're not already, they will begin selling user data/ads heavily in the future. especially with brave searches lack of care towards web publisher's right not to be indexed, and Brendan eich generally being a gremlin of a human, I won't go near it. I'm not even starting with their crypto nonsense.
edit: and to the people saying they don't care what the CEO thinks just realize, by supporting the product, you support the company and in turn, the CEO. to support him means, at the very least, complicity with his views.
Being a chromium skin is a business decision. I don't like it, but at least I understand the thought process. The crypto stuff however? No thanks. That's when I take my business elsewhere.
I've been bouncing around mobile browsers for a while now trying to find one I'm ok with.
I started with Chrome, because it worked reliably and had a decent UI. Then as time went on and Google stopped not being evil, I switched to Brave. Chromium based, but thankfully not Google. The endless crypto shilling started to grate on me, and I started looking into the company, and decided I wanted out.
I gave Firefox a try because I love it on the PC. It didn't work. I love a lot about it, but there are a few excruciating things on Firefox mobile that I couldn't handle. Swiping to close tabs, jump to a new Google image, etc was frustratingly insensitive. The browser would freak out and crash the tab about 30% of the time I went landscape full screen on a video. I had to go back to Brave for a bit.
Now I'm trying out Vivaldi. Chromium based again, but no crypto shilling, and lots of customizability. I haven't heard anything about their CEO being a bigot, or selling data to other companies, but it could be happening. Being able to sync between PC and mobile is nice, and one of the reasons I went with brave earlier and tried Firefox.
It has been updated awhile through Chocolatey for Windows, Fedora maintains a version of IceCat, and anyone who ports Fedora's version like SpakyLinux for Devuan/Debian.
Also the scripts are publicly available to strip Firefox and turn into Icecat, otherwise everybody can use Librewolf.
While I would like to try Brave at some point, I can’t really support any browser based on Chromium. Google’s control over the browser market is far too strong as it is, and I would prefer not to support that by using a browser made with their web technologies. Additionally, Brave has a handful of other issues that would prevent me from choosing it, like their cryptocurrency integration and advertising model.
I doubt they're doing anything to secerative in the background. Not a fan of Bat or their affiliate link scamdle, but also not a fan of Firefox's ads, telemetry, trademark claims against Firefox forks, and accepting Google money for bad defaults - as I'm not a fan of Vivaldi being closed source and their adblock that doesn't block all ads.
Brave is great for somebody who doesn't know/want to configure defaults beyond optionally disabling Bat. If you can then Firefox & derivatives might give a better experience.
Brave is also Chromium based, but being a heavy fork it doesn't hold onto the worst parts, making it more alright.
I do use it sometimes, some websites only work properly on chromium-based and it's handy when I need to cast something to chromecast but I really dislike like their crypto thing, I prefer Firefox most of the time.
I use Brave on my pi400 and on my tablets, phone. It works, and it can use Chrome extensions. I mostly use Firefox on my pi400, but there is the odd site that doesn't work with FIrefox. Every web browser sucks in some way. I could care less what views the CEO of any company holds.
yes the browsers and the search engine. techlore the board and I've had a fantastic experience with it's product. even if it may be unreliable (which I don't think) it will still be better than chrome or edge
I read through the comments and figured I should try to help balance the discussion. For risk of getting pounced on, I use brave browser and brave search for all my personal needs. It is pre configured with things I care about out of the box, ipfs on mobile, great adblock by default, I experimented with their ad/crypto thing. I’m very happy we have companies trying to do new things, the naysayers will shit on innovation always, so “do your own research” lmao. Other features are a built in crypto wallet.
Other things I care about are their terms of service. Whether you believe it or not, at least we have a company out there trying to champion privacy by default. DuckDuckGo is similar on that regard. They also have their own search engine and their AI powered answers is very good, much better than Google’s at this point. I find myself not having to go to Google as often anymore. It’s really good these days!
They also push the envelope and put their money where their mouth is so to speak privacy wise by continually coming out with new features for privacy and security. I honestly do not understand how a privacy community will shit all over Brave. And no I don’t care about their founder nor about their copyright AI infringing API. Have none of you sailed the high seas? If it personally affects you then sue them.
Such a good write up. Thank you. Kinda same opinion. I mainly trust Brave. Yup, there are some weird things were done but who didn't. Especially if you try to do massive project with new finance model and at the same time go against biggest tech. Of course there will be some caviots here and there. They put their money where their mouth. The most important point!
no i dont trust brave. i did never understand why people would choose brave over firefox+ublockorigen
Popular tech (a la pop sci or pop psych). Brave uses the right techy sounding buzzwords to appeal to the pseudo power user.
At the time I switched, the built-in blocker worked on a site I regularly used while Firefox+ublock did not (I think it would just prevent things from working or cause infinite ad-loops). If I wasn't looking for an alternative adblocker, would probably have never bothered switching. There's also the "get pocket change from using our browser" thing. Some may have been speculating on the value of BATs?
I switched back to Firefox, but the one issue I'm having is the gesture add-ons. They just don't work near as well as the ones in Chrome ☹️
This is honestly the first valid drawback I've seen in this thread about Firefox. Personally, I have to disable most gesture-based features on my device due to my big clumsy hands and perhaps a bit of an inherited neurological problem, but I understand that most users are not like me.
I'd encourage you to share your needs with the Firefox community. I've seen some amazing features and add-ons born out of someone simply stepping forward and pointing out how useful a certain feature would be.
I would have choses firefox if it had the support for tab grouping, something chromium browsers do really well and something I need for my workflow.
Chromium based browsers tend to have less issues. I have to use some government websites that have features that won’t work on firefox
Which government web sites don't work? I'd like to report them on Bugzilla.
Portuguese IRS and Social Security websites. It’s been years since I tried to access them through firefox though
Your information is probably no longer accurate then. Firefox has undergone many significant updates even within the past year, and it's very likely those tools are now fully functional, as I'd suspect at some point they'd have been reported on Bugzilla.
I have to access many US government web sites regularly, including the US IRS web site, and I never have a problem.
Back when I was studying computer engineering I was also an avid fan of firefox and I also kept hearing and parroting those lines. Eventually I gave up and stuck with chromium based browsers. (Also because of other reasons, like some extensions only being available for chrome, html games support, etc)
US and portuguese governments are in different leagues. I would assume that yours has better funding and spends more on their virtual infrastructure. I doubt they are comparable, but it is possible that they fixed those issues that I had meanwhile
It's probably been fixed. I'm not just "parroting those lines" -- I'm suggesting that if you find it's still not functioning on Firefox, the thing to do is to report the issue. (I had previously said Bugzilla, but they get reported to Web Compat now.) I will mention that our IRS is not known for its efficiency and being up to date lol.
Which extensions are missing on Firefox?
I can see that you’re enthusiast and care about firefox, it’s thanks to people like you that these tools get better. But me, for lack of better words, can’t bring myself to care that much about any piece of software that ain’t related to my job, nevermind reporting issues. I’ll use whatever gives me less trouble in my personal time, if in the future things change for chromium, I’ll come back to firefox.
When I get home I’ll check my extensions and pass you the ones that don’t exist for firefox. Right now the only one I remember isn’t really an extension, it’s the text to speech function of Edge, that uses their AI voices.
That used to be true, and I keep Chrome and Edge installed just in case, but honestly I haven’t had to use a different browser in years.
Any web page problems that I found turned out not to be Firefox related.
But if you like Chrome, there’s nothing wrong with that either.
To be clear, I don’t like Chrome itself, I use Edge and sometimes Brave.
Depending on how the whole DRM and adblock thing goes, I might come back to firefox.
Portuguese here. Haven't had to use anything but Firefox on the IRS and Social Security websites. What are you having trouble accessing?
From what I remember, autoridade tributaria had some buttons or links that wouldn’t do anything on firefox. I remember suspecting it was javascript, but then noticed that Chrome didn’t have issues.
Seg social and fundo ambiental had odd behaviors but I can’t remember exactly what they were.
I remember having to use Internet Explorer to do some actions on the autoridade tributária website, like simulating and submitting IRS (even had to download an external application) but that was like 10-12 years ago. More recently, I had to do some stuff with regards to opening and closing my activity (I was on recibos verdes for a while) and did it all through Firefox. Haven't had to do much else beyond this.
As for seg. social, I just tried to log in and it said my password expired and I had to create a new one. But when I filled in the password fields and tried to click on the button to submit it, it didn't work. In any browser. Because there was no fucking link associated with the button. So the button did nothing. I had to manually click on the "recover my password" link so I could a create a new one.
When I logged in, I just clicked on a few things, even simulated my retirement pension and everything worked. It's not much of a test, I know, but it's something.
Never entered fundo ambiental so I have no idea if it works or not.
why don't you read mozilla's privacy policy and compare it brave's
Because chromium-based browsers are better in some regards (extensions, good folder support on android). Habit also matter 🙂
That's in your head. I cannot think of anything Firefox won't do for me. And if I came across something I needed chromium for, I would open it that one time. My privacy is worth that tiniest bit of effort.
As an independent computer consultant full time, I operate heavily through my browser for a good 60% of my work.
The ability to send tabs to my phone or desktop at will is enough for me. Firefox always.
For me, there are a few plugins that don't exist on Firefox, which I need. The plugin environment isn't nearly as robust or kept up-to-date as chromium-based browsers.
Which plugins are they?
Mainly Dragon Medical One
Fair enough. That's a fairly niche case, but I could see myself using a chromium browser if I had to use this tool at work, but then switching back to Firefox for everything else.
I still wouldn't use Brave, though, and it would be even better if more developers started supporting Firefox instead.
I agree. I guess I could just use Firefox on mobile and home but use Brave for work.
I’d be interested to hear which plugins you are referring to as my experience with Firefox has been much the opposite. I often find the plug-in selection lacking when required to use a Chromium based browser.
Mainly Dragon Medical One
Tabs folders on Android is a big reason to use Brave instead of Firefox. Tab management is way better. Not some habit. Straight facts. But Firefox has different benefits. F.E. multiple search engines to use in search bar.
Tab folders became such a nuisance for me on Chrome Mobile I started using Firefox. I keep only 5-6 tabs open at a time, webpages opening in the same tab group thing was just too confusing for my very lean tab management mind. Now my 5 tabs really had "9 tabs".
Firefox tab management is way simpler. It can be good for some people. But sometimes I miss good tab management support in Firefox.
I really like Vivaldi's tab management on Android myself. It's more desktop like.
Yup. Good to know you are happy 😃🤘
@FarLine99 @orbituary that's just Google Chrome tab management. You can get the same thing from Cromite, and it's not even owned by an ad company!
Yup. Cromite is also a very good option. Good to see legacy of Bromite is not lost.
Chromium browsers could one day be forced to adopt Google Chrome’s updates to maintain their licenses. This could mean that Chrome’s war against ad-block could spread even to Brave. That gives Google too much control over the internet for any one company.
It definetly can happen. Using Firefox is very important this days. Definetly. So do I. Giving all control about WEB to Google is too bad idea. But it is reality we see.
you mean how Brave doesn't let you install any on mobile, while Firefox does?
Firefox Android extension support is a killer feature. Use it extensively. I was talking about some extensions that are not available on desktop Firefox compared to chromium browsers.
Being able to use Ublock Origin on my Android was a game changer. I can't see using any other browser on mobile.
Can I ask which extensions on chromium browsers that you use that aren't on Firefox. For me, I've found every extension I ever needed on Firefox.
For me, everything is OK. But I heard people that needed very specific extensions for work/hobby/productivity that are not available in Firefox. So Brave will be just better on desktop then 🙂
Can you expand on this? What do you mean by "folder support"? I use Firefox on Android (Fennec branch), and I guess I'm not sure what I'm missing.
Folders for browser tabs. And all in all, working with tabs is more convenient in Chromium browsers.
I've never had a problem on Firefox. What is the complaint people have about browser tabs in Firefox? The only complaints I've seen have been strictly cosmetic.
I do agree it would be nice to have more folders for my mobile bookmarks. It's actually one thing that perplexes me. Seems like such a basic thing. It definitely would not make me switch browsers, though, especially not to Brave.
Edit: Perhaps ironically, I just remembered the thing that made me switch from Chrome on Android once and for all was their insistence on displaying browser tabs as cards. At the time, I had heard many of the same myths and half-truths about Firefox that are being shared in this thread (slow, buggy, won't recognize certificates). Happily, I discovered none of these things were accurate, and in fact if anything it ran faster and more efficiently on my device. It was at that point that I also started becoming more concerned about my privacy, and I subsequently learned that I was already using the best browser where privacy is concerned -- I just had to adjust a few settings and switch to a different branch. Funny how "better browser tabs" is hailed as a reason to use a chromium-based browser, when I found the better browser tabs in Firefox all along!
Are you suggesting Firefox doesn't work out of the box?
No, I mean thst Firefox does not have privacy enchainment tools enabled/installed out of the box. You have to do it manually.
Also a big reason to use it.
I don't trust Brave one bit. Its whole approach reeks of a bait-and-switch (think "we won't share or sell your data" pre-9/11 Google). Its founder is a massive homophobe and crypto-bro, and I have a massive learned distrust of homophobes and crypto-bros.
Moreover, I see no reason to use it when we already have far superior options (Firefox).
Remember when facebook was a new alternative to myspace that offered privacy and control over who sees your posts? Pepperidge farm remembers.
No
/thread
This is the way
Absolutely not. Brave is a bloated mess with feature creep and stealing advertisements. It's ran by a right wing nut job that got fired from Mozilla after publicly stating he hated gay marriage. And the greatest sin of them all: it's chromium.
No idea why people consider them private over Firefox. Literally just install uBlock Origin on Firefox and you'll have a way better experience.
LibreWolf is better.
LibreFox is LibreWolf now btw
You are right 👍
Google monopoly which is causing huge issues right now
Chromium isn't that bad. It's Google that's bad
it's involved in crypto. That's a permanent red flag for me.
The red flag is that they quietly added crypto and made it opt-out by default. They have a history of shady things like this over the years, such as using ad referral links. Immediately after they get caught, they go on a marketing campaign and drown out the controversy with an influx of new users.
They basically act like it would only take a small sack of money to get them to sell all their users down the river.
the red flag for me is that they have anything to do with cryptocurrencies at all. Anything else is superfluous details.
I view anything to do with cryptocurrency as a scam. Which, I have found, is the safest bet to make.
It's incredibly volatile as an investment, so yes avoiding it would be safest.
Cryptomining as a feature in software is most definitely a scam.
Yep.
Crypto is nothing but a scam that the lowest common denominators are constantly fooled into thinking its their get rich quick method, only to be shocked when they lose all their money.
Anyone involved in crypto is a scam.
anyone pushing crypto is either a scammer or a brainless moron.
Any company or group sneakily putting crypto in their shit deserves to be burned to the ground, metaphorically speaking, and the ashes pissed in .
I agree, but it’s a shame that crypto has garnered this reputation as a get rich quick scheme. It reaally had the potential to upend digital currency and end our reliance on banks.
Currency only has value when people think it has value. And at this point, the current state of bitcoin, the largest crypto, isn’t very great.
Monero is a good contender for digital currency, as it has privacy set on default and it follows the spirit of the bitcoin whitepaper than bitcoin ever did, imo. Its value is stable, and more privacy companies are accepting it as a valid currency for their services (mullvad, for example)
Crypto has garnered that reputation, because thats all it is. Since its inception. Its never been anything but.. Anyone who thinks otherwise were just people who fell for the scam.
Its nothing but a MLM for idiot techies who think they are smart, but would totally pick up a USB drive in the parking lot and plug it into a critical system to find out whats on it.
I've heard they store your cookies on the block chain, or something.
They implement profile syncing (bookmarks, cookies, history, etc) using blockchain. AFAIK the data is encrypted with your private key which is derived from a mnemonic phrase, so it’s probably ZK.
if only I can access it anyway, why the hell does it need to be on a blockchain in the first place? I still don't want everyone to have a copy of it even if it is encrypted. Nobody else should ever need it. I'd rather just sync that data between my own devices, and not everyone else's
Fair enough. Are there extensions for Chromium/Firefox that do multi-device sync properly (e.g. strictly peer to peer)?
Never trust Brave. The CEO is a horrible person too
You mean the crypto-bro browser funded by billionaire Peter Thiel, who runs the corporate intelligence agency Palantir, which contracts with the Department of Defense to spy on Americans?
Uh, no.
According to Brave's CEO, that's not really true though: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25840586
Can you provide contradictory evidence? I tried to no avail. I would stop using Brave if it turns out that Thiel is having a bigger stake in Brave than I knew so far.
Its entire business model is a protection racket wrapped in a crypto scam, so no, I don't trust it!
It also doesn't help that that it's run by the incompetent dipshit who inflicted JavaScript on the world and who later got kicked out of Mozilla for being a bad person. Furthermore, being based on Chromium instead of Firefox is an unforgivable sin by itself. Really, from my perspective there's basically nothing in its favor at all.
and they tried to add a cryptominer to the browser.
Never trust a web browser sold to you with crypto incentives.
Firefox is foss, transparent and it has more than enough add-ons to make brave pointless.
Oh no!
(no one cares)
Exactly this.
Plus, Brave's CEO is a piece of shit
and firefox has manifest v2 so you can controll what network loads.
Never trust anything sold to you with crypto incentives honestly.
Games, software, no matter what.
Firefox is the only browser I trust.
And I don’t trust them, but from all other options they seem the ones that I will accept.
Honest question: what do you have against Mozilla/firefox?
They're a company, and a company is a collection of people driven by financial motives. You shouldn't trust any company implicitly.
Mozilla has made a lot of bad decisions recently(laying off 50% of staff a couple years ago), they gave up on their XR browser, and numerous performance issues on Mac. I love what Mozilla stands for, but the management has degraded quite a bit in the last 10 years. The only thing I use these days from Mozilla is Thunderbird but even that is showing its age.
.
Lesser of two evils
That approach gets you evil solutions.
I welcome any alternatives to the current situation, but unfortunately that's where we are right now.
The only solution would be a massive effort that requires decades of engineering hours and a few million dollars.
CEO is a massive bigot. no way
👌🙂
I just switched to Librewolf from Brave because fuck Chromium and fuck Google.
Did I trust brave as a Browser? Yes, at least enough to use it as my daily driver. Because the worst thing they’ve done that I’m aware of is add affiliate links. When somebody noticed they didn’t bullshit their way out of it, they apologised and fixed it:
https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/8/21283769/brave-browser-affiliate-links-crypto-privacy-ceo-apology
There is a lot of hand wringing about various aspects of their browser and the personality of their CEO but the browser is open source and the code is watched by a lot of eyeballs. If they went truly bad somebody is going to notice quickly.
They are a company and have to find a way to make money but they never once forced anything on me. It was always relatively simple to disable anything they added that I didn’t want and they never added anything surreptitiously. Unlike Firefox: https://medium.com/@neothefox/firefox-installs-add-ons-into-your-browser-without-consent-again-d3e2c8e08587 and https://techcrunch.com/2017/12/15/mozillas-mr-robot-promo-backfires-after-it-installs-firefox-extension-without-permission/
I know it’s not going to be popular to criticise Firefox and I understand it’s importance as the last true alternative to chromium but my point is that none of the options are whiter than white. And in so far as the available options, Brave and Firefox stand head and shoulders above the rest.
I imagine product managers at Google and Microsoft would be very happy to see us shitting on one of the few open source browsers to gain any kind of traction, instead of focusing our outrage towards their behaviour.
This comment is way underrated. Thanks for this.
I use Brave on my work machine. Tried Firefox, but it just collided with too many internal web tools I need to use. I also heavily use tab grouping, and last I checked, it was a no-go on FF.
People are desperately looking for a hero browser. In the end, you just may wanna roll with the browser that ticks the most boxes…
Yup. Brave and Firefox are basically the best options out there. Big tech is very happy when privacy people are shitting about choice.
The best options for me is either Librewolf or ungoogled chromium when it comes to privacy.
No.
I'd prefer them over Chrome, jus slightly, but thank the gods for Firefox.
God bless Firefox. Definitely. I use Brave as a second browser sometimes. But my main browser is Firefox (Fennec) with uBlock Origin and Skip Redirect.
Anything that promotes crypto usually reeks of a scam.
Not always 😃
Probably why they said "usually."
Yes always actually
Always
I can never trust them again after they got caught injection their own affiliate codes in URLs
When people complained, they removed it and apologized.
Is it that much worse than this?
At least Firefox wasn't nefarious even if it was a dumb idea.
How is it nefarious?
I think Brave redirecting URL's to affiliate links would fit under the umbrella of being nefarious.
Ok... But why?
I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to ask?
Brave is shady
https://stackdiary.com/brave-selling-copyrighted-data-for-ai-training/
My view: Brave browser is a pretty useless Chrome reskin with crypto ads attached. Brave search is a pretty new and exciting alternative to Google.
The crypto bit alone makes the browser super-sketchy. By now, I think everybody has realized crypto is a giant scam.
It has very good ad blocker / fingerprinting protection out of the box. Pretty useful! Brave Search is definetly exciting with it's own index, pretty good results and AI summarizer.
The aren't supporting the Web Integrity API
Just use Firefox ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The point of web diversity is to allow people to use what browser they want. If you like Firefox use it, if someone else wants to use Brave, let them.
Brave is not a bad browser, turn on what you want, turn off what you don't. The idea that there must be a right and wrong is stupid.
To write off an entire browser because of one person at the company doesn't really make sense.
To write it off because "it's chromium" is also a problem because they don't support chrome decisions and are not applying their trash to it.
To write it off because crypto is attached is ignorant because you're welcome to just turn those features off.
There is only one question: does it use blink?
I am sure those who bought bitcoin relatively early and are sitting on $100K+ worth of bitcoin disagree…
You're got going to magically turn into one of these people by using Brave btw.
I am one of those people.
The circus is that way.
"Do you trust [company name] ? -No."
I trust DuckDuckGo and Proton.
Duckduckgo had trackers in it and didn't tell anyone, proton gave away data to the swiss government. If a company is for profit it is not to be trusted.
Well, Proton is a Swiss company and, as such, is obligated to comply with legally binding orders like the one they received in the case of the arrested activist. Expecting someone (or, in this case, a company) to risk legal repercussions just to protect one of their thousands of users is simply ridiculous, even more knowing that similar data access orders are normally issued by the Swiss authorities for really serious crimes. As for the IP logging, everyone can turn it off in the account settings and Proton, not being subject to data retention requirements under the Swiss law, will delete all the previously saved data.
More info can be found in this article they published just after the incident: https://proton.me/blog/climate-activist-arrest
*proton was coerced into collecting data and giving it to the swiss government
hardly even coerced. they were following the law, you know those things you have to follow if you want to continue to remain in business and functional. they also gave data post subpoena, nothing before it, so it's not really anything to be afraid of.
iirc it was interpol on behalf of French government as well, not swiss but I could be wrong on that as it doesn't matter much.
I blindly trusted these two. A lesson learnt.
Duckduckgo didn't track anyone if I recall correctly.
I think they whitelisted (or it was a bug, can't remember) some Microsoft trackers.
Not great, but not as bad as it looks.
DuckDuckGo more than Brave Search yep
Nope. And you shouldn't as well
Will see in the future 😉
Brave as a whole? Brendan Eich is the next Elon Musk. Not in wealth, mind you, but dude's got the antics, is all I'm saying. (Not a good look. Look just what's going on with Reddit.) Also, a dipshit of EPIC proportions.
Brave Browser? Hell no. The whole marketing point is "oh, it's a web browser, but with ad blocker". ...installing uBlock Origin is a 2 minute job on Firefox and even on Edge. Have literally walked elderly people through the process. (It got even weirder when they talked about replacing ads with approved ones. I don't know if they still do that.)
I do draw the line on the whole BAT nonsense. "Oh, you can use cryptocurrencies to support your fave content creators? Even if they didn't opt in to the program in the first place, and you still make it seem like the donations go to them? And then say 'oh yeah the donations will eventually go to them IF they sign up for the program' oh FUCK YOU you're just deceiving fans aren't you."
Say what you will of Elon Musk, at least he didn't inflict Javascript upon the world.
I don't know about this take. I'm not sure how serious you are about it, but imagine a web without Javascript. Perhaps we'd all be using proprietary abominations such as Java or Flash today, not knowing what would've been possible with a more open, albeit somewhat clunky, programming language that's supported by every browser.
Just because something is slightly less atrocious than something else doesn't make it good.
No.
The way Brave goes about making money seems more shady to me than Google. Google tells you exactly what they are going to do if you're paying attention, Brave on the other hand spends its time trying to convince everyone that they are more privacy focused than the likes of Google because they have a more off the radar money making scheme with all of the Crypto junk.
If they are not doing something underhanded with it already, they are one management shakeup from starting to.
Definitely not. The whole "allow some ads to earn rewards" thing doesn't sit right with me. The only adblockers that do that are in bed with the ad companies. Firefox with UBlock Origin and NoScript + Strict security settings is all you need.
NoScript is obsolete with uBlock
what about cross site scripting?
How is NoScript obsoleted by uBlock?
The features of NoScript are also present in uBlock
You can turns that off… also those ads are text notifications that are shown at predetermined (by the user) time intervals.
I like choice. I use Librewolf with Adnauseam for sites that are in the super sketchy category, and Brave for everything else.
Using Noscript is safe, sure, but I’m not into 1992 web browsing, except at nerdout parties where we try using an old 486 laptop running Windows 95 and Netscape 4.01 to browse today’s web.
My point is that there are reasonable steps and compromises one can take to protect their privacy somewhat. Achieving Snowden level protection is cool, but not my cup of tea; too much of a compromise and loss of functionality, sorry. Sure, you can drop a nuke (like NoScript) in retaliation, but that’s overkill and will break most modern sites out there.
Brave, on the other hand, is based on uBlock Origin with actively maintained filters. It’s also 100% compatible with custom filters too. It’s also nicely deGoogled out of the box, so that’s definitely a bonus.
Not at all.
What's their incentive? A crypto token that relies on you viewing ads to gain more of said token.
They probably don't track you if you have all that crap disabled, but they definitely don't want you to have it disabled. So no, I don't trust them, it's like trusting a wolf that says it's vegan.
It could be saying the truth, but just like how they murdered Braver/Bold, that wolf is probably eating your neighbouring farm's sheep
Not even a little bit.
What are your reasons? 🙂
No, Brendan Eich is an asshole and shady things are still shady, even if you can turn them off.
Firefox/Librewolf +containers should really be the end of the conversation every time a Chrome Clone is brought up. Throw FF a few bucks their way and you can add a different VPN per container. Shopping container with a USA VPN, social media container on an EU VPN, etc.
I'm kinda ambivalent about Brave. They're a bit too into crypto for my comfort, but the search works well and the browser seems to do what it's meant to.
I don't use Brave though. I use Firefox (or a derivative) or Gnome Web. If a site doesn't work in either of those I don't use that site.
I'm just not willing to contribute the Blink monopoly.
Nope.
Short and to the point 👏
No. The CEO is a POS.
I don't particularly trust any Chromium-based browser, because that affords more power to Google and their efforts to bully the rest of the world with Chrome.
I don't trust non-free software
Careful, he's based
So you trust the free stuff? This makes zero sense.
Probably referring to free open-source software and not just free to download.
Free as in freedom (libre), not free as in free beer (gratis).
Nope. Iceraven or Firefox forks or just Firefox in general are the ones I use. Don't trust those guys either but at least it's better than everything else out there.
Absolutely not. They have a history of one scam after another and now they're supposed to be trusted for some of the most privacy critical tools?
As long it's open source and audited,i trust them.
Nope
No, I don't trust them. Their idea to replace people ad with their own ad (https://archive.is/W0k4j) and their experiment with cryptocoin are two of the biggest red flags.
Just use firefox instead of brave if you wanted a privacy respecting browser
👍🙂
Nope.
Never trusted them, they just feel like a Opera clone with a "crypto bro" mindset haha
Don’t trust Brave nor its conspiracy spreading, narrow-minded CEO Brendan Eich.
Absolutely not
brave is like the mcafee of browsers Theoretically protects you, but there are much better options
Hell no lol
The only correct answer.
I personally do trust Brave as a company. I don't think they're perfect by any means, and I strongly disagree with and dislike their CEO, but overall I think their browser is the best Chromium option out there, and search engine is probably 2nd best to Kagi. I don't primarily use Brave's browser, I do mainly stick to and recommend hardened Firefox (as I dislike and am strongly against Chromium and it's monopoly), but for the rare times I run into a site that needs Chromium, I use Brave. I do also primarily use Brave's search engine because I think it's just currently the best option out there for search (Kagi is excellent overall but its paid and too expensive imo), and I love that Brave Search has its own index, so no reliance on big tech like Google and Microsoft, unlike other options like StartPage and DDG. I've never bothered with Brave's VPN.
I just think overall a lot of Brave as a company's controversies have been blown out of proportion and aren't as big of a deal as people make them out to be. Their browser is open source which means it can be fully audited, they have very strong privacy protections in place out of the box, and they're even recommended by trustworthy sources like Privacy Guides. Their browser and search engine is really solid from a technical standpoint, and I don't think that should be overlooked just because of a few fuck-ups as a company which were walked back and fixed.
Brendan Eich is a little bitch.
No.
When I have to set up one of my not-so-privacy-conscius friends' system, I usually install Brave and turn most of the shit off. Not because it's the best choice out there, but because it basically doesn't have a learning curve for ex-chrome users and is still probably the best, when it comes to chromium-based browsers.
I never trust a company that pretends to provide a browser that respects my privacy for free. "Free" and "privacy" are mutually exclusive in the corporate surveillance economy.
Why would I?
Not really. I used it for ~2 years but after a conversation on irc 5 months ago I switched back to Firefox and I have been mostly using it ever since. Search I trust slightly more and the VPN I dont really trust at all. Also it is better to support firefox and other smaller browser engines so chromium does not have a monopoly on web browser engines. Now that I don't use mobile as much and I don't really care about syncing I am happy with firefox. I originally started using brave because I used an iPad a lot and brave was the only free ios browser with ad block back then. The history with injecting referrals into urls and all the crypto crap makes me not trust it much anymore.
Overall, no. Compared to Apple, Google, and Microsoft? Yes.
What is your distrust based on? Just curious to know 😁
Just a general distrust of all companies because they have a habit of using my data for their own purposes.
Trust is a sliding scale. The majority of Braves code (at least for their browser) is open source, this means you should at least trust them more than companies whos products are wholly proprietary.
Code is either open source or it's not. Brave is not fully open source which means you have no proper way of vetting its operation.
From everything I've read, it is fully open source. What parts of the browser are not open source?
It absolutely is a sliding scale, which is why you trust some people more than others. You have friends you can trust with some things and not others. Same thing with companies. I realize their somewhat shady but a far cry better than those I mentioned.
In order of trust I put it third for browsers that I expect to work with most of the internet. It goes Tor, Firefox, and finally Brave. I like Brave's direction and appreciate them trying to find ethical and sustainable funding models, but they're just not as heavily audited as the first two
I don't trust VPNs that I don't run, Tor is the answer here for me too. Search I am not sure how it compares to DDG tbh so no idea
In terms of level of trust, it's enough for a threat model that doesn't include state actors or any other APT, but nothing more. it shouldn't be ran with elevated privileges and should be sandboxed (i.e. flatpak) and if possible on a separate system from sensitive information. I could be convinced otherwise but I haven't seen a reputable organization discuss an audit of it's code nor have I audited it's code
Fuck no.
Brave is (or at least, was) a good browser technically (as good as any Chromium implementation), at least while it still has the ability to turn off their crypto crap, the proxy/vpn integration and run a "clean" version, but I highly doubt those options will remain forever the way their wankbag of a CEO seems to want to go with it, he can not be trusted.
So no I cant say I trust them anymore, they will make money from you, in increasingly devious ways.
There are many, many better "Clean Chromium" browsers out there like Librewolf that are a better way to go.
Nothing chrome based deserves my trust. Don’t need to even start about the shady crypto shit in regard to brave.
No
Absolutely NO
No. Still stumps me why some people put it up there with Firefox, there is no contest. Brave is sketch as hell.
Because chromium-based browsers sometimes just better than Firefox. That's it. Habits are also important.
Yes except for the VPN as I know nothing about it but that doesn't mean I'll go and blindly recommend any product they release, as with every other company I will read about the product as much as necessary to make an educated decision
Such a good answer. Thank you! It is always neccesary to read terms of service/privacy policy before using some product, even if it is from trusted company. Agreed!
This is where https://tosdr.org/ is very handy, can't recommend it enough
Thank you. Awesome resource! ❤️
No. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
I'm surprised that Vivaldi isn't more popular next to Brave tbh.
You get Chromium with a bunch of other features if you want them, but no crypto crap. They even run their own Mastodon instance with built-in functionality out of the box.
Vivaldi has way worse adblock compared to Brave. Not a replacement.
There are some places where yes. Brave has VERY good, balanced ad blocker built-in.
By default, sure. But uBlock is way more powerful when you configure it. Seriously, take a look at their wiki. I doubt that Brave lets you choose exactly which domains to connect to on a per-site basis. And do you really want an advertising company to make your adblocker? They’ve done shadier stuff.
Their point is to be an ethical ad company. So i still kinda trust them. Also, I use Firefox + uBlock Origin on Hard Mode both on PC and Android. Brave has really good, balanced ad blocker which does not break sites but block ads and trackers.
Why wouldn't you just install uBlock Origin on them though?
Is vivaldi still closed-source?
No
If its a Chrome reskin (which it is, ofc) it's a no go. And that's only the tip of the iceberg with this garbage tech bro tier software.
No, of course.
And I don't understand this stupid Brave promotions from DT, CTT and other bloggers.
It is just convenient, open-source, still private, with very good adblocker and extension support. Why not to recommend (instead of chromium monopoly but it is definetly another story).
I did once, but after the crypto thing, then the trying to sell rights to other people's content, then finding out how awful Eich is, it's a 'no'.
Not their browser or VPN. But I do like and use their search as default on Firefox. Other popular search engines leech off big tech's index (DDG: Bing, Startpage: Google), at least Brave maintains their own index. Their AI summarizer is pretty good.
Need to try this.
No because I inherently don’t trust things that advertise. Maybe I’m weird?
Only LibreWolf.
Do you mean LibreWolf? LibreFox looks dead
Yeah i think he meant that XD
I use the brave mobile browser because it blocks YouTube ads, anyone know an alternative?
Firefox mobile app with ublock origin add-on
Edit: Bonus - Video background play fix add-on
Thanks! I forget to add ublock origin on my new phone, I thought it was enabled and just didn't block YT ads! Bye Bye Brave
Edit: Was hopping we left arbitrary downvotes on reddit
Thanks for the add on tips! Makes Firefox awesome
Firefox for mobile is such a good browser. Breaks my heart it is so underrated
Nope
I use librewolf and for chrome things may be vivaldi , but brave I dont trust at all !!
Just out of interest, what are 'chrome things'
Things those break on ff
👌🙂
No, its a profit company, tried to add a crypto miner secretly to the browser. The privacy policy is hidden after 2 sites.
Lol no
I'm using Firefox & Brave Search which is kinda ironic. I'm open to other suggestions if anybody can recommend anything close to Google and with good support for searches in other languages (I speak Polish)
Not much, but for android I prefer it over Chrome.
1000000x better. definetly.
Why not firefox or kiwi ? They allow extensions , like ublock origin and all , much better choice i feel !
Kiwi whitelists some pages from ad blockers https://fosstodon.org/@sponsorblock/110803883664782262
I use Firefox sometimes, but for personal certificates it doesn't work. The lack of updates on Kiwi and some ads that Brave blocks and Kiwi not made me stop using it.
Well I have been looking for brave replacement on Android. Brave has been slowly degrading itself for the past 2 years with shit ton of bloat being put in the browser.
I do have FF but for some unique sites, I have to use a chromium browser. Cromite (Bromite's Fork) seems interesting for now. I will wait for it to get more stable as things like auto-fill pass don't work and more.
Just use Bitwarden for passwords and auto-fill.
I already have BW setup, but Cromite doesn't seem to work with any password manager.
Have a look at Vivaldi for Android.
Is that Chromium based?
Yes, it sadly is Chromium based.
Nah. Not completely open-source.
I use Firefox but Brave is much more secure out of the box. I use Brave's search. I trust them more than Google, Bing or DuckDuckGo.
LibreWolf is about as secure as a browser can get out of the box. Check out the stats here.
this is testing privacy. not security. security would moreso fall under sandbox strength and trust placed on web content, which chromium beats Firefox a bit (fission being rolled out by default has decreased this metric, however.)
the thing about brave is whenever a company markets itself as privacy forward with no obvious business model/monetization strategy, it's safe to assume that, if they're not already, they will begin selling user data/ads heavily in the future. especially with brave searches lack of care towards web publisher's right not to be indexed, and Brendan eich generally being a gremlin of a human, I won't go near it. I'm not even starting with their crypto nonsense.
edit: and to the people saying they don't care what the CEO thinks just realize, by supporting the product, you support the company and in turn, the CEO. to support him means, at the very least, complicity with his views.
Isn't it's crypto scheme to provide a universal donation mechanism or payment mechanism for ads the obvious business model?
Trust no 1
No
🤌
@FarLine99. Lol, no
Being a chromium skin is a business decision. I don't like it, but at least I understand the thought process. The crypto stuff however? No thanks. That's when I take my business elsewhere.
Is there a better option on iOS?
All the browsers on ios are just skins of safari
yes and no… the browser ENGINE sure, but that’s kinda like saying that brave is just a skin of chrome
Brave is just a skin of Chrome
I mean...
If you find yourself asking this question a lot, you might want to question why you're on iOS.
I believe IOS was being forced to allow different browser engines by the EU so there may be more options soon
I don’t lol , was just wondering after seeing this post 😅
Safari + AdGuard maybe. Not better but pretty good.
Orion Browser allows Firefox extensions on iOS.
Aside from Safari, there’s DuckDuckGo or Firefox. But iOS browsers are all built on Apple’s architecture
Unfortunately no. Had moved from Google to brave. However I hear brave is just as bad so now moving to Firefox
I've been bouncing around mobile browsers for a while now trying to find one I'm ok with.
I started with Chrome, because it worked reliably and had a decent UI. Then as time went on and Google stopped not being evil, I switched to Brave. Chromium based, but thankfully not Google. The endless crypto shilling started to grate on me, and I started looking into the company, and decided I wanted out.
I gave Firefox a try because I love it on the PC. It didn't work. I love a lot about it, but there are a few excruciating things on Firefox mobile that I couldn't handle. Swiping to close tabs, jump to a new Google image, etc was frustratingly insensitive. The browser would freak out and crash the tab about 30% of the time I went landscape full screen on a video. I had to go back to Brave for a bit.
Now I'm trying out Vivaldi. Chromium based again, but no crypto shilling, and lots of customizability. I haven't heard anything about their CEO being a bigot, or selling data to other companies, but it could be happening. Being able to sync between PC and mobile is nice, and one of the reasons I went with brave earlier and tried Firefox.
Vivaldi's CEO is really nice. Saw talk with him on Techlore channel. I definetly can trust them 🙂
nope. not anymore.
As long as the browser remains open source I'll continue using it
Brave search is fine. For browser, I use IceCat on computer and Navi from F-Droid. For VPN I use Riseup VPN.
IceCat is over four years out of date
It has been updated awhile through Chocolatey for Windows, Fedora maintains a version of IceCat, and anyone who ports Fedora's version like SpakyLinux for Devuan/Debian.
Also the scripts are publicly available to strip Firefox and turn into Icecat, otherwise everybody can use Librewolf.
I didn't know that, thanks
👌🙂
Um... No.
Don't like Brave or their products. But only decent & safe browser on Android with site isolation etc.
Only barely as far as I can spit.
While I would like to try Brave at some point, I can’t really support any browser based on Chromium. Google’s control over the browser market is far too strong as it is, and I would prefer not to support that by using a browser made with their web technologies. Additionally, Brave has a handful of other issues that would prevent me from choosing it, like their cryptocurrency integration and advertising model.
I doubt they're doing anything to secerative in the background. Not a fan of Bat or their affiliate link scamdle, but also not a fan of Firefox's ads, telemetry, trademark claims against Firefox forks, and accepting Google money for bad defaults - as I'm not a fan of Vivaldi being closed source and their adblock that doesn't block all ads.
Brave is great for somebody who doesn't know/want to configure defaults beyond optionally disabling Bat. If you can then Firefox & derivatives might give a better experience.
Brave is also Chromium based, but being a heavy fork it doesn't hold onto the worst parts, making it more alright.
I do use it sometimes, some websites only work properly on chromium-based and it's handy when I need to cast something to chromecast but I really dislike like their crypto thing, I prefer Firefox most of the time.
If your going to use chromium then its not a bad choice. Its still better than stock Firefox but Firefox can be hardened pretty well.
It also has protections against some tracking that is a little more obscure
I use Brave on my pi400 and on my tablets, phone. It works, and it can use Chrome extensions. I mostly use Firefox on my pi400, but there is the odd site that doesn't work with FIrefox. Every web browser sucks in some way. I could care less what views the CEO of any company holds.
yes the browsers and the search engine. techlore the board and I've had a fantastic experience with it's product. even if it may be unreliable (which I don't think) it will still be better than chrome or edge
I read through the comments and figured I should try to help balance the discussion. For risk of getting pounced on, I use brave browser and brave search for all my personal needs. It is pre configured with things I care about out of the box, ipfs on mobile, great adblock by default, I experimented with their ad/crypto thing. I’m very happy we have companies trying to do new things, the naysayers will shit on innovation always, so “do your own research” lmao. Other features are a built in crypto wallet.
Other things I care about are their terms of service. Whether you believe it or not, at least we have a company out there trying to champion privacy by default. DuckDuckGo is similar on that regard. They also have their own search engine and their AI powered answers is very good, much better than Google’s at this point. I find myself not having to go to Google as often anymore. It’s really good these days!
They also push the envelope and put their money where their mouth is so to speak privacy wise by continually coming out with new features for privacy and security. I honestly do not understand how a privacy community will shit all over Brave. And no I don’t care about their founder nor about their copyright AI infringing API. Have none of you sailed the high seas? If it personally affects you then sue them.
Such a good write up. Thank you. Kinda same opinion. I mainly trust Brave. Yup, there are some weird things were done but who didn't. Especially if you try to do massive project with new finance model and at the same time go against biggest tech. Of course there will be some caviots here and there. They put their money where their mouth. The most important point!