Biden left feeling angry and betrayed by top Democratic leaders wavering on his campaign
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/joe-biden/biden-left-feeling-angry-betrayed-top-democratic-leaders-wavering-camp-rcna162635Open linkView original on lemmy.world166
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Who cares. This isn't about Biden. This is about what's good for the country. JFC. These people have completely lost any semblance of doing things for the public good.
I've been fucking saying this. He thinks it is about him. He's gonna be dead. Nobody gives a fuck about your legacy except you unless you actually do something worthy of being remembered by. Even then it will be a footnote at best.
The future is now old man. Lead, follow, or get the fuck out of the way.
I think it's best for the country if he stays in the race because he's the incumbent and the best (according to the polls) person to replace him is already on the ticket. Also, if you think they're gonna put someone progressive up, I have some bad news. Essentially, take every position Biden has, and you can safely assume his replacement will be at best as good, and probably at least a little bit worse.
538 puts his chances above Trump's. The Keys to the White House puts Joe Biden as favored to win (at least, that's the expected prediction). I have yet to find a single poll that puts Biden below Trump by more than the margin of Error unless that poll shows 18 to 20-somethings largely voting for Trump, which suggests a sampling bias. Donald Trump already lost to Joe Biden, and since then he attempted an insurrection. Pair the previous fact with the data suggesting Trump didn't get the expected boost from the assassination attempt, and you reach the inevitable conclusion that America probably hates Trump.
Each individual datum I presented defies your conclusion, so I'm given to wonder why you have such confidence that it's not just unlikely but impossible not only for Biden to win but for a reasonable person to disagree? What outstanding evidence do you have that would allow you to reasonably reach this strongest of all conclusions?
Edit: for those of you having trouble reading, I'm criticizing this person claiming that everyone who disagrees is unreasonable.
538 is not what it was. Nate Silver left and took the model with him. The current 538 model is new and untested. The old 538 model has Biden at 26%.
Good to know, thank you! My point about the other person's degrees of certainty remains; it's absolutely asinine to say that you know for sure and everyone who disagrees with you is unreasonable when the supporting data is that shaky.
A. That's a bald faced lie. 538 shows 50/50ish odds right now because it's heavily weighted to do so until after the conventions.
B. Polling in Pennsylvania, the only swing state Trump needs to win, is disastrous for Biden.
C. The bullet bump is hitting now. Polling is always delayed, the news stories breathlessly published the day after were nothing but click bait.
What do you mean by that? That 18-20s don't largely vote R or that they are being disproportionately represented in the data?
Because for the former, Steve Bannon has been working to corrupt the "gaming" community completely. My YouTube algorithm associates gaming with right wing material so he's already succeeded in that department. Not that all 18-20s are gamers, but I believe more of them are than older generations.
I think young voters are on average less likely to vote for Trump, including that particular demographic. I believe that because younger generations are more likely (among other things) to be openly queer, and more politically engaged than people of that age used to be. I believe this because a lot of my friends online and offline are people just out of high school. Almost every young person I meet is about as or more progressive than me, with those who who are less progressive going no further than to the left of Joe Biden. Those exceptions who I've personally met can be counted on one hand, and those I interact with have given me no reason to believe that they're an exception.
If 18 to 20-somethings were tending right wards, people who are still in high school would be reporting their classmates being swept up in the pipeline as well, but we don't see that happening. For clarity, I live in a red county, on the boarder of a swing state, and in a small city surrounded by rural communities. Furthermore, I have a career where I interact with a lot of young people and hobbies that push me towards interacting with the groups you're talking about. If there was a successful strategic effort to push that demographic to the far right, I'd be in a very good position to notice first hand.
I'm 21, from a blue county in a reddish state, it seems mostly 50/50
I'm glad to hear some first hand experience with that then! Thanks for sharing!
None of these models take into account the issue that an 81-year old cannot campaign as effectively as a younger person. It’s very unlikely that Biden can turn the tide in his favour through a great debate performance or speech. The best Campaign he can run is by hiding such that voters do not see how old and fragile he is. That’s not our best bet for beating Trump.
The Democratic donors say it’s over. No money, no campaign.
The question is if Biden can beat Trump, and I'm not considering direct plutocrat interference. Also, no one asked you.
Thought it was pertinent information.
And they have an amazing track record in predicting who can beat Trump.
Please re-read my reply.
^ I see. This guy's comments get to stay, but someone here wants to suppress or censor my opinion which was widely supported by the community. Makes sense....
That ship has sailed. Americans don't turn out for weakness. Whether it's a squee while the 70 ton Main Battle Tank you're riding in takes a jump or showing up to a debate cosplaying "confused old man".
It's not rational and political analysts hate it but it's always been true. Biden had about a week to go on a barnstorm and show us the debate was a fluke and he handled it the exact wrong way. He stayed home and let his campaign staff try to spin things. He needs to step aside now.
There's an argument to be made that incumbency could actually be a drag right now. People don't feel the government is working for them and they blame those currently in power. We saw with Trump that a lot of people will vote for any kind of change, even if it's objectively worse.
Alright, make it. People haven't felt like the government has been working for them since I was old enough to vote, so I very much doubt that by itself is really your reasoning. People tell me that I change my mind surprisingly easily, so go ahead.
Look at the wave of right wing populists winning across Europe. Hungary, Italy, Netherlands, and a bunch of other countries have elected these kind of anti-establishment candidates. Same pattern as "MAGA" conservatives in the US. These people don't win elections because they're competent. They aren't even good campaigners. They get elected because they're promising to trash the system.
It's not just that people don't feel like the government is working for them, it's that they are looking to authoritarianism to provide solutions.
France and the UK just gave the right a pair of fat Ls, so I don't think your chosen narrative is as clear as you seem to think. Furthermore, we were discussing the potential advantage/disadvantage of specifically being the incumbent, rather than the appeal of the right wing. That is to say, your argument fails to support your thesis.
Trump was an incumbent in 2020. He lost.
Exactly, both parties are continually proving our leaders needs and short sighted visions come first before any benefit makes it to the American people, both parties want bigger government with more control and power.
To try and appease the people who voted them in they will throw bits of effort at altruistic efforts and chunks of change at in demand topics of the public while we barely hang on to the quality of life the people worked so hard to get to the point where it is.
Both parties are corrupted at this point, but one is clearly better than the other. Fascism would tear this country apart at the seams. Democrats need to show better leadership management quickly otherwise they are going to lose this important race.
Actually, this whole thing has been about Biden’s ego from the very start, and it’s past time that be fully addressed.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
The country is actively fighting, and in some places losing against, fascism and Bidens response is 'but what about my feelings?'
This man never had what it takes to stop fascism and Ive held that belief since his first campaign. Tell me in the four years since has America gotten more or less fascist?
FUCKING THANK YOU!
This has been one of my main issues with this bullshit lately. The country is going through the most dangerous period in the last 100 years and grandpa Joe only cares about himself...
Sorry your ego had to take an L, but maybe just maybe, give a shit about other people? That'd be nice.
He thinks he's got a golden ticket.
Yup. People are running around saying we must vote for Biden to fight fascism. But he isn't fighting. He's acting like it's still the 1990's and good centrist policy will work.
The country is fighting. One party is fighting for fascism. The other party is fighting against progressives.
I mean I get it, but Biden promised a one term deal for democrats. And it would be a hell of a comfort to see someone young enough to still have the mental flexibility to understand how new situations call for new solutions.
Starting to like the sound of a Newsom presidency.
Same - and I don’t like how corporate friendly he is at all. I’d take him over Biden in a heartbeat. He actually seems like he’d, you know, actually try to fight against fascism, instead of phoning it in and “reaching across the aisle”. You do not negotiate with or tolerate fascists. You tell them to get the fuck out.
Bitch, this ain't about you. This is way bigger than your stupid, bruised ego. You ain't the best person for the job. You know it, we all know it. You just need to swallow your fucking pride and step aside for the good of the nation.
I don't know why he can't be happy that he got to be president. Most people don't get to be president. Just pack it in and relax FFS.
Ego
We’re going to be fucking Nazis in three years if he loses. With all due respect, Mr. President, fuck your feelings.
Every Democratic senator running in battleground states is polling way, way ahead of Biden. The quite literal “unnamed Democrat” has a better chance of winning.
If he wants to stay in the race, he opens the convention on VP and vows to step down right after the inauguration. And let the new VP debate Trump next time.
There are too many people in this country who believe trump did a good job during his presidency. All they know is that they could afford shit under trump. This race is closer than anyone can imagine and Biden needs to realize his performance at the debate ended his presidency.
A large portion of the country already believe Biden broke the economy. It’s unfortunate that they are wrong but that is the optics of it all. Biden can no longer win this race. The only thing keeping him afloat was that he was doing a decent job with the other stuff and now that he is losing his mental acuity the people on the fence are going to choose trump.
At this point, with the way GA, VA, and NC are shaping up, Trump just needs Pennsylvania. The Democrats need every other state on offer plus Pennsylvania. Virginia flipping in the polls is huge.
It could be a bullet bump but combined with the donations being withheld it's not a close race anymore. Trump is firmly ahead.
Jesus he is coming off like such a whiny little bitch. He’s killing his own campaign, and the cause of death is the size of his own ego. I admit I didn’t have this one on my bingo card. I just hope he doesn’t end up dragging us poor bastards down with him.
Yeah and progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" supports Genocide. Suck it up warmonger
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" works with Republicans to make sure the minimum wage stays put.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" works with Republicans to kill BBB.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" works with Republicans to make sure rail workers can't strike.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" fights progressives harder than it fights Republicans.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" adopts Trump's immigration policies.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" slow-walks merely rescheduling cannabis instead of even trying to fully legalize it.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" kills the public option.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" passes NAFTA.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" passes the '94 crime bill.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" votes for the Iraq war.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" keeps extending warrantless wiretapping.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" makes sure that those who caused the 08 housing crisis don't encounter consequences.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" has a majority and chooses not to use it.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" hides behind incrementalism as an excuse for doing nothing.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" makes sure student loans can't be discharged via bankruptcy.
Progressives feel angry and betrayed when the "left wing" repeals Glass-Steagall.
There's a whole pattern of behavior here, and I'm certainly missing plenty. So I doubt progressives have a lot of patience for Biden's whining here.
If he's feeling betrayed, want till he learns how most democrats feel about his leadership.
He should have gotten out of the way in 2020 when Bernie was winning. Fuck around and find out.
we are the ones who will find out he'll be dead
Democrats love to shoot themselves in the foot in a struggle for power. The only reason we are in any of this Trump mess today is because they took Bernie's run away from him and gave it to a much less popular Hillary Clinton. If they wouldn't meddle Bernie would be finishing his second term and Trump would be an after thought, but here we are in this mess they created.
Two party system needs to end.
Doesn't matter because capitalizm will end either way. We go Nazis and work for the rich for no fucking pay or we eat the rich and burn the dollar. Anything else is just a rebirth of the same fraud.
Ooh didims, this election is all about your feelings. I wonder if the Palestinians feel hurt or betrayed?
They're wavering because you need to show strength, stability, and confidence in a way you haven't been able to show them for a month.
If this is genuinely caused by an unlucky series of illnesses and you'll be fine as soon as you bounce back, great. They'll line back up behind you. If not... then it's time to bow out.
A month? How about… ever? He has barely lifted a finger to meaningfully slow or discourage the rise of fascism in this country because tHAt wOuLD bE DiviSiVE.
He’s so far up his own ass about his vaunted ability to compromise that he forgot that you don’t fucking compromise with fascists. That, to me, has been the single biggest failure of his presidency. And the kicker is that he doesn’t even understand any of that, and thinks he did an ok job. Sure, there was a lot of economic recovery and stuff, but forgive me for not being at all confident how long any of that will stand up to the abuses and idiocy of a potential second Trump admin. Biden does not understand that the rules have changed. He is bringing a deck of cards to a gunfight.
I mean, he's been pretty steadfast on one issue.
Boo fucking hoo.
Oh no life is hard. Fighting his old white and rich, dude should just enjoy his last few years of life and get outta the way.
America, it seems that you're doomed to live with your narcissistic lover forever.
Yeah us too, asshole (Biden, not you OP!). Caused by you!
I dont' think biden is an asshole but I judge him by his peers for the last 50 yearsish. So everyone who held presidential office in that time.
Did somebody lock Biden in the hyperbolic time chamber after betrayimg him?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
President Joe Biden feels personally hurt and betrayed by the way so many Democrats, including some of the party’s top leaders, have left him hung out to dry as he faces the biggest crisis of his political career, according to two sources familiar with his thinking.
On Thursday night, Sen. Jon Tester of Montana, one of the party’s most vulnerable members seeking re-election, became the second senator and 22nd Democrat in Congress to call on Biden to exit the race.
Though scattered across the country during congressional recess, Democrats are coalescing around the idea that it’s not a matter of if Joe Biden steps down as their nominee, but when, according to multiple sources who’ve shared the sentiment.
Progressives are successfully seizing the moment to push Biden to embrace some of their policy ideas — like expanding Social Security, nixing medical debt and slapping term limits and ethics rules on the Supreme Court.
The series of leaks Wednesday night about Biden’s private discussions with congressional leaders, as well as reporting from NBC News on Thursday afternoon that Biden-world is bracing for the possibility that he will step aside, did not go unnoticed by lawmakers — and ratcheted up an already intense situation in the party.
Sen. Peter Welch, D-Vt., the first senator to call for Biden’s exit from the race, said that the back and forth “has been a top of mind concern for all” Democrats he’s spoken to, and that he believes there is “significant movement toward the president making a decision to step aside.”
The original article contains 1,521 words, the summary contains 256 words. Saved 83%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Y'all are rage and anger over and with the matter and it will never do more than burn you to the ground like you are right blazingly obviously about to die...if you're lucky right now.
There's only one viable solution. Do the same to all USD and their origin to elect the Joker, Jon Stewart.
Anything else will be fascism, either side, and you need to do this very loud and do not shut up even if they arrest and prison you. That'll happen when we Fascism anyway so do it now or else. And you're all ignorant. We'll go fascism either way, doesn't matter who you elect bar THE JOKER.
Do you know how incoherent this is?
You're not awake.
Oh no are Genocide Joe's feelings hurt? Poor old monster. Let's all decide to throw the election because Grandpa wants to do another 4 years.
I would too. Best president since Carter. Still to this day making moves and camping debt.
But he can't do the dog and pony show so, as per usual in the DNC, they can't toe the line under the big tent. It's bat shit insane and y'all deserve Trump.
Don’t let them get you down Joe! You got more votes then Obama!
You want Harris? You already have her. We're being manipulated into fighting about it to lose moderates.
That is what just amazes me. She is already the backup if he got that bad (and despite peoples hyperbole he is not that bad currently). I mean I will vote for her as the canidate just like I did for her being vp but I find the whole have biden step down is pointless and likely to just make things worse.
I think it not only hurts Trump's arguments against Biden for all the bullshit they've brought up over the last 4 years (hunter, Ukraine, etc...) but it also allows her to step up and unload on Trump which Biden just doesn't have the energy or mental capacity to properly do anymore.
That and not that any moderates were on the fence about him or trump, but they might have been on the fence about Biden or just not voting. Here's to hoping she isn't completely pathetic and doesn't fall flat on her face immediately... But then again these are Democrats, and if anything "we're" the best at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...
yeah. again though I expect a bunch of harris will lose even worse. shes to liberberal or ethnic or testosterone challenged or whatever. My preference is to move forward united as is but its not like im voting any other way regardless what happens
People want a ticket they can be excited about to make sure people get out there and vote in November. While potential Biden voters are not going to switch to Trump, there's a real chance they might stay home. That's essentially a vote for Trump.
Yeah, the Democrats really need a Hail Mary. Kamala is the best bet based upon where she is right now.
Yes, it's a risk, but not as risky as keeping Joe as the candidate.
I don't even think Kamala is a Hail Mary. I think she'd be the favorite to win in November.
yeah but 100% no replacement will get people to be excited. There is always a chance that potential voters will stay at home no matter who is running. I won't be one of them. Well actually I will because my state does mail in.
People are less likely to stay home if they are excited about the ticket. Democrats aren't very excited about the Biden/Harris ticket right now. On the other side, Republicans are very excited about the Trump/Vance ticket.
true but what ticket would make them excited? Not just republicans are excited about trump/vance. I know I am and it certainly energizes my vote.
I can just speak for myself. I'd be more excited about Harris or Whitmer or Shapiro or Newsom.
can you say why though. I like biden because of specific white house actions that came out of this term. Because of that I like harris next in the hope she got the experience and will continue with the current direction on most things (I think bidens term was helped by lessons learned from obamas terms). The others. I would be more excited with yang.
I hope he burns the whole party down.
And I hope you have to walk over a mile of legos with no shoes or socks on.
Edit: I quasi-apologize. See below for comment.
Why would you wish that on me?
The Democrats are not your friend. They’re evil.
I thought you knew that.
You're right...I semi take it back. The democrats are fucking evil. I'm also kinda drunk, so apologies.
At the same time though, burning the party down at the moment would irreparably fuck up this election and unequivocally hand things to the Republicans who are decidedly more evil.
I'm on the side of burning shit down on January 21st after Donald Trump has no chance of seizing power.
No prob.
Be sure to drink some water before you go to bed.
Good call. Will do.
You shouldn't apologize; look at their other comments.
Imagine if the Democrats didn’t exist and American progressives could start to build a real left-wing party.
If that didn't start with the Republicans not existing, the American progressives would probably just get thrown in prison
They are the gatekeepers for preventing progress
I kind of want to see Bernie Sander run and lose so all the Bernie Bros shut up.
boo, go back to being funny
/agree
They were never funny
I didn't ever see myself agreeing with you, but here I am.
I want to see someone 30 years younger than any current candidate on the ballot. Love me some Bernie, I voted for him in the 2016 primary, but guess what, time for someone I don't have to worry about snapping an ankle getting out of bed.
Wouldn’t that be nice?
Someone who is alive for the consequences of their policies?
Yes, but the saying does go "Societies grow great when old men plant trees, the shade of which they shall never enjoy." Or something like that.
Yeah but shouldn’t they be alive for the first watering?
I would settle for them just doing the planting, that's apparently a hard ask these days.
Yes, there is certainly a group within the Democratic Party that prefers a hereditary dictatorship headed by the Trump family to any progressive.
The progressives would rather have Trump then 90% of democrats so I guess those two groups have something in common!
Centrists got their second choice in 2016.
We're talking about the current year, 2024.
Not nearly a decade ago.
Centrists have only moved to the right since then.
Now they've adopted Trump's immigration policy and are happily supporting genocide.
But it seems if you move a bit to the left all the sudden you’re supporting Trump himself.
According to centrists, yes. Opposition to genocide is regularly met with accusations of being a Trump supporter here.